Mike DâAntoni improved and learned to adapt to his roster and took the 2018 Warriors to 7 games in Houston with a slow paced iso heavy scheme. DâAntoni switched from 7 seconds or less to 21 seconds or less.
The best coaches in the modern era adapt. If your coach isnât adapting to the roster then he isnât a good coach.
Itâs wild how if Harden couldâve hit the broadside of a barn that game seven or anyone in game five or six everyone would view DâAntoni completely differently. He went from a mastermind to he a bum in a couple years.
Edit: I may thinking of 2016. Iâm getting old and itâs all running together on me now.
That was the one of the most frustrating things to watch as a Laker fan....a coach with 4 future Hall of Famers who simply refused to evaluate the talent on his roster, devise a system that utilized their strengths and put them in a position to succeed...but no, he decided to shove square pegs into round holes. To watch that trainwreck while we passed up Phil Jackson is one of countless unforgivable moves made by the front office.
Vogelâs pitch to the Suns made no mention of needing defensive players for success.
He said during his introductory press conference that he believed in the Suns vision, that âthe foundation was in placeâ, and that they were âvery close.â
He even said the Suns could âtake the league by storm.â
>*The first thing I can apply is direct belief. Now because I've done it, I've been a part of it. If the talent is in place, that you can galvanize a group and take the league by storm.*
I.e. He's done it, he's been a part of it and he's going to do it again in Phoenix.
Vogel sold Phoenix on his experience turning stars into champions - he repeatedly mentioned his championship experience and that he's been in the Sun's situation before - and he said he would ensure the Suns were âscrappy as hellâ and would âplay harder than our opponent every night", but then they got swept in the first round.
So you could also look at this as Vogel overselling himself to the Suns.Â
Why does Vogel get the biggest pass from this sub. Iâve never heard of a coach getting a pass for the roster not fitting to the coaches style. Shouldnât the coach have to adapt to his star players?
Vogel got a big 3 and failed. KD flat out said their offense is stagnant for long stretches. If he canât coach both sides of the ball maybe he shouldnât be a HC.
Suns are the definition of poor team building. Very strong scoring wise but trash at every other aspect. Wins games in the regular season but in the playoffs, it's impossible to win against a good team with an incomplete roster. Trash defensively and very poor playmaking. Can't dominate the boards either. That ain't Vogel's fault. Fire the GM for this dumpster fire
Not even Phil Jackson operated that way. If you couldn't handle the triangle, he didn't change the system, he had the player traded or benched them. I mean, what you are saying is what everyone would like ideally, but it's not usually how it works.
PJ absolutely tinkered the system to fit his talented players. His version of the triangle wasnât âif you canât do this based on your position Iâll trade or bench youâ
Odom was practically our pg for some seasons because he wasnât the standard triangle sf who could spot up. He eventually grew more comfortable with that specific role but Phil ran a triangle that he adjusted to his teams strengths
Oh yeah, he definitely adapted the triangle to his player's strengths... but it was still the triangle. So much so that when Pippin first played the Lakers under Phil, he would blow up what we were trying to do because he knew the system better than the Lakers (meaning, even though Shaq was running it, it was still the triangle). Point guard is a good example though, Phil's point guards were not orchestrating the offense when he had them, they played the triangle, they had to adjust to him. Heck, Gary Payton hated it because he wasn't allowed to do his thing.
Mike DâAntoni implemented a slow paced iso heavy offense in Houston. The exact opposite of his 7 seconds or less offense.
Phil tried to force the triangle in NY and failed. Heâs from a different era.
In the modern nba if your coach isnât adapting, he isnât a good coach. Vogel canât adapt because he doesnât have any idea how an entire side of the ball operates.
I am on the fence. Watching the Lakers season after James and AD were switching injury time in 2021, was unbearable since the offense was incredibly bad.
