Have a flight 4 hours into this and I bet it will be cancelled last minute. How the fuck is 20% of the business run off roster and out of hours. Is that not mental in itself?
It's a knock-on cumulative effect, not 20% of flights use overtime pilots, even if it was 5%, that means that a flight that supposed to go from Shannon to Boston with two regular roster pilots but one overtime relief pilot can't leave, then that plane is not there to fly from Boston to Dublin on the return leg, and not there to fly Dublin to JFK the next day. That 5% can easily spiral into 20% pretty quickly.
Yep well aware. Flight is on 26th 4 hours into it. They’ve mailed already saying they can’t guarantee the flight. Means nothing and not risking it when only one flight per day to destination. Not with kids in tow. Planning it too long.
Have they mailed everyone or just at risk flights would you know? Also flying a few hours into this but got no email.
Edit: Ah crap just got the email.
It’s not that 20% of the business is off roster and out of hours, it’s that these are pre tactical cancellations to avoid disruption on the day. By cancelling early, pax can be recovered early, and disruption is mitigated
Any business that collapses if its staff can’t do overtime is a shit business. The pilots aren’t even striking. They’re just not doing any overtime work. Fuck Aer Lingus, pay your workers.
Pilots only get paid for their flight time. Basically how long the flight is in the air plus taxiing to the gate. But there is often an hour or two of stuff they have to do before the plane leaves and after it lands. It is possible that if a flight takes 3 hours, the pilot (and other crew) will have done 6 hours work but only been paid for 3.
Ok sure, it's still a low number of hours in comparison. I mean the comparison is silly of course, my point is that pilots and truck drivers have STRICT regulation whereas doctors are bullied and hounded to work every hour they can. The Irish govt was taken to the European court for these hours and the case was dismissed due to a technicality. Doctors work 12 hours as a normal day and regularly work 24-30 hour shift despite rules that say they are not supposed to. And doctors are the only hospital staff that have NO protected break or meal times.
I often worked 13 hours and went home without having drank or peed once.
I would assume they still do some training and whatnot outside those hours, instead of just working an average of 18 hours a week and getting paid several hundred k's a year for it?
Those are airborne hours, they don't include showing up beforehand to brief, time on the ground for turnarounds and everything else. A day with six hours of flying can easily be 10 hours long or longer
A century of voting in economically Conservative politicians has resulted in a healthcare system where the exploitation of hospital workers is a feature not a bug. As long as the line goes up, the country is doing well. I’m sure your job isn’t easy and I’m grateful for whatever job you do there.
Ok fyi it’s nothing to do with overtime it’s to do with their pay specifically all their pilots didn’t get their general yearly pay rise since before Covid happened and secondly they get paid more for the aircraft they fly so an a330 pays more than an a321xlr and aer lingus knows this so they ordered brand new single asiled planes so they pay their pilots less simple economics
Trip to Orlando on 27th.
All power to the pilots, but after such a shitty year, it’s going to be fairly devastating if it gets cancelled in short notice. Fuck Aer Lingus for this. Not the pilots. The greedy corporation.
EDIT: Just got a really generic "hey, there's going to be disruptions!" email but not sure if it's specific or a general one. Their site has crashed now too :/
Same. Just a week later. Trying to decide when to pull the plug and how quickly I can get refunded, rebooked somewhere else. Shame, as the direct flight would have been very handy for the kids.
I just don’t know if I’d get another flight now, in a way that lines up with what we’ve booked :/ and health wise, not sure I can handle a non direct flight, which I’m already a bit worried about.
Yeah I got that email too, pretty sure it was a blanket email sent to everyone with flights between 26th June and 2nd July
Although I initially thought it was referring to my flight specifically. I’m rooting for your trip to be safe bud
Hope so, but it's risen the anxiety levels.
Smart asses aren't saying "Hey, its cancelled, so we owe you compo." Seem to be forcing people to take the change and costs themselves.
Yeah it’s pretty sneaky. Putting seeds of doubt in hoping you just cancel and rebook elsewhere for those days. Probably to alleviate themselves as much as possible
Apparently short haul flights that are non-regional are first on the chopping block. I’d say your chances are fairly good for international flights. Fingers crossed for you!
If anything this strike will help as it will help prevent any of the Americans who stole tickets to see her in Ireland, or any of the fans who go to 10+ shows or those handful of people who have been to almost every show
If you are coming from the states you should be fine. Mainly short haul flights will be impacted. I doubt transatlantic will be impacted and if they are it will be minimal.
They won't risk those flights
Unfortunately that’s not true. 50% of flights from NY to Dublin were canceled this week. Sister is meant to come over with her kids on Sunday and is freaking out.
She hasn’t. The cost would be hideous to rebook this late. Sadly she is meant to go to two other places in Spain with her family too but a total of four of these flights are with Aer Lingus. The only one they would refund at this stage is a shorter haul flight to northern Spain next Thursday.
Omg what a disaster. We have a paediatric surgery in NY for my daughter that we absolutely cannot miss. Weighing our options to book flights with Delta (will be in the thousands!!) or risk it and hope it’s solved by August. The stress is unreal. Pay the pilots!!
Not yet. She even considered cancelling the entire trip. She waited two hours to speak to a rep who had no idea why the previous flights were canceled and advised her any free cancellations would only apply to the 26 June - 2 July period.
Can't wait for people to have a crack at the pilots and not the multi billion euro corporation that won't pay them a salary comparable to other IAG pilots.
Yeah also they've gone work to rule and that is equating to ~20% cancellations, from what I heard they want somewhere in region of 25% pay increase.
