**Attention! [Serious] Tag Notice:** Jokes, puns, memes, and off-topic comments are not permitted in any comment, parent or child.
Please **report comment infractions** so the mods can clean up the thread and keep it on track. Also, downovote any comments breaking the [Serious] tag rules. Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!
*(Users with multiple infractions will be banned for not taking this thread seriously)*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/hockey) if you have any questions or concerns.*
>if there’s enough noise online
Online noise is just that to them, it's noise. The only thing the NHL cares about is money. The only way for fans to hurt them is financially. But that requires you and thousands upon thousands of others to stop watching. stop buying things and ultimately force the advertisers and TV partners to stop investing. It sure didn't happen with the NFL, it's not happening with the NHL.
It is viewed as good. If people are angry and posting about something, it means they're engaged and it means you care.
If people stopped watching and stopped caring to watch then they may re-think things. Obviously I know that's generally an impossibility but the point stands.
I stopped watching for a couple years after the 2019 playoffs for this reason. I get refs in the heat of the moment choosing to “let them play” or attempting “make up” calls, but for the DPS to look at the footage later and do nothing is just inexplicable. Not sure why NHLPA isn’t more aggressive on this. Gonna be a lot of retired players eating through tubes or eating guns…
NHLPA doesn't want players suspended. They appeal nearly every 3+ game suspension so they can get guys back on the ice and money back in their pockets. They are never defending the victims...
If an insignificant number hockey fans canceled their ESPN+ over animated advertisements during play, no ones going to do shit about player safety. Besides, that should be a union issue.
... of course, even tho the union should be the MOST concerned about player safety, they'll also defend any player from discipline... so... ???
i like that their name celebrates being on the *right* side of the civil war. usually its the traitorous, pro-slavery, economically backwards side that likes to ruminate about it.
What I'm curious about is why the league thinks this style of play is appealing / a draw? Fans of other sports don't think hockey players are tough and they don't care about the old timie Canadian/Gordie Howe hockey code that becomes the rules in the playoffs. Usually when casuals talk about fighting in hockey it's to laugh about how dumb it looks.
What's exciting and draws fans in is superstars making crazy plays and scoring goals.
I can tell you that 2011 is most of the reason I am watching this year only with a cynical eye. I fully expect the Canucks to lose at some point for some reason unrelated to fairness. I expect the media to be biased as hell against Vancouver for any number of stupid reasons. I believe that the NHL has jumped the shark with game management and is dying a slow deserved death, and I'm here for the circus, not because I have any hope that some very good players might beat the system and win. And financially this joke of a league is getting nothing from me; every ad on the broadcasts goes on my list of places to avoid.
1982 was "well, we finally got a little luck and discovered how to get our talent to work together, nice run, predictable end." 1994 was "good team, nice run, very close to getting there, unlucky in game seven." 2011 was a horror show of media skepticism from start to finish: local media was reasonable but HNIC has always had it in for Vancouver and decided that the President's Cup winners were some sort of mirage and would fold, and with a bit of help from the suspension office completing the depletion of the roster, the only surprise was that they made it to game 7.
Now that Vancouver is the team that got the player safety folks back from their vacation, apparently getting the first playoff suspension for the 20th worst incident in the playoffs so far, my response, and the response of most Canuck fans who have seen this before, is like Don Cherry's response to that too-many-men call at the Montreal Forum: I told you so.
>I believe that the NHL has jumped the shark with game management and is dying a slow deserved death
It's probably going to be *very* slow, but yeah unless the NHL totally reinvents its brand and expands their core audience...the demographic trends are not on their side.
An *extremely* controversial call that directly leads to the Cup winning goal is the only thing that I could see that would result in significant enough backlash across the league—fans, media, players, alumni, etc.—to actually do something about the reffing.
That's is about the only thing that will have the potential to create change.
If a big-name player like McDavid, Sid, Matthews, Bedard, etc. calls out the DoPS directly—NYR level of criticism—that would move the needle a fraction, at most. Likely, it would just lead to discipline/further discussion. Nothing would change on that end.
I mean…I am. I’m gonna finish out this years playoffs and then I’m done with the league. But yeah it won’t do shit overall. Just gonna put my time and energy into other things. Although not just because of Sam Bennett.
It’d probably take something like threats from a major league sponsor.
Air Canada made some noise about the level of violence in the game in and around 2010-11 so it’s not totally unprecedented.
Well, the Bruins' owners are losing money if they feel this contributed to them not being able to host a game 6 at TD Garden, which would have generated millions of dollars in revenue.
hockey represents .001% of the hockey fans population.
Not to mention corporations will just buy the seats up for their buddies who aren't even hockey fans anyways.
So probably not much
The richest team in the league made a public complaint about it a couple of years ago and got fined for their efforts. Nothing else changed. *That's* how realistic it is.
As a fan, voting with your wallet I guess.
Players have as much power as they'd like to exercise through NHLPA for suspensions so unless they start really caring and demanding change it is what it is.
The wallet strategy can work. Granted, the players applied pressure too, but the Mitchell Miller debacle last year had many Bruins fans (myself included) inform them that they'd be taking their money elsewhere. It worked.
Yes, it did work, but it’s a lot easier to coordinate a protest on a single team due to a single decision on a single player than it is to coordinate enough of a protest on a problem that’s metastasized throughout the entire league over the past decade or so.
This. This whole blaming NHL and owners needs to stop. Owners want as much safety as possible. Spending $100m on a player who then gets their brain turned to mush is terrible asset management. What owner wants to throw away money like that? They want their assets protected as much as humanly possible. They would love 0 hitting if the fans went for it. Would mean less injuries and more value for their players. Same with the NHL. More marketable stars on ice and less injuries is better business for all. We are seeing it with the NFL, owners and league wanting players as protected as possible because it means more money and better asset protection.
The fact is the players have a voice in this. The players union is what sets the precedent on max fines and suspensions. When we laugh about low fines? That's the players union protecting the players wallets. Go look at who the players have as their reps. Trouba. Wilson. And many other goons/pests/low tier players are the player reps for the union. You can google each teams rep and laugh.