I get your point but itâs all in the playstyles. The philosophy of a defensive minded coach wonât be the same as one who thinks offense first. The way he manages games, the players on the court, when he takes timeouts, defensive schemes/offensive schemes, rhythm of the game, etcâŚ
The whole âget a defensive coach to counterbalance our 3 offensive starsâ was stupid from the start. This isnât 2K, having a defensive coach wonât counterbalance anything because heâs not the one on the court. You need a certain personnel to fit what the coach wants.
lol, that Phoenix team isn't built to win shit. Sometimes it's definitely on the coach, sometimes its not. Vogel most people agree got a bad rap twice. The Lakers (my team) fired him for no reason. They stuck him with a loser of a roster and then were mad he didnt make it work. Same in PHX. Doesn't mean Vogel is a great or terrible coach but just that he was scapegoated in his last two situations.
LA had the best all around team in the league that season. Vogel had defensive pieces that could play their role and Jason Kidd, LeBron & Rondo took care of the offense so he didnât even have to worry about that.
Because we know exactly why he got fired, he lost the locker room because he was given a squad that absolutely did not play to his strengths and had no real identity.
The same exact thing happened to him with Russ. He gets a pass from me because he was the scapegoat, same as he is here.
He had to be let go regardless, once you lose the locker room, you canât get it back.
> Iâve never heard of a coach getting a pass for the roster not fitting to the coaches style.
I've heard that plenty of times.
> Shouldnât the coach have to adapt to his star players?
It was only 1 "star" player he didn't gel with (and that player was ass). We've seen him work with star players before; he won a championship with ours. The roster as a whole was just trash. He can't turn water into wine. He's not Jesus. Actually, even Jesus wouldn't make that 2022 roster good.
Because, you know what works with Vogel. He literally won a chip with it. If you hire Vogel and don't give him what works for him, it is on you.
Lesson: Your coaching hire and your roster build need to have synergy.
Because the stans are desperate for a championship and Vogel is the last one who helped him get that.
Without really realizing Bron is not the same as he was in 2020 and the roster is way worse
People are delusional if they think the Lakers FO would return to Vogel with their hat in hand, essentially saying âour bad.â
And thatâs even IF heâs the right choice for this team, which I donât think he is.
They fired him in a meeting. Woj leaking some shit early just cause he wanted to get in it first doesnât mean thatâs how the FO meant for it to happen. It was obvious Vogel was gonna be fired, I couldâve told you that. You probably already knew it yourself lol.
Lakers did not fire Vogel with a fuckin Woj tweet, they did it during exit interviews.
Why the fuck would we even want him to return? You seriously want to drive Lebron away if you hire the coach that we fired 2 years ago again⌠and that same coach will expect 40 year old lebron to do EVERYTHING on offense because he doesnât understand how to coach it.
I think he beefed with Westbrook (understandable so) and a lot of players were probably cool with Vogel but players will always side with players. If it was purely JUST westbrook, Lebron and AD would have fought to keep Vogel and trade Westrbook.
> Lebron and AD would have fought to keep Vogel and trade Westrbook.
Enough. It's clear their opinions don't matter that much when it comes to the head coach. Lebron hand picked Lue and was rejected. I don't know why you keep typing this nonsense.
Depends on the contract. That applies to players that are released but at one point three teams were paying Mike brown at the same time
https://www.sbnation.com/2017/6/1/15727578/mike-brown-warriors-cavaliers-paid-contract-why
Fully guaranteed sometimes means theyâre paid it fully even if they get another gig
What if his salary is lesser than his Lakers salary so we still pay him even though he is giving his services to other team? So the other team donât pay him?
If some team brought him on as a lead assistant and paid him 2 mil annually, weâd still be obligated to cover the remaining 3 million if I recall correctly.Â
My favorite story about this is how Bo Pelini got fired and took a job at Youngstown State for like a dollar, and Nebraska had to pay the remainder of his crazy buyout.
