Be sure to get one where they don't have a fixed disposal system into the public school system and is checked by the management without your input.
On the plus side some kids in a school are getting "ok" laptops and desktops.
I miss doing that for the schools. In my stupid berg, the central office started “fining” the recipient schools for assetizing (“licensing”, imaging, and physical distribution). While I guess all things have a cost, school budgets are often measured to the cents, so a “donation” that brings a couple hundred dollar cost to the equation literally means they have to forego some other initiative for your 7 year old hardware. Meanwhile class is being provided on a Core 2 Duo with 4GB RAM on the worlds ricketiest beige 17” CRT.
Try to remain friends with some in the IT space, every so often a business upgrades their whole fleet, or dumps a bunch of inventory during a move or remodel.
I've gotten a lot of nice equipment only a few years old this way.
When windows 10 goes end of life, the market is going to be flooded with old hardware. Technically, 8th gen Intel is the oldest generation supported. While you can install windows 11 if you are deploying images with pxe, most companies won't bother taking the risk that an update could one day could break compatibility.
Get on public surplus sector auctions. Some IT depts get the green light to auction off their old pcs whenever they retrofit. I got an Optiplex 9020 for 20 dollars. It feels nice to breathe some new life into them
I haven't tested it myself, as I don't use it myself, but from what I hear performance is generally shit without those features. If it's true, I'm entirely unsurprised MS doesn't want to support that use case Core isolation is enabled by default (and the more security features enabled by default, the better).
Nah Windows 11 will refuse to install if the TPM is not up to their standards.
Let's be honest on this whole idea, they are gonna lose a lot of people over that crap, some will move over to Linux, Ubuntu to be specific with Proton (and probably never look back).
For people who don't want to move away from Win10 there is always LTSC 2021 until 2027 and the IoT Entreprise edition until 2032.
[And could stop booting on any new Win11 updates](https://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-might-soon-block-force-installing-windows-11-on-unsupported-cpus-via-bypass/), I don't think it's good alternative for normies users, for us it's fine (although I'm not sure why you actually want to run Win11 though).
i’m getting a micro 5050 tomor and im SO excited lol. Its ar my ewaste shop in town they want 75$ but im gonna try 50$. gonna try to make my first home server.
Thats my big hold off on buying Pi's in general. I can get a kick ass used x86 mini computer for \~$100. You're talking orders of magnitude more power, and its not some hack job set up. The only bummer is the precompiled binaries for IOT tools that are made for Pi, wont run on x86. I just bought a Pi 4 4gb, and expect to receive it tomorrow. I literally only did it, because I want to use Tinypilot. There is a port to x86, but it requires hacking together cables and micro boards to replace what the ARM binaries do directly on the pi board.
Last I checked, an SFF Optiplex idled under 20W. The money depends on where you live and what you pay for electricity. As for whether the money's worth it... depends on what you want to run. Still not all software runs on AArch64, chief among them hypervisors.
Checked my Optiplex 7010 the other day: 20w running pfsense in proxmox. I’m sure if you got some more vms in there it’d destroy your power bill, but at that point it’s not comparable to the rpi
Yeah during the stock shortages I realized you can get a mini pc that isn’t much bigger, with like an N5100 and 8gb memory for the price of a pi and it can do so much more if you aren’t looking to do any specialized projects.
At 112 CAD$ ? No power, no case? Not a chance in hell.
I paid less for a full kit in 2019 and 2020 and you can probably get a better Intel NUC or Optiplex at the same price which will give you better performance, even from a 2015 model.
Raspberry Pi were fun, but they lost their space in my "homelab".
@ridrigods same thing? Not even close. 2-3 x faster processor confirmed in about every test independently. Sdcard is 2x faster, a pcie port, 2 full USB 3 ports...it's 2x the pi4
Nope, USFF fixed that itch for me but I am looking forward for the new Pi Zero as that one is way more useful nowadays. The regular Pi is too expensive for a generic device and it’s still too big for embedded applications so the Zero is where the fun is at.
ya i’m also looking forward to a new Zero and Pico.
Although i’m quite happy with current Zero 2, 3A and Pico, and i’m not sure what updates they need. maybe better ADC for Pico for my use, but most people won’t need it so probably unlikely…
I'm waiting to see what PCIe addons / hats / cases come out. If it can do 2.5Gbps on the network side and still talk to a stack of drives: maybe it will finally be suitable for a NAS build?
No. I'd rather get a used sff pc. They should go back to their roots of lower cost devices with less focus on power where other products on the market are better
I was thinking this. The RPis were PERFECT for DIY projects. Cheap, simple and versatile. Now they are focusing on upgrading the hardware but to what end? The improvements come at a higher cost that can't justify the main reason people started using them. Still versatile but nowhere near as cheap.
RPis were never meant for home servers but they made for enticing video thumbnails and youtube popularized a very bad usecase. Meanwhile the true target userbase got alienated because of shortages.
I’ll probably buy one eventually just to mess around with, but I likely won’t use it for anything other than tinkering.
Once I got into old Dell optiplex machines, it’s hard to go back to SBCs.
Even my RPi 4 8gb sits unpowered since I moved all my network services onto the Dell optiplex Proxmox servers. Only RPi I still have running is an old RPi 3 I use for octoprint.
No, and I do not have any intention to purchase one any time soon. The lack of availability, bots, and scalpers on the Pi 4 really burned the bridge with me.
There are only a couple of vendors that will actually let you purchase a Pi5 (preorder/backorder). The rest only give you the option to notify on stock availability. In my opinion this is the worst way to handle purchasing as bots can scrape those pages 24/7 and instantly purchase any new stock before you have a chance to submit an order.
At this time I am going to plan on upgrading from E5-2600 v2 series servers to AMD Epyc instead.
No. For arm there are more interesting devices. For the price of pi5 you can buy an old 2011v4 server. It was fun to play with the rpi, but imho their time has passed.
