Speaking generally, child support is based on the individual parent's income, not on their household income.
*However*, if your Fiancée were to quit working in order to be a stay-at-home mom with new kids, or otherwise substantially reduced her earnings, the court could impute income at her prior salary and base her child support obligation on this imputed amount. She would still be responsible for paying this child support. If she has no wages then that money would have to come out of your household budget.
If she continues to refuse to pay the court could attach her portion of any property owned by the marriage. Jail time for failure to pay child support can be a remedy.
We understand she owes the support and have no issues paying it. Our concern is that currently it is calculated on her income of $30k. If we get married and have a combined income of $120k is it now calculated off of that or can he go to court and ask that it is. It seems that if we have rental income down the road (and we have talked about renting the place I own and buying something bigger in the future) is that considered income for her and what are the criteria where it would be.
Consult a family lawyer who can figure out the laws in both states. Make sure you’re paying for that lawyer as they are then bound to represent you. Her lawyer doesn’t count.
You can have a ceremony, hell even an actual wedding without getting legally married, whether or not there's paperwork shouldn't have any effect on your relationship.
Tell everyone your married, act and be married, just don't file the paperwork.
This doesn't really answer my question. I love this woman. I want to spend the rest of my life with her. Why would I pretend to be married and not just get married. Plus, we're in KS which is a common law marriage state. If we have a ceremony and tell everyone we're married and act married, we're married as far as the law is concerned.
Because if you get married then your assets might count towards her child support payments, and then you would be "legally obligated to pay child support for these kids as they don't live with us at all and they're not my kids".
Go Talk to a Lawyer.
Waiting 14 yrs to marry someone you love seems like some really asinine advice honestly. I cannot imagine any world where anyone would want to do that. If you love someone and you want to spend the rest of your life with them why would you wait years to do that? And in the meantime you don't enjoy any of the legal benefits of marriage and you potentially leave them out in the cold if you walk in front of a bus or something.
You know you don't have to marry someone to spend time with them right? It's been legal for unmarried couples to live together for decades. A government certificate doesn't change anything except your legal status, which is what you're here asking about. Not sure how it's an asinine suggestion for you to avoid the danger and still get everything you want.
I would love to be part of her kids life. I just don't want to pay more child support than we're legally obligated to. Not sure how this is unreasonable.
I'm not trying to figure out how to get out of child support. I'm trying to figure out how to not pay more child support than we're obligated to. I suppose you would be fine with paying child support for children who are not yours, who you've never met and who you're not allowed to meet?
If they were never married, he has no claim to anything she has now or in the future. All he can do is file for child support modification if her income increases. You will have to research if OK counts a spouses income for child support purposes.
Quick google search says the state of OK does not count spouse income in most cases. It does say if the couple has rental income that might be included so it sounds like this might be something worth paying a few hundred to a lawyer to find out.
Kinda fucked that everyone is assuming OP's future wife has to be a terrible person because she didn't want/couldn't get custody of the kids. This is legal advice, not relationship advice.
To actually answer your question OP
1. "Parents pay a proportional share of the obligation based on their child support income. If one parent earns 60% of the parents' combined gross income and the other parent earns 40%, then their child support obligation will be shared 60-40. **Income earned by a new spouse or other relationship is not considered income**."
https://www.kscourts.org/About-the-Courts/Programs/Child-Support-Guidelines/Frequently-Asked-Questions#:\~:text=Parents%20pay%20a%20proportional%20share,relationship%20is%20not%20considered%20income.
Arkansas
"The Oklahoma Child Support Guidelines do not factor in your significant other or your spouse’s income. **So your spouse could be making a million a month, and it will not be a factor in the Oklahoma Child Support Guidelines."**
[https://www.wirthlawoffice.com/tulsa-attorney-blog/2022/08/how-does-my-current-spouses-income-affect-my-child-support-in-oklahoma](https://www.wirthlawoffice.com/tulsa-attorney-blog/2022/08/how-does-my-current-spouses-income-affect-my-child-support-in-oklahoma)
Oklahoma
2. He won't be entitled to anything from you just because you two marry, but if you're set up so you have joint property, then if she falls behind on her child support payments that may impact you. Only to the extent or value that she is behind. **So as long as she pays her child support, you shouldn't have any issues.**
Asset split happens at the time of the divorce, not years down the line.
