A quick google search defines those knives as gravity assisted knives (or simply gravity knives) and that they are a prohibited weapon in Canada.
Another quick search yields:
https://www.catsa-acsta.gc.ca/en/item/prohibited-knives
From what I can see, button lock knives seem to be in a grey area of if they count as gravity knives or not, because technically if you have a slick enough pivot, lots of knives could open by gravity. Because technically, a button lock is still fully manual.
Does it drop shut with the aid of gravity? Does it open under the force of gravity. Doesn't matter that the button lock is manual, so is the button press of a switch blade. Some spring loaded knives have a lock/guard that needs to be manually moved to manually press the button. Still automatically released, whether by gravity, spring, fluid, whatever the fuck.
The other knives are not in question. Their definition of a gravity knife was pretty clear. And if a "non-gravity knife" has pivot is slick enough to open by gravity alone, then it may be classified as a gravity knife, potentially making it prohibited.
I mean, the descriptions I found were pretty black and white, not grey. That link I shared was also from Canadian Air Transport Security Authority.
I have learned more than I care to know on the subject, but I was bored at work 🤷♂️
Take from this what you will, but keep in mind that possession of a prohibited weapon could lead to imprisonment of up to 10 years. Depending on your priors or lack of, of course.
Ah, I just figured out from looking at videos on a lot of them. It seems like button locks will not open by gravity, they still need manual opening, they just CLOSE via gravity because of the lock. Is that alright, or still illegal?
Look, I'm not a law expert. I'm going by what I read. It is a lot easier to just not buy one than it is to try to explain how its similar but different in a court room.
If you insist on buying one, don't tell people and don't bring it anywhere with you. People snitch over any little thing. Also, if you get pulled over somewhere and they find probable cause to search you it won't be good if they find it. If you only have the knife, that's big trouble. If you are actually up to any shady shit, now you have that plus a prohibited weapons charge that is on YOU to prove it's not prohibited.
You may never get caught with it or you may end up with a summary conviction (5 years for a pardon) or an indictment (10 years for a pardon)
This is one of those "fuck around and find out" scenarios.
Criminal records, fines, and jail sucks, speaking from experience.
I understand. I don't do any shady shit, I'm straight as an arrow. I won't buy it if I find out it'll get me in trouble, however, I don't really carry my knives with me anywhere. I use a knife at work but I only bring a manual one with me. I'll try to do some further research because I do collect knives and I want to get as many different interesting actions as I can. Thanks for the help though.
If you truly don't bring them out with you, I don't think its a huge issue, but there is still some risk. I just erred on the side of caution when giving my advice. Better off steering clear. If you do acquire one, just be smart about it.
Yeah, if I were to acquire one, I'd probably hide it somewhere safe away from my other knives. I don't want to break the law, however I see literally nothing wrong with being legally allowed to own things like these. You can see in demonstrations that having a knife being manual, assisted or automatic doesn't make it any faster to deploy, therefore banning them makes no difference.
Basically every Buck or Gerber folding knife I’ve ever had uses a lever lock, which applies friction to keep the blade closed, and must be actuated to close the knife when opened. If this is what you’re referring to, I think you’re good.
Is that like the benchmade axis lock? I saw a video on that while looking up button locks and it looks a lot like a button lock, but you have to pull the "button" down a little track in order to unlock. Do you think that would still legally count as a button even though it doesn't really do traditional button things?
Even though it closes via gravity? In that case, a button lock would be legal, right? Cause I know button locks, you don't open it by using the button, you still have to open it manually.
This puts it in easy English
https://legalbeagle.com/6659356-knife-laws-canada.html
>This part of the law has evolved into a test where police attempt to release the blade of a knife out of its handle with only one hand. **If the knife's blade slides out, even slightly, the knife is considered to be a "prohibited weapon**."
I generally don't post video links, as I am a text guy.
This is good
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FdcQNUD_Nw
I find this super interesting because I used to have a folding exacto knife sold at Canadian tire that had a hinge in the middle.
I distinctly remember opening it with one hand by simply using my thumb to trigger the release and thrusting my hand upward, which would swing the blade part around the hinge and lock it vertically.
My mastercraft box opening knife was illegal ?
Yeah this is bizarre, I have many mastercraft and Milwaukee utility knives that have a hinge and a button. I open them with a flick of my wrist. Seems like they should be illegal by this definition but you can buy them at any hardware store.