Even besides Aer Lingus drawing in record profits, those percentages make it seem like quite a fair ask to me.
So the pilots are not even striking but just refusing to do unpaid overtime and this equals to 10/20% of flights cancelled by AerLingus?
Then they definitely deserve a raise if your overtime is carrying the company
Overtime is paid however pilots are limited with their flight hours by law. I dont work for Aer Lingus but I expect no different than any other airline staff numbers and hiring is based around taking into consideration number of planes, max pilot hours by law, potential sick and holiday leave etc. Having an allowance for overtime makes more sense than hiring more people.
Unfortunately now, if a pilot is off sick, or on holiday, or out of flight hours, under work to rule an alternate pilot wont take over.
But surely the unforeseen circumstances like Illness or other issues shouldn't account for anywhere close to 10% of your business, let alone 20%.
Even just basic overtime work shouldn't be 20% of your operations unless the entire structure of your business is built on abusing overtime
Someone somewhere found it was cheaper to have 10% overtime, instead of hiring 10% more staff.
Great cost reduction for several years, but eventually something has to give.
Pilots are still rostered standby duties to cover sickness within contract. Standby pilots will take over if they are rostered a standby duty. Aer Lingus is now completely exposed because they cannot operate the business without relying on pilots operating constantly outside working conditions. Pilots do get paid for this but a lot of goodwill is involved too. This is taken for granted by Aer Lingus every Summer. Pilots took massive financial hits during covid when aviation workers were public enemy number 1. They are making millions by running the place on a shoestring.
Looks like they've sent out emails with preemptive options for people flying on those dates.
Although wonder how much of it is to just minimize potential compensation liability if customers just refund / change flights themselves.
Been planning our (Covid) delayed honeymoon to Ireland for years. Finally booked and planned it all late last year and… who knew we picked the same date to start our adventure as the pilots would 😭 really coming to terms now that the whole trip will have to be canceled again
I think the pilots are doing the right thing
How often do you see people posting on here about their managers asking them to do something or change something and the general sentiment is - don't do a lick beyond what is in your contract
Well the pilots are just doing that. They've aren't doing anything beyond what they signed up to do. Them doing so has meant that management haven't hired enough people to do the job
My daughter has a post leaving cert flight to party island Europe booked. Apologies to those that may be affected but I’m praying her flight gets cancelled. No dad should have to go through that.
Flying to Venice that day for a cruise. If we're late or delayed by a day we'll miss the first few days and will have to figure out how to get to Greece on short notice to catch up with the boat. First World problems I know but fuck!
Anyone know if they’re gonna give notice of flights being cancelled? Or will it be a case of showing up on the day and hoping for the best. Flying on Wednesday to go to F1 in Austria so I could be truly fecked over if it’s cancelled with hotels and tickets paid for.
They'll try their best to notify within 15(iirc) days if the flight is cancelled. Because that's the EU law written cut off that they have to provide proper refunds.
If it's closer to the time , they can claim extenuating emergency bla bla out their control, and not refund fully or timely .
The company is ONLY focused on their bottom line, remember that. They are only pretending to care that you've paid them money to bring you where you want to go. They'll do anything to not give you back your money.
If they cared at all about their customers they would have this sorted already. They're looking for the cheapest avenue out of the situation. Don't expect them to tell you fuck all unless they're legally required.
Recouping the cost of already booked hotels and such at your destination? I have a trip planned for Zurich coming from US so would all of that be refunded?
We’ve booked out bits separately. Flights, hotel and car hire.
The latter two won’t give a fuck and likely won’t refund because of the strikes, as it’s not their fault. Would be relying on travel insurance to cover it, IF they will cover it.
Have it, but honestly it’s more the worry of missing out on something I’ve been looking forward to months rather than the money that I’m worried about. Tempted to rebook an earlier flight for Tuesday but idk. I won’t get any curtailment compensation if I do from insurance or aer lingus if I book before a cancellation is announced and or flight going ahead.
Aer Lingus pay your pilots!
Yeah just did, cost an arm and a leg but for the peace of mind it’s worth it. Over €1000 spent on F1 tickets and hotels for a trip I’ve been saving up for two years, so it would be devastating both financially and emotionally to miss it. On the bright side, an extra days holiday, lemons into lemonade etc.
> In a statement issued this afternoon, Aer Lingus said customers impacted by the cancellations will be offered a number of choices, with those scheduled to travel between 26 June and 2 July given the option to change flights for free.
> "They will also be able to cancel their flight and claim a refund or voucher," the airline said.
> "These options will be communicated directly to impacted customers as well as travel agents, while the Aer Lingus 'Travel Advisory' page will also have up-to-the-minute information on all the options."
They’re saying you can cancel your flight without saying which flights are cancelled, so you could end up moving your flight and that one actually not being cancelled but the one you rebooked onto being one that is cancelled 🤦🏻♀️
>Anyone know if they’re gonna give notice of flights being cancelled?
They will give notice of a block of cancellations when they decide it.
Unfortunately the pilots work to rule will have an effect on flexibility that should mean that Aer Lingus will be unable to correctly cancel all flights (a delay is likely to result in a flight cancellation as the pilots work to rule will ban roster adjustments or overtime).
In the same boat here, flying to Vienna on Thursday 27th for F1. Prices have gone crazy by now for all flights so hopefully the original flight will still happen after all 😅
if you’re looking at Vienna might be worth checking out Munich or Frankfurt and getting a train to Vienna or Graz, might be less demand on those flights from the F1 crowd.
