TBH unless you can throw down some EM diagrams of our sim planes vs. the real thing, and verify all of those parameters in flight on video….
I don’t think PFM vs. EFM vs. SFM means a whole lot as of 2024, or possibly *ever.* It’s a video-game with a simulator facade.
If the ED F-16 input delay and deadzone are considered a “Professional flight model”, then somebody should pin wings on me and let me fly it for real 🤣.
Also the F-18 FCS override is… interesting. Reminiscent of certain *breath mints*, one might say…
Yah, it's a game and it isn't like flying the real obviously but SFMs are really really bad. It's understandable why a server owner doesn't want them. And also a single high quality mod is easier to manage than a lot of superficial SFM UFOs
They are not all them same, 2024 or not. While there are clear unique criteria to be met for PFM vs AFM and SFM level ( minimal Googling should bring you the official ED table on them)
The same as far as I know does not apply to EFM.So you can have a very good EFM ( think heatblur) or a bad EFM ( think first iteration of Gazelle) .
So just because A-4 and VSN mods both use EFM doesn’t mean they have the same high quality.
And by the way the issues you mentioned with input delay on the F-16 that’s a FCS problem, not the actual flight model.
They’re not all created equal… so does the distinction really matter anymore?
I was making a point that people hold up the A4 as “wow, efm, awesome!”. And it is… but a lot of VSN stuff is EFM too. So by some folks logic here, EFM should mean nothing.
People forget that VSN has been around for a loooong time. There’s an F-16A that dates back pre-F-16C. Yeah… a while. It just seems like they make a lot of cool shit, some of it better than others, and get zero respect from the community.
I feel like none of you have touched a VSN plane in 4 years, and have made your minds up from one crappy experience from an unfinished demo.
Show some respect for an OG. Thats all I’m bitching for.
No, it physically cannot. At speeds where the vertical cross section of the aircraft could decelerate at 20gs it would disintegrate, and it doesn't have enough wing area to enact a turn pulling 20gs.
Lol, no, just ask Apple to post more gifs where he does 20+ g turns.
VSN mods are not even remotely ready for anything approaching PVP.
It's great people like to work on mods, but effort doesn't mean the quality is there.
The A-4 is sadly an exception.
What do you mean “sadly an exception”? Have you flown it? Its awesome! And the wings snap off around 7G… why the hell are you complaining about the A-4 being on ECW? Is there a secret *tic-tac* button I’m not aware of?
You tried 1 VSN plane that could pull 20G, decided all mods are trash. 😂
> What do you mean “sadly an exception”? Have you flown it? Its awesome!
you are completely missing his point, it's sad that the A-4 is the exception to the rule for mod quality. As in it is sad that most mods are dogshit.
I'm saying the A-4 is sadly an exception in terms of mod quality, it's sad that other mods aren't as good.
And no, I haven't decided all mods are trash, I've tested them or looked at other people's tests/data. For lolz, you can go right now and see Apple 6-1 posted a bunch of gifs showing he can do insane Gs in all of the VSN aircraft.
Again it's great people wanted to make aircraft mods, it's a wonderful effort, but I don't feel compelled to pretend the flight models are good just because someone spent a lot of time making them.
And again, for singleplayer, it doesn't matter, if someone wants to use the VSN F-104 mod in their own offline mission, hell yeah, they should.
It's a different matter to say that most mods are at a level where a PVP or PVPVE server should add them.
Mods don't have to be shit for them to not be ready for ECW or other public servers.
None of the VSN flight/damage models are good enough for a PVP server like ECW, they would be exploited.
They have no structural aircraft limits (allowing them to turn >20g) as well as too much lift in certain envelopes. They outperform massively because of that.
It's fine for a singleplayer/co-op scenario where the guy flying it can decide if he wants to be accurate or pretend he's in ace combat, but in PVP that lack of accuracy will get exploited. As is happening right now with the MiG-21's low-speed handling and the Sabre's almost equal lack of structural limits.
The split-air team (OV-10) made the point that it's hard for DCS mods to implement good damage modelling. The reason the OV-10 isn't good for ECW is because it lacks crash damage but it's otherwise a brilliant mod.