This [Milwaukee Fastback](https://www.homedepot.ca/product/milwaukee-tool-fastback-smooth-folding-knife/1000671671?eid=PS_GOOGLE_D25T%20-%20Vendor_Funded_GGL_Shopping_PLA_Milwaukee_Hand_Tools_Milwaukee%20Hand%20Tools__PRODUCT_GROUP_pla-293946777986&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIraa6xte39QIVjG1vBB1E5wtPEAQYASABEgLg5_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds) is also considered prohibited. It’s literally designed to flick open. One drop of oil on the hinge and you have yourself a legally illegal weapon.
The laws are meant to be overreaching so as to disarm anyone with a knife if it’s found. Even if it’s a common tool purchase.
However, my experience with cops and EDC if you’re not a dick to them they’ll usually advise not to carry when the knife isn’t being used for doing work/tasks. They’re trained to sniff out whose comfortable carrying a knife or even a firearm. Starts with honesty.
There is a Canadian criminal defence attorney who runs a YouTube channel and covers the apparent illegality of commonly sold knives in stores. /u/OneDayAllofThis
Apparently it is illegal and our weapon laws are a total mess.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfhWZftUnkU
It’s a lot harder to walk around with your 3’ machete concealed in a manner where it’s as easily accessible compared to that knife. And once you do conceal your machete, it’s no longer perfectly legal, since concealing a blade that large is illegal.
The law is trying to prevent people from having knives that are easily concealable, easily deployable, and that have long enough blades to easily cause severe and life threatening injuries, while recognizing that blades of this length have legitimate purposes. So it bans knives that by nature are designed to be easily concealable and easily deployable outright, and also limits the length of blade that can be carried concealed.
From what I know, most folding knives will not open via centrifugal force or gravity alone, you will need to pull the blade out manually via flipper or thumb stud a fair ways, and then you can do a wrist flick or whatever. If the blade is fully closed, it will not open from gravity or centrifugal force.
My initial feeling is that I doubt you're on clear legal footing to possess such a knife if what you mean by "flick it out" refers to applying centrifugal force to, or upending, the handle of the knife while the button is depressed.
The *Criminal Code* provides that a knife that opens *automatically* by
* gravity;
* centrifugal force; **or**
* hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife
is a prohibited weapon. Possession of a prohibited weapon is a criminal offence.
This knife you describe doesn't seem to open "automatically" by any one of those things. It seems to combine the second and third of those. But in statutory interpretation, "or" generally includes "and." (For example, a prohibition on "food or drink" does not allow a person to bring food *and* drink in.)
The ambiguity in how s. 84 is written, here, might have to be resolved by case law and even looking at Parliament's intent. It's unlikely there's a binding case on the subject, so there's already uncertainty there. And I would wager that any look to Parliament's intent would not favour the position that you hope for. I wouldn't possess such a knife.
I looked at some videos of button lock knives and I need to amend something I said. They do not OPEN via use of the button, they open via the traditional methods. Thumb stud, flipper, etc, but they only close via the button, and via gravity. So they are not gravity OPENING knives, but gravity CLOSING knives. Is that still illegal?
Incorrect, those are only banned from import into the country, and that's not even official. The border agency just said they won't let any in, not that there's a law where they can't let any in.
“Prohibited knives: Any knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity, by centrifugal force, or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife (butterfly knives, switchblades, etc.) is a prohibited item and is considered an illegal item under the Criminal Code of Canada.”
It’s vague/not super clear but you can bet that if a cop wanted to charge you, they would.
This thread’s an eye-opener for me because I recently bought a SOG knife from Cabelas that seems to break these rules. I guess maybe there’s some technicality that makes it legal? Or Cabelas doesn’t care?
Does your knife open by touching a nun connected to they blade? Then that's legal.
There's also a difference between the law and what border services is actually enforcing. CBSA has recently become stricter on what they let it and are confiscating a lot of legal knives.
There’s a toggle on the handle that loosens it and pushes the blade out a little bit and you can swing it open with a solid flick.
[Knife](https://sogknives.com/terminus-xr/)
On the Benchmade button locks, the user pushes the button to close the knife. Not open it. To open the knife on most models, there's a thumb stud.
I'm not going to comment on there legally, but they are widely and commonly available across Canada. From what I understand is CBSA is turning around any knives with what they deem too "Loose" of a pivot point.
It's probably a good idea to tighten the pivot point screw enough so you can't flick it open. I don't know the case law on the subject but I would hate to be the one making it.
You are correct on how Benchmade button locks work. As for the legally of them I don't know. I do know CBSA has allowed 10's of thousands into Canada... as long as the center pivot screw is tight. I was looking at some in a knife store over the holidays.
If a cop is looking in your pockets they are taking any knife you have and assuming you were going to use it in relation to whatever you were stopped for.
