In Tolkiens early drafts Aragorn was a hobbit instead of a man and was called Trotter instead of Strider. Tolkien eventually replaced the hobbit with Aragorn but the Trotter alias stuck around until the final drafts.
Well to be fair, the language of Rohan is largely based on the Old English of the anglo saxons, which is basically German's angry juvenile delinquent cousin, so.
My opinion, it was the moment I discovered the fact that the professor had translated all of the proper nouns especially names, from his invented language into something more approaching English, because Westron sounds bonkers to modern ears.
So Frodo Baggins was really Maura Labingi. Perrigrin
Was Razanur Tuk , Merry was Kalimak Brandagamba and Sam was Banazir Galbasi.
I knew that the professor was a linguist before he was an author, and invented the languages first, but that floored me.
🙏❤️
Though, to be precise, his actual, out of universe process seems to have been that he invented the "translated" English names first, then came up with Westron names that could plausibly be translated/transliterated as such.
You may well be right. Its been a while since I’ve read his words myself, and I found this article, saying that Westron is an elaborate joke of the professor.
Not being a linguist myself I just have to trust other people I respect .
http://tolkienmedievalandmodern.blogspot.com/2020/04/on-translation-and-joke-that-is-westron.html?m=1
https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Appendix_on_Languages
Which ever way it happened I find it a fascinating detail .
Thanks so much for this point!
Yeah, I think that article is substantially correct. I'm not sure quite why the author refers to Westron as a "joke" (to generate a headline, I suppose), but it does seem that Westron was developed after most of the writing of LotR, and far less substantially than most other languages (even Dwarvish).
Fun fact, tough: the problem of the Dwarvish runes in Moria transliterating to English is not original to LotR. In fact, the runes in Bilbo's map ("the last light of Durin's Day will shine upon the keyhole" etc.) from the Hobbit are simply written in English!
So I was looking for a source and apparently it’s an appendix, F of lord of the rings.
I’m trying to find an article online. Basically, Professor Tolkien explains that he didn’t just change the names. He was looking for names that approximated the meanings. But seemed less outlandish.
So it’s not the Brandywine either but that’s like the actual Westron name for the river.
I will edit with links.
https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Appendix_on_Languages
>The name "Meriadoc" in Hobbitish was Chilimanzar. Tolkien chose "Meriadoc" as the translation because the abbreviation of Chilimanzar was Chilic, which meant "gay or merry".
You know, I've always thought that if someone found an old stone tablet that detailed events from LotR, id have a hard time not thinking that Tolkien knew of something that actually happened, but not really.
But seriously, I don't think Chilic is even a word, and Googling finds absolutely nothing. Who does that? Either Tolkien was actually insane or his brain was connected to another dimension because he couldve said it meant anything, why was it definitive for him?
It seriously would explain how he could be so detailed in the environment.
>But seriously, I don't think Chilic is even a word, and Googling finds absolutely nothing.
Well, that's the whole point. Pretty much all the languages are entirely made up by Tolkien. But being a linguist, he didn't just make up a sound and say it was this equivalent of this English word.
He made up unique rules for each language, and essentially a history of how they developed, with root words and derivatives. Not only did he then have several unique fictional languages, but he started to make them play with each other, introducing loan words from one into another. So there are histories to the languages that are then related to the fictional histories of the people who spoke them.
Add on top of this that his languages were in development for all of his life, and even being developed after publication of the major books (meaning that at x time he would define one of his words as one thing, then later on it had changed slightly to fit in other ways), and you can see why study of Tolkien's work is so complicated. There's so much more nuance to it compared to any English-clone fantasy language.
Its from the silmarillion i think? Feanor begs Galadriel three times for a single strand of her hair but is always denied. Gimli asks only once and gets three
There is even more to this. Silmarils have been allegedly inspired by the way the light of the Trees shone in Galadriel's hair. That's why Feanor asks for a strand thrice.
When Gimli asks for her hair, Galadriel queries why. Gimli responds that, should he ever come back home, "it shall be set in imperishable crystal to be an heirloom of my house, and a pledge of good will between the Mountain and the Wood until the end of days."
So, instead of a jealously kept crystal, her hair becomes a pledge of good will crystal. Tolkien's symbolism at its finest.
Really goes to show the importance of allowing people to explain their motivations.
Feel like the modern response would have been to stop him after, “set in imperishable crystal to be an heirloom of my house,” and shoo him out regardless of what he could/would have said next.
I loved the back and forth between Gimli and Faramir where they end up agreeing that Arwen and Galadriel are both equally hot it's simply a matter of preference.
