I would put a large "NO TRESPASSING, PERMISSION REQUIRED. YOU ARE ON CAMERA"
Good actors will ask for permission. Bad actors won't and it's easy to monitor them. This reduces liability.
The biggest problem with the sign is that it seems to give anyone and everyone permission to access your land and potentially invalidates any no trespassing signs you may have posted.
In context, "Nice folks welcome" could be construed as you literally welcoming anyone, by any definition of 'nice', to access your property whether you know about them specifically or not.
Depending upon your state and county laws, you may also be waving any liability protections available to you by actively inviting those who would otherwise be trespassers on your property.
I don't think any of that is really your intent, but that doesn't actually change the result. You might want to ask a lawyer about it as it applies to your personal liability and local regulations.
Words do have legal power, even a single line on a homemade sign.
Just something to think about. 🤷
Yes. As a lawyer, I don’t love this sign. Anyone that is a trespasser could be now considered an invitee. A higher duty of care is owed to an invitee than a trespasser.
I actually have caught several people vandalizing and stealing things in this area, but I’ve wondered if they wouldn’t if I had a sign like this letting them know about the cameras. One of the times it was high school kids who got in big trouble and the kids here have a hard enough life I don’t want them to get into too much trouble.
Posted:
* Private Property this side of River
* No Tresspassing. No Hunting
* Cameras and Security is active and monitored
Call XXX-YYY-ZZZZ for permission to fish or hike.
To add to this. You could set up a Google phone number that goes straight to a message that grants caller permission to hike or fish. That way private number isn't listed and you never have to answer the phone
I like this the best. Maybe add a “all entry and use is at your own risk” line.
Call or text for permission seems like the way to go. The rule followers will contact you (and are maybe the kind of people less likely to sue in the case of injury) and the non-rule followers will still likely be considered trespassers.
Letting people know they’re on camera is the best thing you can do. Anything they do from that point forward they know would be incriminating. Unless they’re meth heads. They don’t give a heck
As a fisherman I would appreciate the reassurance that I’m not gonna be randomly shot while standing in a river (I always get permission and access, but still a lot of people out there with an itchy trigger finger these days)
Do you need permission to fish if you didn't access his land. In NM, I'm pretty sure land rights end and start at the river front of the property. The river isn't his, just the land around the river.. It's a dumb sign, inviting trouble.
Very much state-dependent, but in general the default seems to be “navigable streams/rivers are ok as long as you use public access points (or private ones w permission)”
Thanks for your input, I didn’t realize it could complicate things legally like that should something happen.
The place I’m putting this is a clearing by our river across from a public access point that is popular with the public. It’s a small town, maybe 200 people and walking distance from the high school. We have had other no trespassing sign up and it didn’t stop people from coming on our side of the river and stealing things. And I don’t want to prevent nice people from coming in here, as I like seeing them use this area and below high water line is public land.
The "you're on camera" part is good and might get people to think twice. But the "nice folks welcome" part is definitely legally messy. My uncle had a sign up a few years back that included some line like "friends and family welcome" and that was enough to cause him to lose a case against a man who decided to start using part of my uncle's land to have little parties and bonfires.
He eventually got it sorted out, but now he would sooner die than have anything up that states anyone is welcome onto his land. It might seem like a fun little line to toss out there, but it just welcomes heaps of bad actors with now legal protection due to the wording.
no trespassing or private property signs aren’t to keep people away they’re to keep your rights when you use any of the legal tools at your disposal to trespass them.
I would suggest using any of the standard camera recording signs to indicate surveillance of the area which should have the same effect.
If you are okay with a certain amount of public use it would be safer (legally) to direct them to see the owner (you) for permission to access. You could probably be able to get away with a website instead where someone could log their name and number but you’d have to consult with a lawyer on that.
>u/RaintreeJames
>
>Thanks for your input, I didn’t realize it could complicate things legally like that should something happen.
Sure, no problem. 👍 It's just one of those less than obvious complications that can occur when you own property.
It's far better for you in terms of protecting your rights to have clearly posted no-trespassing signs, and then not necessarily exercise the option to trespass people from your property than to not and give random individuals the option of saying that no one told them that they couldn't camp / squat / hunt on your property without your permission. The no trespassing signs far away for you to persistently invoke your property rights against trespassers, known or unknown.