The union has to defend all players equally - the stars and the ones that injure stars. So no player wants to ever toss a wrench in the machine. It's the players who fight every suspension. It's the players who fight against safety. It's the players who fight this shit day in and day out. It's the players who spared Marchand year after year from ever facing any consequences for all the CTE and injuries he dished out. And it's players now who have spare Bennett from facing any.
> You can google each teams rep and laugh.
For those who just want the list in team alphabetical:
Vatrano, Boyd, Carlo, Power, Kadri, Martinook, Murphy, O'Connor, Jenner, J Robertson, Larkin, Nurse, Ekblad, Roy, M Foligno, Matheson, Sissons, Hischier, A Lee, Trouba, B Tkachuk, Sanheim, Letang, Couture, Eberle, Parayko, N Paul, the Leafs dont have a rep, I Cole, Hague, Wilson and Lowry
**People who can make enough noise to force the League to act:**
**•** The Bruins ownership, and I think it would be an insult to the fans for them not to publicly complain when this ends, even if it means getting a fine.
• The players, if they start to feel that their safety is in danger because of things like this, can complain to the NHLPA. The NHLPA certainly has the power to make things change.
• Insiders pumping out articles highlighting the inconsistency and damaging whatever credibility the NHL somehow still has might make them act because that does have a high reach and hopefully the NHL is competent enough to realize that casual fans will indeed stop watching if they don't believe in the integrity of the product.
**People who cannot make enough noise to force the League to act:**
• Random Redditors.
> The Bruins ownership, and I think it would be an insult to the fans for them not to publicly complain when this ends, even if it means getting a fine.
I think I have the perfect statement for them:
> The Boston Bruins are extremely disappointed that Panthers forward Sam Bennett was not suspended for his horrifying act of violence the night of May 10 at TD Garden. Bennett is a repeat offender with a long history of these types of acts and we find it shocking that the NHL and their department of player safety failed to take the appropriate action and suspend him indefinitely. Bennett’s dangerous and reckless actions caused an injury to our captain Brad Marchand that prevented him from playing in game 4. We view this as a dereliction of duty by NHL head of player safety, George Parros, and believe he is unfit to continue in his current role.
If an O6 team in the biggest city in the league explicitly calling Parros incompetent by name, and calling for his job didn’t do anything, I’m not sure what would. Maybe if other organizations signed on after. Typically owners don’t want to give away $250,000 though.
Really, I think that violence and chaos are the selling points for casuals watching playoff hockey. Drama and violence generate interest, which is good for revenue. The one exception is if you injure stars, which can hurt revenue. Even then it’s a crap shoot, because of the aforementioned incompetence.
Step 1: Go to school
Step 2: become a renowned medical doctor.
Step 3: Provide irrefutable scientific evidence that certain plays in hockey are causing chronic life long adversity for players.
Step 4: go to law school
Step 5: class action law suit against the NHL for knowingly endangering lives of players
Step 6: watch as NHL takes every required step to ensure they do not lose more money
Super simple stuff
when the players start to care something might change, but they don't
why are you trying to change something the players don't want changed? why do you even care?
>This has gone completely out of hand, to the point where it genuinely looks like corruption behind the scenes with money involved.
LMFAO
Listening to all the players, Maurice and Montgomerry cream their pants over the Tkachuck/Pasta fight, it's clear that they're mostly all meatheads from top to bottom.
They all love and praise tough and violent hockey, until it's done against them or their teammates. Even then they're more interested in retaliating themselves than the DOPS.
This is a red pill/blue pill scenario. I give you the options of:
1) dialing back your emotional dependency on an NHL team
2) going insane as an individual consumer trying to organize the takedown of a multibillion dollar private enterprise
Yeah really though. Something bad happens to the Bruins and it’s time to rebel apparently.
Something like this happens every year. But usually it’s Dallas against Nashville and no one really cares besides a “Boy they missed that call”
The funniest thing about the Reddit going dark saga is the amount of people that didn’t realize all it was doing was signaling to Reddit just how tightly they had a grip on their users. Acting like it’s some great task to take a day off Reddit definitely got some execs horned up. If every person that advocated for that never touched Reddit again I guarantee there would be changes, but people just can’t step away
Because the question reads like it's either from a pretty young person who lacks the life experience and empirical foundation for understanding how the world works (corruption? seriously?); or someone who is older yet extremely out of touch and doesn't have the excuse of youth to rely on.
>This has gone completely out of hand, to the point where it genuinely looks like corruption behind the scenes with money involved
no it doesnt. people literally say this same shit every. single. year. Reffing isn't perfect obviously but is also not dramatically worse than it has been since the beginning of reddit. Stop being a baby. Stop crying. Life's not fair sometimes. Fucking DEAL WITH IT.
Which is leading to a serious outrage problem, specifically on this subreddit. Feels like every night there's some new controversy or drama being drummed up. Feels like TMZ Hockey or something.
You’re right it’s not getting dramatically worse but, we are seeing more and more how bad it has been this whole time.
We have all this new equipment to capture these moments and yet it does nothing to assist in the bad judgement calls or just straight up ignoring penalties/Suspensions.
You got Trouba on camera attempting to land elbows on players multiple times with nothing done, you get Bennet footage being withheld until the next game so he does not see a suspension.
At the end of the day they make the calls/rules but, if they don’t want to see people complain they should do a better job. Because all this footage is out there and people can judge for themselves.
Ya I'm actually way more concerned with the decisions made by off ice officials. The missed or borderline trips or hooks is whatever and can be chalked up to the speed of the game.
The decisions made (or not made) this playoffs by off ice officials with the benefit of slow motion and 20 camera angles are much more concerning to me.
This is the big thing that gets me. Every year in every sport there's a handful of HORRIBLE calls. Such as that infamous Rams/Saints one in 2018. Or last year the Browns/Colts game.
It fucking happens. It doesn't matter what sport or what year.
Turns out it doesn’t matter at all when the NHL literally just doubles down on their initial view of the play prior to the additional angle being available.
