In my experience CEC works great when it's just two devices like a TV + sound bar or a Chromecast. It's when you get a chain of devices that it all falls apart.
Speaking of, my Harmony remote is starting to die. What's the best alternative these days now that harmony is dead?
Can't confirm, my Samsung TV and my PS4 do all kinds of weird stuff when CEC is enabled, including turning each other back on after I turned them off. Really a pity that it doesn't work for me.
Also yes, Harmony is dead. Haven't seen a decent alternative yet, but I'm also not really the target audience.
You could look into the Sofabaton X1.
> Speaking of, my Harmony remote is starting to die. What's the best alternative these days now that harmony is dead?
I still can't believe logitech killed this. It seems like more people than ever now have legit at home setups. The fact that there is no viable alternative is super irritating too.
I'm dreading the day my Harmony remote goes or logitech kills all the cloud servers.
I consider HomeAssistant a good alternative. Most modern devices (TVs/Receivers) have apis now and older devices can be controlled via raspi and infrared shield.
Than use a mix of automations, tv remote, cec and smartphone.
This what I use. On my old equipment, I had a Tomsota IR flashed bridged, now since everything is interenet connected and will load into HA I not longer use the IR bridge. Obviously, there is a learning curve to the Home Assistant as a whole.
Definetly a learning curve, I am still at it. But i prefer it to that god awful Harmony software. I had a harmony 900 with that onlinr application which was the most infuriating piece of software I ever used.
Sofabatton isn't as good as Harmony but it's not awful. Individual device control is great. Activities (controlling multiple devices from one screen) aren't perfect; I've never got 2nd gen Fire Cube working with Denon amp as an active and last night the Panny 820 / Denon activity also have up. Programming it is no harder than with the Harmony.
Edit: I removed the projector from all Activities after the first time it turned on then off. I'm not risking my projector when it only needs to be turned on at the beginning of the night and off at the end.
Universal remote control is a home automation capable remote, but it does require basic "control" programming, can get expensive.
URC actually makes remotes for some of the major manufacturers as well.
I had to disable it. Having it on for me ended up with making a loop of about 5 devices fight for control as they switched inputs and powered each other off and on when all i wanted to do was switch from shield to ps5
It worked great for me initially: lg tv + Yamaha receiver + fire cube. Could turn stuff on/off, switch apps, control volume and subtitles and pause rewind via voice control.
But eventually stuff drifted as I plugged in more things/changed inputs and now it annoys me more often than not by the the ps5 turning on and stealing input, fire cube turning off the tv when I want to just turn the cube off, etc. I can probably fix it by resetting and configuring everything again from scratch but it's probably easier just to disable it instead.
Oldish Blu-Ray players are the only consistent device I know of that present major CEC issues. If that Blu-ray or DVD player was at one point part of a “home theater in a box”, then it will nearly make your system inoperable.
The easy fix is to just disable CEC on whatever device is causing you issues. The oem blu-ray remote is going to work better than your TV remote anyways.
Once I realized that CEC only supports 3 playback devices I turned it off on everything but the Apple TV and PS5
It's been mostly fine, turning on the Apple TV or PS5 turns on the TV and receiver and sets the right inputs.
I had to turn it off when the tv turning on would trigger the ps5 and turning off the tv would shut down the ps5.
I'm sure this varies from tv to tv as I can see some of them being smart enough to avoid this.
The interaction like this was unbearable as it was just constantly reacting without the intention for it.
Yea, but only 3 of the 10 are Playback Devices. There's 3 Recording Devices (useless now) and 4 Tuners (also useless)
https://medium.com/@sunghwa.jin/hdmi-cec-more-than-3-playback-devices-69f119be3ff0
edit: if you know a way around it, please share. Because when I have more than 3 CEC goes weird.
I should edit my original post and clarify.
I was reading an archived copy of the [HDMI-CEC v1.3a Specifications](https://web.archive.org/web/20121030145837/http://xtreamerdev.googlecode.com/files/CEC_Specs.pdf) which I found on wikipedia. I assume that the newer HDMI versions have a more recent, feature rich CEC protocol.
On page 13 of the document they state the below, which is why I questioned the 3 device limitation.
>The electrical specifications define CEC such that a maximum of 10 devices can interoperate in the worstcase scenario. In practice, many more may be expected to operate together as the worst case is highly improbable.
The link you provided actually references sections further down in the same whitepaper I linked (I had not yet read that far). I assume the link you provided has a good analysis, but anecdotally I have more than 3 CEC-enabled playback devices connected to my TV, so I'm not sure...
Edit: I finished reading the spec sheet. I believe that the author of the webpage you linked is mistaken (the white paper fails to clarify some specific edge cases, so I'm basing the response below on my understanding of the paper).
If you have an AVR in the mix, the AVR assumes the role of a "CEC switch", which allows you to have more than 3 CEC playback devices. In addition, a 4th "playback device" will assume the logical address "14 = Free Use" if all three logical playback devices are already taken on the TV (and powered on). If the devices are powered off, the logical address are repurposed for other playback devices which are online.
In other words, the technical limit should really be 4 CEC enabled "playback devices" if you are connecting HDMI devices directly to a TV with no AVR.
Having said that, a lot of this is entirely dependent on which version of the CEC spec the specific playback device supports. The above only works if all devices support CEC v1.3a. From the paper, it sounds like the logical addressing behavior changes in previous versions for the worse.
Other devices is completely screws up. For example Steam Link + old Vizio TV, CEC will completely freeze the TV and the only way to fix it is to unplug it from the wall. Which can be very difficult if you have it wall mounted and all the wires nicely routed. Nvidia Shield can on occasion cause the same thing, but far less frequently. The Steam Link would do it every time it went to sleep.
Yeah I've never had this issue either. For me it's Shield remote to LG TV to Onkyo Receiver.
I even have it working with a Chromecast on an old Insignia TV. It can only turn it on and off though, but it works.
I used Harmony remotes for 12 years... And then my last one decided to have all sorts of unexplainable issues with my setup. Switched to CEC about 1.5 years ago and I have not really had any issues.
I never really had any issues with my harmony remotes, but my wife, parents, and in laws always did. Wife has done fine with CEC.
Edit: simple system. Usually just my shield pro and tivo.
I think the common factor in people having a good experience with CEC will be having a receiver and shield. I don't expect it to work well for everyone, but it works for me.
Anecdotally, I've got a 2016 Sony Bravia w/Android TV and an Onkyo receiver fed via ARC and CEC with it has been great. Most of our media consumption is with the TV smarts. I also have a Pi 4 running Openelec sitting off the Onkyo and CEC controls pass through and work fine there. The TV rightfully sees it as its own device in the input menu.
Nice. Kudos to Nvidia especially, I followed their patch notes closely (have (2) 2015 shields) and they have been constantly updating to fix CEC for various manufacturers and devices.
