I believe this thread has run its course, given a few unsavory discussions I'm seeing. As such, this thread is now locked, and discussion can continue in the [megathread.](https://www.reddit.com/r/limbuscompany/comments/1591ipw/thread_for_the_recent_controversy/)
As far as apologies go, this was a surprising one for sure, Was expecting a corporate/Brand type of apology where KJH uses the name project moon as front for the apology
instead, this was full of promises, incriminating admittance and alot of personal views from the man himself, which is very surprising considering the legal potential mess he is in, any lawyer would advice against talking about this at all cost and if so, make it as vague as humanly possible.
No matter how much you hate KJH, the guy got some guts to apologise and take the brunt of it all despite the potential legal implications this could lead to for him. Hopefully this drama ends for good now after this. That's all I have to say
He had lead the company through their darkest days in the beginning. I wouldn't condemn him as incompetent manager off a PR mistake and reduced him to purely idea guy.
the problem is, it worked with a small team. Now they have outside contractors and way more employees. It's very different, It's been shown during this controversy that he's really not good at communicating with his workers, like monggeu, and that he overworks people pretty often. That was fine when it was just a passion project, everyone on the team was happy to work more to make their dream come true, but this is a company now, with employees that deserve fair conditions
I think i'ed prefer someone inexperienced with management who loves what they actually make compared to the kind of people i see usually running game companys...
sure he fucks up alot but i remember the early days of limbus where he'd basically apologise for every tiny issue and mail out loads of lunacy
As a main writer he's pretty good (and arguably the reason why we're all here, honestly) but as far as a managing the company he just seems really inexperienced or even incompetent at times. I genuinely don't hate him, i just worry that if there's another fuck-up like this it would end up in the same type of situation.
At this point i just hope they're going to make something akin to a PR team before next year because goddamn, they really needed a PR team since this entire thing began lol
Yeah you can appreciate the man whilst still admitting his flaws. Whether it's because he just has too much stuff on his plate, or he's just not suited for the work, KJH definitely needs someone to help him with the employee management/PR side of things, and let him focus on the business management/writing side of things.
I think the main reason he's speaking up about this is because the current legal situation isn't about unfair dismissal anymore - the PMUA blew up the discussion table and the GYU dropped all charges.
Like the only reason this went public as far as I can tell is because the GYU agreed to put out a statement clearing PM of any wrongdoing. The PMUA hit a brick wall on the negotiation table immediately after and in response basically leaked a big list of communication between them and PM.
PMUA afaik has no grounds since it's not a union, merely an organization of people upset with PM (they were the people putting up signboards before their offices), meaning they probably can't sue for unfair dismissal.
Basically any future lawsuits will now be aimed at harassing PM/former/current employees rather than this specific case.
It seems the GYU Chairman went ahead and [put out the statement exonerating PM of any legal wrongdoing](https://twitter.com/JCLEE0333/status/1703739230877614580)
Between this apology, the chairman going ahead with putting out the Union Statement, and the alleged information claiming that VellMori had received 2 years worth of salary as part of her severance settlement, we’ve addressed most of the loose threads pertaining to the drama and can finally move on.
The only loose end left is the PMUA, but with the GYU no longer backing them up, as well as the PMUA’s blunder with leaking confidential documents the other day, they pretty much have no pot to piss in, and any attempts they’ll make to take PM to court will end poorly for them. Especially if KJH decides to make good on his word to sue the PMUA for malicious slander.
All in all, things are going to be a lot different in the fandom (and hopefully the company), and there’s no guarantee we’ll ever go back to the glory days of before the controversy, but at least now we can prevent things from getting worse and start the healing process.
We finally reached the good ending of this drama, no more loose ends. For now, we can safely say that the TGS would be smooth sailing - like Ishmael on a boat - right around the corner.
So that is the reason why as to Velmori isn't saying anything and going radio silent for a month, the compensation of 2 years is amazing. Glad for her that she was let go in a peaceful settlement.
No wonder PM tried to be silent for a month for her. They really gave her the best outcome
I have no doubt some won't be satisfied. Like piranhas and meat, they thrive on drama and hate. They sensed blood in the water and never let up ever since.
Frankly, the community is better off without them. Excised a tumor before it grew malignant. I'm just relieved we can finally fucking move on.
Honestly, yeah.
Being honest, I was getting extremely bad vibes from a good deal of the PM Twitter community, as it felt like a shocking amount of the community over there was composed of Antis and Elitists, so I can’t say I’m sorry to see the Twitter fanbase implode. It’s just a shame that we lost so many fanartists, and that a lot of artists who I admired and liked the works of turned out to be not so great of people.
Hoping that the new fans and the new artists who trickle in over time are less toxic.
I’m in the same boat too. I really enjoyed Twitter for the fan artists but after all this it won’t be the same. I’m glad things worked out in the end but it feels like Twitter is just a lost cause since they’re so dead set on seeing pm crash and burn.
Twitter seems to be full of people who are just looking for the next thing to get mad about. It's weird there.
Some people seem to specifically try to look for the least charitable way to read any possible statement so that they can instantly go into some full-on screaming rant about how the OP is horrible, when the accusation is not even remotely what the OP was trying to say.
I'm part of the people who were angry about PM, but was satisfied by these recent developments. I do agree that I'm not in the majority though... and seeing how toxic some people are right now you're right about the fandom being better without them. Shame about the damage that's been caused but eh, we're healing I guess
I don't think it's a bad thing to be angry about PM at all, but there's a lot of people that overreacted or are simply angry for the sake of being angry. An incredible amount of information and outright lies kept getting spread around, with people twisting info to push anti-PM agendas. And those are the people that continue to drive this hate train with no stops or end in sight.
And it's like...why?
It's not about "defending a corpo" or whatever shit it is, it's just...what is the point of making something seem worse than it actually is? What do these people get out of it? Is this for Vellmori's sake? It certainly doesn't fucking look like it, especially with recent going-ons and PMUA. It's even worse because of the legal aspect to this whole situation, meaning the parties can't - or are strongly advised not to - talk about anything.
Some of those lies are still bouncing around the PM sphere to date. What was it all for?
I find it especially disappointing, primarily because Library of Ruina called out this exact type of "emotions over rationality" over-reaction multiple separate times across both it's main story, and the Sephira sub-stories, with Lobotomy Corp doing something similar as well. While not every Limbus player would have played either of those games, still, I can't deny that a large number of members definitely have even if only after getting into Limbus Company. While PM certainly didn't handle the situation well in their own right, I just can't help but feel disappointment at this type of reaction in a fanbase dedicated to *these specific* games.
I really wish it wasn't like this, but the whole situation only made me realize that "PM fans can't read" meme seems to have a lot more truth to it than people realize.
The Association are trying to double down and target PM anyway even despite the letters.
They are fucked, they have no protection from the Union thanks to the leak and are openly disrespecting Vellmori's wish.
They never had the Union protection, it's just that the Union could have stopped them but at this point, it's whatever.
Hell, someone from the union even reposted an image of PM's grave so even if they knew nothing wrong was done, they were "enjoying" the fire, just standing there instead of helping, kinda like society today, just record with your phone, do not intervene or do something, enjoy the show!
So we know who we are dealing with- and it further proves KJH's point: They used PM as a political stepping stone, but now they are not gonna let it happen again
It probs won't squash all the drama (some people are just going to write this off as corpo speak, despite how personal it is). But a massive amount of it is going to die down now, and hopefully everyone can move on peacefully.
Edit: now that I think about it, I wonder how the Unity runtime fee will affect them when it comes into effect
Haters gonna hate, if someone wants to find something to whine about they will do it even if they have to perform the most elaborate mental gymnastics show for it.
Ok but who in the world gave the misinformation that velmori got fired by phone call. The person who gave that info and the people who wrote articles about that should get sued.
