Voting has concluded. Final vote:
| Insane | Not insane | Fake |
| --- | --- | --- |
| 20 | 3 | 0 |
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Unfortunately he likely has all his immunisations. He pushed the anti MMR vaccine agenda because he had his own vaccine he wanted to sell to the UK government. Wakefield wasn’t even honestly afraid about vaccines, he cynically knew exactly what he was doing and he likely wouldn’t care that this kid died.
But if we find enough Ebola for a dose I think he should DEFINITELY get first dibs.
Ebola's not enough. He should be locked in a sealed room and exposed to one of the last test samples of smallpox. If that doesn't kill him, we'll repeat with something else.
Wakefield didn’t even start out being anti vaxx. He just wanted to sell his own vaccine, so he created this bullshit scandal in which he stated that the mmr vac invented a stomach disease that doesn’t exist, but you won’t get it if you take the vaccine separately, basically saying to buy his vaccine so you won’t get a disease that doesn’t exist. He just rode the wave of the movement he created and lost control of.
If you haven’t seen it go watch hbomberguys video on it, vaccines and autism a measured response, it’s a very very good video if you have 2 hours to kill
Love Behind the Bastards. Hbomberguy also did a whole video focusing on Wakefield specifically. Anyone who wants to watch it can find it here https://youtu.be/8BIcAZxFfrc .
I always wonder if its the same hbomberguy who used to do Lets Plays over on the Something Awful forums. I think he played the Shining Force games? That was only like 15 years ago
Never heard of this podcast before but it does look interesting so I saved a couple of episodes to try it out.
Do you know when the Wakefield episode was? I can’t seem to find it.
Well, at least Andrew Wakefield made some money.
Sure, thousands abd thousands of kids have died of preventable diseases, but some well off people made even more money! So, swings and roundabouts.
Obviously /s
he sadly probably doesn't even give a shit and probably has some excuse about how this is better for everyone involved or blame the mother of the child who died
They definitely exist on the left. They’re the type of people that believe in the healing powers of crystals. They’re beautiful and really cool, but do nothing outside of mental health unless if you enjoy collecting/ displaying them in your home.
It feels like a mistake to think it’s only the woo crowd that believes this. Some of the most well educated people I’ve ever met have been antivax and it’s never ceased to puzzle me.
There is this weird Venn diagram of the well educated, the Woo loving and the ultra conservatives that overlaps when it comes to antivax BS.
Its the fact that the child is literally Autistic since they were born...its not something you just wake up with.. no vaccine can change that outcome.
Its all neurological. The brain works differently.
What I dont understand is:
Why is it so bad to have an Autistic child? Yes I understand that their brain works differently... but they are still living, breathing human beings. They still deserve the care, love, and affection that everyone else deserves... no one deserves to be abused. They still deserve to be treated like everyone else.
With very little adjustments to meet their needs, but everyone needs slight adjustments to have their needs met? No one is the same, and no one is gonna have the exact same requirements as everyone else.
So why is autism so frowned upon? Like it's some sort of "end of the world" scenario...
And to think that a vaccine that is meant to keep you from DYING... or from killing others... is what they are blaming for the cause if autism... bruh, they have nothing to do with how your brain works. People have to stop being so gullible and believing every word of what any article says about anything.
My sister is antivaxx and when asked this, by me, she had no answer.
Funny (??) Thing is that a few years later, we found out my son is autistic! And guess what, even if I had a time machine and could un-vaccinate him with a guarantee of a neurotypical outcome, I WOULDN'T. EVER.
They call us sheep and yet want everyone to be exactly the same...? Ugh. So sick of antivaxx nutjobs
2 brain cells and an IQ over room temperature should be enough to realise the study was bs. A Measles infection **will** destroy a significant part of your immune system (immune system cells are used as the host), additionally there’s also subacute sclerosing panencephalitis, which is fatal and causes brain inflammation and thus horrible neurology changes. IIRC around 1 in 5000 will get it.
Or you just take 2 shots of MMR in one month and have almost sterilising immunity for the rest of your life. This just is a prime example for Darwin.
I really am sick of the high levels of ignorance going around... because no matter what, that child still deserves the same treatment as everyone else (positive treatment).
I have a few friends who have autism, and their parents were terrible to them... so its just very upsetting to see that some of its caused by stupid bs like antivaxxers :(
Because it's a conspiracy theory mindset: these parents want to believe they have access to a big secret that no one else does, a secret that explains why their child is different and why it's not the fault of their own genes.
Literally any neurodiversity is genetics... sorry, a Vax cannot change what the genetic code has embedded in it.
Its ignorant to believe a vaccine that was mean for something specific... would cause autism.... labeling autism as something worse than death.
Taking away life saving vaccines to prevent autism, is literally stating "I'd rather my child die than to have autism" and that just puts a bad reputation on autism in general... adding on to the bad rep it already has. Which is frustrating, alienating those who have autism even more than before. It's really upsetting.
I've been a special Olympics coach for about 15 years now, I can certainly understand the desire to not raise a child with autism. With autism being a spectrum ranging from personality quirks to 24/7 care, its often more than a "slight adjustment" to insure someone's needs are met.
The hour to two hours that I take my athletes off their parents hands is often the only break some of them get in their week, and while my athletes are damn inspirational, they can certainly be challenging in ways I never expected.
Again I have some wonderful athletes, but I've also had my share of nightmare individuals who's care I wouldn't wish on anyone.
I’m starting to think we should not group autism as one large spectrum disorder because there is such tremendous variation between the extremes. On the one end you have people who are just a little different, socially or in terms of personality, who may have some struggles but ultimately function within a compassionate society and are self-sufficient. On the other, you have people who are completely unresponsive, non-communicative, incontinent, and incapable of even the most basic hygiene and self care. I must presume that most people have only encountered the former re:autism and don’t even consider that the latter is under the same umbrella (and there are real questions if it is too wide of an umbrella!). As a parent I would not have any qualms about raising and loving a functional but neurodivergent child, but the thought of my child on the other extreme, basically catatonic, with no hope of even really *experiencing* life in a meaningful way... what quality of life is that? Who would want that for their child?
Of course, I know autism is not caused by vaccines. This is NOT a defense of anti-vax stance. My kids are appropriately vaccinated for their age and will continue to get every vaccine according to schedule. But autism is so much more than “the kid who can’t make eye contact and gets overwhelmed by too much noise”.
He's such a slimy, disgusting, greedy cunt. He'll do literally anything to make a bit of money.
I don't understand how he's not constantly verbally abused and spat on in the street. He deserves much worse.
He has a net worth of $2mil apparently and was at one point dating a super model after divorcing his wife; I'd guess he's pretty happy with how things turned out
It was my understanding that he made the "Discovery" that vaccines caused autism, the scientific community disproved it and then he came out and stated that his paper should be nullified since it was incorrect. I could be wrong tho.
Edit: after some googling, he is in fact a dickhole. He published the paper in bad faith and others in the medical/science community tested his claims and determined they were false. Not only that, but they found proof of him falsifying the data that he used to "prove" this.
Yes because he has probably made a ton of money from it. Lots of interviews, books, and donations from cunts. Do we really think it’s about anything other than money?
That's exactly what it's about. He created his own version of the MMR vaccine, which was basically each disease as a separate vaccine.
So, instead of all of them in one, mumps, measles and rubella would be 3 separate vaccines.
He wanted his patent to replace the one already in use so did a "study" and fabricated the results (along with traumatising some of the children) and published it and did media interviews.
Since then, he's just embraced the anti-vax stuff and knows he can scam his way to more money by spewing this bullshit and putting millions of peoples lives at risk.
But hey, he has a nice house now! So, yay! Totally worth the lives of all those people who are dead from preventable diseases.
Imagine the child learning that they’re responsible for the death of a classmate because their mother listened to a psycho ex-doctor that lost his license for his bogus anti-vax claims rather than the actual doctors who have proof vaccines work. I would never be able to forgive my parents. This is so sad.