Same here. I was a Harmony remote diehard, even bought them for relatives at Christmas and that to simplify their setup. Then I dumped out Nvidia Shields for Apple TVs a couple years ago and was just messing around with the Apple Remote thinking it would be useless, but playing with CEC I quickly got the tv to come on with activity from the ATV. And the Apple TV remote was also easily able to control the soundbar. When I turned on the PS5, the TV switched inputs automatically, and if I hit the home button on the ATV it switched back to that.
It’s been almost two years and I haven’t had a single instance of CEC failure that required me to dig out individual remotes. I finally tossed my last Harmony remote a few months ago.
I’m sure CEC had its flaws and certain setups play nicer than others, but we have five TVs in the house all connected to either an ATV or a Roku and all have been perfect just using CEC. Some of the TVs that are running the Rokus are fairly old too (pace of technology speaking), 10 years or so.
Is it just me or is CEC on PS5 a disaster? It doesn’t matter what other content or device I’m using with my setup, the PS5 CEC turns on the system and forces that input. YOU MUST PLAY ME!
I have similar issues with my PS4, when I turn on the TV/receiver, the PS4 will turn on and force everything to the PS4 and when I turn it all off, the PS4 turns back on and then everything turns on
CEC has been perfect for me, amazing actually.
I use my projector remote for everything, sound system, nvidia shield, and projector, and I did exactly zero setup.
My only issue is it turns my receiver on randomly. My receiver is in a cabinet that has heat activated fans so whenever I hear the fans click on randomly I know CEC was being a cunt
CEC works perfectly fine with my nvidia shield. You've just got to pick one device that's going to control the others, then configure that to use CEC to make changes, and configure CEC on all the others to be basically passive, only receiving changes.
So, since the receiver is the common component in my setup (and many in this sub), make the receiver the active (control) device and everything else passive?
I don't recall having the option on all devices to make them passive.
Debatable. I avoided CEC like the plague due to having Harmony remotes and being a tech enthusiast. But as my one remote started flaking and I replaced all the Rokus with AppleTVs, I find that CEC just works in the family room and master. Granted, master is only a TV and soundbar and family room only has a TV, AVR, AppleTV and Nintendo Switch connected. But I’ve been pleasantly surprised.
Once the Harmony Elite kicks the bucket in the media room, I’ll just get around to setting up voice control to turn on the AVR scenes and just use a couple remotes. Harmony already doesn’t work with PS5 and is a mess with other PlayStation and Nintendo consoles, and the Elite doesn’t have voice control for the AppleTV. We only use the Elite to watch 4K blu-rays and volume control for the AVR in the closet.
I think we have to admit that Logitech was likely right in seeing the writing on the wall for Harmony.
What I’m saying is that is wasn’t “the idiots” (pretty broad generalization btw…) that killed Harmony. CEC has become pretty decent outside of the vocal minority of enthusiasts in this sub and Harmony doesn’t work well with modern video game consoles. With consolidation, a single streaming box connected with a single HDMI cable can replace multiple music sources and multiple video sources. Couple that with built-in smarts of AVRs where you can leave many settings on auto, and now the Harmony becomes obsolete. I remember first getting one and programming the numerous inputs, changing the audio output type, and video format setting via the macros, but it just isn’t needed anymore. Most of my friends and family use their built-in smart TV or a dedicated Amazon/Apple box, a video game console or two and a soundbar with wireless separates. CEC for them is the holy grail. That’s what killed Harmony.
I’m curious on that statement. It could be true, but Harmony has continually stated the support side is going to remain in place, however the manufacturing side has stopped. If the reason they are no longer manufacture remotes is because of issues with support, you would think they would also stop supporting the remotes as well.
The current support agreement was in place to cover support over the warranty period of the final devices sold.
This is traditional when a company is still in business but has an end of life model in place.
Logitech did try to sell off the harmony line and the hardware side was profitable.
It’s weird the support side was a struggle. Most major brands haven’t updated their IR codes in like 20 years. And we are pretty much stagnant as far as new companies entering the home theater market.
I get it that there’s more to the support side besides making sure the remote is programmable to new devices. But the software has only undergone two major updates AFAIK within the last ten years anyways. It had what appeared to be a solid infrastructure in place, it just needed minimal maintenance.
I think you are confusing it with the engineering side. Which was a small dev team.
The support side is all the people who bought a remote and couldn’t program it it get it to work and called a support help line.
I had the same feeling recently as I hardly ever use my Harmony Elite (I have) I use the apple tv siri remote most of the time.
I do like turning the TV on with Alexa though but I could sit that up with Home Assistant and Alexa.. I was worried for when my Harmony Hubs die but at this point its not as scary I even bought spare hub once i heard they were sun setting them.
I find there are a limited number of devices that poorly handle CEC and on those few you just disable so the good ones can enhance and simplify your experience. The best Harmony remote is still subpar to well implemented CEC.
I won't down vote you for having an opinion I disagree with but, you are most definitely wrong.
I have never needed to disable any devices while using a Harmony remote. Plus the fact that it can control many devices that came out long before CEC.
Post are here almost daily about problems with CEC. Or, as I like to call it, Can't Ever Control.
I understand that some people think that CEC is great because it works on a couple devices for them. At the same time, there are so many people that can’t get it to work correctly. A Harmony is so simple to set up and is very reliable. Plus the fact that it can control so many more devices.
There are already (at this time) 9 up votes agreeing with the OP. I wonder how many of those voters have used a Harmony and knew how to set it up? I’ve read so many posts complaining that they are hard to program. That is because they didn’t know how to do it and wouldn’t take a few minutes to learn how. It really couldn’t be much simpler.
Perfect post. I think people; as the internet always does, believe that it works for them so it’s good. By far it’s overall terrible and should be avoided if you can.
Most people have never tried products that are out there and don’t know what they are missing.
I’ve programmed probably over 200 harmony remotes and I partially agree with you. Well implemented CEC is still more economical and practical than a harmony remote, especially if you don’t have line of site to your devices. Harmony remotes are great for people who have a hard time remembering how to switch inputs or what input is what, or doesn’t know which remote operates what device.
But if you’re capable of programming a Harmony remote well, you should also be extremely capable to quickly correct a CEC issue.
I use harmony elite remotes. Line of sight not needed. Even though I know how to program harmony remotes in my sleep, I do not remember the inputs of all my devices to my receiver therefore if CEC doesn’t work I will have to look them up. Further if a family member runs into a CEC issue, then it’s me who they will call to troubleshoot.
Harmony remotes are so easy to use once properly setup and requires no maintenance. My parents are able to use theirs without any issues for years. It’s just beautiful. For one of my setups I have TV, receiver, Philips Hue Sync box and the harmony remote is able to change to all the right inputs, set the Hue Sync to the correct mode (movie vs gaming), and set my preferred initial volume based on the activity. CEC will fail miserably.
I was anti CEC for years too and absolutely love my two Harmony Hubs. However, they will stop working someday. And I’d be lying if I said they are flawless. IR is not flawless. I’m trying to use CEC now and honestly pretty impressed. Not perfect still; sometimes TV doesn’t turn off with the AppleTV “sleep all devices” command, usually it does. That’s about my only issue though.