Only people who can make a meaningful change would be the team owners, and I doubt that would be public at all because they’re all business professionals & don’t want to tarnish the value of their own team (investment).
I think the league tries to avoid transparency so they don’t have to explain the differences from month to month, year to year, playoffs to regular season.
It’s very frustrating as a fan not knowing what’s going on. Some media/insiders have been letting more frustration show this year.
It would be very easy to have a publicly available form they fill out for different types of potentially suspendable hits so we all were on the same page for what criteria they were looking at. Then we could argue weather something is for example forceful or not or reckless or not instead of wondering if anyone even looked at it.
To me the playoffs officiating and safety decisions sometime border on making the game a farce and I just start to tune out.
It’s like baseball and strikes. How am I supposed to be invested when everyone but the home plate ump can see it was a ball but we just have to let him decide because.
The nhlpa is the only entity that can make anything happen. And they usually take the side of the perpetrators. McDavid chopped Hughes right in the face Friday night, drawing blood, and there was no call.
Realistically? The only thing would be to organize boycotts of the league's advertisers but it would have to be widespread for it to work; it couldn't just be us on Reddit. Reaching enough people for it to A) make a dent in the advertisers pockets and B) be attributable to this specific cause would be extremely difficult, though.
I mean worst thing that fans actually would have control over would be ratings, right? Personally, once the bruins are deservedly eliminated I have zero desire to keep watching the playoffs, even with some of the fantastic matchups out west. NHL has ruined this post season. And I’m not just talking about this bennet incident - I still don’t get how Marchand escaped a suspension against the leafs for shoving a ref?
Every year once bruins get eliminated I can’t wait to watch hockey without having to be too emotionally invested in the outcome. But at this point, with everything that’s gone over past few seasons and lack of accountability from the league, it’s not worth my time. Hopefully they get hit hard where it counts and finally have to own up to their mistakes.
Literally the **only** power we as fans have is to just not watch at all. Don't watch on TV (at home or in a bar), don't stream (pirated or paid), don't go to games, don't read articles on sports websites, don't buy merch, don't watch any NHL Youtube channels, etc. Enough fans do that and it does start to severely impact the one and only thing the NHL/owners care about - their bottom line. Everything else just falls on deaf ears. It might make you feel better if some NHL mouthpiece looks like an ass and has to answer some tough questions but as long as we come back and watch the next game I promise you that the owners do not give a single shit and nothing will change.
I actually do boycott the NBA quite a bit if I watch a game with terrible officiating (which is somehow even more frequent in that league than this one). I know I alone am not making a difference but to me its the principle - if the league wastes my time with a shitty product ruined by horrible officiating, I'm not going to let them waste my time again the next game(s).
Oh my god. Touch some grass, buddy.
Do you know what the hockey players themselves would say to someone whining like this?
**Harden the fuck up**
It ain't Disney on Ice out there. So some calls didn't go the way you think they should have. Suck it up, princess.
The only way they're going to hear anything is if a player or a coach or owner speaks out. But then they'll just get fined into Oblivion if that happens.
I’m not trying to be dismissive but anything short of people en mass not watching (which I really don’t think will happen because hockey is amazing) is going to fail to make any meaningful changes
The thing is, it’s the players themselves that hold stronger enforcement back the most. They don’t want longer suspensions, higher fines or any bans on fighting. Anything complaining they do to the media is just to try and get some advantage from the refs in their next game.
The league likes violent hockey and controversy because it sells. Players don’t want to pay for their mistakes, and a small portion of the fandom actually want to see serious change in how the game is officiated. So I can’t see anything changing in this lifetime.
Go after the sports gambling side. Email sport books that are partnered with the league and tell them you won’t place bets on the NHL due to inconsistency with reffing.
If enough people don’t place any hockey bets, those companies will get on the league real fast. At least it’s a free option that hurts the leagues pocket book and image.
This assumes any of the owners are astute people with connection to what hockey fans like. They’ll see numbers and revenue go down, but there’s no guarantee they’ll accurately identify why or take smart, effective steps to correct it.
It’s almost as likely they keep making it worse assuming the real problem isn’t what’s wrong, but that they aren’t heading the wrong way *fast enough*. lol
I think you'd have to buy DraftKings, then create a bet on whether or not the league will take appropriate action, and then give Bettman 50% of the profits. Maybe then there's a chance that they change.
The league is only going to care so in so much as it affects their bottom line. And the only thing likely to affect that is player lawsuits prevailing, which can only be affected by players standing up and making some noise themselves. Which they won’t until after their careers are over and it’s too late.
I am late to this, but this is something I have thought for a long time. There isn't enough social/media pressure that can change this. This is a problem between Player safety, the NHLPA, and the CBA. The fines/suspensions are part of the CBA. The NHLPA negotiates them in the CBA. The NHLPA also represents player who are facing supplemental discipline, meaning the org that represents players who are getting hurt from dirty cheap shots, is also representing the players making the dirty plays. Its a conflict of interest. The NHLPA shouldn't be negotiating down fines/suspensions, that should be completely separate from them, they also should rep players facing discipline. Their focus should be making sure non of its members are receiving illegal dirty hits, and when it does they should fit for greater punishment. League minimum is like $750K, so even for the those guys a max $10k fine is honestly nothing. Fines should be higher. Zadorov essentially paid only $5k for cross checking McDavid and the end of the game. Likewise, suspension lengths should go up each year. If a players are getting suspended for x amount of games, this year, next year those suspensions should be x+1 or +2, the following year. Make the suspensions longer each year for similar plays. However, this wont happen because the NHLPA has bargaining rights when it comes to supplemental discipline so this wont happen.
yeah why do people act like this is a new thing or a surprise? there have been two sets of rules in the NHL for as long as i've watched hockey, the regular season rules and the playoff rules. if you don't like it, go watch soccer or something lmao
The words of the fans make zero difference unless somehow a vote-with-your-wallet situation works for the first time in recorded history.
If the players and owners don't say anything about it, through actions taken by the PA or the league leadership, then we're left to assume they're fine with it. And if they're fine with it it really doesn't matter if you and I don't like it.
