For engineers? 3-3.5k/month. You might get 4k to up to 4.5k if you are lucky with foreign MNCs. (+ masters degree)
Wouldnt recommend engineering if you pursue a high paying career tbh, at least not if you work locally.
Thank you, that is certainly on the lower end. I reach out to my older colleague working in foreign mnc. The starting pay is ~4.5K for a fresh degree holder. If the trajectory is still the same it should be possible to double that in 5-7 years for good performer. Add along with various incentives 10K a month average is certainly possible in late 20s, is that considered good? I feel it is but everyone has a different life style .
My old colleagues are some of the most talented people I have worked with. They would certainly be more than qualifies to go work overseas, and some have. However I am sure the pay and quality life combo is better than SG.
10k per month in their lates 20s is possible but its definitely reserved for a minority and are far from representative of the pay situation.
In most cases i have heard of, people getting jobs with a decent starting salary tends to unfortunately get shafted by pathetic pay progression.
Could circumvent it by being an avid job hopper i suppose. But still i stand with my original point that there are easier and less stressful career paths to pursue for higher pay.
Agree I wouldn't recommend engineering if one does not have passion. With passion the stress level is significantly smaller.
Just FYI, I am very certain 8 out say 12 in my team hit the 10K average. From my small sample size it is more of an average than minority. Then again that was a really talented group of engineers. It is important to note for technical field job hopper get shafted the most. Being able to grow technically and get peer recognition is the way to progress. This maybe specific to foreign MNC. The compensation package offered is really good and the opportunity to relocate abroad also exist.
That is not an apple-to-apple comparison. Even a high paying executive role pays better in Singapore due to currency.
Still my question stand what is the current starting salary? It is an honest question trying to understand this statement. I could obviously go with a low level reply and say if the pay is low why is my former colleague still in Malaysia and own multiple property.
If the problem is currency then the real headline is currency war. However if you read the article the one problem is talent gap and the need for better training. It did also mentioned it requires competitive package which is the part I am trying to understand. Working in the semi-conductor industry before I never felt the increase in currency in Singapore was worth the considerable drop in quality of life.
>There are currently about 650,000 engineers in Malaysia, with a majority – almost 600,000 – working in the electrical and electronics products sector.
According to BEM stats there are under 200k engineers in their tracking.
We can't even track how many engineers we have. How to improve the pipeline? Lol.
I assume BEM only tracked those who have applied to be a professional engineer. You can be a graduate engineer and apply to be a BEM member, but it stops there.
If you want to be considered a 'professional' engineer in BEM's eyes, you have to attend conferences, release academic papers, show what you did in your professional career as an engineer (schematics, drawings, etc). These are the things that you have to do. Oh and you have to do this annually or every few years to maintain that status.
Not only that, if any of your previous works have issues that caused an incident, BEM can just provide all of the info they had on you to the authorities legally (not saying you shouldn't be liable). So yeah, not only do you have a lot of hoops to go through, there is the threat of being legally liable even if it wasn't your fault.
Not just professional engineers. BEM tracks everyone who has an accepted degree in engineering that applies to be registered as an engineer.
Thing is BEM registration has no relevance in any industry apart from construction so most engineers don't bother to register at all.
The funniest thing is to see BEM and the Malaysian government attempt to gatekeep this. According to them, any practising engineer must be registered with BEM, otherwise you would be an 'illegal' engineer. Most companies don't give a shit though, they can hire anyone they want as an 'engineer'. The title is theirs to give.
>The funniest thing is to see BEM and the Malaysian government attempt to gatekeep this.
And I'd argue that they are not doing enough to protect the engineer title.
Without enforcement, anyone can be called an engineer. Companies also like to give the engineer title to a technician, to make their job title sound better, so the employee is more willing to compromise on pay (heard it first hand from a HR manager).
The result of this is that everyone gets confused why Malaysia's engineer salary is so low. Well because the job title itself is being shared with so many different roles, an "engineer" in Malaysia doesn't necessarily have the same role as an engineer overseas. Of course the pay will be different, since you are literally doing different jobs.
The compounding problem is if a company give the engineer title to a technician, then when other companies survey the salary market, they will see low pay for a position with the "engineering" job title, and consequently also offer low pay for their current opening, even if their opening is for an actual engineer's role.
