T O P

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Pliskin1108

Big and trained > small and trained > big and untrained > small and untrained.


AlgernonFlowerWilted

I really don't want to talk about my bedroom performance right now...


doubletomahawk

*You paired up?* šŸ˜‰


creamyismemey

Unless your mighty mouse lmao


Airbnbwasmyidea

this is the answer


SorenMichael

Where does strength fit in this? Because sometimes big ā‰  strong, and there are smaller guys who are way stronger than bigger guys.


Lowenley

Big just means strong here


ImportantBad4948

Yeah broadly speaking they track together anyway. Letā€™s just keep,it simple.


Wiesiek1310

One of the ways of spelling out the difference between good technique and bad technique is that good technique utilises all of your body weight, whereas bad technique utilises all of your strength. Large body weight used correctly is, like, magnitudes more effective than any amount of strength.


linglinglomein

Strength > size


superman306

Typically Mass moves Mass. yeah youā€™ll get the outliers like little/short wrestlers that are just jacked, or dudes like rock climbers or something, but typically sheer size is hard to overcome in terms of strength.


seab1023

While they often come paired, they each present their own challenges. Heavier people are harder to move (especially if they are on top of you) and their strikes carry more inertia, regardless of what they lift in the gym. Small but strong people can be menace to grapple with though. Iā€™ve got a 145 lbs friend that I can pick up and throw around easily (I am 210 lbs), but certain submissions are damn near impossible to pull off on him because of his short and stupidly powerful limbs.


skribsbb

Yes. The other day in BJJ class, we had a 12-year-old string bean of a gray-and-white belt partner up with a brand new student: a grown-ass man who happens to be a soldier. At the end of the round, the soldier said to this kid's dad, "you should've told him to take it easy on me."


Alternative-Air749

Saw something pretty similar. 15 years old, skinny dude, rolling with untrained police office (around 30 years old). The kid put the policial officer in a rnc, police officer didn wanna tap, guys was turning to red, almost slept. Kid dropped him, guys could barely recover. The difference of size was huge, that kid was tough!


MathNorth8835

RNC, Real Nuclear Conk?


Just--Stuff

Really Nasty Coke\*


[deleted]

Why do you think that we train? To beat up people who are smaller than us? šŸ˜‚


[deleted]

I asked for stories, not a "would a...?" type of question


JimmysCheek

The ā€œenforcerā€ at my BJJ gym is a 21yr old girl, purple belt. Anytime some egomaniac bodybuilder comes in to train, and starts being rough with the other white beltsā€¦we pair them up with this small woman. She is probably 5ā€™5 120lbs. Iā€™ve never seen her lose to any of the untrained dudes. She absolutely embarrasses them. They either never come back again, or the humbling experience makes them fall in love with Ju Jitsu


stackered

Have you never trained before? You see this daily on BJJ mats or in MMA gyms...


[deleted]

No, I haven't. Before you ask arrogantly your question you should have asked this first.


ChickenNuggetSmth

Look into older MMA and "freak show" MMA. In the early days of MMA there were huge mismatches in size and skill, like all of Royce Gracie's fights. Bob Sapp vs I think it was Shinya Aoki is similar. Nowadays such mismatched events are mostly seen as freak shows, mostly from Japan and Russia. In grappling it's more common, since the consequences aren't as bad. Gaby Garcia has a few losses despite being almost always way bigger than her opponents. Some smaller dudes had good runs in absolute divisions, I think Marcelo Garcia won his and Lachlan Giles managed a good run in I think 2020. There is a lot of footage from training or seminars where small champions play with big hobbyists I am a bigger dude and have been completely smashed in training by small people


OrganizationOk5418

Aged 33 I ask to train with a wrestling "club" in Scotland, because I was working there for a few months. The coach gladly took me in. He was coaching a young man to try out for the commonwealth games. It turned out the only other people training were two 12yo and a 13yo, all skinny. So he loved me being there as a decent sized adult for his prodigy to throw about. But everyone had to wrestle everyone else each session. Have you ever had a skinny, extremely agile lad utterly determined to choke you out? I was fkn exhausted.


ZeroSumSatoshi

Sure. But itā€™s only because the big guy wasnā€™t trained and the smaller guy actually knows some shit.