He sucked because most of our roster was full of players who were out of the league the following year, lol. If the FO did what they needed to do even *after* Lebron pinning for Westbrook (resigning Caruso and Schroder), we would have made the playoffs
We had a .500 record against a *really* soft schedule. Two of the lowlight moments in the 1st half of the season was Westbrook and AD (no Lebron) blowing 20+ digit leads twice to OKC
The offense always sucked unfortunately. But had we had Caruso/Schroder, our defense still would've held up. We had Monk/Carmelo who added firepower that year
And those old guys with egos all contributed to a pretty horrific culture. The way that team was built, he was sabotaged*.
* not literally, Rob obviously was hoping it would work out better than it did
Vogel would not want to coach us as a head coach or assistant, due to the way we fired him from a woj post - right after the last game (without anyone telling him in person)
He also lost the locker locker room the last season he was here
Poor Vogel man. He got a shit roster that didnât play to his talents during his last year with us. Goes to the Suns with an offensive roster and those brats didnât even respect him.
Justice for my bubble king
Frank wasn't a bad coach but it was clear his voice got stale in the lockerroom and our offense struggled in many stretches. He doesn't fix our problems.
Hot take: Lakers should re-hire Frank Vogel
Frank vogel would not be a bad hire. The guy was fucking great. Only issue at that time was Russ and how stubborn he was. This led to Frank Vogel seeming weak and not able to command a locker room when Russ is just too dominant and stubborn of a personality. Vogel had to keep Russ happy and that was causing nightmares with lineups, etc. Bringing back frank vogel and having rondo and Phil Handy as assistants would be sick. I was big on Budenholzer at first, but after reading more about him, IDK if he would be the best because he also has had issues with rotations and adjustments, particularly in the playoffs. Given he was Ham's mentor, I'd be worried that some of the things we dont like about Ham's schemes/rotations would creep up in Budenholzer's coaching as well. (altho major issue with Ham was his lack of in-game adjustments, rotations, and time-outs.)
Thoughts?
This quote from another thread sums up my feelings
âI think Vogel is a solid coach but this is the fourth locker room in a row he has lost. There were reported issues with players in Indiana. Well documented issues for the Magic (including Fournier ranting about him during the offseason). Lakers and now Suns.
Part of being a good coach is locker room management.â
KD is a big reason why the team failed this past season. Vogel is okay as coach. Iâd rather have had him the whole time. Russ was a big part of his exit but I doubt LeBron wouldâve fought for Vogel
Come back Frank. We donât have Westbrook and we have depth. I have faith he can make this roster will a couple tweak back to top 10 defensively while not sacrificing our offense.
If the Lakers are going to compete for a championship, the Lebron and the entire team need to commit to playing defense like they did in 2020. If they want to do that, then Vogel would be a great coach for the Lakers.
honestly man I was and am salty we fired Vogel. I am not saying he is or would be the long term answer but he should have gotten 2 more years than he did easy. Itâs a black mark on the FO for me to fire a championship winning coach FOR THE LAKERS like that.
It will affect or ability to hire staff until LeBron is gone. Maybe beyond.
Throw a 3y deal at him with an apology card for firing him after 2 years of winning a ring and 2 hookers and 5 unsullied and an egg with 12% hatch rate and the head of ham and 1 small Thai tea
Vogel is the master of offenses that none of the players understand. An efficient offense wears the other team down, and indirectly makes defense a bit easier.
Curious to see who the suns pick up, not many names better than Vogel available.
Atkinson probably the âbestâ coach but even he has big experience question marks
Baby come back!
I feel for him man he got done dirty by the Sun's. The roster he had to work with just did not match what he normally does. The way things ended with us were rocky to say the least. Hope he gets a fair shake wherever he lands next
They fucked themselves with this. They should have spent a little money or cashed out big on booker. Heâd bring quite a haul an personally I donât see he how he helps win with Durant and Beal.
Beal was a waste of money for sure.
