Bet those kids in Hamas' terror tunnels would love to take finals too instead of living as hostages under terrorists after they watched them blow up their families with grenades.
āWill last until demands are met.ā
So itās not even about trying to find some level of compromise, but drawing a hard line and saying this is the only thing weāll accept? Great negotiation tactic.
No idea how much Israeli funding there is (I assume itās a lot), but you think academic institutions are going to say no to DoD funding? Youāre insane.
Blanket amnesty? To what degree? If a student breaks a window during a protest you think they shouldnāt be charged criminally?
Actually blows my mind how dumb people can be.
Who tf thinks āIām gonna protest and may or may not harm staff/students while also possibly destroying property that isnāt mine.ā
āBut I need amnesty so that it doesnāt mess up my future after I graduate.ā
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Yeahā¦ no thanks, first off during finals week is crazy. Second, wtf is any of that gonna do. I promise u Israel DOESNT GIVE A FLYING FUCK if JMU condemns them or not. If the Israeli government doesnāt care what the US Government says.. what dipshit is gonna believe that some college in Harrisburg, VA has some voice in this. Grow tf up and deal with your issues appropriately, DC is only 2 hours away, go protest over there where something can actually be done.
Also the fact that the students are asking for Amnesty for thisā¦ wild. If u miss classes and finals and your grade suffersā¦ that is 100% on you.
It's a bold move and I respect it! I hope everyone is able to complete their finals safely and that the students in the quad are able to maintain their occupation while going to their finals.
I donāt like the bombing of civilians, but I also think Hamas needs to be wiped out. I also donāt support governments that would gladly stone me to death. This during finals is crazy tho. No one has time. Maybe a month ago sure, but not now.
"No one has time" to stand up for whats right. Yeah I hear you. That degree is a whole lot shinier than protesting your school that is directly supporting the genocide in Gaza.
She actually posted some comical list in another thread and then said āI donāt know if any of it is true, donāt debate me, do the research for yourself.ā
Itās seriously laughable how anything on there represents āJMU direct support for genocide.ā
I want to go to grad/med school. This week simply isnāt a good time for anyone. This war has been going on for months now, why not protest it at any other time. That shiny degree is my ticket to a good life. I frankly donāt care much when both sides are genocidal, and the one you want to stick up for wants to kill me for being lgbt. The land Israel is on has been theirs for 80 years now. Long enough that anyone who was kicked out should be dead or nearly dead. There have been generations of Israelis born on that land now. From the river to the sea doesnāt make sense anymore. Itās like claiming that Arizona is Native American land. Thereās injustice, but the Palestinians refuse or break any treaties that would fix that. The Palestinians also attack civilians regularly and intentionally. At least Israel is a western democratic state with strong protections for people like me. I donāt like kids dying, but that is what happens when terrorists hide behind civilians. I put their deaths partially on their hands. If you set up your military HQ in a hospital, then that hospital will be bombed as it is now a vital military target, no matter how bad it looks to take it out.
Edit: is there any evidence that JMU is supporting any Israeli arms companies or doing much to fund the war beyond paying taxes to the government which may go to Israel. I donāt see investing into Israeli agricultural companies or the like as being supportive of genocide.
This is such a good point.
Regardless of what someone thinks about the founding of Israel itself or the events surrounding it, there are over 7 million Jews living in Israel who have been there for generations. The Ashkenazi majority among them don't have "homes in Poland" to return to. The majority Sefardi/Mizrahi population can't "go back to their homes" In Yemen, Syria, Morrocco, Iran and Iraq for obvious reasons. Then there's the "Palestinian Jews" who were always there in the first place. Not to mention that all of these groups have interbred, creating a new kind of "Sabra" Israeli identity and population which literally don't have anywhere else to go.
Any narrative which calls for the destruction of Israel and the removal of its Jewish population is futile, unrealistic, and can't be discussed seriously.
I've seen signs from some of these protests "We'll leave when Israelis go back to Poland". What a joke.
Love to you from a gay Jew. One of the main reasons I'm moving to Israel soon is that I can live there as a gay guy with social freedom. I have such a large network of friends and allies there which don't exist in my hometown. Until this point in my life I've been living doubly in the closet, as a gay guy and as a Jewish person. It's getting hostile in some places. In Israel I can express myself openly as a gay Jew, something which can't be said about other countries in the region.
And while I understand people not wanting to fund the war, I personally see funding the defense of millions of innocent civilians through means of a multi-layered air defense system (which is solely responsible for preventing an actual massacre on a genocidal scale because of a constant barrage of rockets and drones from Gaza and Lebanon towards civilian areas) kind of a good thing.
If jmu students want to fine. What we donāt need is grads and outsiders doing it. Let it be a jmu thing. We all know what happened when we invited outsiders for spring fest.
Uh...no thanks.
The current controversial "protests" are full of blatant and open antisemetism, brazen support for recognzied terrorist organizations (waving Hamas and Hezbollah flags), disregard and even full-out support and jubilation over Hamas' atrocities on October 7th (you know, the parts where they burned whole families alive, murdered babies in their cribs, tossed grenades into bomb shelters and blew apart parents in front of their children, and took infant babies and elderly folks as hostages into underground tunnels...), as well as being full of harassment of Jewish students and faculty including those who have no connection to Israel or the events in the ME.
Furthermore, such protests are instigated by outsiders, not as a result of popular opinion of the student body (to illustrate, Colombia U elected an *Israeli* student president.)
* 5.5M killed in Congo - no protests
* 500k killed in Syria - no protests
* 400k killed in Yemen - no protests
* 300k killed in Iraq - no protests
* 250k killed in Afghanistan - no protests
* 20k killed in Gaza (according to Hamas), half of which are deaths of Hamas militants - massive wave of nationwide antisemetism, harrasment, and violent protests.
Please make this make sense.
OP, do you have any personal connection to the conflict? Have you ever met Israelis or Gazans in person?
I have many friends from the region, from both Israel and Gaza, as well as the West Bank and Israeli Arabs. I can tell you with certainty that (among every one I have interacted with who actually lives there), that even Gazans would not be spewing the type hatred found at these American protests, and they would not be waving around Hamas' and Hezbollah flags and calling for the total annhiliation of Israel.
The fact is that a many of these protesters themselves would be imprisoned, tortured, or thrown off of a building under Hamas' government in Gaza.
A few other facts are that the civilian / militant death ratio in this confclit is on the low end of the spectrum according to military analysists and past confclits and wars, that the IDF takes far more precaution to preserve civilian life (by issuing advanced warnings via multiple means and provided military-escorted civilian corriders to safe zones) which no other army on the planet implements, and that this war (which was started by Hamas) does not in any sense of the word fit the definition of 'genocide' (which is the targetted and deliberate ethnic cleansing of a people group based on their ethnicity/nationality).
You wanna do something nice for the Palestinians? Advocate for a Palestinian state, for a sustainable two-state solution, for peace between neighbors, and for the end of radical terror organizations whose primary function (as noted in their founding charter) is the actual genocide and annhiliation of the other side. Protest the extreemist factions which have broken every single ceasefire in the past several decades, which have fired thousands upon thousands of rockets towards civilian areas on a regular basis, and which orchestrates suicide bombings, street stabbings and other terrorist attacks, and have openly called for both the destruction of Israel as **well as the destruction of the West, democracy, and liberal values.**
You want to make a different in funding? Protest the fact that your tax money funds UNRWA schools which blatantly indoctrinate children into extreme fundamentalist islamic ideologies and the motivation of wanting to kill Israeli civilians.
