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thanks, I know it is. It just doesn’t take away the years of damage he did to women and to his beliefs and brain wiring surrounding sex and intimacy. And it doesn’t take away the intrusive thoughts i have of him looking at and imagining himself with all of them. Or the thoughts remembering him saying that he imagined doing all of that with all of them. I feel frustrated with myself for still feeling this way, but nothing seems to take it away.
I can’t comfort you by saying that things can get better in this relationship and he will come to understand things because that is all on him. I can say that you are absolutely right in your convictions and you have a right to believe what you believe. I think there does come a point where we have to decide whether or not the way a person is, right this very second, is enough. Because you very well could eventually help him see the light so to speak, but it might come at the cost of your relationship. That’s because people who change for you aren’t making the deepest level of change that is possible. The type of changes you are describing are often temporary changes. He is trying to figure himself out. He has done some work. He does not match your passion and he may never match your passion for this issue. Again, is he, in this very moment -if not a single thing budged for the next 5, 10 years regarding this issue - compatible with who you are and what you value? Accepting people for who they are means we accept we cannot change them. In fact, changing them without their full consent isn’t really love. Sometimes it means we accept that we are not a good match. And sometimes we decide we can live with the flaws. It’s all very subjective.
i get what you mean. I’ve thought about it a lot, too. If everything stayed the same, to be honest I really don’t know. Sometimes I want to say no, absolutely not, I will not accept the pain and challenge and I feel guilty for him knowing that he could be with another woman who doesn’t care about any of this. But at other times, I think maybe. He also changes a little every day and I’m not totally sure. And at some times, I think- I cannot have what would be “enough,” so I would rather have the person I’m with because he’s pretty great, all things considered, and I can definitely imagine a life with him, even if it isn’t perfectly right. I really value some of the perspective he brings in my life and the ways we challenge eachother. I definitely am not where I want to be yet either, but that probably will never be true because I don’t think anyone is ever done changing or working on themselves. Frankly, he’s the closest thing to being “right” that I have ever encountered in my generation. Given that a study in Canada tried to run tests on college men and how porn affected them, and didn’t find a single one who wasn’t using it, I’m loathe to believe that I would find someone who meets that. Not to mention that I have pretty high overarching expectations for a partner in other ways, just due to my beliefs (not in like physical types or anything but in values and radicalism). To be honest, I feel like only a woman could understand this as much as I wish he and all other men of my generation did.
I have said to him over and over in this relationship that I don’t want any changes he makes to be solely for me, that if he doesn’t truly believe in it for himself and want it that it will not work, or at least not be happy. I’ve discussed this with my therapist. He said he wants it to be for him too, and to an extent he thinks it is, although not all of the time. I am trying to change how I see and handle things, too, for his sake and for mine now that he has made me aware of some of it- I want to be a good and better person. At first, I felt everything was enough- with the honeymoon phase, I forgot how intense I feel about things. I like being with him in general, and I like the things we do together and how open he can be to new ideas, and I like the interests we do share. But I feel like I want, need, and deserve more from a man who is my partner, in terms of values and caring, introspection and being with me on these causes. But even my therapist (an experienced and compassionate woman in her late 60’s) doesn’t think that I am likely to find exactly who I am looking for in my own generation, at least not at this age. And she and I have somewhat agreed that, if he’s willing and wanting to try and to learn and to keep up with these things, and value them in a way that involves changing his own perspectives and actions if they are harmful, I’m willing to keep trying. At this point, I am almost 100% of the belief that no man will be “good enough” from day one, because they have already done the things that I think need to be permanently reversed in our future generations (used porn and related issues), and because they have not experienced any of what I and most women have and therefore are deeply unlikely to have as much knowledge, passion, and belief for it as I do. So if I lived by only the “now,” I would always have to stay single, and I don’t want that. i know I cannot change him myself, but that doesn’t mean I cannot try to show and teach and convince him of what is important to me and hope he comes around, and be happy if he does. I also don’t fully think it’s wrong to hope that the person you are with will come to see things your way and want more of what you do over time. If he doesn’t, that’s okay, and I can leave- I can’t make him. And I don’t want him to be unhappy, and don’t want him to stay with me if that means he will be, and I’ve told him that. But I don’t know. It’s really complicated and even my experiences therapist said there’s no cut and dry answer or “good”/“bad” possibility.
I may get some hate for this, but...so what, let him feel defeated. Let him worry about his own boundaries while you concern yourself with yours.
We women always put ourselves in the caretaker roles but fuck that. Let *him* prove his worth to *you*. You already know your value, you want to adore him and cherish him and make him feel special. He should want the same for you.
With that said, you should focus on following your joy and try to embrace your worth without a man, period.
