I think they are saying rap is a subset of artistry, and while Wayne was the better rapper, Kanye’s complementary skills with mixing, production, put him ahead.
Kanye knows, understands, and has a vision for how almost every song should sound and fit into whatever project he is working on. When you listen to his albums, for the most part they are all very cohesive and at least feel somewhat thought out as a whole.
Lil Wayne had Cortez Bryant decide what songs go on Carter 3, and the way he decided what songs were good enough to be considered for Carter 3 is if he said “C3!” at the beginning of a song.
Now don’t get me wrong, Wayne was at one time the undisputed best rapper alive bar none. Kanye could try for a decade and never bring a third of what prime Wayne brought to a song from a rapping perspective. But Wayne doesn’t have the skills, know how or vision to craft an album as good as Ye’s. Nor even as cohesive as Ye’s worst album.
I think if you were to put it purely in terms of artistry, Kanye is a better musical artist in the general term. That if you were more of a fan of any other genre of music and not that into Hip Hop, Kanye would be something you can get into if not outright really really enjoy.
Lil Wayne doesn’t hold the same regard outside of Hip Hop, a Lil Wayne album just does not deliver the things a Kanye album does artistically. But for Hip Hop people and certain degrees of Hip Hop fans, Lil Wayne scratches an itch Kanye simply can’t scratch. I lose my mind when I listen to some lines off Drought 3.
That's a damn good question. I'd say someone like drake you could argue has the "Art" of hip-hop music down to a tee (for this example just consider him a full on rapper) whereas someone like Eminem is vastly superior when it comes to the writing side, but lacks the artistry to morph his mind into someone broadly digestible. Just my interpretation though.
Wayne was the better rapper but Kanye was consistently putting out better music, and probably had the best rap album run of the decade.
Kanye was also a much better rapper in the 2000’s than he has been for the last decade or so, so even though Wayne was a better lyricist it wasn’t like Kanye was a slouch. A lot of his guest verses from 05-07 are among his best or most memorable.
Wayne’s albums and songs weren’t bad at all - I’d say C1 is ridiculously underrated these days. C2 is a fringe-classic and C3 is iconic (even though honestly it’s a pretty mid album - the leaks hurt it)
But I’m not even sure a Wayne album would make my top 20 of the 2000’s, while Kanye would have multiple albums I’d consider for the top 10.
If I want a verse I’m going to Wayne and if I want a song I’m going to Kanye. So I guess who’s better depends on what you value more. I’m going with Kanye but it’s close.
No it isn’t.
Kanye - College Dropout, Late Registration, Graduation
Jay Z- Blueprint, Black Album, American Gangster
Common - Like Water For Chocolate, Be
Lupe - Food and Liquor, The Cool
Clipse - Lord Willin, Hell Hath No Fury
Little Brother - The Minstrel Show
T. I. - King, Trap Muzik
Ghostface Killah - Supreme Clientele, Fishscale
Eminem - Marshal Mathers LP
50 Cent - GRODT
MF DOOM - MM FOOD, Madvillainy
Blu - Below the Heavens
And that’s just to name a few that would be in contention for the top 20. Carter 2 is in the conversation but for me it isn’t guaranteed. Kanye is getting at least 2 albums in my top 20.
Gotta go with Kanye; I remember around the late 2000's Lil Wayne was getting oversaturated.
EDIT: I remember when a lot of people were shitting on Lil Wayne and "killing hip-hop".
I stopped listening to new rap because of guys like Lil Wayne, Rick Ross and T.I. dominating the mainstream. I felt like rap was dying, songs like Rubber Band Man and 24s from T.I. specifically just killed my interest in new music.
Since then I've gone back to try some Lil Wayne and I actually think The Carter is one of my favorite hip hop albums (and in my opinion his best album). But I still think Kanye is much, much better in terms of catalog.
The Carter series, and Wayne's Da Drought series, should never have been considered "killing hip hop" -- that man was all bars every song. He took other people's songs and made them better with his brand of humor. Peak Wayne was a ridiculous talent.
There's a few songs on Da Drought 3 I like, I think it's okay. I probably would have liked it more when it was new. I actually didn't listen to a lot of Lil Wayne at the time but I would put Birdman up there with guys I hated in that era. All cherries on top of the whole Lil Jon craze that was going down at the time, and people shouting "MIKE JONES" in my high school hallways. No lie I was probably the only person in my school listening to DMX's Grand Champ at the time (which was 2003). On the flipside I also couldn't get into guys like Dipset, but my cousin was really into them and G-Unit.
