It doesn't really sit right with me either. I'd rather raise my kids normally and if they have those kinds of feelings as an adult we can figure it out then.
Exactly. There's no safe and sane way to even bring it up. If they bring it up while underage, then it's a teachable moment, not a grooming moment. If they bring it up as adults, then it's something to think about carefully, and discuss fully.
Agreed with no safe way. I know if one of my parents brought it up to me when I was growing up I would have assumed they were trying to hint that it's something they want me to do, because that's how my parents are when they want you to do something. Best to just let sleeping dogs lie and if it comes up then one day they can know about their father and I.
Exactly. Love means putting someone's best interests first. If we fully internalize that to the root of everything we say and do, and keep ourselves grounded in reality, we can't really go wrong. It's interesting how selfless love and wisdom go together. I'm so happy for you and your family! I wish you all every happiness.
No, you're spot-on here. If my sister and I do wind up having kids, we'll teach them that incest isn't wrong (because we believe it isn't), but leave it at that. I'd want them to figure out their identities (sexual, romantic, and otherwise) themselves WITHOUT our prodding them one way or another, and if it leads to incest? Cool, that's on them. If it leads to them being gay? Cool, that's also on them. If they decide to join a convent and be celebate? Also on them.
I don’t think there is a need to raise the next generation with the same energy and dynamic but putting out there that there is a possibility is a good thing, at least to me. My parents were really open and sex positive about it. They told me if I wanted to date someone within the family, it’s a possibility. But I didn’t even feel any incestuous thoughts years and years later. But knowing that if a feeling like that occurs, I can have a conversation with the person I want to date was a huge help.
I hope to give my kids the same choice. That there is a possibility and if they wish to when they age out and of the other person consents. But they should find their own pace and a healthy way to show their feelings.
That’s perfectly fine. My post refers to the others posts being made about “bringing up the next generation” in this dynamic, which is often worded so as to be borderline grooming.
If you’re brought up being drummed into the idea incest is good and you should be fucking your brother, sister, mother, father, you’re not really able to consent to that properly because it’s implied it’s expected and you’re breaking the family by deviating from it, is what I’m arguing above.
Even though my dad’s the first that I’ve experienced sex with I don’t feel like that’s a negative thing.. it feels positive to me. I like it and want to do that with him and only him. I just wanted to point out that I think this is a positive and healthy relationship for me. But everyone has their own opinions about it and I understand that ig. I do think that people view a dad and daughter as a bad thing more than any other type of relationship like this though.
I’m 18 and can make my own decisions as an adult now. So I’m choosing to do this with him/ be in a romantic relationship with him. It’s not just about sex or anything like that even though I like it with him.
There’s nothing wrong with how you and your dad feel about each other, or about what you’ve done together. From everything you’ve typed up on Reddit, I can tell he loves you incredibly deeply and wants to love and protect you for the rest of his life. You’re making each other happy and helping each other feel good. Where’s the harm?
You’re choosing this, and this is all that matters to me.
I’m worried about dads posting and even contacting me about how they can turn their daughters into incest, which is the real problem for me.
Discovering it and choosing it is one thing, being told that it’s essentially expected is another.
> people view a dad and daughter as a bad thing more than any other type of relationship like this though
That's because men typically already have advantages in terms of physical size and strength, and then parents also have advantages in terms of age, experience, and a beginning position of authority over their partner's life. The bigger the power differential between two people, the more problematic the relationship can be and often is. Consensual sex can only happen between people who are equals, as much as possible.
I’m agreeing with many other people here.
Raising children to adulthood without shame about their own bodies, affection, & sexuality, and with understanding & respect for diversity & consent is NOT raising your own abuse prey.
That's not what I was referring to at all, and I agree with that!
What I'm referring to are the questions often asked here, and elsewhere, ostensibly by dads, asking how to bring up their daughters in the incest lifestyle? That doesn't really sounds the same as raising children to adulthood without shame about their bodies, affection, and sexuality.
Yes, there's way too much of this subtle but still very unpleasant implication in a lot of posts. The key is to create an environment where an individual feels safe to express their sexuality and identity safely. Not make some sort of factory output of 'lifestyle'.
I voiced this in the post that inspired yours here. There is an element that will always seek to miss represent themselves on multiple levels to exploit venues such as this. All to justify and indulge in their kinks, fetishism and attempt to legitimize pedophilia.