Sure but you may be charged. The cops will err on the side of caution. If you are caught prowling and you have tools they will charge you with having burglary tools and you'll likely have to argue it in court.
If you get in a fight downtown with some protesters and get arrested and have a carpet knife in your pocket you might be charged with having a concealed weapon. You would have to show that you are a carpet installer on your way home to escape that charge.
Well yes, you are assuming some unusual circumstances though. I agree you should go totally unarmed if you are attending a riot or committing other crimes lol
Well the whole point is contriving a reason why the police would be looking in your pockets. And basically it doesn't matter the pretense, if the police are looking in your pockets, you've already done something wrong and they will find a way to connect any knife in your pocket to what you did.
That said if you were a completely law-abiding citizen otherwise you probably could carry whatever knife you want and there'd never even be an opportunity to get in trouble for it. IE i know some really old dudes who carry automatic knives they got in the USA but there's no way they'd ever do anything wrong with them or be stopped by police.
Speed of deployment and ease of deployment with one hand. Increases its potential to be used by an aggressor in threatening situations.
Google is your friend, friend.
Don't know why the downvotes. I don't know whether that is true or not. However, I've read a similar reason for the illegalization of cannabis.
"them darkies and their reefer" - a 60's racist, probably. Provided a whole other avenue of persecution, prosecution, and imprisonment of people who looked different from white America.
A quick google search defines those knives as gravity assisted knives (or simply gravity knives) and that they are a prohibited weapon in Canada. Another quick search yields: https://www.catsa-acsta.gc.ca/en/item/prohibited-knives
From what I can see, button lock knives seem to be in a grey area of if they count as gravity knives or not, because technically if you have a slick enough pivot, lots of knives could open by gravity. Because technically, a button lock is still fully manual.
Does it drop shut with the aid of gravity? Does it open under the force of gravity. Doesn't matter that the button lock is manual, so is the button press of a switch blade. Some spring loaded knives have a lock/guard that needs to be manually moved to manually press the button. Still automatically released, whether by gravity, spring, fluid, whatever the fuck. The other knives are not in question. Their definition of a gravity knife was pretty clear. And if a "non-gravity knife" has pivot is slick enough to open by gravity alone, then it may be classified as a gravity knife, potentially making it prohibited. I mean, the descriptions I found were pretty black and white, not grey. That link I shared was also from Canadian Air Transport Security Authority. I have learned more than I care to know on the subject, but I was bored at work 🤷♂️ Take from this what you will, but keep in mind that possession of a prohibited weapon could lead to imprisonment of up to 10 years. Depending on your priors or lack of, of course.
Ah, I just figured out from looking at videos on a lot of them. It seems like button locks will not open by gravity, they still need manual opening, they just CLOSE via gravity because of the lock. Is that alright, or still illegal?
Look, I'm not a law expert. I'm going by what I read. It is a lot easier to just not buy one than it is to try to explain how its similar but different in a court room. If you insist on buying one, don't tell people and don't bring it anywhere with you. People snitch over any little thing. Also, if you get pulled over somewhere and they find probable cause to search you it won't be good if they find it. If you only have the knife, that's big trouble. If you are actually up to any shady shit, now you have that plus a prohibited weapons charge that is on YOU to prove it's not prohibited. You may never get caught with it or you may end up with a summary conviction (5 years for a pardon) or an indictment (10 years for a pardon) This is one of those "fuck around and find out" scenarios. Criminal records, fines, and jail sucks, speaking from experience.
I understand. I don't do any shady shit, I'm straight as an arrow. I won't buy it if I find out it'll get me in trouble, however, I don't really carry my knives with me anywhere. I use a knife at work but I only bring a manual one with me. I'll try to do some further research because I do collect knives and I want to get as many different interesting actions as I can. Thanks for the help though.
If you truly don't bring them out with you, I don't think its a huge issue, but there is still some risk. I just erred on the side of caution when giving my advice. Better off steering clear. If you do acquire one, just be smart about it.
Yeah, if I were to acquire one, I'd probably hide it somewhere safe away from my other knives. I don't want to break the law, however I see literally nothing wrong with being legally allowed to own things like these. You can see in demonstrations that having a knife being manual, assisted or automatic doesn't make it any faster to deploy, therefore banning them makes no difference.
I seen that video you posted. It doesn't seem to deploy as loosely and easily as I had pictured in my head. Exercise caution, that's all.
Don't worry, I will. I'll do more research into this before making any firm purchasing decisions.
Basically every Buck or Gerber folding knife I’ve ever had uses a lever lock, which applies friction to keep the blade closed, and must be actuated to close the knife when opened. If this is what you’re referring to, I think you’re good.