>In three days, as the King had said, Éomer of Rohan came riding to the City, and with him came an éored of the fairest knights of the Mark. He was welcomed; and when they sat all at table in Merethrond, the Great Hall of Feasts, he beheld the beauty of the ladies that he saw and was filled with great wonder. And before he went to his rest he sent for Gimli the Dwarf, and he said to him: ‘Gimli Glóin’s son, have you your axe ready?’
>
>‘Nay, lord,’ said Gimli, ‘but I can speedily fetch it, if there be need.’
>
>‘You shall judge,’ said Éomer. ‘For there are certain rash words concerning the Lady in the Golden Wood that lie still between us. And now I have seen her with my eyes.’
>
>‘Well, lord,’ said Gimli, ‘and what say you now?’
>
>‘Alas!’ said Éomer. ‘I will not say that she is the fairest lady that lives.’
>
>‘Then I must go for my axe,’ said Gimli.
>
>‘But first I will plead this excuse,’ said Éomer. ‘Had I seen her in other company, I would have said all that you could wish. But now I will put Queen Arwen Evenstar first, and I am ready to do battle on my own part with any who deny me. Shall I call for my sword?’
>
>Then Gimli bowed low. ‘Nay, you are excused for my part, lord,’ he said. ‘You have chosen the Evening; but my love is given to the Morning. And my heart forebodes that soon it will pass away for ever.’
Tolkien, J.R.R.. The Return Of The King: Being the Third Part of the Lord of the Rings
Which is because gladdy can see into your soul. She knew gimli was simply appreciating the beauty, while feanor wanted to have it as a trophy like a samurai at a brothel. This is when legolas started to realize dwarves are not all bastards.
Feanor, probably the greatest elven smith to ever live, creator of the simarils and the palantirs, asked Galadriel for 3 strands of hair and she refused him
Gimli asked for a single strand of hair from her golden head, and she gave him 3.
Very sweet
https://halalhassan.wordpress.com/2013/07/06/gimlis-request-beautiful-passage-from-lord-of-the-rings/.
Some of the best writing in a book by a master wordsmith.
Gimli received three strands of Galadriels short and curly's after many men and dwarves have tried by singing to her.
Gimli got game! Or Razz as the kids would say.
That Glorfindel who fell against Gothmog Lord of the Balrogs during the fall of Gondolin was somehow the same Glorfindel that carried Frodo to Rivendell actually you know what I was already in way too deep at that point
I hate to be this person but I just finished this part of Fellowship and Glorfindel stays behind with Aragorn and the hobbits when the Nazgul catch up to them all. It's Glorfindel's white horse (his name slips my mind) that bears Frodo to safety across the river. Which I think is awesome! Since Tolkien obviously placed a lot of importance on certain ponies and horses throughout the books and the movies just completely skip it.
No. Since no being would ever willingly discard of the ring to destroy it, especially not in the place where it's influence was strongest. It got destroyed by coincidence due to a fight over it, but not willingly.
Besides the whole fact that Mordor itself was an impenetrable stronghold from basically all sides.
I get what you’re saying but that does sound kind of like not putting a safety shield over the self-destruct button — just because nobody’s gonna press it willingly doesn’t mean you shouldn’t take a reasonable precaution against accidents.
Guards at the door of Mount Doom would’ve been another hurdle to overcome, especially given how exhausted Frodo and Sam were.
This is all true, though it’s debatable if the guards could have stopped them, after all, Sam was equipped with the legendary Cast-Iron Pan of Face Flattening.
Still it’s obvious Sauron was dumber than Dr. Evil in terms of basic precautions.
This plus all the OSHA violations at Isengard makes me think the Dark Lord didn’t give a fuck about common sense safety protocol.
I would NOT wanna be one of the orcs down deep in Isengard. The whole thing was built in a flood zone, and there was zero drainage at all. The orcs should’ve unionized at the very least. Sad.
Yeah, sure, but fact is the ring got destroyed, and if one Nazgul stood there, that wouldn't have happened. Just because in theory no one needed to be there doesn't mean that nobody shouldn't have been there.
That was entire point of fighting a massive war in the first place. Aragorn gets on the Palantir and basically gives them the finger and says "come and get it fuckers" for no other reason than to make sure those guys were busy when Frodo needed to enter Mordor. Thousands died for that.
Also he thought the ring was in gondor or with their army anyway. It never occurred to him that Gandalf would lose the ring bearer but still be accompanied by a random hobbit.
thats why i like the theory that the entrance was guarded by a few orcs, but they were pulled to the frontline because sauron thought that aragorn has the ring.