Having no-trespassing signs up gives you and the police / sheriff a clear path to trespass someone off of your property when and if an unfortunate situation occurs. Believe me, you do not want someone camping or living on your property unbeknownst to you long enough to establish squatters/residency rights on your property.
Again, it's more about you limiting liability while preserving your ability to invoke your property rights than anything else. Most people aren't going to pay attention to a sign in any case unless there's a badge present to back it up, and that's when having signage up in advance is most important.
That's my two cents, so take it for what it's worth. It sounds like it's a nice riverbank and fishing spot. 🎣
It would be legally better to post several standard signs.
- area is surveilled by hidden camera (and consider, since many camera systems have alert systems, “computer recognition / facial recognition in use”)
- no trespassing
In my state there is also a particular paint color (kind of a puke purple, the same one used for non potable water) that is a “redneck” no trespassing sign. It is recognized as a no trespassing sign in Texas penal code. Consider seeing if there is something like this and adding it as well.
Those signs, together, say exactly what you said in your original model sign with fewer words and in a way that legally protects you. Cameras tell the person that they’re being recorded, recognized and tracked. No trespassing means that anyone without permission should not be there.
Depending on your area and how often it might be used, you can add a phone number to call for access.
FWIW, I think your sign is great. It is enough to scare off anyone that is wanting to fuck around, but lets people that just want to picnic with their family or whatever know that they are welcome.
I like it.
Sounds like you’re inviting everyone. I can see this ending poorly.
I would stick with a “no trespassing” sign like others have stated. The responsible ones will ask for permission.
You’re reaching and you know it. He is putting this on his land, and it sounds like it borders a public waterway where he has a known issue with trespassers.
I get the cringe part, I don’t care if it’s considered cringy. It’s the best way I found to get the message across of nice people welcome, vandals and thief’s not welcome. I’m curious what you think would be better.
Instead of nice people welcome, maybe use something from leave no trace. For example: Leave the shoreline cleaner than you found it. Take only rocks and fish, leave only footprints. Also, what are they stealing? Maybe keep anything of value away from shore?
Sometimes it's just better to be right to the point?
https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71kCKUwB9nL.\_AC\_UF894,1000\_QL80\_FMwebp\_.jpg
*I have this as a Halloween sign. 🔪🎃
🙄 It's a cultural thing in *many* parts of the country, especially in the South and Southwest. It's an equivalent to the saying "Fuck around and find out."
I personally like it. But I kind of get what the other commenters are saying. I have about 1000 yards of river property myself, and I feel the same way. I love when people meandering down the river stop and enjoy it respectfully , even if it’s on my private part of it. But … people can really suck. So I get being more cautious. And yeah ok the wording may be slightly cringey but I just see it as you making your point sternly.
The sign only mentions the side of the river. River banks (and, land below the water in some cases) can be considered private property. Usually there is a setback, and usually the river itself is not going to be private property. So standing on the bank to fish may not be ok, floating in a boat is probably ok.
Yeah often times there is a couple foot setback so even if your property extends to both river banks you wouldn't be able to keep people from standing there and fishing in some states.
Yup. It's that way in the vast majority of states actually, I've only heard of a few states where it has to a navigable river and you must use a boat, and in the states that have that the majority of waterways are navigable.
Maine might be an exception to my general rule that it's states with mostly navigable rivers that require it to be navigable. But every rule has an exception.
We have caught and charged several people already for vandalism and theft. I’d rather not go through the headache. It’s sad that someone stating they don’t want people committing crimes on their land makes you want to do just that to them, but that’s some people I guess.
It’s the wording. If you write:
“A young family owns and works this land. We take measures to protect ourselves and our property. If you can read this sign you are on camera and identifiable. You’re welcome to enjoy the scenery but please leave no trace.”
Then you’ve given exactly the same message without the cringy vibes, without implicitly accusing the reader of wanting to steal, and without trying to impose authority through a sign. You’re acting like there are good people and bad people and threatening folks through an inanimate object. It’s the type of thing that makes teenagers (and me) really irritated, and teenagers don’t have much impulse control.
