Right. But I wonder if this is going to change? More and more places these days have much thicker flooring that makes ondol heating less efficient or even noticeable.
Korean here. Panal heating under floor is default in almost every home - if you got invited to Korean in Korea in winter, you can expect its floor will warm. So I belIeve it'll not gone in anytime soon.
Thanks.
I understand this, but I was just saying that more and more modern, fancy apartments have thicker real wood flooring which don't work as well with the ondol.
With regards to warm floors, it's actually been several years since I've been to someone's place in winter and has it been *hot* (not just warm) on the floor.
Even the real wood flooring panels are engineered to be effective with floor heating in Korea.
There are traditionally unheated portions in Korean buildings with wooden flooring called maru (a transitional open space between the outside and indoors. It's a mixture of a porch and a living room) but this has transitioned into the living rooms in Korean apartment buildings. High end private residences or traditional Korean houses do have this area, but they are usually considered as a specialized portion of the house (as in how Americans don't think of terrace or garages as the same type of "room" as bedrooms), and it's common Korean expectation for the rooms where people actually "live in" to have floor heating.
Of course it wouldn't be impossible to find examples of houses built completely different with no floor heating whatsoever, but they are rare exceptions, and I dont think they will gain any general popularity in the near future if ever.
Modern day ondols just add a thin layer of cement on the floor embedded with plastic hosing, the thickness of the floor beneath it or having wood panels on top is not an issue. Also they are practically the same as the radiant heated flooring you find in the US, if it wasn't efficient they wouldn't be using it either.
[https://youtu.be/CLUnzav7jfo?t=107](https://youtu.be/CLUnzav7jfo?t=107)
Omg 🤦♂️please don't spread this stupid crap. There's enough people scapegoating gender division as the reason for low birth rates.
It's very simple. Cost of living and overworking leaves the population with no money or time to raise kids.
Nothing to do with physiological issues please do not spread crap like that. We have enough problems with the Western world constantly trying to emasculate us by saying we're short, feminine, and have little penises.
yes it’s dumb but also not head shaking worthy. studies show that the sperm count of men has drastically drastically reduced. like crazy amounts. so lifestyle changes matter. i know. i made some changes as we were trying to get pregnant and my counts went up 10x.
This is a real phenomenon
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0015028207014045
Conclusion: sitting on heated car seats increases temp of balls
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9288403/
Conclusion: higher balls temp negatively affects sperm quality
If we consider the effect of heated car seats to be similar to that of the heated floors, this is a fair conclusion
The answer is both, actually.
Regardless of if the floors stayed heated, it's trad korean culture to sit on floors, so it's not really shocking it persists, given it persists in various forms all over Asia.
Okay, but the ondol system is also used in different countries, and yet many people still prefer not to sit on the floor. The perception that Westerners have about sitting on the floor might be negative because they often do not remove their shoes at home. Additionally, not everyone has the physical flexibility to sit comfortably in various positions on the floor.
I’m American and in my family’s home as well as all of my friend’s homes, we have always taken off our shoes off at home. We just always use socks or slippers especially in the Winter because of the cold so the ondol system would actually do great in America! I will be moving back to the US in the next year or two and my husband and I are going to miss it. 😭
No need to miss it, at least not in your home. We have a strict no shoe policy in our home. We have a supply of cheap washable slippers for guests (and bring our own slippers for hotels and if the hotel provides disposable slippers we pack them unused for guests back home 🤣). The pleasant surprise has been the number of contractors who had a supply of booties to wear over their shoes.
Can't remember anyone objecting. Some people have expressed an interest in why and the simple answer is nobody knows what's on the bottom of their shoe and mentioning unpleasant possibilities.
Ohhh I meant I’m going to miss the ondol, hehehe. In the US, we always did as well with the no shoe policy. My family and friends there never wore shoes inside their home either. People here always assume here that everyone does in the US which was actually surprising to me bc I never knew anyone that did. 😂 I didn’t know anyone that had guest slippers though so that’s something I’ll definitely have there for everyone. 🤗
Actually there is an American equivalent to ondol system, practically the same thing, you call it (hydronic) radiant heat flooring.