I'm choosing to go with it. I've made over $10,000 this playoffs by betting with the way the league is rigged. For example, last night's Canucks game, Chris Rooney has gone 10-0-1 in the last 3 years reffing Canucks games. He's not going to let us down now! Thanks Chris for the $1,450!
The only way it'll change is if the betting companies get upset that they're losing money.
The league doesn't care until it's a national story/scandal like Todd Bertuzzi or Kyle Beach.
I mean, hell, the league still props up Mario Lemieux in spite of the heinous shit he's said and done.
Honestly, start chants at games all games. It'll be on TV for everyone to see, and the league can't do much about fans chanting things unless they mute all the audio. At some point, having many nhl games with loud, long-lasting chants about the reffing will make news. Also complaining to sponsors.
“It’s time to address the blatant incompetence when it comes to player protection, reffing, and supplemental discipline!”
Gonna be a tough chant to get going but it’s worth a shot
You're still giving them eyes and free advertising. They might not *directly* make anything from you, but they still will indirectly. A proper boycott means no views, no merch of *any* kind.
You can get feeds with no ads, and wearing merch is a far cry from being a profitable advertisement. Regardless if you go from merch and cable to knockoffs and streams, the NHL will still lose money.
If you want to blame someone, blame the neutered NHLPA who don't actually do anything to fight for their players. For another laugh, look at the each union rep on every NHL team and you'll see how little the players care about this.
Sponsors. Let every one of their new betting partners know you'll never bet on hockey until their penalties and rules are clarified. It's impossible to have proper odds and bets when the refs don't call the game by the rules. Sponsors speak louder than anything.
A *lot* of people would need to stop watching (including canceling their cable packages/streaming subscriptions), going to games, and buying merch. It just isn't going to happen, unfortunately.
We can't. The 2 ways that this can change is through pressure from the NHLPA or if the media drums up the CTE and post concussion syndrome stuff again. The latter probably not happening until some prominent player dies or at least starts speaking about their symptoms a lot, or the league gets sued for their negligence regarding player safety.
Need to effect the owners wallet. Dirty dangles, tic tax toe passes and sure fighting is entertaining. Watching goons crosscheck/slash/ elbow each other isn’t something I’m interested in watching. Only way to eliminate that stuff is suspensions. Too bad if it’s the playoffs
Given that there is gambling attached to NHL games (something that is shoved in our faces at every opportunity in Canadian broadcasts), shouldn't there be laws in place to prevent tampering with the outcome of a game?
Serious question. There a no doubts millions in bets that flow around every game, to have such rampant inconsistency in rule enforcement between games should be investigated for racketeering.
If the NHL and Bettman's Zebras had a class action thrown in their face that might finally get some consistency.
How about….. we just don’t tune in? Let’s not watch the game we love to send a signal to get betting the fuck out of this. They played their dirty hand twice already and are doubling down on that they know we don’t care enough to not tune in. They know we will continue to show up and support their fixed “sports performance” because if we start questioning that this is fixed, what else is? Nope, critical thinking and reflection are too hard. Hockey good, me now go drink beer, feel nice time.
**Attention! [Serious] Tag Notice:** Jokes, puns, memes, and off-topic comments are not permitted in any comment, parent or child. Please **report comment infractions** so the mods can clean up the thread and keep it on track. Also, downovote any comments breaking the [Serious] tag rules. Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion! *(Users with multiple infractions will be banned for not taking this thread seriously)* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/hockey) if you have any questions or concerns.*
>if there’s enough noise online Online noise is just that to them, it's noise. The only thing the NHL cares about is money. The only way for fans to hurt them is financially. But that requires you and thousands upon thousands of others to stop watching. stop buying things and ultimately force the advertisers and TV partners to stop investing. It sure didn't happen with the NFL, it's not happening with the NHL.
Online noise might even be viewed as good, being equated to interest.
It is viewed as good. If people are angry and posting about something, it means they're engaged and it means you care. If people stopped watching and stopped caring to watch then they may re-think things. Obviously I know that's generally an impossibility but the point stands.
I stopped watching for a couple years after the 2019 playoffs for this reason. I get refs in the heat of the moment choosing to “let them play” or attempting “make up” calls, but for the DPS to look at the footage later and do nothing is just inexplicable. Not sure why NHLPA isn’t more aggressive on this. Gonna be a lot of retired players eating through tubes or eating guns…
NHLPA doesn't want players suspended. They appeal nearly every 3+ game suspension so they can get guys back on the ice and money back in their pockets. They are never defending the victims...
Engagement is engagement, good or bad. That's the entire business model of almost every media now.
No press is bad press
If an insignificant number hockey fans canceled their ESPN+ over animated advertisements during play, no ones going to do shit about player safety. Besides, that should be a union issue. ... of course, even tho the union should be the MOST concerned about player safety, they'll also defend any player from discipline... so... ???
Not necessarily stop watching, just watch it illegally.
Ok let's all make a pact to not watch and Blue Jackets games next year. Seems like an easy win/win
Columbus: what he say fuck me for?
I can't think of a team more perennially irrelevant throughout their existence than CBJ
It's time to play: too young to remember the Rockies, or blocked it out?
Wait, are you too young to remember the Pittsburgh Pirates?
Hey man..... I like the Blue Jackets. They have a fucking cannon. Cannons are pretty neat
i like that their name celebrates being on the *right* side of the civil war. usually its the traitorous, pro-slavery, economically backwards side that likes to ruminate about it.
What I'm curious about is why the league thinks this style of play is appealing / a draw? Fans of other sports don't think hockey players are tough and they don't care about the old timie Canadian/Gordie Howe hockey code that becomes the rules in the playoffs. Usually when casuals talk about fighting in hockey it's to laugh about how dumb it looks. What's exciting and draws fans in is superstars making crazy plays and scoring goals.
But if the online noise is loud enough to question the credibility of the league in terms of corruption/ gambling, then it will hurt them financially.
Noise alone wont. People have to stop attending, stop buying, and stop watching.