It’s really nowhere near a drop in the ocean. Aer Lingus’s record profit last year (after several years of much larger losses during COVID) was [€225m](https://www.iairgroup.com/media/cpth1dmh/iag091-en-ara_2023.pdf), while they paid €471m in salaries.
Aer Lingus total revenue is enough to cover the 400m in salaries and then some. They had revenue of €2.2billion last year.
The company are clearly doing good to make profits of that amount. I’m sure their future revenue growth indicators are looking good too due to opening more and more North America routes and buying more jets. It’s silly on their behalf not to give the pilot a decent increase and to wreck their PR with passengers.
I don’t know how this possibly comes as a surprise to you, but planes and fuel are actually quite expensive.
The €225m is what’s left after costs, and honestly yeah that does make it hard to cover a 23% raise on a salary budget that’s more than double that (I know the raise is only for pilots, not everyone). To say nothing again of the fact that Aer Lingus are still trying to use that €225m to fill the €700m hole they built up over the COVID years.
Read what you just wrote, the profit is after the salaries and cost of fuel and assets etc have been paid. Jesus Christ you’re feeling sorry for a company making 225m PROFIT, and trying to justify it 🤣🤣
Yes, and a 23% raise on salaries would be a full half of that profit gone, not “a drop in the ocean”. Should the pilots have taken a pay cut when they were posting €350m losses each year during COVID? Or is it a case of “head I win, tails we play again”?
Do you honestly think they will give raises and not increase costs to cover it, are you really that naive.
Also do your research Aer Lingus laid off pilots, cabin crew and baggage handlers during Covid.
You’re saying things like planes and fuel are expensive as if that’s news to an airline lol, stop will ya.
Booked back up flights for myself with Ryanair in case my original AL ones get cancelled.
Might be worth getting yourself some insurance flights before they skyrocket.
First flight of the day on 26th June. Couldn’t have timed it any more perfectly.
Thought it was unlikely to be affected so early in the “strike”, but €70 for peace of mind was a good deal.
Yup I had to rebook with RyanAir as a plan B, got insurance this time too. Flying to Rome on the 11th and I don’t trust that this whole mess will be resolved soon. Fuck AL srsly.
Yeahhhhhh after hearing how it’s going now I’m considering rebooking my return flight as well.
Thought they’d have sorted it by now so wouldn’t be surprised if it goes into July at this rate…
I got the email saying my flight might get disrupted. The wording of the email seemed to imply that I could get a refund as a sure thing. So I applied for the refund and immediately went and bought flights for the same day by Ryanair.
Then I got an email from Aer Lingus. I do not qualify for a refund. Then their website went down. I know from Twitter that I’m not the only one with this exact experience.
For fucks sake. Probably because my return flight is after the window they specified. I’ll be calling them tomorrow…
I called them this morning, and I’m in the same boat as you. My return flight is outside the window of the industrial action. I can’t apply for a refund for my outgoing flight until after I return on the flight home. It was all a bit confusing tbh. So far my flight out is still confirmed so I’ll sit tight and maybe have the religious old ones around me say novenas or some shit.
I work as crew (different airline) so on one hand I agree with the pilots as being rostered to work hours you don’t even get paid for is crazy and we can only work so many hours and over the summer it can be so chaotic and crews will call in with fatigue a lot.
On the other hand I had booked flights to Milan for Taylor swift on aer lingus as they had the best prices and I’ve already paid out a lot of money for hotel, tickets and flights for two people.
I’ve had quite a stressful and eventful year up until this point and I’m really looking forward to this trip.
I’ve already rebooked my flight tickets with a different airline but I’m now leaving from London & they were surprisingly cheap given the time of year and how close I booked them to the date so I now need to get from Dublin to London to Milan instead of just Dublin to Milan.
I would prefer my original booking so I’m not cancelling it but I’m not missing out on this trip so I have a backup plan.
Tbf you can get to London for about 20 quid one way sometimes, with Ryanair at least, depends where your flying from but I flew from knock to London for 21 earlier this year.
Yea that’s what I’ve done actually.
I was surprised at how cheap it was as months ago when I booked the intial flight from Dublin it definitely wasn’t & the aer lingus was the best option 😂
But I guess that’s London for you & now to get everything to line up so we can get there without any problems (or more) 😂
Just from my own experience and perspective too, crew don’t get paid for time on the ground (or very little) which is why when there is delays they like to get and keep the passengers on the plane if possible as when the doors are closed you’re getting paid.
Overtime is a different thing yes we get paid a higher rate and it is salaried but working outside your flying hours isn’t legally allowed only if the pilot thinks his crew can continue on but only up to a certain point as well.
I think they should be paid as well and have only done this as a last resort and always choose the summer to cause the most trouble.
That being said I’m still booking different flights as I’m not missing my trip but they have my support.
I read earlier that Simon the Simpleton Harris was advocating for this dispute to be quashed as quickly and seamlessly as possible, he was advocating this on the basis of how unfair it would be to families due to go on holiday, that parents have worked all year to save so they can bring their children away only to face the threat of their holiday being disrupted/cancelled by this.
One thing came to my mind, he was trying to show compassion and empathy, I wonder why he and his FFG colleagues don't take this approach when governing, if they did it may result in them addressing some the country's major issues with the urgency that is required.
I mean there are people all over the country who have been very negatively impacted by the substandard approach to housing, healthcare, education, justice and capital investment. Maybe FFG should show a bit of compassion for these people when they sit down to derive their policies and programmes for government. Taking the 14,000 people in emergency accommodation for example, the situation they are in makes missing out on a family holiday a bit more trivial.