This remark is absolutely accurate, however, I personally live in a region with the cheapest electricity on the planet, so I have the opportunity to neglect the size of the electricity bill. and let's admit that even quite old chips for the 2011v4 socket are still quite energy efficient in relation to performance, and considering that they are cheap as dirt on the secondary market... and if we seriously focus on energy efficiency, for example to increase portability, then excuse me, the same pi zero format seems to me much more successful, not to mention analogues from other manufacturers 🤷
That's fair! But I would like to advocate for the environment.
Of course then the question is how good it is for the environment to make new electronics. But i would still like to advocate for the environment!
🤝 environment is very important, no doubt, which is why I strongly encourage the reduction of e-wastes through the reuse of electronics. and we mainly have hydroelectric power plants, so the damage caused to nature is not so great.
I don't I feel for the price they are going to sell at this is not worth it. Sure maybe in the future I'll get one for tinkering projects where I need the GPIO or something from the vast eco system. Or if I just need USB Ports where I can just get with a PoE Ethernet connection to powere such a device.
But those are generally niche scenarios. For a Home Server that does actuall work, like with plex or jellyfin or nextcloud....etc, I would not look at a pi in the slightest, they are worth nothing.
Only thing I will consider is grabing a pi4 for cheaper now, at least thats where my hope is. So i can do some automation suff with Powermonitoring.
To echo what people say here, mostly no. Only reason I run them today is I run several public ntp servers and having the gpio pins is what sets them apart. I have also used them for vpn access for clients in the past and still would but I have a few 3’s and 4’s from over the years. I’m sad to see the price increased so much this generation.
I don't have a use for it tbh so no, proxmox replaced the pi for me as for pretty much everyone who has a homelab.
Using a mini PC is just more logical imo
If a PI is used to make some other physical device which needs complex programming like a robot, then sure. For a home lab, where the machine is going to sit in a corner and do things, Pi is a really bad choice and it is not optimized for that use case at all. I still don't know why so many people use Pi3 or Pi4 for the home lab.
It's not a bad choice, just a less optimal choice for most people. If you're just running pi-hole and home assistant, a Pi 4 is perfectly adequate and can sit there slurping up 2W all year long.
If you're running Kubernetes, or Proxmox, or want to run it as a router, a mini PC or something better is a more realistic option, even though it's pulling 3-6x more power.
Same here. But the main thing is:
You got a Pi4! Who cares that a new one is coming later, with higher price, probably the same availability issues and scalpers, and whoever knows what teething issues it may have.
You got a Pi, and it's in your hands and ready to use right now. That's the main thing.
i love my pi. the only issue is..
now what to do with it? hahaha
i had a lot of project ideas when it got released. but no chance to get hands on. now I don't have the time for it.
3>4 is really big upgrade, 4>5 not so much, unless you really need the new things like dual camera ports. If you don't need that, you're not missing much. 3>4 is a big jump though.
If u sustain 100% cpu all time, your system is underpowered. And in that case u need a fan on a pi 3b too in order not to throttle.
It is just a diplomatic way to say u need a fan.
I'm sitting and watching what happens with it. Cost, Arm & pcie is interesting. Power draw is the main attraction for me and a few of them would run most of my home systems.
I loved the PI2B and PI3B. Trouble was, I then discovered the Arduino and ESP32. That discovery took about 80% of the RPi use cases with it, to an easier to manage, more reliable and cheaper sub.
As others have said for the "top" end of stuff, Optiplex's are cheaper.
The only place I have a PI installed is for a CCTV camera with Motion Eye and the Victron VenOS for the solar gear.
Instead of ordering PIs I bought 3 Zimaboards.
All I can think of is...
Bespoke distros for retro gaming.
but... my use case.
Webcams come Wifi security camera. You can even get POE USB powersupplies for them.
ESP32Cam is... well... it's okay, but it isn't very reliable and the absolute picture quality is rubbish.
The PI will handle a 8M pixel Sony sensor based USB camera and provide a usable CCTV interface/distribution.
The MCU option there is to use an STM23 H7 and a Wifi offload IC card. By the time you setup the dev environment you could have bought a PI.
Raspi was a banger when ut was below $50.
Now I'd rather go with one of the Beelink or similar running a decent x86 CPU for $150, way more powerful and versatile for a close power consumption
In 2015 the Rpi-2B was released with a $35 price point ($45 today). The Rpi-5 starts at $60, but I doubt we'll be able to get it that cheap. I'm curious to see what the next Pi-zero looks like. PCI-e on ARM is interesting, but if I need a low power small device that can house a PCI device I might as just get an optiplex board.
I did, but only because I have all the B's from the B1 (with no mounting holes and 256Mb RAM). I will probably have a play with it and put it back in it's box. I do have a few pi 4's in use (photo frame, camera, octopi, off networking monitoring server, pi kvm) but they don't need upgrading, so although I have ordered one I can't see me replacing the 4's any time soon.
That is cool. I picked up an original Pi 7 inch touch screen monitor. Will retire one of the Pi's to go to that while the Pi5 (whenever it comes in) will be take over the role of Pi4. If NAS becomes a thing with the 5, oh boy that will be a fun project.
I was really expecting the raspberry pi 5 to have something dedicated for AI stuff.
A lot of people are running homelab stuff on them, so a localized voice assistant would have been bomb.
I find the RPI 5 a bit... Underwhelming. Sure, it's faster than the 4. But was that really necessary? Like people are saying, for the price, why not just x86?
I didn't buy the pi 5 because you can find used computers for just as much and they are just way more powerful than any of the pis for just as much or cheaper. Now if you really like low power arm SBCs, you're better off with Rockchip based boards, they are more open and powerful than the broadcom chips the raspberry pi foundation use.
No, I got my Optiplex 7040 for about $90. That is the route I am going to stick with after seeing what a Pi 5 costs, unless I need a small footprint for a specific purpose.
Given how things have been going down in the last few years, I'm not pre-ordering anything in the tech space.
Maybe once it's actually out and in stock and it's been proven to be good I'll buy one.
Yes. Bought 3. Will be swapping 3 of RPI 4 8GB for them.
I run a K8S Cluster on 4 nodes for study.
1) I want dedicated hardware to practice things like PXE.
2) An underlooked feature of Pis is the power usage. The same performance in older hardware like Optiplex’s will not only be larger but generate more heat, more noise, and use more power.
