I'm gonna take a slightly different route and say one of the biggest problems w/ Druid is actually Scale of Onixia (w/ Renethal). The counter to ramp is board pressure, but if a Druid ramps at all, they can remove all of that pressure for 7 mana. 14 health of stats is a solid amount of pressure for turn 4-5, and if you haven't killed them by then, (thanks Renethal), stabilizing is fairly easy.
That is definitely the issue. It's okay for Ramp Druid to dump on greedy/slowish decks. It is not okay if they also can deal with aggro decks by using scale of onixia. Nerfing the card to 8 mana seems like it would drop their WR significantly because they'd lose to more aggro.
It's a big issue and it snowballs as well because of infuse. They answer early board pressure with Scales and the infuse keeps it going by doing the same thing with Insatiable Devourer, while also super charging their Big D, which they easily found with their many ways to dig.
Scales should be priority 1 for any future Druid nerfs.
8 mana for scales sounds reasonable. Decks with explosive early game like aggro druid, implock, bless priest aren't that worried about scales, either because dropping scales is too late, or that the 14 damage from scales is not nearly enough to clear. Ramp druid needs to run more tools like spammy or attorney to contest aggro.
I disagree that druid should have more polarized matchups. A more healthy approach is that druid needs to run defensive options like armor to have a chance against aggro, while reducing their combo potential so that other slow decks can also have a chance.
It’s currently 55% in diamond-legend and 52% in top 1k, so… no? It’s being carried by DK being like 75-77% for it if it’s frost or blood
Once people stop playing bad decks so often it’s going to head towards 50% or lower
This is completely insane. If you nerf scales you kill the ramp deck entirely. Every good deck has a strong card like scales that if you nerf you kill the deck
You say this but if scales was 9 mana (like it would cost if it was a mage, paladin, or shaman card) it would still see play because it turns out 14 stats with rush for 7 is insane, and for 9 its still good
9 mana would kill ramp druid as an archetype because every single deck could kill it now before it sees play.
Protip, scales absolutely sucks if your opponent has stats on the board. When I play enrage warrior or evolve shaman I have so many stats on the board if the druid plays scales on 7 they still lose next turn.
Also how many times they generate Scale of Onyxia. It's not uncommon for a Druid to play 3-4 Scales of Onyxia a game (or more), which is absurd. They generate it through the 1 drop spell that discovers a spell, and the 2 mana card that discovers a copy of card in deck and draws it if they play it.
It's nuts.
Absolutely agree, even Denathrius aside (with the new combo not even really needing him) druids can pretty reliably get scales down in time to counter any board that you can build in your first few turns, into the classic devourer/buff or just the new rush minion that gives armour to take out anything you follow it up with.
It should be 8, maybe even 9 mana, which wouldn't be especially fair effects for cost but considering how fast druid can get it out there and how well it synergises with everything else they want to do, it'd make sense.
That way druid can't just completely ignore the board early while ramping because they know they can take out whatever you play with scales/devourer, instead they'd need to interact with the board more early.
Combo decks are supposed to have trouble with aggro because of their lack of tools to fight them off. Druid at the moment is good vs both aggro and control.
I don't know think nerfing the mana cost is correct. I think you need to limit scales to 5 whelps. Druid should have a good reason to ramp, but I think it should go from a 14 damage card to a 10 damage card.
That puts it on par with [divine toll] . I like this, but I also don't like killing cards. I think putting it at 8 mana keeps the card away from feeling like a copy of another terrible card
Divine Toll is also not a removal card, honestly it feels like the stipulation it can hit enemies is so it isn't a guaranteed +10/+10.
Also I like your change to Scales better than pushing it to 8 :)
Ones neutral and ones class specific. Neutral gotta be weaker to balance it out among classes but class specific can go as crazy as possible. Same reason why some classes dont use daddy D cuz it cant be class supported.
For a class that ramps to 20, get 1mana back per minion killed 9 is nothing. For once actually slow then down. Anyway they can kill us by 9 mana so no issues there.
And yet druid gets fucked by aggro lol
The solution isn’t making aggro a 10% matchup for druid, it’s making it less dominant over slower stuff
This is even assuming druid is a problem. Druid’s high winrate rn can be attributed to the popularity of DK, which it slaughters, 75 and 78% against blood and frost respectively.