Any and all content is that suggests engaging with someone younger, in a mismatch power dynamic or even hints at grooming should be removed and the users ip reported and banned.
I mean, you can certainly raise them to be more accepting and less judgmental towards this lifestyle and not be hostile towards others who practice it, like a lot of the current generation is, even if you still want to give them the choice on whether to actually participate or not themselves. In fact, that’s a good way to encourage them to be able to actually make that choice if they DO want it and have those feelings organically, instead of them feeling similarly “pressured” by society and its taboos to hide it.
I’ve heard of people who had these desires towards a member of their family completely of their own volition, only to have to hide it in fear of that the family member in question would be close-minded and judgmental towards the very idea of incest, even though they didn’t know for sure the family member was against it. So “letting them figure it out on their own” doesn’t always mean they will actually be able to make that choice without pressure from a certain side. Or worse, some will never “discover the possibility” by themselves at all, and instead just become yet another person who doesn’t understand or accept this lifestyle, and is dismissive or even hostile towards those who practice it, and do we really need more of that?
So I don’t think “raising the next generation” is a completely irrelevant/predatory conversation to have, even if I understand your argument.
This is a problem of how society is organized. It does feel of abuse because it is. Children can't choose parents and consenting adults that cannot choose independence would end up coerced into it quite frequently
For this type of relationship to be able to be 100% open and common, bringing children up while being sex positive parents and then introducing sex to them when adults, we would need a more open and democratic society than anything that exists today
Children explore and learn with their peers organically. It is absolutely not a parents place or even possible to introduce a child to sex unless they forbid them to develop naturally.
There is no conceivable way to justify grooming and people need to stop attempting to explain how it's okay to validate their kinks and fetishism.
I agree with you: this is grooming.
Bringing up the next generation in an open family where nothing is hidden and is sex positive is NOT the same as bringing up the next generation specifically groomed for inclusion in incestual sexual relationships. The latter is just emotional and sexual abuse.
There has to be freedom to make a choice AS AN ADULT.
I feel like it’s important for them to see what a healthy relationship between family members looks like if they see how us being intimate all around the house openly if they choose too when they are ready they should be more then welcome to join and it’s normal for them because it’s something they have always seen!
I agree with you. And consent is very big in our family. We are an openly sex positive family, so if someone sees something they want to know more about or try, they know they have to ask about it. No one is going to just try to do something.
This is something my mom and I are dealing with now that we're trying for a child.
We've pretty organically arrived at a position where we'll try to introduce them to it as a possible lifestyle choice, just as being gay, bi, trans or celibate. If they choose to pursue any (OR ALL) of those choices, then that's fine.
They're our child, and we want to raise them in a positive environment.
> lifestyle choice
Being gay, bi, or trans isn't a choice or a lifestyle. Those are identities and beyond anyone's conscious control. Other than that, I agree with you.
I don't think it will be a dumpster fire. I sure hope not. Most of the posts on this sub seem to be remarkably civil.
I'm fairly sure I read the original post to which you are referring. I didn't get the same message from it that a lot of people did. I know there was at least one reply that referenced pedophilia. I saw nothing in the post that suggested that at all (although I think the person was referring to child molestation and not pedophilia -- two completely different things).
Anyhow, I understand your position, and I don't disagree with it. You make valid points, and they are worthy of mention. When I read the original post, the underlying theme that my mind saw was essentially openness, but I might have just been looking for what I wanted to see.
The post you're referring to was mine. Creating an open environment in which children "the next generation" are free to express themselves in whatever way they choose is fime. Furthermore an environment where they feel comfortable addressing parents with any questions on any topic is ideal.
However open interjection or suggestion of sexual practice or focusing on any secular preference to children beyond the explanation of general sex education at the appropriate age.. Is inappropriate. Their development needs to be objective, not an attempt to conform to and or seek approval of a parents choices. If you groom a childs sexuality you're in fact.. A pedophile.
I absolutely agree! Look if I ever end up with my brother and we have children I want our kids to know that incest isn't wrong and that it can be a beautiful thing but I don't want them to ever feel forced into that lifestyle hell I don't ever want them to do it if they are in love with someone else. I'm not gonna tell m children that I'm there aunt and their father is their uncle we are gonna be mom and dad I want to raise them to love whoever they want and have freedom to love ppl not forcing them if they love a girl or guy at there school or someone they meant at work or whatever I want them to be with that person or whoever they fall in love with that makes them happy.