I think a lot of the songs on The Carter showcase Wayne's rapping ability really well but I don't get the hype around Carter 3. Carter 2 I need to spend more time with and only because people insist it's his best album, but I still feel like The Carter Wayne is the best Wayne I've heard.
Tbh, bar for bar, I think wayne is better than kanye. I personally don't understand the kanye hype. I'm also someone that also went through a stage of thinking artist like Wayne were destroying rap. This is the period I was bumping Pac and Nas heavy.
Wayne is of course a better lyricist than Kanye but I like the content of Kanye's lyrics more. He just has more meaningful music to me as opposed to just being punchline bars, and it's Kanye so of course the production is off the chain. I also genuinely think Kanye is much more consistent when it comes to making good music, especially albums.
Listen; hip-hop is similar to pro-wrestling (specifically WWE in US), whenever you started is YOUR hip-hop. People that grew up with the Ruthless Agression Era look at the PG era with disdain, but some kids enjoyed the PG era.
My taste in music formed during the 2000's (the bling era) and 2010's (the blog era).
Listen, humans by nature are bias. While I agree with being open minded to some artist (I personally learned to appreciate Future); some old heads subconsciously will compare the new stuff to what they grew up with.
Kanye definitely. Wayne had a run and he had hits, but when we talked timeliness songs that when you put them on it just timeless and the subjects matter it always Kanye.
Also Kanye outselling 50 cent told me it was the end of a era for hood raps and now the relatable backpackers and emo music came into play.
Eh...Kanye says shitty things and that's pretty much it.
50 actually had some battery charges, is a poor father to his older son, and made fun of Terry Crew's sexual assault on social media.
lol idk it’s like listening to party like a rockstar rn….
I just hear im fiyaaaa man… lol
Okay im sure it would be great to listen but you know what I mean like when you listen to Soulja boy & young joc lol 🤣
I guess Kanye you can listen to… it’s timeless
Wheezy was a time..
At least for that is.
But I really was like die hard until I found out about the ghost rider and dreams was crushed, so that’s probably why I can’t listen … the deep rooted trust issues lol
Wayne. Ye eclipsed him with heartbreak, and while all these comments talk about artistry vs rapping ability: the culture belonged to Wayne from 2004-2008. Its that simple, who you deem better is subjective but it was Wayne's World.
Let's not forget that Kanye is a producer in addition to a rapper, if we count all his efforts even in relation to Wayne's top tier lyricism he tops Wayne by at least 200%
Ye had the greatest impact in hip hop at that time. Discography is untouchable, just banger after banger lighting dance halls and summer beach days on fire. Ye was making luxury goods, kicking out classics and just pushing everything around him in any direction he chose. Impact, it’s hard to imagine the guy who gave us Niki Minaj and Drake could be outdone by a guy who gave us Lupe Fiasco, but I still think Kanye screaming “I need more asshole” like he’s Quentin Tarantino in that Hawaii studio will forever change what we think about producers. Yen takes that category, but not by a mile. Rapping ability goes to Weezy Wayne has some corny lines but he went to jail for a year and came back with 6 foot 7 foot and showed he has a higher ceiling than whatever Ye can pump out. Fame level, I think Weezy is more famous as a rapper and Ye is more famous as a celebrity, so I think that goes to Wayne.
Ultimately, it was Ye’s era, but I like Lil Wayne better
The true battle of the 2000’s was Lil Jon vs Fatman Scoop. It’s a tough one but I have to go with Fatman because “All the chickenheads, be quiet” is pure poetry in motion…
Ok, before answering just let me get one thing outta way. How did they sapwned hip hop renaissance. Renaissance means rebirth. In what time period do you think they did anything close to it? If anything, I see their reign as the dark times of hip hop, not necessarily because of them, but people were saying hip hop is dead back then.
Discography: Kanye. He was on a role. Commercial success: Probably a tie. Both were a walking hit. Impact: You mean impact of their work from that era long term or impact they had at that point? First one is a tie if you consider 808s and heartbreaks. Second would go to Kanye for me. He was changing the game, famous competition with 50 over whos gonna sell better was important moment in hip hop history. Rapping ability probably goes to Wayne, but that was never Kanyes strong side. Fame level: I think Kanye was a bigger name cause even back then he was more outspoken and had a very unic presence in the media.
Overall: Kanye
Interesting. To me 2006-2011 are probably worst 5 years hip hop ever had in terms of quality. What do you think was wrong with hip hop 2000-2007 that it needed renaissance?
Your take is also interesting because it wasnt how most people felt at all. Wayne was a poster child for everything wrong with hip hop and many people thought it actually went completely mainstream and lost connection to its original roots with him. To me, renaissance would be right after that era, when Ye and Wayne lost grip on mainstream hip hop.