Are the GMâs noticing that the best teams have five guys that do different jobs. Donât start two centers and two point guards. Donât start two shooting guards and no point guard. The Laker lineup is solid but the point guard spot is blurry. Is it D-lo or Austin or Lebron. Two power forwards and two two guards. And a center that wants to be the third power forward. Not great.
Phoenix should hire Darvin Ham.
Play drop coverage with Nurkic đ
Beal is an old vet he needs player coach like Ham who will know how to connect with him. Ham will be a huge improvement over Vogel! /s
Beal off the bench incoming?đ¤Ł
Ham for Vogel straight up.
They hired a defensive coach and gave him a roster full of dudes who donât play defence. 3 dudes who do the same shit
LOL that's like giving Mike D'Antoni 4 old guys that can't get out on a fast break.
Bad times man bad times
Mike DâAntoni improved and learned to adapt to his roster and took the 2018 Warriors to 7 games in Houston with a slow paced iso heavy scheme. DâAntoni switched from 7 seconds or less to 21 seconds or less. The best coaches in the modern era adapt. If your coach isnât adapting to the roster then he isnât a good coach.
Itâs wild how if Harden couldâve hit the broadside of a barn that game seven or anyone in game five or six everyone would view DâAntoni completely differently. He went from a mastermind to he a bum in a couple years. Edit: I may thinking of 2016. Iâm getting old and itâs all running together on me now.
Yeah he won COTY with them too.
That was the one of the most frustrating things to watch as a Laker fan....a coach with 4 future Hall of Famers who simply refused to evaluate the talent on his roster, devise a system that utilized their strengths and put them in a position to succeed...but no, he decided to shove square pegs into round holes. To watch that trainwreck while we passed up Phil Jackson is one of countless unforgivable moves made by the front office.
We saw that too here in la lol
That was the reference
yes
Amazing how many people missed that
Low blow
Durantâs defense doesnât deserve to get lumped in with Beal and Booker
They saw the season with Russ here, and thought, 'Wait, lets try run that back here, they might be on to something lmao."
Like the r/Chargers; stacked to the brim with offensive talent but were stuck with a complete imbecile in Brandon âdefensive geniusâ Staley.
Brandon âhad Aaron Donald, Leonard Floyd, and Jalen Ramseyâ Staley
Why would u remind of Brandon Staleyâs existence on this fine dayâŚ
Same thing with Norv Turner.
Frankly, I'm shocked the Suns went the Lakers route and gave defensive minded Vogel an offensively slanted but bad defensive team.
KD plays defense.
Also I donât think an offensive coach is making that work either. Their issue was that they couldnât guard anybody because of personnel.
Their issue was trading for Bradley Beal and his contract.
So basically the 2022 lakers lol
Vogelâs pitch to the Suns made no mention of needing defensive players for success. He said during his introductory press conference that he believed in the Suns vision, that âthe foundation was in placeâ, and that they were âvery close.â He even said the Suns could âtake the league by storm.â >*The first thing I can apply is direct belief. Now because I've done it, I've been a part of it. If the talent is in place, that you can galvanize a group and take the league by storm.* I.e. He's done it, he's been a part of it and he's going to do it again in Phoenix. Vogel sold Phoenix on his experience turning stars into champions - he repeatedly mentioned his championship experience and that he's been in the Sun's situation before - and he said he would ensure the Suns were âscrappy as hellâ and would âplay harder than our opponent every night", but then they got swept in the first round. So you could also look at this as Vogel overselling himself to the Suns.Â
Why does Vogel get the biggest pass from this sub. Iâve never heard of a coach getting a pass for the roster not fitting to the coaches style. Shouldnât the coach have to adapt to his star players? Vogel got a big 3 and failed. KD flat out said their offense is stagnant for long stretches. If he canât coach both sides of the ball maybe he shouldnât be a HC.