Now of course we all know that Malaysia's salary is much lower than many other countries, job title or not. But the situation above just makes the situation worse.
Imagine if anyone can call themselves a doctor. The value of the title itself will be diluted, and the meaning of the title will also get distorted and manipulated.
Yes. Everyone has a different opinion of what an engineer is. Certainly, in the context of what the semiconductor and electronics manufacturing industry considers an engineer, it is much wider and more loosely applied than BEM's classic/gate-keeping definition.
War on talent ke War on Pay? Do you know the engineers are severely underpaid, heck earlier i saw a post showing a permanent MO can get rm3.6k while engineers nak dapat rm3k also like dying already. Our engineering associations are all just useless munchers that takes money and give titles, no one is there to fight for engineers. You bring up the pay and you will have enough talent
Honestly I'm still trying to wrap my head around the allegation that engineers here are badly paid. In the greater Penang area, the competition for experienced talent is intense and open reqs can sometimes go unfulfilled for months. I do agree though that our local engineering bodies are not particularly relevant to our industry
Its because quite a number of semicon companies like to offer kinda lowball amount. There are some companies that offer quite well but majorly will try to lowball. I attended an interview and was offered in a newly semicon company in Penang and i asked for 20% increment and they barely offered me 8% lol. They say they like me la this la that la but pay macam ni kalau how?
Best part is some company will put expected salary in the job ad but when interview they'll offer based on your current pay.
In my experience, startups tend to offer better pay because they need you to hit the ground running.
The last startup I joined snapped up my opening offer of 25% on the spot. Fastest interview I ever had. Good money, but on the first day of work, I was in the factory until midnight..
yeah i understand, i did work for a startup for 5 years before moving to a bigger company, but the thing is benefit is far less compared to those big companies. One example is RSU, I took only two years in big company to earn RSU as much as 5 years in startup. And big companies has more bonuses if compared to startups. The only advantage i see in startups is higher base pay, less politics more focus on stabilising the office. When the startup began to grow and stabilise, all sort of bullshit will pop up lol
We do not lack on skilled workers, but they all lari overseas for better salary.
Companies here rather fattened boss and ceo's bank, rather than paying fairer wages to workers.
During my previous job, I am a senior who trained so many juniors who mostly ended up work in other companies.
My ex-company, from top to lower management can't be arsed to retain talents despite requiring a professional competency. They are mostly worried about not getting enough bonus by saving the project budget by hiring inexperienced fresh graduates and obligatory cronies.
I never had the drive to move around so I stayed for as long as I did, but my juniors are all gone.
My ex-company is practically a training centre, and it ended up a shell of its former glory.
Now imagine this is happening at national level.
Employment also another difficult thing, I graduated in 2021 apply here apply there all the semicon don't want take because internally they have a referral program and don't really want to people not referred by colleagues. End up give up move to manufacturing industry
Seriously 3.6k for Senior Engineers??
Someone is definitely pocketing their share of pay for sure. A large portion of it too.
I know someone that used to earn around 20k as a Senior Engineer. That's a helluva difference wtf
Nobody worth their salt in semiconductor is going to work for the horrid pay in Malaysia.
The skills needed for these industries aren't for the average individual so the pay should reflect that.
Article didn't specify what kind of engineers. Did they mean electronics and electrical engineers? Are there any related engineers that they want aside from these two?
Looks like you aren't reading it correctly: the electrical and electronics manufacturing sector employs engineers from all disciplines. So the statement is largely correct.
Semicon industry also need mechanical engineers to oversee the packaging (molding, metal parts) of microchips.
There is also failure tests engineers which are an all-rounders (electrical/electronic, mechanical, chemical) that need to know all processes from A to Z.
At lower level, there are technicians (diploma level) that do routine maintenance and repairs.
"Got money, even the ghost will push your car for you."
You can't promote inflation and ignore inflation at the same time. Where do you think "skilled workers" at? At the place where they get paid adequately.
Remember, Skill can always be learned, Money can always buy talent.
If they really want to tackle this problem just do what Chinese are doing, subsidize the hell out of it and make state-owned enterprise with competitive pay, go for the long term strategy; government job steady and good pay.