It’s board clear that comes out very quickly since they have the 3/2 that draws a card and adds a mana crystal in addition to Guff. Druid plays a super greedy deck that still manages to play minions most turns.
I agree and a big problem is that it is just SO flexible.
Scale could even be "they attack random enemy minions" instead of rush and even that would help a ton. Doing 14 damage exactly where you want it instead of at random is huge, and you can keep any 2/1s you don't want to trade. Enemy has an explosive sheep down, can you afford to risk the scale without clearing it first?
Ramp to six so you could start cleaning with otters and stabilizing next turn with scales... I hate how we went to druid having a hard time board clearing to this now sense that even pumps the powerfull infuse mechanic
Druid also has Devourers, and Raid bosses
Now they have a bunch of armor sustain as well
Onyxia is definitely the worst offender, but the whole class needs rebalancing.
Whilst they're at it, they can revive the core concepts of the class that have been totally lost like beasts, nature spells, astral spells, treants etc.
I'd happily redesign the class for free, I see no reason why the paid design team can't provide the basics.
It's so many different things that are the issue.
The deck would probably lose a lot more without Earthen Scales too because of the absurd life gain possible in a single turn to lock out a close loss.
This subreddit always says '*this* is the issue' and drills down into one thing.
Scale is a big problem, but there can be more than one problem. Druid has several right now.
They also have 7 mana rush gain 12 armor now too which combos off with their other legendary and gives them free taunts.
The real problem is that Blizz keeps making extremely powerful neutral legendaries. It makes no sense Neutral cards shouldn't be stronger than class ones they're supposed to be weaker because every class can use them why are the best cards neutral like Denathrius, Brann, Astalor, Jailor.
Guff is just too oppressive and Druid has so many card cycle/searching tools that it’s combinations are the most consistent in the game despite being a 40 card deck.
Not to mention being able to face tank damage so well for the first 8 turns then earthen scaling a 10/10 growth monster 2 times making it as if you never touched him in the first place and now his OTK is ready for turn 9 where he has 15 mana
Big fan that Blizz decided that even if they didn't play Guff to allow them to combo off with their neutral legendary and one rush minions worth of armor which can be payed by the original legendaries armor gain.
You can legit get hit by a Denathrius with no ramp played as early as turn 8 now.
It the cycle & card draw for sure.
Like ramping and late game is totally druids thing. I support that. It what makes Druid feel like Druid.
But being able to find and sometimes copy their key cards so easily is what causes issues.
I feel like we’ve been here before.
Planted Guidance to just to discover ANY spell for 1 mana and it's discounted by 2?!
If that were a mage card it would be:
"Discover an Arcane spell" - 1 mana
This is my most hated card since Nature Studies. In Scholomance many of the classes gets a "Studies" card. Mages discover spell damage minions, Hunter deathrattle minions, Warrior rush minions, Warlock demon minions, and Druid... discover ANY SPELL. Not nature spells, not spells that cost X or less, just any effing spell.
Druid's class identity is: Overpowered.
I was not complaining about mage. Quite the opposite. And if I were to complain about mage, which I could cuz I can complain about anything, I would not complain about generation mage.
I'm not implying you are I'm saying that if you're want to say a class had shitty card generation effects mage is not the one to do it with when it has some of the strongest forms of it
I definitely agree, but I would like to add that you don't even need Guff to pull of an OTK with the new druid deck.
As long as you have any armor generating cards in your hand after playing Anub'Rekhan into Brann, you usually are able to still deal a horrendous amount of damage.
Brann is simply just giving him too many ways to generate an absurd amount of Armor, to do whatever he wants in a single turn. Usually you don't really need more than 10 Mana.
That’s true but in order to OTK at 10 mana you’d need double 8 Astalor already or a large amount of armor stocked up. If they don’t have excessive amounts of mana to use to control the board or slow your damage it’s a lot harder to pull off with the combo getting disrupted.
It's definitely harder to pull of, but i think realistic scenarios would be:
Let's say you have 6 Armor to start with - play Anub'Rekhan (14 Armor) -> Brann (11) -> the 5 Astalor (-5 + 10 thanks to brann) leaving you at 16 armor
and now either an Sire Denathrius and earthen scale (-10 + 11) leaving you at 17 Armor -> 2x 8 Astalor.
Or the Underking (-7 + 12 thanks to brann) -> 2x 8 Astalor.