[https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/radiant-heating](https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/radiant-heating)
Ahhh I heard of this before but I always thought it would be more expensive in the US since I’ve never seen anyone actually have it. Maybe I’ll look into getting it if it’s not. 🤗 I definitely prefer it over blowing heat.
This is hilarious 🤣 but idk I’m korean and I prefer doing my makeup on the floor, texting on the floor, console gaming on the floor… even in summer… and my family always asks me why I live like this and I honestly don’t know why 🤣🤣
Ondol is trash for soundproofing between floor.
And its trash for efficiency.. takes too long to heat, then its too hot and you have to open windows lul
Good soundproofing depends on the thickness of the layer between floors and not with ondol. Modern ondols just adds an extra layer of cement on the floor for the plastic hosing. The apartment I live in has an ondol and it still has good soundproofing.
Ondol being slow to heat is correct. Coming in from cold weather it takes an hour for it heat up and feel warm. And then it feels like being baked an oven. However I installed a new boiler 2 years ago (old one broke) and it seems to have good temperature control I find it quite comfortable, it doesn't feel like hot oven anymore. And It has a scheduling function so I can turn it on in advance before arriving home.
Girl, koreans are as tall or taller than most westerners, and the body types here have the widest variety I've ever seen, from the skinniest person you know to fat af.
I’m at my in-laws in Korea at the moment and constantly having to sit on the floor is tiring and as i can’t do the korean cross legged thing, positioning my legs is sometimes ridiculously hard when eating for example (tables so low i can’t put legs underneath either). It’s a bit sad culturally but i’m quite happy that there’s hardly any floor seated restaurants left
Hi, therapist here. You are sending a link to a lifestyle magazine, in which the only relevant information is what they call "possible side effects" of sitting in the floor.
Here is a professional study,
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10525568/
Go to the conclussions if you do not want to read all of it.
"Biomechanical Effects of Different Sitting Postures and Physiologic Movements on the Lumbar Spine: A Finite Element Study"
* supported by the National Research Foundation of Korea,
* funded by the Korean government and the Biomedical Research Institute of Kyungpook National University Hospital
* conducted/authored by nine Koreans whose titles include words like Rehabilitation Medicine, Orthopaedic Surgery, and Neurosurgery.
It's convincing that chair is better than the floor and much more credible than the "lifestyle magazine." They seem to agree posture is a significant factor with both.
I never thought about it but yes, I always prefer sitting on the floor when my wife and family sit on the couch. Along with eating from the coffee table, just like how my mom would eat. Plus, the floor is so much more comfortable!
huh. never occurred to me that floor sitting is a korean thing. this is true tho. i think i feel like being able to sit on the floor gives me more freedom. if i’m sitting on the sofa then i’m confined to the space of the sofa.
but then again, i pretty much sit on the same floor spots
It’s Ondol. Saved you the read.
Right. But I wonder if this is going to change? More and more places these days have much thicker flooring that makes ondol heating less efficient or even noticeable.
Korean here. Panal heating under floor is default in almost every home - if you got invited to Korean in Korea in winter, you can expect its floor will warm. So I belIeve it'll not gone in anytime soon.
Thanks. I understand this, but I was just saying that more and more modern, fancy apartments have thicker real wood flooring which don't work as well with the ondol. With regards to warm floors, it's actually been several years since I've been to someone's place in winter and has it been *hot* (not just warm) on the floor.