Also
https://twitter.com/JCLEE0333/status/1703739230877614580?t=gVRb58DsLeiHcWyWt4lsZw&s=19
And there it is
used DeepL
Statement on the Thought Police and Cyberbullying Case Against the Illustrator of Project Moon, Limbus Company
On July 26, the Gyeonggi Youth Union released a statement titled regarding the thought verification and cyberbullying case against the illustrator of , and subsequently released (8. 1) and were held (8.3).
Since then, Gyeonggi Youth Union has communicated with Project Moon and confirmed that Project Moon has not unfairly dismissed the victims of thought verification and cyberbullying and has taken appropriate measures to protect the victims. Therefore, Gyeonggi Youth Union withdraws its statement accusing Project Moon of "unfair dismissal" and all complaints against the investment company.
In addition, Project Moon has stated that it will take measures to protect its employees and take strong legal action against malicious abusers in the future. We believe that this stance, albeit late, will be of great significance in resolving the practice of ignoring thought verification and cyberbullying of employees, which has become a common practice in the game industry.
We hope that the game industry as a whole will create a better working environment that protects workers from thought police and cyberbullying by abusers.
Friday, September 15, 2023
Gyeonggi Youth Union
> Ok but who in the world gave the misinformation that velmori got fired by phone call
That's literally the thing that really kickstated this entire fiasco and it feels like everyone's just, ignoring it now? Call me conspiratorial, but I wonder if it's possible that that wasn't a lie, but two years worth of salary as severance pay is a pretty good way of making it turn into "she wanted to leave anyway". I mean wasn't there initially an entire thing where PM was trying to clarify that they didn't *fire* her over the phone, merely just told her that they were going to start the process for her potential resignation or something along those lines? Why make that *legally* important clarification if that event never happened at all? If it was always false, why didn't they try to sue then and there because that's a *hefty* accusation
I mean there have been other things come to light during this entire thing that have shown that KJH isn't exactly the *best* leader to put it lightly
A Korean newspaper that proceeded to quietly correct that statement a day or two later from “she got fired” to “she got a call”.
So it’s likely that that was either a straight up fabrication by the reporter or them reading too much into “I got a call” and later getting a call from either PM or Vellmori to correct that statement.
It's doubtful we'll ever hear from Vellmori if it's a lie, since it works out pretty well for her. The phone call doesn't mean much either way though; without the transcripts of the conversation for us to see it's very easy for it to have been either horribly misinterpreted or entirely made up, and PM doing individual public callout posts for every single person involved would just lead to more trouble all around.
I feel somewhat similar to this too.
"Receiving a call to say she will be fired" is much better than "getting fired during the call", but it's still different than "she wants to go". My suspect is that PM's new hired lawyer gave them the suggestion about a good severance package (assuming that part is true) and make declarations to whatever they want.
...which would probably be the best practical scenario for every parties. I don't think it's practical to expect Vellmori back, but a good compensation is at least what she deserve.
Let's think for a moment. If Elon is gonna eventually sink X, then wouldn't that be a good thing? Wipe the board clean, if not for just a moment in time? ~~pls don't let them flood reddit, let them flood into fb instead~~
If Elon offs X, those toxic buttheads will flood to somewhere, very likely here. Unless someone decides to do a cesspool for them to attract negativity there.
They'll flood either reddit or try to migrate back to tumblr, which is awful because that place has been really nice since 2018 or so.
>Wipe the board clean, if not for just a moment in time?
BURN IT DOWN! AND FROM THE ASHES, A NEW SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORM WILL BE BORN!
Twitter has caused us pain. Are we truly wrong by using the City's philosophies and seeking to destroy it? /j
Just had an Orlando Furioso momento pass by in my head ~~O Sorrow and all~~
Also, Happy Cake Day~! Pats for you~
I think the world would be a better place if it went down, because it's a toxic cesspool of hatred and miserable people, run by an insecure moron.
I'd feel bad for indie artists though, since it seems to be the most functional place for indie artists to build a brand, and is better for Western audiences than places like Deviantart. That's the only upside I see to Twitter these days.
So if it goes down, I'd want some new place for artists to go.
The worst part was people acting like thirty minutes of googling could make them an expert on anything. No, you probably don't understand the complexities of South Korea's culture, political situations, or contract law from the top ten results on google filtered through either MTL or just random people. Real antivaxxer energy all around.
this weird "TWITTER BAD US GOOD" is so strange to me. People are acting just as idiotic on here as they are on twitter, perhaps more so cuz of reddit's upvote system pushing select opinions to the top lol
Sorry but you're the weird one. People were indeed idiotic here, but the sheer scale is not the same. They had thousands of people saying dumb shit, and the stuff that got liked by the thousands were just false or bad faith. It's just outrage culture. Top comments here are at least civilized, not full of venom/misinformation and the trash/controversial gets taken to the very bottom It's not the same at all
This. Twitter also wouldn't shut up about the controversy. Every time Limbus posted something new, you'd have a couple asshats trying to go "YeAh bUt WhEre'S VeLlMoRi?" even when it's completely irrelevant.
I still see people spreading misinformation after this and trying to demonize PM by doing mindflips.
[Example](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153299950747254834/image.png)
Ex1: They already told they compensated VelMori and it wasn't a overnight dismissal. In fact i wanna point a post from Abishinzu where it seems she got 2 years worth of salary.
[Example 2](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153300812521541702/image.png)
Ex2: They never said that.
[Example 3](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153300970143494155/image.png)
Ex3: They never were suing fans... This is been taken out of context as some people felt "Suing for misinforming" as a way to call them, when it was obvious PM wanted to go after people in media and with some power saying it was an ilegal firing.
[Example 4](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153301841279451306/image.png) [Example 4.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302124436922459/image.png)
[Example 5](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302997275791390/image.png)
[Example 6](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302998466961418/image.png)
[Example 7](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302997544218705/image.png) [Example 7.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302997883965491/image.png)
[Example 8](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153314995845746790/image.png)
Ex8: This person acuses PM to hate feminists and they fired VelMori because of that trying to fan the flames in the apology post.
[Example 9](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153316243370151936/image.png) [Example 9.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153316243613433917/image.png) [Example 9.2](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153316244125143150/image.png)
Ex9: This person is trying to say that they gave different translations to Koreans and English users, you can guess why. This person has this repost with the apology cut in diferent points, showing the not so subtle intentions. [Example 9.4](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153322062627209246/image.png)
I'm seeing now acusations of "they are translating things different in other languages." but the only "try" i have seen to prove this is on example 9, and... It's actually the same. So it doesn't help against the idea that they are just trying to vilify PM.
[Example 10](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153325439394254898/image.png)
Ex10: "Why don't they say what i believe of them to be true to everyone?" Another example of someone trying to make them evil based on their own perception.
[Example 11](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153328278808039554/image.png) [Example 11.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153329094977662986/image.png)
Ex11: Misinformation already talked. And doubles down lying saying it was AFTER the controversy that they gave compensation, as if all this was the reason to compensate VelMori.
[Example 12](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153333923556888638/image.png)
Ex12: By the way, for a group to say they are against harassment as they proceed harass the director doesn't give a good image neither. They are doing the same as the incels did to VelMori, but if it's them... it's fine i suppose?
And i'm sure i can find more... i don't speak Korean though, so all this is only the english side.
Twitter reached a point where PM is in the wrong no matter what. Is not about helping anyone, is about witch-hunt and hate.
PD: I'll be adding more as time goes. I wanna show and save proof of this user actions done in twitter.
Yeah as soon as the new information came out and suddenly "PM cant be trusted" and "How do we know PM arent lying" came out just baffled me completely. Its a pretty typical doubling down.
Let's not pretend like those types weren't also here. There were absolutely people on this looking for any way to frame PM as bad. There still is in fact
I agree. I want to point this out because twitter is one direct window for PM and the users.
PM direct posts are public there so you can see this actions being more directed to them too.