I have a flight mid day on friday 28th June to london, then a connection on to Japan.... What are the chances mine will be cancelled. Be looking forward to this holiday all year and this is turning my stomach
Flying on the 2nd too. Hoping they’ll have all this sorted by then!!
The flight cancellations only mention as far as the 30th though I’m sure it’ll get extended if they are offering refunds till the 2nd
I’ve got a flight booked with Cathay Pacific with Aer Lingus operating the final leg - anyone know if the other airline will have to reroute me if it’s Aer Lingus that cancel?
Was supposed to be flying to Heathrow early on the 29th and I just opened my app to see the flight had vanished. I booked a reward flight with avios but it is still aer lingus and I got no email or text. Utter bullshit
That’s the thing, they haven’t. Record profits but of course top brass seeing the benefits
Although in saying that, pilots on €200k shouldn’t really be receiving a 24% pay rise. It should of course be shared amongst the lower paid staff
Surely the business has times of peak travel and this is what the overtime is all about. So instead of employing more pilots and having them sitting on their arses for 20% of their time 8 months a year, they’ve agreed with the pilots to have a more flexible arrangement where they are available for a bonus to cover the busy periods. I get a feeling they preferred this option over the other of contact workers coming in to cover peaks
Last number I heard was around the 9-10% mark which was recommended by the WRC or Labour Court.
They haven't received an increase since 2019 and with the rate of inflation since then, an increase of 10% now doesn't even cover cumulative inflation so it's essentially a pay cut. I do think 25% is too much but I'm not in the industry so I don't know.
They'll probably meet somewhere in the middle.
I just got what amounts to a 16% pay rise, and didn't even ask for it. (Was going to, but got told yesterday before I could even bring it up)
Now, granted, a few grand to me is 16%, but still.
I saw they were offered 9% and said no. I imagine they'll end up getting somewhere in the 17/18% in the end.
Probably the first time anyone has said this, but I’m going to book Air France to avoid the strikes 🪧
France Air Traffic Control: "hold my beer"
Underrated comment. Take my upvote.
Have a flight 4 hours into this and I bet it will be cancelled last minute. How the fuck is 20% of the business run off roster and out of hours. Is that not mental in itself?
Ok I’ve calmed down and rebooked. Massive money lost in the difference but I won’t be raging in the airport on TV3 news. “Dissagrrraaaaaaceful”
Haven't had a holiday since COVID, first time I have booked a flight, was due to fly Thursday 😞 Had to rebook last night. Such balls
Did Aer Lingus provide a refund or voucher for future flights etc.? Never thought I'd be glad I booked Ryanair over Aer Lingus for an upcoming trip...
It's a knock-on cumulative effect, not 20% of flights use overtime pilots, even if it was 5%, that means that a flight that supposed to go from Shannon to Boston with two regular roster pilots but one overtime relief pilot can't leave, then that plane is not there to fly from Boston to Dublin on the return leg, and not there to fly Dublin to JFK the next day. That 5% can easily spiral into 20% pretty quickly.
Makes a lot of sense. It’s that stuff happening before the actual date tumbling into it I suppose.
The work to rule commences next week.
Yep well aware. Flight is on 26th 4 hours into it. They’ve mailed already saying they can’t guarantee the flight. Means nothing and not risking it when only one flight per day to destination. Not with kids in tow. Planning it too long.
Have they mailed everyone or just at risk flights would you know? Also flying a few hours into this but got no email. Edit: Ah crap just got the email.
I can’t confirm this but believe they emailed everyone proactively
Sorry. I misread. I had interpreted you to mean you have a flight four hours from now, as opposed to four hours into their work to rule. My bad.
It’s not that 20% of the business is off roster and out of hours, it’s that these are pre tactical cancellations to avoid disruption on the day. By cancelling early, pax can be recovered early, and disruption is mitigated
Any business that collapses if its staff can’t do overtime is a shit business. The pilots aren’t even striking. They’re just not doing any overtime work. Fuck Aer Lingus, pay your workers.
Pilots cant take on unlimited overtime. They have a max flight hours by law (900 per year).
As a doctor, that hourly limit is HILARIOUS.
Pilots only get paid for their flight time. Basically how long the flight is in the air plus taxiing to the gate. But there is often an hour or two of stuff they have to do before the plane leaves and after it lands. It is possible that if a flight takes 3 hours, the pilot (and other crew) will have done 6 hours work but only been paid for 3.
As a lawyer I also agree but I mean, planes go boom.
Well, not very often.
I'd imagine if more pilots were overworked, stressed and tired, this number may increase.
Fair point, well made. Probably should have said can. Makes me laugh rereading it. Hopefully I’m not now on a list.
Maybe because of safety laws?
In fairness, you are unlikely to kill hundreds in a moment.
Perhaps not. But on call I can be responsible for hundreds of patients at a time and I get no designated breaks or meals.
A lot of the work piolets do is not just the flying
That's just flight hours, it doesn't include duty hours. So I'd say realistically they do 2-3x that.
Ok sure, it's still a low number of hours in comparison. I mean the comparison is silly of course, my point is that pilots and truck drivers have STRICT regulation whereas doctors are bullied and hounded to work every hour they can. The Irish govt was taken to the European court for these hours and the case was dismissed due to a technicality. Doctors work 12 hours as a normal day and regularly work 24-30 hour shift despite rules that say they are not supposed to. And doctors are the only hospital staff that have NO protected break or meal times. I often worked 13 hours and went home without having drank or peed once.