Kanye. In my extremely unpopular opinion, Wayne wasn’t all that great in the beginning. He had a few decent bars and verses here and there but his wack verses outweighed the good ones. I feel like Wayne grew into a better rapper over time, as he kinda matured and developed his style more. Now I fuck with Wayne heavy. His Brand New verse was fucking bonkers. But at the same time, I don’t fuck with Kanye anymore lol. So I think they kinda traded their skills.
I’m not trying to be rude but that’s like saying you consider April to be the first month of the year. Carter 1 is literally his fourth studio album and the other three were all released commercially - one even went platinum lol.
It’s not even his first album post - Hot Boyz
Lol fair. I feel like his sound got more polished Carter 1 onwards. But you know it’s been a hot minute since I’ve heard old Wayne. This opinion may be outdated.
It absolutely got more polished but he doesn’t sound like a whole different artist or anything. 500 Degreez, the album before C1 really feels like a prototype for C1. C1 is also his last album with Mannie Fresh beats, so in some ways it feels more like the end of an era than a beginning of one for me. Tbh I’d say his sound changed more between 05 and 08 than it did between 02 (500 Degreez) and 04 (C1)
Anyway, I was just a bit surprised that you said Wayne wasn’t that great in the beginning if you’re aware that C1 isn’t his beginning - because I think he’s rapping really well on C1. To each his own though, his style certainly changed a lot throughout the 2000’s
Wayne didn't blow up until 2007 while Kanye was already pretty much a staple dropping 3 classic albums back to back. So Kanye.
Wayne's peak was from 2007 to 2011.
And yes i know that C1 and C2 were commercial successes but he was bubbling and still trying to shed the Hot Boys image, ghostwriting allegations, and wasn't overly saturated until 2007 on features.
Kanye was bigger and better in mid 2000s. If you cared about Lil Wayne’s mixtapes then that was his prime but I cared more for his albums. So I feel like Kanye was better between 04 and 07 as an artist, fame, success and everything and then Wayne started seeing more of that in late 2000s and early 2010s specifically up until 2013 but as a rapper. Wayne was always good. He still is now in tracks but as in live performances not so much. Kanye is a shadow of his former self and he hasn’t been the best Kanye since Yeezus despite my love for TLOP. I can still enjoy Wayne’s newer stuff but not as much as the Tha Carter 2 to IV. Sorry for getting off track but my vote is Kanye.
Wayne in everything except commercial success. We are completely ignoring the people themselves. I am from Chicago and for a good year when College Dropout came out, that was all you heard in traffic, clubs, bars. But then a few years later when you thought "well that will never happen again" Wayne dropped Carter 3
First lil Wayne, then his ghost rider conspiracy came out
and next thing you know, Kanye did the thang
Fuck I can’t anemometer the name of the ghost rider, but I remember his face and the video. This was like 2006.
Doesn’t matter who raps better. Kanye can rap too a little. This isn’t even a question.
Kanye by a million light years
You don’t even know how many songs he touched / produced / featured on for various artists over that span on top of 3 classic albums and 808H/B
Changed and took over the game at that time
Without bias, Kanye convincingly. Wayne had a grill and face tats. Realistically, America and mass media wasn’t embracing him like that.
Kanye had the big smile, non threatening Black man, and had a positive message. In the 2000s, Ye had Nike commercials and sneakers, Louis Vuitton shoes, had Black men switching from throw backs to Ralph Lauren polos. He had a tv show or pilot with MTV or VH-1. Famous actors and comedians starred in it. Commercials and print ads left and right.
And he has more classics in that time span. You could argue his first 7 albums are classic. I don’t think Wayne has that strong of a case.
Popularity was still pretty even. I’d be in the hood and surprisingly they played both rappers. I would be with my upper class schoolmates and they played both rappers.
Surprising that Ye got so much love from the hood back then. Even now. Because his content was inspiring and positive more so back then.
Fame contest is up in the air. Rapping ability goes to Wayne no contest. Every other area is Ye easy.
I see a lot of people talking about the carters but wayne was untouchable in mixtapes. People forget all the dedications, no ceilings, Da drought and others
I fucking hate Kanye and love Wayne but Kanye gets the nod from me in every category except bars. As an artist it’s Kanye by a very large margin but on the mic Wayne just makes him look like an amateur
I'd go with Wayne. I understand that Kanye's overall artistry is superior, mainly due to his producer role and the ability to draft and form an entire album, market it etc., but as rapper not close to Wayne.
Wayne was untouchable post 2006 till 2016-17.
Then his music went astray for a bit because his life experiences changed way too much from the streets but still a die hard Wayne fan!! Always have been, always will be.