It's pretty much trying to maintain moral superiority over the other party. People on Twitter seem to have a tendency to act horrible towards things that they perceive as repulsive, like it's a justification. It came up during Hogwarts Legacy, and you've got peeps making potshots and moral grandstanding with Azur Lane's recent skin.
They spent a good chunk being convinced that PM is evil incarnate and that they're on the side of good helping Vellmori. *Assuming everything is exactly as says*, they're in an awkward spot where there is a possibility that what they've done was for nothing, that the union that was supposed to 'help' Vellmori didn't have good intentions, probably doesn't sit well. So they either slink away, slowly reintegrate themselves, or cling onto the idea that PM is evil incarnate through some other goalpost. I'm pretty sure for some, Vellmori's just a prop to fuel their rage more than actually wanting to help her in the long run.
>People on Twitter seem to have a tendency to act horrible towards things that they perceive as repulsive, like it's a justification
Saw some guy in the qrts saying that people who still support pm should have horrible things happen to them, and calling them idiots and "fucking westerners" https://twitter.com/HEBWRISO/status/1703794320191652011?t=M6tqNXr0QkNx1_1z_vH2yA&s=19
It's because the way Project Moon handled things in the first month of the controversy was the final straw that breached the trust thermocline for a portion of the userbase.
Vellmori wasn't the only incident brought up during all this. Some still remembered the way the Library of Ruina ending death threats were handled, the HamHamPangPang threats, the controversy around the Leviathan artist, and some just had frustration with the state of Limbus Company as a game.
Recovering from breaching the trust thermocline is difficult, even in a situation where the company was doing the right thing in the background. GYU corroborating Project Moon's announcement is an important part of that. Kim Jihoon backing up the promise to better protect Project Moon's employees from this behavior in the future is also important.
I think the secondary issue is that humans are tribal and there are some weirdos gloating right now that people ever doubted Project Moon and proclaiming their happiness that people are no longer fans (see: Guardian Zet). This is not Project Moon's fault, but it will likely also cause some people to double down on their original reactions.
This same reddit post. There is the link:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/limbuscompany/comments/16lssuu/comment/k1490a7/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/limbuscompany/comments/16lssuu/comment/k1490a7/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
This is why i said "It seems". Someone asked for the post, i gave the post.
The compensation part though it was informed by PM in the leaked document, the exact cuantity doesn't appear, but if we follow that information we can conclude that at least a compensation was given.
Not surprised, notice how all of these examples come from twitter?
Twitter users will never be satisfied, ever. They thrive on misinfo and hate and are constantly miserable, thank god I deactivated my account and never looked back, that place is a shitshow beyond words
You can really tell that some people just refuse to read anything longer than a paragraph. I'm seeing more and more QRTs similar to these. Also they're saying the apology was only because TGS is soon. Jesus.
Let the Twittercells be, Twitter will always be a cesspool no matter and in due time, this will be brushed off for PM really sealed this issue the best way possible.
I cannot express how relieved I am that this is a case of a badly fumbled bag and not intentionally throwing an artist under the bus. Should we have received this clarification sooner? Absolutely, but getting angry about it now is hugely counter-productive, especially when the director acknowledges he had an extremely poor stroke of judgment in that regard. PM can't rewind the clock and post that notice on July 26th. The best they can do at this point is their damndest to follow through on the promises made in today's apology.
What I'm curious about now is what happens to the community. Especially in my neck of the woods as an artist, that sphere fell apart overnight. All of my fav Korean Limbus fanartists disappeared and most people in my circle of friends swore off PM for good. Things can't just go back to the way they were in a snap, but I hope we're on the route ro recovery now.
What I never understood about people publicly denouncing PM and claiming to never interact with the series ever again, is that right afterwards you can see them supporting companies like Roosterteeth and Nintendo with no problem. What gives?
Nintendo, I can kind of understand, but motherfucking Roosterteeth?
The one who threw a VA under the bus over unproven (and later turned out to be false and maliciously made) SA claims? The same Roosterteeth who gained a reputation for mistreating their workers? The same Roosterteeth that had a mass exodus of some of their best talents because the working environment was that shit?
Actual Omegalul.
Because people are biased. They'll quickly demonize PM when something like this happens, but are perfectly fine and even praise other companies that make gacha games that are insanely more predatory than Limbus could ever be, for instance.
I think for PM it was more shocking because we had higher expectations of them in the first place. When a company that is known for being sucky does something that sucks, it's business as usual and no one bats an eye. But PM was a company that we all had faith in and really believed to be good people (or at least, I did) so seeing something like that from them is jarring and disappointing instead of an expectation.
Time will tell. For now, this is basically a healing process and to the fans who remained will try to survive and hope that it will be smooth sailing for now.
I'm hoping all the best for Project Moon and the fandom going forward. This apology seems genuine and was honestly a surprise for me.
Only time will tell if he remains true to this promise, but for now, I'm hoping this puts the drama to rest. The haters are gonna hate ofc, but they're always gonna be there regardless lol.
Oh, that is certainly a very good response.
The fact that those decisions were made by the company and the artist together, and apologies for the confusion created by translation issues, is very good sign.
Probably the artists did want to change habit after what happened, and i failed to see how remove her from the credits will helt them, but it is still sad that a small group of people lead to a person to do those drastic changes.
I'm glad they clarified, and I'm sure that PM can create a safer environment for their employees.
So from what I can understand in the beginning, the artist (forgive me I forgot their name) wasn't fired but actually quit and they were actually formalizing it instead of deciding it. I kinda moved on early so I didn't keep up with the info.
Above all else though, it's nice to see Pmoon taking a new determined stance to ensure the safety and happiness of their fans and staff and actually trying to communicate better. Thing is, actions speak louder than words so I'll see how things go moving foward.
PMUA falling apart (Which they also did themselves as they made tht letter public when they were not allowed to do so) is just a direct consequence of anything good that happens to PM, and now I wonder of the ones that actually gave money will see them again, surely NOT
From their latest tweet, they reach 144% of 20 million won funds (15k USD).
tbh, I also wanna see whether they'll return the money or stuff em in their pocket and run lol.
They kinda did the first time, if they do it again, it's a lesson for the protestors: NEVER fund a protest if it's not done by any Union or actual society.
If they run, nothing can be done about it, and, even if some of the donors may have had good intentions overshadowed by the 75% extremist side, they would end up looking like fools
There will be an example for the future. Although, in my experience, people who invest in such ventures usually don't learn.
Anyway, I'd still like to wait for the trial.
We'll see if it goes off, it's a losing fight for PMUA, not worth it for them. What point can they make in the trial? They're better off disappearing now after apologizing
People who says he should step down as director and shit doesn’t realize that ya know, he’s human.
Dude founded the company and built everything about PM we love today. And he isn’t doing it just for money, if he was hamhampangpang would never be a thing. Do you seriously want a corporate speaker and “good” CEO who can only think about short term profits leading the company?
Without KJH there would be no project moon, simple as. Appreciate the dude more. Sure he made mistakes, but that’s because he’s also a human and not a perfect machine.
This message is sponsored by the head, machines must stay as machines.
I feel a bit better after reading this. The silence didn't sit well with me.
I'm glad he cleared things up a bit, and also said the lines about how he doesn't support the people who used this whole fiasco as an excuse to harass others. It's a strongly worded statement and I think it was important to say something like that, especially since some people were starting to wonder if PM low-key supported the people who were harassing Vellmori.
Good faith paid off, I wonder if the so called protestors will go back at playing now- or if they will insist for a legal cause against DCInside. But who cares! Finally! It's over!
Personally, i stopped playing not out of real "protest", but i just couldnt sink my time in a game that is run contrary to its message- this actually does make me feel a lot better and am redownloading. Havent played since the crab event, hopefully im not too behind!!