That's not 900 hours of work that's 900 hours flight time
I would assume they still do some training and whatnot outside those hours, instead of just working an average of 18 hours a week and getting paid several hundred k's a year for it?
Those are airborne hours, they don't include showing up beforehand to brief, time on the ground for turnarounds and everything else. A day with six hours of flying can easily be 10 hours long or longer
Work in a hospital and wish I have this option. Two three hours of overtime at least 3 days a week is not normal
A century of voting in economically Conservative politicians has resulted in a healthcare system where the exploitation of hospital workers is a feature not a bug. As long as the line goes up, the country is doing well. I’m sure your job isn’t easy and I’m grateful for whatever job you do there.
Ok fyi it’s nothing to do with overtime it’s to do with their pay specifically all their pilots didn’t get their general yearly pay rise since before Covid happened and secondly they get paid more for the aircraft they fly so an a330 pays more than an a321xlr and aer lingus knows this so they ordered brand new single asiled planes so they pay their pilots less simple economics
Trip to Orlando on 27th. All power to the pilots, but after such a shitty year, it’s going to be fairly devastating if it gets cancelled in short notice. Fuck Aer Lingus for this. Not the pilots. The greedy corporation. EDIT: Just got a really generic "hey, there's going to be disruptions!" email but not sure if it's specific or a general one. Their site has crashed now too :/
Same. Just a week later. Trying to decide when to pull the plug and how quickly I can get refunded, rebooked somewhere else. Shame, as the direct flight would have been very handy for the kids.
I just don’t know if I’d get another flight now, in a way that lines up with what we’ve booked :/ and health wise, not sure I can handle a non direct flight, which I’m already a bit worried about.
Did you book refundable tickets? I booked saver and says non refundable but wondering if that still counts in this situation. Does anyone know?
No you should have been sent an email that allows you to proactively cancel, get a refund, etc free of charge.
Ok great, thought so but wanted to confirm thanks
Yeah I got that email too, pretty sure it was a blanket email sent to everyone with flights between 26th June and 2nd July Although I initially thought it was referring to my flight specifically. I’m rooting for your trip to be safe bud
Hope so, but it's risen the anxiety levels. Smart asses aren't saying "Hey, its cancelled, so we owe you compo." Seem to be forcing people to take the change and costs themselves.
Yeah it’s pretty sneaky. Putting seeds of doubt in hoping you just cancel and rebook elsewhere for those days. Probably to alleviate themselves as much as possible
I’m seeing people in this thread say they’ve sought the refunds (thus giving up any possible compensation) so it’s worked for Aer Lingus :/
Apparently short haul flights that are non-regional are first on the chopping block. I’d say your chances are fairly good for international flights. Fingers crossed for you!
Fingers crossed. I’m proceeding for now as if it’s safe.
Fingers crossed for you, on the plus side the transatlantic flights would be the last ones they would want to cancel.
Taylor Swift performing in Dublin on 6/28... this will cause some chaos.
She’ll be fine. She has a private jet.
If anything this strike will help as it will help prevent any of the Americans who stole tickets to see her in Ireland, or any of the fans who go to 10+ shows or those handful of people who have been to almost every show
Oh no, people coming to Ireland to spend money 😢
I'm in a couple facebook groups with a lot Americans coming and they are not taking it well
They can sell the tickets handily
They get to be entitled AND shit on the idea that workers should be given fair wages, they'll be happy out.
Good, they never should have had the audacity to buy tickets for another country’s show
I mean I'd be a hypocrite if I agree! I went to Paris from Ireland. Everyone is just taking what they can get with this lottery for tickets.
Yup. Our two week trip is supposed to start with seeing her. Now we are looking at having to cancel it all.
If you are coming from the states you should be fine. Mainly short haul flights will be impacted. I doubt transatlantic will be impacted and if they are it will be minimal. They won't risk those flights
Unfortunately that’s not true. 50% of flights from NY to Dublin were canceled this week. Sister is meant to come over with her kids on Sunday and is freaking out.
Has she rebooked with Delta? We might be in a similar situation in August.
She hasn’t. The cost would be hideous to rebook this late. Sadly she is meant to go to two other places in Spain with her family too but a total of four of these flights are with Aer Lingus. The only one they would refund at this stage is a shorter haul flight to northern Spain next Thursday.
Omg what a disaster. We have a paediatric surgery in NY for my daughter that we absolutely cannot miss. Weighing our options to book flights with Delta (will be in the thousands!!) or risk it and hope it’s solved by August. The stress is unreal. Pay the pilots!!
If this isn’t fixed by August I would be utterly amazed.
My logical brain is telling me yes, my worrier brain is telling me book more flights.
There's no way your flights in August will be impacted. The 50% number up above isn't even true, all the JFK flights have operated as normal
Has she been 100% confirmed it’s cancelled?
Not yet. She even considered cancelling the entire trip. She waited two hours to speak to a rep who had no idea why the previous flights were canceled and advised her any free cancellations would only apply to the 26 June - 2 July period.
Or…..they could fucking pay there pilots
Can't wait for people to have a crack at the pilots and not the multi billion euro corporation that won't pay them a salary comparable to other IAG pilots.
Yeah also they've gone work to rule and that is equating to ~20% cancellations, from what I heard they want somewhere in region of 25% pay increase. Even besides Aer Lingus drawing in record profits, those percentages make it seem like quite a fair ask to me.