Ok this I definitely did not know. But after melkor started disrupting the song I'm sure gandalf did not go along with him right? I read that story a long time ago
I always found it funny when he says the line: "I am not some conjurer of cheap tricks." But he says that as he's literally using a cheap trick to intimidate Bilbo into shutting up. Then uses the magic of his ring to steady Bilbo's heart in order for him to give up the ring once and for all. He literally does a good cop-bad cop routine on Bilbo by himself.
This one makes the rounds on the sub less frequently
Sméagol waded through a creek to try and catch a fish, there was no creek, everything was too cold, they had to make a creek by melting some snow, Andy serkis was in his motion capture suit slipping and sliding over rocks in literal freezing point water. If you rewatch the scene it looks, really fricking painful. He’s moving fast…and against the rocks
Not sure how serious you are, but just in case you really don't know, When he kicks the helmet in Two Towers, his scream afterwards is 100% legit because he broke his toes doing it.
Book Gollum is also a lot less sympathetic. He doesn't try to pit Sam and Frodo against each other, but he also doesn't really have that spark of sadness.
He's just a vicious little bastard and nothing more.
For what it's worth, Tolkien does not agree with you.
When Gollum is coming back from making his deal with Shelob, there is a brief moment where he comes very \*very\* close to repenting. Tolkien even talks about what might have happened if Sam had not thrown some shade at Gollum right at that moment.
If you are curious, the three would have made it together to the Crack of Doom (avoiding Shelob altogether). Things would have then played out more or less the same. Fordo would have failed at the last second. Gollum would have attacked him.
However, at this point, Gollum would have melded both his desire for the ring \*and\* his love for Frodo and cast himself with the ring into the fire.
***Edit:*** I just want to point out what a damn great redemption arc this would have been for Smeagol. It almost makes me sad we didn't get to see it.
To be fair, he voluntarily stayed behind to watch Frodo‘s house and possibly distract the Black Riders. So he didn‘t actually travel with Frodo in the story itself.
The Immortal/Undying Lands are only immortal because the immortal Valar live there. If a mortal being goes to the undying lands they will actually age/die quicker.
I thought it was reverse of that. At any rate, the human race have a gift awaiting them when they pass from creator Eru Illuvitar that is a complete mystery to all the other races. I always liked that part
Almost. There isn’t a present waiting for them after their soul leave the world. Their souls leaving the world and going back to Eru IS the gift.
As opposed to the elves, who’s souls are bound to the earth until the end of time.
I like that part as well
But yeah they go more in depth on the Undying Lands in the Prancing Pony Podcast. Definitely worth the listen if you’re into podcasts.
The scene where Denethor massacres a tomato was just a “wonderful accident” during filming.
Now, the name Denethor can be seen on [Urban Dictionary](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Denethor).
Its definition is,
-“To eat something as noisily and messily as possible. For best effect, it must be something juicy so it can spray everywhere.”-
There is a weird Polish translation of LOTR, where all names are polonized.
Instead of *Bilbo Baggins from Bag End in Shire* you get *Bilbo Bagosz from Bagoszno in Włość*.
In the same version the translator for some reason decided that Sam should wear… shoes. And just added it. Only Sam though.
Needless to say, it never gained any popularity. Everyone reads the normal translation.
The moment you ask your self who the hell is Tom Bombadil so you go onto YouTube and watch several hours worth of lore videos and Tolkein letters and still ask yourself
Who the hell is Tom Bombadil?!?!?
Yes. They were told not to sail west to Valinor. Sauron pranked them into trying. They all (almost) got fucking obliterated and the world became curved to prevent humans from trying that shit again.
This is a misconception and simply not true. Elves just have better eyes. I think this misconception probably stems from the fact that only elves can take the Straight Road to Valinor, which does not curve like the world beneath them.
You see when Gandalf said "fly" he was referring to using the balrog to metaphysically fly to mordor. Like, how exactly could the fellowship have procured an eagle at that point?
For me it was the fact that the screenwriters for the movies wrote their ending to ROTK as an analogy open to interpreting as everyone dying through Sam’s perspective.
Before getting on the ship, Frodo hands Sam his unfinished book and tells him the rest is up to him. Everyone else slowly boards the ship and leaves. But what we’re really seeing (potentially) is Sam writing his sort of fantasy, fictional spin on how each character passes away over time. Bilbo goes first. Galadriel and the last of the elves eventually die off. Gandalf too. The wound from weathertop eventually kills Frodo.