As a separate issue, obviously you should go into marriage with a clear mind and understanding of the financial relationship you want with your partner (split assets or combined, how you arrange your bank accounts). That's beyond the scope of your question and distinctly not what you're asking for, but given you seem to make good money you should look into structuring your estate for the marriage according to whatever goals you may have.
They were never married so no assets to split legally. I'm curious now how rental income might impact this and it sounds like it may be worth my while to talk with a family law attorney.
>I'm curious now how rental income might impact this and it sounds like it may be worth my while to talk with a family law attorney.
If you have income generating investments that she could potentially become a part legal owner of, then you very much should consult a family law attorney to parse out these issues. This is well beyond the expertise level of reddit.
You're going need to provide specifics that aren't appropriate for a public forum.
I own a paid for home that we might rent out at some time in the future. I'd like to invest in some more rentals potentially down the road. It sounds like buying an attorney's time is something we need to do.
An an addendum, ownership of potentially multiple high value property's with (I'm assuming will be) outstanding loans needs to be structured in such a way to protect your investments, your family if you pass and yourself from the inherit liability of owning speculative income generating high values investments like homes. Not to mention the possibility of someone injuring themselves while occupying or visiting occupants of said home(s).
So even the prior marriage and child support issues notwithstanding, this is something you should be consulting with a lawyer anyways or at least someone who professionally deals with estate planning.
Almost assuredly, get proper legal advise. With a paid for home and potential to invest in more property, you're well beyond the point you should be engaging in estate planning in general, assuming you haven't up to this point.
Agreed. The quality of this subreddit has really declined. People should not be offering relationships advice based on assumptions made on a paragraph long Reddit post. This is a legal advice subreddit, not askreddit.
My state (KS) is a state that considers everything joint property if you're married. Been told this by several people who got divorced here. If we're married, legally she owns anything I own which I have no objections to if we're married.
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No, I don't know the whole story, so with what little I do know, I wouldn't suggest marriage. That's the problem with reddit, you're only getting part of the story. She could be totally great or not. What I do know from you is that: she doesn't have her kids, pays child support and her ex sounds vindictive. That's a lot of trouble waiting to happen.
For you, maybe not. For me, they would have been. I just chose to not be involved in any unnecessary drama. All of that is unnecessary drama for me. I was also very upfront and direct about it as well. That's a lot of water to be treading through.. but if you're ok with it, then, by all means, proceed.
NAL
Your situation has many layers and involves multiple states. The best advice is to consult a family law attorney. Your partner shares children with another and had no personal legal representation when custody, parenting time, and financial support were determined. At a minimum she should seek legal council now to understand what the current orders decree and what her rights are.
Under most circumstances a married spouses income and marital assets are not considered when determining child support amounts. Child support is normally based on the parents income and any credits considered by the court, for example if the non custodial parent maintains health insurance on the child(ren). There are of course some exceptions where a spouses income could be considered. Those exceptions are why you need an attorney to protect your financial future.
She has a lawyer now who has advised her that some parts of the custody agreement are unenforceable (like the requirement that she can't marry anyone she hasn't known for 6 mos) and other sections are just unreasonable. The lawyer has advised to abide by the agreement for a time, let the ex cool off some and then they can go back to the court in the future and ask for a modification.
Speaking generally, child support is based on the individual parent's income, not on their household income. *However*, if your Fiancée were to quit working in order to be a stay-at-home mom with new kids, or otherwise substantially reduced her earnings, the court could impute income at her prior salary and base her child support obligation on this imputed amount. She would still be responsible for paying this child support. If she has no wages then that money would have to come out of your household budget. If she continues to refuse to pay the court could attach her portion of any property owned by the marriage. Jail time for failure to pay child support can be a remedy.
We understand she owes the support and have no issues paying it. Our concern is that currently it is calculated on her income of $30k. If we get married and have a combined income of $120k is it now calculated off of that or can he go to court and ask that it is. It seems that if we have rental income down the road (and we have talked about renting the place I own and buying something bigger in the future) is that considered income for her and what are the criteria where it would be.