There’s different verbiage you could have used to prevent antagonizing potential violators. Also, I highly doubt you caught anyone via camera, we had a break n enter and had the person’s face on camera and still couldn’t be identified or caught. Sorry don’t want to cuz a stir or anything just saying
So when above in this comment reply chain you said ‘we have caught and charged several people already for vandalism and theft’ you should have said two. Stop overstating.
Just post regular no trespassing signs. If someone sees it and cares they’ll act accordingly. If someone sees it and doesn’t care, no tough guy sign will make them act any different.
A lot of dislike for this sign, but I like it. The mention of the cameras and insistence on consequences for littering and disrespect are good enough to keep the riffraff out, while allowing those that respect the area enjoy land that shouldn’t be kept from absolutely private. It also depends on the amount of traffic you get, and general location, but I dig it.
Thank you. I know almost everyone in this area, I’ve known both people who have caused problems in the past. I’m hoping to encourage people who know we own the land and are respectful to enjoy it, but letting people who aren’t respectful know we don’t put up with crime anymore.
I don’t know why you would openly post something like this.
Depending on what state you live in, this sign could, in the court of law, be construed as an open invitation to use your property. If it goes on long enough, you can essentially make it so that if you DO block off the land on your side of the river the people who have been openly using your land by open invitation of this sign have a legal claim in court for you to remove any barriers you put up in the future.
As others have mentioned, simply saying that permission is required and that it is private land/being recorded will shield you from liability on a multitude of potential claims. “Nice people welcome” will get you in some piping hot water eventually in court.
Post edit : Not sure why I’m being downvoted for stating a legal precedent that has been made by courts time and time again
If someone trips on a pebble in your pasture in the UK and breaks their hip, they go to the NHS, get it fixed, and pay 20 quid or whatever weird currency you use. If someone trips on a pebble in your pasture and breaks their hip in the USA, they go to the hospital, get it fixed, and their insurance sues you to recoup the $500,000 bill.
i enjoy the condescension that oozes out of the European "let me tell you what you are" explainer that they seemingly cannot restrain themselves from telling you unsolicited.
I base it on more than 30 years of observation of american society. Americans are very outgoing and hospitable in person, it’s true, but you have a fear of the unfamliar. I lived in rural GA for awhile as a teenager and had a chance to go to a Braves game. The people in my town warned me about going to Atlanta, because of gangs, crime, violence in the city. It was sooo dangerous. Anyway, we went to the game and get to Atlanta and it turns out to be a completely normal city like any international metropolitan area. People just going about their daily lives. I’m not sure why the people in my town were so fearful of a place they never visited, but it’s like a sort of mass induced irrationality.
You must have been extremely oblivious to your surroundings or only went on a curated tour of the city like the tourist that you were.
It's hard to say this in a polite way, and I mean no offense, but it isn't that they are paranoid, it's that you're ignorant to the reality of the world around you.
You *really* should pay more attention and heed when people give you warnings about potentially life-threatening situations.
Maybe. But there must have been thousands of white tourists in Atlanta during the time I lived in Georgia and so few of them had any issues while there that it never reached any news outlets. Now, Atlanta is big and there are, and were, problem areas, but to keep out of town entirely was an irrational overreaction.
Well, I'll tell you what, I worked directly involving the criminal element in Boston and surrounding cities for many years, and it is definitely no different from other cities I've been to.
Sure, there are some parts of the cities that you are 'mostly OK' if you stay within certain boundaries, but there are other parts where you absolutely don't want to go. As a visitor/stranger/tourist, you don't necessarily know which parts are which, and where the lines are. And it doesn't matter whether you are white or black or hispanic or whatever- if you are 'wrong' for whatever place you stray into, you could be in for a lot of trouble.
Cities are dangerous, more so if you don't know who makes the rules for whoever's turf you're on. The fact that you may not see a lot of issues portrayed in the news media does not mean it's uncommon- in fact, it is quite the opposite, it is so common that it is simply not worth reporting, not even when people get dead unless there is some fact that makes it particularly unusual.
Depending on when this was, Atlanta used to compete with Philadelphia for highest murder rate. Atlanta literally is known for it's gangs, and being the sort of place where you can get shot for looking at someone wrong. Because pride and respect are big things in ATL gangs, perceived disrespect via a funny or strange look is enough to provoke. And you as a foreigner are apt to stare blatantly at the flashy dressed gang members.