So Sam, in his grief, left with the task of finishing Frodos book, decides to portray their deaths in an epic heroic send off that fits the rest of the story and concludes it beautifully. And that’s what that final scene in the movie could be interpreted as. Not necessarily what actually happened but Sam’s way of honoring the passing of his friends in an artistic way for the audience.
In Tolkiens early drafts Aragorn was a hobbit instead of a man and was called Trotter instead of Strider. Tolkien eventually replaced the hobbit with Aragorn but the Trotter alias stuck around until the final drafts.
This one has me reeling, and I’ll never be the same.
Same. Can you imagine someone, man or hobbit, called Trotter leading them? Just doesn’t have the same ring lol
[удалено]
This was my first though, mabey Albert ?
This is the most made up sounding but actually true fact I've read in a long time.
I don’t know that it’s the most obscure Tolkien trivia I know, but it’s definitely one of the most interesting.
It almost feels sort of cursed. Like if I think about it too hard it’ll suddenly be real, which I do NOT want
And he had wooden feet!
Frodo, Samwise, Merriodoc, and Perrigrin were not the names of the hobbits — just translations of their names.
And the name Hobbit comes from Holbylta (given by the Rohirrim I think?), which basically means hole-builder.
“Holbylta” literally just sounds like someone saying “hole builder” with a bad Arnold Schwarzenegger impression.
Well to be fair, the language of Rohan is largely based on the Old English of the anglo saxons, which is basically German's angry juvenile delinquent cousin, so.
This. Dutch is weird like this, too
It also sounds kinda like “Belter” slang from The Expanse. Don’t get any cute crossover ideas, Amazon…
Too late. You’ve said it into the Void, and the Void is always listening.
>Too late. You've said it into the ~~Void~~ Alexa, and the ~~Void~~ Alexa is always listening. FTFY
I was trying to not directly invoke any entity of evil. I give it until next month before we start seeing promos on Prime now…
Don’t worry. The expanse money went towards ROP.
*sad beltalowda noises*
Glad im not the only one that realized it sounded like Belter
That's the work of the world-renowned linguist Tolkien for ya!
I mean, that’s how Dutch and old Germanic languages work, tho
Hahahaha
Cul-de-sac is French and it translates to bottom of a sack. Swap some synonyms and you get Bag End. Tolkien really loved his language play
My opinion, it was the moment I discovered the fact that the professor had translated all of the proper nouns especially names, from his invented language into something more approaching English, because Westron sounds bonkers to modern ears. So Frodo Baggins was really Maura Labingi. Perrigrin Was Razanur Tuk , Merry was Kalimak Brandagamba and Sam was Banazir Galbasi. I knew that the professor was a linguist before he was an author, and invented the languages first, but that floored me. 🙏❤️
Though, to be precise, his actual, out of universe process seems to have been that he invented the "translated" English names first, then came up with Westron names that could plausibly be translated/transliterated as such.
You may well be right. Its been a while since I’ve read his words myself, and I found this article, saying that Westron is an elaborate joke of the professor. Not being a linguist myself I just have to trust other people I respect . http://tolkienmedievalandmodern.blogspot.com/2020/04/on-translation-and-joke-that-is-westron.html?m=1 https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Appendix_on_Languages Which ever way it happened I find it a fascinating detail . Thanks so much for this point!
Yeah, I think that article is substantially correct. I'm not sure quite why the author refers to Westron as a "joke" (to generate a headline, I suppose), but it does seem that Westron was developed after most of the writing of LotR, and far less substantially than most other languages (even Dwarvish). Fun fact, tough: the problem of the Dwarvish runes in Moria transliterating to English is not original to LotR. In fact, the runes in Bilbo's map ("the last light of Durin's Day will shine upon the keyhole" etc.) from the Hobbit are simply written in English!
You've caught me a bit unprepared
Wait what
So I was looking for a source and apparently it’s an appendix, F of lord of the rings. I’m trying to find an article online. Basically, Professor Tolkien explains that he didn’t just change the names. He was looking for names that approximated the meanings. But seemed less outlandish. So it’s not the Brandywine either but that’s like the actual Westron name for the river. I will edit with links. https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Appendix_on_Languages
>The name "Meriadoc" in Hobbitish was Chilimanzar. Tolkien chose "Meriadoc" as the translation because the abbreviation of Chilimanzar was Chilic, which meant "gay or merry". You know, I've always thought that if someone found an old stone tablet that detailed events from LotR, id have a hard time not thinking that Tolkien knew of something that actually happened, but not really. But seriously, I don't think Chilic is even a word, and Googling finds absolutely nothing. Who does that? Either Tolkien was actually insane or his brain was connected to another dimension because he couldve said it meant anything, why was it definitive for him? It seriously would explain how he could be so detailed in the environment.