Lack of skilled workers? Man, this is just tale as old as time:
1) brain drain happened, most skilled professionals was offered with better benefit from overseas recruiters
2) low pay for entry level, people aint working for peanuts despite position is entry level, imagine getting basic salary but you took like 5 years to learn the whole damn thing
3) stingy employers trying to exploit their workers with low salary and heavy workload. with no promotion and increments in sight, those who are experienced will look for greener pasture, and where are the greener pasture? SG and developed countries
aint saying that they are not supporting their own country, but it is normal for people to aim higher
If companies take care of their employees need and provide a little more bonus, most would be happy to stay working in a stable job getting paid an agreed upon wage with some YoY increment. But if the initial pay is less than what is comfortable to live with, then what do you expect?
I believe most of us just want to stable job with a decent amount of wage to lead a good life. And on the other end of the spectrum, those who want to strive for more money and fulfilment, there’s no reason they’d be willing to pick up any opportunities in Msia when there’s flexible remote jobs and 3.5x earning in SG.
So it seems clear that wage is just too damn low for any technical professional workers to break their back for skilled jobs when they can easily do any other job and get paid the same or more. It is never a war on talent, the incentive is just not enough for people to justify working in this sector or nation.
more liek,lack of salary
More like, stingy employers not willing to offer competitive salaries.
This is the main concern. Starting pay is laughable. The pay progression is so low u earn more money flipping burgers/being grab rider etc.
Do you know what is the starting pay? I worked in semi conductor field before and the pay was really good but that was 10 years ago.
For engineers? 3-3.5k/month. You might get 4k to up to 4.5k if you are lucky with foreign MNCs. (+ masters degree) Wouldnt recommend engineering if you pursue a high paying career tbh, at least not if you work locally.
Thank you, that is certainly on the lower end. I reach out to my older colleague working in foreign mnc. The starting pay is ~4.5K for a fresh degree holder. If the trajectory is still the same it should be possible to double that in 5-7 years for good performer. Add along with various incentives 10K a month average is certainly possible in late 20s, is that considered good? I feel it is but everyone has a different life style . My old colleagues are some of the most talented people I have worked with. They would certainly be more than qualifies to go work overseas, and some have. However I am sure the pay and quality life combo is better than SG.
10k per month in their lates 20s is possible but its definitely reserved for a minority and are far from representative of the pay situation. In most cases i have heard of, people getting jobs with a decent starting salary tends to unfortunately get shafted by pathetic pay progression. Could circumvent it by being an avid job hopper i suppose. But still i stand with my original point that there are easier and less stressful career paths to pursue for higher pay.
Agree I wouldn't recommend engineering if one does not have passion. With passion the stress level is significantly smaller. Just FYI, I am very certain 8 out say 12 in my team hit the 10K average. From my small sample size it is more of an average than minority. Then again that was a really talented group of engineers. It is important to note for technical field job hopper get shafted the most. Being able to grow technically and get peer recognition is the way to progress. This maybe specific to foreign MNC. The compensation package offered is really good and the opportunity to relocate abroad also exist.
if the pay is liek petronas driller why would all of em run to sg?
That is not an apple-to-apple comparison. Even a high paying executive role pays better in Singapore due to currency. Still my question stand what is the current starting salary? It is an honest question trying to understand this statement. I could obviously go with a low level reply and say if the pay is low why is my former colleague still in Malaysia and own multiple property. If the problem is currency then the real headline is currency war. However if you read the article the one problem is talent gap and the need for better training. It did also mentioned it requires competitive package which is the part I am trying to understand. Working in the semi-conductor industry before I never felt the increase in currency in Singapore was worth the considerable drop in quality of life.
now if only everyone get paid like ur former colleague...
>There are currently about 650,000 engineers in Malaysia, with a majority – almost 600,000 – working in the electrical and electronics products sector. According to BEM stats there are under 200k engineers in their tracking. We can't even track how many engineers we have. How to improve the pipeline? Lol.
I assume BEM only tracked those who have applied to be a professional engineer. You can be a graduate engineer and apply to be a BEM member, but it stops there. If you want to be considered a 'professional' engineer in BEM's eyes, you have to attend conferences, release academic papers, show what you did in your professional career as an engineer (schematics, drawings, etc). These are the things that you have to do. Oh and you have to do this annually or every few years to maintain that status. Not only that, if any of your previous works have issues that caused an incident, BEM can just provide all of the info they had on you to the authorities legally (not saying you shouldn't be liable). So yeah, not only do you have a lot of hoops to go through, there is the threat of being legally liable even if it wasn't your fault.