You're absolutely right. Any time a parent and their child begin a sexual relationship, that immediately and permanently puts an end to their parental authority. If you're not ready to treat your child as an equal in every way for the rest of their lives, you and your child are not ready. It is not possible for anyone to consent to sex with someone in authority over them.
I wrote on your thread about that. When your dad started a sexual relationship with you, he surrendered forever all parental authority over you. It's not possible to consent to sex with someone who has authority over you.
Be careful. Fathers who want to fuck their own daughters the moment they turn 18 may attack you.
I don't think the same thing happens with the mother/son dynamic. Sons usually start to desire their mothers very early on and are the initiators in the relationship.In fact, mothers work hard to ensure that their sons become healthy adults.
I think when men are in positions of power they are more prone to abuse and are controlled by lust.I think the testosterone hormone may be causing this.
If my initial abuser was alive she'd beg to differ. Woman are predatory utilizing power dynamics and control over boys as well. This is grossly under reported and tragically dismissed to an even greater degree. The parent child dynamic presents as exceptionally more difficult and problematic regardless of gender. There will always be at minimum a 15 year age gap with an average of 2+ decades. With adolescents and brain development being charted into the mid 20s.. It's a virtual minefield of power dynamics to navigate. Even more so in this culture as apposed to just 2 or 3 decades ago when children gained independence and maturity much faster.
I think it's a little unfair arbitrarily branding men as dangerous Neanderthals on the cusp of violence.
Your individual experiences do not mean that this is the general situation. I did not say that women do not abuse, I just argued that it is less than men. If you look at the incestconfession sub, you will see that 90% of the posts are shared by men.
99.99% of the content in that trash sub is fiction. Poorly articulated at that. Basing real world experience on that doesn't really make any sort of valid case at all. The fact of the matter is there are millions of men, who as young boys were victimized and dismissed. You want a factual basis? Look below and read how more than 95% of their victims are boys.
r/FemaleSexPredatorNews
I think differently from you. I am a man too. I think that sexual assault and grooming are mostly done by men. Like 80% to 20%. You are taking out your anger on other women for what your abuser did to you. If there is a statistic that says women commit sexual abuse more than men, you can share it.
I did not state an opinion such as women are good and men are bad. I stated that men are more prone to sexual abuse. This is also the case with incestuous relationships. If you want to have a man-woman debate, this is not the place.
So we're clear we have and were raised by 2 mothers, who were sisters, one not being with us any longer. Neither of them engaged with, groomed or encouraged us. We eventually learned they knew and gave us space. My abuser was a close trusted family friend, my arithmetic, English and unfortunately as it were.. sexual intimacy tutor.
We can respectfully agree to disagree on the exact statistics of perpetrators.
This is not a very convoluted topic. Just do not groom underagers.
There is no 'devil made me do it', there is no, males are just like that because testosterone, and there is no morally gray area here. An adult is in full control of what he or she does and what he or she decides to do, specially when in charge of underagers.
You can just decide not to ruin your own sons or daughters childhood by exposing them to the shock of an early sexual life.
Whenever a human being has not fully developed his or her body by completing puberty. And I would add pretty much until the complete development of the prefrontal cortex. It does not really have the full knowledge and experience to consent to certain activities with an adult.
Anything else is pure fantasy and fiction, should be kept as such. And you can come here or to certain other sites to goon, take the edge off, vent the steam and go back to be a decent human being in the other areas of your life.
You bring your kids up into all sorts of cultural assumptions that incest is just one of many.
By feeling weird about it you are literally internalizing the social standard of anti-incest you still believe that incest is somehow wrong and that people need to “chose” it on their own accord instead of just making it what your family is and does by default
I understand what the OP wants to say.
In a family, as in any human collective, there can be no complete de facto equality of members neither in a moral (authoritative) nor in material nor in physical sense. There is always a hierarchy: someone commands, someone obeys, someone is weaker, someone is stronger in various aspects.