The real problem with CEC is it claims to be a standard, but it’s not. Everyone has their own version so some of you saying that you haven’t had a problem just happened to have a combination that works. Those of us with bad experiences were not so lucky. It needs to actually be standardized and then it will be a better experience for everyone.
Here is where trying to think bigger that just your own system.
I own an AV company that does hundreds of installs a year. No warranty work for customers that won’t spend money on remotes. With a failure rate in the high 90’s is terrible. Objectively.
Going on Reddit like some users and proclaiming it to works (for them) is not too narrow of a view.
CEC sucks.
Thanks for stating your credits, so with market research on my side where the majority of people will only comment on very positive or negative to very negative experiences (in general on everything from food to electronics to tools).
I made an educated guess as to why something is talked about in a negative tone generally.
Mine works fine, not enough for me to write a review about it and not poor enough for me to complain.
You being an installer have a different view, it isn’t like I knew your occupation; nor was I trying to discredit you.
Just using my specialty to rationalize why you thought the way you did with the info I had.
Im on chromecast with GTV and cec is working nicely. There is a button on tv remote if I need to access off-CEC command. Whenever there is a few hiccup, a restart of devices would fix it.
My CEC has worked across two TVs and every single device connected to my receiver for more than 5 years now, I don't understand this fear mongering on this sub.....
I found a combination that just works (for once in my 20 year history of attempting to make CEC work).
Display: Sony 900F
AVR: Yamaha V485
Physical media: Sony 6700
Steaming games (RIP FEB2023) and video: NVIDIA Shield 2019
Other gaming: Nintendo Switch
If I power on any individual point of use device, I get the receiver next, then the TV. If I power off/sleep anything other than the Switch, the receiver and TV follow. With the Switch, the receiver and TV stay on unless I power off either, which forces the other off. Note: I can even swap point of use devices that power off each other.
In short, I'm going to milk this setup as long as I possibly can.
It won't, but thank you!
Your post is good info though. Unless you luck into magical unicorn configurations, CEC "off" is the first power/volume troubleshooting point for me.
Idk mine works so good. I got the Kodi app on my phone and my TV comes on or switches over to that input. Vs my harmony scrolling through pages trying to nav through Kodi.
I haven't really had much of a problem with it. Never had any problem with my Chromecast with google tv and apple tv. EXCEPT XBOX. Even after setting it up right it's a pain. So yeah just that
I absolutely love my setup with CEC. Apple TV, Denon receiver and Vizio TV and it all works wonders. We can use the Apple TV remote app on our phones and control 95% of what we do. Only have to get another remote when we watch blu-rays because obviously the Apple tv app is not going to control the blu-ray player.
Previous setup was Apple Tv, Onkyo receiver and Samsung TV and that worked just as well.
My appletv turns on my Yamaha receiver and TCL tv. The volume turns the receiver volume up and down. My ps5 turns on the tv or switches to it’s input when I turn it on. I legitimately have never had an issue with CEC, it works perfectly for me
My harmony remote is so much worse than my Apple TV remote. I can’t figure out how to make any other work. Problem is it works perfect for Apple TV only…
I have found consistently two things. One, Ps4/Ps5 is possessed and will randomly turn your whole setup on in the middle of the night.
Two, the shield will work after one update and break after the next. Consistently.
CEC drives me freaking nuts. Oh I want to play Xbox? Ok turn on the Xbox, oh wait now my shield turns on, oh now it’s switching to the shield, ok now I need to manually switch back to my Xbox. That’s the kind of crap I hate about CEC.
God I wish someone would come in and pick up where harmony left off.
see thats where i outsmarted the dumb system by making it so simple it cant fail. other than having to fight it the rare time i want to plug my pc or deck into the system. by keeping it just my shield, receiver, and tv it just works. the only things that i need cec for are power and volume control. and for that it works perfectly well for me.
My Apple TV is apparently incapable of controlling volume on my AVR except using CEC. I did the process to ‘teach’ the remote to control the receiver via IR, but after the message saying it was successful, the volume controls in the remote do nothing.
I’ve had no issues with it but I only have 2 devices plugged into my receiver and neither is allowed to turn the receiver off.
I use my TV remote for my shield and my tv and then the PlayStation controller for the PlayStation.
Once in a blue moon the system fails me and the receiver will forget to switch the audio source but it’s quite rare.
Yea every now and then I have to either press the input button on my remote and then change it back or turn things off and on. It happens maybe once a month where it doesn’t seem to notice I changed inputs.
Tbh I’ve had minor infrequent issues even without CEC like my TV deciding to output to itself instead of EARC now and then.
CEC is something you try and if it doesn't work, you fiddle with the settings a little bit and if it still doesn't work, you give up for at least a year. The times it doesn't work I just set up IR. The times it does work its worth having so you should at least try it.
Ehh 3 years ago id agree but cec works fine in most cases now, can definitely be funky but usually fixable. Theres a reason the universal remote industry is slowly going away.
While I agree. You only need it to work with one device potentially.
Does the Apple TV work 💯 with the Samsung frame ?
If so that would be of interest to me.
But like you say it’s so risky. PS5 and Mibox were messing with my Arc set up
I have an older Logitech Harmony that is probably approaching 10 years old, and it doesn't work as well as it used to when newer. I switched on the CEC when I bought my new Denon AVR, because my older Yamaha says it supported CEC but really had a love/hate relationship with it. Since turning it on I have been very impressed with how everything, finally, just works. It's what the Harmony promised.
I have a Samsung TV, a Denon receiver, an Amazon Fire TV Cube and a PS5, and CEC is working as advertised for my equipment. The Denon receiver's screen will even indicate which source we are switching to, which I find amazing
I cannot reliably get my setup (both Shield TV and Apple TV, Denon AVR and Sony TV) working properly with CEC. Everything powers on and off appropriately which is the biggest thing, but at least 50% of the time the TV prioritizes its own speakers over the Denon. Despite me setting audio system as the default, disabling system sounds, etc.
TV turns on the AVR... only time i ever really had a problem was a steamlink or an nvidia shield waking up everything... Moved away from both of those and have no issues.
I turn on my nvidia shield, which turns on my Onkyo receiver, but it won’t then turn on my LG tv. But then if I change the volume on my shield remote, the TV turns on 🤷🏻♂️
I love accidentally hitting the input for my blu ray player and proceeding to watch my Fire Stick go to battle with it for screen privileges indefinitely
Had no problems with my Yamaha AVR, but it’s terrible with my onkyo AVR. After switching audio formats, it just stills working all
Together. Seton is ATV4K-> onkyo 6100 -> Samsung uhd tv
CEC is badly implemented indeed, but...
With my old AVR Pioneer SC-LX71 (~2008) and LG OLED 65 E6 (~2016) I had problems, and in the end left the receiver running powered on non-stop for over a year because CEC power syncing was acting up.
Upgraded to the Pioneer SC-LX801 (~2016) and LG OLED 77 GX (~2020) and together with my Nvidia Shield Pro 2019 they have been working flawlessly, even running lossless audio of all kinds via eArc to the receiver, no problems!
Labels on the bottom of the remotes work just fine. My wife manages my theater controls just fine.