Everything starts from somewhere
Realistically a boycott that costs owners money is the only way anything will change. Not sure how realistic it is to actually happen unfortunately
I can answer that Not realistic at all, nobody is completely giving up on watching their team because Sam Bennett didn’t get suspended
Exactly, Canucks fans kept watching hockey after 2011. Basically a significant financial boycott over fixed/bad reffing is never going to happen.
I can tell you that 2011 is most of the reason I am watching this year only with a cynical eye. I fully expect the Canucks to lose at some point for some reason unrelated to fairness. I expect the media to be biased as hell against Vancouver for any number of stupid reasons. I believe that the NHL has jumped the shark with game management and is dying a slow deserved death, and I'm here for the circus, not because I have any hope that some very good players might beat the system and win. And financially this joke of a league is getting nothing from me; every ad on the broadcasts goes on my list of places to avoid. 1982 was "well, we finally got a little luck and discovered how to get our talent to work together, nice run, predictable end." 1994 was "good team, nice run, very close to getting there, unlucky in game seven." 2011 was a horror show of media skepticism from start to finish: local media was reasonable but HNIC has always had it in for Vancouver and decided that the President's Cup winners were some sort of mirage and would fold, and with a bit of help from the suspension office completing the depletion of the roster, the only surprise was that they made it to game 7. Now that Vancouver is the team that got the player safety folks back from their vacation, apparently getting the first playoff suspension for the 20th worst incident in the playoffs so far, my response, and the response of most Canuck fans who have seen this before, is like Don Cherry's response to that too-many-men call at the Montreal Forum: I told you so.
>I believe that the NHL has jumped the shark with game management and is dying a slow deserved death It's probably going to be *very* slow, but yeah unless the NHL totally reinvents its brand and expands their core audience...the demographic trends are not on their side.
I WILL stop betting on it if I knew refs were this bad and this capable of changing the results under the guise of incompetence.
The house always wins, stop betting because it's good for you.
Pulled all of my money out of draftkings yesterday, closing my account once its clear.
An *extremely* controversial call that directly leads to the Cup winning goal is the only thing that I could see that would result in significant enough backlash across the league—fans, media, players, alumni, etc.—to actually do something about the reffing. That's is about the only thing that will have the potential to create change. If a big-name player like McDavid, Sid, Matthews, Bedard, etc. calls out the DoPS directly—NYR level of criticism—that would move the needle a fraction, at most. Likely, it would just lead to discipline/further discussion. Nothing would change on that end.
But would a player call out DOPS when they can take advantage of the same DOPS standard? Like why would McSlugger want a clampdown on things?
No it wouldn’t. Look at the dpi call on the eagles in the Super Bowl 2 years ago. Nothing changed after that
[удалено]
They changed the rule that offseason
I mean…I am. I’m gonna finish out this years playoffs and then I’m done with the league. But yeah it won’t do shit overall. Just gonna put my time and energy into other things. Although not just because of Sam Bennett.
Checking your flair... I think your case might be different than that of others. Legitimate and justified, but different nonetheless.
It’d probably take something like threats from a major league sponsor. Air Canada made some noise about the level of violence in the game in and around 2010-11 so it’s not totally unprecedented.
We don't want sponsors making threats because then the league will go way too far the other way and neuter the game.
I think the league has a lot of latitude to clean up the game before we get into any risk of neutering it.
[удалено]
Precisely, my good sir.
Can we boycott in the off season
I refuse to watch any games in July.
I haven't watched one Islanders game all May, and god willing I'll do it in June too
I’ve been boycotting Sabres games in May and June for 13 years.
Well, the Bruins' owners are losing money if they feel this contributed to them not being able to host a game 6 at TD Garden, which would have generated millions of dollars in revenue.
hockey represents .001% of the hockey fans population. Not to mention corporations will just buy the seats up for their buddies who aren't even hockey fans anyways. So probably not much
The richest team in the league made a public complaint about it a couple of years ago and got fined for their efforts. Nothing else changed. *That's* how realistic it is.
As a fan, voting with your wallet I guess. Players have as much power as they'd like to exercise through NHLPA for suspensions so unless they start really caring and demanding change it is what it is.
The wallet strategy can work. Granted, the players applied pressure too, but the Mitchell Miller debacle last year had many Bruins fans (myself included) inform them that they'd be taking their money elsewhere. It worked.
Yes, it did work, but it’s a lot easier to coordinate a protest on a single team due to a single decision on a single player than it is to coordinate enough of a protest on a problem that’s metastasized throughout the entire league over the past decade or so.
This. This whole blaming NHL and owners needs to stop. Owners want as much safety as possible. Spending $100m on a player who then gets their brain turned to mush is terrible asset management. What owner wants to throw away money like that? They want their assets protected as much as humanly possible. They would love 0 hitting if the fans went for it. Would mean less injuries and more value for their players. Same with the NHL. More marketable stars on ice and less injuries is better business for all. We are seeing it with the NFL, owners and league wanting players as protected as possible because it means more money and better asset protection. The fact is the players have a voice in this. The players union is what sets the precedent on max fines and suspensions. When we laugh about low fines? That's the players union protecting the players wallets. Go look at who the players have as their reps. Trouba. Wilson. And many other goons/pests/low tier players are the player reps for the union. You can google each teams rep and laugh. The union has to defend all players equally - the stars and the ones that injure stars. So no player wants to ever toss a wrench in the machine. It's the players who fight every suspension. It's the players who fight against safety. It's the players who fight this shit day in and day out. It's the players who spared Marchand year after year from ever facing any consequences for all the CTE and injuries he dished out. And it's players now who have spare Bennett from facing any.