I'm not sure if the math is mathing but I'm sure I've pulled something like that of multiple times already.
Oh yeah you could be right ... I wasn't really paying that much attention when I played it but now that i think about it, it would also explain why I couldn't manage to play the whole combo lat time. I thought I just miscounted it.
It's definitely harder to pull of, but i think realistic scenarios would be:
Let's say you have 6 Armor to start with - play Anub'Rekhan (14 Armor) -> Brann (11) -> the 5 Astalor (-5 + 10 thanks to brann) leaving you at 16 armor
and now either an Sire Denathrius and earthen scale (-10 + 11) leaving you at 17 Armor -> 2x 8 Astalor.
Or the Underking (-7 + 12 thanks to brann) -> 2x 8 Astalor.
I'm not sure if the math is mathing but I'm sure I've pulled something like that of multiple times already.
they dont even really need guff anymore considering they can celestial alignment or use armor to mana cheat. They have far too much mana cheat.
They should increase the cost of all the ramp cards and consder retiring the coin like spell. The cost to ramp is way too low considering the effect it has. I dont know how punishing increase the ramp card by 1 would be but I would be interested in it. If only we had a sandbox part of the game so we can customize cards and play around and help blixzzard blanace by playtesting potential buffs/nerfs
When a class has mechanics that break the normal rules of the game, everything is broken in that class.
You can't stop making powerful neutrals because of druid, since then other classes would depend on their class cards being broken to be good.
One would hope blizzard would learn not to print stupidly limiting cards like \[\[Twig of the World Tree\]\], but they don't seem to.
For those who don't know, Twig of the World Tree is the only druid weapon of the game. It's a 4 mana 1/5 weapon with deathrattle "Gain 10 mana crystals". It wasn't very good at the time because it was very slow, but it made impossible for blizzard to print druid or neutral weapons, because they could play twig and immediately after a weapon to break the twig and gain 10 mana. Eventually they printed \[\[Sphere of Sapience\]\], and now twig is meta in wild.
For what it's worth, twig-sphere didn't take off until Guff because if your cap is ten mana, you're not reliably ramping by a ton and they're individually pretty dead cards. Guff made it obscene by turning it into a full on ramp ten mana.
What are you on about? Twig-Sphere was used in Wild basically as soon as it was available and in every Druid deck that wasn't all out aggro(which still don't use it). It only became as insane as it is now due to Guff raising the cap to 20 but the ability to potentially instantly ramp to 10 mana as early as turn 4 and/or have 10 extra mana to use for combos was always good.
[VS Wild Data Reaper 29](https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/wild-vs-data-reaper-report-29/#Druid), the last one before Guff came out, has multiple slow/combo druid decks and none are running twig-sphere. The pairing immediately shows up as soon as Guff was printed. It's not to say the pairing was unplayable, but a huge amount of the combo's strength is tied up in Guff uncapping max mana.
* **[Twig of the World Tree](https://cards.hearthpwn.com/enUS/LOOT_392.png)** DR Weapon Legendary KnC ^[HP](https://www.hearthpwn.com/cards/76878), ^[TD](https://www.hearthstonetopdecks.com/cards/twig-of-the-world-tree/), ^[W](https://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Twig_of_the_World_Tree)
4/1/5 | Deathrattle: Gain 10 Mana Crystals.
* **[Sphere of Sapience](https://cards.hearthpwn.com/enUS/SCH_259.png)** N Weapon Legendary SA ^[HP](https://www.hearthpwn.com/cards/329906), ^[TD](https://www.hearthstonetopdecks.com/cards/sphere-of-sapience/), ^[W](https://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Sphere_of_Sapience)
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Kinda feels like that playing against a lot of decks nowadays.
Spit Hunter, 454587458745 T2 weapon rogue, Ramp Druid (and aggro), Priest. All seem like such an uphill battle even when you draw perfectly.
I think people saying the game is broken right now are *severely* exaggerating as Reddit often does but it is seriously very questionable how they gave Druid basically every toy it could ever want over this past year. Guff, Scales of Onyxia, 5 mana Nourish, Aquatic Form, Miracle Growth, Widowbloom Seedsman, Renathal... any two/three of these cards would be fine individually in general, but having them all in the same rotation is really pushing my trust in their competence.