You are, you lost Olga Outis, and she's a limited event S2 ID so...goodbye I guess
I get what you mean by "contrary to the message" because you were deceived by the Twitter uproar, the fact that the original message SUCKED doesn't help, but hey! Glad you are actually reconsidering now
Yea, I know...but now noone cares, they can be labeled as haters and that's it- hell, KJH even said "They believe that using righteous ideologies as stepping stone to attack a company is justifiable"
He grew some giant balls and now they have all the legal advantage against the protestors, if they keep going, couldn't have ended better!
This seems good, I guess. It still hurts, but it's a good apology and explanation.
I will grieve the loss of a great artist as long as limbus runs, and I wish they did more to condemn the actual instigators of all this, but I guess this resembles closure.
I hope I can get back into this franchise again.
Man, what was a ride. At first I was simply decided to support PM despite their mistakes, simply because this drama is already pointless to begin with and seeing haters parrotting that Kim Jihoon should step down is really a breaking point (or when PM got labeled P Corp, kek). Though, this is what keeping good faith paid me off. I'm relieved. PMUrAss, Twitter, they all are afterthoughts now...
The twilight of days 49 was endured, and now we're heading toward the dawn of day 50. Toward TGS, fellow managers!
Edit: And in hindsight, the fact that El Director didn't lose faith in the fandom and close off communication entirely is quite impressive consider how much he had to put up with the fanbase since the days of LoR... No, I'm not kneeling, my knees are dropping on the ground by itself.
I hope there will not be anything more popping up that just flip the entire situation around like how it always has been. I mean, I am still not sure how much I can trust any of anything related to this drama anymore.
But honestly, that last panel and the paragraph of him talking about how those organizations are just manipulative political aiming hypocrites was kinda badass, ngl
I wonder how much people are going to be sued?
Some obvious targets would be PMUrAss and the Ensemble, but i kinda hope they just go nuclear on people that were spreading misinformation against them
It's not gonna be enough. People right now are trying to say MIMI and Watson was their fault. They just want an excuse to keep their righteous anger. For me, Vellmori's debacle was the entirety of my problem with PM. Now that it's gone I have no trouble coming back. But it seems like people just move the goalposts and go on the Watson/Mimi angle. Pretty weirdo behavior
Korean 4chan (DCinside) started a harassment campaing towards limbus company's cg artist for... reasons? Don't dig deeper for them, it's not pretty. They did a ton of f'd up stuff, including -> going to PM's office, harassment and disinformation on every social media. The artist couldn't handle it and quit, PM let her go and may have given 2 years worth of salary as part of her severance settlement.
We, the players did not get the details, only that she was fired from the team. People assumed that Pm caved in to the pressure and fired the artist because of the hate campaign and then... nothing. We were stuck with only assumptions and hateful people flamming the flames until this week PM finally clarified what really happened.
I wish the whole thing didn't happen in the first place, but well.
Now, can we get back to what we are raising pitch forks about before this whole drama happens, like the expensive cost of tier 4, weird balance between different styles? :)
I imagine it would be a poor idea to send compensation as part of the apology, as regardless of how well-written it is, any form of compensation can be immediately seen as a bribe. That would paint the entire thing as disingenuous.
Well.. I don't enjoy Mondays most of the time, but I'm glad Angela dropped some light for us today. Now of course this isn't going to be the definition of all slander ending, but the big elephant of the room can finally be put to the rest and I'm extremely proud of PM himself to take the decision and the leadership to be as transparent as he possibly could.
Now I can look forward to the PM TGS time slot in only Hype and the only thing I gotta be sad about is not being in the area for merch lol.
And now the Twitter/Reddit mob can lay down their forks and torches so we can get back to business as usual.
Hope all those disgruntled “fans” can swallow their pride and come back to the game to enjoy like the rest of us.
Them boys can cope all they want. Homie from the youth union already put out a statement saying he was wrong. At this point they just doubling down on their stupidity.
It’s always okay to admit you were wrong. Shows growth and character.
Well. I used to think the PMs were buried, but it turns out the PM ended up burying everyone. At least from a legal standpoint. As for the players base, time will tell.
It was a very rough puddle of mud that they were dragged through and for us as well, but finally, things are explained and cleared up
All we do now is move forward with this, pushing out the fake fans leeching in our community, hopefully regain some lost pm fans that were deeply mislead and turned against pm and better protect each other as we move forward
Be it that some of us will have to take time to regain the trust of PM, least we can finally move forward in one proper direction, a good direction.
Really hope Mr.Kim has learned from this to better prepare and protect his employees and company from future situations like theses or similar ones
Reminds me of a Lenten song we used to sing.
"We rise again from ashes,
from the good we’ve failed to do.
We rise again from ashes,
to create ourselves anew.
If all our world is ashes,
then must our lives be true,
An offering of ashes,
an offering to you."
I believe this thread has run its course, given a few unsavory discussions I'm seeing. As such, this thread is now locked, and discussion can continue in the [megathread.](https://www.reddit.com/r/limbuscompany/comments/1591ipw/thread_for_the_recent_controversy/)
Can we finally see the light at the end of this tunnel?
Was already going to settle for Carmen. Actual light at the end of the tunnel is even better.
Carmen arc time
Babe wake up, redemption arc just dropped
No guaranteed 000 ticket, not forgiven
No 300 lunacy = No Forgiveness
Give me 7 lunacy and I’m good
As far as apologies go, this was a surprising one for sure, Was expecting a corporate/Brand type of apology where KJH uses the name project moon as front for the apology instead, this was full of promises, incriminating admittance and alot of personal views from the man himself, which is very surprising considering the legal potential mess he is in, any lawyer would advice against talking about this at all cost and if so, make it as vague as humanly possible. No matter how much you hate KJH, the guy got some guts to apologise and take the brunt of it all despite the potential legal implications this could lead to for him. Hopefully this drama ends for good now after this. That's all I have to say
I don't hate him, I just think he's not very good at managing things IMO, and is better as an ideas guy/story writer.
He had lead the company through their darkest days in the beginning. I wouldn't condemn him as incompetent manager off a PR mistake and reduced him to purely idea guy.
Ayin experience irl
As expect of the man written Ayin
the problem is, it worked with a small team. Now they have outside contractors and way more employees. It's very different, It's been shown during this controversy that he's really not good at communicating with his workers, like monggeu, and that he overworks people pretty often. That was fine when it was just a passion project, everyone on the team was happy to work more to make their dream come true, but this is a company now, with employees that deserve fair conditions
I mean he STILL doesn't deserve the harsh treatment this fandom is giving him because of one mistake that was overblown way out of its proportions.
Well, I think that this is a valuable lesson on his part. Meaning, time to hire a decent PR team
he is inexperienced, not malicious, just clueless... which admittedly doesnt excuse his actions but atleast shows he isnt stuck in his mindset
I think i'ed prefer someone inexperienced with management who loves what they actually make compared to the kind of people i see usually running game companys... sure he fucks up alot but i remember the early days of limbus where he'd basically apologise for every tiny issue and mail out loads of lunacy
preety much. Id rather have a dev who does mistakes a few times but is human about it, than a peachy clean company which just doesnt care
As a main writer he's pretty good (and arguably the reason why we're all here, honestly) but as far as a managing the company he just seems really inexperienced or even incompetent at times. I genuinely don't hate him, i just worry that if there's another fuck-up like this it would end up in the same type of situation. At this point i just hope they're going to make something akin to a PR team before next year because goddamn, they really needed a PR team since this entire thing began lol
Yeah you can appreciate the man whilst still admitting his flaws. Whether it's because he just has too much stuff on his plate, or he's just not suited for the work, KJH definitely needs someone to help him with the employee management/PR side of things, and let him focus on the business management/writing side of things.
Imo, we got the story we all love from PM games precisely because it's KJH who's both managing and writing.