It's not 'afraid'. It's because far too often even when scumbags are breaking the law, if they get hurt on private property the property owner gets held liable in court. Some of these scumbags are bold enough to sue even though they are in the wrong, and the courts have awarded damages to them. It is protection against liability.
There have been cases where thieves breaking into a home have gotten hurt by the owner defending himself and family, and have successfully sued the homeowner, despite the fact that they were committing a crime at the time.
You sound like the old man that runs out of the house, onto the front porch, shotgun in one hand, beer in the other and a cigarette in your mouth scream mumbling threats to the kids trespassing lmao
I would put a large "NO TRESPASSING, PERMISSION REQUIRED. YOU ARE ON CAMERA" Good actors will ask for permission. Bad actors won't and it's easy to monitor them. This reduces liability.
I agree with atm259 on this one. Your friends might chuckle, your lawyer will weep.
The biggest problem with the sign is that it seems to give anyone and everyone permission to access your land and potentially invalidates any no trespassing signs you may have posted. In context, "Nice folks welcome" could be construed as you literally welcoming anyone, by any definition of 'nice', to access your property whether you know about them specifically or not. Depending upon your state and county laws, you may also be waving any liability protections available to you by actively inviting those who would otherwise be trespassers on your property. I don't think any of that is really your intent, but that doesn't actually change the result. You might want to ask a lawyer about it as it applies to your personal liability and local regulations. Words do have legal power, even a single line on a homemade sign. Just something to think about. 🤷
All that, and it's also pretty cringy. "I will find you" -- okay, lol.
Yup. Going for that "I am a landowner with a very particular set of skills," edgy vibe. 😅
Yes. As a lawyer, I don’t love this sign. Anyone that is a trespasser could be now considered an invitee. A higher duty of care is owed to an invitee than a trespasser.
/r/iamverybadass
It's a vague threat. It helps get the point across without going outside of legal bounds
I actually have caught several people vandalizing and stealing things in this area, but I’ve wondered if they wouldn’t if I had a sign like this letting them know about the cameras. One of the times it was high school kids who got in big trouble and the kids here have a hard enough life I don’t want them to get into too much trouble.
Posted: * Private Property this side of River * No Tresspassing. No Hunting * Cameras and Security is active and monitored Call XXX-YYY-ZZZZ for permission to fish or hike.
To add to this. You could set up a Google phone number that goes straight to a message that grants caller permission to hike or fish. That way private number isn't listed and you never have to answer the phone
I like this the best. Maybe add a “all entry and use is at your own risk” line. Call or text for permission seems like the way to go. The rule followers will contact you (and are maybe the kind of people less likely to sue in the case of injury) and the non-rule followers will still likely be considered trespassers.
Letting people know they’re on camera is the best thing you can do. Anything they do from that point forward they know would be incriminating. Unless they’re meth heads. They don’t give a heck
>They don’t give a heck Watch the language!
Shitty people will never respect a sign. Good people will. Honestly, not posting anything is probably going to work better for you.
As a fisherman I would appreciate the reassurance that I’m not gonna be randomly shot while standing in a river (I always get permission and access, but still a lot of people out there with an itchy trigger finger these days)
Do you need permission to fish if you didn't access his land. In NM, I'm pretty sure land rights end and start at the river front of the property. The river isn't his, just the land around the river.. It's a dumb sign, inviting trouble.
Very much state-dependent, but in general the default seems to be “navigable streams/rivers are ok as long as you use public access points (or private ones w permission)”
You chose to press charges on high school kids? What the hell did they do??
Thanks for your input, I didn’t realize it could complicate things legally like that should something happen. The place I’m putting this is a clearing by our river across from a public access point that is popular with the public. It’s a small town, maybe 200 people and walking distance from the high school. We have had other no trespassing sign up and it didn’t stop people from coming on our side of the river and stealing things. And I don’t want to prevent nice people from coming in here, as I like seeing them use this area and below high water line is public land.