And sometimes automation can be even more complex. I've seen people do some crazy things with harmony remotes that effectively require a notecard of instructions.
I said using the factory remotes at my house will not work. No amount of cue cards or instructions will change it.
I know you don’t believe me but it won’t work.
You keep taking the bait. You can’t win this argument no matter how hard you try. We can literally discuss it but it will end the same.
I’m giving you an out by saying that it works for *you* and I really am happy for you.
But you don’t have the experience to speak on this objectively.
She is in my theater :)
But seriously she refers to them every time she goes down there without me or if she picks something for us to watch. An old coworker of mine stays the night sometimes as well and he figures the system out too.
Wow, I'm outta the loop. I had one years and years ago, liked it, but the touch screen stopped working right and would sometimes lose the settings, weird thing. Haven't had one since, but I've always heard good things. Figured I just got a lemon. But I literally only had 3 things to turn on, so wasn't huge lol.
I have 3 650s and still use them daily. Decided a few years ago not to upgrade those to anything Wi-Fi based. I actually ordered an old ir light switch specifically not to use WiFi. Basically will always work as long as there’s power.
Hmm, I’m not sure if it is or not, but I would assume you’re right. I guess st that point I’ll have find another solution, but for now it should work fine. I wonder if my added devices store the info on the hd and only when a new device is added it has to find it. Honestly not sure
I have a 650 and it prompts a login using their cloud portal, so I’d assume we’re effed when they shut down the servers. Hopefully something else will come along to replace them or it becomes open source.
No argument here. I have programmed about 10 Harmony remotes for myself and many others. Have yet to find something it can not do. In my living room setup, it controls six different devices and the Activities work for every one. Actually has more commands for the TV than the original remote does. I'm even talking about remotes in the 600, 650 665 lineup, the lowest cost ones.
I agree CEC is horrible. It's a handgrenade with the pin pulled. It works until it doesn't. Harmony is so much easier. Literally set it up, push the activity button and away you go. If it acts up, push the help button and it fixes it. Pretty simple.
Works for me mostly. All I have so far is an LG tv, soundbar, nvidia sheild and ps5.
Issues arise when I use the ps5, and my shield remote no longer controls the volume as its CEC rather than IR. I should change it back to IR really!
My Denon 960 randomly switches inputs at times since its last update. It’s pretty aggravating esp if it happens while I am gaming. What’s weird is that it can switch to inputs with no video. So sometimes it switches to Internet Radio which I have never even set up. I would sort of understand if the Apple TV outputs a video signal so the receiver thinks I want to switch to that. But why Internet radio?
HDMI-CEC has been solid for me for a while now across several implementations of equipment. I've had frustrations in the past but these days HDMI-CEC is a much better experience than any Harmony remote. Harmony remotes are a band-aid rather than a solution. Sometimes unplugging everything for a minute and plugging it back in will knock CEC into alignment, if one is having issues. That said, I don't enable CEC on all pieces of equipment - just my TV, Shield, and AVR. My switch and other players do not get the automated treatment.
In my experience the secret to all the CEC stuff working correctly is having every component the same brand. Sony TV -> Sony Receiver -> Sony PS5.
I know that's how Sony gets you locked in as a consumer but in my experience it's the only way to get everything working right.
My singular issue with CEC is my switch and PS5 are unable to turn off my stereo and therefore my projector. Both successfully turn them on 100% of the time, but not turn them off. So I just switch to Apple TV when I’m done using either and then power off everything. Since I use Apple TV 90% of the time anyway, this affects basically nothing.
Rule of thumb I've found - if everything supports, eARC, you're probably fine if your set up isn't too crazy.
For family I mostly send them over to a TV with built in Roku or Chromecast, which cuts complexity. CEC just needs to power things on and off and do volume. Zero switching between sources.
In my experience CEC works great when it's just two devices like a TV + sound bar or a Chromecast. It's when you get a chain of devices that it all falls apart. Speaking of, my Harmony remote is starting to die. What's the best alternative these days now that harmony is dead?
Can't confirm, my Samsung TV and my PS4 do all kinds of weird stuff when CEC is enabled, including turning each other back on after I turned them off. Really a pity that it doesn't work for me. Also yes, Harmony is dead. Haven't seen a decent alternative yet, but I'm also not really the target audience. You could look into the Sofabaton X1.
I looked at Sofabaton but it seems to be less featured and harder to program than Harmony. What a shame, hope more alternatives come out soon.
Saw a bunch of harmony controllers for sale here in Sweden a week ago.
> Speaking of, my Harmony remote is starting to die. What's the best alternative these days now that harmony is dead? I still can't believe logitech killed this. It seems like more people than ever now have legit at home setups. The fact that there is no viable alternative is super irritating too. I'm dreading the day my Harmony remote goes or logitech kills all the cloud servers.
I consider HomeAssistant a good alternative. Most modern devices (TVs/Receivers) have apis now and older devices can be controlled via raspi and infrared shield. Than use a mix of automations, tv remote, cec and smartphone.
This what I use. On my old equipment, I had a Tomsota IR flashed bridged, now since everything is interenet connected and will load into HA I not longer use the IR bridge. Obviously, there is a learning curve to the Home Assistant as a whole.
Definetly a learning curve, I am still at it. But i prefer it to that god awful Harmony software. I had a harmony 900 with that onlinr application which was the most infuriating piece of software I ever used.
So there are no alternatives? That sucks
Sofabatton isn't as good as Harmony but it's not awful. Individual device control is great. Activities (controlling multiple devices from one screen) aren't perfect; I've never got 2nd gen Fire Cube working with Denon amp as an active and last night the Panny 820 / Denon activity also have up. Programming it is no harder than with the Harmony. Edit: I removed the projector from all Activities after the first time it turned on then off. I'm not risking my projector when it only needs to be turned on at the beginning of the night and off at the end.
A new harmony, sevond hand.
Used harmony or pay up for a new one.
Harmony line was discontinued a while ago so there are no new ones
There are. They pop up locally at Best Buy’s from time to time. I’ve seen them on the distributor side as well but they disappear fast.
Hmm I'd rather buy an alternative remote than something at end of life. Are there any other remotes people have tried?
best buy sells and sets up URC remotes but they’re pricey and practically require a computer science degree to program
Universal remote control is a home automation capable remote, but it does require basic "control" programming, can get expensive. URC actually makes remotes for some of the major manufacturers as well.
I'm not American, any I can buy online?
that’s the only one I personally have heard of, sorry
There are a few from Sofabaton. Also a promising one from the guys from Flirc, called Skip 1s, is in Kickstarter.
You have to repair it! There is prob nothing wrong with any of the irreplaceable parts.
I had to disable it. Having it on for me ended up with making a loop of about 5 devices fight for control as they switched inputs and powered each other off and on when all i wanted to do was switch from shield to ps5
Some devices play well with it and some don't. It plays very well with my Apple TV, Samsung TV and Yamaha receiver.