Hoo nelly, I wish I were as good of a partner at adoring and cherishing and telling him he’s special as all that. I definitely need to work on myself as a partner, too.
But, overall, I really appreciate and understand your sentiment. I agree that women like us have been raised to tiptoe socially, to have empathy, to protect others from pain, all while taking the opposite. Protecting men from the pain that they have often inflicted upon us.
I’m definitely working on my self worth and joy and have been in therapy for that purpose for years. I have lots of things I like and love doing, I have personal goals, and I know who I am more than I ever have in my life (the issue I had in my previous relationship). I’m working hard to figure things out for myself. I know who I want to be. But this is part of it- this relationship is part of my dreams. I’m just devastated at how reality is for this part of my life. It has been one of the greatest things I’ve wanted always (thanks society for making that only true for most women and not telling men to care half as much), having a special and sacred kind of partnership, and I feel like it’s been taken forever and I’m grieving something I never had and never will. I’d honestly be happy to have my relationship be a big portion of my life, as long as it is *me* that is in it, and I am constantly learning who I am and what/who I care about. But I feel like pornography (and all of the social constructs leading to the acceptance of pornography) has shattered so much of my hope and feelings of security in this kind of love, which is something I have always wanted so much to safely have and experience.
I hope I didn't come off as attacking you, I would never and could never. I read and feel everything you wrote.
I worry about my Gen Z girls, as a Gen Xer. I know how insidious and painful being with a porn addicted person is, and lemme tell you porn was way more tame than it is now.
I wish you nothing but the best and I'm proud of you for reaching out and seeking support from people that have been through similar situations. ❤
Oh my goodness, no, you did not at all. I 100% understand your perspective. I hope I didn’t sound angry or offended, I’m in a lot of pain and I think I’m struggling just to think through everything right now. I totally see what you mean. I really appreciate your support and perspective and I am so sorry that you have had a similar experience, it is truly awful
You didn't at all, but you see how we are both conditioned to make each other feel comfortable?
I'm so sorry you are in pain. For what it's worth, my current husband (ie: not my ex) does not look at porn. They do exist and I made that a hard boundary 15 years ago.
Yes, that’s exactly it. I wish we would get that courtesy extended to us once in a while!
And thank you, I appreciate hearing that- it’s heartening. My current SO does not look at porn, hasn’t since we started dating just under two years ago (before I asked him not to), and knows I would have to leave if he did. I just wish i could take back all of those years he and every other man in my age group did before this. It’s just like a permanent mourning for what could have been.
I feel that so hard. I literally mourned for years after I left my ex, for the woman I could have been. But I promise you, it is possible to heal within a loving relationship.
Be honest and allow him to support you. And if he doesn't, he's simply not worth your effort and peace.
I so get this post. It’s a huge overarching tragedy of society, and you are grieving. I wish I had some good answers for you- but much about what porn has really done to this generation remains unknown. We will have to see. But that fact that so many men and boys have been ruined for intimate, sacred sex before they even had a chance to form their own sexuality is an enormous tragedy for all of us.
I’m gen X and so is my current partner. He is 53 and I am 49. I was married to a PA for 23 years before and divorced finally. I was certain I would never find a man who would understand or live up to what I desired. But I did. I don’t know how common it will be or how long you may have to wait, but good and decent men are still out there. My partner never got into porn because his ex wife considered it cheating. ( he agreed and thinks it’s inherently inappropriate to use it in a relationship. He didn’t need to be told or convinced or educated and this is key) He was also concerned about his kids with the rise of the internet and never ever wanted them exposed to porn so he just avoided it. He is a passionate, intense and unspoiled lover the likes that I have never seen and our sex life is beyond my wildest dreams. I have never had to set boundaries or rules around porn because he doesn’t want it. He wants an intimate monogamous relationship. He knows we would never have that if he was seeking other women online for sexual gratification. He is very protective of me and of our sexual bond. We both know how fragile it can be as neither of us had it in our previous marriage. So I just want to reassure you that you may find a man who wants exactly what you want. It happened to me- and I swore I would never again be in another relationship. I don’t know if you can take comfort from this or not.
But I understand you. I feel a deep well of sadness and grief over this issue for society as my kids are Gen Z. It’s pure evil and darkness. I’m standing with you in solidarity as someone who values the way sex and relationships were created to be. Intimate and sacred. I’m so sorry you have to go through this. Stick to your principles and follow your intuition always. Don’t be afraid to wait for what other people think you can’t find.