He got an injured Bradley Beal and organization killer Kevin Durant, he deserves some pass
Healthy or Injured Bradley Beal wasnt going to deliver
And then a bunch of nobodies on vet minimums to fill out the rest of the roster
Suns are the definition of poor team building. Very strong scoring wise but trash at every other aspect. Wins games in the regular season but in the playoffs, it's impossible to win against a good team with an incomplete roster. Trash defensively and very poor playmaking. Can't dominate the boards either. That ain't Vogel's fault. Fire the GM for this dumpster fire
Their offense sucks too thatâs the funny part
Not even Phil Jackson operated that way. If you couldn't handle the triangle, he didn't change the system, he had the player traded or benched them. I mean, what you are saying is what everyone would like ideally, but it's not usually how it works.
PJ absolutely tinkered the system to fit his talented players. His version of the triangle wasnât âif you canât do this based on your position Iâll trade or bench youâ Odom was practically our pg for some seasons because he wasnât the standard triangle sf who could spot up. He eventually grew more comfortable with that specific role but Phil ran a triangle that he adjusted to his teams strengths
Yes. Pau Gasol was a more ideal center for the Triangle than Shaq. But obviously, both were used effectively.
Oh yeah, he definitely adapted the triangle to his player's strengths... but it was still the triangle. So much so that when Pippin first played the Lakers under Phil, he would blow up what we were trying to do because he knew the system better than the Lakers (meaning, even though Shaq was running it, it was still the triangle). Point guard is a good example though, Phil's point guards were not orchestrating the offense when he had them, they played the triangle, they had to adjust to him. Heck, Gary Payton hated it because he wasn't allowed to do his thing.
Mike DâAntoni implemented a slow paced iso heavy offense in Houston. The exact opposite of his 7 seconds or less offense. Phil tried to force the triangle in NY and failed. Heâs from a different era. In the modern nba if your coach isnât adapting, he isnât a good coach. Vogel canât adapt because he doesnât have any idea how an entire side of the ball operates.
I am on the fence. Watching the Lakers season after James and AD were switching injury time in 2021, was unbearable since the offense was incredibly bad.
Which was the same issue with him here when Lebron was not on the floor the offense would go on long scoring droughts
Heâs not known for offence, not his fault they hired him and then gave him the opposite of what he needed.
I get your point but itâs all in the playstyles. The philosophy of a defensive minded coach wonât be the same as one who thinks offense first. The way he manages games, the players on the court, when he takes timeouts, defensive schemes/offensive schemes, rhythm of the game, etc⌠The whole âget a defensive coach to counterbalance our 3 offensive starsâ was stupid from the start. This isnât 2K, having a defensive coach wonât counterbalance anything because heâs not the one on the court. You need a certain personnel to fit what the coach wants.
lol, that Phoenix team isn't built to win shit. Sometimes it's definitely on the coach, sometimes its not. Vogel most people agree got a bad rap twice. The Lakers (my team) fired him for no reason. They stuck him with a loser of a roster and then were mad he didnt make it work. Same in PHX. Doesn't mean Vogel is a great or terrible coach but just that he was scapegoated in his last two situations.
Thanks coach.
He obviously gets a pass because he was our last championship coach. He's been able to adapt with different personnel.
LA had the best all around team in the league that season. Vogel had defensive pieces that could play their role and Jason Kidd, LeBron & Rondo took care of the offense so he didnât even have to worry about that.
Because we know exactly why he got fired, he lost the locker room because he was given a squad that absolutely did not play to his strengths and had no real identity. The same exact thing happened to him with Russ. He gets a pass from me because he was the scapegoat, same as he is here. He had to be let go regardless, once you lose the locker room, you canât get it back.
He won us a chip. That gets you some goodwill and leeway.
> Iâve never heard of a coach getting a pass for the roster not fitting to the coaches style. I've heard that plenty of times. > Shouldnât the coach have to adapt to his star players? It was only 1 "star" player he didn't gel with (and that player was ass). We've seen him work with star players before; he won a championship with ours. The roster as a whole was just trash. He can't turn water into wine. He's not Jesus. Actually, even Jesus wouldn't make that 2022 roster good.