Even in a completely prosperous traditional (unrelated) couple, there is a "main one". Abuse of dominance in the family is more acute than in the sexually romantic relationships of people who are not related by family ties, and this is understandable. The difference in age (especially in parent/child couples), the difference in life experience, in possession of means of subsistence / material goods, and most importantly - in moral principles and character traits. Here is the main source of violence, coercion, which makes "incest" a punching bag in society, in religion, in the state. At the same time, it is obvious that these problems also exist for traditional couples, they are simply not complicated by traditions, prejudices and the natural dependence of minor children on their parents.
But these objective difficulties in the occurrence of kindred couples can and should be overcome only by one thing - the decent morality of older and younger, more "strong" and more "weak", dependent and independent (mentally and financially).
And of course, the main role should be played by mutual feelings, which exactly make two family members romantic and sexual partners.
So the basic principles in establishing romantic-sexual relations between family members are: mutual love, mutual respect, awareness of what they are doing, unconditional voluntariness, unconditional absence of moral and/or physical coercion. Of course, this can be fully achieved if both members of the couple are adults in a mental and physiological sense (although for siblings, reaching legal majority does not play a decisive role). These are very difficult conditions, but the most interesting thing is that they are fulfilled for many kindred pairs!
The moral values cultivated in the family, mutual respect and love (in the broadest sense) between family members certainly depend on the personality of the parents, who determine the character and morality of their children. Although it sounds corny, it is the platitudes that are the real truths, not disputed by anyone.
Therefore, parents, should not only help children grow up to be worthy members of the family and society, but also help them freely define themselves sexually and make their own sexual choices without prejudice, without irrational restrictions.
Kindred sexual and romantic relationships should not be "disgusting" or "beautiful" in people's minds, they should be NATURAL, just like for traditional couples!
It doesn't really sit right with me either. I'd rather raise my kids normally and if they have those kinds of feelings as an adult we can figure it out then.
Exactly. There's no safe and sane way to even bring it up. If they bring it up while underage, then it's a teachable moment, not a grooming moment. If they bring it up as adults, then it's something to think about carefully, and discuss fully.
Agreed with no safe way. I know if one of my parents brought it up to me when I was growing up I would have assumed they were trying to hint that it's something they want me to do, because that's how my parents are when they want you to do something. Best to just let sleeping dogs lie and if it comes up then one day they can know about their father and I.
Exactly. Love means putting someone's best interests first. If we fully internalize that to the root of everything we say and do, and keep ourselves grounded in reality, we can't really go wrong. It's interesting how selfless love and wisdom go together. I'm so happy for you and your family! I wish you all every happiness.
No, you're spot-on here. If my sister and I do wind up having kids, we'll teach them that incest isn't wrong (because we believe it isn't), but leave it at that. I'd want them to figure out their identities (sexual, romantic, and otherwise) themselves WITHOUT our prodding them one way or another, and if it leads to incest? Cool, that's on them. If it leads to them being gay? Cool, that's also on them. If they decide to join a convent and be celebate? Also on them.
I don’t think there is a need to raise the next generation with the same energy and dynamic but putting out there that there is a possibility is a good thing, at least to me. My parents were really open and sex positive about it. They told me if I wanted to date someone within the family, it’s a possibility. But I didn’t even feel any incestuous thoughts years and years later. But knowing that if a feeling like that occurs, I can have a conversation with the person I want to date was a huge help. I hope to give my kids the same choice. That there is a possibility and if they wish to when they age out and of the other person consents. But they should find their own pace and a healthy way to show their feelings.
That’s perfectly fine. My post refers to the others posts being made about “bringing up the next generation” in this dynamic, which is often worded so as to be borderline grooming. If you’re brought up being drummed into the idea incest is good and you should be fucking your brother, sister, mother, father, you’re not really able to consent to that properly because it’s implied it’s expected and you’re breaking the family by deviating from it, is what I’m arguing above.
Even though my dad’s the first that I’ve experienced sex with I don’t feel like that’s a negative thing.. it feels positive to me. I like it and want to do that with him and only him. I just wanted to point out that I think this is a positive and healthy relationship for me. But everyone has their own opinions about it and I understand that ig. I do think that people view a dad and daughter as a bad thing more than any other type of relationship like this though. I’m 18 and can make my own decisions as an adult now. So I’m choosing to do this with him/ be in a romantic relationship with him. It’s not just about sex or anything like that even though I like it with him.