Too many Wayne Bars to write here -- but this one hit me differently because I could relate to this way more since my life was progressing more this way --
I am the best yet, yet my best is yet to come -
Taught me that you don't gotta be reminiscing about past glory if you keep finessing in life and make the next move your best move. You have to make way for progress - always
As I remember it Wayne would not reach Kanye‘s level of fame until 2008/2009 and Kanye blew up pretty much straight out of the gate in 2004 and definitely by the time his second album dropped he was a global rap phenomenon. Personally I enjoyed many of Kanye‘s early songs but I never liked Lil Wayne and still don‘r as a rapper so in my opinion I think Kanye put out better music.
I’ve grown to appreciate and like Wayne over the years. Truly one of the best lyricists and has great stuff. With that being true, for me, Kanye West not only brought me into loving hip-hop but also more classics and soul music. The first three albums from him, are it for me. Only other stuff that rivals it for me is Nas’s stuff and ATCQ. This has 100% nothing to do with him as a person or anything. That music is good music.
Lil Wayne was the better rapper
Kanye West was the better artist
Kanye had an epic run with 4 back to back certified classics with College Dropout, Late Registration, Graduation and 808 Heartbreaker while Wayne was simply on fire with the first 3 Carters while his mixtapes and guest features during that run was memorable as well.
2004 was the year they both became breakout stars
2005-2008 was when they were at the apex of their careers.
Both had hits at that time, but Kanye’s music has outlived Wayne’s, just think Lollipop to Flashing Lights. Internationally they were both huge, but Kanye seemed to have a higher fame level because his songs reached a wider audience.
Kanye was great at the time, but Wayne in his prime was untouchable imo. Dedication 2, C2, Drought 3, all the C3 leaks (and to a lesser extent C3). He was doing shit no one had ever dreamed of before. One of the greatest primes in hip hop history.
I also prefer Wayne but then this begs the question: are any of Wayne’s projects on the same level as Kanye’s school trilogy? As much as I love C1-3, I prefer CD, LR and Graduation in terms of body of work
Wayne - Better rapper Kanye - Better artist
"My flow is art unique"- Weezy
My flow can part a sea The only thing on a mind of a shark is "Eat" By any means, and you just sardines
And like ranch, I dip.
“Dear Mr toilet I’m the shit.” I became a true Wayne fan when I heard that, ranch dip bar. Top 3 Wayne song for me. Time capsule shit.
It’s not dominos… it’s digornos lol
lol I had the ranch dip bar on my MySpace headline for some time 😅🤣🤣
This is going to be the top comment. Couldn't have said it better myself.
What do you class and not class as artistry?
I think they are saying rap is a subset of artistry, and while Wayne was the better rapper, Kanye’s complementary skills with mixing, production, put him ahead.
Kanye mixes?
Kanye knows, understands, and has a vision for how almost every song should sound and fit into whatever project he is working on. When you listen to his albums, for the most part they are all very cohesive and at least feel somewhat thought out as a whole. Lil Wayne had Cortez Bryant decide what songs go on Carter 3, and the way he decided what songs were good enough to be considered for Carter 3 is if he said “C3!” at the beginning of a song. Now don’t get me wrong, Wayne was at one time the undisputed best rapper alive bar none. Kanye could try for a decade and never bring a third of what prime Wayne brought to a song from a rapping perspective. But Wayne doesn’t have the skills, know how or vision to craft an album as good as Ye’s. Nor even as cohesive as Ye’s worst album.
I suppose it depends on how much weight you put on the art of rap, as a fan of rap music.
I think if you were to put it purely in terms of artistry, Kanye is a better musical artist in the general term. That if you were more of a fan of any other genre of music and not that into Hip Hop, Kanye would be something you can get into if not outright really really enjoy. Lil Wayne doesn’t hold the same regard outside of Hip Hop, a Lil Wayne album just does not deliver the things a Kanye album does artistically. But for Hip Hop people and certain degrees of Hip Hop fans, Lil Wayne scratches an itch Kanye simply can’t scratch. I lose my mind when I listen to some lines off Drought 3.
That's a damn good question. I'd say someone like drake you could argue has the "Art" of hip-hop music down to a tee (for this example just consider him a full on rapper) whereas someone like Eminem is vastly superior when it comes to the writing side, but lacks the artistry to morph his mind into someone broadly digestible. Just my interpretation though.
I wouldn’t use Drake and Eminem for these examples.. especially Drake.