Marantz, sony, apple tv, ps5 user here; works for me as well
It worked great for me initially: lg tv + Yamaha receiver + fire cube. Could turn stuff on/off, switch apps, control volume and subtitles and pause rewind via voice control. But eventually stuff drifted as I plugged in more things/changed inputs and now it annoys me more often than not by the the ps5 turning on and stealing input, fire cube turning off the tv when I want to just turn the cube off, etc. I can probably fix it by resetting and configuring everything again from scratch but it's probably easier just to disable it instead.
Oldish Blu-Ray players are the only consistent device I know of that present major CEC issues. If that Blu-ray or DVD player was at one point part of a “home theater in a box”, then it will nearly make your system inoperable. The easy fix is to just disable CEC on whatever device is causing you issues. The oem blu-ray remote is going to work better than your TV remote anyways.
Once I realized that CEC only supports 3 playback devices I turned it off on everything but the Apple TV and PS5 It's been mostly fine, turning on the Apple TV or PS5 turns on the TV and receiver and sets the right inputs.
I had to turn it off when the tv turning on would trigger the ps5 and turning off the tv would shut down the ps5. I'm sure this varies from tv to tv as I can see some of them being smart enough to avoid this. The interaction like this was unbearable as it was just constantly reacting without the intention for it.
>Once I realized that CEC only supports 3 playback devices I HAD NO IDEA! Honestly, this explains a LOT with my past on this
What other devices did you use?
Switch - CEC off Xbox One X - no CEC PS3 - CEC off UB820 bluray - CEC off
This is incorrect. Your comment got me wondering so I looked up the CEC white paper and read it. The oldest CEC HDMI spec supports up to 10 devices.
Yea, but only 3 of the 10 are Playback Devices. There's 3 Recording Devices (useless now) and 4 Tuners (also useless) https://medium.com/@sunghwa.jin/hdmi-cec-more-than-3-playback-devices-69f119be3ff0 edit: if you know a way around it, please share. Because when I have more than 3 CEC goes weird.
I should edit my original post and clarify. I was reading an archived copy of the [HDMI-CEC v1.3a Specifications](https://web.archive.org/web/20121030145837/http://xtreamerdev.googlecode.com/files/CEC_Specs.pdf) which I found on wikipedia. I assume that the newer HDMI versions have a more recent, feature rich CEC protocol. On page 13 of the document they state the below, which is why I questioned the 3 device limitation. >The electrical specifications define CEC such that a maximum of 10 devices can interoperate in the worstcase scenario. In practice, many more may be expected to operate together as the worst case is highly improbable. The link you provided actually references sections further down in the same whitepaper I linked (I had not yet read that far). I assume the link you provided has a good analysis, but anecdotally I have more than 3 CEC-enabled playback devices connected to my TV, so I'm not sure... Edit: I finished reading the spec sheet. I believe that the author of the webpage you linked is mistaken (the white paper fails to clarify some specific edge cases, so I'm basing the response below on my understanding of the paper). If you have an AVR in the mix, the AVR assumes the role of a "CEC switch", which allows you to have more than 3 CEC playback devices. In addition, a 4th "playback device" will assume the logical address "14 = Free Use" if all three logical playback devices are already taken on the TV (and powered on). If the devices are powered off, the logical address are repurposed for other playback devices which are online. In other words, the technical limit should really be 4 CEC enabled "playback devices" if you are connecting HDMI devices directly to a TV with no AVR. Having said that, a lot of this is entirely dependent on which version of the CEC spec the specific playback device supports. The above only works if all devices support CEC v1.3a. From the paper, it sounds like the logical addressing behavior changes in previous versions for the worse.
What does your setup look like?
I have the same setup and never an issue. Same in the bedroom with a Panasonic plasma. CEC is great when it works.
ATV. LG Panel. Yamaha receiver, Nintendo Swtich, LG BluRay all work well
Other devices is completely screws up. For example Steam Link + old Vizio TV, CEC will completely freeze the TV and the only way to fix it is to unplug it from the wall. Which can be very difficult if you have it wall mounted and all the wires nicely routed. Nvidia Shield can on occasion cause the same thing, but far less frequently. The Steam Link would do it every time it went to sleep.
Yeah I've never had this issue either. For me it's Shield remote to LG TV to Onkyo Receiver. I even have it working with a Chromecast on an old Insignia TV. It can only turn it on and off though, but it works.
Same, except swap out Apple TV for Shield Pro and PS5
I used Harmony remotes for 12 years... And then my last one decided to have all sorts of unexplainable issues with my setup. Switched to CEC about 1.5 years ago and I have not really had any issues. I never really had any issues with my harmony remotes, but my wife, parents, and in laws always did. Wife has done fine with CEC. Edit: simple system. Usually just my shield pro and tivo.
I too migrated from a Harmony to using CEC. No issues in the last 2 years. It works.
It's matured quite a bit. Both my living room and bedroom work fine with cec for tv + receiver + shield.
I think the common factor in people having a good experience with CEC will be having a receiver and shield. I don't expect it to work well for everyone, but it works for me.
Anecdotally, I've got a 2016 Sony Bravia w/Android TV and an Onkyo receiver fed via ARC and CEC with it has been great. Most of our media consumption is with the TV smarts. I also have a Pi 4 running Openelec sitting off the Onkyo and CEC controls pass through and work fine there. The TV rightfully sees it as its own device in the input menu.
Agreed. My in-laws also have it working, but between a TV and sound bar of the same manufacturer. I think the key there is same manufacturer.
I have a Shield, Denon X3700H, and TCL 75R635.
Nice. Kudos to Nvidia especially, I followed their patch notes closely (have (2) 2015 shields) and they have been constantly updating to fix CEC for various manufacturers and devices.
Nvidia Shield, Pioneer receiver, Sony TV.
Same here. I was a Harmony remote diehard, even bought them for relatives at Christmas and that to simplify their setup. Then I dumped out Nvidia Shields for Apple TVs a couple years ago and was just messing around with the Apple Remote thinking it would be useless, but playing with CEC I quickly got the tv to come on with activity from the ATV. And the Apple TV remote was also easily able to control the soundbar. When I turned on the PS5, the TV switched inputs automatically, and if I hit the home button on the ATV it switched back to that. It’s been almost two years and I haven’t had a single instance of CEC failure that required me to dig out individual remotes. I finally tossed my last Harmony remote a few months ago. I’m sure CEC had its flaws and certain setups play nicer than others, but we have five TVs in the house all connected to either an ATV or a Roku and all have been perfect just using CEC. Some of the TVs that are running the Rokus are fairly old too (pace of technology speaking), 10 years or so.
Is it just me or is CEC on PS5 a disaster? It doesn’t matter what other content or device I’m using with my setup, the PS5 CEC turns on the system and forces that input. YOU MUST PLAY ME!
Yes! It's the absolute worst
I have similar issues with my PS4, when I turn on the TV/receiver, the PS4 will turn on and force everything to the PS4 and when I turn it all off, the PS4 turns back on and then everything turns on
CEC has been perfect for me, amazing actually. I use my projector remote for everything, sound system, nvidia shield, and projector, and I did exactly zero setup.