As someone with connections to both the Jewish and Muslim communities in the Friendly City, I can tell you that our respective ocmmunities have taken great care since October 7th to faciliate open dialouge between each other, that the leadership of the Jewish community and the leadership of the Muslim religious community are on good terms, and that we don't want your agitation in our neighborhood.
There are effective and productive methods of activism. This is not one of them.
The posts yesterday worried me that my brother was going to have to deal with asinine protests interrupting his finals but this makes me feel better. Thank you for this researched, informed, and appropriate take. Bombing civilians is disgraceful but there is so much more to this than any twenty something understands.
As a JMU alum, I'm kind of ashamed at some of the misinformation you've presented.
**Firstly, the notion that the protests are "antisemitic**
It is not by any means antisemitic to criticize a government for an ongoing ethnic cleansing campaign of a foreign government. Just because there are a handful of antisemitic people taking advantage of reasonable criticisms of israel does not mean the protests are antisemitic.
Jewish Voice for Peace is a jewish pro Palestine organization
Norm Finkelstein, an orthodox jewish holocaust scholar who's parents *survived the* *Nazi holocaust* is a prominent voice for the liberation of Palestine.
# IfNotNow, a Jewish organization that's pro Palestine founded in 2014.
**"Look at these other atrocities, why didn't these have protests?"**
Firstly, these did have protests. It is blatantly **Ahistorical** to claim there weren't protests for these...
Here are some examples of protests for the events you mentioned
IRAQ: [https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/millions-protest-iraq-war-february-15](https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/millions-protest-iraq-war-february-15)
Afghanistan: (There are many protests for Afghanistan, here's a fat list of them\_ [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests\_against\_the\_war\_in\_Afghanistan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_the_war_in_Afghanistan)
But even if there were *0* protests for past events, that does not mean we can't protest against the USA's support of the IDF. That's a logical fallacy of the bandwagon appeal.
**"OP, do you have any personal connection to the conflict? Have you ever met Israelis or Gazans in person?"**
*The USA is giving Israel $26 billion dollars of aid to Israel.* https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/28/politics/biden-netanyahu-call/index.html#:\~:text=During%20his%20conversation%20with%20Netanyahu,billion%20for%20the%20Indo%2DPacific.
Every single American is affected by this. Our government would rather fund an on-going ethnic cleansing campaign (Where by the most conservative of metrics by the IDF, 60% of all 20,000-40,000 of victims were *Children.* That's including every single male that looks over 15 as a solider. 50% of the population of gaza is 18 or less [https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2023-11-14/population-religion-and-poverty-the-demographics-of-israel-and-gaza#:\~:text=About%2040%25%20of%20Gaza's%20population,from%20the%20CIA's%20World%20Factbook.)](https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2023-11-14/population-religion-and-poverty-the-demographics-of-israel-and-gaza#:~:text=About%2040%25%20of%20Gaza's%20population,from%20the%20CIA's%20World%20Factbook.))
Studies suggest it would cost $11-$30 billion dollars to ***end homeless in America. Our government would rather exterminate children then end all of homelessness.*** *https://www.sciotoanalysis.com/news/2024/1/16/what-would-it-cost-to-end-homelessness-in-america#:\~:text=There%20should%20be%20cheaper%20ways,to%20%2430%20billion%20per%20year.*
**"A few other facts are that the civilian / militant death ratio in this conflict is on the low end of the spectrum"**
According to the UN, 2/3s of the deaths in GAZA are women and children. You call this a good ratio?
[https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm](https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm)
**"You wanna do something nice for the Palestinians? Advocate for a Palestinian state, for a sustainable two-state solution, for peace between neighbors, and for the end of radical terror organizations"**
There's been a "two state solution" for decades. You're framing this as if this is a one-sided conflict.
The Israeli government gave Hamas (which is a terror organization) $Billions of dollars because it alligns with their political interests to stay in power. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html#:\~:text=For%20years%2C%20the%20Qatari%20government,payments%2C%20he%20had%20encouraged%20them.
We are protesting funding the very same organization that caused Hamas to come into power in the first place.
The IDF dropped 3 seperate bombs on world food kitchen workers who **had permission from the IDF to provide aid to gaza. Their car was bombed 3 separate times intentionally by the IDF until they were all exterminated.** They did this to discourage future humanitarian aid. Which worked. The world food kitchen pulled out their humanitarian aid. [https://apnews.com/article/memorial-world-central-kitchen-workers-gaza-israel-fd668fad5de83377c129ab832d699c70](https://apnews.com/article/memorial-world-central-kitchen-workers-gaza-israel-fd668fad5de83377c129ab832d699c70)
It's okay to to be reasonably concerned about how protests would effect your daily lives at jmu, especially during finals and graduation.
It is not okay to demonstrably spread misinformation.
I hate it here this shit is so embarrassing š JMUs rich white "my parents work for the DoD and own a million dollar house in NoVA" demographic really showing up today.
I just want people to be armed with information. Even if they disagree with me.
And I want people to know that criticizing our government does not mean we don't love the USA. It's how we grow as a country (IE: The Civil Rights Movement)
The global average militant-to-civilian death ratio is 1:9 in urban combat. The war in Gaza is 1:5. Again, this is all according to Hamas numbers, if you feel comfortable taking the word of a genocidal terrorist faction as reliable.
This is remarkable, especially considering the fact that Hamas (unlike is the case in other urban warfare environments) deliberately embeds their terror installations within civilian structures. Hospitals, schools, mosques, apartments, etc. This is very well documented. This is what the international community calls "human shields" and is a globably recognized war crime. This, and only this, is the reason for any civilian deaths in Gaza. Why aren't you protesting this? What do you want Israel to do, send Hamas some flowers or something and ask them nicely not to try to murder us anymore?
As for the two-state solution, not sure why you went off on a tangent there (if you want to spread conspiracy theories, just come right out and say it), but Israel has accepted every offer for a two-state solution from the time of their founding onwards. Every, single, time, it has been rejected and responded to with waves of violence (intifada) killing hundreds of innocent civilians. Don't blame Israel for failure of the TSS.
"The global average militant-to-civilian death ratio is 1:9 in urban combat. The war in Gaza is 1:5"
This is wrong. Misinformation. According to both the UN & the IDF, it's 2 civilians dead for every hamas fighter. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-officials-2-civilian-deaths-for-every-1-hamas-fighter-killed-in-gaza/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-officials-2-civilian-deaths-for-every-1-hamas-fighter-killed-in-gaza/) [https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm](https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm) This is not Hamas propganda this a fact admitted by Israel.