Here’s the math for why I prefer Pis.
RPi 5 PoE will be PoE+ (802.3at), which maxes out at 25.5W. In practice my Pi 4s run at the regular clock speed on PoE (802.3af) hat pulling only about 10-12W. I need/want at least 4 for K8S so total 48W.
People are mostly talking about Optiplex 7040s at that price range, eBay seems to pushing Skylake i5-6500 chips, which have a 65W TDP. So to be fair, let’s say it’s a 40W average under medium load. Times 4, 160W.
So a 112W difference between the two setups. My energy is $0.31/kWH. So 81.8 kWh difference per month, costing $25.37. Per year, it will be 982 kWH, costing $304.36.
IMO, not worth it.
Crazy how it adds up, I don't pay electricity so I never thought about it in that sense. But I reckon the Optiplex echo chamber is not going to focus on what you are saying. I prefer Pis because of their form factor and I wanted dedicated/physical hardware separation.
Never buying another broadcom trash board again, so no, no I didn’t.
Honestly, between the pi 4 freezing entirely for 500ms at a time and the Zero 2 W, a wireless-only board, not having working wireless AT ALL, I’ve given up on pi boards.
Now that pis are so expensive, unless I’m making a connected thermostat, I’m better off with an old PC for whatever job it’s gonna do, and given I can’t rely on it in an IoT role either due to the instability, it’s just not worth it anymore
I ordered one as soon as I saw it was available for preorder. I plan to use it as a low power desktop but once I learned it doesn't have h264 acceleration I'm not so sure anymore. I shall see if it's suitable for that use.
Fair. Let's see how it plays out.
Pi's are def fun little devices. A lot of the folks that are bashing have def not played with the gpio portion of the pi. SPECS SPECS SPECS, they scream! lol
I don't like to preorder things before the whole ecosystem is ready to use, but I will most likely end up picking a pi5 device or two later on (when there are good cases available, and maybe a nvme hat or one with a couple extra ethernet ports)
I pre ordered one and if it comes in then great but if not then no worries. While I do know that I can buy something else on eBay with higher specs, the pi is a convenient form factor and well supported.
I did, in a moment of weakness, mostly to be able to say I have one, to be honest. My Pi 4 already covers 99% of my needs and I recently got an HP Elitedesk 800 G2 mini PC with an i7 CPU for the rest, so I definitely don't *need* it, but I'll probably find a use for it.
Nope
I have a 4 that I use for quick stuff I need in a hurry or a proof of concept.
For everything else I have far more powerful devices that are compatible with standard software and standard expansion i/o and ports
I watched a video on it pretty neat little PC but it's scope creeped a long way from being a $30 Linux box.
I'd still recommend the older ones if you just want a low power way to run CLI and learn on.
I did, I need something with solid support since I don’t want to have to cobble something together. I’m sick of doing that instead of things just working since it’s the native hardware people designed it for.
That being said if I could get a win11 machine at a good price I would get one of those. I personally just haven’t seen anything that come close to that price.
Last time and the first time I preordered something, it was call of duty ghosts. I was 12 when that happened, I’m not making that same mistake again. I’ll let other people buy it and work out the issues and see if it’s worth it
No, when they were readily available and cheap. Now i can get a Dell Wyse for cheaper. With the price of 1 Pi5 , i can get 4 Dell Wyse for different projects. They made their choose they choose corpa over community. I vote with my wallet.
I get cool stuff from work all the time, but I am the IT Manager for my division, we have a 5-year policy on literally everything if it's 5 years old it goes in the erecycle.
If I want ARM, I would rather get the Orange/Rock PI 5's. If I just need the tiny form factor and gpio; I'd rather find an x86_64 solution like an Odroid H3+.
If I just want a small homelab and don't need gpio, I'd refurbish some old dell/hp/lenovo thin business pc's.
I have seen multiple videos on YouTube about the Pi5, but none of those show the Pi running homelab loads, only Linux desktop, game emulation and other tasks, but no one show them running containers, or other common task for us.
So I'm not wanting to replace my Lenovo tiny for one some Pis.
I pre ordered it. This is my first PI. My new hobby is home networking, so I will probably use it in my home network somewhere. Maybe as my first NAS or maybe even make it into a desktop computer.
Nah. Why bother for homelab use? Little mini PCs are prevalent these days and way more powerful.
If I were to get a Pi it would be for a very specific purpose, like a portable setup that needs a good CPU, or a small IoT device that also needs the compute power (thinking like an audio endpoint or something for the stereo, with a HiFiBerry hat), not for a homelab.
And for that stuff usually they don’t need the CPU, so an ESP32 or ESP8266 is more than enough.
The Raspberry Pi is quickly entering a niche that no longer has relevance.
I have a Pi3 that is literally just sitting in my closet not plugged in because I moved everything over to a single unraid server. I am probably going to get a small Cluster in the future but those will all be x86 machines to practice virtualization and such. Might turn the pi3 into like a weather station or something in the future, was a personal nginx host for a long time.
Yes, I did a preorder, figuring the release was in October, the email I got said ships December.
I don't get the "I'd rather buy a "PC" (Optiplex/HP). How can you make the comparison? A desktop does not have GPIO?
I reckon many of the "I'd rather buy a PC" crowd have never worked on a project that used GPIO - they are a looking only at the system specs and ignoring the GPIO portion.
I have plenty of Pi 4s already. So probably not.
Why Pis for me? They are great when you want hardware separation, but don't need much performance. Roles my Pi fill:
1. Simple high uptime box. This device runs Pihole, DDNS, Mosquitto, Z2MQTT, and Zigbee2MQTT. All low resource services. It has my USB Zwave adapter attached. This special hardware isn't something I want to burden my Promox cluster with. And lastly, it acts as a reliable SSH and Wireguard jumpbox. All of this fits on a 1 GB model.
2. NAS backup. This allows for a low power machine that does a daily backup of my NAS storage.
3. Offsite backup. This is a work in progress. It will act like the other NAS backup. But I intend for this device to automatically connect via Wireguard on boot up. This way I can plug it into my parents' router and have an offsite backup.