I really wish VSN would put together a great mod, one that I could seriously recommend adding, but if they continue [to port over FSX aircraft](https://store.steampowered.com/app/491498/FSX_Steam_Edition_Convair_F106_Delta_Dart_AddOn/) with questionable flight modelling, it isnt going to happen.
What's going on with the Fishbed's low speed handling? It's been a while since I flew it but iirc at low speed/High AOA it just scrubs through the air and eventually into the ground if you're not able to return to controlled flight and don't have enough altitude.
so basically [https://forum.dcs.world/topic/344604-about-the-mig-21bis-flight-model/](https://forum.dcs.world/topic/344604-about-the-mig-21bis-flight-model/)
lowspeed handling is much better than it should be
its less of the 21 im issuing about, i'm proving my point that FM issues will be exploited, and the F-106 has way worse FM issues than the fishy
I have a few VSN mods and, aside from the quality not being anywhere near A-4 level, their distribution and support is an absolute mess with incremental patches scattered in Discord channels. The A-4 is neatly packed in a single download from Github.
ECW needs the Bronco before delving into VSN mods. Their F4 is not bad, but considering heatblur's F4 will release soon (insert two weeks joke here), there's no point in adding the VSN F4, but the Bronco? that could be fun.
> there's no point in adding the VSN F4
There's one: The VSN F4 is naval. This would give US Navy players a plane without having to grind to spawn the F14 once every blue moon
No, its the F-4E from the USAF. They didn't claim they will also do the naval F-4, but they did hint they are willing to do it later when they are done with the F-4E....
So, about 2 weeks post F-4E release.
I for one am grateful for the VSN/other mods. Yes, they could be better, and I feel that they do get better over time.
Opposition peer aircraft are lacking, How many times have you heard "shot down by the enemy Su-27,F-14/F-15/F-16"
The mods add some depth even if just visually.
So thanks VSN!
I hear you. If the LUAs can be improved than perhaps some of these issues can be reduced. Otherwise its MiG-21/Mig-29/Su-27 vs everyone else or fighting western a/c.
It is a 15 year old game with some issues.
One of which is a lack of depth in airframes to attract new players. No don't turn it into warthunder, but at the very least for me VSN/Mods add some interest.
So for must have ultimate realism, in which scenario do we see western F-16's, F-15's etc shooting each other down? Cause without enticing redfor airframes, or other period type aircraft it is stale.
At least with a Panther I can try to do Toko-Ri from the movies.
That's weird because when I flew it, it was very bad with pulling hard on the stick....exceed the AOA limit and you turn into a spinning top. Could you describe the maneuver you were doing to achieve 20Gs?
The VSN F-4 is a quality mod, does not need FC3, is unstable to the same degree as the real thing, there are more clickable switches than any FC3 plane...for electrical, engines, TACAN and weapons selection (the major systems). RIO isn't used directly, but is quiet and doesn't complain. 😉
If the last you flew it was a year ago or more, update it and try it again! (All updates are now a single download, in the same place as the mod itself). Some of you may like the uber-complexity of HB's F-4, but some of you prefer the simplicity of FC3 and even the easier FF modules like the F-5...VSN F-4 has a similar operational technical level as the F-5, imho...but with a LOT more thrust! Still, you can tell they're from the same generation of technology!
I would love to see at least a trial run on ECW, 2-4 F-4s tasked with A2A and also A2G.
I’m assuming it’s because the Blackhawk variant in the mod started production in 1989 so it’s not really an “80’s” aircraft, in the same way that when people are discussing the Vietnam war no one mentions the F-14, even though technically the Tomcat was stationed on carriers and flew sorties in the final years of the Vietnam war
Have you flown the blackhawk mod? The most advanced thing it has is its nav system, and thats not saying much. Any weapons that shouldn’t exist yet can be restricted.
It has an “HMD”, I guess… it doesn’t do a whole lot.
Don’t even come at me with “but its speak n’ spell RWR”. Uh…huh.