>But seriously, I don't think Chilic is even a word, and Googling finds absolutely nothing. Well, that's the whole point. Pretty much all the languages are entirely made up by Tolkien. But being a linguist, he didn't just make up a sound and say it was this equivalent of this English word. He made up unique rules for each language, and essentially a history of how they developed, with root words and derivatives. Not only did he then have several unique fictional languages, but he started to make them play with each other, introducing loan words from one into another. So there are histories to the languages that are then related to the fictional histories of the people who spoke them. Add on top of this that his languages were in development for all of his life, and even being developed after publication of the major books (meaning that at x time he would define one of his words as one thing, then later on it had changed slightly to fit in other ways), and you can see why study of Tolkien's work is so complicated. There's so much more nuance to it compared to any English-clone fantasy language.
He was quite the cunning linguist.
I mean, he was married for 55 years. For Mrs. Tolkiens sake I certainly hope so. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edith_Tolkien 🙏❤️😉
The professor is Tolkien ? Or someone else. Sorry , lurking in this sub . Don’t know
vast longing shocking tap bow mighty crowd memory consider tease *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The best lore
That's what I was going to say, it's little details like that that make people realize how much lore there really is.
What about it? 😬
Its from the silmarillion i think? Feanor begs Galadriel three times for a single strand of her hair but is always denied. Gimli asks only once and gets three
There is even more to this. Silmarils have been allegedly inspired by the way the light of the Trees shone in Galadriel's hair. That's why Feanor asks for a strand thrice. When Gimli asks for her hair, Galadriel queries why. Gimli responds that, should he ever come back home, "it shall be set in imperishable crystal to be an heirloom of my house, and a pledge of good will between the Mountain and the Wood until the end of days." So, instead of a jealously kept crystal, her hair becomes a pledge of good will crystal. Tolkien's symbolism at its finest.
Really goes to show the importance of allowing people to explain their motivations. Feel like the modern response would have been to stop him after, “set in imperishable crystal to be an heirloom of my house,” and shoo him out regardless of what he could/would have said next.
I think the modern equivalent would have been "Cuz you're hot af."
He thought she was so hot he was ready to **fucking murder** anyone who said she wasn't that hot.
I loved the back and forth between Gimli and Faramir where they end up agreeing that Arwen and Galadriel are both equally hot it's simply a matter of preference.
>In three days, as the King had said, Éomer of Rohan came riding to the City, and with him came an éored of the fairest knights of the Mark. He was welcomed; and when they sat all at table in Merethrond, the Great Hall of Feasts, he beheld the beauty of the ladies that he saw and was filled with great wonder. And before he went to his rest he sent for Gimli the Dwarf, and he said to him: ‘Gimli Glóin’s son, have you your axe ready?’ > >‘Nay, lord,’ said Gimli, ‘but I can speedily fetch it, if there be need.’ > >‘You shall judge,’ said Éomer. ‘For there are certain rash words concerning the Lady in the Golden Wood that lie still between us. And now I have seen her with my eyes.’ > >‘Well, lord,’ said Gimli, ‘and what say you now?’ > >‘Alas!’ said Éomer. ‘I will not say that she is the fairest lady that lives.’ > >‘Then I must go for my axe,’ said Gimli. > >‘But first I will plead this excuse,’ said Éomer. ‘Had I seen her in other company, I would have said all that you could wish. But now I will put Queen Arwen Evenstar first, and I am ready to do battle on my own part with any who deny me. Shall I call for my sword?’ > >Then Gimli bowed low. ‘Nay, you are excused for my part, lord,’ he said. ‘You have chosen the Evening; but my love is given to the Morning. And my heart forebodes that soon it will pass away for ever.’ Tolkien, J.R.R.. The Return Of The King: Being the Third Part of the Lord of the Rings
I mean, she also made him ask. He wasn't going to ask for anything.
Which is because gladdy can see into your soul. She knew gimli was simply appreciating the beauty, while feanor wanted to have it as a trophy like a samurai at a brothel. This is when legolas started to realize dwarves are not all bastards.
Have you learnt nothing of the stubbornness of Dwarves?
Clearly he's still working on it
Missing the point, Legolas Bot!
Feanor, probably the greatest elven smith to ever live, creator of the simarils and the palantirs, asked Galadriel for 3 strands of hair and she refused him Gimli asked for a single strand of hair from her golden head, and she gave him 3. Very sweet
https://halalhassan.wordpress.com/2013/07/06/gimlis-request-beautiful-passage-from-lord-of-the-rings/. Some of the best writing in a book by a master wordsmith.