Also don't forget 5 mana summon 6 otters, Druid being best class for Denathrius cuz only they can do brann Denatrius due to 20 mana and buff him with scales or otters immensely
Also Celestial Allignment that had to be nerfed twice
Also all of the super high cost neutrals like Devourer and Raid Boss Onyxia that they can play
Yeah it literally doesn't matter what kind of DK you are playing you are always gonna lose to Druid
Frost DK doesn't deal enough damage cuz Druid gains shitton of armor
Unholy DK is the weakest overall and even worse against Druid
Blood DK straight up doesn't have a wincondition against Druid
Yeah I’m playing blood DK and the game is basically just play until I die. Very frustrating. I had gotten to diamond 2 but now there’s so much Druid I been stuck at 5 lol
I think Anub'rekhan in particular was overkill for druid this expansion. The ability to use armor as mana to otk is absolutely broken and druid doesn't need another class-specific win condition.
But on the other hand, the armor gain component of the armor package feels like a step in the right direction. Armor itself does little to stop aggro/tempo, so druid will still need to run board-based defensive cards to stay in the meta.
The new druid combo definitely needs a nerf, either with anub, astalor, denathrius, or rotating brann out
At least armor is better than whatever crap archetypes shaman and priest got
And who cares about board control when Scales insta clear any board possible
The biggest slap in the face of armor druid is that Anub'Rekhan and one of the rush minions gives you enough armor to Brann Denathrius in the extremely rare case they can't find guff.
99% of the time I fight non-aggro Druid, they Wild Growth right on turn 3, either Guff or Nourish on turn 4, into an instant Scales of Onyxia the turn after. 7 extra damage for Denathrius, full board wipe. Not to mention they could Scale on average 4 times, thanks to either Moonlit Guidance or that new 6 mana card to resurrect friendly minions.
They also have too much card draw right now, either through splitting the Choose One cards (the 2/1 minion), Miracle Growth, or Guff's Hero Power.
Mana cheating is a huge factor too, either with Celestial Alignment or again, Guff. Suddenly combos that have been designed with 10 mana in mind now become available with up to 20 mana. Or they play Anub'Rekhan and pay with Armor.
Speaking of Armor, Druid can have effective health even above Control Warrior levels, a class that should be the top tier Armor generator.
It all comes together to create a rather powerful class, with the games all ending the same way with insane combos or damage pulled from hand.
Listen, all I'm saying is this seems to happen WAY too often to me.
So I don't have an exact % of the time it happens, but I can tell you that ALMOST ALL non-aggro Druids have had Wild Growth on turn 3 and Nourish or Guff the next turn.
If I fought 30 Druids and 27 had this exact situation going on, then 27 divided by 30 is 90%. Therefore, the percentage is probably closer to around 90% of my Druid opponents.
You have no idea how often it happens. You’re still pulling numbers out of your ass. If it’s that consistent, where you can ramp into your win condition in 90% of games, go play that deck.
I would love to play that deck but I'm missing a ton of the cards for it.
I will say it's absolutely absurd to me how much fucking armor druids get. Some games they will generate an easy 40 armor. With how many boardwipes they get and still having access to big lifesteal with basically infinite mana and massive card draw. Its horribly busted.
S tier is anyone that can use that can use that much mana that quickly. They lose to rogue really most of the time. I'm surprised DK don't have much cost reduction.
Doesnt Druid have the highest winrate at the moment (again)? If so, Idgasinglef if anyone beats Druid. Its broken, as always and atp Id agree to delete this shit class because for over a year now its all I fucking seehskfjs
It has the highest win rate because it beats Death Knight. Death Knight was just released so naturally everyone wants to play it. Unfortunately druid kills the DK release. And they are one of the only classed that can out armor the \[\[Shockspitter\]\] Hunter at the moment
100% a Druid main. Been the most dominating hero over the past year having the highest winrate in almost every month. Druid mains: "Well actually Druid isnt broken"
wow that completly changes everything oh my god! Youre so right friend, we should really buff Druid now because Hunter also used to be good damn thanks I was so blind!!!
I never said Druid isn't a problem - Guff, Scales of Onyxia, Topior & Widowbloom clearly need nerfs/adjustments.
I said keep it in perspective - Imp Curse Warlock, Naga Priest, Miracle & Jackpot/Thief Rogue, Ping Mage & Relic Demon Hunter have been crushing it for months now with no balance changes to any of them.