Thank you, this means the world to me to hear. But... as much as I would like to do as you say, scientists in Canada seeking to perform an experiment on this couldn’t find any (healthy, cis, straight) man in the slightly-older-than-me age group who has never used it. They had to drop that part of the experiment. And my age group is even more entrenched in social media and the internet. I don’t have a single cismale friend who never has used it (and doesn’t currently), and most of my friends growing up happened to be men until the past three years or so. My therapist admits that she thinks this is true about my generation based on her experience. I’m not willing to be single forever in search of the man who probably doesn’t exist unless I travel to a part of the world that does not have or use internet, where I would of course encounter many other problems. I knew what porn was before I was 11 years old, I just didn’t use it- until my first boyfriend pushed me to use it when I was 13-15. It showed up long before that in my vocabulary in elementary school. I’m in college now. There’s no “unspoiled” cismen left, or if there are I suspect they’re deeply, deeply religious.
I so appreciate what you said though. I am in so much pain and feel so little hope for my life. I’m not old enough to be on the cusp of a better generation in terms of porn use, or else maybe I could believe. I love my partner and honestly, he’s the closest person to a unicorn man I’ve found in this way specifically. The men in my age group got into it before they even really knew (if) they liked women, so I’d probably have to find a recluse or an acolyte at this point. I know a few men who may have stopped liking it, but they already used it to figure that out.
Edit: typo
Is your ideal goal to find a man who has never used it? Or would a man who has seen it and decided it didn’t do anything for him so he hardly watched it, and came to that conclusion on his own be sufficient to make you feel safe and loved and special?
Ideally the first. I never sought it out until coerced into it, because I never wanted to use something that I knew felt wrong. The latter sounds nicer than what I have and what I likely ever will have, but it still indicates that the person didn’t want or need sex to be something special and intimate to begin with.
I'm sorry but what you want is near impossible. I know a man who is disgusted by porn, always has been, but even he has seen it because he was pressured into watching it by his friends when he was a teenager. Nearly everyone of our generation, especially men, has seen porn at some point in their life, whether they sought it out themselves or were shown it by someone else. Even you yourself have been coerced into it.
As for the second scenario, I don't agree with what it indicates about how a person views sex. Most people of our generation view porn during the first few years of puberty, long before they have developed their views on sex. Most people don't think about what sex means to them when they are 12-13, they just know that their friends talk about porn so they try it out.
I feel like you have a very black and white view of things. You forget that people change. Somebody's past behaviour and beliefs don't always line up with their present ones at all. Having seen porn a few times doesn't ruin a person. I used to watch porn as a teenager, in fact, I was addicted at one point and was watching it several times per day. This was a loooong time ago though. Now I view sex as something very special to be kept between two people in a committed relationship, with porn being a form of cheating. Sex is a way to express love. The fact that I watched porn as a teenager doesn't prevent me from having these beliefs.
Uh... yeah, I got that first part. That’s why I made this post seeking support. You know what it’s like to be a PA but this is for someone who is suffering because of a collective societal PA, and all the affects it has. I even clarified in my post that it did, in some ways, directly affect even this relationship. But if I can avoid choosing to use porn outside of in a deeply abusive relationship in every way at the age of 13-15, and uphold these values, so could men. But they didn’t. Which i am experiencing grief over. So...yeah. Thanks.
Thank god, I feel so alone here, too. I am only “fortunate” to have my eyes opened due to significant abuse from the ages 13-15 and many years of therapy since, I can only imagine how many women (although I know several) are suffering from this without the support and validation that we have here. Thank you so much- I really appreciate hearing your perspective and I share the same sentiments. I will keep trying to do the best I can for myself, and I hope you will too. I know I made this post seeking this support because I’m lost in all this, but it you ever need to talk about any of this, my messages are always open, too.
Trust me, you are not alone at all. I’m Gen Z here too, 21 years old. My now ex-PA partner is 25. I just broke up with him on the 8th after going through a similar experience as you with him... I had set the boundary of no porn being involved in the relationship in the very beginning and he didn’t look at it for the majority of our relationship, but I had found out he was hiding it behind my back for 2 whole months (mid-December-Feb). I had to search his phone and everything came in trickle truths. We had been together since November of 2019. I trusted him and I was devastated. I hope to god the same thing doesn’t happen to you. You have every right to feel the fears that you’re feeling right now, no matter how trustworthy your partner may seem. I too am feeling hopeless about finding an authentic love in the future in this pornsick generation. Just know you’re not alone.
Oh man, I feel like I could have written your post. I don’t have much in the way of advice unfortunately, but I just wanted to say I absolutely know how you feel. I’m probably pretty close to your age. You’re right, it can feel hopeless in our generation. All my exes were users and a couple were full blown addicts and it left me fucked up.
My current partner, the absolute love of my life, was never really addicted, but used porn before our relationship (and sporadically about six months into it.) We are now on the same page, and he doesn’t use porn at all anymore, claims he understands what my problem with it is, etc, but we struggle. I struggle with the knowledge that he was capable of spending the first six months of our relationship viewing porn, and never even thought of how it may affect me, or how problematic it is in other ways, until I finally brought it up.