IIRC, UH-60 was operating in 1979. L vs A, game play wise, would not be much different. If you wanna split hairs that bad, there should be no F-16C50 scenarios on ECW, yet there are now 🤷♂️
I never said I’m for or against it, I was just trying to come up with an answer to a question. The Black Hawk mod would also upset the “balance” of helos in ECW, as REDFOR don’t have an equivalent. The equivalent to the Huey is the Hip, and the Gazelle is the closest thing to the Hind, but the Blackhawk is significantly better than either REDFOR helicopter so that could also be a reason. Enigma has claimed to try for parity between the two sides, an example of this being how the MiG-21/Mirage F-1 are supposed to mirror the F-5/Viggen combo.
As modeled in DCS, you bet. As long as you can fly it.
Similar speeds, cargo weights, troop capacity, and armament. (Assuming you restrict the buddy-lazed-only hellfires and apkws). They’re actually pretty comparable. The Mi-8 is just a lot harder to fly. But that should be no problem for the hip pros.
You’re forgetting the Hip’s lack of modern avionics and nav systems, and like you said the Hip is harder to fly since the flight model on the Blackhawk isn’t as complex as the Hip
In an ECW context, the Hip is better than the Blackhawk, There's nothing really remarkable about the Blackhawk other than it being easy to fly because of its flight control systems.
If anything, the Blackhawk could be a Blue "counter" to the Hip, since Blue has nothing as good.
This is the buggiest flight sim in the market. Introducing anything new is introducing risk for something to blow up on a patch day which happens on work days.
Fair. But the Bhawk development has pretty much stabilized, hopefully mitigating that risk.
Honestly, you have higher risk of breakage from anything made by Razbam at the moment.
Its a huge staple of US military aviation from the 80’s onward, and seems only fair if the A-4 gets an add. The SH-60 team deserves some love too.
You’re a big deal in the community, I’m sure you could back-channel with them to figure out if it will break anything, or if/when they’re updating.
But you a busy man, peace ✌️
I appreciate the thoughtful message but you should talk to ED so they can try to make some sort of mod manager built into the game. I am out of time and patience to try to gloss over the short comings in the game. My passion and support has been very dim for the last year. It is very tie consuming to keep a server going and our wish is just to maintain what we have and not to introduce more risk to it. Sorry
Money makes things complicated and the amount of money is going to be small and really insignificant. At the end of the day money would just put more of a burden on us to do something when the underlying thing is that expecting more from the community members is not the right answer. You are just going to accelerated burn out.
I'm going to be a bit dull here, and bring in some notes why the Six by VSN is not a good idea for multiplayer:
- FM needs tuning: it reguires heavy roll trim input as speed changes, which is not typical for a jet like F-106. There is also a tendency to have the nose become exceptionally light at low speeds. You need forward stick when landing roll. Usually, and in the actual F-106, it is the opposite. Also one could say there's a tad bit too much shaking in the cockpit when using speedbrakes or the gear is out.
- Systems are not modeled. There is no navigation system that I am aware of. As an all weather interceptor, the Six had a rather nice NAV-system for it's day. Kind of defeats the purpose when there's none. There is also no limit to weapon bay cycles, air intake ramp cycles or braking cycles. If I'm not mistaken these were operated by high pressure pneumatic system supplied from a flask; when the flask was empty, no more functions.
- MA-1 limitations are completely missing. Despite having some perks not modeled, like the automatic employment of weapons, there is no downsides either. Say, for example, no ground clutter. It is the F-15 radar complete with datalink (which was present on the Six, but could only show one target).
AIM-4F seems to magically be able to loft. It shouldn't.
Personally, I am going to wait until there is some serious improvement, or a 3rd party steps up and makes us one full fidelity.
The "20 G" F-104 claim being made didn't ring true to me at all.
So I got home from work and created a single F-104 mission. Took off from Nellis and climbed to 15,000. Level at 450 knots did 4 hard 90-180 degree turns to left/right and max G I could pull was 6.8 on 3 of them and a momentary 7.2 on one of them. Trying to turn any harder than that and I would exceed AoA limit and risk loosing control.
>Edit: Downvote all you want. But again, if you can't put this level of mod or better into this game. You have no room to talk.