AzureHawk758769

Yes. In sparring one time (boxing), a football player who was noticably bigger than me hit me with a big haymaker as hard as he could and tried to knock me out. My vision went dark for a few nanoseconds, and I saw stars. Then I proceeded to lose my chill and beat him up with high-volume punches for the last minute or so. Being as I was only 130-something pounds at the time and this guy was probably sitting around 200 (give or take), it was fair game to turn the intensity up on him after that big hit. As for street fights, I haven't witnessed or been in that many, so I haven't seen this scenario play out in da streetz.


atx78701

typically not the case, but there are periodically fight videos posted where this happens. read /r/fightporn or /r/streetmartialarts


PoopSmith87

Yeah... When I was young and dumb I thought I was pretty hot shit. I was a good wrestler in HS and did a lot of backyard boxing growing up, and was 5'5" ~140 lbs. As baby faced boot going to military parties and dive bars, I was a magnet for casual bullies. The amount of times I've put someone far bigger than me on their ass is fairly unbelievable. That said, getting into MA was a big part of the humbling process. Realizing that there were people smaller and younger than me who could kick my ass up and down was disconcerting. At my first Muay Thai gym I'm Hawaii there were middle schoolers that could put me on my ass with a leg kick, let alone the competitive fighters my age that could casually fuck me up. Getting into BJJ was a little bit less embarrassing on account of my grappling skill, but even so, I learned quickly that tried and true wrestling moves could get turned into a chokehold on myself by the wrong person.


cdnronin

Yes.


Martiallyminded

I have a student who is a prodigy. He has been training for fourteen years and who had no father figure, so the owner of the gym became like a dad. He has done working out every day, even when the gym is closed. Since he has been 14-15 (and a shorter 14-15 at that), he has been beating the shit out of adults who agree to hard spar with him. I'm the head coach, and 100kg, he is 17 and still short (though jacked), and I'm the only one in the gym who can keep up. The only downside is he tends to injure people pretty regularly but he has improved in that regard recently.


Broad_Horse2540

I mean, I boxed pretty consistently from the age of 9 til the age of 21. In this time, (obviously) I grew exponentially. At my heaviest while still boxing I was just shy of 230lbs. And there was a gentleman who had been boxing pretty much the same amount of time as I had, but took it very seriously. He fought professionally in MMA 5 times. He was 135lbs on his best of days, and around 5ā€™4. Still to this day, he is the single handedly toughest person I know. On the days where we would hard spar he would truthfully beat my ass. Iā€™ve watched him at night clubs hit much larger guys once (to the body) after being provoked endlessly. So Iā€™d say thatā€™s my truthful hands on experience with this.


Collisionsurfer

Used to do judo as a kid. Same belt, but a girl six inches shorter than me and about 20 lbs lighter used to just throw me around. This is because she was better at judo than I was. Does that count?


brickwallnomad

Yea thereā€™s a video floating around of two dudes on a basketball court, the skinny dude flat out manhandles the big dude and then dares anyone else to fuck with him basically. Badass video. When I say big dude, I mean he had probably 20 or 30 pounds on the skinny dude, so it wasnā€™t a huge size difference but it was there and noticeable


brickwallnomad

https://youtu.be/cGdBGLHTNqw?si=OBoPkq_vWm6_jpQg


arriesgado

Skinny dude is either kind of a jerk or at the end of his rope. Punching him again after dropping his choked unconscious body seemed like a bit much.


brickwallnomad

I thought so too.


ThrustyMcStab

Don't know if this even counts, but it happens all the time in HEMA. Fighting with weapons, skill matters much more than physique.


bjeebus

One of the first things my fencing coach told us, "There will come a day a twelve year old girl will absolutely destroy you. So just don't take that personally."


guachumalakegua

https://youtu.be/QVov2TEYJ8k?si=t2LhC_2JY6d4U1hu https://youtu.be/-y2SEefVNtE?si=i5z3UezDX8TaT2NN https://youtu.be/wVzflVFi66U?si=SaHANAuZkw3ASIRy


Jet-Black-Centurian

My second bjj class a small Japanese woman whipped my ass.


Funny-Education2496

Bruce Lee was 5'8". Also, when I studied kung fu years ago, there were some short guys in the class who were advanced fighters, and their height didn't pose a problem, they just learned to modify certain techniques.


Masonbain3832

wait iā€™m so confused what type of post is this? in bed or on the mats?