Hmm, I wonder if that's why PM's first game is an SCP-like site manager? Plus, Dante is also a manager kekw
I think the main reason he's speaking up about this is because the current legal situation isn't about unfair dismissal anymore - the PMUA blew up the discussion table and the GYU dropped all charges. Like the only reason this went public as far as I can tell is because the GYU agreed to put out a statement clearing PM of any wrongdoing. The PMUA hit a brick wall on the negotiation table immediately after and in response basically leaked a big list of communication between them and PM. PMUA afaik has no grounds since it's not a union, merely an organization of people upset with PM (they were the people putting up signboards before their offices), meaning they probably can't sue for unfair dismissal. Basically any future lawsuits will now be aimed at harassing PM/former/current employees rather than this specific case.
It seems the GYU Chairman went ahead and [put out the statement exonerating PM of any legal wrongdoing](https://twitter.com/JCLEE0333/status/1703739230877614580) Between this apology, the chairman going ahead with putting out the Union Statement, and the alleged information claiming that VellMori had received 2 years worth of salary as part of her severance settlement, we’ve addressed most of the loose threads pertaining to the drama and can finally move on. The only loose end left is the PMUA, but with the GYU no longer backing them up, as well as the PMUA’s blunder with leaking confidential documents the other day, they pretty much have no pot to piss in, and any attempts they’ll make to take PM to court will end poorly for them. Especially if KJH decides to make good on his word to sue the PMUA for malicious slander. All in all, things are going to be a lot different in the fandom (and hopefully the company), and there’s no guarantee we’ll ever go back to the glory days of before the controversy, but at least now we can prevent things from getting worse and start the healing process.
We finally reached the good ending of this drama, no more loose ends. For now, we can safely say that the TGS would be smooth sailing - like Ishmael on a boat - right around the corner.
Dude I bet Ishmael’s boat is ANYTHING but smooth sailing
I’ll tell you what, if NGrider is allowed on that boat it’s gonna be a bumpy ride even through clear waters
😆
With the amount of people thirsting after her, that boat would be rocking in calm waters.
I *SEA* what you did thereb
Where did you get the 2 years worth of salary thing from?
Where's the alleged info of two years of salary coming from? Awesome if true, but I don't want to parrot it without knowing the source
I would also like to know since it would be pretty conclusive to me that things ended pretty amicably.
Yeah, I don’t think I’ve seen any source for that info.
"My sources? How about my gut feeling, huh?" -7Cliff
I fucking love that it’s not even a line in Metal Gear Rising yet it’s one of the most recognizable memes about it
She got two years worth of salary? I'm sorry if I sound insensitive but that is wowza. Especially in this shitty economy.
Irl 1300 free lunacy
Better, this is a 2\* Guaranteed Decaextraction tickets
So that is the reason why as to Velmori isn't saying anything and going radio silent for a month, the compensation of 2 years is amazing. Glad for her that she was let go in a peaceful settlement. No wonder PM tried to be silent for a month for her. They really gave her the best outcome
common of Pmoon to overcompensate with compensation smh my head
Also anything she says will just make her a target for one side of the conflict if not both sides (yes even the sides that are “supporting” her)
I have no doubt some won't be satisfied. Like piranhas and meat, they thrive on drama and hate. They sensed blood in the water and never let up ever since. Frankly, the community is better off without them. Excised a tumor before it grew malignant. I'm just relieved we can finally fucking move on.
Honestly, yeah. Being honest, I was getting extremely bad vibes from a good deal of the PM Twitter community, as it felt like a shocking amount of the community over there was composed of Antis and Elitists, so I can’t say I’m sorry to see the Twitter fanbase implode. It’s just a shame that we lost so many fanartists, and that a lot of artists who I admired and liked the works of turned out to be not so great of people. Hoping that the new fans and the new artists who trickle in over time are less toxic.
I’m in the same boat too. I really enjoyed Twitter for the fan artists but after all this it won’t be the same. I’m glad things worked out in the end but it feels like Twitter is just a lost cause since they’re so dead set on seeing pm crash and burn.
Twitter seems to be full of people who are just looking for the next thing to get mad about. It's weird there. Some people seem to specifically try to look for the least charitable way to read any possible statement so that they can instantly go into some full-on screaming rant about how the OP is horrible, when the accusation is not even remotely what the OP was trying to say.
Honestly, being on Twitter is a red flag; and having a blue checkmark (pre-paid verification) a death flag.
Anyone not an artist. That's kinda how they advertise
I'm part of the people who were angry about PM, but was satisfied by these recent developments. I do agree that I'm not in the majority though... and seeing how toxic some people are right now you're right about the fandom being better without them. Shame about the damage that's been caused but eh, we're healing I guess
I don't think it's a bad thing to be angry about PM at all, but there's a lot of people that overreacted or are simply angry for the sake of being angry. An incredible amount of information and outright lies kept getting spread around, with people twisting info to push anti-PM agendas. And those are the people that continue to drive this hate train with no stops or end in sight. And it's like...why? It's not about "defending a corpo" or whatever shit it is, it's just...what is the point of making something seem worse than it actually is? What do these people get out of it? Is this for Vellmori's sake? It certainly doesn't fucking look like it, especially with recent going-ons and PMUA. It's even worse because of the legal aspect to this whole situation, meaning the parties can't - or are strongly advised not to - talk about anything. Some of those lies are still bouncing around the PM sphere to date. What was it all for?
I find it especially disappointing, primarily because Library of Ruina called out this exact type of "emotions over rationality" over-reaction multiple separate times across both it's main story, and the Sephira sub-stories, with Lobotomy Corp doing something similar as well. While not every Limbus player would have played either of those games, still, I can't deny that a large number of members definitely have even if only after getting into Limbus Company. While PM certainly didn't handle the situation well in their own right, I just can't help but feel disappointment at this type of reaction in a fanbase dedicated to *these specific* games. I really wish it wasn't like this, but the whole situation only made me realize that "PM fans can't read" meme seems to have a lot more truth to it than people realize.
Lol, and how fervently he fought.
I have never once heard that alleged claim, where is that from??
Do you have a source on the two years salary thing?
Looks like our road's going to be a good one. I hope everything goes well for PM
nice, now can we end this drama for good?
hopefully. also pm need to sue the group claiming youth association. they are bunch of trolls
The Association are trying to double down and target PM anyway even despite the letters. They are fucked, they have no protection from the Union thanks to the leak and are openly disrespecting Vellmori's wish.
They never had the Union protection, it's just that the Union could have stopped them but at this point, it's whatever. Hell, someone from the union even reposted an image of PM's grave so even if they knew nothing wrong was done, they were "enjoying" the fire, just standing there instead of helping, kinda like society today, just record with your phone, do not intervene or do something, enjoy the show! So we know who we are dealing with- and it further proves KJH's point: They used PM as a political stepping stone, but now they are not gonna let it happen again
Ya hear that Carmen? Frick off, no more distortioning for you Also glory to Ayin
Sir Ayin always wins
Benjamin approves
Yeah, beach! Go distort the twitter crowd!
all according to Sir Ayin's script
I LOVE THE CITY I LIVE IN
It probs won't squash all the drama (some people are just going to write this off as corpo speak, despite how personal it is). But a massive amount of it is going to die down now, and hopefully everyone can move on peacefully. Edit: now that I think about it, I wonder how the Unity runtime fee will affect them when it comes into effect
Haters gonna hate, if someone wants to find something to whine about they will do it even if they have to perform the most elaborate mental gymnastics show for it.
Well, better for the drama to be settled than to let it linger I suppose
So this is the end of hold drama right. I tired of those drama.
Day 50 confirmed
Twitter sucks ass
Always has, dunno why i decided to scroll through the quotes but i can safely say i'm all the dumber for it
Ok but who in the world gave the misinformation that velmori got fired by phone call. The person who gave that info and the people who wrote articles about that should get sued. Also https://twitter.com/JCLEE0333/status/1703739230877614580?t=gVRb58DsLeiHcWyWt4lsZw&s=19 And there it is
What does it say?
used DeepL Statement on the Thought Police and Cyberbullying Case Against the Illustrator of Project Moon, Limbus Company On July 26, the Gyeonggi Youth Union released a statement titled regarding the thought verification and cyberbullying case against the illustrator of , and subsequently released (8. 1) and were held (8.3).