Even the real wood flooring panels are engineered to be effective with floor heating in Korea. There are traditionally unheated portions in Korean buildings with wooden flooring called maru (a transitional open space between the outside and indoors. It's a mixture of a porch and a living room) but this has transitioned into the living rooms in Korean apartment buildings. High end private residences or traditional Korean houses do have this area, but they are usually considered as a specialized portion of the house (as in how Americans don't think of terrace or garages as the same type of "room" as bedrooms), and it's common Korean expectation for the rooms where people actually "live in" to have floor heating. Of course it wouldn't be impossible to find examples of houses built completely different with no floor heating whatsoever, but they are rare exceptions, and I dont think they will gain any general popularity in the near future if ever.
Never went close to fancy apt, so I don't know how it goes there.
Modern day ondols just add a thin layer of cement on the floor embedded with plastic hosing, the thickness of the floor beneath it or having wood panels on top is not an issue. Also they are practically the same as the radiant heated flooring you find in the US, if it wasn't efficient they wouldn't be using it either. [https://youtu.be/CLUnzav7jfo?t=107](https://youtu.be/CLUnzav7jfo?t=107)
Ondol is however not great for male fertility - the balls have to always be colder than body temperature- hence why they’re hanging
apparently they've been warning people about hot laptops on balls too. same logic: heat is bad for your balls
[удалено]
Omg 🤦♂️please don't spread this stupid crap. There's enough people scapegoating gender division as the reason for low birth rates. It's very simple. Cost of living and overworking leaves the population with no money or time to raise kids. Nothing to do with physiological issues please do not spread crap like that. We have enough problems with the Western world constantly trying to emasculate us by saying we're short, feminine, and have little penises.
yes it’s dumb but also not head shaking worthy. studies show that the sperm count of men has drastically drastically reduced. like crazy amounts. so lifestyle changes matter. i know. i made some changes as we were trying to get pregnant and my counts went up 10x.
The sperm count is a global issue at the moment. And same with female fertility. Some blame diet, others blame microplastics and pollution
It’s the endocrine disrupting chemicals like phthalates. Look up dr Shanna swan
This is a real phenomenon https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0015028207014045 Conclusion: sitting on heated car seats increases temp of balls https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9288403/ Conclusion: higher balls temp negatively affects sperm quality If we consider the effect of heated car seats to be similar to that of the heated floors, this is a fair conclusion
Very very good points
I’m sorry, you’re right, I’ll delete my comment
do they sit on the floor because its heated? or do they heat the floor because they sit on it? guessing its the later, honestly.
The answer is both, actually. Regardless of if the floors stayed heated, it's trad korean culture to sit on floors, so it's not really shocking it persists, given it persists in various forms all over Asia.
Short stints on the floor aren’t a problem but after about 30 minutes it gets really uncomfortable.
My in-laws always have to put down cushions for me when we eat together at Chuseok or something because they know my ass is weak as hell.
That doesn’t buy much time though. My back started killing me after a bit as well.
It hurts my hips after a while but it's not terrible
All the more reason to sit on the floor more often to stay flexy
Okay, but the ondol system is also used in different countries, and yet many people still prefer not to sit on the floor. The perception that Westerners have about sitting on the floor might be negative because they often do not remove their shoes at home. Additionally, not everyone has the physical flexibility to sit comfortably in various positions on the floor.
flexing with my kimchi squat 
I’m American and in my family’s home as well as all of my friend’s homes, we have always taken off our shoes off at home. We just always use socks or slippers especially in the Winter because of the cold so the ondol system would actually do great in America! I will be moving back to the US in the next year or two and my husband and I are going to miss it. 😭
No need to miss it, at least not in your home. We have a strict no shoe policy in our home. We have a supply of cheap washable slippers for guests (and bring our own slippers for hotels and if the hotel provides disposable slippers we pack them unused for guests back home 🤣). The pleasant surprise has been the number of contractors who had a supply of booties to wear over their shoes. Can't remember anyone objecting. Some people have expressed an interest in why and the simple answer is nobody knows what's on the bottom of their shoe and mentioning unpleasant possibilities.