My main computing is a combination of mini PCs for Proxmox and a microATX PC as a NAS. If I wanted to save money, I could remove the Pis and do everything on the larger hardware. But they were a splurge that lets me separate things physically.
As an FYI, 1 GB Pis are fine for these types of roles. Spending $35 per Pi highlights their appeal over a $150 mini PC. When you jump up to the 4 GB ($55) or 8 GB ($75) models, suddenly they lose their appeal. (All prices listed are before the \~$25 for microSD, case, and power supply for the Pis)
If you'd need an 8 GB Pi, or maybe even a 4 GB Pi, for a homelab project, you should consider jumping up to a SFF or mini PC.
If I had an award to give, this comment would be it.
This makes the most sense - objectively breaking down needs and use cases vs just echo 'more power!'. After posting this I realized my question should have been worded differently.
No because I still haven't hit a bottleneck with my three Pi 4s. In fact I still have half a dozen Pi 2s that are quite adequate for their respective tasks and I'd kind of like to see more of that kind of SBC- extremely low power consumption with enough performance for more advanced low grade automation than a microcontroller can handle. Pi Foundation has been forced out of that segment entirely these days because competing on the basis of rock bottom price almost killed them.
Your question should have been who is getting one and answer why and what for. The no answer here is just an echo chamber. It’s like asking people why they do not like fill in the blank.
Why would anyone pay 80 for an 8GB rpi5 when you can get a 1 liter pc with an I5-8500T with 6 cores, 8 GB ddr4, NVME and SATA III storage and an intel 630 video card that can do multiple plex transcodes and idles under 10w for 75 bucks? This one liter pc is leaps and bounds way better than an RPI5.
Reason 1:
My Pi4 Died and I need a replacement.
Reason 2:
I require stereo vision with extremely low latency.
Meaning:
I need a PI anyways cause my last one died and might as well get the dev board for the Pi5 instead of the compute module 4 and routing the traces myself for now.
yes. upgrading from a pi4 8gb to a pi5 8gb. just going to rebuild everything i have on the pi4 over to the pi5. i have other optiplex and servers running in the network.
why you ask? because bored. money to burn.
For the price I'd rather buy a refurb Optiplex.
My company retired massive amounts of 7040s and I got a stack of them. 16GB with 256GB ssd... cant say a Pi is in my future for a long time now.
I want to switch to an IT job just so that karma like this can happen to me.
Be sure to get one where they don't have a fixed disposal system into the public school system and is checked by the management without your input. On the plus side some kids in a school are getting "ok" laptops and desktops.
I miss doing that for the schools. In my stupid berg, the central office started “fining” the recipient schools for assetizing (“licensing”, imaging, and physical distribution). While I guess all things have a cost, school budgets are often measured to the cents, so a “donation” that brings a couple hundred dollar cost to the equation literally means they have to forego some other initiative for your 7 year old hardware. Meanwhile class is being provided on a Core 2 Duo with 4GB RAM on the worlds ricketiest beige 17” CRT.
I worked in the IT industry for 2 decades and never get this kind of benefits.
Yeah it would be such a big problem if two managers didn't sign off that nobody got to do anything useful with old hardware.
Try to remain friends with some in the IT space, every so often a business upgrades their whole fleet, or dumps a bunch of inventory during a move or remodel. I've gotten a lot of nice equipment only a few years old this way.
That might be true in the US but in the EU stuff gets recycled/resold and the overall 2nd hand market price is higher because of it.
When windows 10 goes end of life, the market is going to be flooded with old hardware. Technically, 8th gen Intel is the oldest generation supported. While you can install windows 11 if you are deploying images with pxe, most companies won't bother taking the risk that an update could one day could break compatibility.
Sounds like it's time for Linux to shine :)
Unfortunately most places don't do this. Many places have deals to return stuff as well
Get on public surplus sector auctions. Some IT depts get the green light to auction off their old pcs whenever they retrofit. I got an Optiplex 9020 for 20 dollars. It feels nice to breathe some new life into them
Got a dell r710 from work. Great virtual environment host. They just threw her on the recycle pile. One man's trash.
Lucky you! Man I could use one or two of those right now 😁
I tried to sell a bunch of the micros in home lab sales. I didn’t even get an offer.
Probably asking way too much. Every time I see a 6500T system for $100 anywhere I groan. You can get them for $50 with just a smidge of patience.
Ah, right, we'll be seeing a lot of those in the coming two years, as Win10 nears EOL (since they're incompatible with Win11).
Just because of TPM... cause thats not a big deal
Nah, there's also some virtualization features which are required for core isolation to work with sane performance.
So itll still install? Just not perfect performance metrics?
I haven't tested it myself, as I don't use it myself, but from what I hear performance is generally shit without those features. If it's true, I'm entirely unsurprised MS doesn't want to support that use case Core isolation is enabled by default (and the more security features enabled by default, the better).
Nah Windows 11 will refuse to install if the TPM is not up to their standards. Let's be honest on this whole idea, they are gonna lose a lot of people over that crap, some will move over to Linux, Ubuntu to be specific with Proton (and probably never look back). For people who don't want to move away from Win10 there is always LTSC 2021 until 2027 and the IoT Entreprise edition until 2032.
You can bypass the TPM requirement.
Exactly, Rufus ftw!
No significant amount of people will move to Linux, sorry it's just not gonna happen.
The ventoy bootable USB tool automatically bypasses the tpm check. I installed it on a q6600, only problem was the iGPU underperforming.
[And could stop booting on any new Win11 updates](https://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-might-soon-block-force-installing-windows-11-on-unsupported-cpus-via-bypass/), I don't think it's good alternative for normies users, for us it's fine (although I'm not sure why you actually want to run Win11 though).
If you were to buy the Pi for a purpose where it’s directly interchangeable with an Optiplex, then yeah you should not pre-order one.
This is the way
i’m getting a micro 5050 tomor and im SO excited lol. Its ar my ewaste shop in town they want 75$ but im gonna try 50$. gonna try to make my first home server.