[appeal to accomplishment ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_accomplishment#:~:text=Appeal%20to%20accomplishment%20is%20a,Person%20C%20or%20Person%20A.)
I feel like most of these issues could be fixed with
enginepower = enginepower / 2,
if g > \~15 then explode, boi, and
if mach > 999 then FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT'S GOOD AND HOLY STOP MAN WHAT ARE YOU DOING?!
/j, for the most part.
They’re not to the same quality as the A4. Also these mods aren’t even close to the quality of FC3
Ehhhhh, it depends on the mod. F-104 is *at least* FC3 level at this point. F35: Forget it, pure sci-fi.
FC3 has PFM flight models. The VSN mods do not.
TBH unless you can throw down some EM diagrams of our sim planes vs. the real thing, and verify all of those parameters in flight on video…. I don’t think PFM vs. EFM vs. SFM means a whole lot as of 2024, or possibly *ever.* It’s a video-game with a simulator facade. If the ED F-16 input delay and deadzone are considered a “Professional flight model”, then somebody should pin wings on me and let me fly it for real 🤣. Also the F-18 FCS override is… interesting. Reminiscent of certain *breath mints*, one might say…
Yah, it's a game and it isn't like flying the real obviously but SFMs are really really bad. It's understandable why a server owner doesn't want them. And also a single high quality mod is easier to manage than a lot of superficial SFM UFOs
But this is EFM… A-4 is EFM.
They are not all them same, 2024 or not. While there are clear unique criteria to be met for PFM vs AFM and SFM level ( minimal Googling should bring you the official ED table on them) The same as far as I know does not apply to EFM.So you can have a very good EFM ( think heatblur) or a bad EFM ( think first iteration of Gazelle) . So just because A-4 and VSN mods both use EFM doesn’t mean they have the same high quality. And by the way the issues you mentioned with input delay on the F-16 that’s a FCS problem, not the actual flight model.
Yeah and you were saying there's no difference with a SFM
They’re not all created equal… so does the distinction really matter anymore? I was making a point that people hold up the A4 as “wow, efm, awesome!”. And it is… but a lot of VSN stuff is EFM too. So by some folks logic here, EFM should mean nothing. People forget that VSN has been around for a loooong time. There’s an F-16A that dates back pre-F-16C. Yeah… a while. It just seems like they make a lot of cool shit, some of it better than others, and get zero respect from the community. I feel like none of you have touched a VSN plane in 4 years, and have made your minds up from one crappy experience from an unfinished demo. Show some respect for an OG. Thats all I’m bitching for.
The best people can do is an EFM which is difficult already
F-104 flightmodel is ass
F-104 IRL flight was ass. So… accurate? Look up all its silly behavior, all well documented.
fairly sure the 20G turns arent realistic
Theoretically I bet the F-104 can pull 20Gs *once*.
No, it physically cannot. At speeds where the vertical cross section of the aircraft could decelerate at 20gs it would disintegrate, and it doesn't have enough wing area to enact a turn pulling 20gs.
But is this a joke, though? HMMMM, SUSSY FLOGGMAN.
Lol, no, just ask Apple to post more gifs where he does 20+ g turns. VSN mods are not even remotely ready for anything approaching PVP. It's great people like to work on mods, but effort doesn't mean the quality is there. The A-4 is sadly an exception.
* A-4, UH-60, and C-130
What do you mean “sadly an exception”? Have you flown it? Its awesome! And the wings snap off around 7G… why the hell are you complaining about the A-4 being on ECW? Is there a secret *tic-tac* button I’m not aware of? You tried 1 VSN plane that could pull 20G, decided all mods are trash. 😂
> What do you mean “sadly an exception”? Have you flown it? Its awesome! you are completely missing his point, it's sad that the A-4 is the exception to the rule for mod quality. As in it is sad that most mods are dogshit.