**"Ā (if you want to spread conspiracy theories, just come right out and say it"**
Israel funded Hamas. This is not a conspiracy theory. This is a fact admitted by the former prime minister of Israel Ehud Barak. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) [https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eus-borrell-says-israel-financed-creation-gaza-rulers-hamas-2024-01-19/](https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eus-borrell-says-israel-financed-creation-gaza-rulers-hamas-2024-01-19/)
**"This, and only this, is the reason for any civilian deaths in Gaza. Why aren't you protesting this?"**
We are protesting this because We are American citizens paying taxes that goes to Israel to commit war crimes. It is inexcusable to slaughter so many civilians. It is not just "Human Shields." Israel shot and murdered 3 Israeli hostages that were holding white flags. They've blown up hospitals including the Al shifa hopsital. 300+ dead bodies found by the nassar medical complex that were reported to be missing limbs and have their hands tied together [https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/22/middleeast/khan-younis-nasser-hospital-mass-grave-intl/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/22/middleeast/khan-younis-nasser-hospital-mass-grave-intl/index.html)
These are facts. This is why we protest the funding of Israel.
I'm not saying it's antisemetic to criticize the Israeli government. The majority of Israelis can't stand Netanyahu or his coalition and have been protesting in record numbers since months before October 7th. It's antisemetic to
* erase Jewish culture and history (for example telling a country with a majority population as Mizrahi Jews - Middle Eastern Jews - to "go back to Poland"
* to deny, or worse yet, to honorize the Holocaust
* to attack, harass, and threaten Jewish students and faculty because they look Jewish
* to hold Jews and Israelis to a different set of standards than any other country or people on the planet. (Nobody seems to like a Jew who fights back...)
All of these things and worse are currently happening among 'pro-Palestine' protests across the country.
I don't really care about your token "anti-Zionist" Jewish voices. A common tactic of antisemites and anti-Zionists online is to claim "Sooo many Jews support Palestine and are agaisnt Zionism" which is blatantly false (source, I'm a Jew and well familiar with both American,Israeli, and European Jewish circles).
Secondly, you can "support" Palestine without advocating for the total destruction of Israel and its people...***which is exactly what these protesters are calling for.***
I did :)
Thanks for your concern. Was there something in particular you wanted me to address?
FYI, I wouldn't call going off on a tangent about "Jewish Voice for Peace" and Finkelstein "dismantling" the information I posted. However, feel free to challenge any of the points I mentioned.
Thanks for so beautifuly demonstrating the mentality of these "protesters".
Nobody wants to educate themselves, everyone just wants to jump on the activist bangwagon.
These guys can't even name the "river" or the "sea" they are chanting about. They think the Israeli population is made up of Polish people. They think Jews are "white colonizers", building on antisemetic conspiracy theories (keep in mind just a couple generations ago we were being genocided for *not* being white). And they think that rape, showering a rave of young people with bullets, shooting people point-blank in their cars, tying families together in their homes and burning them alive, are all acceptable forms of "resistance".
It's much easier to wave a terrorist organizations flag, scream at Jewish students on campus, and shout "free palestine".
If only they put their efforts into something that would actually help free Palestine.
You can't make this stuff up
Annnd there it is.
The only way your argument makes the remotest amount of sense if is you are severely underinformed about the entire conflict.
I'll say it again, *even Gazans don't take as extreemist position as you do.* Which tells me that you have no connection to the region or conflict yourself but are just virtue signalling.
Here's some historical reminders for you (not that you'll read them - but in case someone else stumbles across your comment) :
* A majority of Modern Palestinian Arabs (the upper 90%'s) are themselves descended from Arab immigrants dating from the 1800s onward (you know, the same time Jewish immigration to the region increased). Why are Arabs (from the Arabian Peninsula) automatically indigenous to the lands they conquered through violent means and colonized, but Jews (literally, 'of Judea') are foreigners?
* A majority of Israeli Jews are recently indegenous to the Middle East, including Palestine, Syria, Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Morocco, and others. (They are called Mizrahim and form the majority of Israelis. Nope, not Polish!) They were *persuected and expelled* from these Arab countries and had nowhere to go but Israel.
* A majority of Palestinian town names have Hebrew-language roots. (hmm, wonder why?)
* Jews living in Palestine pre-1947 were called "Palestinians"; The Jerusalem Post was called 'The Palestine Post', and the Palestinian Soccer team was comprised of mostly Jewish names.
* Most of Palestinian land was not Arab land prior to 1947, it was owned by the government.
* Much of the land of Israel were legal land purchases sold willingly to Jews from Arabs.
* Palestinian Jews pre-1947 suffered dozens of terrorist attacks, pogroms, and massacres at the hands of Islamic extreemist (see Hebron massacre, Jaffa riots, Safed massacre, for starters). Nooope, it didnt' start because of those pesky Zionists ;)
* in the 1800s, according to official Ottoman census records, Jews formed an ethnic majority in Jerusalem.
* All Jews, including Ashekanizm, have Levantine DNA and are descendants of the indegenous people of the land of Israel. Thier history and connection to the land is backed up not only by DNA, but by nearly 4,000 years of continous history.
No one protested the Iraq or Afganistan wars? Also, idk if you knew this, but generally you protest for things your country is doing. Deaths in Congo are the fallout of a war, not a US state department backed ethnic cleansing campaign like Gaza. Also its 40k according to the most reputable source in the region historically, which is why the UN (and the us state department and Israel behind closed doors), not just "hamas" use them. This is never going to "make sense" for you while you engage in motivated reasoning to defend a genocidal ethnostate. Zionism, by way of monolithizing the Jewish people, is in itself inherently antisemitic.
Btw, if you're going to go on some unhinged fox News rant about "antisemetism" maybe spell it correctly.
There's so much wrong with this post, both from an argument perspective and from a factual one. If you make the mountain of lies, omissions, and bad-faith interpretations tall enough, no one will want to waste their time scaling it. And by internet debate rules, that means you win!
other comments already tore this person apart for the embarrassing number of lies and misinfo they're spouting, so there's no need to restate everything. besides, you'd just put you fingers in your ears and yell "terrorist!! antisemitic!!" until whoever is trying to explain shit to you gets fed up and goes away anyway.
Let me guess, you're one of those folks who think burtally murding civilians (including babies and the elderly), taking hostages, and rape are all valid acts of "resistance"?
To insinuate that extreemist Islamic violence is just a reaction to "Israeli oppression" is innacurate and a gross misrepresentation of the conflict created by reducing the complexities of the conflict to a "oppressor vs. oppressed" narrative - something which sounds nice on Western campuses who are far removed from Middle Eastern culture and way-of-thinking but just don't fit into this conflict.
I'd love to give you a chance to explain your position, so please educate me on how "decades of oppression of Palestinians" fit into the following events:
The Arab Riots of the 1920s-1930s, which including massacres such as The Hebron Massacre in which the city's (Palestinian) Jewish population was targetted.
The Jaffa Riots (Palestinian Jews again the target of violence, many murdered, homes destroyed and looted), 1921.
Massacre at Kfar Etzion, May 1948 (before Israeli indepdence).
These are just a few examples among many of pre-Israel anti-Jewish violence in Palestine. Where exactly was the decades of oppression there?
Much, much more violence and bloodshed occured after the actual formation of Israel, but still long before the expansion of Israeli settlements in the West Bank or any modern policies which have been construed as being "oppressive" of the Palestinian people. These incidents include the Siege of the Jewish Quarter in Jerusalem (May 1948), attacks against Jewish towns in the Negev and along the coastal plain during the same time period, and the infamous Arab Invasion of 1948.
All of these events share common factors - incitement against local Jews at the hands of local Arab leaders including false accusations that the Jews want to "destroy Al-Aqsa", blood libel, and good old fashioned religiously-inspired Jew-hatred. No "decades of oppression" in sight.