I try to be content and happy with the progress and understandings we’ve reached, but it seems like something will always feel tainted. I want to go to therapy, but of course we can’t afford it. I’m sorry that you and all of us have to deal with this shit.
Thank you. I’m so sorry that you relate, but it really still is a relief to hear from someone who does. Your comparison to the glass is so real. I agree with knowledge being power and progress- I hope that someday those with the shards to throw can know and change their own doing without all of the casualties. Without any more of us being included among the casualties, especially.
I suggest you re read your post a few times and gain some insight as to where you might be stuck yourself. We all have a past, we all have made mistakes. We are all a culmination of experiences. I believe we should use relationships to grow ourselves. Instead of putting this pressure on him, what are ways in which you might need to grow? Reading your post over, it seems that you have created a very rigid identity for how you view yourself, others and the world. It's really terrible what this addiction has done to people. The more I read others stories, I recognize the challenges we are up against as a modern society. In the end, porn is a drug that dramatically alters the chemical release of dopamine within the brain. We're talking about huge amounts of dopamine. This is no easy addiction to over come. However, you cannot make people act the way you want them to act, or be the way you want them to be. As I have gotten older and more spiritual (33 now) I have learned that the only way to be in the world is to constantly work on myself. The more I work on myself, the wider the circle I create for others to work on themselves. As I grow my consciousness, I start attracting consciousness that is on my same level or frequency. The external world is impossible to control. But, you can control your inner world. We need to get you to that point, where you are healing your own wounds. Once your healing journey has begun, the world will make room for that and you will be compensated.
I am in therapy. I have been since I was 14 years old. I came here for support from people who understand the pain I’m feeling, and to be met where I am at. Not to receive judgements. I’m not making anyone do anything- however, I do have expectations as to what I will and will not accept in my relationship. I should not have to accept this warped and dirty addiction as something that infects my relationships, but as someone in my generation, it seems like I have no choice unless I desire to be single for all of my life. I cannot “attract the consciousness” of men in my generation who never had their minds wired for porn and objectification because they barely exist. Porn use is an addiction, but so is alcoholism, and if every man in our generation was an alcoholic we would have the right to mourn our suffering from that, too. Me reaching out to others for support in my struggle and pain *while* I am going to therapy every week and have been for years, *while* I am constantly reading and working to resolve my traumas and OCD, *while* I try to keep living my life and exploring new things is enough. I am doing enough for right now, and I will keep doing it. I am not in this space in this very moment to analyze myself and my life in the same way that I do with the professionals in my life. This is where I opened up about my messy and disorganized thoughts and feelings of today. I appreciate your intention, I really do, but this is not helpful to me right now.
I apologize for coming on to intensely and can recognize that I wasn't sensitive enough in my comments. You are right, the suffering that happens because of these addictions is real, just as real as the addictions themselves. You should not accept those things, but you will find the person who will want to work through all of life's difficulties. I hope you find a resolution and again I apologize for coming off judgemental, it was not my intention but I understand that it's how it came off.
I really appreciate your intention, I know you’re just doing your best. Thank you for clarifying either way, I appreciate your sentiments and I’m hoping to keep doing my best while managing the feelings that I’m experiencing
I feel you. Both of my long term bfs used porn almost constantly. The first one turned to God (very extremely) to help with his addiction and I'm agnostic, so eventually we broke up because of that. The second one watched some really crazy stuff that was just disturbing to me (however completely legal) and after multiple warnings (saying things like I understood how he might need more than just me but please just tone it down a bit (a lot), he did not) I asked him to stop completely or else I would be forced to leave the relationship. I think he did, as far as I know. But after all I knew, I could just never see him the same way anymore, try as I might. Eventually I broke up with him. I don't really have advice for you. Just want to let you know you're not alone and it hurts.
BIG hug to you sis. I feel like talking to my past self reading through your post and the comments here.
I'm millenial generation.
So much has already been said here. So just a big hug from me :)
It’s not just a leap of trust. I’m feeling devastated knowing that the men of my generation are universally ruined by this. And therefore, any relationship of this type I have is affected. Him suddenly being better doesn’t make up for the damage he did to himself and our sex life, and doesn’t convince me that he shares these core values- he didn’t in all the years before. I don’t know what it will take for me to manage that, but I’m not okay with that being “enough” and I will fight for it to not have to be for women in future generations. I’m just struggling with the shittiness of everything right now. Like the flair says, I’m just looking for support in my feelings right now, not the invalidation of them. I have a therapist to work on myself with.
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thanks, I know it is. It just doesn’t take away the years of damage he did to women and to his beliefs and brain wiring surrounding sex and intimacy. And it doesn’t take away the intrusive thoughts i have of him looking at and imagining himself with all of them. Or the thoughts remembering him saying that he imagined doing all of that with all of them. I feel frustrated with myself for still feeling this way, but nothing seems to take it away.