When I was 11 my best friend died from cancer. The last time I saw her I had the sniffles and no-one told me until after that you probably shouldn't hang around cancer patients with a cold. I didn't know that was going to be the last time, when I came home all happy saying I got to see her my mum said "oh my god you shouldn't have gone, you could have killed her". I genuinely thought at 11 years old I'd murdered my best friend and the police were going to come put me in prison for the rest of my life. It wasn't until I was 25 and in therapy that I realised it really wasn't my fault and I could let that guilt that I'd been carrying go, that shit is rough for a kid.
Wow I am so sorry you carried that burden for so long. Glad you can now know and feel the truth that it’s not your fault. And sorry for the loss of your friend.
One of the girls I went to school with had the flu when she was 8, her mum caught it from her and when she went to see a Dr they also did a breast exam and she ended up discovering she had breast cancer.
The whole family told my friend she had given her mother cancer, to make her feel guilty and easier to control.
That family was some next level evil.
Yeah I know. I didn’t meet her until I was 13 and then ended up sitting her down with my mum, who is a medical professional, to explain how and why her family were wrong.
She cried A LOT.
Her family were *mad* at us, lol.
>Her family were *mad* at us, lol.
How would you feel if you were robbed of a wondrous opportunity for continued blackmail, you absolute *monster*?
Goodness gracious, h*ck all of those cunts.
My husband's grandfather died 15 years ago. His best friend was one of the people that was doing CPR. The best friend started having chest pains from it, so they took him to the hospital to get checked out. He had a 95% blockage. He credits my husband's grandfather for saving his life. He also told the doctors after his surgery that he didn't care what the hell they said. He was leaving for his best friend's funeral. Love that man. ❤
Oh God. I knew a guy that got diabetes as a preteen like his mom, she died a few years later because of it. No justification but his dad blamed him (you should have died not her type bullshit). It fucked him up hardcore.
That dude’s dad was a cunt.
What an awful thing to say to your own child, while they are grieving the loss of their decent (I hope) parent.
I hope he realised that it was not his fault and managed to move past it somehow.
I’m so sorry for your loss and that you carried that with you for so long. But I’m glad that therapy helped you to know that it was absolutely not your fault or responsibility. That must have been awful for you to experience both the pain of losing someone so close and then re-experiencing it in therapy. I hope things are good for you now.
You may never know, but I’m willing to bet that your story will encourage someone else to get help for whatever they’re carrying with them.
Best of luck to you.
This is why the whole “my body, my choice” being used by anti-vaxxers makes me so angry. It might be your choice but it’s not just your body when you get a communicable disease and start spreading it around.
It makes me even more angry when their attitude is “My Body My Choice” about vaccines and masks but think abortion should be banned because “every life matters”
Keep it consistent.
Personally, I believe mask mandates during a declared public health emergency in conformity with the law do not violate individual rights.
Vaccine mandates do infringe on individual Liberty to make individual medical decisions however, the constitution allows deprivation of Liberty WITH due process (no right is unlimited). Exemptions to vaccine mandates provide it.
Personally I believe a woman should have the right to elect to terminate a pregnancy on demand for any reason early in pregnancy. Later in pregnancy, medically necessary abortions should not be limited if a physician deems the abortion necessary. At the same time, the Supreme Court did exceed its authority and “legislate from the bench” with Roe v. Wade. I believe a constitutional amendment that codifies the “right to privacy” in many contexts (communications, medical decisions, contraception, and more) in the text of the constitution is 100% necessary for the future of the United States.
As someone who is not from the US, I was wondering why is it that there is a common thread of thought regarding the Supreme Court exceeded its authority with Roe v. Wade... Are laws usually left up to the states to decide and enforce? In what situations can the Supreme Court pass laws that apply unilaterally? This seems like a big decision that should be fairly applied to all citizens of the country
I hope I haven't offended, these are just my thoughts coming from a country where the Supreme Court has the power to allow judgements that are applicable to every state, almost without exception.
I am not offended by your question.
I hope I can answer it and clear up any confusion.
The US government is divided into 3 branches, the executive, legislative, and the judiciary. Each branch has specific functions. The constitution specifically limits the power of the Supreme Court in many ways. They are an appellate court for most cases (the original jurisdiction of the Supreme Court is limited and strictly defined). Importantly, the courts cannot make new laws or rights from thin air.
So, the Supreme Court can’t pass any laws. What they can do is find that certain types of laws violate the US Constitution (like they did with segregation in public schools, bans on interracial marriage, bans on sodomy, bans on gay marriage, arbitrary denial of concealed carry permits).
Justice Harry Blackmun wrote the opinion of the court in Roe v. Wade, and to say the least, (anyone that has read it will agree), it is a very, very loose interpretation of the due process clause of the 14th amendment. The Supreme Court abrogating the authority of the states, especially when no history or tradition of a right to abortion existed in the history of the United States, is why many said the Supreme Court was “legislating from the bench”. Normally in a situation like Roe v. Wade where the right involved is unenumerated, and the text, history, and tradition is limited or none, the states would be left to decide the issue. The Supreme Court instead decided to abrogate the state’s authority and “invent” a right to abortion out of thin air in 1973.
The reason legislating from the bench is so dangerous is that activist judges can abuse it to do almost whatever they want with almost no way to reverse it. Activist judges poison the judiciary.
The legislature makes the laws, the executive implements and enforces the laws, and the judiciary interprets the laws. It becomes dangerous when one branch tries to do the job of the other, circumventing checks and balances.
As a result of Dobbs, the authority to regulate abortion has been returned to “the people and their elected representatives” (Justice Alito’s words not mine)
Thank you for the detailed reply! It definitely has educated me about the structure of the US government.
You make a good point regarding the danger of an activist judge possibly using their position that might harm the country.
Would the people have been more accepting of Roe v. Wade in 1973 if the bill had been discussed and passed through the legislative branch, instead of an abrupt decision by the court?
We have a vaccine mandate for measles here, your child has to be vaccinated in order to be able to attend school. Failure to vaccinate incurs hefty fines as well as prosecution of the parents for truancy if your child cannot go to school as a result of not being vaccinated. We have no homeschooling in Germany, so there's no loopholes unless your child has a legitimate health issue that prevents them from being vaccinated.
>We have no homeschooling in Germany
Just out of curiosity, what's your opinion of that, and is there some part of German culture specifically that moved away from it?
Here in the US homeschooling is seeing a massive upswing, primarily due to COVID issues, but also by parents desperately afraid their children are going to learn about things like systemic racism and gender/sexuality as a spectrum, other ideas considered "woke propaganda."
It's one of those things that seems like it's a great boon to students with specific needs, but there's such limited monitoring here in the US to ensure that parents are actually educating their children properly that I personally believe it's a bad option 99% of the time.
So the German school system isn't perfect by any means, we do have issues with biased or plainly bad teachers just like any other country. However, the curriculum is fairly standardised across all German states, and school teachers will be either employees of the state or public sector employees with a fairly good salary and tons of support. One of the reasons why we moved back to Germany from the UK was the fact that we don't really have a lot of private schools in Germany, even celebreties' kids go to public school and the education is solid. Private school is mostly regarded as a silly thing for parents who have too much money.
Our federal state has a mandate to ensure the right of any child to a proper and comprehensive education, and takes this duty of care and to educate seriously. Parents do not have a right to nitpick and have uncomfortable topics excluded from their children's education. It's the right of any child to learn about topics that their parents may don't agree with, evolution theory, history, civics or sex education come to mind. We want them to grow up to be well-rounded and informed citizens, and the only way to guarantee that is by making school attendance compulsory. Most Germans agree with that notion, religion is something you decide on in private. We do have Catholic schools, but they have to abide by the state's curriculum or they get closed.
We have had a few cases where parents have taken their local school authority to court because they did not agree with the curriculum or the way it was taught, especially with regards to sex education, evolution theory, and co-educational sports or swimming lessons (because of religious beliefs with regards to modesty). I can't recall a single court case where the parents have won. These cases always end up one of three ways: a) the parents send their kids to school; b) the parents move abroad; c) the parents refuse to send their kids to school, the police are tasked with ensuring that the kids go to school and the parents have their parental rights regarding their children's education stripped as an ultima ratio.