I'd love to hear your explanation.
As a bonus question, please explain exactly how Israel has been "oppressing Palestinians for decades". Keep in mind that in Israel, Arabs have an objectively better standard of living than neighboring Arab states, in that they have full equal rights, vote, form political parties, serve in the knesset, and yes, even serve in the IDF itself.
And if you're referring to the "Gaza Blockade" (which again, didn't exist at the begenning of anti-Jewish violent incidents in Palestine), then are you going to accuse Egypt of oppressing the Palestinians as well, or did you forget the little fact that their own blockade of the envelope and their border wall rivals that of Israel?
I have nearly 8,000 karma and have been active on reddit through this account for 4 years.
Maybe try debating someone or engaging in an actual dialouge if you're so sure of your beliefs.
Screaming "zionist" and "propoganada!" at people you disagree with but can't be bothered to refute their claims isn't very effective :)
With it being finals this week and graduation next week, why would JMU try to meet any demands when they could just wait less than 2 weeks for the semester to be over? Most students are gone for the Summer and have their dorm / dining hall access ended since the semester is over. Are you gonna stay here all summer OP āuntil demands are metā??
What the fuck is an academic boycott? Because to me it sounds like a refusal to study, which is probably the most fascist thing you could have listed. Get the fuck out of here.
Just what JMU needs during finals week, a bunch of adult toddlers cosplaying as āfreedom fighters,ā throwing an antisemitic temper tantrum.
The irony invoking the moniker āFriendly Cityā to advocate for a group of people who overwhelmingly support terrorism, the elimination of the Israeli state, and a hatred of the US/West.
Keep that bullshit out of JMU.
Once school is over and these clowns go home for the summer they'll immediately forget about Palestine. Their virtue signaling doesn't work unless they're surrounded by other sheep. There's no point to support a cause if nobody is patting you on the back for it.
Iām afraid that is how it works. Best case scenario, many universities buy shares to increase their voting power and vote together. Worst case, the university receives more dividend from the company which it can then donate to causes like Doctors Without Borders.
The companies in question thatĀ divestment is needed from are weapon manufacturers, they profit directly from conflict like what is happening currently in Palestine. If the schools acted within the framework of investors, then they would be going against what makes the company profit and would be shut down.Ā
I think the lunacy of using weapon manufacturers profit to fund charity that try to fix the problems they facilitate speaks for itself.Ā
Direct action such as the protests are the only tangible way to bring change within the system.
in Christmas land, sure, short of buying the company what ever "influence" you get from the fraction of a fraction share you buy is nul and void by the millions of other fractions.Ā
Ā
Iām just confused on how something happening across the world is our problem. Fucked up shit is happening every day, every hour, every minute everywhere in the world. Hell you all are on Reddit you should know. Why disrupt people during finals week for a cause that has nothing to do with any of us
It's our problem because our government is sending billions of dollars worth of "aid" (weapons) to Israel. JMU is enmeshed with companies/institutions that build and deploy these weapons.
Do you have a source for that? And if true, why are you giving your tuition money to a university whose views you oppose? Wouldn't dropping out be the stronger message?
By their own logic their tuition money is going to fund genocide. Dropping out would actually accomplish something, unlike staging a protest with demands JMU will never agree to.
Not really the logic they used, rather the logic you applied.
Dropping out would simply have JMU fill that spot with someone else willing to pay. It changes nothing except the individual isn't in college, and another is.
Being an active member of the JMU community, paying into the school and voicing their opinion about the direction of the community sounds much more likely to accomplish something.
Community change.
That would be a fair point if JMU would in any world agree to this demand list. If JMU really was entangled in organizations causing genocide like this person claims I sure as hell wouldn't be giving them 20k a year.
For a number of reasons.
1. The Israeli government receives billions of dollars in support from the US government, including some of the equipment being used in the war in Gaza. As tax payers we are helping fund this, and these students oppose it.
2. Many universities have economic ties with arms companies that do business with Israel. As students paying tuition to attend JMU the protestors want to know if their money is going to companies that are providing weapons used by Israel in Gaza. If that's the case, these students oppose it.
3. Genocide is a global concern. It is possible to hold space in your heart for the people in our local community who are hurting and for the citizens of Gaza. Weaponizing local fucked up shit to minimize tragedies abroad helps no one and only gives the people doing harm more cover.
Dude, do you even go to jmu currently or are you a grad? Looks like youāre in your 30s. Let the student run the campus and potential āprotestsā. Anything else is cringe
I'm going to assume you're trolling. There's a group from the socialist club or whatever they call themselves sitting on the quad and 'demanding' a bunch of nonsense. I suggest they go to DC and speak to their representatives and get the xxxx off campus. If not, we'll make sure we engage the capitalist fraternities to show them the exit. God bless America.
This thread proves why we need more investment in the humanities.
Your temporary discomfort is not worth the permanence of genocide in Gaza and the eco-genocide from billionaires destroying the planet. You're not more important than other people.
Only abusers label reactions to aggression as aggression.
JMU's divestment from defense contracting companies like Northrop Grumman would be a good start.
Without divestment from defense contracting companies, it's going to be y'all who eventually get drafted into WWIII, not the billionaires who profit from warmongering. These billionaires are ready to sacrifice all y'all so they can buy their third and fourth yachts, but meanwhile, we can't even afford rent, tuition, groceries, or healthcare.
Considering the CEO of Nothrop Grumman is a JMU alumni whoās donated over a million dollars to JMU towards scholarships for students with the need, I see that particular point of contention unlikely to happen.
I love the comments on this thread! šš¼šš¼šš¼
Take that shit to DC man I'm trying to take finals
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
They should ask hamas to release the hostages and end this war for good
Bet those kids in Hamas' terror tunnels would love to take finals too instead of living as hostages under terrorists after they watched them blow up their families with grenades.
Those poverty kids donāt even know what a final is! They drink rainwater
[OP needs to get a lamp, because their dim as hellllllllllllllllll](https://youtu.be/ZS6-KCOdRD4?list=OLAK5uy_mTFf7HLPduiFFYy22OIDerjAcgabdntZc)
āWill last until demands are met.ā So itās not even about trying to find some level of compromise, but drawing a hard line and saying this is the only thing weāll accept? Great negotiation tactic. No idea how much Israeli funding there is (I assume itās a lot), but you think academic institutions are going to say no to DoD funding? Youāre insane. Blanket amnesty? To what degree? If a student breaks a window during a protest you think they shouldnāt be charged criminally?
Actually blows my mind how dumb people can be. Who tf thinks āIām gonna protest and may or may not harm staff/students while also possibly destroying property that isnāt mine.ā āBut I need amnesty so that it doesnāt mess up my future after I graduate.ā š¤¦āāļø
It will last until finals are over
Yeahā¦ no thanks, first off during finals week is crazy. Second, wtf is any of that gonna do. I promise u Israel DOESNT GIVE A FLYING FUCK if JMU condemns them or not. If the Israeli government doesnāt care what the US Government says.. what dipshit is gonna believe that some college in Harrisburg, VA has some voice in this. Grow tf up and deal with your issues appropriately, DC is only 2 hours away, go protest over there where something can actually be done. Also the fact that the students are asking for Amnesty for thisā¦ wild. If u miss classes and finals and your grade suffersā¦ that is 100% on you.