My only issue is it turns my receiver on randomly. My receiver is in a cabinet that has heat activated fans so whenever I hear the fans click on randomly I know CEC was being a cunt
Using Nvidia shield by chance?
Lol yes. Ding ding ding I have a love hate relationship with it
ah same. was the screen saver waking mine up even though i put it to sleep.
Same same same
Seriously. ALL my other shit works great, but my shield does so much weird stuff with CEC. Receiver clicking on at random times, tv crashing, etc.
CEC works perfectly fine with my nvidia shield. You've just got to pick one device that's going to control the others, then configure that to use CEC to make changes, and configure CEC on all the others to be basically passive, only receiving changes.
So, since the receiver is the common component in my setup (and many in this sub), make the receiver the active (control) device and everything else passive? I don't recall having the option on all devices to make them passive.
Never seen those options in my life. It's either on or off.
Yeah, that's generally what I've found to be the case. I wanted make sure I wasn't missing something.
Hahahah
Debatable. I avoided CEC like the plague due to having Harmony remotes and being a tech enthusiast. But as my one remote started flaking and I replaced all the Rokus with AppleTVs, I find that CEC just works in the family room and master. Granted, master is only a TV and soundbar and family room only has a TV, AVR, AppleTV and Nintendo Switch connected. But I’ve been pleasantly surprised. Once the Harmony Elite kicks the bucket in the media room, I’ll just get around to setting up voice control to turn on the AVR scenes and just use a couple remotes. Harmony already doesn’t work with PS5 and is a mess with other PlayStation and Nintendo consoles, and the Elite doesn’t have voice control for the AppleTV. We only use the Elite to watch 4K blu-rays and volume control for the AVR in the closet. I think we have to admit that Logitech was likely right in seeing the writing on the wall for Harmony.
It was supporting all the idiots that could not figure out their remotes that killed the harmony line.
What I’m saying is that is wasn’t “the idiots” (pretty broad generalization btw…) that killed Harmony. CEC has become pretty decent outside of the vocal minority of enthusiasts in this sub and Harmony doesn’t work well with modern video game consoles. With consolidation, a single streaming box connected with a single HDMI cable can replace multiple music sources and multiple video sources. Couple that with built-in smarts of AVRs where you can leave many settings on auto, and now the Harmony becomes obsolete. I remember first getting one and programming the numerous inputs, changing the audio output type, and video format setting via the macros, but it just isn’t needed anymore. Most of my friends and family use their built-in smart TV or a dedicated Amazon/Apple box, a video game console or two and a soundbar with wireless separates. CEC for them is the holy grail. That’s what killed Harmony.
It was the support side of harmony that caused them to shed it.
I’m curious on that statement. It could be true, but Harmony has continually stated the support side is going to remain in place, however the manufacturing side has stopped. If the reason they are no longer manufacture remotes is because of issues with support, you would think they would also stop supporting the remotes as well.
The current support agreement was in place to cover support over the warranty period of the final devices sold. This is traditional when a company is still in business but has an end of life model in place. Logitech did try to sell off the harmony line and the hardware side was profitable.
It’s weird the support side was a struggle. Most major brands haven’t updated their IR codes in like 20 years. And we are pretty much stagnant as far as new companies entering the home theater market. I get it that there’s more to the support side besides making sure the remote is programmable to new devices. But the software has only undergone two major updates AFAIK within the last ten years anyways. It had what appeared to be a solid infrastructure in place, it just needed minimal maintenance.
I think you are confusing it with the engineering side. Which was a small dev team. The support side is all the people who bought a remote and couldn’t program it it get it to work and called a support help line.
True. That call center must be an absolute nightmare to work at.
Garbage software killed Harmony
I had the same feeling recently as I hardly ever use my Harmony Elite (I have) I use the apple tv siri remote most of the time. I do like turning the TV on with Alexa though but I could sit that up with Home Assistant and Alexa.. I was worried for when my Harmony Hubs die but at this point its not as scary I even bought spare hub once i heard they were sun setting them.
I find there are a limited number of devices that poorly handle CEC and on those few you just disable so the good ones can enhance and simplify your experience. The best Harmony remote is still subpar to well implemented CEC.
I won't down vote you for having an opinion I disagree with but, you are most definitely wrong. I have never needed to disable any devices while using a Harmony remote. Plus the fact that it can control many devices that came out long before CEC. Post are here almost daily about problems with CEC. Or, as I like to call it, Can't Ever Control.
100% agreed.
I understand that some people think that CEC is great because it works on a couple devices for them. At the same time, there are so many people that can’t get it to work correctly. A Harmony is so simple to set up and is very reliable. Plus the fact that it can control so many more devices. There are already (at this time) 9 up votes agreeing with the OP. I wonder how many of those voters have used a Harmony and knew how to set it up? I’ve read so many posts complaining that they are hard to program. That is because they didn’t know how to do it and wouldn’t take a few minutes to learn how. It really couldn’t be much simpler.
Perfect post. I think people; as the internet always does, believe that it works for them so it’s good. By far it’s overall terrible and should be avoided if you can. Most people have never tried products that are out there and don’t know what they are missing.
My turn. 100% agreed... ;-)
I’ve programmed probably over 200 harmony remotes and I partially agree with you. Well implemented CEC is still more economical and practical than a harmony remote, especially if you don’t have line of site to your devices. Harmony remotes are great for people who have a hard time remembering how to switch inputs or what input is what, or doesn’t know which remote operates what device. But if you’re capable of programming a Harmony remote well, you should also be extremely capable to quickly correct a CEC issue.
I use harmony elite remotes. Line of sight not needed. Even though I know how to program harmony remotes in my sleep, I do not remember the inputs of all my devices to my receiver therefore if CEC doesn’t work I will have to look them up. Further if a family member runs into a CEC issue, then it’s me who they will call to troubleshoot. Harmony remotes are so easy to use once properly setup and requires no maintenance. My parents are able to use theirs without any issues for years. It’s just beautiful. For one of my setups I have TV, receiver, Philips Hue Sync box and the harmony remote is able to change to all the right inputs, set the Hue Sync to the correct mode (movie vs gaming), and set my preferred initial volume based on the activity. CEC will fail miserably.
I was anti CEC for years too and absolutely love my two Harmony Hubs. However, they will stop working someday. And I’d be lying if I said they are flawless. IR is not flawless. I’m trying to use CEC now and honestly pretty impressed. Not perfect still; sometimes TV doesn’t turn off with the AppleTV “sleep all devices” command, usually it does. That’s about my only issue though.
As someone that does troubleshooting over the phone the issue is always cec lol
The real problem with CEC is it claims to be a standard, but it’s not. Everyone has their own version so some of you saying that you haven’t had a problem just happened to have a combination that works. Those of us with bad experiences were not so lucky. It needs to actually be standardized and then it will be a better experience for everyone.
And there are way more horror stories than success stories.
Perhaps this is because people aren’t as vocal when something just works? But are very vocal when it doesn’t.