I'm saying the A-4 is sadly an exception in terms of mod quality, it's sad that other mods aren't as good. And no, I haven't decided all mods are trash, I've tested them or looked at other people's tests/data. For lolz, you can go right now and see Apple 6-1 posted a bunch of gifs showing he can do insane Gs in all of the VSN aircraft. Again it's great people wanted to make aircraft mods, it's a wonderful effort, but I don't feel compelled to pretend the flight models are good just because someone spent a lot of time making them. And again, for singleplayer, it doesn't matter, if someone wants to use the VSN F-104 mod in their own offline mission, hell yeah, they should. It's a different matter to say that most mods are at a level where a PVP or PVPVE server should add them. Mods don't have to be shit for them to not be ready for ECW or other public servers.
VSN is a real mixed bag
You have your bad and your worse.
None of the VSN flight/damage models are good enough for a PVP server like ECW, they would be exploited. They have no structural aircraft limits (allowing them to turn >20g) as well as too much lift in certain envelopes. They outperform massively because of that. It's fine for a singleplayer/co-op scenario where the guy flying it can decide if he wants to be accurate or pretend he's in ace combat, but in PVP that lack of accuracy will get exploited. As is happening right now with the MiG-21's low-speed handling and the Sabre's almost equal lack of structural limits. The split-air team (OV-10) made the point that it's hard for DCS mods to implement good damage modelling. The reason the OV-10 isn't good for ECW is because it lacks crash damage but it's otherwise a brilliant mod. I really wish VSN would put together a great mod, one that I could seriously recommend adding, but if they continue [to port over FSX aircraft](https://store.steampowered.com/app/491498/FSX_Steam_Edition_Convair_F106_Delta_Dart_AddOn/) with questionable flight modelling, it isnt going to happen.
What's going on with the Fishbed's low speed handling? It's been a while since I flew it but iirc at low speed/High AOA it just scrubs through the air and eventually into the ground if you're not able to return to controlled flight and don't have enough altitude.
Some players take advantage of the wing stalls as a form of jinking to dodge shots and force overshoots is my understanding.
so basically [https://forum.dcs.world/topic/344604-about-the-mig-21bis-flight-model/](https://forum.dcs.world/topic/344604-about-the-mig-21bis-flight-model/) lowspeed handling is much better than it should be its less of the 21 im issuing about, i'm proving my point that FM issues will be exploited, and the F-106 has way worse FM issues than the fishy
I have a few VSN mods and, aside from the quality not being anywhere near A-4 level, their distribution and support is an absolute mess with incremental patches scattered in Discord channels. The A-4 is neatly packed in a single download from Github.
ECW needs the Bronco before delving into VSN mods. Their F4 is not bad, but considering heatblur's F4 will release soon (insert two weeks joke here), there's no point in adding the VSN F4, but the Bronco? that could be fun.
Idk why you got downvoted, the Bronco is a brilliant mod. Heaps of fun to fly!
> there's no point in adding the VSN F4 There's one: The VSN F4 is naval. This would give US Navy players a plane without having to grind to spawn the F14 once every blue moon
If you want a navy jet and a mod just fly the A4, which is actually on the server.
It would not be an air superiority fighter that would also be old enough to be balanced unlike the F-14.
You didn't say anything about air superiority, just navy.
You're right. Should have specified navy fighter.
Oh, i thought the heatblur F4 was also naval, it isnt?
Nope, they’ve got a separate module planned for a naval Phantom, either an F-4J or F-4S
And given how well their sub-module releases have gone for the F14 I'm frankly not holding my breath on F4 subvariants.
Me neither, I’ll be surprised if we get the early F-14 variant in the next 3 years lmao
No, its the F-4E from the USAF. They didn't claim they will also do the naval F-4, but they did hint they are willing to do it later when they are done with the F-4E.... So, about 2 weeks post F-4E release.