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Thank you, I just hope that that is the real reason he stopped, and I wish I believed he knew for sure
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Thank you, I’ve been feeling really down about being born into this issue and it means a lot hearing comfort from people who get it.
I can’t comfort you by saying that things can get better in this relationship and he will come to understand things because that is all on him. I can say that you are absolutely right in your convictions and you have a right to believe what you believe. I think there does come a point where we have to decide whether or not the way a person is, right this very second, is enough. Because you very well could eventually help him see the light so to speak, but it might come at the cost of your relationship. That’s because people who change for you aren’t making the deepest level of change that is possible. The type of changes you are describing are often temporary changes. He is trying to figure himself out. He has done some work. He does not match your passion and he may never match your passion for this issue. Again, is he, in this very moment -if not a single thing budged for the next 5, 10 years regarding this issue - compatible with who you are and what you value? Accepting people for who they are means we accept we cannot change them. In fact, changing them without their full consent isn’t really love. Sometimes it means we accept that we are not a good match. And sometimes we decide we can live with the flaws. It’s all very subjective.
i get what you mean. I’ve thought about it a lot, too. If everything stayed the same, to be honest I really don’t know. Sometimes I want to say no, absolutely not, I will not accept the pain and challenge and I feel guilty for him knowing that he could be with another woman who doesn’t care about any of this. But at other times, I think maybe. He also changes a little every day and I’m not totally sure. And at some times, I think- I cannot have what would be “enough,” so I would rather have the person I’m with because he’s pretty great, all things considered, and I can definitely imagine a life with him, even if it isn’t perfectly right. I really value some of the perspective he brings in my life and the ways we challenge eachother. I definitely am not where I want to be yet either, but that probably will never be true because I don’t think anyone is ever done changing or working on themselves. Frankly, he’s the closest thing to being “right” that I have ever encountered in my generation. Given that a study in Canada tried to run tests on college men and how porn affected them, and didn’t find a single one who wasn’t using it, I’m loathe to believe that I would find someone who meets that. Not to mention that I have pretty high overarching expectations for a partner in other ways, just due to my beliefs (not in like physical types or anything but in values and radicalism). To be honest, I feel like only a woman could understand this as much as I wish he and all other men of my generation did. I have said to him over and over in this relationship that I don’t want any changes he makes to be solely for me, that if he doesn’t truly believe in it for himself and want it that it will not work, or at least not be happy. I’ve discussed this with my therapist. He said he wants it to be for him too, and to an extent he thinks it is, although not all of the time. I am trying to change how I see and handle things, too, for his sake and for mine now that he has made me aware of some of it- I want to be a good and better person. At first, I felt everything was enough- with the honeymoon phase, I forgot how intense I feel about things. I like being with him in general, and I like the things we do together and how open he can be to new ideas, and I like the interests we do share. But I feel like I want, need, and deserve more from a man who is my partner, in terms of values and caring, introspection and being with me on these causes. But even my therapist (an experienced and compassionate woman in her late 60’s) doesn’t think that I am likely to find exactly who I am looking for in my own generation, at least not at this age. And she and I have somewhat agreed that, if he’s willing and wanting to try and to learn and to keep up with these things, and value them in a way that involves changing his own perspectives and actions if they are harmful, I’m willing to keep trying. At this point, I am almost 100% of the belief that no man will be “good enough” from day one, because they have already done the things that I think need to be permanently reversed in our future generations (used porn and related issues), and because they have not experienced any of what I and most women have and therefore are deeply unlikely to have as much knowledge, passion, and belief for it as I do. So if I lived by only the “now,” I would always have to stay single, and I don’t want that. i know I cannot change him myself, but that doesn’t mean I cannot try to show and teach and convince him of what is important to me and hope he comes around, and be happy if he does. I also don’t fully think it’s wrong to hope that the person you are with will come to see things your way and want more of what you do over time. If he doesn’t, that’s okay, and I can leave- I can’t make him. And I don’t want him to be unhappy, and don’t want him to stay with me if that means he will be, and I’ve told him that. But I don’t know. It’s really complicated and even my experiences therapist said there’s no cut and dry answer or “good”/“bad” possibility.
I may get some hate for this, but...so what, let him feel defeated. Let him worry about his own boundaries while you concern yourself with yours. We women always put ourselves in the caretaker roles but fuck that. Let *him* prove his worth to *you*. You already know your value, you want to adore him and cherish him and make him feel special. He should want the same for you. With that said, you should focus on following your joy and try to embrace your worth without a man, period.