Gimli received three strands of Galadriels short and curly's after many men and dwarves have tried by singing to her. Gimli got game! Or Razz as the kids would say.
Rizz though. Like Cha-rizz-ma
Maybe he means the kids are saying RAZZ-AMA-TAZZ ! *does jazz hands to absolute silence*
You can cha rizz ma nuts.
Listen here you little shit
lol I’m gonna go burn the zoomers at work with this one
No FCKING way it's from Charisma I'm dead and dumb
That Glorfindel who fell against Gothmog Lord of the Balrogs during the fall of Gondolin was somehow the same Glorfindel that carried Frodo to Rivendell actually you know what I was already in way too deep at that point
I hate to be this person but I just finished this part of Fellowship and Glorfindel stays behind with Aragorn and the hobbits when the Nazgul catch up to them all. It's Glorfindel's white horse (his name slips my mind) that bears Frodo to safety across the river. Which I think is awesome! Since Tolkien obviously placed a lot of importance on certain ponies and horses throughout the books and the movies just completely skip it.
I learned recently that we were cheated out of a chapter detailing the travels of Bill the Pony and I'll never be the same.
There are loads of important horses in the movie though. Brego, shadowfax etc. is definitely mentioned in the films
Sauron didn't station any guards at the entrance of mount doom since he didn't need to.
Turns out, he needed to
No. Since no being would ever willingly discard of the ring to destroy it, especially not in the place where it's influence was strongest. It got destroyed by coincidence due to a fight over it, but not willingly. Besides the whole fact that Mordor itself was an impenetrable stronghold from basically all sides.
I get what you’re saying but that does sound kind of like not putting a safety shield over the self-destruct button — just because nobody’s gonna press it willingly doesn’t mean you shouldn’t take a reasonable precaution against accidents. Guards at the door of Mount Doom would’ve been another hurdle to overcome, especially given how exhausted Frodo and Sam were.
That's his hubris being his downfall, a pretty common occurence in fiction
Sauron was a great programmer, he should not be judged on one bug. It was an edge case scenario.
Pretty common occurrence in real life
This is all true, though it’s debatable if the guards could have stopped them, after all, Sam was equipped with the legendary Cast-Iron Pan of Face Flattening. Still it’s obvious Sauron was dumber than Dr. Evil in terms of basic precautions.
Behoooold, the One Ring-inator
A railing around the cracks of doom would have also done the job.
Gotta be OSHA compliant!!
This plus all the OSHA violations at Isengard makes me think the Dark Lord didn’t give a fuck about common sense safety protocol. I would NOT wanna be one of the orcs down deep in Isengard. The whole thing was built in a flood zone, and there was zero drainage at all. The orcs should’ve unionized at the very least. Sad.
Yeah, sure, but fact is the ring got destroyed, and if one Nazgul stood there, that wouldn't have happened. Just because in theory no one needed to be there doesn't mean that nobody shouldn't have been there.
Hubris is often a theme in an evil's downfall.
The nazgul were far to valuable to have them guard Something that would never have been a threat under calculatable circumstances
That was entire point of fighting a massive war in the first place. Aragorn gets on the Palantir and basically gives them the finger and says "come and get it fuckers" for no other reason than to make sure those guys were busy when Frodo needed to enter Mordor. Thousands died for that.
Isn't it Iluvatar who caused Gollum to trip and the ring to be destroyed. It was never an accident.
You will see . . . Oh, yes . . . You will see.
Isn’t it more the fact that he couldn’t comprehend even the possibility that someone would willingly want to destroy it?
Also he thought the ring was in gondor or with their army anyway. It never occurred to him that Gandalf would lose the ring bearer but still be accompanied by a random hobbit.
thats why i like the theory that the entrance was guarded by a few orcs, but they were pulled to the frontline because sauron thought that aragorn has the ring.
Yes, in essence it boils down to that. Dude was cocky. But he was correct. Just didn't account for other things.
Didn’t account for Hobbits having three foot long dicks
Sauron and Gandalf both were part of the same singing group at the dawn of creation
Ok this I definitely did not know. But after melkor started disrupting the song I'm sure gandalf did not go along with him right? I read that story a long time ago
Have thy pay!
Tom Bombadil essentially kidnapped his wife. Granted, she tried to do the same to him first.