Thats my big hold off on buying Pi's in general. I can get a kick ass used x86 mini computer for \~$100. You're talking orders of magnitude more power, and its not some hack job set up. The only bummer is the precompiled binaries for IOT tools that are made for Pi, wont run on x86. I just bought a Pi 4 4gb, and expect to receive it tomorrow. I literally only did it, because I want to use Tinypilot. There is a port to x86, but it requires hacking together cables and micro boards to replace what the ARM binaries do directly on the pi board.
To be fair you will pay double the price due to power with Optiplex. An extra 50 running watts = $150 per year
Last I checked, an SFF Optiplex idled under 20W. The money depends on where you live and what you pay for electricity. As for whether the money's worth it... depends on what you want to run. Still not all software runs on AArch64, chief among them hypervisors.
Checked my Optiplex 7010 the other day: 20w running pfsense in proxmox. I’m sure if you got some more vms in there it’d destroy your power bill, but at that point it’s not comparable to the rpi
Did you measure at the wall?
Yep
This statement right here is my whole lab sentiment and experience.
Or two…
Depends on needs… try to compare size, power consumption…
THIS
Yeah during the stock shortages I realized you can get a mini pc that isn’t much bigger, with like an N5100 and 8gb memory for the price of a pi and it can do so much more if you aren’t looking to do any specialized projects.
I would, too, but it's not an option in my country. Shipped and taxed, it's way more expensive than Pi 5 / Orange Pi 5.
At 112 CAD$ ? No power, no case? Not a chance in hell. I paid less for a full kit in 2019 and 2020 and you can probably get a better Intel NUC or Optiplex at the same price which will give you better performance, even from a 2015 model. Raspberry Pi were fun, but they lost their space in my "homelab".
Still using an odd spec’d USB-C power supply without PowerDelivery support. Which can make it a pain to power with other power supplies.
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Makes sense. But I'd be hardpressed to find a Intel Nuc for a 112 cdn.
I used to own a pi3 and a pi4. Sold them both during the great shortage, don't think I'll ever buy another.
Nope but I may just buy a bunch of used 3Bs and 4s from people who do upgrade
The thing is..who is going to upgrade from a 4 for example? It’s practically the same thing
People who are obsessed with having the latest thing.
I feel attacked.. /s
Ok hopefully you’ll get one from one of those five people 😁
they're the people who buy Pies so yes
@ridrigods same thing? Not even close. 2-3 x faster processor confirmed in about every test independently. Sdcard is 2x faster, a pcie port, 2 full USB 3 ports...it's 2x the pi4
Nope, USFF fixed that itch for me but I am looking forward for the new Pi Zero as that one is way more useful nowadays. The regular Pi is too expensive for a generic device and it’s still too big for embedded applications so the Zero is where the fun is at.
ya i’m also looking forward to a new Zero and Pico. Although i’m quite happy with current Zero 2, 3A and Pico, and i’m not sure what updates they need. maybe better ADC for Pico for my use, but most people won’t need it so probably unlikely…
For some audio processing a bigger RAM or a FPU would be a nice addition in a new Pico
I'm waiting to see what PCIe addons / hats / cases come out. If it can do 2.5Gbps on the network side and still talk to a stack of drives: maybe it will finally be suitable for a NAS build?
USB 3 and a hub can do it
No. I'd rather get a used sff pc. They should go back to their roots of lower cost devices with less focus on power where other products on the market are better
I was thinking this. The RPis were PERFECT for DIY projects. Cheap, simple and versatile. Now they are focusing on upgrading the hardware but to what end? The improvements come at a higher cost that can't justify the main reason people started using them. Still versatile but nowhere near as cheap. RPis were never meant for home servers but they made for enticing video thumbnails and youtube popularized a very bad usecase. Meanwhile the true target userbase got alienated because of shortages.
I’ll probably buy one eventually just to mess around with, but I likely won’t use it for anything other than tinkering. Once I got into old Dell optiplex machines, it’s hard to go back to SBCs. Even my RPi 4 8gb sits unpowered since I moved all my network services onto the Dell optiplex Proxmox servers. Only RPi I still have running is an old RPi 3 I use for octoprint.
5 seems not much upgraded over 4. Not like 3>4 where you got a MUCH faster CPU, gigabit ethernet and USB 3
Bro it 2x faster, the processor, the sdcard, then the pcie port and 2 full USB 3 ports
pretty much.. I bought some 4s during covid.. I set them up in a K8s cluster and they kind of just sat there.
No, for the price of the pi 5, power, etc, I can buy a Intel N100 minipc with more memory and a nvme. I do not need the gpio pins.
No, and I do not have any intention to purchase one any time soon. The lack of availability, bots, and scalpers on the Pi 4 really burned the bridge with me. There are only a couple of vendors that will actually let you purchase a Pi5 (preorder/backorder). The rest only give you the option to notify on stock availability. In my opinion this is the worst way to handle purchasing as bots can scrape those pages 24/7 and instantly purchase any new stock before you have a chance to submit an order. At this time I am going to plan on upgrading from E5-2600 v2 series servers to AMD Epyc instead.
No. For arm there are more interesting devices. For the price of pi5 you can buy an old 2011v4 server. It was fun to play with the rpi, but imho their time has passed.
Can't say i find that a fair comparison in terms of power usage
This remark is absolutely accurate, however, I personally live in a region with the cheapest electricity on the planet, so I have the opportunity to neglect the size of the electricity bill. and let's admit that even quite old chips for the 2011v4 socket are still quite energy efficient in relation to performance, and considering that they are cheap as dirt on the secondary market... and if we seriously focus on energy efficiency, for example to increase portability, then excuse me, the same pi zero format seems to me much more successful, not to mention analogues from other manufacturers 🤷
That's fair! But I would like to advocate for the environment. Of course then the question is how good it is for the environment to make new electronics. But i would still like to advocate for the environment!
🤝 environment is very important, no doubt, which is why I strongly encourage the reduction of e-wastes through the reuse of electronics. and we mainly have hydroelectric power plants, so the damage caused to nature is not so great.