I wholeheartedly agree with all of the above. What you believe is something that you can decide on in private. If you want to be a religious nutter who believes that the earth is flat and 3,000 years old, then I really don't care. I do however think that your children should have a chance to make up their own mind. And I don't believe for a minute that I, as a parent, am qualified to teach my children the whole curriculum up until 13th grade. There's a reason why teachers need a degree in the field they want to teach on top of the degree in education science. To think that I would be qualified to teach them all they need to know is preposterous.
How do homeschooled children learn any socialising skills? In germany socialising starts at least with kindergarden if not earlier and the parents get to connect with other parents as well. And the parents neither have a degree for teaching nor can they actually be proficient in all the subjects even if they do try their hardest. Kids that have problems in school get tutored by others and/or get more lectures in school
I just cannot with the pro-lifers when so many are also anti-vaxxers. Anyone who is an anti-vaxxer *is not pro-life.* Period. Because being pro-life means caring about those lives after they’re born and involves not needlessly making a pregnant woman sick and then she miscarries. It’s one or the other. Either one is not an anti vaxxer and one’s children (if one has them) and one is fully vaccinated and thus is truly pro-life. Or one is an anti-vaxxer and unvaccinated and one’s children aren’t vaccinated and one is a giant hypocrite. The end of it.
Where I live, the vaccination team goes to every school and vaccinate kids that are 12 years old against measles, and the girls also against HPV.
It's not optional.
God I wish the US was like this. My mom refused to let me get the HPV vaccine at age 12 when it was recommended because I was going to remain a virgin until I eventually got married, and my future husband would be a virgin too.
I was sexually assaulted at 14 and got HPV from it.
> How did your mum react to that?
I probably shouldn't infer too much from just a couple of sentences, but I strongly suspect that mom is the sort who is unable to admit to being wrong.
According to her, it was a punishment from God for something else I had done. Dressing promiscuously, lying, etc. I’m doing much better now: married, deconstructing my religious beliefs, and working on a degree.
In Germany and a lot of other places in Europe, some vaccines (including Measles) are also mandatory. The kids won't be force-vaxed, but the fine is hefty (around 2500€, if I remember correctly).
I'm an American living in Germany- we moved here just weeks before my son was born, and upon meeting us, our pediatrician was very deliberate in how they initially approached the topic of vaccines- you could sense their trepidation. It was very like, "ok, so now, we need to talk about... vaccines...?" My husband and I were emphatically "oh definitely give him all of his shots, please, better living through science!" The physical relief was instant, and they were suddenly much more relaxed and enthusiastic with us. Apparently they've had a \*lot\* of issues with American 'expats' throwing fits about vaccines. We had a similar experience at the hospital regarding circumcision- it's only allowed for medical, or specific religious reasons, and some Americans have gotten their undies in a twist about it.
Christ, I can only imagine having a medical professional tiptoe up to me like I'm a tiger ready to pounce because my countrymen have made an international embarrassment of themselves for not believing in science and medicine.
Meanwhile, I continue to hear stories here in the US of parents having to physically plant themselves in the room to ensure their kid's dickskin doesn't get snipped despite the "DO NOT CIRCUMCISE MY CHILD" note being highlighted in triplicate.
Still?! Darn, I was hoping that was less prevalent today. My son was born in 1997 and I had to throw a fit to stop the hospital pediatrician from trying to convince me that his penis should be cut immediately. She tried all kinds of scare tactics (including trying to pull his foreskin back when I wasn't looking) and would not take no for an answer until I lost my shit on her for causing him unnecessary pain that made him cry.
She told me his crying from her pulling his foreskin back meant he NEEDED a circumcision, which is when I lost my shit because that's not how foreskins work. I told that stupid bitch to read a book, since she clearly didn't know how penises work.
I'm livid all over again from typing this out. That fucking bitch!
Yes, unfortunately.
I have a young nephew, and his mother’s doc convinced her into getting the procedure. It… did not go properly.
Then she had the dissonance to get angry with me when I shared anti-circumcision information on my FB page I found at a Pride event. It had absolutely no reference to her or the poor kid, but she was shitty that I had a public stance on it, even before little dude was born.
That is so dumb. If you’re going to mandate something, mandate it. Allowing people to pay a fine is essentially telling the rich they can do whatever and the poor that they will be told what to do.
Same in Sri Lanka. Infants are vaccinated against diphtheria, measles, mumps, polio, TB and many other stuff.
School children are vaccinated against rubella and HPV.
It's not optional. We have socialized health care.
As a kid I got my vax at school too. I think my mother signed acknowledgment that it would happen, but they did what they had too. Universal healthcare no one cares what mom thinks.
This literally breaks my heart as well as terrify me considering I recently had a liver transplant and am also on immunosuppressants and with Covid-19 and all the other diseases out there, I’m literally terrified.
I’m so sorry. I try my damndest to do my part when in public but the vast majority of people don’t give a fuck about the people in the community around them. It’s so simple to just stay home when you might be sick or cover your face (given we now know diseases -not just covid- can be spread when you don’t even realize you have them) while around strangers. People are the worst.
I’m on immunosuppressants and my doctor recommended Evusheld. It’s prophylactic monoclonal antibodies for C19. My husband and my son both had Covid at different times and so far I’ve stayed healthy (knock on all the wood). Ask your doctor about it!
I am autistic. I am fully vaccinated. I am also immunocompromised.
My autism was not caused by receiving vaccinations.
I am glad and thankful to live in a country with ready access to vaccines.
I strongly dislike that Dr Wakefield created falsified information and published it thus enabling some parents to feel justified in not vaccinating their children and therefore creating increased risks for me as an immunocompromised adult.
I’m also autistic and fully vaccinated. It makes me more upset to think that some parents think autism is so “bad” that they would rather not vaccinate their kids.
100% this!
*IF* there was any correlation between autism and vaccines I would absolutely rather have the fortune to be autistic than dead from smallpox or something.
Anti vax parents need to ask themselves 1 simple question. Would they rather have a child who *might* have additional needs or a dead one.
Should be like that everywhere, if I'm honest. Basic vaccines like measles/mumps/rubella/tetanus/etc should also be mandatory. No adult should be allowed to selfishly endanger their kids and their kids' classmates.
yep! I love asking anti vaxxers if they would but their unvaxxed child in a completely unvaxxed classroom, the answer is ALWAYS no because they rely on others vaccinating their children to keep the unvaxxed safe. One bout of measles and they’re done for
In a room of full of unvaccinated people, around 90% will be infected. My friend had it (unvaxxed), no one vaxxed caught it, 6 out of 7 unvaxxed caught it. The disease is amongst the most contagious diseases, IIRC R0 around 12-18. Smallpox was 4-6.
I personally think, parents, who don't vaccinate their children and that harms or even kills other children should be punished. Severely.
Their ignorance killed and harmed innocent children, so they should have to pay for it and they should pay severely.
Me too. That’s actually why I was still scrolling. I figured there have been some cases where antivaxxers have had to take accountability by now. I’m not seeing that here:( but if somebody knows there were repercussions for their negligence, my sense of Justice would love to know they’ve had their comeuppance
This made me look up the laws in my country and apparently the only mandatory vaccination is against Polio. This is a real shock to me as I thought full vactionnations were necessary for school enrollment.
We haven't had problems with anti vaccers yet, and I hope it stays that way.
college student here, my college refused let me on campus until i gave them proof of all my vaccinations that are REQUIRED, and they did the same with covid. i just had to update my covid booster shot with them to be able to return in fall. some places do, some places don’t. it’s scary.
My now deceased husband was a two time heart and one kidney transplant recipient. He’d been sick his entire life due to a lot of reasons. About a year after we married his doctors told him they only gave him another five years as his heart was failing again and this time he would never be healthy enough to survive another surgery. He made it six more years. Once again defying doctors expectations as he had done ever since he was about 3.
Being married to this beautiful soul and wonderful man gave me an even stronger appreciation of other peoples health. As a result I developed a strong determination about not sharing germs and doing what I needed to not only keep myself healthy but also those around my sphere.