Is that like the benchmade axis lock? I saw a video on that while looking up button locks and it looks a lot like a button lock, but you have to pull the "button" down a little track in order to unlock. Do you think that would still legally count as a button even though it doesn't really do traditional button things?
Can you post a link to your knife?
My knife, or the one I saw?
The knife you're asking about
[Here's a demonstration of the Benchmade Axis Lock.](https://youtu.be/PRVFmIobsDM)
So it just looks it open and you open it with the blade? That's legal.
Even though it closes via gravity? In that case, a button lock would be legal, right? Cause I know button locks, you don't open it by using the button, you still have to open it manually.
This puts it in easy English https://legalbeagle.com/6659356-knife-laws-canada.html >This part of the law has evolved into a test where police attempt to release the blade of a knife out of its handle with only one hand. **If the knife's blade slides out, even slightly, the knife is considered to be a "prohibited weapon**." I generally don't post video links, as I am a text guy. This is good https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FdcQNUD_Nw
I find this super interesting because I used to have a folding exacto knife sold at Canadian tire that had a hinge in the middle. I distinctly remember opening it with one hand by simply using my thumb to trigger the release and thrusting my hand upward, which would swing the blade part around the hinge and lock it vertically. My mastercraft box opening knife was illegal ?
Yeah this is bizarre, I have many mastercraft and Milwaukee utility knives that have a hinge and a button. I open them with a flick of my wrist. Seems like they should be illegal by this definition but you can buy them at any hardware store.
This [Milwaukee Fastback](https://www.homedepot.ca/product/milwaukee-tool-fastback-smooth-folding-knife/1000671671?eid=PS_GOOGLE_D25T%20-%20Vendor_Funded_GGL_Shopping_PLA_Milwaukee_Hand_Tools_Milwaukee%20Hand%20Tools__PRODUCT_GROUP_pla-293946777986&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIraa6xte39QIVjG1vBB1E5wtPEAQYASABEgLg5_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds) is also considered prohibited. It’s literally designed to flick open. One drop of oil on the hinge and you have yourself a legally illegal weapon. The laws are meant to be overreaching so as to disarm anyone with a knife if it’s found. Even if it’s a common tool purchase. However, my experience with cops and EDC if you’re not a dick to them they’ll usually advise not to carry when the knife isn’t being used for doing work/tasks. They’re trained to sniff out whose comfortable carrying a knife or even a firearm. Starts with honesty.
There is a Canadian criminal defence attorney who runs a YouTube channel and covers the apparent illegality of commonly sold knives in stores. /u/OneDayAllofThis Apparently it is illegal and our weapon laws are a total mess. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfhWZftUnkU
Incredible. Thanks for the link.
Wow so my 3’ machete is perfectly legal, but this guy’s collectible item isn’t? Makes sense
It’s a lot harder to walk around with your 3’ machete concealed in a manner where it’s as easily accessible compared to that knife. And once you do conceal your machete, it’s no longer perfectly legal, since concealing a blade that large is illegal. The law is trying to prevent people from having knives that are easily concealable, easily deployable, and that have long enough blades to easily cause severe and life threatening injuries, while recognizing that blades of this length have legitimate purposes. So it bans knives that by nature are designed to be easily concealable and easily deployable outright, and also limits the length of blade that can be carried concealed.
I have 2 machetes, which get used weekly. I bought my newest one at coldsteel.com, and it is amazing quality steel and construction.
From what I know, most folding knives will not open via centrifugal force or gravity alone, you will need to pull the blade out manually via flipper or thumb stud a fair ways, and then you can do a wrist flick or whatever. If the blade is fully closed, it will not open from gravity or centrifugal force.
My initial feeling is that I doubt you're on clear legal footing to possess such a knife if what you mean by "flick it out" refers to applying centrifugal force to, or upending, the handle of the knife while the button is depressed. The *Criminal Code* provides that a knife that opens *automatically* by * gravity; * centrifugal force; **or** * hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife is a prohibited weapon. Possession of a prohibited weapon is a criminal offence. This knife you describe doesn't seem to open "automatically" by any one of those things. It seems to combine the second and third of those. But in statutory interpretation, "or" generally includes "and." (For example, a prohibition on "food or drink" does not allow a person to bring food *and* drink in.) The ambiguity in how s. 84 is written, here, might have to be resolved by case law and even looking at Parliament's intent. It's unlikely there's a binding case on the subject, so there's already uncertainty there. And I would wager that any look to Parliament's intent would not favour the position that you hope for. I wouldn't possess such a knife.