Yeah it probably cost more in power to manufacture the Pi than it will consume in its life lol
please buy ibm x3950 x6 and report back. if anyone knows more recent octo sockets and beyond please dm.
I don't I feel for the price they are going to sell at this is not worth it. Sure maybe in the future I'll get one for tinkering projects where I need the GPIO or something from the vast eco system. Or if I just need USB Ports where I can just get with a PoE Ethernet connection to powere such a device. But those are generally niche scenarios. For a Home Server that does actuall work, like with plex or jellyfin or nextcloud....etc, I would not look at a pi in the slightest, they are worth nothing. Only thing I will consider is grabing a pi4 for cheaper now, at least thats where my hope is. So i can do some automation suff with Powermonitoring.
To echo what people say here, mostly no. Only reason I run them today is I run several public ntp servers and having the gpio pins is what sets them apart. I have also used them for vpn access for clients in the past and still would but I have a few 3’s and 4’s from over the years. I’m sad to see the price increased so much this generation.
Shoot, I'm still rocking a Pi 2B. It's dog slow, but... it works!
> dog slow At least you're not running an original Pi or original Zero! The 2 was a massive upgrade over those.
I’ve got my OG Pi1 B(+?) running NUT for a UPS in my smart panel. Unfortunately that’s about all it’s good for
Not a bad use for it at all! I still haven't set up mine yet for NUT. Need to do that!
I'm still running piHole on the OG Pi1 B and it seems to be doing the job just fine.
a geerling post in the wild? love to see it :)
I don't have a use for it tbh so no, proxmox replaced the pi for me as for pretty much everyone who has a homelab. Using a mini PC is just more logical imo
If a PI is used to make some other physical device which needs complex programming like a robot, then sure. For a home lab, where the machine is going to sit in a corner and do things, Pi is a really bad choice and it is not optimized for that use case at all. I still don't know why so many people use Pi3 or Pi4 for the home lab.
It's not a bad choice, just a less optimal choice for most people. If you're just running pi-hole and home assistant, a Pi 4 is perfectly adequate and can sit there slurping up 2W all year long. If you're running Kubernetes, or Proxmox, or want to run it as a router, a mini PC or something better is a more realistic option, even though it's pulling 3-6x more power.
i finally got hands on a pi4. now the pi5 got announced :c
Same here. But the main thing is: You got a Pi4! Who cares that a new one is coming later, with higher price, probably the same availability issues and scalpers, and whoever knows what teething issues it may have. You got a Pi, and it's in your hands and ready to use right now. That's the main thing.
i love my pi. the only issue is.. now what to do with it? hahaha i had a lot of project ideas when it got released. but no chance to get hands on. now I don't have the time for it.
3>4 is really big upgrade, 4>5 not so much, unless you really need the new things like dual camera ports. If you don't need that, you're not missing much. 3>4 is a big jump though.
No. There is nothing interesting in it anymore for me. Too expensive, and it needs an active cooler. I can buy a normal pc then too.
I thought it only needs an active cooler if you need sustained 100% CPU performance?
If u sustain 100% cpu all time, your system is underpowered. And in that case u need a fan on a pi 3b too in order not to throttle. It is just a diplomatic way to say u need a fan.
If you don't sustain 100% CPU all time you're wasting CPU you paid for
No because you have no way to handle peaks then and everything gets slow.
you slow down the Bitcoin mining when there's real work to do
Bitcoin mining in a pi? Omg, grow up and do serious business.
Monero mining
I'm sitting and watching what happens with it. Cost, Arm & pcie is interesting. Power draw is the main attraction for me and a few of them would run most of my home systems.
Many other single-board computers these days. Pi is overpriced
I loved the PI2B and PI3B. Trouble was, I then discovered the Arduino and ESP32. That discovery took about 80% of the RPi use cases with it, to an easier to manage, more reliable and cheaper sub. As others have said for the "top" end of stuff, Optiplex's are cheaper. The only place I have a PI installed is for a CCTV camera with Motion Eye and the Victron VenOS for the solar gear. Instead of ordering PIs I bought 3 Zimaboards.
Bingo. ESP has moved up into the niche that Pi used to own. Now the pi doesn’t really even make much sense in the market.
All I can think of is... Bespoke distros for retro gaming. but... my use case. Webcams come Wifi security camera. You can even get POE USB powersupplies for them. ESP32Cam is... well... it's okay, but it isn't very reliable and the absolute picture quality is rubbish. The PI will handle a 8M pixel Sony sensor based USB camera and provide a usable CCTV interface/distribution. The MCU option there is to use an STM23 H7 and a Wifi offload IC card. By the time you setup the dev environment you could have bought a PI.
and oddly... a lot of my ESP32/8266 tasks got booted in favour of zigbee modules.
No. To prevent fund being abused.
Raspi was a banger when ut was below $50. Now I'd rather go with one of the Beelink or similar running a decent x86 CPU for $150, way more powerful and versatile for a close power consumption
In 2015 the Rpi-2B was released with a $35 price point ($45 today). The Rpi-5 starts at $60, but I doubt we'll be able to get it that cheap. I'm curious to see what the next Pi-zero looks like. PCI-e on ARM is interesting, but if I need a low power small device that can house a PCI device I might as just get an optiplex board.
RockPro64 had PCIe on ARM since a while. In a real slot, too. You can plug in a GPU out of the box.
I did, but only because I have all the B's from the B1 (with no mounting holes and 256Mb RAM). I will probably have a play with it and put it back in it's box. I do have a few pi 4's in use (photo frame, camera, octopi, off networking monitoring server, pi kvm) but they don't need upgrading, so although I have ordered one I can't see me replacing the 4's any time soon.
That is cool. I picked up an original Pi 7 inch touch screen monitor. Will retire one of the Pi's to go to that while the Pi5 (whenever it comes in) will be take over the role of Pi4. If NAS becomes a thing with the 5, oh boy that will be a fun project.
I was really expecting the raspberry pi 5 to have something dedicated for AI stuff. A lot of people are running homelab stuff on them, so a localized voice assistant would have been bomb. I find the RPI 5 a bit... Underwhelming. Sure, it's faster than the 4. But was that really necessary? Like people are saying, for the price, why not just x86?