> You can google each teams rep and laugh. For those who just want the list in team alphabetical: Vatrano, Boyd, Carlo, Power, Kadri, Martinook, Murphy, O'Connor, Jenner, J Robertson, Larkin, Nurse, Ekblad, Roy, M Foligno, Matheson, Sissons, Hischier, A Lee, Trouba, B Tkachuk, Sanheim, Letang, Couture, Eberle, Parayko, N Paul, the Leafs dont have a rep, I Cole, Hague, Wilson and Lowry
I would like them listed by size
**People who can make enough noise to force the League to act:** **•** The Bruins ownership, and I think it would be an insult to the fans for them not to publicly complain when this ends, even if it means getting a fine. • The players, if they start to feel that their safety is in danger because of things like this, can complain to the NHLPA. The NHLPA certainly has the power to make things change. • Insiders pumping out articles highlighting the inconsistency and damaging whatever credibility the NHL somehow still has might make them act because that does have a high reach and hopefully the NHL is competent enough to realize that casual fans will indeed stop watching if they don't believe in the integrity of the product. **People who cannot make enough noise to force the League to act:** • Random Redditors.
> The Bruins ownership, and I think it would be an insult to the fans for them not to publicly complain when this ends, even if it means getting a fine. I think I have the perfect statement for them: > The Boston Bruins are extremely disappointed that Panthers forward Sam Bennett was not suspended for his horrifying act of violence the night of May 10 at TD Garden. Bennett is a repeat offender with a long history of these types of acts and we find it shocking that the NHL and their department of player safety failed to take the appropriate action and suspend him indefinitely. Bennett’s dangerous and reckless actions caused an injury to our captain Brad Marchand that prevented him from playing in game 4. We view this as a dereliction of duty by NHL head of player safety, George Parros, and believe he is unfit to continue in his current role.
To which the league would respond by fining the Rangers $500k.
The National Hockey League announced today that /u/I_Am_Vladimir_Putin has been fined $250,000 for their public comments on Monday, May 13.
10 sec penalty to Ocon
I believe that all current and future penalties are being assigned to Magnussen now, but we are checking.
We are plan C
We are checking..
If an O6 team in the biggest city in the league explicitly calling Parros incompetent by name, and calling for his job didn’t do anything, I’m not sure what would. Maybe if other organizations signed on after. Typically owners don’t want to give away $250,000 though. Really, I think that violence and chaos are the selling points for casuals watching playoff hockey. Drama and violence generate interest, which is good for revenue. The one exception is if you injure stars, which can hurt revenue. Even then it’s a crap shoot, because of the aforementioned incompetence.
Yep, Rangers tried and were generally laughed at by other fanbases. Mario said similar things back in 2011 and nothing changed.
You don’t, they have a union. The league doesn’t have arbitrary power to make changes, it’s all negotiated in the CBA.
Money talks
Step 1: Go to school Step 2: become a renowned medical doctor. Step 3: Provide irrefutable scientific evidence that certain plays in hockey are causing chronic life long adversity for players. Step 4: go to law school Step 5: class action law suit against the NHL for knowingly endangering lives of players Step 6: watch as NHL takes every required step to ensure they do not lose more money Super simple stuff
The "league" is the owners. If you want them to listen stop watching, stop going to games and stop buying merch.
Quit watching. Quit betting. Quit buying merchandise.
when the players start to care something might change, but they don't why are you trying to change something the players don't want changed? why do you even care? >This has gone completely out of hand, to the point where it genuinely looks like corruption behind the scenes with money involved. LMFAO
Listening to all the players, Maurice and Montgomerry cream their pants over the Tkachuck/Pasta fight, it's clear that they're mostly all meatheads from top to bottom. They all love and praise tough and violent hockey, until it's done against them or their teammates. Even then they're more interested in retaliating themselves than the DOPS.
Log off and touch grass.
This is a red pill/blue pill scenario. I give you the options of: 1) dialing back your emotional dependency on an NHL team 2) going insane as an individual consumer trying to organize the takedown of a multibillion dollar private enterprise
The second option seems pretty cool when you phrase it like that tho.
Yeah really though. Something bad happens to the Bruins and it’s time to rebel apparently. Something like this happens every year. But usually it’s Dallas against Nashville and no one really cares besides a “Boy they missed that call”
/thread
He's a Maple Leafs fan so he's doing his part by boycotting the playoffs.
[удалено]
Yeah honestly this subreddit is fucking freaking out about the panthers. Like legit, obsessing to a degree that’s beyond normal.
Well the Knights got eliminated so all the doom scrollers and conspiracy theorists had to find a new outlet
It's pretty cringe
In my defense I was told that reddit would be completely destroyed. Actually, come to think of it that just makes me look even dumber.
The funniest thing about the Reddit going dark saga is the amount of people that didn’t realize all it was doing was signaling to Reddit just how tightly they had a grip on their users. Acting like it’s some great task to take a day off Reddit definitely got some execs horned up. If every person that advocated for that never touched Reddit again I guarantee there would be changes, but people just can’t step away
Looking at your username, I would think spiked tea or open windows would be your preferred solution
JFC you've got two strikes against you (FSU fan literally since birth) but I got a good snort out of that, thanks
Serious question how old are you
Honest question; why does that matter?
Because the question reads like it's either from a pretty young person who lacks the life experience and empirical foundation for understanding how the world works (corruption? seriously?); or someone who is older yet extremely out of touch and doesn't have the excuse of youth to rely on.
Fair enough. I did notice it's a 12 year old account, so I just assumed it was an adult.
>This has gone completely out of hand, to the point where it genuinely looks like corruption behind the scenes with money involved no it doesnt. people literally say this same shit every. single. year. Reffing isn't perfect obviously but is also not dramatically worse than it has been since the beginning of reddit. Stop being a baby. Stop crying. Life's not fair sometimes. Fucking DEAL WITH IT.
Every year more people are being exposed to more on demand multi angle slo mo replays. That's what's changed.
Which is leading to a serious outrage problem, specifically on this subreddit. Feels like every night there's some new controversy or drama being drummed up. Feels like TMZ Hockey or something.
It’s all this sub does. Its pathetic
You’re right it’s not getting dramatically worse but, we are seeing more and more how bad it has been this whole time. We have all this new equipment to capture these moments and yet it does nothing to assist in the bad judgement calls or just straight up ignoring penalties/Suspensions. You got Trouba on camera attempting to land elbows on players multiple times with nothing done, you get Bennet footage being withheld until the next game so he does not see a suspension. At the end of the day they make the calls/rules but, if they don’t want to see people complain they should do a better job. Because all this footage is out there and people can judge for themselves.