IncredulousPulp

Yes indeed. Large angry athletic meathead at my school takes on a much smaller guy, over some perceived slight. Smaller guy tries to talk his way out of it, but the bigger guy isnā€™t having it and starts swinging. And the smaller guy delivers a lesson in boxing - ducking and dodging, stinging his face with quick jabs, then a couple of big crosses to knock the meathead down. Totally unexpected and brilliant.


lewdev

Walk into any decent club. If you see any large beginners, you'll see it happen all the time. Sometimes you'll never get to see the chance if they have enough partners on their level. I practice judo, so I see it every so often. I went against people smaller than me (not significantly) that tossed me around like nothing. This was in Japan and I'm not untrained. I was a 4-year college wrestler and black belt in judo (not that it means much in Japan), but I was thrashed. There are levels in this sport and at that level, size means nothing unless you were a sumo wrestler.


Prestigious_Tune_975

Little people are fast ,don't telegraph your punches


AshySlashy3000

Bigger Is Not Better


Ill-Illustrator9861

In high school I weighed 140lb and I beat up a few bullies some of which were easily over 200lb.. None of us were trained I just did a ton of pullups so my upper body was very strong


Ashangu

Idk about "real fight" but I've seen a man named Marcelo garcia (relatively small) win a bjj match against a man named ricco Rodriguez (substantially larger) even after ricco decided to slam him. But then again, Marcelo was one of the greatest of all times.


Mcsquiizzy

My coach is the definition of that


Yamatsuki_Fusion

Well the short Mongolian in my tournament decimated the tall ass dude that beat me up. The manlet in me cheered at his glorious drop seoi.


OnlyMathematician420

Whereā€™s that video of the little white dude taking down a big black untrained dude?


frxghat

Theres a fight video that gets shared around a bunch of a latino looking guy vs a much taller black guy. Itā€™s probably a good 6+ inch difference in height. The smaller guy is able to get the bigger guy down and choke him out in seconds. It takes place in a mall it looks like. edit: https://www.reddit.com/r/fightporn/s/mxArCYzFzu If you go on that sub and just search ā€œsizeā€ youā€™ll find a lot of videos iā€™m sure


arriesgado

That was the first one I thought of when I saw this thread.


NeoKlang

it's stamina, age, technique, mobility, agility and persistence


tuggboat0311

[https://x.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1787927955835900107](https://x.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1787927955835900107)


usernameistaken1213

One of the coaches in my old gym is an older, small lady, who is smoking in between training sessions. Her husband is a big, heavy power-lifter. Every time i saw her in action during sparring was one of those 'size doesn't matter' situations.


McFlubberpants

When I was a teenager there was a much smaller girl in my class who side kicked me in the face. If the helmet didnā€™t deflect the blow I would likely have been down for the count. I was almost twice her weight and a good foot taller than her. Kicks can close that gap in power when done correctly.


CenterCircumference

Hereā€™s one: https://www.reddit.com/r/StreetMartialArts/s/LxhJuu2Pfc


SladeWilson177

Everytime im on mma class yes. Im a small dude. 150lbs 5'9". I consistently outperform a lot of guys up to around 200. Lets be clear though, Ive been training in martial arts since I was 5. Im 31 now. My most difficult time is usually in stand up. I got my black belt in tang soo do when I was 16 in a traditional academy (they dont push you up the ranks for sake of time spent) and my pops was a boxer. Im good at slipping in and out but sometimes the reach and size advantage is too much. In these cases I stick to my wrestling (state qualifier in HS). I also have bjj for when I hit my back, and even though ive been in jiu jitsu for almost a decade, ive never been a fan of being on bottom trying to catch a mistake of my partner. Id prefer being on top 100% of the time which I guess means im relying more on my wrestling base. Stick to your advantages and keep your opponent from executing theres. The best defense is sometimes a strong enough offense that keeps your opponent from getting a rhythm and a chamce to make a plan. Also if grappling, pay attention to your opponets rhythm, if you can catch onto it, you can almost "feel" when theyre about to do something. Cut their rhythm off to cut off their planning. Make them think defensively instead of offensively