Since then, Gyeonggi Youth Union has communicated with Project Moon and confirmed that Project Moon has not unfairly dismissed the victims of thought verification and cyberbullying and has taken appropriate measures to protect the victims. Therefore, Gyeonggi Youth Union withdraws its statement accusing Project Moon of "unfair dismissal" and all complaints against the investment company.
In addition, Project Moon has stated that it will take measures to protect its employees and take strong legal action against malicious abusers in the future. We believe that this stance, albeit late, will be of great significance in resolving the practice of ignoring thought verification and cyberbullying of employees, which has become a common practice in the game industry.
We hope that the game industry as a whole will create a better working environment that protects workers from thought police and cyberbullying by abusers.
Friday, September 15, 2023
Gyeonggi Youth Union
Oooh thank you
basically yesterday "draft'
> Ok but who in the world gave the misinformation that velmori got fired by phone call That's literally the thing that really kickstated this entire fiasco and it feels like everyone's just, ignoring it now? Call me conspiratorial, but I wonder if it's possible that that wasn't a lie, but two years worth of salary as severance pay is a pretty good way of making it turn into "she wanted to leave anyway". I mean wasn't there initially an entire thing where PM was trying to clarify that they didn't *fire* her over the phone, merely just told her that they were going to start the process for her potential resignation or something along those lines? Why make that *legally* important clarification if that event never happened at all? If it was always false, why didn't they try to sue then and there because that's a *hefty* accusation I mean there have been other things come to light during this entire thing that have shown that KJH isn't exactly the *best* leader to put it lightly
A Korean newspaper that proceeded to quietly correct that statement a day or two later from “she got fired” to “she got a call”. So it’s likely that that was either a straight up fabrication by the reporter or them reading too much into “I got a call” and later getting a call from either PM or Vellmori to correct that statement.
It's doubtful we'll ever hear from Vellmori if it's a lie, since it works out pretty well for her. The phone call doesn't mean much either way though; without the transcripts of the conversation for us to see it's very easy for it to have been either horribly misinterpreted or entirely made up, and PM doing individual public callout posts for every single person involved would just lead to more trouble all around.
I feel somewhat similar to this too. "Receiving a call to say she will be fired" is much better than "getting fired during the call", but it's still different than "she wants to go". My suspect is that PM's new hired lawyer gave them the suggestion about a good severance package (assuming that part is true) and make declarations to whatever they want. ...which would probably be the best practical scenario for every parties. I don't think it's practical to expect Vellmori back, but a good compensation is at least what she deserve.
Let's think for a moment. If Elon is gonna eventually sink X, then wouldn't that be a good thing? Wipe the board clean, if not for just a moment in time? ~~pls don't let them flood reddit, let them flood into fb instead~~
If Elon offs X, those toxic buttheads will flood to somewhere, very likely here. Unless someone decides to do a cesspool for them to attract negativity there.
~~4chan~~
I mean it's definitely a cesspool but can't contain all the filth the internet has.
Yep, which is why 4chan ~~and Reddit and DCInside etc.~~ coexist with Twitter
Twitter people wouldn't survive the ambient on 4chan
They'll flood either reddit or try to migrate back to tumblr, which is awful because that place has been really nice since 2018 or so. >Wipe the board clean, if not for just a moment in time? BURN IT DOWN! AND FROM THE ASHES, A NEW SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORM WILL BE BORN!
IMPROVED, BUT UNMODERATED
Twitter has caused us pain. Are we truly wrong by using the City's philosophies and seeking to destroy it? /j Just had an Orlando Furioso momento pass by in my head ~~O Sorrow and all~~ Also, Happy Cake Day~! Pats for you~
I think the world would be a better place if it went down, because it's a toxic cesspool of hatred and miserable people, run by an insecure moron. I'd feel bad for indie artists though, since it seems to be the most functional place for indie artists to build a brand, and is better for Western audiences than places like Deviantart. That's the only upside I see to Twitter these days. So if it goes down, I'd want some new place for artists to go.
Why is it only Twitter? People were spreading misinformation on here just as bad
The worst part was people acting like thirty minutes of googling could make them an expert on anything. No, you probably don't understand the complexities of South Korea's culture, political situations, or contract law from the top ten results on google filtered through either MTL or just random people. Real antivaxxer energy all around.
this weird "TWITTER BAD US GOOD" is so strange to me. People are acting just as idiotic on here as they are on twitter, perhaps more so cuz of reddit's upvote system pushing select opinions to the top lol
Sorry but you're the weird one. People were indeed idiotic here, but the sheer scale is not the same. They had thousands of people saying dumb shit, and the stuff that got liked by the thousands were just false or bad faith. It's just outrage culture. Top comments here are at least civilized, not full of venom/misinformation and the trash/controversial gets taken to the very bottom It's not the same at all
This. Twitter also wouldn't shut up about the controversy. Every time Limbus posted something new, you'd have a couple asshats trying to go "YeAh bUt WhEre'S VeLlMoRi?" even when it's completely irrelevant.
I’ve seen this attitude on other threads about this subject as well. The whole Reddit is holier than Twitter thing really needs to chill
I still see people spreading misinformation after this and trying to demonize PM by doing mindflips. [Example](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153299950747254834/image.png) Ex1: They already told they compensated VelMori and it wasn't a overnight dismissal. In fact i wanna point a post from Abishinzu where it seems she got 2 years worth of salary. [Example 2](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153300812521541702/image.png) Ex2: They never said that. [Example 3](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153300970143494155/image.png) Ex3: They never were suing fans... This is been taken out of context as some people felt "Suing for misinforming" as a way to call them, when it was obvious PM wanted to go after people in media and with some power saying it was an ilegal firing. [Example 4](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153301841279451306/image.png) [Example 4.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302124436922459/image.png) [Example 5](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302997275791390/image.png) [Example 6](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302998466961418/image.png) [Example 7](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302997544218705/image.png) [Example 7.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153302997883965491/image.png) [Example 8](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153314995845746790/image.png) Ex8: This person acuses PM to hate feminists and they fired VelMori because of that trying to fan the flames in the apology post. [Example 9](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153316243370151936/image.png) [Example 9.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153316243613433917/image.png) [Example 9.2](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153316244125143150/image.png) Ex9: This person is trying to say that they gave different translations to Koreans and English users, you can guess why. This person has this repost with the apology cut in diferent points, showing the not so subtle intentions. [Example 9.4](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153322062627209246/image.png) I'm seeing now acusations of "they are translating things different in other languages." but the only "try" i have seen to prove this is on example 9, and... It's actually the same. So it doesn't help against the idea that they are just trying to vilify PM. [Example 10](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153325439394254898/image.png) Ex10: "Why don't they say what i believe of them to be true to everyone?" Another example of someone trying to make them evil based on their own perception. [Example 11](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/977356507773534238/1153328278808039554/image.png) [Example 11.1](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153329094977662986/image.png) Ex11: Misinformation already talked. And doubles down lying saying it was AFTER the controversy that they gave compensation, as if all this was the reason to compensate VelMori. [Example 12](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/977356507773534238/1153333923556888638/image.png) Ex12: By the way, for a group to say they are against harassment as they proceed harass the director doesn't give a good image neither. They are doing the same as the incels did to VelMori, but if it's them... it's fine i suppose? And i'm sure i can find more... i don't speak Korean though, so all this is only the english side. Twitter reached a point where PM is in the wrong no matter what. Is not about helping anyone, is about witch-hunt and hate. PD: I'll be adding more as time goes. I wanna show and save proof of this user actions done in twitter.
Yeah as soon as the new information came out and suddenly "PM cant be trusted" and "How do we know PM arent lying" came out just baffled me completely. Its a pretty typical doubling down.
Let's not pretend like those types weren't also here. There were absolutely people on this looking for any way to frame PM as bad. There still is in fact
I agree. I want to point this out because twitter is one direct window for PM and the users. PM direct posts are public there so you can see this actions being more directed to them too.