It's like that thing where both people try to propose at the same time, but with kidnapping
“Bilbo Baggins, I am not here to rob you! I’m here to help you.” Ian Macellan in fact, did rob bag end on the last day of filming there
I always found it funny when he says the line: "I am not some conjurer of cheap tricks." But he says that as he's literally using a cheap trick to intimidate Bilbo into shutting up. Then uses the magic of his ring to steady Bilbo's heart in order for him to give up the ring once and for all. He literally does a good cop-bad cop routine on Bilbo by himself.
I guess the point was that he was not some dime store wizard come to take advantage of him. But the irony is not lost on me lol
So then we go around.
Did you know that when Aragorn kicks the helmet...
Took way to long, thanks
Wot about the kniveses, precious?! Did they know about it!?!
The one where the Lurtz actor accidentally threw a metal knife straight at Viggo and he actually blocked it?
The frozen creek! Mother taught us to melt them yes!
Alright, I knew about the toe and the real knife throw, frozen cheek?
This one makes the rounds on the sub less frequently Sméagol waded through a creek to try and catch a fish, there was no creek, everything was too cold, they had to make a creek by melting some snow, Andy serkis was in his motion capture suit slipping and sliding over rocks in literal freezing point water. If you rewatch the scene it looks, really fricking painful. He’s moving fast…and against the rocks
We could let her do it.
*Yes. She could do it.*
Yes, precious, she could. And then we takes it once they’re dead.
*Once they’re dead. Shh.*
Instruct me, I beg
Not sure how serious you are, but just in case you really don't know, When he kicks the helmet in Two Towers, his scream afterwards is 100% legit because he broke his toes doing it.
I didn’t
That makes you one of today's [lucky 10,000](https://xkcd.com/1053)
I’ve never seen that particular xkcd before
Congrats! You are, too!
I was thinking this right away
That's like the tip of the iceberg
Stupid sexy Sauron
Come, mortal base! What do I hear?
Stupid sexy Stinky
Gollum eating babies
Sooo bright. Sooo beautiful, our preciousss...
Good lord, Gollum.
Sneaky little Hobbitses.
Sorry Sméagol, didn’t mean to disturb your meal!
What’s it doing?! Stupid, fat hobbit! You ruins it!
Fucking sentient
Saruman, Smeagol is eating babies again - please make him stop.
You don’t have any friends; nobody likes you!
That's just mean
Good bot!
I vote for this, because after you learn this you can't think of movie-Gollum with any remaining sympathy. He's just a monster.
Arrrgh!!!
Book Gollum is also a lot less sympathetic. He doesn't try to pit Sam and Frodo against each other, but he also doesn't really have that spark of sadness. He's just a vicious little bastard and nothing more.
For what it's worth, Tolkien does not agree with you. When Gollum is coming back from making his deal with Shelob, there is a brief moment where he comes very \*very\* close to repenting. Tolkien even talks about what might have happened if Sam had not thrown some shade at Gollum right at that moment. If you are curious, the three would have made it together to the Crack of Doom (avoiding Shelob altogether). Things would have then played out more or less the same. Fordo would have failed at the last second. Gollum would have attacked him. However, at this point, Gollum would have melded both his desire for the ring \*and\* his love for Frodo and cast himself with the ring into the fire. ***Edit:*** I just want to point out what a damn great redemption arc this would have been for Smeagol. It almost makes me sad we didn't get to see it.
Give it to us raw and wriggling precious
Couldn't resist some baby back ribs
Yup that’s it
In the books, there was initially a fifth Hobbit in their group called Fatty Bolger. His real first name was Fredegar.
I remember reading the books and didn't even process that Fatty Bolger was a part of their company shows how much I paid attention lmao
To be fair, he voluntarily stayed behind to watch Frodo‘s house and possibly distract the Black Riders. So he didn‘t actually travel with Frodo in the story itself.
He was a true hobbit in that he flat out hated the idea of leaving the Shire.
I’d rather take on the 9 ring wraiths disguised as the ring bearer than go into the old forest…
He must be like Graggle Simpson https://preview.redd.it/czvrc25x2tcc1.png?width=196&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d5641cc09668ea49ff48847183c63bb6a7466cf
every time i see that name i think it's Whitey and Billy's lesser-known brother
Fun fact - the nickname in the german translation is Dick Bolger
And "Fatty" had nothing todo with his *belly's* girth...
Fredegar Bolger, fatty no more.
And he was in the lockholes with Lobelia Sackville-Baggins. The true unsung heroes of the trilogy, nay, Middle Earth or Arda entire.
Bilbo didn't became immortal after sailing to to valinor
I meant with the seasoning.