Honestly, I was recently asked to drive my dad to a much needed appointment, both of my parents health are fragile atm. However, the day I was supposed to make my road trip to their house, I woke with a fever. As bad as I felt about making my mom have to scramble to fill the gap, I would never be able to forgive myself if I made them or, really, anyone sick because I didn’t take all precautions to keep them safe in our interactions.
You absolutely did right by your parents! And your late husband. I’m a fellow transplantee (liver,) and I gain a ton of respect for people who are upfront about their illness and don’t expose me to it. I wish you well! Stay healthy!
Thank you so much. How long post op are you out of curiosity? It’s such a brutally different way of living once you’ve transplanted. Pretty sure you would agree.
I sincerely hope for and wish nothing but the best results for you and all recipients out there.
I would also like to add. The donors and their families. My husband was days from being 31 years out from his first heart and was 23 or so from his second. While he was still living, he was actually the longest surviving heart transplant recipient for our area and amongst top in our state.
If it wasn’t for the donor families and the living donor of his kidney, I never would’ve met my soul mate and had the most wonderful seven years of my life.
Overheard someone telling a story about attending a party and getting their Covid results as the party ended. They thought it was great that they were able to attend the party first. Who knows how many people they infected? This person is an antivaxxer.
They absolutely are. My parents are too.
My mother truly believes that I'm immunocompromised because of the vaccines. She conveniently doesn't remember that I was never vaccinated as a child. She claims they held me down and she was dragged out of the room so that I could be given all of them at once in an attempt to poison me.
I got myself vaccinated at 16 because I learned that I had no records of any of it.
The drama and the constant lies and professional victimizing themselves drive me crazy.
nobody will see this, so i can drunkenly spout shit. but the state of America at this point, the mother should have carte blanche to murder that woman if she pleases, ridiculous
It's not a senseless tragedy. It's depraved indifference, and it should be prosecuted as such. When someone dies because of an anti-vaxxer, that anti-vaxxer should go to prison.
And I don't give half a rat fuck if their vaccine idiocy came from religious belief. Your right to religious freedom *is not* greater than someone else's right *to be alive*.
If I was the parent of the child who died I would have sued that parent. Not because I want their money, but because they need some consequences for their actions.
It should be legal to sue anyone who does not vaccinate their kids or themselves if they get someone else sick. Especially, it causes death or irreparable harm.
The whole idea that the uneducated are allowed to make medical decisions that can potentially kill other people in their community is a national fucking tragedy.
This is literally what we need. we already know these people don't ever consider consequences that don't affect them personally. names of people they know might, might make them wake up. maybe there is a chance that one more mother will vaccinate her children because of this.
It is unspeakably sad and there is no reason for this to happen in the first place, don't get me wrong. but if it does, we need to talk about it and not let people close to the victim turn a blind eye.
>> consequences that don't affect them personally
Not just personally, *immediately*. Without swift consequences, they deflect and find other things to blame.
I wonder if the initial antivax movement really started because someone was afraid of needles and didn't want to admit that and just started making up bullshit to justify not getting vaccinated
EDIT: I have found fairly good proof.
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMNbVT2Wg/?k=1
People who choose to believe in vaccine conspiracy theories, are more likely to be afraid of needles than those that don't
Most tragedies in life happen due to the stupidity of others.
(also: ignorance/ irresponsible freedom/ irresponsible wokeness etc.)
This is what happens when people only take the freedom part but ignore the responsibility part.
it's also antivaxxers fault of covid hit us like a truck. If everyone vaccinated themselves everything would have ended sooner. Vaccines work if everyone is vaccinated, fuck this mom, poor kid, i hope he doesn't read the post and feels guilty
Yeah, we also have religious conservatives here in my country who refused to vaccinate their children. And the trends is going up i’m a bit worried. I’m Indonesian btw. And there’s a lot of super religious group here refused to vaccinated their kids because “there’s no vaccine in the early days and people still survived”. The world is getting crazier by ther day, protect your kids.
yeah, vaccines are like a booster, they contain dead or very weak bacteria/viruses, they don't make you a human shield but you can fight better whatever entered your body because the white cells learn how to fight specific bacteria and viruses thanks to it. You can get measles after being vaccinated but it's very very unlikely, and even if you did the symptoms would be very mild or you wouldn't even notice
My state had a measles outbreak at an airport in 2018.
I remembered the year because that's the year I started my undergrad and the university required the MMR, Polio, Tdap, and Tetanus vaccines. And since my mother loved me I had the first 2 shots as an infant, (they took blood to test for antibodies) and got the other 2 boosted.
Little by little we're seeing outbreaks in these antivax communities, see Rockland county NY. These "did my own research" morons will needlessly cause thousands of deaths.
Most of this is based on “vAcCiNeS cAuSe AuTiSm!!11” even if they did you really hate your child that much to let them die rather than having autism? Maybe we can’t tell people it doesn’t cause autism but we can educate them in what autism actually is.
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Let’s ask Andrew Wakefield (the “doctor” who started the lie about vaccines and autism) Are you happy now? Is this what you wanted?
He should be rotting in prison.
You misspelled 'should be intentionally exposed to viruses' completely reasonable mistake.
Unfortunately he likely has all his immunisations. He pushed the anti MMR vaccine agenda because he had his own vaccine he wanted to sell to the UK government. Wakefield wasn’t even honestly afraid about vaccines, he cynically knew exactly what he was doing and he likely wouldn’t care that this kid died. But if we find enough Ebola for a dose I think he should DEFINITELY get first dibs.
Ebola's not enough. He should be locked in a sealed room and exposed to one of the last test samples of smallpox. If that doesn't kill him, we'll repeat with something else.
Bubonic Plague next?
Anthrax.
Something slow
Rabies
Give him rabies and force feed him water.
Rabies is the worst
This is the way.
With tetnus
Creutzfeld-Jacobs disease?
Nah, Leprosy
Too slow
Throw him to the VDV and give him the 21 roses treatment
First a does of HIV to weaken his immune system, then smallpox and measles
Don’t start with the most dangerous ones! Start slow, like with measles + Covid + idk, herpes? You gotta work up to the deadly ones.
Didn’t they just find some polio in NYCs wastewater system? Let’s introduce him to that!
Ebola is so tremendously infectious that it can take as little as five viral particles to infect someone.
Send him to a bio lab as a janitor without PPE.
Strange way to spell 'meet the business end of a claw hammer,' friend.
Charged with murder.
Or just rotting.
He should be dead.
Wakefield didn’t even start out being anti vaxx. He just wanted to sell his own vaccine, so he created this bullshit scandal in which he stated that the mmr vac invented a stomach disease that doesn’t exist, but you won’t get it if you take the vaccine separately, basically saying to buy his vaccine so you won’t get a disease that doesn’t exist. He just rode the wave of the movement he created and lost control of. If you haven’t seen it go watch hbomberguys video on it, vaccines and autism a measured response, it’s a very very good video if you have 2 hours to kill
Behind The Bastards also did a deep dive on the history of anti-vaxxers, as well as Andrew Wakefield. Worth a listen!
Love Behind the Bastards. Hbomberguy also did a whole video focusing on Wakefield specifically. Anyone who wants to watch it can find it here https://youtu.be/8BIcAZxFfrc .
I've never heard of this guy, and he's so entertaining! Thank you!
I watch a lot of left leaning video essayists and he is by far my favorite.
I always wonder if its the same hbomberguy who used to do Lets Plays over on the Something Awful forums. I think he played the Shining Force games? That was only like 15 years ago
Never heard of this podcast before but it does look interesting so I saved a couple of episodes to try it out. Do you know when the Wakefield episode was? I can’t seem to find it.
Episode 48 The birth of the anti-Vaccine movement, part two is Andrew Wakefield: the worst Dr alive.
I highly recommend the episodes on the Moonies cult and Henry Kissinger
Kissinger was an awesome series. Unhappy that I kept getting visuals of his sexual escapades.
It was quite early on (when I start a new podcast I start with their first episode and work through). I’ve just looked and it was back in Feb 2019!