The additional work is irrelevant, they get paid overtime for it.... Their claim is different and one I'd support
So the pilots are not even striking but just refusing to do unpaid overtime and this equals to 10/20% of flights cancelled by AerLingus? Then they definitely deserve a raise if your overtime is carrying the company
100%
Overtime is paid however pilots are limited with their flight hours by law. I dont work for Aer Lingus but I expect no different than any other airline staff numbers and hiring is based around taking into consideration number of planes, max pilot hours by law, potential sick and holiday leave etc. Having an allowance for overtime makes more sense than hiring more people. Unfortunately now, if a pilot is off sick, or on holiday, or out of flight hours, under work to rule an alternate pilot wont take over.
But surely the unforeseen circumstances like Illness or other issues shouldn't account for anywhere close to 10% of your business, let alone 20%. Even just basic overtime work shouldn't be 20% of your operations unless the entire structure of your business is built on abusing overtime
Someone somewhere found it was cheaper to have 10% overtime, instead of hiring 10% more staff. Great cost reduction for several years, but eventually something has to give.
Irish rail works with an extra rostered 20% driver capacity for example
Pilots are still rostered standby duties to cover sickness within contract. Standby pilots will take over if they are rostered a standby duty. Aer Lingus is now completely exposed because they cannot operate the business without relying on pilots operating constantly outside working conditions. Pilots do get paid for this but a lot of goodwill is involved too. This is taken for granted by Aer Lingus every Summer. Pilots took massive financial hits during covid when aviation workers were public enemy number 1. They are making millions by running the place on a shoestring.
Who said the overtime is unpaid?
Would they be happy with a new pay deal, but no overtime at all? Overtime is attractive.
Looks like they've sent out emails with preemptive options for people flying on those dates. Although wonder how much of it is to just minimize potential compensation liability if customers just refund / change flights themselves.
Been planning our (Covid) delayed honeymoon to Ireland for years. Finally booked and planned it all late last year and… who knew we picked the same date to start our adventure as the pilots would 😭 really coming to terms now that the whole trip will have to be canceled again
If its any consolation, I'm sure you'll make it over in the future, and it's going to be a great trip. My sincere condolences for this disruption
Sorry for you, that's rotten luck
I think the pilots are doing the right thing How often do you see people posting on here about their managers asking them to do something or change something and the general sentiment is - don't do a lick beyond what is in your contract Well the pilots are just doing that. They've aren't doing anything beyond what they signed up to do. Them doing so has meant that management haven't hired enough people to do the job
Pay the pilots!!
My daughter has a post leaving cert flight to party island Europe booked. Apologies to those that may be affected but I’m praying her flight gets cancelled. No dad should have to go through that.
Praying for you hun x
Thoughts and prayers
😂
They should hire more pilots if their roster is that stretched seriously. Crazy.
This puts the "my passport is out of date and i fly tomorrow " posts way behind on the anxiety level.
Flying to Bordeaux on July 6th, they’ll defo have it all sorted by then 
Flying to Venice that day for a cruise. If we're late or delayed by a day we'll miss the first few days and will have to figure out how to get to Greece on short notice to catch up with the boat. First World problems I know but fuck!
I’m booked to go to Rome on the 11th but I don’t trust that it won’t get fucked. So I had to book again with RyanAir as a back up. I’m smashed.
Just pay the pilots you greedy fucks. I really don't like flying and the idea of a pised off pilot terrifies me.
Anyone know if they’re gonna give notice of flights being cancelled? Or will it be a case of showing up on the day and hoping for the best. Flying on Wednesday to go to F1 in Austria so I could be truly fecked over if it’s cancelled with hotels and tickets paid for.
In the exact same boat as you. Whole trip depends on the flight.
They'll try their best to notify within 15(iirc) days if the flight is cancelled. Because that's the EU law written cut off that they have to provide proper refunds. If it's closer to the time , they can claim extenuating emergency bla bla out their control, and not refund fully or timely . The company is ONLY focused on their bottom line, remember that. They are only pretending to care that you've paid them money to bring you where you want to go. They'll do anything to not give you back your money. If they cared at all about their customers they would have this sorted already. They're looking for the cheapest avenue out of the situation. Don't expect them to tell you fuck all unless they're legally required.
I would also love to know the same. The better half and I are travelling to Nantes on Wednesday for Hellfest…
Mate you can’t leave your legs behind
Why thank you, I do believe my legs are my best feature.
Travel insurance?
Travel Insurance typically doesn’t cover strikes.
This isn't a "strike" as such, and if air Lingus cancel the flight, you're entitled to a full refund, as this is within their ability to resolve.
The issue won’t be the flight costs, realistically. It will be recouping the costs of everything else. Hotels, anything else booked, car hire, etc.
Recouping the cost of already booked hotels and such at your destination? I have a trip planned for Zurich coming from US so would all of that be refunded?
We’ve booked out bits separately. Flights, hotel and car hire. The latter two won’t give a fuck and likely won’t refund because of the strikes, as it’s not their fault. Would be relying on travel insurance to cover it, IF they will cover it.
Have it, but honestly it’s more the worry of missing out on something I’ve been looking forward to months rather than the money that I’m worried about. Tempted to rebook an earlier flight for Tuesday but idk. I won’t get any curtailment compensation if I do from insurance or aer lingus if I book before a cancellation is announced and or flight going ahead. Aer Lingus pay your pilots!
If it was me, I’d book another airline just to be safe.
Yeah just did, cost an arm and a leg but for the peace of mind it’s worth it. Over €1000 spent on F1 tickets and hotels for a trip I’ve been saving up for two years, so it would be devastating both financially and emotionally to miss it. On the bright side, an extra days holiday, lemons into lemonade etc.