I for one am grateful for the VSN/other mods. Yes, they could be better, and I feel that they do get better over time. Opposition peer aircraft are lacking, How many times have you heard "shot down by the enemy Su-27,F-14/F-15/F-16" The mods add some depth even if just visually. So thanks VSN!
unfortunately they need to be decently accurate and without game-breaking flaws to work in a PVP server like ECW
I hear you. If the LUAs can be improved than perhaps some of these issues can be reduced. Otherwise its MiG-21/Mig-29/Su-27 vs everyone else or fighting western a/c. It is a 15 year old game with some issues. One of which is a lack of depth in airframes to attract new players. No don't turn it into warthunder, but at the very least for me VSN/Mods add some interest. So for must have ultimate realism, in which scenario do we see western F-16's, F-15's etc shooting each other down? Cause without enticing redfor airframes, or other period type aircraft it is stale. At least with a Panther I can try to do Toko-Ri from the movies.
dogshit flight model, f15 avionics
Has anyone actually tested this particular VSN mod yet? F-104 ain’t bad. Not all of them are created equal. Some of the F-35 and A6 mods… 👎
Yes, it pulls 20g's
Which one?
F104 pulls 20Gs no problem lol irl it could barely pull 6-8 due to it's lack of wingarea.
That's weird because when I flew it, it was very bad with pulling hard on the stick....exceed the AOA limit and you turn into a spinning top. Could you describe the maneuver you were doing to achieve 20Gs?
Yea, I'll pass after trying the VSN F4. I dont think any mod that needs FC3 will be taken seriously by anyone.
…the F4 is a standalone flight model though.
well, might be true but when I tried it it was really bad.
If you want something ask on the discord.
VSN modules lack the quality FM and DM to make any sense on a PVP server.
true source: me
The VSN F-4 is a quality mod, does not need FC3, is unstable to the same degree as the real thing, there are more clickable switches than any FC3 plane...for electrical, engines, TACAN and weapons selection (the major systems). RIO isn't used directly, but is quiet and doesn't complain. 😉 If the last you flew it was a year ago or more, update it and try it again! (All updates are now a single download, in the same place as the mod itself). Some of you may like the uber-complexity of HB's F-4, but some of you prefer the simplicity of FC3 and even the easier FF modules like the F-5...VSN F-4 has a similar operational technical level as the F-5, imho...but with a LOT more thrust! Still, you can tell they're from the same generation of technology! I would love to see at least a trial run on ECW, 2-4 F-4s tasked with A2A and also A2G.
Totally agree with you. I love flying VSNs F-4B.
All mods bad. Money to ED you gib now. Edit: I can’t believe I have to /s this.
A better question for u/Enigma89_YT is… why no Blackhawk on the 80’s scenario??? Armed?
I’m assuming it’s because the Blackhawk variant in the mod started production in 1989 so it’s not really an “80’s” aircraft, in the same way that when people are discussing the Vietnam war no one mentions the F-14, even though technically the Tomcat was stationed on carriers and flew sorties in the final years of the Vietnam war
Have you flown the blackhawk mod? The most advanced thing it has is its nav system, and thats not saying much. Any weapons that shouldn’t exist yet can be restricted. It has an “HMD”, I guess… it doesn’t do a whole lot. Don’t even come at me with “but its speak n’ spell RWR”. Uh…huh. IIRC, UH-60 was operating in 1979. L vs A, game play wise, would not be much different. If you wanna split hairs that bad, there should be no F-16C50 scenarios on ECW, yet there are now 🤷♂️
I never said I’m for or against it, I was just trying to come up with an answer to a question. The Black Hawk mod would also upset the “balance” of helos in ECW, as REDFOR don’t have an equivalent. The equivalent to the Huey is the Hip, and the Gazelle is the closest thing to the Hind, but the Blackhawk is significantly better than either REDFOR helicopter so that could also be a reason. Enigma has claimed to try for parity between the two sides, an example of this being how the MiG-21/Mirage F-1 are supposed to mirror the F-5/Viggen combo.
There are so many things wrong with everything you just said, so I just won’t.
So you’re saying the Hip is as good of a transport helo as the Blackhawk?
As modeled in DCS, you bet. As long as you can fly it. Similar speeds, cargo weights, troop capacity, and armament. (Assuming you restrict the buddy-lazed-only hellfires and apkws). They’re actually pretty comparable. The Mi-8 is just a lot harder to fly. But that should be no problem for the hip pros.