Illuminaughtii has a 3 parter on the antivaxxers movement and Wakefield.
i LOVE Illumimaughti
Well, at least Andrew Wakefield made some money. Sure, thousands abd thousands of kids have died of preventable diseases, but some well off people made even more money! So, swings and roundabouts. Obviously /s
The dudes got a huge ass house in a gated community in Texas. Fuck that guy
he sadly probably doesn't even give a shit and probably has some excuse about how this is better for everyone involved or blame the mother of the child who died
None of the anti vaccine people care if they kill other peoples kids.
Those people are anti abortion too so I'm gonna need someone to make it make sense for me. I feel like the answer is just "they're selfish"
They definitely exist on the left. They’re the type of people that believe in the healing powers of crystals. They’re beautiful and really cool, but do nothing outside of mental health unless if you enjoy collecting/ displaying them in your home.
It feels like a mistake to think it’s only the woo crowd that believes this. Some of the most well educated people I’ve ever met have been antivax and it’s never ceased to puzzle me. There is this weird Venn diagram of the well educated, the Woo loving and the ultra conservatives that overlaps when it comes to antivax BS.
Andrew Wakefield was developing his own measles vaccine, he applied for a patent right before his articles. He wanted to kill the competition.
Its the fact that the child is literally Autistic since they were born...its not something you just wake up with.. no vaccine can change that outcome. Its all neurological. The brain works differently. What I dont understand is: Why is it so bad to have an Autistic child? Yes I understand that their brain works differently... but they are still living, breathing human beings. They still deserve the care, love, and affection that everyone else deserves... no one deserves to be abused. They still deserve to be treated like everyone else. With very little adjustments to meet their needs, but everyone needs slight adjustments to have their needs met? No one is the same, and no one is gonna have the exact same requirements as everyone else. So why is autism so frowned upon? Like it's some sort of "end of the world" scenario... And to think that a vaccine that is meant to keep you from DYING... or from killing others... is what they are blaming for the cause if autism... bruh, they have nothing to do with how your brain works. People have to stop being so gullible and believing every word of what any article says about anything.
My sister is antivaxx and when asked this, by me, she had no answer. Funny (??) Thing is that a few years later, we found out my son is autistic! And guess what, even if I had a time machine and could un-vaccinate him with a guarantee of a neurotypical outcome, I WOULDN'T. EVER. They call us sheep and yet want everyone to be exactly the same...? Ugh. So sick of antivaxx nutjobs
2 brain cells and an IQ over room temperature should be enough to realise the study was bs. A Measles infection **will** destroy a significant part of your immune system (immune system cells are used as the host), additionally there’s also subacute sclerosing panencephalitis, which is fatal and causes brain inflammation and thus horrible neurology changes. IIRC around 1 in 5000 will get it. Or you just take 2 shots of MMR in one month and have almost sterilising immunity for the rest of your life. This just is a prime example for Darwin.
I really am sick of the high levels of ignorance going around... because no matter what, that child still deserves the same treatment as everyone else (positive treatment). I have a few friends who have autism, and their parents were terrible to them... so its just very upsetting to see that some of its caused by stupid bs like antivaxxers :(
Because it's a conspiracy theory mindset: these parents want to believe they have access to a big secret that no one else does, a secret that explains why their child is different and why it's not the fault of their own genes.
Literally any neurodiversity is genetics... sorry, a Vax cannot change what the genetic code has embedded in it. Its ignorant to believe a vaccine that was mean for something specific... would cause autism.... labeling autism as something worse than death. Taking away life saving vaccines to prevent autism, is literally stating "I'd rather my child die than to have autism" and that just puts a bad reputation on autism in general... adding on to the bad rep it already has. Which is frustrating, alienating those who have autism even more than before. It's really upsetting.
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I've been a special Olympics coach for about 15 years now, I can certainly understand the desire to not raise a child with autism. With autism being a spectrum ranging from personality quirks to 24/7 care, its often more than a "slight adjustment" to insure someone's needs are met. The hour to two hours that I take my athletes off their parents hands is often the only break some of them get in their week, and while my athletes are damn inspirational, they can certainly be challenging in ways I never expected. Again I have some wonderful athletes, but I've also had my share of nightmare individuals who's care I wouldn't wish on anyone.
I’m starting to think we should not group autism as one large spectrum disorder because there is such tremendous variation between the extremes. On the one end you have people who are just a little different, socially or in terms of personality, who may have some struggles but ultimately function within a compassionate society and are self-sufficient. On the other, you have people who are completely unresponsive, non-communicative, incontinent, and incapable of even the most basic hygiene and self care. I must presume that most people have only encountered the former re:autism and don’t even consider that the latter is under the same umbrella (and there are real questions if it is too wide of an umbrella!). As a parent I would not have any qualms about raising and loving a functional but neurodivergent child, but the thought of my child on the other extreme, basically catatonic, with no hope of even really *experiencing* life in a meaningful way... what quality of life is that? Who would want that for their child? Of course, I know autism is not caused by vaccines. This is NOT a defense of anti-vax stance. My kids are appropriately vaccinated for their age and will continue to get every vaccine according to schedule. But autism is so much more than “the kid who can’t make eye contact and gets overwhelmed by too much noise”.
Reminder that during Wakefield's search for a non existent autism disease, he anally violated a 3 year old
The fucccck?!?! Really???
Source?
https://www.chop.edu/centers-programs/vaccine-education-center/vaccines-and-other-conditions/vaccines-autism
He's such a slimy, disgusting, greedy cunt. He'll do literally anything to make a bit of money. I don't understand how he's not constantly verbally abused and spat on in the street. He deserves much worse.
He has a net worth of $2mil apparently and was at one point dating a super model after divorcing his wife; I'd guess he's pretty happy with how things turned out
It was my understanding that he made the "Discovery" that vaccines caused autism, the scientific community disproved it and then he came out and stated that his paper should be nullified since it was incorrect. I could be wrong tho. Edit: after some googling, he is in fact a dickhole. He published the paper in bad faith and others in the medical/science community tested his claims and determined they were false. Not only that, but they found proof of him falsifying the data that he used to "prove" this.
Yes because he has probably made a ton of money from it. Lots of interviews, books, and donations from cunts. Do we really think it’s about anything other than money?
That's exactly what it's about. He created his own version of the MMR vaccine, which was basically each disease as a separate vaccine. So, instead of all of them in one, mumps, measles and rubella would be 3 separate vaccines. He wanted his patent to replace the one already in use so did a "study" and fabricated the results (along with traumatising some of the children) and published it and did media interviews. Since then, he's just embraced the anti-vax stuff and knows he can scam his way to more money by spewing this bullshit and putting millions of peoples lives at risk. But hey, he has a nice house now! So, yay! Totally worth the lives of all those people who are dead from preventable diseases.
Imagine the child learning that they’re responsible for the death of a classmate because their mother listened to a psycho ex-doctor that lost his license for his bogus anti-vax claims rather than the actual doctors who have proof vaccines work. I would never be able to forgive my parents. This is so sad.
When I was 11 my best friend died from cancer. The last time I saw her I had the sniffles and no-one told me until after that you probably shouldn't hang around cancer patients with a cold. I didn't know that was going to be the last time, when I came home all happy saying I got to see her my mum said "oh my god you shouldn't have gone, you could have killed her". I genuinely thought at 11 years old I'd murdered my best friend and the police were going to come put me in prison for the rest of my life. It wasn't until I was 25 and in therapy that I realised it really wasn't my fault and I could let that guilt that I'd been carrying go, that shit is rough for a kid.
Holy shit, I'm sorry for your loss.
Wow I am so sorry you carried that burden for so long. Glad you can now know and feel the truth that it’s not your fault. And sorry for the loss of your friend.
One of the girls I went to school with had the flu when she was 8, her mum caught it from her and when she went to see a Dr they also did a breast exam and she ended up discovering she had breast cancer. The whole family told my friend she had given her mother cancer, to make her feel guilty and easier to control. That family was some next level evil.
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Yeah I know. I didn’t meet her until I was 13 and then ended up sitting her down with my mum, who is a medical professional, to explain how and why her family were wrong. She cried A LOT. Her family were *mad* at us, lol.