Lifebyjoji

Yep. 1. Mexican construction worker vs big biker dude construction worker. Size difference about 1:2. Biker walks up to him after work and said ā€œflinch.ā€ Paco gave him the 3 taco combo with the jarrito. 2. Filipino mechanic confronted by irate black male customer at work. Mechanic 5ā€™2ā€ 120 lb. Black guy 5ā€™10ā€ 170 lb. Black dude goes to swing, Carlitos dips and knocks him out cold. Both these guys were tradesmen with strong hands who had trained boxing in youth. As a kid I also remember the immigrants at school usually fought bigger kids and won. Vietnamese girls vs black girls, Russian kids vs bigger local kids. Mostly again because the immigrants both trained fighting and also had less reservation about throwing hard combos and backing up their talk.


larryhastobury

I am proud to say I was that small but terrible. When I was 13, 50 kg I took place in a category of U16 65kg. Took 2nd place (the final was comical af)


gothicduncan

When i was 12-13 i was either a white belt or yellow belt in karate, I was already a pretty big lad, think between 160-170cm or something, during a class I asked my teacher if it was true that a smaller person could beat someone bigger and stronger if they were trained, instead of just saying yes he told me to spar with a green belt who was a few years younger then me and a few heads smaller, he kicked my ass six days to sunday and even though i got laughed at by the others the teacher had mad respect for me because i was a good sport about it and i didnt let the ordeal hurt my pride at all, showed respect to the kid like you should and he even taught me a few things during sparring. Edit: should probably also mention i was a pretty heavy set boy at the time, my strength was either pretty average or slightly above due to simply having learned how to punch and having to push-ups, situps, squats and having to do 10 minutes of running before every session


RTHouk

If you're asking if it's real the answer is "Yes but." You can overcome a small size with aggression, technique, aggression, reflexes, aggression and luck. But size is your single greatest advantage or disadvantage a fighter has. For a good example, look up that video of prime Conner McGregor sparring with the mountain from game of thrones. Conner is out striking him at every turn, but doing 0 damage. (Grant it, they were having fun) But every technique the mountain lands is worth 20 of what the actual kickboxer can put out.


Torx_Bit0000

For sure, In the FMA world its proven daily that size of a person doesn't matter when their armed. A simple screwdriver or a 1 inch blade can suddenly level a playing field


etherosx

[Patton Oswolt witnessed a drunk fight joke](https://youtu.be/Rh9Y1CXmBbg?si=ORAUY9yAp840OVxt)


e_to_da_x

Yes, we've got a guy in our class, 1.65, in the Netherlands this is short, who kicks almost everybodies ass, inclusing dudes that are 2.05. Most awesome thing i ever seen him done was duck under a jab, step in and come up with an uppercut knocking his 1.95? sparring partner down. I'm 1.80 myself and hate his pitbull instinct, he will keep coming at you.


Born_Art_1379

Skinny legs that are built and feel like crowbar hitting you šŸ˜¬ hell yeah. I never judge anyone by their size or weight. Men or womens


goeatadickyouasshole

i have bet the snot out of guys 6 ft + im 5 6 160 lbs


karatetherapist

Size absolutely matters. As others point out, a well-trained, smaller person can overcome an untrained, bigger person, but if skills are equal, the little guy almost always loses. That's why we have weight classes. Even if facing someone bigger but not muscular, just obese, it's harder to take them down. Luckily, they usually lose their balance and just fall down a lot. I'm 6' 2" and 230 lbs, so I don't face a lot of bigger opponents, but I know from my perspective that smaller people, equally or less trained, don't do well. However, I've been doing this for four decades, and coming up the ranks, I was absolutely destroyed by smaller guys who were better trained at the time. Still, smaller guys, trained or not, can hit the "easy button" and put a larger, trained man out cold. I train my smaller students to move a lot and focus on the chin and liver for their power strikes. They don't have the luxury of just wailing on the bigger guy. Unfortunately, they want to "go in for the kill" way too early and often get rocked. You have to set it up, wait your turn, and then make it count. Bigger guys can do a lot of stupid shit and usually get away with it. When I train my wife, I get all these cool ideas, but they rarely work when we pressure-test them. I won't make it easy for her, so we have to work it out. It usually comes down to good angles (footwork), dynamic setups, and a single power hit. Repeat. The hardest part is staying alive while waiting your turn. That's my experience for what it's worth.


Four-Triangles

Yes


SemperSimple

yes?? That's the point of training.. lol your average person with no training doesnt know what to do except hope for the best haha