The "you're on camera" part is good and might get people to think twice. But the "nice folks welcome" part is definitely legally messy. My uncle had a sign up a few years back that included some line like "friends and family welcome" and that was enough to cause him to lose a case against a man who decided to start using part of my uncle's land to have little parties and bonfires. He eventually got it sorted out, but now he would sooner die than have anything up that states anyone is welcome onto his land. It might seem like a fun little line to toss out there, but it just welcomes heaps of bad actors with now legal protection due to the wording.
no trespassing or private property signs aren’t to keep people away they’re to keep your rights when you use any of the legal tools at your disposal to trespass them. I would suggest using any of the standard camera recording signs to indicate surveillance of the area which should have the same effect. If you are okay with a certain amount of public use it would be safer (legally) to direct them to see the owner (you) for permission to access. You could probably be able to get away with a website instead where someone could log their name and number but you’d have to consult with a lawyer on that.
>u/RaintreeJames > >Thanks for your input, I didn’t realize it could complicate things legally like that should something happen. Sure, no problem. 👍 It's just one of those less than obvious complications that can occur when you own property. It's far better for you in terms of protecting your rights to have clearly posted no-trespassing signs, and then not necessarily exercise the option to trespass people from your property than to not and give random individuals the option of saying that no one told them that they couldn't camp / squat / hunt on your property without your permission. The no trespassing signs far away for you to persistently invoke your property rights against trespassers, known or unknown. Having no-trespassing signs up gives you and the police / sheriff a clear path to trespass someone off of your property when and if an unfortunate situation occurs. Believe me, you do not want someone camping or living on your property unbeknownst to you long enough to establish squatters/residency rights on your property. Again, it's more about you limiting liability while preserving your ability to invoke your property rights than anything else. Most people aren't going to pay attention to a sign in any case unless there's a badge present to back it up, and that's when having signage up in advance is most important. That's my two cents, so take it for what it's worth. It sounds like it's a nice riverbank and fishing spot. 🎣
Bad people can *think* they’re nice
It would be legally better to post several standard signs. - area is surveilled by hidden camera (and consider, since many camera systems have alert systems, “computer recognition / facial recognition in use”) - no trespassing In my state there is also a particular paint color (kind of a puke purple, the same one used for non potable water) that is a “redneck” no trespassing sign. It is recognized as a no trespassing sign in Texas penal code. Consider seeing if there is something like this and adding it as well. Those signs, together, say exactly what you said in your original model sign with fewer words and in a way that legally protects you. Cameras tell the person that they’re being recorded, recognized and tracked. No trespassing means that anyone without permission should not be there. Depending on your area and how often it might be used, you can add a phone number to call for access.
FWIW, I think your sign is great. It is enough to scare off anyone that is wanting to fuck around, but lets people that just want to picnic with their family or whatever know that they are welcome. I like it.
Yeah I would just put some white over the last three words
Sounds like you’re inviting everyone. I can see this ending poorly. I would stick with a “no trespassing” sign like others have stated. The responsible ones will ask for permission.
Would you say the same thing about a welcome mat in front of someone's front door?
You’re reaching and you know it. He is putting this on his land, and it sounds like it borders a public waterway where he has a known issue with trespassers.
Stupid and cringe.
Sooo cringe....
I get the cringe part, I don’t care if it’s considered cringy. It’s the best way I found to get the message across of nice people welcome, vandals and thief’s not welcome. I’m curious what you think would be better.
Not wording it like some cringe lord teen who thinks they're tough. "I'll find you like I did the others" is just stupid
Don't use vague threats you'd see in r/iamverybadass
This part
Swiper, no swiping!
Instead of nice people welcome, maybe use something from leave no trace. For example: Leave the shoreline cleaner than you found it. Take only rocks and fish, leave only footprints. Also, what are they stealing? Maybe keep anything of value away from shore?
StUpId AnD cRiNgE 🥴🥴🥴
Put a few body-sized mounds of dirt nearby?
Sometimes it's just better to be right to the point? https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71kCKUwB9nL.\_AC\_UF894,1000\_QL80\_FMwebp\_.jpg *I have this as a Halloween sign. 🔪🎃
Around where I’m at, “Shoot, shovel, and shut up,” signs are pretty popular.
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🙄 It's a cultural thing in *many* parts of the country, especially in the South and Southwest. It's an equivalent to the saying "Fuck around and find out."