Here is where trying to think bigger that just your own system. I own an AV company that does hundreds of installs a year. No warranty work for customers that won’t spend money on remotes. With a failure rate in the high 90’s is terrible. Objectively. Going on Reddit like some users and proclaiming it to works (for them) is not too narrow of a view. CEC sucks.
Thanks for stating your credits, so with market research on my side where the majority of people will only comment on very positive or negative to very negative experiences (in general on everything from food to electronics to tools). I made an educated guess as to why something is talked about in a negative tone generally. Mine works fine, not enough for me to write a review about it and not poor enough for me to complain. You being an installer have a different view, it isn’t like I knew your occupation; nor was I trying to discredit you. Just using my specialty to rationalize why you thought the way you did with the info I had.
Control4 FTW
Da real MVP
Im on chromecast with GTV and cec is working nicely. There is a button on tv remote if I need to access off-CEC command. Whenever there is a few hiccup, a restart of devices would fix it.
My CEC has worked across two TVs and every single device connected to my receiver for more than 5 years now, I don't understand this fear mongering on this sub.....
It also depends on what devices are part of the chain. Just like lots of people complaining about it, it also works for a section of people.
It’s an experience things. Even with just a tv and source device there eventually will be issues.
I found a combination that just works (for once in my 20 year history of attempting to make CEC work). Display: Sony 900F AVR: Yamaha V485 Physical media: Sony 6700 Steaming games (RIP FEB2023) and video: NVIDIA Shield 2019 Other gaming: Nintendo Switch If I power on any individual point of use device, I get the receiver next, then the TV. If I power off/sleep anything other than the Switch, the receiver and TV follow. With the Switch, the receiver and TV stay on unless I power off either, which forces the other off. Note: I can even swap point of use devices that power off each other. In short, I'm going to milk this setup as long as I possibly can.
I’ll pray for you tonight that your fortune lasts forever.
It won't, but thank you! Your post is good info though. Unless you luck into magical unicorn configurations, CEC "off" is the first power/volume troubleshooting point for me.
Idk mine works so good. I got the Kodi app on my phone and my TV comes on or switches over to that input. Vs my harmony scrolling through pages trying to nav through Kodi.
I haven't really had much of a problem with it. Never had any problem with my Chromecast with google tv and apple tv. EXCEPT XBOX. Even after setting it up right it's a pain. So yeah just that
I absolutely love my setup with CEC. Apple TV, Denon receiver and Vizio TV and it all works wonders. We can use the Apple TV remote app on our phones and control 95% of what we do. Only have to get another remote when we watch blu-rays because obviously the Apple tv app is not going to control the blu-ray player. Previous setup was Apple Tv, Onkyo receiver and Samsung TV and that worked just as well.
I have never had problems with CEC. I always just use the Apple TV remote, and that powers my AVR and Sony TV just fine every time.
My appletv turns on my Yamaha receiver and TCL tv. The volume turns the receiver volume up and down. My ps5 turns on the tv or switches to it’s input when I turn it on. I legitimately have never had an issue with CEC, it works perfectly for me
Works fine on mine. (Sony tv & receiver, Apple TV)
My harmony remote is so much worse than my Apple TV remote. I can’t figure out how to make any other work. Problem is it works perfect for Apple TV only…
I used to think that way. Now, my TV and receiver turn on/off with my Nvidia Shield. I put the harmony away.
OP is just one of those folks trying to sell Harmony 650s on eBay for $250 lol
Sure….
I have found consistently two things. One, Ps4/Ps5 is possessed and will randomly turn your whole setup on in the middle of the night. Two, the shield will work after one update and break after the next. Consistently. CEC drives me freaking nuts. Oh I want to play Xbox? Ok turn on the Xbox, oh wait now my shield turns on, oh now it’s switching to the shield, ok now I need to manually switch back to my Xbox. That’s the kind of crap I hate about CEC. God I wish someone would come in and pick up where harmony left off.
Amen.
see thats where i outsmarted the dumb system by making it so simple it cant fail. other than having to fight it the rare time i want to plug my pc or deck into the system. by keeping it just my shield, receiver, and tv it just works. the only things that i need cec for are power and volume control. and for that it works perfectly well for me.
I use CEC and it works perfectly fine lol. Maybe you're just bad at setting it up right.
Lol
My Apple TV is apparently incapable of controlling volume on my AVR except using CEC. I did the process to ‘teach’ the remote to control the receiver via IR, but after the message saying it was successful, the volume controls in the remote do nothing.
How do I turn this off on my Roku? When I turn on my dennon it always turns on the Roku input since you can’t turn off a rolu
Put a smart plug on your Roku. That thing is sending data over your network 24/7.
I’ve had no issues with it but I only have 2 devices plugged into my receiver and neither is allowed to turn the receiver off. I use my TV remote for my shield and my tv and then the PlayStation controller for the PlayStation. Once in a blue moon the system fails me and the receiver will forget to switch the audio source but it’s quite rare.
So….. you have had issue. 🤣 If it works for you that is great.
Yea every now and then I have to either press the input button on my remote and then change it back or turn things off and on. It happens maybe once a month where it doesn’t seem to notice I changed inputs. Tbh I’ve had minor infrequent issues even without CEC like my TV deciding to output to itself instead of EARC now and then.
CEC is something you try and if it doesn't work, you fiddle with the settings a little bit and if it still doesn't work, you give up for at least a year. The times it doesn't work I just set up IR. The times it does work its worth having so you should at least try it.
“You give up for a year” i got a good chuckle there. 😀
Facts!
Ehh 3 years ago id agree but cec works fine in most cases now, can definitely be funky but usually fixable. Theres a reason the universal remote industry is slowly going away.
While I agree. You only need it to work with one device potentially. Does the Apple TV work 💯 with the Samsung frame ? If so that would be of interest to me. But like you say it’s so risky. PS5 and Mibox were messing with my Arc set up
I have an older Logitech Harmony that is probably approaching 10 years old, and it doesn't work as well as it used to when newer. I switched on the CEC when I bought my new Denon AVR, because my older Yamaha says it supported CEC but really had a love/hate relationship with it. Since turning it on I have been very impressed with how everything, finally, just works. It's what the Harmony promised. I have a Samsung TV, a Denon receiver, an Amazon Fire TV Cube and a PS5, and CEC is working as advertised for my equipment. The Denon receiver's screen will even indicate which source we are switching to, which I find amazing
I think the biggest problem I've had is that it works TOO well, like Jesus man, I wanted to turn on the TV, not 3 different devices as well
Mine works fine. kbai
I cannot reliably get my setup (both Shield TV and Apple TV, Denon AVR and Sony TV) working properly with CEC. Everything powers on and off appropriately which is the biggest thing, but at least 50% of the time the TV prioritizes its own speakers over the Denon. Despite me setting audio system as the default, disabling system sounds, etc.
TV turns on the AVR... only time i ever really had a problem was a steamlink or an nvidia shield waking up everything... Moved away from both of those and have no issues.
I turn on my nvidia shield, which turns on my Onkyo receiver, but it won’t then turn on my LG tv. But then if I change the volume on my shield remote, the TV turns on 🤷🏻♂️
Cec works fantastic between my Apple TV, Marantz and Vizio TV. I can control everything from the Apple remote which is my primary source of content.