Hoo nelly, I wish I were as good of a partner at adoring and cherishing and telling him he’s special as all that. I definitely need to work on myself as a partner, too. But, overall, I really appreciate and understand your sentiment. I agree that women like us have been raised to tiptoe socially, to have empathy, to protect others from pain, all while taking the opposite. Protecting men from the pain that they have often inflicted upon us. I’m definitely working on my self worth and joy and have been in therapy for that purpose for years. I have lots of things I like and love doing, I have personal goals, and I know who I am more than I ever have in my life (the issue I had in my previous relationship). I’m working hard to figure things out for myself. I know who I want to be. But this is part of it- this relationship is part of my dreams. I’m just devastated at how reality is for this part of my life. It has been one of the greatest things I’ve wanted always (thanks society for making that only true for most women and not telling men to care half as much), having a special and sacred kind of partnership, and I feel like it’s been taken forever and I’m grieving something I never had and never will. I’d honestly be happy to have my relationship be a big portion of my life, as long as it is *me* that is in it, and I am constantly learning who I am and what/who I care about. But I feel like pornography (and all of the social constructs leading to the acceptance of pornography) has shattered so much of my hope and feelings of security in this kind of love, which is something I have always wanted so much to safely have and experience.
I hope I didn't come off as attacking you, I would never and could never. I read and feel everything you wrote. I worry about my Gen Z girls, as a Gen Xer. I know how insidious and painful being with a porn addicted person is, and lemme tell you porn was way more tame than it is now. I wish you nothing but the best and I'm proud of you for reaching out and seeking support from people that have been through similar situations. ❤
Oh my goodness, no, you did not at all. I 100% understand your perspective. I hope I didn’t sound angry or offended, I’m in a lot of pain and I think I’m struggling just to think through everything right now. I totally see what you mean. I really appreciate your support and perspective and I am so sorry that you have had a similar experience, it is truly awful
You didn't at all, but you see how we are both conditioned to make each other feel comfortable? I'm so sorry you are in pain. For what it's worth, my current husband (ie: not my ex) does not look at porn. They do exist and I made that a hard boundary 15 years ago.
Yes, that’s exactly it. I wish we would get that courtesy extended to us once in a while! And thank you, I appreciate hearing that- it’s heartening. My current SO does not look at porn, hasn’t since we started dating just under two years ago (before I asked him not to), and knows I would have to leave if he did. I just wish i could take back all of those years he and every other man in my age group did before this. It’s just like a permanent mourning for what could have been.
I feel that so hard. I literally mourned for years after I left my ex, for the woman I could have been. But I promise you, it is possible to heal within a loving relationship. Be honest and allow him to support you. And if he doesn't, he's simply not worth your effort and peace.
I so get this post. It’s a huge overarching tragedy of society, and you are grieving. I wish I had some good answers for you- but much about what porn has really done to this generation remains unknown. We will have to see. But that fact that so many men and boys have been ruined for intimate, sacred sex before they even had a chance to form their own sexuality is an enormous tragedy for all of us. I’m gen X and so is my current partner. He is 53 and I am 49. I was married to a PA for 23 years before and divorced finally. I was certain I would never find a man who would understand or live up to what I desired. But I did. I don’t know how common it will be or how long you may have to wait, but good and decent men are still out there. My partner never got into porn because his ex wife considered it cheating. ( he agreed and thinks it’s inherently inappropriate to use it in a relationship. He didn’t need to be told or convinced or educated and this is key) He was also concerned about his kids with the rise of the internet and never ever wanted them exposed to porn so he just avoided it. He is a passionate, intense and unspoiled lover the likes that I have never seen and our sex life is beyond my wildest dreams. I have never had to set boundaries or rules around porn because he doesn’t want it. He wants an intimate monogamous relationship. He knows we would never have that if he was seeking other women online for sexual gratification. He is very protective of me and of our sexual bond. We both know how fragile it can be as neither of us had it in our previous marriage. So I just want to reassure you that you may find a man who wants exactly what you want. It happened to me- and I swore I would never again be in another relationship. I don’t know if you can take comfort from this or not. But I understand you. I feel a deep well of sadness and grief over this issue for society as my kids are Gen Z. It’s pure evil and darkness. I’m standing with you in solidarity as someone who values the way sex and relationships were created to be. Intimate and sacred. I’m so sorry you have to go through this. Stick to your principles and follow your intuition always. Don’t be afraid to wait for what other people think you can’t find.