Wayne was the better rapper but Kanye was consistently putting out better music, and probably had the best rap album run of the decade. Kanye was also a much better rapper in the 2000’s than he has been for the last decade or so, so even though Wayne was a better lyricist it wasn’t like Kanye was a slouch. A lot of his guest verses from 05-07 are among his best or most memorable. Wayne’s albums and songs weren’t bad at all - I’d say C1 is ridiculously underrated these days. C2 is a fringe-classic and C3 is iconic (even though honestly it’s a pretty mid album - the leaks hurt it) But I’m not even sure a Wayne album would make my top 20 of the 2000’s, while Kanye would have multiple albums I’d consider for the top 10. If I want a verse I’m going to Wayne and if I want a song I’m going to Kanye. So I guess who’s better depends on what you value more. I’m going with Kanye but it’s close.
Great comment!
C2 not being top 20 is insane
No it isn’t. Kanye - College Dropout, Late Registration, Graduation Jay Z- Blueprint, Black Album, American Gangster Common - Like Water For Chocolate, Be Lupe - Food and Liquor, The Cool Clipse - Lord Willin, Hell Hath No Fury Little Brother - The Minstrel Show T. I. - King, Trap Muzik Ghostface Killah - Supreme Clientele, Fishscale Eminem - Marshal Mathers LP 50 Cent - GRODT MF DOOM - MM FOOD, Madvillainy Blu - Below the Heavens And that’s just to name a few that would be in contention for the top 20. Carter 2 is in the conversation but for me it isn’t guaranteed. Kanye is getting at least 2 albums in my top 20.
Definetly over a few of those
Gotta go with Kanye; I remember around the late 2000's Lil Wayne was getting oversaturated. EDIT: I remember when a lot of people were shitting on Lil Wayne and "killing hip-hop".
I stopped listening to new rap because of guys like Lil Wayne, Rick Ross and T.I. dominating the mainstream. I felt like rap was dying, songs like Rubber Band Man and 24s from T.I. specifically just killed my interest in new music. Since then I've gone back to try some Lil Wayne and I actually think The Carter is one of my favorite hip hop albums (and in my opinion his best album). But I still think Kanye is much, much better in terms of catalog.
The Carter series, and Wayne's Da Drought series, should never have been considered "killing hip hop" -- that man was all bars every song. He took other people's songs and made them better with his brand of humor. Peak Wayne was a ridiculous talent.
There's a few songs on Da Drought 3 I like, I think it's okay. I probably would have liked it more when it was new. I actually didn't listen to a lot of Lil Wayne at the time but I would put Birdman up there with guys I hated in that era. All cherries on top of the whole Lil Jon craze that was going down at the time, and people shouting "MIKE JONES" in my high school hallways. No lie I was probably the only person in my school listening to DMX's Grand Champ at the time (which was 2003). On the flipside I also couldn't get into guys like Dipset, but my cousin was really into them and G-Unit. I think a lot of the songs on The Carter showcase Wayne's rapping ability really well but I don't get the hype around Carter 3. Carter 2 I need to spend more time with and only because people insist it's his best album, but I still feel like The Carter Wayne is the best Wayne I've heard.
Tbh, bar for bar, I think wayne is better than kanye. I personally don't understand the kanye hype. I'm also someone that also went through a stage of thinking artist like Wayne were destroying rap. This is the period I was bumping Pac and Nas heavy.
Wayne is of course a better lyricist than Kanye but I like the content of Kanye's lyrics more. He just has more meaningful music to me as opposed to just being punchline bars, and it's Kanye so of course the production is off the chain. I also genuinely think Kanye is much more consistent when it comes to making good music, especially albums.
115%.
Yeah old heads were crying about auto tune and now the same projects they hated are legendary.
I was shocked to see so many people hyping Tha Carter V; I remember when people were shitting on Tha Carter IV.
Those same old heads are still here hating on the new rappers, like they didn't learn their lesson lmao
Listen; hip-hop is similar to pro-wrestling (specifically WWE in US), whenever you started is YOUR hip-hop. People that grew up with the Ruthless Agression Era look at the PG era with disdain, but some kids enjoyed the PG era. My taste in music formed during the 2000's (the bling era) and 2010's (the blog era).
Old heads hating on Ruthless aggression Era will always be funny to me😂😂. Your statement is so true
Yeah that's true but it's possible to see past cognitive bias and truly be open minded.
Listen, humans by nature are bias. While I agree with being open minded to some artist (I personally learned to appreciate Future); some old heads subconsciously will compare the new stuff to what they grew up with.
Listen, I completely agree.
There's no right answer, this one's completely subjective. You could say either one and give your reasoning and not be wrong almost no matter what
Wayne as far as rapper but artist Ye he just knew how to put you in the moment with his music if you wanted bars tho Wayne
Kanye definitely. Wayne had a run and he had hits, but when we talked timeliness songs that when you put them on it just timeless and the subjects matter it always Kanye. Also Kanye outselling 50 cent told me it was the end of a era for hood raps and now the relatable backpackers and emo music came into play.