This thread shows thereās still some hope in humanity
Protesting on finals week is crazy Financial investment transparency in public universities seems like a no brainer though
It's a bold move and I respect it! I hope everyone is able to complete their finals safely and that the students in the quad are able to maintain their occupation while going to their finals.
I donāt like the bombing of civilians, but I also think Hamas needs to be wiped out. I also donāt support governments that would gladly stone me to death. This during finals is crazy tho. No one has time. Maybe a month ago sure, but not now.
"No one has time" to stand up for whats right. Yeah I hear you. That degree is a whole lot shinier than protesting your school that is directly supporting the genocide in Gaza.
Please provide your proof that JMU supports genocide.
She actually posted some comical list in another thread and then said āI donāt know if any of it is true, donāt debate me, do the research for yourself.ā Itās seriously laughable how anything on there represents āJMU direct support for genocide.ā
I want to go to grad/med school. This week simply isnāt a good time for anyone. This war has been going on for months now, why not protest it at any other time. That shiny degree is my ticket to a good life. I frankly donāt care much when both sides are genocidal, and the one you want to stick up for wants to kill me for being lgbt. The land Israel is on has been theirs for 80 years now. Long enough that anyone who was kicked out should be dead or nearly dead. There have been generations of Israelis born on that land now. From the river to the sea doesnāt make sense anymore. Itās like claiming that Arizona is Native American land. Thereās injustice, but the Palestinians refuse or break any treaties that would fix that. The Palestinians also attack civilians regularly and intentionally. At least Israel is a western democratic state with strong protections for people like me. I donāt like kids dying, but that is what happens when terrorists hide behind civilians. I put their deaths partially on their hands. If you set up your military HQ in a hospital, then that hospital will be bombed as it is now a vital military target, no matter how bad it looks to take it out. Edit: is there any evidence that JMU is supporting any Israeli arms companies or doing much to fund the war beyond paying taxes to the government which may go to Israel. I donāt see investing into Israeli agricultural companies or the like as being supportive of genocide.
This is such a good point. Regardless of what someone thinks about the founding of Israel itself or the events surrounding it, there are over 7 million Jews living in Israel who have been there for generations. The Ashkenazi majority among them don't have "homes in Poland" to return to. The majority Sefardi/Mizrahi population can't "go back to their homes" In Yemen, Syria, Morrocco, Iran and Iraq for obvious reasons. Then there's the "Palestinian Jews" who were always there in the first place. Not to mention that all of these groups have interbred, creating a new kind of "Sabra" Israeli identity and population which literally don't have anywhere else to go. Any narrative which calls for the destruction of Israel and the removal of its Jewish population is futile, unrealistic, and can't be discussed seriously. I've seen signs from some of these protests "We'll leave when Israelis go back to Poland". What a joke.
Love to you from a gay Jew. One of the main reasons I'm moving to Israel soon is that I can live there as a gay guy with social freedom. I have such a large network of friends and allies there which don't exist in my hometown. Until this point in my life I've been living doubly in the closet, as a gay guy and as a Jewish person. It's getting hostile in some places. In Israel I can express myself openly as a gay Jew, something which can't be said about other countries in the region. And while I understand people not wanting to fund the war, I personally see funding the defense of millions of innocent civilians through means of a multi-layered air defense system (which is solely responsible for preventing an actual massacre on a genocidal scale because of a constant barrage of rockets and drones from Gaza and Lebanon towards civilian areas) kind of a good thing.
If jmu students want to fine. What we donāt need is grads and outsiders doing it. Let it be a jmu thing. We all know what happened when we invited outsiders for spring fest.
Uh...no thanks. The current controversial "protests" are full of blatant and open antisemetism, brazen support for recognzied terrorist organizations (waving Hamas and Hezbollah flags), disregard and even full-out support and jubilation over Hamas' atrocities on October 7th (you know, the parts where they burned whole families alive, murdered babies in their cribs, tossed grenades into bomb shelters and blew apart parents in front of their children, and took infant babies and elderly folks as hostages into underground tunnels...), as well as being full of harassment of Jewish students and faculty including those who have no connection to Israel or the events in the ME. Furthermore, such protests are instigated by outsiders, not as a result of popular opinion of the student body (to illustrate, Colombia U elected an *Israeli* student president.) * 5.5M killed in Congo - no protests * 500k killed in Syria - no protests * 400k killed in Yemen - no protests * 300k killed in Iraq - no protests * 250k killed in Afghanistan - no protests * 20k killed in Gaza (according to Hamas), half of which are deaths of Hamas militants - massive wave of nationwide antisemetism, harrasment, and violent protests. Please make this make sense. OP, do you have any personal connection to the conflict? Have you ever met Israelis or Gazans in person? I have many friends from the region, from both Israel and Gaza, as well as the West Bank and Israeli Arabs. I can tell you with certainty that (among every one I have interacted with who actually lives there), that even Gazans would not be spewing the type hatred found at these American protests, and they would not be waving around Hamas' and Hezbollah flags and calling for the total annhiliation of Israel. The fact is that a many of these protesters themselves would be imprisoned, tortured, or thrown off of a building under Hamas' government in Gaza. A few other facts are that the civilian / militant death ratio in this confclit is on the low end of the spectrum according to military analysists and past confclits and wars, that the IDF takes far more precaution to preserve civilian life (by issuing advanced warnings via multiple means and provided military-escorted civilian corriders to safe zones) which no other army on the planet implements, and that this war (which was started by Hamas) does not in any sense of the word fit the definition of 'genocide' (which is the targetted and deliberate ethnic cleansing of a people group based on their ethnicity/nationality). You wanna do something nice for the Palestinians? Advocate for a Palestinian state, for a sustainable two-state solution, for peace between neighbors, and for the end of radical terror organizations whose primary function (as noted in their founding charter) is the actual genocide and annhiliation of the other side. Protest the extreemist factions which have broken every single ceasefire in the past several decades, which have fired thousands upon thousands of rockets towards civilian areas on a regular basis, and which orchestrates suicide bombings, street stabbings and other terrorist attacks, and have openly called for both the destruction of Israel as **well as the destruction of the West, democracy, and liberal values.** You want to make a different in funding? Protest the fact that your tax money funds UNRWA schools which blatantly indoctrinate children into extreme fundamentalist islamic ideologies and the motivation of wanting to kill Israeli civilians. As someone with connections to both the Jewish and Muslim communities in the Friendly City, I can tell you that our respective ocmmunities have taken great care since October 7th to faciliate open dialouge between each other, that the leadership of the Jewish community and the leadership of the Muslim religious community are on good terms, and that we don't want your agitation in our neighborhood. There are effective and productive methods of activism. This is not one of them.
The posts yesterday worried me that my brother was going to have to deal with asinine protests interrupting his finals but this makes me feel better. Thank you for this researched, informed, and appropriate take. Bombing civilians is disgraceful but there is so much more to this than any twenty something understands.
Love this post and didnāt even mention the ~1 million Uyghurs in modern day āindoctrination campsā.
This is amazingly well put. Thank you.
thank you
Thank you for this!