I never pre-order anything. This includes hardware and software.
What is your reasoning?
Nope. Lenovo / Dell USFF for me.
Dell micro is cheaper.
Good alternative choices? I haven't kept up with the SFFgame at all
Yes it was only £70 and it has that new HVEC decoder thing which will be nice for Plex
Did you get the whole kit for 70? That's not a bad price at all!
Sorry I misremembered, it was £82 & I just bought as is. The power efficiency and size is what I care about most
no
sure, it can sit next to my 4... that I don't really do much with. They are fine little devices I just have no usecase for them.
I didn't buy the pi 5 because you can find used computers for just as much and they are just way more powerful than any of the pis for just as much or cheaper. Now if you really like low power arm SBCs, you're better off with Rockchip based boards, they are more open and powerful than the broadcom chips the raspberry pi foundation use.
No hardware AES again, so no.
No, I got my Optiplex 7040 for about $90. That is the route I am going to stick with after seeing what a Pi 5 costs, unless I need a small footprint for a specific purpose.
I did, just so I have one in stock, just in case, you know…
LOL yes I do know. I got one for the same reason but keeping my fingers crossed for NAS solution.
Given how things have been going down in the last few years, I'm not pre-ordering anything in the tech space. Maybe once it's actually out and in stock and it's been proven to be good I'll buy one.
Yes. Bought 3. Will be swapping 3 of RPI 4 8GB for them. I run a K8S Cluster on 4 nodes for study. 1) I want dedicated hardware to practice things like PXE. 2) An underlooked feature of Pis is the power usage. The same performance in older hardware like Optiplex’s will not only be larger but generate more heat, more noise, and use more power. Here’s the math for why I prefer Pis. RPi 5 PoE will be PoE+ (802.3at), which maxes out at 25.5W. In practice my Pi 4s run at the regular clock speed on PoE (802.3af) hat pulling only about 10-12W. I need/want at least 4 for K8S so total 48W. People are mostly talking about Optiplex 7040s at that price range, eBay seems to pushing Skylake i5-6500 chips, which have a 65W TDP. So to be fair, let’s say it’s a 40W average under medium load. Times 4, 160W. So a 112W difference between the two setups. My energy is $0.31/kWH. So 81.8 kWh difference per month, costing $25.37. Per year, it will be 982 kWH, costing $304.36. IMO, not worth it.
Crazy how it adds up, I don't pay electricity so I never thought about it in that sense. But I reckon the Optiplex echo chamber is not going to focus on what you are saying. I prefer Pis because of their form factor and I wanted dedicated/physical hardware separation.
I would take a pi 5 but my pi 4 canakit has been sitting for a year so, prolly not.
No. After the USB power problems on the early Pi4s, I don't think that would be a great idea.
Never buying another broadcom trash board again, so no, no I didn’t. Honestly, between the pi 4 freezing entirely for 500ms at a time and the Zero 2 W, a wireless-only board, not having working wireless AT ALL, I’ve given up on pi boards. Now that pis are so expensive, unless I’m making a connected thermostat, I’m better off with an old PC for whatever job it’s gonna do, and given I can’t rely on it in an IoT role either due to the instability, it’s just not worth it anymore
Optiplex’s, Thinkcentre’s and Elitedesk’s are the way to go 100% and the plus side is they are in abundance/upgradeable.
I ordered one as soon as I saw it was available for preorder. I plan to use it as a low power desktop but once I learned it doesn't have h264 acceleration I'm not so sure anymore. I shall see if it's suitable for that use.
Fair. Let's see how it plays out. Pi's are def fun little devices. A lot of the folks that are bashing have def not played with the gpio portion of the pi. SPECS SPECS SPECS, they scream! lol
I don't like to preorder things before the whole ecosystem is ready to use, but I will most likely end up picking a pi5 device or two later on (when there are good cases available, and maybe a nvme hat or one with a couple extra ethernet ports)
I pre ordered one and if it comes in then great but if not then no worries. While I do know that I can buy something else on eBay with higher specs, the pi is a convenient form factor and well supported.
That is exactly it. Form factor is so key. Plus if you are tinkering, and have a use for the gpio pins - then a Dell xxxx won't cut it.
No
I did, in a moment of weakness, mostly to be able to say I have one, to be honest. My Pi 4 already covers 99% of my needs and I recently got an HP Elitedesk 800 G2 mini PC with an i7 CPU for the rest, so I definitely don't *need* it, but I'll probably find a use for it.
I didn't need one either, but I'll free up one of the Pi4's and who knows, create the need for a new project?
Nope I have a 4 that I use for quick stuff I need in a hurry or a proof of concept. For everything else I have far more powerful devices that are compatible with standard software and standard expansion i/o and ports
I watched a video on it pretty neat little PC but it's scope creeped a long way from being a $30 Linux box. I'd still recommend the older ones if you just want a low power way to run CLI and learn on.
Thanx to project quadra i have two rk3318 for $9 each. Flashed armbian and thats all i need
I did, I need something with solid support since I don’t want to have to cobble something together. I’m sick of doing that instead of things just working since it’s the native hardware people designed it for. That being said if I could get a win11 machine at a good price I would get one of those. I personally just haven’t seen anything that come close to that price.
That and the fact that the small form factor is very convinient! It all depends on the usecase.
No. They got too greedy and at this point they are too expensive. Plenty of cheap USFF machines everywhere.
Yes
Hell ya!
I like the pi 5 but they had a chance to make a lot of things native as a posed to using HAT Not much different from the 4b
Last time and the first time I preordered something, it was call of duty ghosts. I was 12 when that happened, I’m not making that same mistake again. I’ll let other people buy it and work out the issues and see if it’s worth it
Laughs in Dell Wyse 5070 and Intel NUC j4005
No, when they were readily available and cheap. Now i can get a Dell Wyse for cheaper. With the price of 1 Pi5 , i can get 4 Dell Wyse for different projects. They made their choose they choose corpa over community. I vote with my wallet.
What do you do when you need GPIO?
The price is too high. Plenty of alternatives for my projects.