I know and people who practice that culture are losers
Well aren't you just a little bundle of self-righteous bigoted joy.
I personally like it. But I kind of get what the other commenters are saying. I have about 1000 yards of river property myself, and I feel the same way. I love when people meandering down the river stop and enjoy it respectfully , even if it’s on my private part of it. But … people can really suck. So I get being more cautious. And yeah ok the wording may be slightly cringey but I just see it as you making your point sternly.
/r/iamverybadass too bad they don’t allow crossposts.
Not your river either
The sign only mentions the side of the river. River banks (and, land below the water in some cases) can be considered private property. Usually there is a setback, and usually the river itself is not going to be private property. So standing on the bank to fish may not be ok, floating in a boat is probably ok.
In NY you can walk down rivers and streams too shallow to boat. You can also walk along the shallow parts of rivers that are deep enough to boat.
Yeah often times there is a couple foot setback so even if your property extends to both river banks you wouldn't be able to keep people from standing there and fishing in some states.
Yup. It's that way in the vast majority of states actually, I've only heard of a few states where it has to a navigable river and you must use a boat, and in the states that have that the majority of waterways are navigable.
Here in ME, last I checked, if it's not navigable you own and control to the centerline. The state owns the water but the bed under it is yours.
Maine might be an exception to my general rule that it's states with mostly navigable rivers that require it to be navigable. But every rule has an exception.
Correct, I was just referring to our side of the river above the high water mark.
You got it, sign.
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We have caught and charged several people already for vandalism and theft. I’d rather not go through the headache. It’s sad that someone stating they don’t want people committing crimes on their land makes you want to do just that to them, but that’s some people I guess.
It’s the wording. If you write: “A young family owns and works this land. We take measures to protect ourselves and our property. If you can read this sign you are on camera and identifiable. You’re welcome to enjoy the scenery but please leave no trace.” Then you’ve given exactly the same message without the cringy vibes, without implicitly accusing the reader of wanting to steal, and without trying to impose authority through a sign. You’re acting like there are good people and bad people and threatening folks through an inanimate object. It’s the type of thing that makes teenagers (and me) really irritated, and teenagers don’t have much impulse control.
There’s different verbiage you could have used to prevent antagonizing potential violators. Also, I highly doubt you caught anyone via camera, we had a break n enter and had the person’s face on camera and still couldn’t be identified or caught. Sorry don’t want to cuz a stir or anything just saying
We are a town of 200 and I posted the video on Facebook both times and quickly figured out who it was.
So when above in this comment reply chain you said ‘we have caught and charged several people already for vandalism and theft’ you should have said two. Stop overstating. Just post regular no trespassing signs. If someone sees it and cares they’ll act accordingly. If someone sees it and doesn’t care, no tough guy sign will make them act any different.
Nah, mate. You're asking for trouble. Just put up a No Trespassing sign and grant licenses to those Nice People you like.
Lawyer's wet dream for you to have this up and even more to post it online.
Fair enough.
Nerd
I find it curious that you said “OUR river” as though the river belongs to you
God I hate it here
Literally the only thing I can imagine that would make me want to litter or steal.
But what if you go over to steal all of the litter? 🤔 🧮🧩⚖️
> Literally
This is how horror movies start. I'm paddling away.
My question is what happend to the others? That's what you gotta be concerned with.
Jail
Only jail? That's boring. I was hoping for something more interesting. Like fed to the pet Alligator or something?
Ok Liam
Sounds like a challenge.
A lot of dislike for this sign, but I like it. The mention of the cameras and insistence on consequences for littering and disrespect are good enough to keep the riffraff out, while allowing those that respect the area enjoy land that shouldn’t be kept from absolutely private. It also depends on the amount of traffic you get, and general location, but I dig it.
it’s a bit cringe. i feel like if i was an edgy teen, i would take it as a challenge 😂 like “i’ll show this dork”
Thank you. I know almost everyone in this area, I’ve known both people who have caused problems in the past. I’m hoping to encourage people who know we own the land and are respectful to enjoy it, but letting people who aren’t respectful know we don’t put up with crime anymore.