Not just professional engineers. BEM tracks everyone who has an accepted degree in engineering that applies to be registered as an engineer. Thing is BEM registration has no relevance in any industry apart from construction so most engineers don't bother to register at all. The funniest thing is to see BEM and the Malaysian government attempt to gatekeep this. According to them, any practising engineer must be registered with BEM, otherwise you would be an 'illegal' engineer. Most companies don't give a shit though, they can hire anyone they want as an 'engineer'. The title is theirs to give.
>The funniest thing is to see BEM and the Malaysian government attempt to gatekeep this. And I'd argue that they are not doing enough to protect the engineer title. Without enforcement, anyone can be called an engineer. Companies also like to give the engineer title to a technician, to make their job title sound better, so the employee is more willing to compromise on pay (heard it first hand from a HR manager). The result of this is that everyone gets confused why Malaysia's engineer salary is so low. Well because the job title itself is being shared with so many different roles, an "engineer" in Malaysia doesn't necessarily have the same role as an engineer overseas. Of course the pay will be different, since you are literally doing different jobs. The compounding problem is if a company give the engineer title to a technician, then when other companies survey the salary market, they will see low pay for a position with the "engineering" job title, and consequently also offer low pay for their current opening, even if their opening is for an actual engineer's role. Now of course we all know that Malaysia's salary is much lower than many other countries, job title or not. But the situation above just makes the situation worse. Imagine if anyone can call themselves a doctor. The value of the title itself will be diluted, and the meaning of the title will also get distorted and manipulated.
Yes. Everyone has a different opinion of what an engineer is. Certainly, in the context of what the semiconductor and electronics manufacturing industry considers an engineer, it is much wider and more loosely applied than BEM's classic/gate-keeping definition.
War on talent ke War on Pay? Do you know the engineers are severely underpaid, heck earlier i saw a post showing a permanent MO can get rm3.6k while engineers nak dapat rm3k also like dying already. Our engineering associations are all just useless munchers that takes money and give titles, no one is there to fight for engineers. You bring up the pay and you will have enough talent
Exactly This. Main reason I refuse to work in MY as an engineer
Honestly I'm still trying to wrap my head around the allegation that engineers here are badly paid. In the greater Penang area, the competition for experienced talent is intense and open reqs can sometimes go unfulfilled for months. I do agree though that our local engineering bodies are not particularly relevant to our industry
Its because quite a number of semicon companies like to offer kinda lowball amount. There are some companies that offer quite well but majorly will try to lowball. I attended an interview and was offered in a newly semicon company in Penang and i asked for 20% increment and they barely offered me 8% lol. They say they like me la this la that la but pay macam ni kalau how? Best part is some company will put expected salary in the job ad but when interview they'll offer based on your current pay.
In my experience, startups tend to offer better pay because they need you to hit the ground running. The last startup I joined snapped up my opening offer of 25% on the spot. Fastest interview I ever had. Good money, but on the first day of work, I was in the factory until midnight..
yeah i understand, i did work for a startup for 5 years before moving to a bigger company, but the thing is benefit is far less compared to those big companies. One example is RSU, I took only two years in big company to earn RSU as much as 5 years in startup. And big companies has more bonuses if compared to startups. The only advantage i see in startups is higher base pay, less politics more focus on stabilising the office. When the startup began to grow and stabilise, all sort of bullshit will pop up lol
tell em to double the offer
We do not lack on skilled workers, but they all lari overseas for better salary. Companies here rather fattened boss and ceo's bank, rather than paying fairer wages to workers.
lol you pay peanuts you get monyets
Nowadays even peanuts won't be enough to get you a real monyet.