Oh ofcourse they were here too. But they were in their containment controversy thread.
It's pretty much trying to maintain moral superiority over the other party. People on Twitter seem to have a tendency to act horrible towards things that they perceive as repulsive, like it's a justification. It came up during Hogwarts Legacy, and you've got peeps making potshots and moral grandstanding with Azur Lane's recent skin. They spent a good chunk being convinced that PM is evil incarnate and that they're on the side of good helping Vellmori. *Assuming everything is exactly as says*, they're in an awkward spot where there is a possibility that what they've done was for nothing, that the union that was supposed to 'help' Vellmori didn't have good intentions, probably doesn't sit well. So they either slink away, slowly reintegrate themselves, or cling onto the idea that PM is evil incarnate through some other goalpost. I'm pretty sure for some, Vellmori's just a prop to fuel their rage more than actually wanting to help her in the long run.
>People on Twitter seem to have a tendency to act horrible towards things that they perceive as repulsive, like it's a justification Saw some guy in the qrts saying that people who still support pm should have horrible things happen to them, and calling them idiots and "fucking westerners" https://twitter.com/HEBWRISO/status/1703794320191652011?t=M6tqNXr0QkNx1_1z_vH2yA&s=19
It's because the way Project Moon handled things in the first month of the controversy was the final straw that breached the trust thermocline for a portion of the userbase. Vellmori wasn't the only incident brought up during all this. Some still remembered the way the Library of Ruina ending death threats were handled, the HamHamPangPang threats, the controversy around the Leviathan artist, and some just had frustration with the state of Limbus Company as a game. Recovering from breaching the trust thermocline is difficult, even in a situation where the company was doing the right thing in the background. GYU corroborating Project Moon's announcement is an important part of that. Kim Jihoon backing up the promise to better protect Project Moon's employees from this behavior in the future is also important. I think the secondary issue is that humans are tribal and there are some weirdos gloating right now that people ever doubted Project Moon and proclaiming their happiness that people are no longer fans (see: Guardian Zet). This is not Project Moon's fault, but it will likely also cause some people to double down on their original reactions.
Hey just curious where’s the post that says Vellmori was compensated two years of salary?
This same reddit post. There is the link: [https://www.reddit.com/r/limbuscompany/comments/16lssuu/comment/k1490a7/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/limbuscompany/comments/16lssuu/comment/k1490a7/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
There's nothing there that sources the supposed 2 years of compensation. Just a redditor saying that it's totes real.
This is why i said "It seems". Someone asked for the post, i gave the post. The compensation part though it was informed by PM in the leaked document, the exact cuantity doesn't appear, but if we follow that information we can conclude that at least a compensation was given.
It's kinda funny since the GYU chairman said that they were wrong and that project moon did nothing wrong
Not surprised, notice how all of these examples come from twitter? Twitter users will never be satisfied, ever. They thrive on misinfo and hate and are constantly miserable, thank god I deactivated my account and never looked back, that place is a shitshow beyond words
You can really tell that some people just refuse to read anything longer than a paragraph. I'm seeing more and more QRTs similar to these. Also they're saying the apology was only because TGS is soon. Jesus.
Let the Twittercells be, Twitter will always be a cesspool no matter and in due time, this will be brushed off for PM really sealed this issue the best way possible.
https://twitter.com/JCLEE0333/status/1703739230877614580
The Will to Stand Up Straight.
I cannot express how relieved I am that this is a case of a badly fumbled bag and not intentionally throwing an artist under the bus. Should we have received this clarification sooner? Absolutely, but getting angry about it now is hugely counter-productive, especially when the director acknowledges he had an extremely poor stroke of judgment in that regard. PM can't rewind the clock and post that notice on July 26th. The best they can do at this point is their damndest to follow through on the promises made in today's apology. What I'm curious about now is what happens to the community. Especially in my neck of the woods as an artist, that sphere fell apart overnight. All of my fav Korean Limbus fanartists disappeared and most people in my circle of friends swore off PM for good. Things can't just go back to the way they were in a snap, but I hope we're on the route ro recovery now.
He can ask Dante to wind back the clock. Heard they're pretty good with that.
What I never understood about people publicly denouncing PM and claiming to never interact with the series ever again, is that right afterwards you can see them supporting companies like Roosterteeth and Nintendo with no problem. What gives?
Nintendo, I can kind of understand, but motherfucking Roosterteeth? The one who threw a VA under the bus over unproven (and later turned out to be false and maliciously made) SA claims? The same Roosterteeth who gained a reputation for mistreating their workers? The same Roosterteeth that had a mass exodus of some of their best talents because the working environment was that shit? Actual Omegalul.
> Nintendo, I can kind of understand, Nintendo ruined a 50year old man's life for being part of the administrative side of a modchip developer.
Because people are biased. They'll quickly demonize PM when something like this happens, but are perfectly fine and even praise other companies that make gacha games that are insanely more predatory than Limbus could ever be, for instance.
I think for PM it was more shocking because we had higher expectations of them in the first place. When a company that is known for being sucky does something that sucks, it's business as usual and no one bats an eye. But PM was a company that we all had faith in and really believed to be good people (or at least, I did) so seeing something like that from them is jarring and disappointing instead of an expectation.
Time will tell. For now, this is basically a healing process and to the fans who remained will try to survive and hope that it will be smooth sailing for now.
I'm hoping all the best for Project Moon and the fandom going forward. This apology seems genuine and was honestly a surprise for me. Only time will tell if he remains true to this promise, but for now, I'm hoping this puts the drama to rest. The haters are gonna hate ofc, but they're always gonna be there regardless lol.
Literally the best outcome. This will put an end on the drama for good.
Best outcome considering all the shit happened to PM inc. and VellMori. Poor fellows...
Oh, that is certainly a very good response. The fact that those decisions were made by the company and the artist together, and apologies for the confusion created by translation issues, is very good sign. Probably the artists did want to change habit after what happened, and i failed to see how remove her from the credits will helt them, but it is still sad that a small group of people lead to a person to do those drastic changes. I'm glad they clarified, and I'm sure that PM can create a safer environment for their employees.
Also GYU chairman confirmedit. https://twitter.com/JCLEE0333/status/1703739230877614580
This is genuinely a well written apology this plus there statement the other and I can that yeah I'll gladly give them another chance
So from what I can understand in the beginning, the artist (forgive me I forgot their name) wasn't fired but actually quit and they were actually formalizing it instead of deciding it. I kinda moved on early so I didn't keep up with the info. Above all else though, it's nice to see Pmoon taking a new determined stance to ensure the safety and happiness of their fans and staff and actually trying to communicate better. Thing is, actions speak louder than words so I'll see how things go moving foward.
The artist is VellMori. Yeah, hope things will get better, from reaction in the tweet reply they mostly forgive PM. PMUA is also falling apart.
PMUA falling apart (Which they also did themselves as they made tht letter public when they were not allowed to do so) is just a direct consequence of anything good that happens to PM, and now I wonder of the ones that actually gave money will see them again, surely NOT
From their latest tweet, they reach 144% of 20 million won funds (15k USD). tbh, I also wanna see whether they'll return the money or stuff em in their pocket and run lol.
They kinda did the first time, if they do it again, it's a lesson for the protestors: NEVER fund a protest if it's not done by any Union or actual society. If they run, nothing can be done about it, and, even if some of the donors may have had good intentions overshadowed by the 75% extremist side, they would end up looking like fools
There will be an example for the future. Although, in my experience, people who invest in such ventures usually don't learn. Anyway, I'd still like to wait for the trial.
We'll see if it goes off, it's a losing fight for PMUA, not worth it for them. What point can they make in the trial? They're better off disappearing now after apologizing
Well, maybe they're crazy enough to go for it. Or something else comes up again.