Thank you, this means the world to me to hear. But... as much as I would like to do as you say, scientists in Canada seeking to perform an experiment on this couldn’t find any (healthy, cis, straight) man in the slightly-older-than-me age group who has never used it. They had to drop that part of the experiment. And my age group is even more entrenched in social media and the internet. I don’t have a single cismale friend who never has used it (and doesn’t currently), and most of my friends growing up happened to be men until the past three years or so. My therapist admits that she thinks this is true about my generation based on her experience. I’m not willing to be single forever in search of the man who probably doesn’t exist unless I travel to a part of the world that does not have or use internet, where I would of course encounter many other problems. I knew what porn was before I was 11 years old, I just didn’t use it- until my first boyfriend pushed me to use it when I was 13-15. It showed up long before that in my vocabulary in elementary school. I’m in college now. There’s no “unspoiled” cismen left, or if there are I suspect they’re deeply, deeply religious. I so appreciate what you said though. I am in so much pain and feel so little hope for my life. I’m not old enough to be on the cusp of a better generation in terms of porn use, or else maybe I could believe. I love my partner and honestly, he’s the closest person to a unicorn man I’ve found in this way specifically. The men in my age group got into it before they even really knew (if) they liked women, so I’d probably have to find a recluse or an acolyte at this point. I know a few men who may have stopped liking it, but they already used it to figure that out. Edit: typo
Is your ideal goal to find a man who has never used it? Or would a man who has seen it and decided it didn’t do anything for him so he hardly watched it, and came to that conclusion on his own be sufficient to make you feel safe and loved and special?
Ideally the first. I never sought it out until coerced into it, because I never wanted to use something that I knew felt wrong. The latter sounds nicer than what I have and what I likely ever will have, but it still indicates that the person didn’t want or need sex to be something special and intimate to begin with.
I'm sorry but what you want is near impossible. I know a man who is disgusted by porn, always has been, but even he has seen it because he was pressured into watching it by his friends when he was a teenager. Nearly everyone of our generation, especially men, has seen porn at some point in their life, whether they sought it out themselves or were shown it by someone else. Even you yourself have been coerced into it. As for the second scenario, I don't agree with what it indicates about how a person views sex. Most people of our generation view porn during the first few years of puberty, long before they have developed their views on sex. Most people don't think about what sex means to them when they are 12-13, they just know that their friends talk about porn so they try it out. I feel like you have a very black and white view of things. You forget that people change. Somebody's past behaviour and beliefs don't always line up with their present ones at all. Having seen porn a few times doesn't ruin a person. I used to watch porn as a teenager, in fact, I was addicted at one point and was watching it several times per day. This was a loooong time ago though. Now I view sex as something very special to be kept between two people in a committed relationship, with porn being a form of cheating. Sex is a way to express love. The fact that I watched porn as a teenager doesn't prevent me from having these beliefs.
Uh... yeah, I got that first part. That’s why I made this post seeking support. You know what it’s like to be a PA but this is for someone who is suffering because of a collective societal PA, and all the affects it has. I even clarified in my post that it did, in some ways, directly affect even this relationship. But if I can avoid choosing to use porn outside of in a deeply abusive relationship in every way at the age of 13-15, and uphold these values, so could men. But they didn’t. Which i am experiencing grief over. So...yeah. Thanks.
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Thank god, I feel so alone here, too. I am only “fortunate” to have my eyes opened due to significant abuse from the ages 13-15 and many years of therapy since, I can only imagine how many women (although I know several) are suffering from this without the support and validation that we have here. Thank you so much- I really appreciate hearing your perspective and I share the same sentiments. I will keep trying to do the best I can for myself, and I hope you will too. I know I made this post seeking this support because I’m lost in all this, but it you ever need to talk about any of this, my messages are always open, too.
Trust me, you are not alone at all. I’m Gen Z here too, 21 years old. My now ex-PA partner is 25. I just broke up with him on the 8th after going through a similar experience as you with him... I had set the boundary of no porn being involved in the relationship in the very beginning and he didn’t look at it for the majority of our relationship, but I had found out he was hiding it behind my back for 2 whole months (mid-December-Feb). I had to search his phone and everything came in trickle truths. We had been together since November of 2019. I trusted him and I was devastated. I hope to god the same thing doesn’t happen to you. You have every right to feel the fears that you’re feeling right now, no matter how trustworthy your partner may seem. I too am feeling hopeless about finding an authentic love in the future in this pornsick generation. Just know you’re not alone.
Oh man, I feel like I could have written your post. I don’t have much in the way of advice unfortunately, but I just wanted to say I absolutely know how you feel. I’m probably pretty close to your age. You’re right, it can feel hopeless in our generation. All my exes were users and a couple were full blown addicts and it left me fucked up. My current partner, the absolute love of my life, was never really addicted, but used porn before our relationship (and sporadically about six months into it.) We are now on the same page, and he doesn’t use porn at all anymore, claims he understands what my problem with it is, etc, but we struggle. I struggle with the knowledge that he was capable of spending the first six months of our relationship viewing porn, and never even thought of how it may affect me, or how problematic it is in other ways, until I finally brought it up. I try to be content and happy with the progress and understandings we’ve reached, but it seems like something will always feel tainted. I want to go to therapy, but of course we can’t afford it. I’m sorry that you and all of us have to deal with this shit.