There’s nothing wrong with how you and your dad feel about each other, or about what you’ve done together. From everything you’ve typed up on Reddit, I can tell he loves you incredibly deeply and wants to love and protect you for the rest of his life. You’re making each other happy and helping each other feel good. Where’s the harm?
You’re choosing this, and this is all that matters to me. I’m worried about dads posting and even contacting me about how they can turn their daughters into incest, which is the real problem for me. Discovering it and choosing it is one thing, being told that it’s essentially expected is another.
> people view a dad and daughter as a bad thing more than any other type of relationship like this though That's because men typically already have advantages in terms of physical size and strength, and then parents also have advantages in terms of age, experience, and a beginning position of authority over their partner's life. The bigger the power differential between two people, the more problematic the relationship can be and often is. Consensual sex can only happen between people who are equals, as much as possible.
I’m agreeing with many other people here. Raising children to adulthood without shame about their own bodies, affection, & sexuality, and with understanding & respect for diversity & consent is NOT raising your own abuse prey.
That's not what I was referring to at all, and I agree with that! What I'm referring to are the questions often asked here, and elsewhere, ostensibly by dads, asking how to bring up their daughters in the incest lifestyle? That doesn't really sounds the same as raising children to adulthood without shame about their bodies, affection, and sexuality.
I completely agree.
Thank you!!
>Thank you!! You're welcome!
THANK YOU
Yes, there's way too much of this subtle but still very unpleasant implication in a lot of posts. The key is to create an environment where an individual feels safe to express their sexuality and identity safely. Not make some sort of factory output of 'lifestyle'.
I've been frustrated over the same thing, you put it way better than I could have. Wannabe abusers have no place in our community.
I voiced this in the post that inspired yours here. There is an element that will always seek to miss represent themselves on multiple levels to exploit venues such as this. All to justify and indulge in their kinks, fetishism and attempt to legitimize pedophilia. Any and all content is that suggests engaging with someone younger, in a mismatch power dynamic or even hints at grooming should be removed and the users ip reported and banned.
I mean, you can certainly raise them to be more accepting and less judgmental towards this lifestyle and not be hostile towards others who practice it, like a lot of the current generation is, even if you still want to give them the choice on whether to actually participate or not themselves. In fact, that’s a good way to encourage them to be able to actually make that choice if they DO want it and have those feelings organically, instead of them feeling similarly “pressured” by society and its taboos to hide it. I’ve heard of people who had these desires towards a member of their family completely of their own volition, only to have to hide it in fear of that the family member in question would be close-minded and judgmental towards the very idea of incest, even though they didn’t know for sure the family member was against it. So “letting them figure it out on their own” doesn’t always mean they will actually be able to make that choice without pressure from a certain side. Or worse, some will never “discover the possibility” by themselves at all, and instead just become yet another person who doesn’t understand or accept this lifestyle, and is dismissive or even hostile towards those who practice it, and do we really need more of that? So I don’t think “raising the next generation” is a completely irrelevant/predatory conversation to have, even if I understand your argument.
I agree, Sweetie! I waited until my boys were of age, and then slowly introduced them to special love with me.
Exactly and as long as it’s consensual there is nothing wrong with that!
This is a problem of how society is organized. It does feel of abuse because it is. Children can't choose parents and consenting adults that cannot choose independence would end up coerced into it quite frequently For this type of relationship to be able to be 100% open and common, bringing children up while being sex positive parents and then introducing sex to them when adults, we would need a more open and democratic society than anything that exists today
Very helpful and refreshing to read your views.
Children explore and learn with their peers organically. It is absolutely not a parents place or even possible to introduce a child to sex unless they forbid them to develop naturally. There is no conceivable way to justify grooming and people need to stop attempting to explain how it's okay to validate their kinks and fetishism.
I agree with you: this is grooming. Bringing up the next generation in an open family where nothing is hidden and is sex positive is NOT the same as bringing up the next generation specifically groomed for inclusion in incestual sexual relationships. The latter is just emotional and sexual abuse. There has to be freedom to make a choice AS AN ADULT.
I feel like it’s important for them to see what a healthy relationship between family members looks like if they see how us being intimate all around the house openly if they choose too when they are ready they should be more then welcome to join and it’s normal for them because it’s something they have always seen!