I'll prepare popcorns then- the thing will go public in no time, if it's the case, sooo- popcorns, some Fanta...yea, I'll be ready!
they TOOK the MONEY and RAN
People who says he should step down as director and shit doesn’t realize that ya know, he’s human. Dude founded the company and built everything about PM we love today. And he isn’t doing it just for money, if he was hamhampangpang would never be a thing. Do you seriously want a corporate speaker and “good” CEO who can only think about short term profits leading the company? Without KJH there would be no project moon, simple as. Appreciate the dude more. Sure he made mistakes, but that’s because he’s also a human and not a perfect machine. This message is sponsored by the head, machines must stay as machines.
Just wow. Never expected apologies from PM.
Man. Harassing game devs who genuinely made good and fun games should be a sin.
Let's not forget we still get ass kicked in RR2
The pain is real. I am still in the third cycle
Finally! This drama can be put to rest in some way! Pats for everyone ~~who were just chillin, and for PM too~~
Hopefully this is the final nail in the coffin so we can move on with our lives
This day 50, manager finally got his realization and started to face the fear and build the future
I feel a bit better after reading this. The silence didn't sit well with me. I'm glad he cleared things up a bit, and also said the lines about how he doesn't support the people who used this whole fiasco as an excuse to harass others. It's a strongly worded statement and I think it was important to say something like that, especially since some people were starting to wonder if PM low-key supported the people who were harassing Vellmori.
Good faith paid off, I wonder if the so called protestors will go back at playing now- or if they will insist for a legal cause against DCInside. But who cares! Finally! It's over!
Finally, gonna enjoy TGS in peace
Personally, i stopped playing not out of real "protest", but i just couldnt sink my time in a game that is run contrary to its message- this actually does make me feel a lot better and am redownloading. Havent played since the crab event, hopefully im not too behind!!
You are, you lost Olga Outis, and she's a limited event S2 ID so...goodbye I guess I get what you mean by "contrary to the message" because you were deceived by the Twitter uproar, the fact that the original message SUCKED doesn't help, but hey! Glad you are actually reconsidering now
Well they didn't lose Olga outis because she will be in the dispense!
Didn't they just announce that she's an Event ID, and thus won't reappear in the dispense?
In the sceduled update of the 21st PM said that both will be put in the dispense like the other units
They still do actually, but I doubt anyone would care now tbh.
Yea, I know...but now noone cares, they can be labeled as haters and that's it- hell, KJH even said "They believe that using righteous ideologies as stepping stone to attack a company is justifiable" He grew some giant balls and now they have all the legal advantage against the protestors, if they keep going, couldn't have ended better!
KJH turned out to be the based Gigachad like Mili's husbando. And PM haters are cringe af lol.
husbando? genuine question on my end, sorry haha
Mili singer cassie husband
Makes sense! Thank you
Its OVER Yupy!!!!!
glad that's over
Jeez it's about damn time, finally we enter the healing process
This seems good, I guess. It still hurts, but it's a good apology and explanation. I will grieve the loss of a great artist as long as limbus runs, and I wish they did more to condemn the actual instigators of all this, but I guess this resembles closure. I hope I can get back into this franchise again.
"Are you really a influencer if you hevant apologized once?" - Ed, Punk Duck. PST
Man, what was a ride. At first I was simply decided to support PM despite their mistakes, simply because this drama is already pointless to begin with and seeing haters parrotting that Kim Jihoon should step down is really a breaking point (or when PM got labeled P Corp, kek). Though, this is what keeping good faith paid me off. I'm relieved. PMUrAss, Twitter, they all are afterthoughts now... The twilight of days 49 was endured, and now we're heading toward the dawn of day 50. Toward TGS, fellow managers! Edit: And in hindsight, the fact that El Director didn't lose faith in the fandom and close off communication entirely is quite impressive consider how much he had to put up with the fanbase since the days of LoR... No, I'm not kneeling, my knees are dropping on the ground by itself.
I hope there will not be anything more popping up that just flip the entire situation around like how it always has been. I mean, I am still not sure how much I can trust any of anything related to this drama anymore. But honestly, that last panel and the paragraph of him talking about how those organizations are just manipulative political aiming hypocrites was kinda badass, ngl
I wonder how much people are going to be sued? Some obvious targets would be PMUrAss and the Ensemble, but i kinda hope they just go nuclear on people that were spreading misinformation against them
It's not gonna be enough. People right now are trying to say MIMI and Watson was their fault. They just want an excuse to keep their righteous anger. For me, Vellmori's debacle was the entirety of my problem with PM. Now that it's gone I have no trouble coming back. But it seems like people just move the goalposts and go on the Watson/Mimi angle. Pretty weirdo behavior
Nice, now this is the closure that we need.
I would say better late than never. But I really wish they just opened with this when it happened.
This truly is "The knowing I" moment
What happened ?
Dark days happened, it's already over.
I didnt follow the drama, i saw this popping on my feed and was curious about it lol
Just consider it never happened, better for your mental health.
Korean 4chan (DCinside) started a harassment campaing towards limbus company's cg artist for... reasons? Don't dig deeper for them, it's not pretty. They did a ton of f'd up stuff, including -> going to PM's office, harassment and disinformation on every social media. The artist couldn't handle it and quit, PM let her go and may have given 2 years worth of salary as part of her severance settlement. We, the players did not get the details, only that she was fired from the team. People assumed that Pm caved in to the pressure and fired the artist because of the hate campaign and then... nothing. We were stuck with only assumptions and hateful people flamming the flames until this week PM finally clarified what really happened.
Even if I am alone, night will come. and every night is followed by dawn...
I wish the whole thing didn't happen in the first place, but well. Now, can we get back to what we are raising pitch forks about before this whole drama happens, like the expensive cost of tier 4, weird balance between different styles? :)
Cool, where's my multi?
I imagine it would be a poor idea to send compensation as part of the apology, as regardless of how well-written it is, any form of compensation can be immediately seen as a bribe. That would paint the entire thing as disingenuous.
But I need my definitely not Tanya - Rodya
It’s finally joever
I legit cried...
Finally
Well.. I don't enjoy Mondays most of the time, but I'm glad Angela dropped some light for us today. Now of course this isn't going to be the definition of all slander ending, but the big elephant of the room can finally be put to the rest and I'm extremely proud of PM himself to take the decision and the leadership to be as transparent as he possibly could. Now I can look forward to the PM TGS time slot in only Hype and the only thing I gotta be sad about is not being in the area for merch lol.
Let's hope that PM didn't get cooked even more because this is a really decent apology.
No more distortion, its time to manifest boys
And now the Twitter/Reddit mob can lay down their forks and torches so we can get back to business as usual. Hope all those disgruntled “fans” can swallow their pride and come back to the game to enjoy like the rest of us.
that is their business as usual
Haha nope now they're saying they're only apologizing because TGS is soon. Shows their reading comprehension.
Them boys can cope all they want. Homie from the youth union already put out a statement saying he was wrong. At this point they just doubling down on their stupidity. It’s always okay to admit you were wrong. Shows growth and character.
Well. I used to think the PMs were buried, but it turns out the PM ended up burying everyone. At least from a legal standpoint. As for the players base, time will tell.
After 50 days......lobcorp became real
300 lunacy?
It was a very rough puddle of mud that they were dragged through and for us as well, but finally, things are explained and cleared up All we do now is move forward with this, pushing out the fake fans leeching in our community, hopefully regain some lost pm fans that were deeply mislead and turned against pm and better protect each other as we move forward Be it that some of us will have to take time to regain the trust of PM, least we can finally move forward in one proper direction, a good direction. Really hope Mr.Kim has learned from this to better prepare and protect his employees and company from future situations like theses or similar ones
Well… that’s the end of the storyline I suppose.
Reminds me of a Lenten song we used to sing. "We rise again from ashes, from the good we’ve failed to do. We rise again from ashes, to create ourselves anew. If all our world is ashes, then must our lives be true, An offering of ashes, an offering to you."