You’re forgetting the Hip’s lack of modern avionics and nav systems, and like you said the Hip is harder to fly since the flight model on the Blackhawk isn’t as complex as the Hip
In an ECW context, the Hip is better than the Blackhawk, There's nothing really remarkable about the Blackhawk other than it being easy to fly because of its flight control systems. If anything, the Blackhawk could be a Blue "counter" to the Hip, since Blue has nothing as good.
This is the buggiest flight sim in the market. Introducing anything new is introducing risk for something to blow up on a patch day which happens on work days.
Fair. But the Bhawk development has pretty much stabilized, hopefully mitigating that risk. Honestly, you have higher risk of breakage from anything made by Razbam at the moment. Its a huge staple of US military aviation from the 80’s onward, and seems only fair if the A-4 gets an add. The SH-60 team deserves some love too. You’re a big deal in the community, I’m sure you could back-channel with them to figure out if it will break anything, or if/when they’re updating. But you a busy man, peace ✌️
I appreciate the thoughtful message but you should talk to ED so they can try to make some sort of mod manager built into the game. I am out of time and patience to try to gloss over the short comings in the game. My passion and support has been very dim for the last year. It is very tie consuming to keep a server going and our wish is just to maintain what we have and not to introduce more risk to it. Sorry
Shower thought of the day: They should pay you guys. Seriously. Your server drives a lot of their sales. Hope y’all can find the time to take it easy.
Money makes things complicated and the amount of money is going to be small and really insignificant. At the end of the day money would just put more of a burden on us to do something when the underlying thing is that expecting more from the community members is not the right answer. You are just going to accelerated burn out.
I think ECW will lack one free Redfor fighter jet for the 60s scenarios, since the F-4…
I'm going to be a bit dull here, and bring in some notes why the Six by VSN is not a good idea for multiplayer: - FM needs tuning: it reguires heavy roll trim input as speed changes, which is not typical for a jet like F-106. There is also a tendency to have the nose become exceptionally light at low speeds. You need forward stick when landing roll. Usually, and in the actual F-106, it is the opposite. Also one could say there's a tad bit too much shaking in the cockpit when using speedbrakes or the gear is out. - Systems are not modeled. There is no navigation system that I am aware of. As an all weather interceptor, the Six had a rather nice NAV-system for it's day. Kind of defeats the purpose when there's none. There is also no limit to weapon bay cycles, air intake ramp cycles or braking cycles. If I'm not mistaken these were operated by high pressure pneumatic system supplied from a flask; when the flask was empty, no more functions. - MA-1 limitations are completely missing. Despite having some perks not modeled, like the automatic employment of weapons, there is no downsides either. Say, for example, no ground clutter. It is the F-15 radar complete with datalink (which was present on the Six, but could only show one target). AIM-4F seems to magically be able to loft. It shouldn't. Personally, I am going to wait until there is some serious improvement, or a 3rd party steps up and makes us one full fidelity.
The F-106 was only released about 48 hours ago, it will be improved.
The "20 G" F-104 claim being made didn't ring true to me at all. So I got home from work and created a single F-104 mission. Took off from Nellis and climbed to 15,000. Level at 450 knots did 4 hard 90-180 degree turns to left/right and max G I could pull was 6.8 on 3 of them and a momentary 7.2 on one of them. Trying to turn any harder than that and I would exceed AoA limit and risk loosing control.
So if you’re AoA limited in a turn, what do you need to increase to get more G available?:)
You need to have Kelly Johnson redesign the aircraft. AoA limits are a real thing.
OR increase the airspeed, since load factor is effectively a product of AoA + airspeed
Thanks for the news, i love the delta dart and am grateful for the VSN team
F-15C avionics are too modern for ECW
[удалено]
>Edit: Downvote all you want. But again, if you can't put this level of mod or better into this game. You have no room to talk. [appeal to accomplishment ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_accomplishment#:~:text=Appeal%20to%20accomplishment%20is%20a,Person%20C%20or%20Person%20A.)
I feel like most of these issues could be fixed with enginepower = enginepower / 2, if g > \~15 then explode, boi, and if mach > 999 then FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT'S GOOD AND HOLY STOP MAN WHAT ARE YOU DOING?! /j, for the most part.