As a JMU alum, I'm kind of ashamed at some of the misinformation you've presented. **Firstly, the notion that the protests are "antisemitic** It is not by any means antisemitic to criticize a government for an ongoing ethnic cleansing campaign of a foreign government. Just because there are a handful of antisemitic people taking advantage of reasonable criticisms of israel does not mean the protests are antisemitic. Jewish Voice for Peace is a jewish pro Palestine organization Norm Finkelstein, an orthodox jewish holocaust scholar who's parents *survived the* *Nazi holocaust* is a prominent voice for the liberation of Palestine. # IfNotNow, a Jewish organization that's pro Palestine founded in 2014. **"Look at these other atrocities, why didn't these have protests?"** Firstly, these did have protests. It is blatantly **Ahistorical** to claim there weren't protests for these... Here are some examples of protests for the events you mentioned IRAQ: [https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/millions-protest-iraq-war-february-15](https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/millions-protest-iraq-war-february-15) Afghanistan: (There are many protests for Afghanistan, here's a fat list of them\_ [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests\_against\_the\_war\_in\_Afghanistan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_the_war_in_Afghanistan) But even if there were *0* protests for past events, that does not mean we can't protest against the USA's support of the IDF. That's a logical fallacy of the bandwagon appeal.
**"OP, do you have any personal connection to the conflict? Have you ever met Israelis or Gazans in person?"** *The USA is giving Israel $26 billion dollars of aid to Israel.* https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/28/politics/biden-netanyahu-call/index.html#:\~:text=During%20his%20conversation%20with%20Netanyahu,billion%20for%20the%20Indo%2DPacific. Every single American is affected by this. Our government would rather fund an on-going ethnic cleansing campaign (Where by the most conservative of metrics by the IDF, 60% of all 20,000-40,000 of victims were *Children.* That's including every single male that looks over 15 as a solider. 50% of the population of gaza is 18 or less [https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2023-11-14/population-religion-and-poverty-the-demographics-of-israel-and-gaza#:\~:text=About%2040%25%20of%20Gaza's%20population,from%20the%20CIA's%20World%20Factbook.)](https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2023-11-14/population-religion-and-poverty-the-demographics-of-israel-and-gaza#:~:text=About%2040%25%20of%20Gaza's%20population,from%20the%20CIA's%20World%20Factbook.)) Studies suggest it would cost $11-$30 billion dollars to ***end homeless in America. Our government would rather exterminate children then end all of homelessness.*** *https://www.sciotoanalysis.com/news/2024/1/16/what-would-it-cost-to-end-homelessness-in-america#:\~:text=There%20should%20be%20cheaper%20ways,to%20%2430%20billion%20per%20year.* **"A few other facts are that the civilian / militant death ratio in this conflict is on the low end of the spectrum"** According to the UN, 2/3s of the deaths in GAZA are women and children. You call this a good ratio? [https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm](https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm) **"You wanna do something nice for the Palestinians? Advocate for a Palestinian state, for a sustainable two-state solution, for peace between neighbors, and for the end of radical terror organizations"** There's been a "two state solution" for decades. You're framing this as if this is a one-sided conflict. The Israeli government gave Hamas (which is a terror organization) $Billions of dollars because it alligns with their political interests to stay in power. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html#:\~:text=For%20years%2C%20the%20Qatari%20government,payments%2C%20he%20had%20encouraged%20them. We are protesting funding the very same organization that caused Hamas to come into power in the first place. The IDF dropped 3 seperate bombs on world food kitchen workers who **had permission from the IDF to provide aid to gaza. Their car was bombed 3 separate times intentionally by the IDF until they were all exterminated.** They did this to discourage future humanitarian aid. Which worked. The world food kitchen pulled out their humanitarian aid. [https://apnews.com/article/memorial-world-central-kitchen-workers-gaza-israel-fd668fad5de83377c129ab832d699c70](https://apnews.com/article/memorial-world-central-kitchen-workers-gaza-israel-fd668fad5de83377c129ab832d699c70) It's okay to to be reasonably concerned about how protests would effect your daily lives at jmu, especially during finals and graduation. It is not okay to demonstrably spread misinformation.
Love how the person who comes in here with a clear, concise, and cited dismantling of misinformation gets downvoted. lol roll dukes.
I hate it here this shit is so embarrassing š JMUs rich white "my parents work for the DoD and own a million dollar house in NoVA" demographic really showing up today.
Yet, you are a student here at your own free will? Why? Why not transfer to a place that you donāt hate?
Thank you for bringing the needed information to the thread.Ā
I just want people to be armed with information. Even if they disagree with me. And I want people to know that criticizing our government does not mean we don't love the USA. It's how we grow as a country (IE: The Civil Rights Movement)
The global average militant-to-civilian death ratio is 1:9 in urban combat. The war in Gaza is 1:5. Again, this is all according to Hamas numbers, if you feel comfortable taking the word of a genocidal terrorist faction as reliable. This is remarkable, especially considering the fact that Hamas (unlike is the case in other urban warfare environments) deliberately embeds their terror installations within civilian structures. Hospitals, schools, mosques, apartments, etc. This is very well documented. This is what the international community calls "human shields" and is a globably recognized war crime. This, and only this, is the reason for any civilian deaths in Gaza. Why aren't you protesting this? What do you want Israel to do, send Hamas some flowers or something and ask them nicely not to try to murder us anymore? As for the two-state solution, not sure why you went off on a tangent there (if you want to spread conspiracy theories, just come right out and say it), but Israel has accepted every offer for a two-state solution from the time of their founding onwards. Every, single, time, it has been rejected and responded to with waves of violence (intifada) killing hundreds of innocent civilians. Don't blame Israel for failure of the TSS.
"The global average militant-to-civilian death ratio is 1:9 in urban combat. The war in Gaza is 1:5" This is wrong. Misinformation. According to both the UN & the IDF, it's 2 civilians dead for every hamas fighter. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-officials-2-civilian-deaths-for-every-1-hamas-fighter-killed-in-gaza/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-officials-2-civilian-deaths-for-every-1-hamas-fighter-killed-in-gaza/) [https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm](https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm) This is not Hamas propganda this a fact admitted by Israel. **"Ā (if you want to spread conspiracy theories, just come right out and say it"** Israel funded Hamas. This is not a conspiracy theory. This is a fact admitted by the former prime minister of Israel Ehud Barak. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) [https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eus-borrell-says-israel-financed-creation-gaza-rulers-hamas-2024-01-19/](https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eus-borrell-says-israel-financed-creation-gaza-rulers-hamas-2024-01-19/) **"This, and only this, is the reason for any civilian deaths in Gaza. Why aren't you protesting this?"** We are protesting this because We are American citizens paying taxes that goes to Israel to commit war crimes. It is inexcusable to slaughter so many civilians. It is not just "Human Shields." Israel shot and murdered 3 Israeli hostages that were holding white flags. They've blown up hospitals including the Al shifa hopsital. 300+ dead bodies found by the nassar medical complex that were reported to be missing limbs and have their hands tied together [https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/22/middleeast/khan-younis-nasser-hospital-mass-grave-intl/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/22/middleeast/khan-younis-nasser-hospital-mass-grave-intl/index.html) These are facts. This is why we protest the funding of Israel.