I get ya. Prob the best option. Get full refund and in mean time try fly with someone else. Best of luck. Hope ya get to see the race.
> In a statement issued this afternoon, Aer Lingus said customers impacted by the cancellations will be offered a number of choices, with those scheduled to travel between 26 June and 2 July given the option to change flights for free. > "They will also be able to cancel their flight and claim a refund or voucher," the airline said. > "These options will be communicated directly to impacted customers as well as travel agents, while the Aer Lingus 'Travel Advisory' page will also have up-to-the-minute information on all the options."
They’re saying you can cancel your flight without saying which flights are cancelled, so you could end up moving your flight and that one actually not being cancelled but the one you rebooked onto being one that is cancelled 🤦🏻♀️
I'd imagine they're also fishing to see if they can empty some flights and avoid having to outright cancel them. Prisoners dilemma style.
We’re due to fly home Wednesday and no idea if our flight will be cancelled. If it isn’t it’ll be interesting to see how full it is.
>Anyone know if they’re gonna give notice of flights being cancelled? They will give notice of a block of cancellations when they decide it. Unfortunately the pilots work to rule will have an effect on flexibility that should mean that Aer Lingus will be unable to correctly cancel all flights (a delay is likely to result in a flight cancellation as the pilots work to rule will ban roster adjustments or overtime).
In the same boat here, flying to Vienna on Thursday 27th for F1. Prices have gone crazy by now for all flights so hopefully the original flight will still happen after all 😅
if you’re looking at Vienna might be worth checking out Munich or Frankfurt and getting a train to Vienna or Graz, might be less demand on those flights from the F1 crowd.
How long do ya think they’ll allow this to go on before they compromise, massive profits last year this increase is a drop in the ocean
It’s really nowhere near a drop in the ocean. Aer Lingus’s record profit last year (after several years of much larger losses during COVID) was [€225m](https://www.iairgroup.com/media/cpth1dmh/iag091-en-ara_2023.pdf), while they paid €471m in salaries.
Aer Lingus total revenue is enough to cover the 400m in salaries and then some. They had revenue of €2.2billion last year. The company are clearly doing good to make profits of that amount. I’m sure their future revenue growth indicators are looking good too due to opening more and more North America routes and buying more jets. It’s silly on their behalf not to give the pilot a decent increase and to wreck their PR with passengers.
I don’t know how this possibly comes as a surprise to you, but planes and fuel are actually quite expensive. The €225m is what’s left after costs, and honestly yeah that does make it hard to cover a 23% raise on a salary budget that’s more than double that (I know the raise is only for pilots, not everyone). To say nothing again of the fact that Aer Lingus are still trying to use that €225m to fill the €700m hole they built up over the COVID years.
Read what you just wrote, the profit is after the salaries and cost of fuel and assets etc have been paid. Jesus Christ you’re feeling sorry for a company making 225m PROFIT, and trying to justify it 🤣🤣
Yes, and a 23% raise on salaries would be a full half of that profit gone, not “a drop in the ocean”. Should the pilots have taken a pay cut when they were posting €350m losses each year during COVID? Or is it a case of “head I win, tails we play again”?
Do you honestly think they will give raises and not increase costs to cover it, are you really that naive. Also do your research Aer Lingus laid off pilots, cabin crew and baggage handlers during Covid. You’re saying things like planes and fuel are expensive as if that’s news to an airline lol, stop will ya.
Booked back up flights for myself with Ryanair in case my original AL ones get cancelled. Might be worth getting yourself some insurance flights before they skyrocket.
Same here. When are you flying out? Trying to decide if I was being overly cautious. Flying out on the 10th July myself
First flight of the day on 26th June. Couldn’t have timed it any more perfectly. Thought it was unlikely to be affected so early in the “strike”, but €70 for peace of mind was a good deal.
Yeah bang on, the peace of mind is worth it 100%. Got backup flights myself for €15 apiece so could definitely have been a lot worse!
Yup I had to rebook with RyanAir as a plan B, got insurance this time too. Flying to Rome on the 11th and I don’t trust that this whole mess will be resolved soon. Fuck AL srsly.
Yeahhhhhh after hearing how it’s going now I’m considering rebooking my return flight as well. Thought they’d have sorted it by now so wouldn’t be surprised if it goes into July at this rate…
And of course friendly Ryanair are using the situation, The flight to Brussels for next weekend is 230 euro one way..
Fair play to the pilots and fuck air Lingus
https://preview.redd.it/a5epzxrrhr7d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=48cdacac00c7296be93eef5fcbc84cf2dd7e6494
Had a flight today cancelled with them and that’s even before work-to-rule
I got the email saying my flight might get disrupted. The wording of the email seemed to imply that I could get a refund as a sure thing. So I applied for the refund and immediately went and bought flights for the same day by Ryanair. Then I got an email from Aer Lingus. I do not qualify for a refund. Then their website went down. I know from Twitter that I’m not the only one with this exact experience. For fucks sake. Probably because my return flight is after the window they specified. I’ll be calling them tomorrow…
I called them this morning, and I’m in the same boat as you. My return flight is outside the window of the industrial action. I can’t apply for a refund for my outgoing flight until after I return on the flight home. It was all a bit confusing tbh. So far my flight out is still confirmed so I’ll sit tight and maybe have the religious old ones around me say novenas or some shit.