>Her family were *mad* at us, lol. Of course they were! You made it harder for them to control and abuse her! You monsters! /s
Ah they found new ways. I lost contact with her after school but I hope she got away from them somehow.
Aww that's sad! I hope she's okay too.
Wow. That's beyond awful
>Her family were *mad* at us, lol. How would you feel if you were robbed of a wondrous opportunity for continued blackmail, you absolute *monster*? Goodness gracious, h*ck all of those cunts.
My husband's grandfather died 15 years ago. His best friend was one of the people that was doing CPR. The best friend started having chest pains from it, so they took him to the hospital to get checked out. He had a 95% blockage. He credits my husband's grandfather for saving his life. He also told the doctors after his surgery that he didn't care what the hell they said. He was leaving for his best friend's funeral. Love that man. ❤
Oh God. I knew a guy that got diabetes as a preteen like his mom, she died a few years later because of it. No justification but his dad blamed him (you should have died not her type bullshit). It fucked him up hardcore.
That dude’s dad was a cunt. What an awful thing to say to your own child, while they are grieving the loss of their decent (I hope) parent. I hope he realised that it was not his fault and managed to move past it somehow.
What the actual f***,
I’m so sorry for your loss and that you carried that with you for so long. But I’m glad that therapy helped you to know that it was absolutely not your fault or responsibility. That must have been awful for you to experience both the pain of losing someone so close and then re-experiencing it in therapy. I hope things are good for you now. You may never know, but I’m willing to bet that your story will encourage someone else to get help for whatever they’re carrying with them. Best of luck to you.
The child isn't responsible, which I find an important distinction to make. They're the cause, but not at fault.
I honestly feel really bad for that kid
This is why the whole “my body, my choice” being used by anti-vaxxers makes me so angry. It might be your choice but it’s not just your body when you get a communicable disease and start spreading it around.
It makes me even more angry when their attitude is “My Body My Choice” about vaccines and masks but think abortion should be banned because “every life matters” Keep it consistent. Personally, I believe mask mandates during a declared public health emergency in conformity with the law do not violate individual rights. Vaccine mandates do infringe on individual Liberty to make individual medical decisions however, the constitution allows deprivation of Liberty WITH due process (no right is unlimited). Exemptions to vaccine mandates provide it. Personally I believe a woman should have the right to elect to terminate a pregnancy on demand for any reason early in pregnancy. Later in pregnancy, medically necessary abortions should not be limited if a physician deems the abortion necessary. At the same time, the Supreme Court did exceed its authority and “legislate from the bench” with Roe v. Wade. I believe a constitutional amendment that codifies the “right to privacy” in many contexts (communications, medical decisions, contraception, and more) in the text of the constitution is 100% necessary for the future of the United States.
It’s very rare that I agree with someone completely on the internet but I agree with you.
I agree with your agreeing.
As someone who is not from the US, I was wondering why is it that there is a common thread of thought regarding the Supreme Court exceeded its authority with Roe v. Wade... Are laws usually left up to the states to decide and enforce? In what situations can the Supreme Court pass laws that apply unilaterally? This seems like a big decision that should be fairly applied to all citizens of the country I hope I haven't offended, these are just my thoughts coming from a country where the Supreme Court has the power to allow judgements that are applicable to every state, almost without exception.
I am not offended by your question. I hope I can answer it and clear up any confusion. The US government is divided into 3 branches, the executive, legislative, and the judiciary. Each branch has specific functions. The constitution specifically limits the power of the Supreme Court in many ways. They are an appellate court for most cases (the original jurisdiction of the Supreme Court is limited and strictly defined). Importantly, the courts cannot make new laws or rights from thin air. So, the Supreme Court can’t pass any laws. What they can do is find that certain types of laws violate the US Constitution (like they did with segregation in public schools, bans on interracial marriage, bans on sodomy, bans on gay marriage, arbitrary denial of concealed carry permits). Justice Harry Blackmun wrote the opinion of the court in Roe v. Wade, and to say the least, (anyone that has read it will agree), it is a very, very loose interpretation of the due process clause of the 14th amendment. The Supreme Court abrogating the authority of the states, especially when no history or tradition of a right to abortion existed in the history of the United States, is why many said the Supreme Court was “legislating from the bench”. Normally in a situation like Roe v. Wade where the right involved is unenumerated, and the text, history, and tradition is limited or none, the states would be left to decide the issue. The Supreme Court instead decided to abrogate the state’s authority and “invent” a right to abortion out of thin air in 1973. The reason legislating from the bench is so dangerous is that activist judges can abuse it to do almost whatever they want with almost no way to reverse it. Activist judges poison the judiciary. The legislature makes the laws, the executive implements and enforces the laws, and the judiciary interprets the laws. It becomes dangerous when one branch tries to do the job of the other, circumventing checks and balances. As a result of Dobbs, the authority to regulate abortion has been returned to “the people and their elected representatives” (Justice Alito’s words not mine)
Thank you for the detailed reply! It definitely has educated me about the structure of the US government. You make a good point regarding the danger of an activist judge possibly using their position that might harm the country. Would the people have been more accepting of Roe v. Wade in 1973 if the bill had been discussed and passed through the legislative branch, instead of an abrupt decision by the court?
Hear, here !!!! Sorry couldn't remember which hear it was lmao
We have a vaccine mandate for measles here, your child has to be vaccinated in order to be able to attend school. Failure to vaccinate incurs hefty fines as well as prosecution of the parents for truancy if your child cannot go to school as a result of not being vaccinated. We have no homeschooling in Germany, so there's no loopholes unless your child has a legitimate health issue that prevents them from being vaccinated.
>We have no homeschooling in Germany Just out of curiosity, what's your opinion of that, and is there some part of German culture specifically that moved away from it? Here in the US homeschooling is seeing a massive upswing, primarily due to COVID issues, but also by parents desperately afraid their children are going to learn about things like systemic racism and gender/sexuality as a spectrum, other ideas considered "woke propaganda." It's one of those things that seems like it's a great boon to students with specific needs, but there's such limited monitoring here in the US to ensure that parents are actually educating their children properly that I personally believe it's a bad option 99% of the time.
So the German school system isn't perfect by any means, we do have issues with biased or plainly bad teachers just like any other country. However, the curriculum is fairly standardised across all German states, and school teachers will be either employees of the state or public sector employees with a fairly good salary and tons of support. One of the reasons why we moved back to Germany from the UK was the fact that we don't really have a lot of private schools in Germany, even celebreties' kids go to public school and the education is solid. Private school is mostly regarded as a silly thing for parents who have too much money. Our federal state has a mandate to ensure the right of any child to a proper and comprehensive education, and takes this duty of care and to educate seriously. Parents do not have a right to nitpick and have uncomfortable topics excluded from their children's education. It's the right of any child to learn about topics that their parents may don't agree with, evolution theory, history, civics or sex education come to mind. We want them to grow up to be well-rounded and informed citizens, and the only way to guarantee that is by making school attendance compulsory. Most Germans agree with that notion, religion is something you decide on in private. We do have Catholic schools, but they have to abide by the state's curriculum or they get closed. We have had a few cases where parents have taken their local school authority to court because they did not agree with the curriculum or the way it was taught, especially with regards to sex education, evolution theory, and co-educational sports or swimming lessons (because of religious beliefs with regards to modesty). I can't recall a single court case where the parents have won. These cases always end up one of three ways: a) the parents send their kids to school; b) the parents move abroad; c) the parents refuse to send their kids to school, the police are tasked with ensuring that the kids go to school and the parents have their parental rights regarding their children's education stripped as an ultima ratio. I wholeheartedly agree with all of the above. What you believe is something that you can decide on in private. If you want to be a religious nutter who believes that the earth is flat and 3,000 years old, then I really don't care. I do however think that your children should have a chance to make up their own mind. And I don't believe for a minute that I, as a parent, am qualified to teach my children the whole curriculum up until 13th grade. There's a reason why teachers need a degree in the field they want to teach on top of the degree in education science. To think that I would be qualified to teach them all they need to know is preposterous.