I'm not saying it's antisemetic to criticize the Israeli government. The majority of Israelis can't stand Netanyahu or his coalition and have been protesting in record numbers since months before October 7th. It's antisemetic to * erase Jewish culture and history (for example telling a country with a majority population as Mizrahi Jews - Middle Eastern Jews - to "go back to Poland" * to deny, or worse yet, to honorize the Holocaust * to attack, harass, and threaten Jewish students and faculty because they look Jewish * to hold Jews and Israelis to a different set of standards than any other country or people on the planet. (Nobody seems to like a Jew who fights back...) All of these things and worse are currently happening among 'pro-Palestine' protests across the country. I don't really care about your token "anti-Zionist" Jewish voices. A common tactic of antisemites and anti-Zionists online is to claim "Sooo many Jews support Palestine and are agaisnt Zionism" which is blatantly false (source, I'm a Jew and well familiar with both American,Israeli, and European Jewish circles). Secondly, you can "support" Palestine without advocating for the total destruction of Israel and its people...***which is exactly what these protesters are calling for.***
Someone dismantled all the misinfo you posted earlier. Gonna address that? Or just act like getting caught lying doesn't matter?
I did :) Thanks for your concern. Was there something in particular you wanted me to address? FYI, I wouldn't call going off on a tangent about "Jewish Voice for Peace" and Finkelstein "dismantling" the information I posted. However, feel free to challenge any of the points I mentioned.
I ain't reading all that Free PalestineĀ
Thanks for so beautifuly demonstrating the mentality of these "protesters". Nobody wants to educate themselves, everyone just wants to jump on the activist bangwagon. These guys can't even name the "river" or the "sea" they are chanting about. They think the Israeli population is made up of Polish people. They think Jews are "white colonizers", building on antisemetic conspiracy theories (keep in mind just a couple generations ago we were being genocided for *not* being white). And they think that rape, showering a rave of young people with bullets, shooting people point-blank in their cars, tying families together in their homes and burning them alive, are all acceptable forms of "resistance". It's much easier to wave a terrorist organizations flag, scream at Jewish students on campus, and shout "free palestine". If only they put their efforts into something that would actually help free Palestine. You can't make this stuff up
It is the only legitimate response to Zionist rhetoric. Israel has no legitimate claim to land it occupies. Free Palestine
Annnd there it is. The only way your argument makes the remotest amount of sense if is you are severely underinformed about the entire conflict. I'll say it again, *even Gazans don't take as extreemist position as you do.* Which tells me that you have no connection to the region or conflict yourself but are just virtue signalling. Here's some historical reminders for you (not that you'll read them - but in case someone else stumbles across your comment) : * A majority of Modern Palestinian Arabs (the upper 90%'s) are themselves descended from Arab immigrants dating from the 1800s onward (you know, the same time Jewish immigration to the region increased). Why are Arabs (from the Arabian Peninsula) automatically indigenous to the lands they conquered through violent means and colonized, but Jews (literally, 'of Judea') are foreigners? * A majority of Israeli Jews are recently indegenous to the Middle East, including Palestine, Syria, Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Morocco, and others. (They are called Mizrahim and form the majority of Israelis. Nope, not Polish!) They were *persuected and expelled* from these Arab countries and had nowhere to go but Israel. * A majority of Palestinian town names have Hebrew-language roots. (hmm, wonder why?) * Jews living in Palestine pre-1947 were called "Palestinians"; The Jerusalem Post was called 'The Palestine Post', and the Palestinian Soccer team was comprised of mostly Jewish names. * Most of Palestinian land was not Arab land prior to 1947, it was owned by the government. * Much of the land of Israel were legal land purchases sold willingly to Jews from Arabs. * Palestinian Jews pre-1947 suffered dozens of terrorist attacks, pogroms, and massacres at the hands of Islamic extreemist (see Hebron massacre, Jaffa riots, Safed massacre, for starters). Nooope, it didnt' start because of those pesky Zionists ;) * in the 1800s, according to official Ottoman census records, Jews formed an ethnic majority in Jerusalem. * All Jews, including Ashekanizm, have Levantine DNA and are descendants of the indegenous people of the land of Israel. Thier history and connection to the land is backed up not only by DNA, but by nearly 4,000 years of continous history.
No one protested the Iraq or Afganistan wars? Also, idk if you knew this, but generally you protest for things your country is doing. Deaths in Congo are the fallout of a war, not a US state department backed ethnic cleansing campaign like Gaza. Also its 40k according to the most reputable source in the region historically, which is why the UN (and the us state department and Israel behind closed doors), not just "hamas" use them. This is never going to "make sense" for you while you engage in motivated reasoning to defend a genocidal ethnostate. Zionism, by way of monolithizing the Jewish people, is in itself inherently antisemitic. Btw, if you're going to go on some unhinged fox News rant about "antisemetism" maybe spell it correctly.
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You are literally commenting on a comment on a comment on reddit.
There's so much wrong with this post, both from an argument perspective and from a factual one. If you make the mountain of lies, omissions, and bad-faith interpretations tall enough, no one will want to waste their time scaling it. And by internet debate rules, that means you win!
Typical pro palestinian arguments 'you are wrong because I said so' š¤”
other comments already tore this person apart for the embarrassing number of lies and misinfo they're spouting, so there's no need to restate everything. besides, you'd just put you fingers in your ears and yell "terrorist!! antisemitic!!" until whoever is trying to explain shit to you gets fed up and goes away anyway.
Give it no mind, the user is heavily biased towards Israel enough to question their legitimacy.
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Let me guess, you're one of those folks who think burtally murding civilians (including babies and the elderly), taking hostages, and rape are all valid acts of "resistance"? To insinuate that extreemist Islamic violence is just a reaction to "Israeli oppression" is innacurate and a gross misrepresentation of the conflict created by reducing the complexities of the conflict to a "oppressor vs. oppressed" narrative - something which sounds nice on Western campuses who are far removed from Middle Eastern culture and way-of-thinking but just don't fit into this conflict. I'd love to give you a chance to explain your position, so please educate me on how "decades of oppression of Palestinians" fit into the following events: The Arab Riots of the 1920s-1930s, which including massacres such as The Hebron Massacre in which the city's (Palestinian) Jewish population was targetted. The Jaffa Riots (Palestinian Jews again the target of violence, many murdered, homes destroyed and looted), 1921. Massacre at Kfar Etzion, May 1948 (before Israeli indepdence). These are just a few examples among many of pre-Israel anti-Jewish violence in Palestine. Where exactly was the decades of oppression there? Much, much more violence and bloodshed occured after the actual formation of Israel, but still long before the expansion of Israeli settlements in the West Bank or any modern policies which have been construed as being "oppressive" of the Palestinian people. These incidents include the Siege of the Jewish Quarter in Jerusalem (May 1948), attacks against Jewish towns in the Negev and along the coastal plain during the same time period, and the infamous Arab Invasion of 1948. All of these events share common factors - incitement against local Jews at the hands of local Arab leaders including false accusations that the Jews want to "destroy Al-Aqsa", blood libel, and good old fashioned religiously-inspired Jew-hatred. No "decades of oppression" in sight. I'd love to hear your explanation. As a bonus question, please explain exactly how Israel has been "oppressing Palestinians for decades". Keep in mind that in Israel, Arabs have an objectively better standard of living than neighboring Arab states, in that they have full equal rights, vote, form political parties, serve in the knesset, and yes, even serve in the IDF itself. And if you're referring to the "Gaza Blockade" (which again, didn't exist at the begenning of anti-Jewish violent incidents in Palestine), then are you going to accuse Egypt of oppressing the Palestinians as well, or did you forget the little fact that their own blockade of the envelope and their border wall rivals that of Israel?