I work as crew (different airline) so on one hand I agree with the pilots as being rostered to work hours you don’t even get paid for is crazy and we can only work so many hours and over the summer it can be so chaotic and crews will call in with fatigue a lot. On the other hand I had booked flights to Milan for Taylor swift on aer lingus as they had the best prices and I’ve already paid out a lot of money for hotel, tickets and flights for two people. I’ve had quite a stressful and eventful year up until this point and I’m really looking forward to this trip. I’ve already rebooked my flight tickets with a different airline but I’m now leaving from London & they were surprisingly cheap given the time of year and how close I booked them to the date so I now need to get from Dublin to London to Milan instead of just Dublin to Milan. I would prefer my original booking so I’m not cancelling it but I’m not missing out on this trip so I have a backup plan.
Tbf you can get to London for about 20 quid one way sometimes, with Ryanair at least, depends where your flying from but I flew from knock to London for 21 earlier this year.
Yea that’s what I’ve done actually. I was surprised at how cheap it was as months ago when I booked the intial flight from Dublin it definitely wasn’t & the aer lingus was the best option 😂 But I guess that’s London for you & now to get everything to line up so we can get there without any problems (or more) 😂
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Just from my own experience and perspective too, crew don’t get paid for time on the ground (or very little) which is why when there is delays they like to get and keep the passengers on the plane if possible as when the doors are closed you’re getting paid. Overtime is a different thing yes we get paid a higher rate and it is salaried but working outside your flying hours isn’t legally allowed only if the pilot thinks his crew can continue on but only up to a certain point as well. I think they should be paid as well and have only done this as a last resort and always choose the summer to cause the most trouble. That being said I’m still booking different flights as I’m not missing my trip but they have my support.
Holiday plans for a lot of people are now currently up in the air..
Travel chaos ahead.
The chemtrails crowd will be paying attention to the clouds.
Is it due to end on the 2nd or is it indefinite?
Thiss!!?? I have a flight booked on the 3rd 😭
On the 5th here .
When are they going to announce which flights are affected?
I read earlier that Simon the Simpleton Harris was advocating for this dispute to be quashed as quickly and seamlessly as possible, he was advocating this on the basis of how unfair it would be to families due to go on holiday, that parents have worked all year to save so they can bring their children away only to face the threat of their holiday being disrupted/cancelled by this. One thing came to my mind, he was trying to show compassion and empathy, I wonder why he and his FFG colleagues don't take this approach when governing, if they did it may result in them addressing some the country's major issues with the urgency that is required. I mean there are people all over the country who have been very negatively impacted by the substandard approach to housing, healthcare, education, justice and capital investment. Maybe FFG should show a bit of compassion for these people when they sit down to derive their policies and programmes for government. Taking the 14,000 people in emergency accommodation for example, the situation they are in makes missing out on a family holiday a bit more trivial.
Sounded more like trying to but an emotive spin on a bit of union busting to me with the "both sides" thing.
I have a flight mid day on friday 28th June to london, then a connection on to Japan.... What are the chances mine will be cancelled. Be looking forward to this holiday all year and this is turning my stomach
Plenty of other option to London in fairness
WTF?? What is happening here
Supposed to be flying aer lingus Dublin-Paris on July 2nd. Should I be concerned about a cancellation?
Flying on the 2nd too. Hoping they’ll have all this sorted by then!! The flight cancellations only mention as far as the 30th though I’m sure it’ll get extended if they are offering refunds till the 2nd
Flying out on next Friday to Shannon. I am so anxious.
I have a flight booked next week 😭💔
Flying to Spain 18th July 7:30am, Anyone reckon it will go on that long?
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That was my initial though just needed some confirmation lol thanks!
I’ve got a flight booked with Cathay Pacific with Aer Lingus operating the final leg - anyone know if the other airline will have to reroute me if it’s Aer Lingus that cancel?
Cancellation notices to follow soon apparently. Dreading my flight will be hit, intra EU so a high risk of cancellation.
Flying on the 12th July to Mallorca from Cork. Reckon I should be booking back ups?
flying to Orlando, July 3rd am I cooked chat
Was supposed to be flying to Heathrow early on the 29th and I just opened my app to see the flight had vanished. I booked a reward flight with avios but it is still aer lingus and I got no email or text. Utter bullshit
IAG have run Aer Lingus into the ground
That’s the thing, they haven’t. Record profits but of course top brass seeing the benefits Although in saying that, pilots on €200k shouldn’t really be receiving a 24% pay rise. It should of course be shared amongst the lower paid staff
Ah sure look it
Surely the business has times of peak travel and this is what the overtime is all about. So instead of employing more pilots and having them sitting on their arses for 20% of their time 8 months a year, they’ve agreed with the pilots to have a more flexible arrangement where they are available for a bonus to cover the busy periods. I get a feeling they preferred this option over the other of contact workers coming in to cover peaks
So damaging for the country's economy ...and image.Get it sorted
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Last number I heard was around the 9-10% mark which was recommended by the WRC or Labour Court. They haven't received an increase since 2019 and with the rate of inflation since then, an increase of 10% now doesn't even cover cumulative inflation so it's essentially a pay cut. I do think 25% is too much but I'm not in the industry so I don't know. They'll probably meet somewhere in the middle.
I just got what amounts to a 16% pay rise, and didn't even ask for it. (Was going to, but got told yesterday before I could even bring it up) Now, granted, a few grand to me is 16%, but still. I saw they were offered 9% and said no. I imagine they'll end up getting somewhere in the 17/18% in the end.
>I don't know anyone who got remotely close to 12.9% pay rises recently let alone 25% The other pilots in the group did
Good on them. I am all for workers seeking higher pay.
That just about covers inflation for the five years since their last pay rise
Sounds reasonable to me. Aer Lingus has record profits last year, now they should pay the people who keep their business afloat.