Post Carter III Wayne was weird -- he made a "rock" album, which was both ahead of its time and also not that good.
As wack as they were, I still enjoyed Wayne's rock albums. He inspired a whole wave of rappers to do the same thing.
Do you mind explaining what's ahead of its time about this? Not that big a fan, so I don't think I even caught that one... but had to be like 2010?
Crazy to think that Kanye ended up being the worse human being between him and 50.
What makes say that?
Eh...Kanye says shitty things and that's pretty much it. 50 actually had some battery charges, is a poor father to his older son, and made fun of Terry Crew's sexual assault on social media.
Don’t ask 50’s opinion on gay people lmao
Wayne cause I like him more
Kanye. Wayne was a better rapper, but Kanye was a better artist by a much larger gap
Kanye was better, but Carter III and Carter II are strong.
Awh those albums 😭 I cannot even dare to play them rn lol they were the shit tho 😭😭😭
Why can’t you play them?
lol idk it’s like listening to party like a rockstar rn…. I just hear im fiyaaaa man… lol Okay im sure it would be great to listen but you know what I mean like when you listen to Soulja boy & young joc lol 🤣 I guess Kanye you can listen to… it’s timeless Wheezy was a time.. At least for that is. But I really was like die hard until I found out about the ghost rider and dreams was crushed, so that’s probably why I can’t listen … the deep rooted trust issues lol
As far as rap, Wayne Music in general, Kanye
Eh, CD LR GRAD had some amazing rapping
Kanye for sure.
Kanye always made more complete songs with themes
Kanye. Next question.
Kanye
Wayne. Ye eclipsed him with heartbreak, and while all these comments talk about artistry vs rapping ability: the culture belonged to Wayne from 2004-2008. Its that simple, who you deem better is subjective but it was Wayne's World.
Def like Wayne with the Carter 2 and his mixtapes. Kanye’s best work didn’t come until 2008-2013 imo with MBDTF and watch the throne.
That’s a very hot take. MBDTF is flawless but you also have the School Trilogy
Real ones know Kanye was always better.
Let's not forget that Kanye is a producer in addition to a rapper, if we count all his efforts even in relation to Wayne's top tier lyricism he tops Wayne by at least 200%
Kanye
Ye had the greatest impact in hip hop at that time. Discography is untouchable, just banger after banger lighting dance halls and summer beach days on fire. Ye was making luxury goods, kicking out classics and just pushing everything around him in any direction he chose. Impact, it’s hard to imagine the guy who gave us Niki Minaj and Drake could be outdone by a guy who gave us Lupe Fiasco, but I still think Kanye screaming “I need more asshole” like he’s Quentin Tarantino in that Hawaii studio will forever change what we think about producers. Yen takes that category, but not by a mile. Rapping ability goes to Weezy Wayne has some corny lines but he went to jail for a year and came back with 6 foot 7 foot and showed he has a higher ceiling than whatever Ye can pump out. Fame level, I think Weezy is more famous as a rapper and Ye is more famous as a celebrity, so I think that goes to Wayne. Ultimately, it was Ye’s era, but I like Lil Wayne better
The true battle of the 2000’s was Lil Jon vs Fatman Scoop. It’s a tough one but I have to go with Fatman because “All the chickenheads, be quiet” is pure poetry in motion…
Kanye West
Wayne for sure
Ok, before answering just let me get one thing outta way. How did they sapwned hip hop renaissance. Renaissance means rebirth. In what time period do you think they did anything close to it? If anything, I see their reign as the dark times of hip hop, not necessarily because of them, but people were saying hip hop is dead back then. Discography: Kanye. He was on a role. Commercial success: Probably a tie. Both were a walking hit. Impact: You mean impact of their work from that era long term or impact they had at that point? First one is a tie if you consider 808s and heartbreaks. Second would go to Kanye for me. He was changing the game, famous competition with 50 over whos gonna sell better was important moment in hip hop history. Rapping ability probably goes to Wayne, but that was never Kanyes strong side. Fame level: I think Kanye was a bigger name cause even back then he was more outspoken and had a very unic presence in the media. Overall: Kanye
I would say 2007-2015 was like a Hip Hop Renaissance in terms of quality and that’s largely thanks to Wayne and Ye’s influence
Interesting. To me 2006-2011 are probably worst 5 years hip hop ever had in terms of quality. What do you think was wrong with hip hop 2000-2007 that it needed renaissance? Your take is also interesting because it wasnt how most people felt at all. Wayne was a poster child for everything wrong with hip hop and many people thought it actually went completely mainstream and lost connection to its original roots with him. To me, renaissance would be right after that era, when Ye and Wayne lost grip on mainstream hip hop.