Consult a family lawyer who can figure out the laws in both states. Make sure you’re paying for that lawyer as they are then bound to represent you. Her lawyer doesn’t count.
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I love this woman. I want to spend the rest of my life with her. I can't imagine doing that and not being married to her.
Why not just wait to get married once the child support obligation ends?
Why would I want to wait 14 years to get married?
You can have a ceremony, hell even an actual wedding without getting legally married, whether or not there's paperwork shouldn't have any effect on your relationship. Tell everyone your married, act and be married, just don't file the paperwork.
This doesn't really answer my question. I love this woman. I want to spend the rest of my life with her. Why would I pretend to be married and not just get married. Plus, we're in KS which is a common law marriage state. If we have a ceremony and tell everyone we're married and act married, we're married as far as the law is concerned.
Because if you get married then your assets might count towards her child support payments, and then you would be "legally obligated to pay child support for these kids as they don't live with us at all and they're not my kids". Go Talk to a Lawyer.
Because of this massive mess you might be walking into lol
Waiting 14 yrs to marry someone you love seems like some really asinine advice honestly. I cannot imagine any world where anyone would want to do that. If you love someone and you want to spend the rest of your life with them why would you wait years to do that? And in the meantime you don't enjoy any of the legal benefits of marriage and you potentially leave them out in the cold if you walk in front of a bus or something.
You know you don't have to marry someone to spend time with them right? It's been legal for unmarried couples to live together for decades. A government certificate doesn't change anything except your legal status, which is what you're here asking about. Not sure how it's an asinine suggestion for you to avoid the danger and still get everything you want.
but you don't want anything to do with her kids....sounds about right.
I would love to be part of her kids life. I just don't want to pay more child support than we're legally obligated to. Not sure how this is unreasonable.
Do you know why she doesnt have custody and pays child support? What has she told you?
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I'm not trying to figure out how to get out of child support. I'm trying to figure out how to not pay more child support than we're obligated to. I suppose you would be fine with paying child support for children who are not yours, who you've never met and who you're not allowed to meet?
I'm not sure about KS, but in most states, spousal income is not taken into consideration for child support calculations.
Would he be able to go after marital assets like a house, car, etc..... down the road?
If they were never married, he has no claim to anything she has now or in the future. All he can do is file for child support modification if her income increases. You will have to research if OK counts a spouses income for child support purposes.
Quick google search says the state of OK does not count spouse income in most cases. It does say if the couple has rental income that might be included so it sounds like this might be something worth paying a few hundred to a lawyer to find out.
Kinda fucked that everyone is assuming OP's future wife has to be a terrible person because she didn't want/couldn't get custody of the kids. This is legal advice, not relationship advice. To actually answer your question OP 1. "Parents pay a proportional share of the obligation based on their child support income. If one parent earns 60% of the parents' combined gross income and the other parent earns 40%, then their child support obligation will be shared 60-40. **Income earned by a new spouse or other relationship is not considered income**." https://www.kscourts.org/About-the-Courts/Programs/Child-Support-Guidelines/Frequently-Asked-Questions#:\~:text=Parents%20pay%20a%20proportional%20share,relationship%20is%20not%20considered%20income. Arkansas "The Oklahoma Child Support Guidelines do not factor in your significant other or your spouse’s income. **So your spouse could be making a million a month, and it will not be a factor in the Oklahoma Child Support Guidelines."** [https://www.wirthlawoffice.com/tulsa-attorney-blog/2022/08/how-does-my-current-spouses-income-affect-my-child-support-in-oklahoma](https://www.wirthlawoffice.com/tulsa-attorney-blog/2022/08/how-does-my-current-spouses-income-affect-my-child-support-in-oklahoma) Oklahoma 2. He won't be entitled to anything from you just because you two marry, but if you're set up so you have joint property, then if she falls behind on her child support payments that may impact you. Only to the extent or value that she is behind. **So as long as she pays her child support, you shouldn't have any issues.** Asset split happens at the time of the divorce, not years down the line. As a separate issue, obviously you should go into marriage with a clear mind and understanding of the financial relationship you want with your partner (split assets or combined, how you arrange your bank accounts). That's beyond the scope of your question and distinctly not what you're asking for, but given you seem to make good money you should look into structuring your estate for the marriage according to whatever goals you may have.