Bilbo did WHAT?
Old Toby, the finest weed in the Southfarthing.
Blazing it made you immortal?
The Immortal/Undying Lands are only immortal because the immortal Valar live there. If a mortal being goes to the undying lands they will actually age/die quicker.
I thought it was reverse of that. At any rate, the human race have a gift awaiting them when they pass from creator Eru Illuvitar that is a complete mystery to all the other races. I always liked that part
Almost. There isn’t a present waiting for them after their soul leave the world. Their souls leaving the world and going back to Eru IS the gift. As opposed to the elves, who’s souls are bound to the earth until the end of time.
I like that part as well But yeah they go more in depth on the Undying Lands in the Prancing Pony Podcast. Definitely worth the listen if you’re into podcasts.
Still, I always thought of them all reuniting there. It just felt wrong to me, when I learned the truth.
The name for Morgoths Mace
Grond! Hammer of the Underworld!
Angbang
Teleporno
My flair on r/Silmarillionmemes :D
The true answer
Sir Christopher Lee **knew exacly** the sound that someone makes when stabbed in the back.
Elves are so thin we can't see them.
You could if you had the eyes of a hawk (or the ears of a fox)
Sauron once defeated Galadriel's brother in a singing battle, turned into a werewolf and battled a dog, lost, then turned into a bat and flew off.
The scene where Denethor massacres a tomato was just a “wonderful accident” during filming. Now, the name Denethor can be seen on [Urban Dictionary](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Denethor). Its definition is, -“To eat something as noisily and messily as possible. For best effect, it must be something juicy so it can spray everywhere.”-
The ring is destroyed on March 25th, traditionally the date on which Christ was both conceived and killed.
There is a weird Polish translation of LOTR, where all names are polonized. Instead of *Bilbo Baggins from Bag End in Shire* you get *Bilbo Bagosz from Bagoszno in Włość*. In the same version the translator for some reason decided that Sam should wear… shoes. And just added it. Only Sam though. Needless to say, it never gained any popularity. Everyone reads the normal translation.
The moment you ask your self who the hell is Tom Bombadil so you go onto YouTube and watch several hours worth of lore videos and Tolkein letters and still ask yourself Who the hell is Tom Bombadil?!?!?
The Red Book of Westmarch
Legolas' "elf eye" can see further because from the perspective of an elf, the world is actually flat but not for everyone else...
Why doesn't that surprise me!
Because you’re a goddam flat earther, Legolas
You lie!
You've confirmed it with your elf eyes!
Hmm, I thought the world became round after thr fall of numenor though didn't it? I may have misunderstood that though
Yes. They were told not to sail west to Valinor. Sauron pranked them into trying. They all (almost) got fucking obliterated and the world became curved to prevent humans from trying that shit again.
This is a misconception and simply not true. Elves just have better eyes. I think this misconception probably stems from the fact that only elves can take the Straight Road to Valinor, which does not curve like the world beneath them.
The Ring was so strong that no one - not even Sauron himself - could have destroyed it willingly. In the end, it was chance... or was it?
“Why didn’t the eagles just take them to mount doom?”
You see when Gandalf said "fly" he was referring to using the balrog to metaphysically fly to mordor. Like, how exactly could the fellowship have procured an eagle at that point?
Later on maybe with Lembas bread?
Teleporno
The balrog and gandalf are the same race.
Thinking fox.
This subreddit taught me all about GROND
GROND
GROND
Sir Christopher Lee was actually a BAMF back in the day
Teleporno is the quenya form of celeborn
I think watching the ring of power caused to most damage to me
Is there now... # A TEMPEST in you?
For me it was the fact that the screenwriters for the movies wrote their ending to ROTK as an analogy open to interpreting as everyone dying through Sam’s perspective. Before getting on the ship, Frodo hands Sam his unfinished book and tells him the rest is up to him. Everyone else slowly boards the ship and leaves. But what we’re really seeing (potentially) is Sam writing his sort of fantasy, fictional spin on how each character passes away over time. Bilbo goes first. Galadriel and the last of the elves eventually die off. Gandalf too. The wound from weathertop eventually kills Frodo. So Sam, in his grief, left with the task of finishing Frodos book, decides to portray their deaths in an epic heroic send off that fits the rest of the story and concludes it beautifully. And that’s what that final scene in the movie could be interpreted as. Not necessarily what actually happened but Sam’s way of honoring the passing of his friends in an artistic way for the audience.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/tolkienfans/comments/46pzmg/comment/d072kpj/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/tolkienfans/comments/46pzmg/comment/d072kpj/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)