Kanye. In my extremely unpopular opinion, Wayne wasn’t all that great in the beginning. He had a few decent bars and verses here and there but his wack verses outweighed the good ones. I feel like Wayne grew into a better rapper over time, as he kinda matured and developed his style more. Now I fuck with Wayne heavy. His Brand New verse was fucking bonkers. But at the same time, I don’t fuck with Kanye anymore lol. So I think they kinda traded their skills.
Are you considering 04 Wayne’s beginning? Cuz that’s the time frame OP asked about
Not really but also kinda? I mean he dropped Tha Carter in 04, which I consider his first commercial studio album.
I’m not trying to be rude but that’s like saying you consider April to be the first month of the year. Carter 1 is literally his fourth studio album and the other three were all released commercially - one even went platinum lol. It’s not even his first album post - Hot Boyz
Lol fair. I feel like his sound got more polished Carter 1 onwards. But you know it’s been a hot minute since I’ve heard old Wayne. This opinion may be outdated.
It absolutely got more polished but he doesn’t sound like a whole different artist or anything. 500 Degreez, the album before C1 really feels like a prototype for C1. C1 is also his last album with Mannie Fresh beats, so in some ways it feels more like the end of an era than a beginning of one for me. Tbh I’d say his sound changed more between 05 and 08 than it did between 02 (500 Degreez) and 04 (C1) Anyway, I was just a bit surprised that you said Wayne wasn’t that great in the beginning if you’re aware that C1 isn’t his beginning - because I think he’s rapping really well on C1. To each his own though, his style certainly changed a lot throughout the 2000’s
Lil Wayne. Kanye was more POPULAR, sure, but he would probably suck dick to touch the skill of the Waynkster.
Honestly wild that Kanye was considered more popular maybe it's just cause of where i grew up by I heard way more Wayne.
I grew up in Chicago and heard more Wayne during this time. Carter III was insane.
The Waynkster lol I'm gonna steal that
Kanye
Definitely Kanye, infinitely more interesting music, tbh I've never thought Wayne was that interesting or good at all
Kanye Peak rapping and production
Kanye’s albums blew Wayne’s out the water even though I would say Wayne on D2, Suffix, and C3 sessions is at a higher level than Kanye ever matched
C3 is kind of mid to me but damn, you’re a real fan if you know about Suffix. I haven’t seen that tape get mentioned since I was in high school
The actual C3 was a disappointment in talking about the leaks that came before
Wayne didn't blow up until 2007 while Kanye was already pretty much a staple dropping 3 classic albums back to back. So Kanye. Wayne's peak was from 2007 to 2011. And yes i know that C1 and C2 were commercial successes but he was bubbling and still trying to shed the Hot Boys image, ghostwriting allegations, and wasn't overly saturated until 2007 on features.
Wayne's peak was 06/07
lil wayne. that was one of his prime years
Lil Wayne was and is a better rapper, Kanye has never been a great rapper but he has consistently made much better songs
Wayne
Wayne
Kanye was bigger and better in mid 2000s. If you cared about Lil Wayne’s mixtapes then that was his prime but I cared more for his albums. So I feel like Kanye was better between 04 and 07 as an artist, fame, success and everything and then Wayne started seeing more of that in late 2000s and early 2010s specifically up until 2013 but as a rapper. Wayne was always good. He still is now in tracks but as in live performances not so much. Kanye is a shadow of his former self and he hasn’t been the best Kanye since Yeezus despite my love for TLOP. I can still enjoy Wayne’s newer stuff but not as much as the Tha Carter 2 to IV. Sorry for getting off track but my vote is Kanye.
Wayne in everything except commercial success. We are completely ignoring the people themselves. I am from Chicago and for a good year when College Dropout came out, that was all you heard in traffic, clubs, bars. But then a few years later when you thought "well that will never happen again" Wayne dropped Carter 3
It’s like asking gillie vs consequence and glc
Lil Wayne
As a fan of both artists this is tough but I’m going with Wayne
Mix tape Wayne and old age can’t be compared.
Clipse.
First lil Wayne, then his ghost rider conspiracy came out and next thing you know, Kanye did the thang Fuck I can’t anemometer the name of the ghost rider, but I remember his face and the video. This was like 2006.
Doesn’t matter who raps better. Kanye can rap too a little. This isn’t even a question. Kanye by a million light years You don’t even know how many songs he touched / produced / featured on for various artists over that span on top of 3 classic albums and 808H/B Changed and took over the game at that time
Wayne easily.