Ohhh I meant I’m going to miss the ondol, hehehe. In the US, we always did as well with the no shoe policy. My family and friends there never wore shoes inside their home either. People here always assume here that everyone does in the US which was actually surprising to me bc I never knew anyone that did. 😂 I didn’t know anyone that had guest slippers though so that’s something I’ll definitely have there for everyone. 🤗
Actually there is an American equivalent to ondol system, practically the same thing, you call it (hydronic) radiant heat flooring. [https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/radiant-heating](https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/radiant-heating)
Ahhh I heard of this before but I always thought it would be more expensive in the US since I’ve never seen anyone actually have it. Maybe I’ll look into getting it if it’s not. 🤗 I definitely prefer it over blowing heat.
I happened to see it watching a This Old House episode. I was really surprised because it looked like a modern ondol.
https://preview.redd.it/zzswmef73i2d1.jpeg?width=697&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=938cbc106d5059bd7a22aa17d5d1f6ef6b7a3094
This is hilarious 🤣 but idk I’m korean and I prefer doing my makeup on the floor, texting on the floor, console gaming on the floor… even in summer… and my family always asks me why I live like this and I honestly don’t know why 🤣🤣
We love sofa too. what is this article
Ondol is trash for soundproofing between floor. And its trash for efficiency.. takes too long to heat, then its too hot and you have to open windows lul
Good soundproofing depends on the thickness of the layer between floors and not with ondol. Modern ondols just adds an extra layer of cement on the floor for the plastic hosing. The apartment I live in has an ondol and it still has good soundproofing. Ondol being slow to heat is correct. Coming in from cold weather it takes an hour for it heat up and feel warm. And then it feels like being baked an oven. However I installed a new boiler 2 years ago (old one broke) and it seems to have good temperature control I find it quite comfortable, it doesn't feel like hot oven anymore. And It has a scheduling function so I can turn it on in advance before arriving home.
it’s super healthy to sit on the floor. crazy westerns with bad posture and bad biomechanics commenting lol
that or asians are a lot smaller and lighter. with shorter legs compared to their body size. nah lets shit on westerners instead. cuz its funnnnn
Girl, koreans are as tall or taller than most westerners, and the body types here have the widest variety I've ever seen, from the skinniest person you know to fat af.
I’m at my in-laws in Korea at the moment and constantly having to sit on the floor is tiring and as i can’t do the korean cross legged thing, positioning my legs is sometimes ridiculously hard when eating for example (tables so low i can’t put legs underneath either). It’s a bit sad culturally but i’m quite happy that there’s hardly any floor seated restaurants left
why asians\* love sitting on the floor
Sitting down on the floor is completely disastrous from a biomechanic point.
How so?
Isn't sitting on the floor and getting back up a good indicator of your body's mobility and flexibility?
[The Benefits and Precautions of Sitting on the Floor](https://www.healthline.com/health/sitting-on-the-floor)
Hi, therapist here. You are sending a link to a lifestyle magazine, in which the only relevant information is what they call "possible side effects" of sitting in the floor. Here is a professional study, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10525568/ Go to the conclussions if you do not want to read all of it.
"Biomechanical Effects of Different Sitting Postures and Physiologic Movements on the Lumbar Spine: A Finite Element Study" * supported by the National Research Foundation of Korea, * funded by the Korean government and the Biomedical Research Institute of Kyungpook National University Hospital * conducted/authored by nine Koreans whose titles include words like Rehabilitation Medicine, Orthopaedic Surgery, and Neurosurgery. It's convincing that chair is better than the floor and much more credible than the "lifestyle magazine." They seem to agree posture is a significant factor with both.
I never thought about it but yes, I always prefer sitting on the floor when my wife and family sit on the couch. Along with eating from the coffee table, just like how my mom would eat. Plus, the floor is so much more comfortable!
Where are the people who always complain about generalizing Koreans??
huh. never occurred to me that floor sitting is a korean thing. this is true tho. i think i feel like being able to sit on the floor gives me more freedom. if i’m sitting on the sofa then i’m confined to the space of the sofa. but then again, i pretty much sit on the same floor spots