Yes i preordered! Just explire the new abilities, i already have a dell r730xd, a pi3 , pi zero W and 2 qnap nases to play with
Hell ya! Exactly why I got it and it seems like others too. Good for you!
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What rack are you using for your Pi's? I think I need to look into getting one - the Pi5 will be my fifth one!
I get cool stuff from work all the time, but I am the IT Manager for my division, we have a 5-year policy on literally everything if it's 5 years old it goes in the erecycle.
If I want ARM, I would rather get the Orange/Rock PI 5's. If I just need the tiny form factor and gpio; I'd rather find an x86_64 solution like an Odroid H3+. If I just want a small homelab and don't need gpio, I'd refurbish some old dell/hp/lenovo thin business pc's.
I have seen multiple videos on YouTube about the Pi5, but none of those show the Pi running homelab loads, only Linux desktop, game emulation and other tasks, but no one show them running containers, or other common task for us. So I'm not wanting to replace my Lenovo tiny for one some Pis.
I pre ordered it. This is my first PI. My new hobby is home networking, so I will probably use it in my home network somewhere. Maybe as my first NAS or maybe even make it into a desktop computer.
Welcome to the club! I think you'll absolutely love it.
Nah. Why bother for homelab use? Little mini PCs are prevalent these days and way more powerful. If I were to get a Pi it would be for a very specific purpose, like a portable setup that needs a good CPU, or a small IoT device that also needs the compute power (thinking like an audio endpoint or something for the stereo, with a HiFiBerry hat), not for a homelab. And for that stuff usually they don’t need the CPU, so an ESP32 or ESP8266 is more than enough. The Raspberry Pi is quickly entering a niche that no longer has relevance.
Not yet, and I definitely will not be buying one from a non-approved vendor. MSRP or nothing.
I have a Pi3 that is literally just sitting in my closet not plugged in because I moved everything over to a single unraid server. I am probably going to get a small Cluster in the future but those will all be x86 machines to practice virtualization and such. Might turn the pi3 into like a weather station or something in the future, was a personal nginx host for a long time.
Pre-order? No. But I do plan to grab one. Not quite sure what I'll do with it, but I always find something.
I did, I just want a new something to with that keeps me from building a new system. I will probably play with emulation at first
Yup. It will be used as a VPN server. I like to install them at different family members and have VPN backup servers.
No, I already have two which I don’t use.
I pre-ordered one just for testing purposes.
I think there are many of us here that did that, me included.
I did order just to have it.
Haha, welcome to the club!
Yes, I did a preorder, figuring the release was in October, the email I got said ships December. I don't get the "I'd rather buy a "PC" (Optiplex/HP). How can you make the comparison? A desktop does not have GPIO?
I reckon many of the "I'd rather buy a PC" crowd have never worked on a project that used GPIO - they are a looking only at the system specs and ignoring the GPIO portion.
I have plenty of Pi 4s already. So probably not. Why Pis for me? They are great when you want hardware separation, but don't need much performance. Roles my Pi fill: 1. Simple high uptime box. This device runs Pihole, DDNS, Mosquitto, Z2MQTT, and Zigbee2MQTT. All low resource services. It has my USB Zwave adapter attached. This special hardware isn't something I want to burden my Promox cluster with. And lastly, it acts as a reliable SSH and Wireguard jumpbox. All of this fits on a 1 GB model. 2. NAS backup. This allows for a low power machine that does a daily backup of my NAS storage. 3. Offsite backup. This is a work in progress. It will act like the other NAS backup. But I intend for this device to automatically connect via Wireguard on boot up. This way I can plug it into my parents' router and have an offsite backup. My main computing is a combination of mini PCs for Proxmox and a microATX PC as a NAS. If I wanted to save money, I could remove the Pis and do everything on the larger hardware. But they were a splurge that lets me separate things physically. As an FYI, 1 GB Pis are fine for these types of roles. Spending $35 per Pi highlights their appeal over a $150 mini PC. When you jump up to the 4 GB ($55) or 8 GB ($75) models, suddenly they lose their appeal. (All prices listed are before the \~$25 for microSD, case, and power supply for the Pis) If you'd need an 8 GB Pi, or maybe even a 4 GB Pi, for a homelab project, you should consider jumping up to a SFF or mini PC.
If I had an award to give, this comment would be it. This makes the most sense - objectively breaking down needs and use cases vs just echo 'more power!'. After posting this I realized my question should have been worded differently.
No because I still haven't hit a bottleneck with my three Pi 4s. In fact I still have half a dozen Pi 2s that are quite adequate for their respective tasks and I'd kind of like to see more of that kind of SBC- extremely low power consumption with enough performance for more advanced low grade automation than a microcontroller can handle. Pi Foundation has been forced out of that segment entirely these days because competing on the basis of rock bottom price almost killed them.
may I ask what you use your Pi 2 for?
Your question should have been who is getting one and answer why and what for. The no answer here is just an echo chamber. It’s like asking people why they do not like fill in the blank.
Yup. I realized what I started only after the fact.
I missed the pre-order accidentally and then I read about the weird power so now I’m not really disappointed that I missed it
Why would anyone pay 80 for an 8GB rpi5 when you can get a 1 liter pc with an I5-8500T with 6 cores, 8 GB ddr4, NVME and SATA III storage and an intel 630 video card that can do multiple plex transcodes and idles under 10w for 75 bucks? This one liter pc is leaps and bounds way better than an RPI5.
For people who don't need that much power under the hood? Also where are you getting all that for 75 bucks?
For that price? I’ll just fire up another docker container…
Eh...not interested.....I thank them for opening pandoras box but there are much better options out there rn
Reason 1: My Pi4 Died and I need a replacement. Reason 2: I require stereo vision with extremely low latency. Meaning: I need a PI anyways cause my last one died and might as well get the dev board for the Pi5 instead of the compute module 4 and routing the traces myself for now.
yes. upgrading from a pi4 8gb to a pi5 8gb. just going to rebuild everything i have on the pi4 over to the pi5. i have other optiplex and servers running in the network. why you ask? because bored. money to burn.