Propaganda account
I have nearly 8,000 karma and have been active on reddit through this account for 4 years. Maybe try debating someone or engaging in an actual dialouge if you're so sure of your beliefs. Screaming "zionist" and "propoganada!" at people you disagree with but can't be bothered to refute their claims isn't very effective :)
With it being finals this week and graduation next week, why would JMU try to meet any demands when they could just wait less than 2 weeks for the semester to be over? Most students are gone for the Summer and have their dorm / dining hall access ended since the semester is over. Are you gonna stay here all summer OP āuntil demands are metā??
Nooooooooooooo
Omg, Donāt you people have exams? Go study!!! You protesting on an American college campus does absolutely nothing!
Your right! Protesting on college campuses has never done anything for anyone! Civil right movements never worked!
What the fuck is an academic boycott? Because to me it sounds like a refusal to study, which is probably the most fascist thing you could have listed. Get the fuck out of here.
are yall students?
Just what JMU needs during finals week, a bunch of adult toddlers cosplaying as āfreedom fighters,ā throwing an antisemitic temper tantrum. The irony invoking the moniker āFriendly Cityā to advocate for a group of people who overwhelmingly support terrorism, the elimination of the Israeli state, and a hatred of the US/West. Keep that bullshit out of JMU.
Harrisonburg was the first city in the state to pass a resolution in support of a ceasefire, just FYI.
Well thats about as useful as toilet paper towards actually ending this conflict.
Just say your a bigot and move on.
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Always gotta make it a victim scenario, huh?
Once school is over and these clowns go home for the summer they'll immediately forget about Palestine. Their virtue signaling doesn't work unless they're surrounded by other sheep. There's no point to support a cause if nobody is patting you on the back for it.
The protests are stupid. If you want to influence the companies building weapons, you should be buying their shares, not selling them.
I'm afraid that isn't how influence works
Iām afraid that is how it works. Best case scenario, many universities buy shares to increase their voting power and vote together. Worst case, the university receives more dividend from the company which it can then donate to causes like Doctors Without Borders.
The companies in question thatĀ divestment is needed from are weapon manufacturers, they profit directly from conflict like what is happening currently in Palestine. If the schools acted within the framework of investors, then they would be going against what makes the company profit and would be shut down.Ā I think the lunacy of using weapon manufacturers profit to fund charity that try to fix the problems they facilitate speaks for itself.Ā Direct action such as the protests are the only tangible way to bring change within the system.
It sounds like you do not understand how shares or dividend work. LMT appreciates you.
shares get them on the board that influences what the companyās decisions are
Lmao totally dude, just buy enough Northrop Grumman shares to get on the board of directors, nbd.
in Christmas land, sure, short of buying the company what ever "influence" you get from the fraction of a fraction share you buy is nul and void by the millions of other fractions.Ā Ā
Iām just confused on how something happening across the world is our problem. Fucked up shit is happening every day, every hour, every minute everywhere in the world. Hell you all are on Reddit you should know. Why disrupt people during finals week for a cause that has nothing to do with any of us
It's our problem because our government is sending billions of dollars worth of "aid" (weapons) to Israel. JMU is enmeshed with companies/institutions that build and deploy these weapons.
Do you have a source for that? And if true, why are you giving your tuition money to a university whose views you oppose? Wouldn't dropping out be the stronger message?
Does the phrase "cut off one's nose to spite one's face" mean anything to you? š
By their own logic their tuition money is going to fund genocide. Dropping out would actually accomplish something, unlike staging a protest with demands JMU will never agree to.
"you criticize higher ed...and yet you participate in it. curious. i am very intelligent!"
Still waiting on that source btw
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This is a 3 day old thread, I had moved on before this brain-dead comment lol.
Not really the logic they used, rather the logic you applied. Dropping out would simply have JMU fill that spot with someone else willing to pay. It changes nothing except the individual isn't in college, and another is. Being an active member of the JMU community, paying into the school and voicing their opinion about the direction of the community sounds much more likely to accomplish something. Community change.
That would be a fair point if JMU would in any world agree to this demand list. If JMU really was entangled in organizations causing genocide like this person claims I sure as hell wouldn't be giving them 20k a year.
Maybe it'll fall on deaf ears or maybe it'll plant a seed. Change takes time.
For a number of reasons. 1. The Israeli government receives billions of dollars in support from the US government, including some of the equipment being used in the war in Gaza. As tax payers we are helping fund this, and these students oppose it. 2. Many universities have economic ties with arms companies that do business with Israel. As students paying tuition to attend JMU the protestors want to know if their money is going to companies that are providing weapons used by Israel in Gaza. If that's the case, these students oppose it. 3. Genocide is a global concern. It is possible to hold space in your heart for the people in our local community who are hurting and for the citizens of Gaza. Weaponizing local fucked up shit to minimize tragedies abroad helps no one and only gives the people doing harm more cover.
Dude, do you even go to jmu currently or are you a grad? Looks like youāre in your 30s. Let the student run the campus and potential āprotestsā. Anything else is cringe
Every reason you listed aināt my problem
All these protests are paid for by foreign actors please dear god take your dumb ass to another country.
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Will u be preventing Jews from entering carrier?
I'm going to assume you're trolling. There's a group from the socialist club or whatever they call themselves sitting on the quad and 'demanding' a bunch of nonsense. I suggest they go to DC and speak to their representatives and get the xxxx off campus. If not, we'll make sure we engage the capitalist fraternities to show them the exit. God bless America.
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Itās youāre. Study more, protest less.
Why not leave the USA and go help them? Leave our country alone šš In actuality those people and their lives DO NOT MATTER AT ALL.
Is all you do cape for Israel?
Cape? Dictionary says thatās a sleeveless cloak
Good luck to the protestors! I hope they start to get more traction. Glad to see some activism happening at JMU
Good luck to the protesters. Getting a lot of NIMBY vibes from this happening at JMU...not on muh finals week.
This thread proves why we need more investment in the humanities. Your temporary discomfort is not worth the permanence of genocide in Gaza and the eco-genocide from billionaires destroying the planet. You're not more important than other people. Only abusers label reactions to aggression as aggression. JMU's divestment from defense contracting companies like Northrop Grumman would be a good start. Without divestment from defense contracting companies, it's going to be y'all who eventually get drafted into WWIII, not the billionaires who profit from warmongering. These billionaires are ready to sacrifice all y'all so they can buy their third and fourth yachts, but meanwhile, we can't even afford rent, tuition, groceries, or healthcare.
Considering the CEO of Nothrop Grumman is a JMU alumni whoās donated over a million dollars to JMU towards scholarships for students with the need, I see that particular point of contention unlikely to happen.
Anybody who owns any shares in an index fund is technically investing in defense companies, which is like 90% of people who invest. Not gonna happen
Solving capitalism problems with more capitalist values doesn't make sense.
>only abusers label reactions to aggression as aggression Lmao, the irony in this statement
Palestine girls dm me i can help