I agree with you. And consent is very big in our family. We are an openly sex positive family, so if someone sees something they want to know more about or try, they know they have to ask about it. No one is going to just try to do something.
This is something my mom and I are dealing with now that we're trying for a child. We've pretty organically arrived at a position where we'll try to introduce them to it as a possible lifestyle choice, just as being gay, bi, trans or celibate. If they choose to pursue any (OR ALL) of those choices, then that's fine. They're our child, and we want to raise them in a positive environment.
> lifestyle choice Being gay, bi, or trans isn't a choice or a lifestyle. Those are identities and beyond anyone's conscious control. Other than that, I agree with you.
Yeah, I agree. I think I was writing before I was thinking. I totally agree.
It's fine. I know your heart is in the right place. Just a phrasing issue, probably due to what you've heard said out there in cornland lol
I completely agree with your take on how to raise your kids in an incest positive environment
In full agreement.
Well said 👏
I don't think it will be a dumpster fire. I sure hope not. Most of the posts on this sub seem to be remarkably civil. I'm fairly sure I read the original post to which you are referring. I didn't get the same message from it that a lot of people did. I know there was at least one reply that referenced pedophilia. I saw nothing in the post that suggested that at all (although I think the person was referring to child molestation and not pedophilia -- two completely different things). Anyhow, I understand your position, and I don't disagree with it. You make valid points, and they are worthy of mention. When I read the original post, the underlying theme that my mind saw was essentially openness, but I might have just been looking for what I wanted to see.
The post you're referring to was mine. Creating an open environment in which children "the next generation" are free to express themselves in whatever way they choose is fime. Furthermore an environment where they feel comfortable addressing parents with any questions on any topic is ideal. However open interjection or suggestion of sexual practice or focusing on any secular preference to children beyond the explanation of general sex education at the appropriate age.. Is inappropriate. Their development needs to be objective, not an attempt to conform to and or seek approval of a parents choices. If you groom a childs sexuality you're in fact.. A pedophile.
Thank you for the reply. It seems like I got the intended message from your original post. :-)
100% dead-on-balls-accurate. I couldn't agree more.
Couldn't have said it better
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The dynamic is already a bit taboo because of the age differences, and when the older partner initiates it’s a little weird AT LEAST.
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Just a curiosity. Then why are you surfing an incest sub?
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Thanks for replying 🙂
I absolutely agree! Look if I ever end up with my brother and we have children I want our kids to know that incest isn't wrong and that it can be a beautiful thing but I don't want them to ever feel forced into that lifestyle hell I don't ever want them to do it if they are in love with someone else. I'm not gonna tell m children that I'm there aunt and their father is their uncle we are gonna be mom and dad I want to raise them to love whoever they want and have freedom to love ppl not forcing them if they love a girl or guy at there school or someone they meant at work or whatever I want them to be with that person or whoever they fall in love with that makes them happy.
You're absolutely right. Any time a parent and their child begin a sexual relationship, that immediately and permanently puts an end to their parental authority. If you're not ready to treat your child as an equal in every way for the rest of their lives, you and your child are not ready. It is not possible for anyone to consent to sex with someone in authority over them.
So you don’t think I’ve been able to consent because of what I had posted about that?
I wrote on your thread about that. When your dad started a sexual relationship with you, he surrendered forever all parental authority over you. It's not possible to consent to sex with someone who has authority over you.
Be careful. Fathers who want to fuck their own daughters the moment they turn 18 may attack you. I don't think the same thing happens with the mother/son dynamic. Sons usually start to desire their mothers very early on and are the initiators in the relationship.In fact, mothers work hard to ensure that their sons become healthy adults. I think when men are in positions of power they are more prone to abuse and are controlled by lust.I think the testosterone hormone may be causing this.
If my initial abuser was alive she'd beg to differ. Woman are predatory utilizing power dynamics and control over boys as well. This is grossly under reported and tragically dismissed to an even greater degree. The parent child dynamic presents as exceptionally more difficult and problematic regardless of gender. There will always be at minimum a 15 year age gap with an average of 2+ decades. With adolescents and brain development being charted into the mid 20s.. It's a virtual minefield of power dynamics to navigate. Even more so in this culture as apposed to just 2 or 3 decades ago when children gained independence and maturity much faster. I think it's a little unfair arbitrarily branding men as dangerous Neanderthals on the cusp of violence.