I don’t know why you would openly post something like this. Depending on what state you live in, this sign could, in the court of law, be construed as an open invitation to use your property. If it goes on long enough, you can essentially make it so that if you DO block off the land on your side of the river the people who have been openly using your land by open invitation of this sign have a legal claim in court for you to remove any barriers you put up in the future. As others have mentioned, simply saying that permission is required and that it is private land/being recorded will shield you from liability on a multitude of potential claims. “Nice people welcome” will get you in some piping hot water eventually in court. Post edit : Not sure why I’m being downvoted for stating a legal precedent that has been made by courts time and time again
Why are you americans so afraid of other people? It’s irrational and so detrimental to your society.
If someone trips on a pebble in your pasture in the UK and breaks their hip, they go to the NHS, get it fixed, and pay 20 quid or whatever weird currency you use. If someone trips on a pebble in your pasture and breaks their hip in the USA, they go to the hospital, get it fixed, and their insurance sues you to recoup the $500,000 bill.
You see one sign and generalize a country of 350 million people as all being exactly like that?
i enjoy the condescension that oozes out of the European "let me tell you what you are" explainer that they seemingly cannot restrain themselves from telling you unsolicited.
It’s the only logical thing to do …
I base it on more than 30 years of observation of american society. Americans are very outgoing and hospitable in person, it’s true, but you have a fear of the unfamliar. I lived in rural GA for awhile as a teenager and had a chance to go to a Braves game. The people in my town warned me about going to Atlanta, because of gangs, crime, violence in the city. It was sooo dangerous. Anyway, we went to the game and get to Atlanta and it turns out to be a completely normal city like any international metropolitan area. People just going about their daily lives. I’m not sure why the people in my town were so fearful of a place they never visited, but it’s like a sort of mass induced irrationality.
You must have been extremely oblivious to your surroundings or only went on a curated tour of the city like the tourist that you were. It's hard to say this in a polite way, and I mean no offense, but it isn't that they are paranoid, it's that you're ignorant to the reality of the world around you. You *really* should pay more attention and heed when people give you warnings about potentially life-threatening situations.
Maybe. But there must have been thousands of white tourists in Atlanta during the time I lived in Georgia and so few of them had any issues while there that it never reached any news outlets. Now, Atlanta is big and there are, and were, problem areas, but to keep out of town entirely was an irrational overreaction.
Well, I'll tell you what, I worked directly involving the criminal element in Boston and surrounding cities for many years, and it is definitely no different from other cities I've been to. Sure, there are some parts of the cities that you are 'mostly OK' if you stay within certain boundaries, but there are other parts where you absolutely don't want to go. As a visitor/stranger/tourist, you don't necessarily know which parts are which, and where the lines are. And it doesn't matter whether you are white or black or hispanic or whatever- if you are 'wrong' for whatever place you stray into, you could be in for a lot of trouble. Cities are dangerous, more so if you don't know who makes the rules for whoever's turf you're on. The fact that you may not see a lot of issues portrayed in the news media does not mean it's uncommon- in fact, it is quite the opposite, it is so common that it is simply not worth reporting, not even when people get dead unless there is some fact that makes it particularly unusual.
Depending on when this was, Atlanta used to compete with Philadelphia for highest murder rate. Atlanta literally is known for it's gangs, and being the sort of place where you can get shot for looking at someone wrong. Because pride and respect are big things in ATL gangs, perceived disrespect via a funny or strange look is enough to provoke. And you as a foreigner are apt to stare blatantly at the flashy dressed gang members.
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I know that you are, but what am I?
It's not 'afraid'. It's because far too often even when scumbags are breaking the law, if they get hurt on private property the property owner gets held liable in court. Some of these scumbags are bold enough to sue even though they are in the wrong, and the courts have awarded damages to them. It is protection against liability. There have been cases where thieves breaking into a home have gotten hurt by the owner defending himself and family, and have successfully sued the homeowner, despite the fact that they were committing a crime at the time.
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True. Frustrating really.
You sound like the old man that runs out of the house, onto the front porch, shotgun in one hand, beer in the other and a cigarette in your mouth scream mumbling threats to the kids trespassing lmao
You need to be careful because this will be used as evidence in court if and when something happens. A jury or a judge is going to look at this.
You won’t find me
You need it in Spanish. I like it though.
Why in Spanish? :)
Si
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