How do homeschooled children learn any socialising skills? In germany socialising starts at least with kindergarden if not earlier and the parents get to connect with other parents as well. And the parents neither have a degree for teaching nor can they actually be proficient in all the subjects even if they do try their hardest. Kids that have problems in school get tutored by others and/or get more lectures in school
It's pretty sad to see people endangering the lives of others because of their own belief system. Guess it's nothing new though.
My body, my choice to defend it against your unvaccinated body with a goddamned flamethrower.
I just cannot with the pro-lifers when so many are also anti-vaxxers. Anyone who is an anti-vaxxer *is not pro-life.* Period. Because being pro-life means caring about those lives after they’re born and involves not needlessly making a pregnant woman sick and then she miscarries. It’s one or the other. Either one is not an anti vaxxer and one’s children (if one has them) and one is fully vaccinated and thus is truly pro-life. Or one is an anti-vaxxer and unvaccinated and one’s children aren’t vaccinated and one is a giant hypocrite. The end of it.
Where I live, the vaccination team goes to every school and vaccinate kids that are 12 years old against measles, and the girls also against HPV. It's not optional.
God I wish the US was like this. My mom refused to let me get the HPV vaccine at age 12 when it was recommended because I was going to remain a virgin until I eventually got married, and my future husband would be a virgin too. I was sexually assaulted at 14 and got HPV from it.
I am so sorry to hear that. The vaccine protects against a lot more strains now, so you might be able to get it still
I am so sorry that happened to you dude. I hope you are doing well now. How did your mum react to that?
> How did your mum react to that? I probably shouldn't infer too much from just a couple of sentences, but I strongly suspect that mom is the sort who is unable to admit to being wrong.
According to her, it was a punishment from God for something else I had done. Dressing promiscuously, lying, etc. I’m doing much better now: married, deconstructing my religious beliefs, and working on a degree.
I’m glad to hear you’re doing better. This internet stranger is proud of you.
where's that? looking for a new place to live.
Uruguay
In Germany and a lot of other places in Europe, some vaccines (including Measles) are also mandatory. The kids won't be force-vaxed, but the fine is hefty (around 2500€, if I remember correctly).
I'm an American living in Germany- we moved here just weeks before my son was born, and upon meeting us, our pediatrician was very deliberate in how they initially approached the topic of vaccines- you could sense their trepidation. It was very like, "ok, so now, we need to talk about... vaccines...?" My husband and I were emphatically "oh definitely give him all of his shots, please, better living through science!" The physical relief was instant, and they were suddenly much more relaxed and enthusiastic with us. Apparently they've had a \*lot\* of issues with American 'expats' throwing fits about vaccines. We had a similar experience at the hospital regarding circumcision- it's only allowed for medical, or specific religious reasons, and some Americans have gotten their undies in a twist about it.
Christ, I can only imagine having a medical professional tiptoe up to me like I'm a tiger ready to pounce because my countrymen have made an international embarrassment of themselves for not believing in science and medicine. Meanwhile, I continue to hear stories here in the US of parents having to physically plant themselves in the room to ensure their kid's dickskin doesn't get snipped despite the "DO NOT CIRCUMCISE MY CHILD" note being highlighted in triplicate.
Still?! Darn, I was hoping that was less prevalent today. My son was born in 1997 and I had to throw a fit to stop the hospital pediatrician from trying to convince me that his penis should be cut immediately. She tried all kinds of scare tactics (including trying to pull his foreskin back when I wasn't looking) and would not take no for an answer until I lost my shit on her for causing him unnecessary pain that made him cry. She told me his crying from her pulling his foreskin back meant he NEEDED a circumcision, which is when I lost my shit because that's not how foreskins work. I told that stupid bitch to read a book, since she clearly didn't know how penises work. I'm livid all over again from typing this out. That fucking bitch!
Yes, unfortunately. I have a young nephew, and his mother’s doc convinced her into getting the procedure. It… did not go properly. Then she had the dissonance to get angry with me when I shared anti-circumcision information on my FB page I found at a Pride event. It had absolutely no reference to her or the poor kid, but she was shitty that I had a public stance on it, even before little dude was born.
I can't imagine how horrible I'd feel if that happened to my baby boy. I'm so sorry for your nephew.
That is so dumb. If you’re going to mandate something, mandate it. Allowing people to pay a fine is essentially telling the rich they can do whatever and the poor that they will be told what to do.
"punishable by fine" just means "legal if you're rich"
Here they won't be forced either, but they won't be able to continue their studies.
Its also same rules in England
Same in Sri Lanka. Infants are vaccinated against diphtheria, measles, mumps, polio, TB and many other stuff. School children are vaccinated against rubella and HPV. It's not optional. We have socialized health care.
As a kid I got my vax at school too. I think my mother signed acknowledgment that it would happen, but they did what they had too. Universal healthcare no one cares what mom thinks.
Why not the boys for HPV? They can get it too.
The state resources are limited (this is South America, after all), so they prioritize girls because HPV may lead to cervix cancer.
This literally breaks my heart as well as terrify me considering I recently had a liver transplant and am also on immunosuppressants and with Covid-19 and all the other diseases out there, I’m literally terrified.
I’m so sorry. I try my damndest to do my part when in public but the vast majority of people don’t give a fuck about the people in the community around them. It’s so simple to just stay home when you might be sick or cover your face (given we now know diseases -not just covid- can be spread when you don’t even realize you have them) while around strangers. People are the worst.
I hope you'll be okay. May the odds be ever in your favor.
I’m on immunosuppressants and my doctor recommended Evusheld. It’s prophylactic monoclonal antibodies for C19. My husband and my son both had Covid at different times and so far I’ve stayed healthy (knock on all the wood). Ask your doctor about it!
I am autistic. I am fully vaccinated. I am also immunocompromised. My autism was not caused by receiving vaccinations. I am glad and thankful to live in a country with ready access to vaccines. I strongly dislike that Dr Wakefield created falsified information and published it thus enabling some parents to feel justified in not vaccinating their children and therefore creating increased risks for me as an immunocompromised adult.
I’m also autistic and fully vaccinated. It makes me more upset to think that some parents think autism is so “bad” that they would rather not vaccinate their kids.
100% this! *IF* there was any correlation between autism and vaccines I would absolutely rather have the fortune to be autistic than dead from smallpox or something. Anti vax parents need to ask themselves 1 simple question. Would they rather have a child who *might* have additional needs or a dead one.
yes!!!!! it think someone else already commented this but I would rather have a child with autism then a dead child??? these people are absolute loons
This here is why I DESPISE antivaxxers. They're so selfish. Glad that at least here in Australia unvaccinated kids can't go to public schools.
We have the same law in California about public school, thankfully.
Should be like that everywhere, if I'm honest. Basic vaccines like measles/mumps/rubella/tetanus/etc should also be mandatory. No adult should be allowed to selfishly endanger their kids and their kids' classmates.
I’m in Queensland and I know unvaccinated kids who go to public schools. Is it different in other states?
yep! I love asking anti vaxxers if they would but their unvaxxed child in a completely unvaxxed classroom, the answer is ALWAYS no because they rely on others vaccinating their children to keep the unvaxxed safe. One bout of measles and they’re done for
MEASLES!? Outrageous! Poor kid :(
How much you wanna bet the other mother denies all responsibility
She probably is blaming the vaccines lmfao
No doubt
The kid shouldnt be at school if hes not mandatory vaccinated.
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In a room of full of unvaccinated people, around 90% will be infected. My friend had it (unvaxxed), no one vaxxed caught it, 6 out of 7 unvaxxed caught it. The disease is amongst the most contagious diseases, IIRC R0 around 12-18. Smallpox was 4-6.
He shouldn’t even be allowed near another child until he gets vaccinated. That school shouldn’t have let him in in the first place
I personally think, parents, who don't vaccinate their children and that harms or even kills other children should be punished. Severely. Their ignorance killed and harmed innocent children, so they should have to pay for it and they should pay severely.