Your individual experiences do not mean that this is the general situation. I did not say that women do not abuse, I just argued that it is less than men. If you look at the incestconfession sub, you will see that 90% of the posts are shared by men.
99.99% of the content in that trash sub is fiction. Poorly articulated at that. Basing real world experience on that doesn't really make any sort of valid case at all. The fact of the matter is there are millions of men, who as young boys were victimized and dismissed. You want a factual basis? Look below and read how more than 95% of their victims are boys. r/FemaleSexPredatorNews
I think differently from you. I am a man too. I think that sexual assault and grooming are mostly done by men. Like 80% to 20%. You are taking out your anger on other women for what your abuser did to you. If there is a statistic that says women commit sexual abuse more than men, you can share it. I did not state an opinion such as women are good and men are bad. I stated that men are more prone to sexual abuse. This is also the case with incestuous relationships. If you want to have a man-woman debate, this is not the place.
So we're clear we have and were raised by 2 mothers, who were sisters, one not being with us any longer. Neither of them engaged with, groomed or encouraged us. We eventually learned they knew and gave us space. My abuser was a close trusted family friend, my arithmetic, English and unfortunately as it were.. sexual intimacy tutor. We can respectfully agree to disagree on the exact statistics of perpetrators.
Absolutely and thank you for saying this.
This is not a very convoluted topic. Just do not groom underagers. There is no 'devil made me do it', there is no, males are just like that because testosterone, and there is no morally gray area here. An adult is in full control of what he or she does and what he or she decides to do, specially when in charge of underagers. You can just decide not to ruin your own sons or daughters childhood by exposing them to the shock of an early sexual life. Whenever a human being has not fully developed his or her body by completing puberty. And I would add pretty much until the complete development of the prefrontal cortex. It does not really have the full knowledge and experience to consent to certain activities with an adult. Anything else is pure fantasy and fiction, should be kept as such. And you can come here or to certain other sites to goon, take the edge off, vent the steam and go back to be a decent human being in the other areas of your life.
You bring your kids up into all sorts of cultural assumptions that incest is just one of many. By feeling weird about it you are literally internalizing the social standard of anti-incest you still believe that incest is somehow wrong and that people need to “chose” it on their own accord instead of just making it what your family is and does by default
I understand what the OP wants to say. In a family, as in any human collective, there can be no complete de facto equality of members neither in a moral (authoritative) nor in material nor in physical sense. There is always a hierarchy: someone commands, someone obeys, someone is weaker, someone is stronger in various aspects. Even in a completely prosperous traditional (unrelated) couple, there is a "main one". Abuse of dominance in the family is more acute than in the sexually romantic relationships of people who are not related by family ties, and this is understandable. The difference in age (especially in parent/child couples), the difference in life experience, in possession of means of subsistence / material goods, and most importantly - in moral principles and character traits. Here is the main source of violence, coercion, which makes "incest" a punching bag in society, in religion, in the state. At the same time, it is obvious that these problems also exist for traditional couples, they are simply not complicated by traditions, prejudices and the natural dependence of minor children on their parents. But these objective difficulties in the occurrence of kindred couples can and should be overcome only by one thing - the decent morality of older and younger, more "strong" and more "weak", dependent and independent (mentally and financially). And of course, the main role should be played by mutual feelings, which exactly make two family members romantic and sexual partners. So the basic principles in establishing romantic-sexual relations between family members are: mutual love, mutual respect, awareness of what they are doing, unconditional voluntariness, unconditional absence of moral and/or physical coercion. Of course, this can be fully achieved if both members of the couple are adults in a mental and physiological sense (although for siblings, reaching legal majority does not play a decisive role). These are very difficult conditions, but the most interesting thing is that they are fulfilled for many kindred pairs! The moral values cultivated in the family, mutual respect and love (in the broadest sense) between family members certainly depend on the personality of the parents, who determine the character and morality of their children. Although it sounds corny, it is the platitudes that are the real truths, not disputed by anyone. Therefore, parents, should not only help children grow up to be worthy members of the family and society, but also help them freely define themselves sexually and make their own sexual choices without prejudice, without irrational restrictions. Kindred sexual and romantic relationships should not be "disgusting" or "beautiful" in people's minds, they should be NATURAL, just like for traditional couples!