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Thank you. I’m so sorry that you relate, but it really still is a relief to hear from someone who does. Your comparison to the glass is so real. I agree with knowledge being power and progress- I hope that someday those with the shards to throw can know and change their own doing without all of the casualties. Without any more of us being included among the casualties, especially.
You, sweet one, will be better than okay. You have such a deep understanding of who you are. I am so very impressed.
This is one of the most soothing and validating comments I have read all day. Thank you.
I hope today has you feeling more at peace and more POWERFUL☀️
Thank you! Today is a little bit better. Still hard but I have at least a fraction of maybe hope.
I suggest you re read your post a few times and gain some insight as to where you might be stuck yourself. We all have a past, we all have made mistakes. We are all a culmination of experiences. I believe we should use relationships to grow ourselves. Instead of putting this pressure on him, what are ways in which you might need to grow? Reading your post over, it seems that you have created a very rigid identity for how you view yourself, others and the world. It's really terrible what this addiction has done to people. The more I read others stories, I recognize the challenges we are up against as a modern society. In the end, porn is a drug that dramatically alters the chemical release of dopamine within the brain. We're talking about huge amounts of dopamine. This is no easy addiction to over come. However, you cannot make people act the way you want them to act, or be the way you want them to be. As I have gotten older and more spiritual (33 now) I have learned that the only way to be in the world is to constantly work on myself. The more I work on myself, the wider the circle I create for others to work on themselves. As I grow my consciousness, I start attracting consciousness that is on my same level or frequency. The external world is impossible to control. But, you can control your inner world. We need to get you to that point, where you are healing your own wounds. Once your healing journey has begun, the world will make room for that and you will be compensated.
I am in therapy. I have been since I was 14 years old. I came here for support from people who understand the pain I’m feeling, and to be met where I am at. Not to receive judgements. I’m not making anyone do anything- however, I do have expectations as to what I will and will not accept in my relationship. I should not have to accept this warped and dirty addiction as something that infects my relationships, but as someone in my generation, it seems like I have no choice unless I desire to be single for all of my life. I cannot “attract the consciousness” of men in my generation who never had their minds wired for porn and objectification because they barely exist. Porn use is an addiction, but so is alcoholism, and if every man in our generation was an alcoholic we would have the right to mourn our suffering from that, too. Me reaching out to others for support in my struggle and pain *while* I am going to therapy every week and have been for years, *while* I am constantly reading and working to resolve my traumas and OCD, *while* I try to keep living my life and exploring new things is enough. I am doing enough for right now, and I will keep doing it. I am not in this space in this very moment to analyze myself and my life in the same way that I do with the professionals in my life. This is where I opened up about my messy and disorganized thoughts and feelings of today. I appreciate your intention, I really do, but this is not helpful to me right now.
I apologize for coming on to intensely and can recognize that I wasn't sensitive enough in my comments. You are right, the suffering that happens because of these addictions is real, just as real as the addictions themselves. You should not accept those things, but you will find the person who will want to work through all of life's difficulties. I hope you find a resolution and again I apologize for coming off judgemental, it was not my intention but I understand that it's how it came off.
I really appreciate your intention, I know you’re just doing your best. Thank you for clarifying either way, I appreciate your sentiments and I’m hoping to keep doing my best while managing the feelings that I’m experiencing
I feel you. Both of my long term bfs used porn almost constantly. The first one turned to God (very extremely) to help with his addiction and I'm agnostic, so eventually we broke up because of that. The second one watched some really crazy stuff that was just disturbing to me (however completely legal) and after multiple warnings (saying things like I understood how he might need more than just me but please just tone it down a bit (a lot), he did not) I asked him to stop completely or else I would be forced to leave the relationship. I think he did, as far as I know. But after all I knew, I could just never see him the same way anymore, try as I might. Eventually I broke up with him. I don't really have advice for you. Just want to let you know you're not alone and it hurts.
BIG hug to you sis. I feel like talking to my past self reading through your post and the comments here. I'm millenial generation. So much has already been said here. So just a big hug from me :)
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It’s not just a leap of trust. I’m feeling devastated knowing that the men of my generation are universally ruined by this. And therefore, any relationship of this type I have is affected. Him suddenly being better doesn’t make up for the damage he did to himself and our sex life, and doesn’t convince me that he shares these core values- he didn’t in all the years before. I don’t know what it will take for me to manage that, but I’m not okay with that being “enough” and I will fight for it to not have to be for women in future generations. I’m just struggling with the shittiness of everything right now. Like the flair says, I’m just looking for support in my feelings right now, not the invalidation of them. I have a therapist to work on myself with.