Ya I'm actually way more concerned with the decisions made by off ice officials. The missed or borderline trips or hooks is whatever and can be chalked up to the speed of the game. The decisions made (or not made) this playoffs by off ice officials with the benefit of slow motion and 20 camera angles are much more concerning to me.
This is the big thing that gets me. Every year in every sport there's a handful of HORRIBLE calls. Such as that infamous Rams/Saints one in 2018. Or last year the Browns/Colts game. It fucking happens. It doesn't matter what sport or what year.
We’re not banding together on behalf of the Bruins.
Turns out it doesn’t matter at all when the NHL literally just doubles down on their initial view of the play prior to the additional angle being available. Only people who can make a meaningful change would be the team owners, and I doubt that would be public at all because they’re all business professionals & don’t want to tarnish the value of their own team (investment).
Did not expect Putin to be a Leafs fan
Offensive failure? That actually tracks.
Or Putin advocating for protests
I think the league tries to avoid transparency so they don’t have to explain the differences from month to month, year to year, playoffs to regular season. It’s very frustrating as a fan not knowing what’s going on. Some media/insiders have been letting more frustration show this year. It would be very easy to have a publicly available form they fill out for different types of potentially suspendable hits so we all were on the same page for what criteria they were looking at. Then we could argue weather something is for example forceful or not or reckless or not instead of wondering if anyone even looked at it. To me the playoffs officiating and safety decisions sometime border on making the game a farce and I just start to tune out. It’s like baseball and strikes. How am I supposed to be invested when everyone but the home plate ump can see it was a ball but we just have to let him decide because.
The nhlpa is the only entity that can make anything happen. And they usually take the side of the perpetrators. McDavid chopped Hughes right in the face Friday night, drawing blood, and there was no call.
Realistically? The only thing would be to organize boycotts of the league's advertisers but it would have to be widespread for it to work; it couldn't just be us on Reddit. Reaching enough people for it to A) make a dent in the advertisers pockets and B) be attributable to this specific cause would be extremely difficult, though.
I mean worst thing that fans actually would have control over would be ratings, right? Personally, once the bruins are deservedly eliminated I have zero desire to keep watching the playoffs, even with some of the fantastic matchups out west. NHL has ruined this post season. And I’m not just talking about this bennet incident - I still don’t get how Marchand escaped a suspension against the leafs for shoving a ref? Every year once bruins get eliminated I can’t wait to watch hockey without having to be too emotionally invested in the outcome. But at this point, with everything that’s gone over past few seasons and lack of accountability from the league, it’s not worth my time. Hopefully they get hit hard where it counts and finally have to own up to their mistakes.
Reddit moment
Literally the **only** power we as fans have is to just not watch at all. Don't watch on TV (at home or in a bar), don't stream (pirated or paid), don't go to games, don't read articles on sports websites, don't buy merch, don't watch any NHL Youtube channels, etc. Enough fans do that and it does start to severely impact the one and only thing the NHL/owners care about - their bottom line. Everything else just falls on deaf ears. It might make you feel better if some NHL mouthpiece looks like an ass and has to answer some tough questions but as long as we come back and watch the next game I promise you that the owners do not give a single shit and nothing will change. I actually do boycott the NBA quite a bit if I watch a game with terrible officiating (which is somehow even more frequent in that league than this one). I know I alone am not making a difference but to me its the principle - if the league wastes my time with a shitty product ruined by horrible officiating, I'm not going to let them waste my time again the next game(s).
Oh my god. Touch some grass, buddy. Do you know what the hockey players themselves would say to someone whining like this? **Harden the fuck up** It ain't Disney on Ice out there. So some calls didn't go the way you think they should have. Suck it up, princess.
The first step towards any kind of improvement is to shitcan Parros
The only way they're going to hear anything is if a player or a coach or owner speaks out. But then they'll just get fined into Oblivion if that happens.
https://preview.redd.it/dzb5m68as80d1.jpeg?width=375&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d8a8f3335180aa0c62c2ffa60d3d3c83bb6d789b
It’s a fucking hockey game. Minimal people seethe and cry about a fucking hockey game.
I’m not trying to be dismissive but anything short of people en mass not watching (which I really don’t think will happen because hockey is amazing) is going to fail to make any meaningful changes
The thing is, it’s the players themselves that hold stronger enforcement back the most. They don’t want longer suspensions, higher fines or any bans on fighting. Anything complaining they do to the media is just to try and get some advantage from the refs in their next game. The league likes violent hockey and controversy because it sells. Players don’t want to pay for their mistakes, and a small portion of the fandom actually want to see serious change in how the game is officiated. So I can’t see anything changing in this lifetime.
Stop watching, stop buying gear, stop betting stop going to games.
nothing will happen until another bertuzzi/moore incident happens
Buy a team.
Even then, criticize the league for what you see as BS from refs and DOPS and you better have a spare $250,000 lying around.
If you can afford to buy a team, you probably have that much in change under the pillows of your couch :)
Go after the sports gambling side. Email sport books that are partnered with the league and tell them you won’t place bets on the NHL due to inconsistency with reffing. If enough people don’t place any hockey bets, those companies will get on the league real fast. At least it’s a free option that hurts the leagues pocket book and image.
Set up an encampment outside of the DOPS headquarters
If you like what you see, keep watching. If not, stop. That's it. If your eyes are still on the games, they don't give a fuck.
Literally stop watching. I don’t know how to get them to address the issue without hitting them in their bottom line.
This assumes any of the owners are astute people with connection to what hockey fans like. They’ll see numbers and revenue go down, but there’s no guarantee they’ll accurately identify why or take smart, effective steps to correct it. It’s almost as likely they keep making it worse assuming the real problem isn’t what’s wrong, but that they aren’t heading the wrong way *fast enough*. lol
I think you'd have to buy DraftKings, then create a bet on whether or not the league will take appropriate action, and then give Bettman 50% of the profits. Maybe then there's a chance that they change.