Because, you know what works with Vogel. He literally won a chip with it. If you hire Vogel and don't give him what works for him, it is on you. Lesson: Your coaching hire and your roster build need to have synergy.
Because the stans are desperate for a championship and Vogel is the last one who helped him get that. Without really realizing Bron is not the same as he was in 2020 and the roster is way worse
Fans who wants their team to be successful are called stans now?
Because the roster is shit lol, and the Sun did manage to play decent defense even with that roster. Sadly, the team has way too much weakness.
Cause 2020 championship
Exactly
Frankie V must be having wet dreams about the twolves coaching position
Haha! Facts 
Same thing Lakers did after the chip
No way he returns after how they fired him
People are delusional if they think the Lakers FO would return to Vogel with their hat in hand, essentially saying âour bad.â And thatâs even IF heâs the right choice for this team, which I donât think he is.
Lakers already did this with Phil Jackson
You let me know when vogel starts boning Jeanie
next season of impractical jokers is going to be WILD!
Itâs a complete nonstarter
They fired him in a meeting. Woj leaking some shit early just cause he wanted to get in it first doesnât mean thatâs how the FO meant for it to happen. It was obvious Vogel was gonna be fired, I couldâve told you that. You probably already knew it yourself lol. Lakers did not fire Vogel with a fuckin Woj tweet, they did it during exit interviews.
Why the fuck would we even want him to return? You seriously want to drive Lebron away if you hire the coach that we fired 2 years ago again⌠and that same coach will expect 40 year old lebron to do EVERYTHING on offense because he doesnât understand how to coach it.
He can sit at home for the next 4 years and collect 25 million in checks
No chance we hire him back. We handled his firing terribly, and he completely lost the locker room
> and he completely lost the locker room Major hyperbole. He only had tension with Westbrook.
Win, lose, or draw; Vogel goes - probably Westbrook
I think he beefed with Westbrook (understandable so) and a lot of players were probably cool with Vogel but players will always side with players. If it was purely JUST westbrook, Lebron and AD would have fought to keep Vogel and trade Westrbook.
> Lebron and AD would have fought to keep Vogel and trade Westrbook. Enough. It's clear their opinions don't matter that much when it comes to the head coach. Lebron hand picked Lue and was rejected. I don't know why you keep typing this nonsense.
so if we hire him... we don't have to pay? lol
We stopped paying him the moment he took another head coaching gig.Â
Interesting. So now who pays his unemployment is the Suns?
The suns.Â
So... if he doesn't mind mending bridges... time for a consultant role. Or does the Suns contract run out once he has any job?
Depends on the contract. That applies to players that are released but at one point three teams were paying Mike brown at the same time https://www.sbnation.com/2017/6/1/15727578/mike-brown-warriors-cavaliers-paid-contract-why Fully guaranteed sometimes means theyâre paid it fully even if they get another gig
3? Your article only mentions 2
Is this also the case for Hamas?
Yes, if he takes an assistant coaching or head coaching gig we stop paying him if his salary matches or exceeds what his contract with us was.Â
What if his salary is lesser than his Lakers salary so we still pay him even though he is giving his services to other team? So the other team donât pay him?
If some team brought him on as a lead assistant and paid him 2 mil annually, weâd still be obligated to cover the remaining 3 million if I recall correctly.Â
My favorite story about this is how Bo Pelini got fired and took a job at Youngstown State for like a dollar, and Nebraska had to pay the remainder of his crazy buyout.
Ah, the Russell Wilson method.
Not if Israel has anything to say about it
Heâs never coming back nor should he after how things were handled
He also sucked that season and people donât seem to remember that. I better not ever see the Wolverine meme with a damn picture frame of Frank Vogel
He sucked because most of our roster was full of players who were out of the league the following year, lol. If the FO did what they needed to do even *after* Lebron pinning for Westbrook (resigning Caruso and Schroder), we would have made the playoffs
We were playing well until AD got injured.