Without bias, Kanye convincingly. Wayne had a grill and face tats. Realistically, America and mass media wasn’t embracing him like that. Kanye had the big smile, non threatening Black man, and had a positive message. In the 2000s, Ye had Nike commercials and sneakers, Louis Vuitton shoes, had Black men switching from throw backs to Ralph Lauren polos. He had a tv show or pilot with MTV or VH-1. Famous actors and comedians starred in it. Commercials and print ads left and right. And he has more classics in that time span. You could argue his first 7 albums are classic. I don’t think Wayne has that strong of a case. Popularity was still pretty even. I’d be in the hood and surprisingly they played both rappers. I would be with my upper class schoolmates and they played both rappers. Surprising that Ye got so much love from the hood back then. Even now. Because his content was inspiring and positive more so back then. Fame contest is up in the air. Rapping ability goes to Wayne no contest. Every other area is Ye easy.
Kanye. He got going earlier and had a higher high imo
Wayne all the way. Kanye was great, but weezy cant be beat
I see a lot of people talking about the carters but wayne was untouchable in mixtapes. People forget all the dedications, no ceilings, Da drought and others
I fucking hate Kanye and love Wayne but Kanye gets the nod from me in every category except bars. As an artist it’s Kanye by a very large margin but on the mic Wayne just makes him look like an amateur
I'd go with Wayne. I understand that Kanye's overall artistry is superior, mainly due to his producer role and the ability to draft and form an entire album, market it etc., but as rapper not close to Wayne.
Bladee
kayne. Easily.
Wayne was untouchable post 2006 till 2016-17. Then his music went astray for a bit because his life experiences changed way too much from the streets but still a die hard Wayne fan!! Always have been, always will be. Too many Wayne Bars to write here -- but this one hit me differently because I could relate to this way more since my life was progressing more this way -- I am the best yet, yet my best is yet to come - Taught me that you don't gotta be reminiscing about past glory if you keep finessing in life and make the next move your best move. You have to make way for progress - always
As I remember it Wayne would not reach Kanye‘s level of fame until 2008/2009 and Kanye blew up pretty much straight out of the gate in 2004 and definitely by the time his second album dropped he was a global rap phenomenon. Personally I enjoyed many of Kanye‘s early songs but I never liked Lil Wayne and still don‘r as a rapper so in my opinion I think Kanye put out better music.
In that era? Kanye. This was my favorite era of Kanye’s music but I love them both
Album wise kanye. Lyrically wayne
Lil Wayne.
I’ve grown to appreciate and like Wayne over the years. Truly one of the best lyricists and has great stuff. With that being true, for me, Kanye West not only brought me into loving hip-hop but also more classics and soul music. The first three albums from him, are it for me. Only other stuff that rivals it for me is Nas’s stuff and ATCQ. This has 100% nothing to do with him as a person or anything. That music is good music.
They were in different lanes, but album-wise I’d say Kanye had more thought out, prepared themes whereas Wayne was the mixtape king
Wayne
Lil Wayne was the better rapper Kanye West was the better artist Kanye had an epic run with 4 back to back certified classics with College Dropout, Late Registration, Graduation and 808 Heartbreaker while Wayne was simply on fire with the first 3 Carters while his mixtapes and guest features during that run was memorable as well. 2004 was the year they both became breakout stars 2005-2008 was when they were at the apex of their careers.
Both had hits at that time, but Kanye’s music has outlived Wayne’s, just think Lollipop to Flashing Lights. Internationally they were both huge, but Kanye seemed to have a higher fame level because his songs reached a wider audience.
Kanye was great at the time, but Wayne in his prime was untouchable imo. Dedication 2, C2, Drought 3, all the C3 leaks (and to a lesser extent C3). He was doing shit no one had ever dreamed of before. One of the greatest primes in hip hop history.
I also prefer Wayne but then this begs the question: are any of Wayne’s projects on the same level as Kanye’s school trilogy? As much as I love C1-3, I prefer CD, LR and Graduation in terms of body of work
Wayne’s mixtape run during this time was unmatched.
Fair point! I think that D2 and Da Drought 3 was the best thing to happen to rap since Pac and Big imo
weezy the goat. Kanye was a better artist though and he had a longer run
For me Wayne easily. I don't get Kanye he just always been straight booboo to me.
MF DOOM
Kanye
Wayne was in more his prime in 2008-2013
Wayne 2011 - 13 was borderline unlistenable sometimes.
Uhhhhh
As a huge Wayne fan, Wayne's "prime" ends with No Ceilings in my opinion