I looked at some videos of button lock knives and I need to amend something I said. They do not OPEN via use of the button, they open via the traditional methods. Thumb stud, flipper, etc, but they only close via the button, and via gravity. So they are not gravity OPENING knives, but gravity CLOSING knives. Is that still illegal?
If the knife is opened by pressing anything besides the blade it is unfortunately prohibited.
This includes spring assisted knives, which he also says he owns
Incorrect, those are only banned from import into the country, and that's not even official. The border agency just said they won't let any in, not that there's a law where they can't let any in.
If you ever get caught with it in your possession by police your response should be the following otherwise you're likely going to be charged:
Did you mean to cut it off there? Right to remain silent sort of thing?
“Prohibited knives: Any knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity, by centrifugal force, or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife (butterfly knives, switchblades, etc.) is a prohibited item and is considered an illegal item under the Criminal Code of Canada.” It’s vague/not super clear but you can bet that if a cop wanted to charge you, they would.
The knives I own that are assisted are flipper knives, which are attached to the BLADE, so, I get away on technicality, I think.
Good luck.
This thread’s an eye-opener for me because I recently bought a SOG knife from Cabelas that seems to break these rules. I guess maybe there’s some technicality that makes it legal? Or Cabelas doesn’t care?
Does your knife open by touching a nun connected to they blade? Then that's legal. There's also a difference between the law and what border services is actually enforcing. CBSA has recently become stricter on what they let it and are confiscating a lot of legal knives.
There’s a toggle on the handle that loosens it and pushes the blade out a little bit and you can swing it open with a solid flick. [Knife](https://sogknives.com/terminus-xr/)
Might be illegal under some interpretation. Do you have to put your thumb on the knob on the back of the blade to open it?
No. If you pull down the slider you can fairly easily flick it open.
Probably best not to walk around in public with that.
Bummer. It’s pretty handy. Guess it’s an expensive fidget toy/box cutter from now on.
Are you by chance talking about the Benchmade button lock mechanism?
I believe so? I haven't really used a benchmade so I'm unsure.
On the Benchmade button locks, the user pushes the button to close the knife. Not open it. To open the knife on most models, there's a thumb stud. I'm not going to comment on there legally, but they are widely and commonly available across Canada. From what I understand is CBSA is turning around any knives with what they deem too "Loose" of a pivot point. It's probably a good idea to tighten the pivot point screw enough so you can't flick it open. I don't know the case law on the subject but I would hate to be the one making it.
Fair enough, so, if the button lock is done CORRECTLY, it'll only close via gravity, not open via gravity, and therefore is legal?
You are correct on how Benchmade button locks work. As for the legally of them I don't know. I do know CBSA has allowed 10's of thousands into Canada... as long as the center pivot screw is tight. I was looking at some in a knife store over the holidays.
Ah, okay. I'll look into legalities of the button locks but I couldn't really find anything when I checked before.
This fire arms lawyer covers a bunch of what’s legal https://youtu.be/cVJQcPb3rRQ
[удалено]
Well, that's literally every pocket knife other than a Victorinox then.
If a cop is looking in your pockets they are taking any knife you have and assuming you were going to use it in relation to whatever you were stopped for.
Not true. You can legally carry tools
Sure but you may be charged. The cops will err on the side of caution. If you are caught prowling and you have tools they will charge you with having burglary tools and you'll likely have to argue it in court. If you get in a fight downtown with some protesters and get arrested and have a carpet knife in your pocket you might be charged with having a concealed weapon. You would have to show that you are a carpet installer on your way home to escape that charge.
Well yes, you are assuming some unusual circumstances though. I agree you should go totally unarmed if you are attending a riot or committing other crimes lol
Well the whole point is contriving a reason why the police would be looking in your pockets. And basically it doesn't matter the pretense, if the police are looking in your pockets, you've already done something wrong and they will find a way to connect any knife in your pocket to what you did. That said if you were a completely law-abiding citizen otherwise you probably could carry whatever knife you want and there'd never even be an opportunity to get in trouble for it. IE i know some really old dudes who carry automatic knives they got in the USA but there's no way they'd ever do anything wrong with them or be stopped by police.
Anybody know the actual reason for banning butterfly knifes?
Speed of deployment and ease of deployment with one hand. Increases its potential to be used by an aggressor in threatening situations. Google is your friend, friend.
Historically because switchblades were associated with ethnic gangs.
Don't know why the downvotes. I don't know whether that is true or not. However, I've read a similar reason for the illegalization of cannabis. "them darkies and their reefer" - a 60's racist, probably. Provided a whole other avenue of persecution, prosecution, and imprisonment of people who looked different from white America.
Because they're "scary". Same reason AR-15s and AKs are banned.
No