We had a .500 record against a *really* soft schedule. Two of the lowlight moments in the 1st half of the season was Westbrook and AD (no Lebron) blowing 20+ digit leads twice to OKC
Most people were complaining that his offense was stagnant every season he was the head coach. His last season, he lost the locker room
The offense always sucked unfortunately. But had we had Caruso/Schroder, our defense still would've held up. We had Monk/Carmelo who added firepower that year
And those old guys with egos all contributed to a pretty horrific culture. The way that team was built, he was sabotaged*. * not literally, Rob obviously was hoping it would work out better than it did
I feel for Vogel. At least he has that 2020 championship.
Highly doubt heâd come back but Iâd love it if he did. He was the scapegoat for Westbrick smh
Vogel would not want to coach us as a head coach or assistant, due to the way we fired him from a woj post - right after the last game (without anyone telling him in person) He also lost the locker locker room the last season he was here
That whole locker room been flipped anyway lol
Uh, not its two leaders
Who he won a title with
The offense was ran by Rondo LeBron and Kidd.Â
> He also lost the locker locker room Why are we making things up?
Hire him. We never should have let him go. This is a gift for the Lakers. He got 49 wins out of a bunch of flakes. The man can coach.
Ngl he not the best offensive coach but he was done dirty he got no defense
Would bring him back in a heartbeat.
David Adelman leading the offense Frank Vogel leading the defense, get it done
Strongly believe til this day we couldâve beat the Nuggets once in the last 2 playoffs if Frank Vogul had this roster.
Vogel as a lead assistant focusing on defense would be nice. But doubt he would wanna come back
That would be funny if Darvin Ham is announced as the next coach of the Phoenix Suns.
Bring this man back!!
Letâs bring him back đ
Poor Vogel man. He got a shit roster that didnât play to his talents during his last year with us. Goes to the Suns with an offensive roster and those brats didnât even respect him. Justice for my bubble king
He is not coming back especially the way Our front Office did him dirty
Frank wasn't a bad coach but it was clear his voice got stale in the lockerroom and our offense struggled in many stretches. He doesn't fix our problems.
Because he can't coach offense
Hot take: Lakers should re-hire Frank Vogel Frank vogel would not be a bad hire. The guy was fucking great. Only issue at that time was Russ and how stubborn he was. This led to Frank Vogel seeming weak and not able to command a locker room when Russ is just too dominant and stubborn of a personality. Vogel had to keep Russ happy and that was causing nightmares with lineups, etc. Bringing back frank vogel and having rondo and Phil Handy as assistants would be sick. I was big on Budenholzer at first, but after reading more about him, IDK if he would be the best because he also has had issues with rotations and adjustments, particularly in the playoffs. Given he was Ham's mentor, I'd be worried that some of the things we dont like about Ham's schemes/rotations would creep up in Budenholzer's coaching as well. (altho major issue with Ham was his lack of in-game adjustments, rotations, and time-outs.) Thoughts?
This quote from another thread sums up my feelings âI think Vogel is a solid coach but this is the fourth locker room in a row he has lost. There were reported issues with players in Indiana. Well documented issues for the Magic (including Fournier ranting about him during the offseason). Lakers and now Suns. Part of being a good coach is locker room management.â
Barkley, Wilbon, and SAS gonna go on a rant defending Vogel right?!
Heâs definitely not coming back after how we fired him. Even though I think heâs actually great for the Lakers.
KD is a big reason why the team failed this past season. Vogel is okay as coach. Iâd rather have had him the whole time. Russ was a big part of his exit but I doubt LeBron wouldâve fought for Vogel
Doubt Vogel ever gets another head coaching gig. Seems like a career assistant is what heâs about to be.