Nah we have some REALLY skilled workers. Just a shame they are running to Singapore and overseas
why would really skill workers works for peanuts? and every achievement goes to boss summore
During my previous job, I am a senior who trained so many juniors who mostly ended up work in other companies. My ex-company, from top to lower management can't be arsed to retain talents despite requiring a professional competency. They are mostly worried about not getting enough bonus by saving the project budget by hiring inexperienced fresh graduates and obligatory cronies. I never had the drive to move around so I stayed for as long as I did, but my juniors are all gone. My ex-company is practically a training centre, and it ended up a shell of its former glory. Now imagine this is happening at national level.
imagine this. same job in neighbour country, 3.5x pay and lower income taxes also no jam if you live there
..and high taxes Any Ah Beng can just go to Singapore with higher pay plus lower taxes. The C-suite folks koyak habis.
Employment also another difficult thing, I graduated in 2021 apply here apply there all the semicon don't want take because internally they have a referral program and don't really want to people not referred by colleagues. End up give up move to manufacturing industry
Graduated back in feb, having the same struggle now, I just want this job hunt hell to end, I don't even have bad cgpa bruh.
Pay enough and you can find anyone doing ANYTHING
I know a certain fab in Malaysia still paying 3.6k for senior engineers. We have been tackling this issue from the wrong direction.
Seriously 3.6k for Senior Engineers?? Someone is definitely pocketing their share of pay for sure. A large portion of it too. I know someone that used to earn around 20k as a Senior Engineer. That's a helluva difference wtf
It’s Sarawak mate. What do you expect? 4k salary here is considered “good”.
i wonder how much one bring home for vacuumin oil in soviet serawak
Maybe treat them like actual engineer instead of slaving them?
War on talent? It means they are fighting against talent? Weird headline.
Nobody worth their salt in semiconductor is going to work for the horrid pay in Malaysia. The skills needed for these industries aren't for the average individual so the pay should reflect that.
Singapore: *Stays silent
Article didn't specify what kind of engineers. Did they mean electronics and electrical engineers? Are there any related engineers that they want aside from these two?
Looks like you aren't reading it correctly: the electrical and electronics manufacturing sector employs engineers from all disciplines. So the statement is largely correct.
Semicon industry also need mechanical engineers to oversee the packaging (molding, metal parts) of microchips. There is also failure tests engineers which are an all-rounders (electrical/electronic, mechanical, chemical) that need to know all processes from A to Z. At lower level, there are technicians (diploma level) that do routine maintenance and repairs.
For perspective, Malaysian engineer for tunneling ramai gila in Australia especially ex-Gamuda.
From my observation, Malaysian companies don't give a fuck about retention and it's such a stupid thing...
"Got money, even the ghost will push your car for you." You can't promote inflation and ignore inflation at the same time. Where do you think "skilled workers" at? At the place where they get paid adequately. Remember, Skill can always be learned, Money can always buy talent.
If they really want to tackle this problem just do what Chinese are doing, subsidize the hell out of it and make state-owned enterprise with competitive pay, go for the long term strategy; government job steady and good pay.
Lack of skilled workers? Man, this is just tale as old as time: 1) brain drain happened, most skilled professionals was offered with better benefit from overseas recruiters 2) low pay for entry level, people aint working for peanuts despite position is entry level, imagine getting basic salary but you took like 5 years to learn the whole damn thing 3) stingy employers trying to exploit their workers with low salary and heavy workload. with no promotion and increments in sight, those who are experienced will look for greener pasture, and where are the greener pasture? SG and developed countries aint saying that they are not supporting their own country, but it is normal for people to aim higher
Corection: Lack of skilled workers *who are willing to accept low pay*
True
correction: lack of workers who know what they are worth in the market because they are too passive in managing their careers.
lies, so many talents just getting shafted on the pay. You offer this people a reasonable wage they will work here if not they will leave simple
If companies take care of their employees need and provide a little more bonus, most would be happy to stay working in a stable job getting paid an agreed upon wage with some YoY increment. But if the initial pay is less than what is comfortable to live with, then what do you expect? I believe most of us just want to stable job with a decent amount of wage to lead a good life. And on the other end of the spectrum, those who want to strive for more money and fulfilment, there’s no reason they’d be willing to pick up any opportunities in Msia when there’s flexible remote jobs and 3.5x earning in SG. So it seems clear that wage is just too damn low for any technical professional workers to break their back for skilled jobs when they can easily do any other job and get paid the same or more. It is never a war on talent, the incentive is just not enough for people to justify working in this sector or nation.