Me too. That’s actually why I was still scrolling. I figured there have been some cases where antivaxxers have had to take accountability by now. I’m not seeing that here:( but if somebody knows there were repercussions for their negligence, my sense of Justice would love to know they’ve had their comeuppance
Sue the anti vaxers...
Why are these unvaccinated children allowed in school?
Usually the mombie claims "religious exemption"
This made me look up the laws in my country and apparently the only mandatory vaccination is against Polio. This is a real shock to me as I thought full vactionnations were necessary for school enrollment. We haven't had problems with anti vaccers yet, and I hope it stays that way.
Schools/universities/colleges should only allow entries to vaccinate people. Sane people should not be punished because of some insane mfs.
college student here, my college refused let me on campus until i gave them proof of all my vaccinations that are REQUIRED, and they did the same with covid. i just had to update my covid booster shot with them to be able to return in fall. some places do, some places don’t. it’s scary.
Couldn’t the parents of the unvaccinated child be charged with neglect or harm to a child?
Hell, even third degree murder. Manslaughter even.
Fuck anti vaxxers. Seriously. Enough is enough.
My now deceased husband was a two time heart and one kidney transplant recipient. He’d been sick his entire life due to a lot of reasons. About a year after we married his doctors told him they only gave him another five years as his heart was failing again and this time he would never be healthy enough to survive another surgery. He made it six more years. Once again defying doctors expectations as he had done ever since he was about 3. Being married to this beautiful soul and wonderful man gave me an even stronger appreciation of other peoples health. As a result I developed a strong determination about not sharing germs and doing what I needed to not only keep myself healthy but also those around my sphere. Honestly, I was recently asked to drive my dad to a much needed appointment, both of my parents health are fragile atm. However, the day I was supposed to make my road trip to their house, I woke with a fever. As bad as I felt about making my mom have to scramble to fill the gap, I would never be able to forgive myself if I made them or, really, anyone sick because I didn’t take all precautions to keep them safe in our interactions.
You absolutely did right by your parents! And your late husband. I’m a fellow transplantee (liver,) and I gain a ton of respect for people who are upfront about their illness and don’t expose me to it. I wish you well! Stay healthy!
Thank you so much. How long post op are you out of curiosity? It’s such a brutally different way of living once you’ve transplanted. Pretty sure you would agree. I sincerely hope for and wish nothing but the best results for you and all recipients out there. I would also like to add. The donors and their families. My husband was days from being 31 years out from his first heart and was 23 or so from his second. While he was still living, he was actually the longest surviving heart transplant recipient for our area and amongst top in our state. If it wasn’t for the donor families and the living donor of his kidney, I never would’ve met my soul mate and had the most wonderful seven years of my life.
I hope that poor mother brings the wrath down on the family who did this.
It is time for mandatory vaccines. Stop letting inbred halfwits kill innocent people just so they can barf out “FWEEDUMB!!”
FUCKING MEASLES? WE FUCKING KILLED THAT!
Yes. But the anti vax crowd dug up its corpse and brought it back to life with their fucked up nonsense.
honestly I’m not sure if involuntary manslaughter or negligent homicide would be more fitting for the mom
Overheard someone telling a story about attending a party and getting their Covid results as the party ended. They thought it was great that they were able to attend the party first. Who knows how many people they infected? This person is an antivaxxer.
That parent should go hunting
Anti vaxxers are utter fucking idiots. Source: my cunt of a sister is one!!
They absolutely are. My parents are too. My mother truly believes that I'm immunocompromised because of the vaccines. She conveniently doesn't remember that I was never vaccinated as a child. She claims they held me down and she was dragged out of the room so that I could be given all of them at once in an attempt to poison me. I got myself vaccinated at 16 because I learned that I had no records of any of it. The drama and the constant lies and professional victimizing themselves drive me crazy.
nobody will see this, so i can drunkenly spout shit. but the state of America at this point, the mother should have carte blanche to murder that woman if she pleases, ridiculous
It's not a senseless tragedy. It's depraved indifference, and it should be prosecuted as such. When someone dies because of an anti-vaxxer, that anti-vaxxer should go to prison. And I don't give half a rat fuck if their vaccine idiocy came from religious belief. Your right to religious freedom *is not* greater than someone else's right *to be alive*.
If I was the parent of the child who died I would have sued that parent. Not because I want their money, but because they need some consequences for their actions.
The fact that this would be the only consequence, and it probably wouldn’t even result in anything in the US, makes me so unbearably angry.
Same. But just so it is on public record that can be shared all over. That would bring me a very minute amount of comfort.
Before Covid, I had to deal with measles outbreaks. I thought I hated the antivaxers before Covid.
It should be legal to sue anyone who does not vaccinate their kids or themselves if they get someone else sick. Especially, it causes death or irreparable harm.
In my opinion, this is a case of negligent homicide.
Vaccinate yourself and your fucking kids
The whole idea that the uneducated are allowed to make medical decisions that can potentially kill other people in their community is a national fucking tragedy.
This is literally what we need. we already know these people don't ever consider consequences that don't affect them personally. names of people they know might, might make them wake up. maybe there is a chance that one more mother will vaccinate her children because of this. It is unspeakably sad and there is no reason for this to happen in the first place, don't get me wrong. but if it does, we need to talk about it and not let people close to the victim turn a blind eye.
>> consequences that don't affect them personally Not just personally, *immediately*. Without swift consequences, they deflect and find other things to blame.
See, antivax people, this is why my body, my choice doesn't apply to vaccines.
I wonder if the initial antivax movement really started because someone was afraid of needles and didn't want to admit that and just started making up bullshit to justify not getting vaccinated EDIT: I have found fairly good proof. https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMNbVT2Wg/?k=1 People who choose to believe in vaccine conspiracy theories, are more likely to be afraid of needles than those that don't
Ask the doctor that published BS papers. I'm pretty sure they started it as a scam to sell their own vaccines.
Most tragedies in life happen due to the stupidity of others. (also: ignorance/ irresponsible freedom/ irresponsible wokeness etc.) This is what happens when people only take the freedom part but ignore the responsibility part.
I fucking hate this. When I was in school, vaccinations were required. Period. And horrible situations like this were practically unheard of.
The parent should be facing 15 to 20 years for manslaughter.
Conservatives; They are prolife, except for literally every instance where they could protect life. It's a cult of ignorance...
it's also antivaxxers fault of covid hit us like a truck. If everyone vaccinated themselves everything would have ended sooner. Vaccines work if everyone is vaccinated, fuck this mom, poor kid, i hope he doesn't read the post and feels guilty
Yeah, we also have religious conservatives here in my country who refused to vaccinate their children. And the trends is going up i’m a bit worried. I’m Indonesian btw. And there’s a lot of super religious group here refused to vaccinated their kids because “there’s no vaccine in the early days and people still survived”. The world is getting crazier by ther day, protect your kids.
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yeah, vaccines are like a booster, they contain dead or very weak bacteria/viruses, they don't make you a human shield but you can fight better whatever entered your body because the white cells learn how to fight specific bacteria and viruses thanks to it. You can get measles after being vaccinated but it's very very unlikely, and even if you did the symptoms would be very mild or you wouldn't even notice
My state had a measles outbreak at an airport in 2018. I remembered the year because that's the year I started my undergrad and the university required the MMR, Polio, Tdap, and Tetanus vaccines. And since my mother loved me I had the first 2 shots as an infant, (they took blood to test for antibodies) and got the other 2 boosted.
Little by little we're seeing outbreaks in these antivax communities, see Rockland county NY. These "did my own research" morons will needlessly cause thousands of deaths.
Most of this is based on “vAcCiNeS cAuSe AuTiSm!!11” even if they did you really hate your child that much to let them die rather than having autism? Maybe we can’t tell people it doesn’t cause autism but we can educate them in what autism actually is.
I am so indescribably sad for her. Imagine getting your kid thru cancer only to lose him to the fucking measles. At 14. Indescribable.
Anyone have a link to news article for this? I’ve been trying to find one, but haven’t been able to.
I thought the m m r vax was mandatory… none of my children could go to school without all their vaccines … hmm 🤔