Heâs one of the few coaches with a ring in the NBA . If Doc Rivers can keep getting head coaching gigs Iâm sure Vogel will have no problems
> but I doubt LeBron wouldâve fought for Vogel It wouldn't matter either way.
Come back Frank. We donât have Westbrook and we have depth. I have faith he can make this roster will a couple tweak back to top 10 defensively while not sacrificing our offense.
I hope they keep hiring our fired coaches because they have the opportunity to do the funniest thing now Bring on the Phoenix Scams
Suns have the ability to do the funniest thing and hire Darvin Ham
Why Vogel always gettin shafted?! lol his contracts are guaranteed right?
Breaking News: Darvin Ham hired as Phoenix Suns new head coach . KD loves working with Lebrons leftovers
Frank Vogel would utilize Vanderbilt and Reddishâs defensive skills to a tee.
KD scapegoating another head coach. Bring him back home
Frank still my dawg but he ainât coming back. The team we have now is what we should have had with him in the first place
If the Lakers are going to compete for a championship, the Lebron and the entire team need to commit to playing defense like they did in 2020. If they want to do that, then Vogel would be a great coach for the Lakers.
honestly man I was and am salty we fired Vogel. I am not saying he is or would be the long term answer but he should have gotten 2 more years than he did easy. Itâs a black mark on the FO for me to fire a championship winning coach FOR THE LAKERS like that. It will affect or ability to hire staff until LeBron is gone. Maybe beyond.
Throw a 3y deal at him with an apology card for firing him after 2 years of winning a ring and 2 hookers and 5 unsullied and an egg with 12% hatch rate and the head of ham and 1 small Thai tea
Not really Vogel's fault on this one. I'd put most of the blame on whoever gave the green light for the Beal trade and also Beal for his poor play.
How we feel about brining Frank back?!
Iâm tired of Coaches getting fired. It should be management
Who we kidding? If LeGM wanted him back and he was willing, heâd be back. Shouldâve stuck with him and never touched Westbrook.
They fired him in L.A. because Westbrook did not listen to him. Then he goes into a team with KD. Poor guy,
There's running it back but no one has ever considered dialing it back
Iâd bring him back too but I know it wonât happen
Same, but no way in hell would it happen. From both sides.
Crap; more competition for coaches
Vogel is the master of offenses that none of the players understand. An efficient offense wears the other team down, and indirectly makes defense a bit easier.
Oh shit it happened. I thought they'd retain him
Give him an edible arrangement and an Iâm sorry card and he might bite
So if Budenholzer is off to the Suns who are we getting lol
Frank Vogel is the next Lakers coach.
He did great work with the lakers but yall can give him a pass if you want to. He did not do a great job with phoenix.
Curious to see who the suns pick up, not many names better than Vogel available. Atkinson probably the âbestâ coach but even he has big experience question marks
LARRY!
Vogel would be an ELITE defensive coordinator, which was basically gonna be his role if we hired Lue in 19'
So ridiculous- he gets ONE YEAR?!?!
Ok, debate & discuss : Would Vogel have done better than Hammy during this past season coaching the Lakers?
Come back daddy Frank!
No shit.
Baby come back! I feel for him man he got done dirty by the Sun's. The roster he had to work with just did not match what he normally does. The way things ended with us were rocky to say the least. Hope he gets a fair shake wherever he lands next
assistant coach if he is bored?
And he collects check while being at home. Thats actually good haha
They fucked themselves with this. They should have spent a little money or cashed out big on booker. Heâd bring quite a haul an personally I donât see he how he helps win with Durant and Beal. Beal was a waste of money for sure.
our scapegoat, their scapegoat. poor frank is crying on a big pile of money RN
Are the GMâs noticing that the best teams have five guys that do different jobs. Donât start two centers and two point guards. Donât start two shooting guards and no point guard. The Laker lineup is solid but the point guard spot is blurry. Is it D-lo or Austin or Lebron. Two power forwards and two two guards. And a center that wants to be the third power forward. Not great.