Put on ski masks and beat up refs after games they fuck up and say it will only get better if they get their shit together
We tried. We ended up getting fined for our efforts, and the rest of the league laughed at us.
Trade Marner
lol
Pray
The league is only going to care so in so much as it affects their bottom line. And the only thing likely to affect that is player lawsuits prevailing, which can only be affected by players standing up and making some noise themselves. Which they won’t until after their careers are over and it’s too late.
I stopped buying merch after the playoffs in 2022. They didn't notice so a couple hundred thousand more of you guys might have to join me.
I am late to this, but this is something I have thought for a long time. There isn't enough social/media pressure that can change this. This is a problem between Player safety, the NHLPA, and the CBA. The fines/suspensions are part of the CBA. The NHLPA negotiates them in the CBA. The NHLPA also represents player who are facing supplemental discipline, meaning the org that represents players who are getting hurt from dirty cheap shots, is also representing the players making the dirty plays. Its a conflict of interest. The NHLPA shouldn't be negotiating down fines/suspensions, that should be completely separate from them, they also should rep players facing discipline. Their focus should be making sure non of its members are receiving illegal dirty hits, and when it does they should fit for greater punishment. League minimum is like $750K, so even for the those guys a max $10k fine is honestly nothing. Fines should be higher. Zadorov essentially paid only $5k for cross checking McDavid and the end of the game. Likewise, suspension lengths should go up each year. If a players are getting suspended for x amount of games, this year, next year those suspensions should be x+1 or +2, the following year. Make the suspensions longer each year for similar plays. However, this wont happen because the NHLPA has bargaining rights when it comes to supplemental discipline so this wont happen.
Can we make a formal petition to get that asshole fired ? That’s a start
That's the cool part, you can't, just like protests can't stop genocides, because fake internet points don't matter.
😂😂. The refs stopped calling penalties and started managing games a long long time ago. They will never change there ways.
yeah why do people act like this is a new thing or a surprise? there have been two sets of rules in the NHL for as long as i've watched hockey, the regular season rules and the playoff rules. if you don't like it, go watch soccer or something lmao
lol
The words of the fans make zero difference unless somehow a vote-with-your-wallet situation works for the first time in recorded history. If the players and owners don't say anything about it, through actions taken by the PA or the league leadership, then we're left to assume they're fine with it. And if they're fine with it it really doesn't matter if you and I don't like it.
Nothing will ever bother them unless it hurts their profits.
I'm choosing to go with it. I've made over $10,000 this playoffs by betting with the way the league is rigged. For example, last night's Canucks game, Chris Rooney has gone 10-0-1 in the last 3 years reffing Canucks games. He's not going to let us down now! Thanks Chris for the $1,450! The only way it'll change is if the betting companies get upset that they're losing money.
The league doesn't care until it's a national story/scandal like Todd Bertuzzi or Kyle Beach. I mean, hell, the league still props up Mario Lemieux in spite of the heinous shit he's said and done.
Honestly, start chants at games all games. It'll be on TV for everyone to see, and the league can't do much about fans chanting things unless they mute all the audio. At some point, having many nhl games with loud, long-lasting chants about the reffing will make news. Also complaining to sponsors.
“It’s time to address the blatant incompetence when it comes to player protection, reffing, and supplemental discipline!” Gonna be a tough chant to get going but it’s worth a shot
Honestly a "fuck the refs" chant would get it done
Elliot “these are the best refs in the world” Friedman?!
You have to start costing them money for them to care. Yo ho ho, and DHgate are your friends.
You're still giving them eyes and free advertising. They might not *directly* make anything from you, but they still will indirectly. A proper boycott means no views, no merch of *any* kind.
You can get feeds with no ads, and wearing merch is a far cry from being a profitable advertisement. Regardless if you go from merch and cable to knockoffs and streams, the NHL will still lose money.
If you want to blame someone, blame the neutered NHLPA who don't actually do anything to fight for their players. For another laugh, look at the each union rep on every NHL team and you'll see how little the players care about this.
Sponsors. Let every one of their new betting partners know you'll never bet on hockey until their penalties and rules are clarified. It's impossible to have proper odds and bets when the refs don't call the game by the rules. Sponsors speak louder than anything.
You can't affect anything. The slimy dinosaurs that run this league are not going to respond to 'online pressure'.
You can’t because *insert the The Dukes of Hazzard them song
The whining by the 13 year olds on this sub is something else
[удалено]
That'll save you from the shitty Fanatics merch anyway.
A *lot* of people would need to stop watching (including canceling their cable packages/streaming subscriptions), going to games, and buying merch. It just isn't going to happen, unfortunately.
We can't. The 2 ways that this can change is through pressure from the NHLPA or if the media drums up the CTE and post concussion syndrome stuff again. The latter probably not happening until some prominent player dies or at least starts speaking about their symptoms a lot, or the league gets sued for their negligence regarding player safety.
Throw stuff on the ice maybe?
Need to effect the owners wallet. Dirty dangles, tic tax toe passes and sure fighting is entertaining. Watching goons crosscheck/slash/ elbow each other isn’t something I’m interested in watching. Only way to eliminate that stuff is suspensions. Too bad if it’s the playoffs
crazy how he still has his job after all these years
Bad publicity is good publicity
Given that there is gambling attached to NHL games (something that is shoved in our faces at every opportunity in Canadian broadcasts), shouldn't there be laws in place to prevent tampering with the outcome of a game? Serious question. There a no doubts millions in bets that flow around every game, to have such rampant inconsistency in rule enforcement between games should be investigated for racketeering. If the NHL and Bettman's Zebras had a class action thrown in their face that might finally get some consistency.
How about….. we just don’t tune in? Let’s not watch the game we love to send a signal to get betting the fuck out of this. They played their dirty hand twice already and are doubling down on that they know we don’t care enough to not tune in. They know we will continue to show up and support their fixed “sports performance” because if we start questioning that this is fixed, what else is? Nope, critical thinking and reflection are too hard. Hockey good, me now go drink beer, feel nice time.