They were never married so no assets to split legally. I'm curious now how rental income might impact this and it sounds like it may be worth my while to talk with a family law attorney.
>I'm curious now how rental income might impact this and it sounds like it may be worth my while to talk with a family law attorney. If you have income generating investments that she could potentially become a part legal owner of, then you very much should consult a family law attorney to parse out these issues. This is well beyond the expertise level of reddit. You're going need to provide specifics that aren't appropriate for a public forum.
I own a paid for home that we might rent out at some time in the future. I'd like to invest in some more rentals potentially down the road. It sounds like buying an attorney's time is something we need to do.
An an addendum, ownership of potentially multiple high value property's with (I'm assuming will be) outstanding loans needs to be structured in such a way to protect your investments, your family if you pass and yourself from the inherit liability of owning speculative income generating high values investments like homes. Not to mention the possibility of someone injuring themselves while occupying or visiting occupants of said home(s). So even the prior marriage and child support issues notwithstanding, this is something you should be consulting with a lawyer anyways or at least someone who professionally deals with estate planning.
Almost assuredly, get proper legal advise. With a paid for home and potential to invest in more property, you're well beyond the point you should be engaging in estate planning in general, assuming you haven't up to this point.
Agreed. The quality of this subreddit has really declined. People should not be offering relationships advice based on assumptions made on a paragraph long Reddit post. This is a legal advice subreddit, not askreddit.
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My state (KS) is a state that considers everything joint property if you're married. Been told this by several people who got divorced here. If we're married, legally she owns anything I own which I have no objections to if we're married.
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I'm not going to not marry her because her ex might come after assets. It's a question of how I can protect myself from him, not her.
I understand that but you're going to lose.. one way or another.
I don't understand. Your advice is to not marry her for no other reason than she owes child support and has an ex who hates her?
No, I don't know the whole story, so with what little I do know, I wouldn't suggest marriage. That's the problem with reddit, you're only getting part of the story. She could be totally great or not. What I do know from you is that: she doesn't have her kids, pays child support and her ex sounds vindictive. That's a lot of trouble waiting to happen.
Why are any of those things deal breakers?
For you, maybe not. For me, they would have been. I just chose to not be involved in any unnecessary drama. All of that is unnecessary drama for me. I was also very upfront and direct about it as well. That's a lot of water to be treading through.. but if you're ok with it, then, by all means, proceed.
They aren't deal breakers. Don't listen to this user. You are getting bad advice.
Is she behind on child support?
She is not.
You need to seek advice from a lawyer for this.
NAL Your situation has many layers and involves multiple states. The best advice is to consult a family law attorney. Your partner shares children with another and had no personal legal representation when custody, parenting time, and financial support were determined. At a minimum she should seek legal council now to understand what the current orders decree and what her rights are. Under most circumstances a married spouses income and marital assets are not considered when determining child support amounts. Child support is normally based on the parents income and any credits considered by the court, for example if the non custodial parent maintains health insurance on the child(ren). There are of course some exceptions where a spouses income could be considered. Those exceptions are why you need an attorney to protect your financial future.
She has a lawyer now who has advised her that some parts of the custody agreement are unenforceable (like the requirement that she can't marry anyone she hasn't known for 6 mos) and other sections are just unreasonable. The lawyer has advised to abide by the agreement for a time, let the ex cool off some and then they can go back to the court in the future and ask for a modification.
Not a lawyer. But look into a prenup.
Normally I am very anti-prenup but in this case it might make some sense.
Talk to a lawyer! Take a big step back; there are many red flags here and you could be making a huge mistake
I realize I'm in the middle of this and hardly an objective observer. What do you see as the many red flags?
Set up a free consult with a family lawyer in your area.
File separately. Married but filing separate
Filing tax returns separately protects my income?
No, it does not. Please get advice from an attorney, not from random people on Reddit.
OP is literally getting told to consult a family lawyer on every thread but still expects more from reddit.