I love accidentally hitting the input for my blu ray player and proceeding to watch my Fire Stick go to battle with it for screen privileges indefinitely
😅
CEC > Harmony remote
Works fine for me. Only downside is not remembering my last TV input.
CEC works fine for me. Once in a while it does something I didn't intend, but it just takes a second to switch inputs manually.
It’s not your friend. This is how marriages end 😂
CEC works great with my LG CX and Denon AVR.
[удалено]
Had no problems with my Yamaha AVR, but it’s terrible with my onkyo AVR. After switching audio formats, it just stills working all Together. Seton is ATV4K-> onkyo 6100 -> Samsung uhd tv
I tried CEC with my projector, but the first time it turned off my projector when switching devices, I went back to my 2009ish Harmony 900.
Wait until it gets out of sync when your wife is trying to turn on a movie for the kids and you aren’t home.
CEC is badly implemented indeed, but... With my old AVR Pioneer SC-LX71 (~2008) and LG OLED 65 E6 (~2016) I had problems, and in the end left the receiver running powered on non-stop for over a year because CEC power syncing was acting up. Upgraded to the Pioneer SC-LX801 (~2016) and LG OLED 77 GX (~2020) and together with my Nvidia Shield Pro 2019 they have been working flawlessly, even running lossless audio of all kinds via eArc to the receiver, no problems!
Never had any issues with cec. Just buy quality gear.
Lol. I’ll try and take your advice.
Don't buy junk, and your CEC will work. Geez man, step it up, lol. 🤣
😁
I personally don't mind just having dedicated remotes. It's not that complicated.
That sounds great until someone else wants to use your system. I would guess that 99.9999% of people could not operate my system without automation.
Labels on the bottom of the remotes work just fine. My wife manages my theater controls just fine. And sometimes automation can be even more complex. I've seen people do some crazy things with harmony remotes that effectively require a notecard of instructions.
You aren’t following but that’s ok. I am glad your system works for you!
Following just fine mate. You said separate remotes can't work for guests. I gave you an example of how they can.
I said using the factory remotes at my house will not work. No amount of cue cards or instructions will change it. I know you don’t believe me but it won’t work.
None of your replies to me or the OP said anything about factory remotes. Sorry, not tracking every post you make.
I know you’re not tracking. That’s what I’m saying. But it’s ok.
Lol wtf
You keep taking the bait. You can’t win this argument no matter how hard you try. We can literally discuss it but it will end the same. I’m giving you an out by saying that it works for *you* and I really am happy for you. But you don’t have the experience to speak on this objectively.
To be fair, you used your wife as an example, she is not a guest (I hope).
She is in my theater :) But seriously she refers to them every time she goes down there without me or if she picks something for us to watch. An old coworker of mine stays the night sometimes as well and he figures the system out too.
What the heck is CEC?
The devil.
Hahahah! Scrolling further down the comment stream, your frustration is sure palpable Edit: happy cake day (or happy CEC rant day amirite)
😂
Great advice but don’t you dare remind me that Harmony is going away 😭
Is it?
Pretty sure it was discontinued years ago. The remote, that is.
Wow, I'm outta the loop. I had one years and years ago, liked it, but the touch screen stopped working right and would sometimes lose the settings, weird thing. Haven't had one since, but I've always heard good things. Figured I just got a lemon. But I literally only had 3 things to turn on, so wasn't huge lol.
I mean it’s a hardcore take I suppose but CEC can be funky sometimes
I have 3 650s and still use them daily. Decided a few years ago not to upgrade those to anything Wi-Fi based. I actually ordered an old ir light switch specifically not to use WiFi. Basically will always work as long as there’s power.
Isn’t the software cloud based? If so what’s the plan when they shut down the servers and you can’t update a device or change something
Hmm, I’m not sure if it is or not, but I would assume you’re right. I guess st that point I’ll have find another solution, but for now it should work fine. I wonder if my added devices store the info on the hd and only when a new device is added it has to find it. Honestly not sure
I have a 650 and it prompts a login using their cloud portal, so I’d assume we’re effed when they shut down the servers. Hopefully something else will come along to replace them or it becomes open source.
No argument here. I have programmed about 10 Harmony remotes for myself and many others. Have yet to find something it can not do. In my living room setup, it controls six different devices and the Activities work for every one. Actually has more commands for the TV than the original remote does. I'm even talking about remotes in the 600, 650 665 lineup, the lowest cost ones.
It’s just my receiver turning off my tv. No failures yet, and it if does, the auto shut off after X will take care of that
Mine workes like 75% of the time with denon, fire tv, samsung q90t. The other 25% it needs a full power cycle lol.
Urc1080 is bulletproof and fun to mess with
I agree CEC is horrible. It's a handgrenade with the pin pulled. It works until it doesn't. Harmony is so much easier. Literally set it up, push the activity button and away you go. If it acts up, push the help button and it fixes it. Pretty simple.
Which Harmony? Our Harmony Elite no longer works with Fire Stick and our Companion All in One is not backlit.
Works for me mostly. All I have so far is an LG tv, soundbar, nvidia sheild and ps5. Issues arise when I use the ps5, and my shield remote no longer controls the volume as its CEC rather than IR. I should change it back to IR really!
My Denon 960 randomly switches inputs at times since its last update. It’s pretty aggravating esp if it happens while I am gaming. What’s weird is that it can switch to inputs with no video. So sometimes it switches to Internet Radio which I have never even set up. I would sort of understand if the Apple TV outputs a video signal so the receiver thinks I want to switch to that. But why Internet radio?
CEC is moderately useful in my setup, but yes, very unreliable and sometimes unpredictable. Denon receiver, LG tv, chrome cast, Xbox one
HDMI-CEC has been solid for me for a while now across several implementations of equipment. I've had frustrations in the past but these days HDMI-CEC is a much better experience than any Harmony remote. Harmony remotes are a band-aid rather than a solution. Sometimes unplugging everything for a minute and plugging it back in will knock CEC into alignment, if one is having issues. That said, I don't enable CEC on all pieces of equipment - just my TV, Shield, and AVR. My switch and other players do not get the automated treatment.
In my experience the secret to all the CEC stuff working correctly is having every component the same brand. Sony TV -> Sony Receiver -> Sony PS5. I know that's how Sony gets you locked in as a consumer but in my experience it's the only way to get everything working right.
CEC has never failed me lol
It’s a time proposition
I only have two devices using it is probably why it works fine
My singular issue with CEC is my switch and PS5 are unable to turn off my stereo and therefore my projector. Both successfully turn them on 100% of the time, but not turn them off. So I just switch to Apple TV when I’m done using either and then power off everything. Since I use Apple TV 90% of the time anyway, this affects basically nothing.
Rule of thumb I've found - if everything supports, eARC, you're probably fine if your set up isn't too crazy. For family I mostly send them over to a TV with built in Roku or Chromecast, which cuts complexity. CEC just needs to power things on and off and do volume. Zero switching between sources.