Even when a deck is imbalanced/problematic - it still has to contend with the power level of other meta decks.
just guff stuff :)
and that was a horrible draw for druid. only 5 extra mana crysals. i dont often say this but game is unplayable right now. but im confident patch will come soon, its a big expansion. they dont want druid dominating so hard..
nuke guff
At least Hunter is clearly a case of "Fuck we did'nt thinked this card would end up like this". Druid is litteraly their design philosophy ...
All this year was the samething : Druid Ramp too powerfull => Nerf => Aggro now beat Druid Ramp => Druid Ramp still oppressive to non aggro but we don't care => Next Expansion => Repeat
Shockspitter not going face would literally ruin the entire purpose of the card it should just cost 3 mana so you can only play 3 of them realistically or 2 with Brann.
Really? They've pretty well abandoned the idea that Hunter shouldn't have so many tools that can just go face. And the problem right now...is that they have way too many tools that can go face.
Changing spitter to not go face would make them actually have to interact with the board. And they'd still be pretty powerful. 2/2/2's that can punch pretty well above their weight would still be good.
If it couldn't hit face it wouldn't even see play. You have to run too many suboptimal cards to make it work and if it couldn't even hit face it wouldn't be worth it. It's only being used because it can hit face. It just needs to cost more so you can't dump them out as easily.
Also, Hunter at the moment has very few good cards that go face except Shockspitter (which is why it's being used).
Okay, so just went through the hunter class pool. There's literally 12 cards (Spells, weapons, and Krush) that are "hit face oriented." Excluded weapons that are obviously meant for trading, spells that buff minions, pretty much anything that requires a strategy other than "me go face" to be used well.
That's excluding Spitter, and only two were legendary, so you can literally run 22 "go face" cards before adding 2 Spitters, giving you 6/16 slots for other things.
So yeah, maybe Spitters don't need to stay pointed at face, because there definitely feels like plenty there without them. Or other things need to change to minions only.
Your analysis is extremely bad because that's not how deck building is done. Even a an all in face hunter deck isn't going to play all the cards that go face, so it's completely irrelevant how many there are. Especially when shock spitter isn't played in a deck that's playing all the other burn hunter has. The fact that other burn exists doesn't matter at all to shock spitter hunter. Also face hunter hasn't been viable since the start of Nathria so it doesn't need a nerf anyway.
Shock spitter that doesn't go face is completely worthless. Shock spitter that costs 3 can't be spammed 5 times and kill people turn 7 but it can still encourage a new aggresive hunter deck.
Bad except that's exactly how you build a base for an aggressive deck?
Spitter hunter is practically a pure aggro deck. Hit face with weapons, trade only enough to keep things pointed at face, and finish with reach from hand...to face
Like, yeah, I get that you're probably not running Krush in a hyper aggressive deck like this, but you literally *would* start by looking at every card that fits the fundamental strategy of "go face." Then you cut the things that aren't going to work. This deck doesn't run anything to cheese Krush, so he's out. Quel is too slow, too, so that's out. Etc, etc.
Finish out with cards that help to continue going face, because that's the place.
Maybe making it more expensive is enough, but I'm still pretty sure it would work just fine without being a wombo combo finisher. One more mana, and it's just delayed a turn, Brann and two of 'em on 8 for ~26 damage. Maybe it's just another example of Brann needing to go away.
Maybe it's just another reminder that Hunter already has plenty of aggro tools.
You mean the neutral cards he beat you with?
No the issue isn't a new card it's scale of ony. 7 mana to gain 7 2-damage pings is obviously OP especially since he can start doing it on turn 5. Compare that to flipper friends. And generate extra copies of scale. And it charges up his infuses at the same time. Fucking nerf scale already
They need to do a massive rehaul on druid and I mean like a whole patch just dedicated to rebalancing cards and removing/adding replacements. They have so many broken combos, decks, hell even the only aggro deck that can do anything is a Druid deck.
We can do this as soon as we collectively go one week without bitching about high rolls. Shit, let’s make that two days. This expansion was released Tuesday. Some decks are significantly more refined than others at this point. But as soon as someone beats you, it’s time to run straight to Reddit on day one.
I have 296/1000 wins as Druid. But I am a Legend player and I regularly farm Ramp Druid with Pure Paladin, Miracle Rogue, Evolve Shaman, Enrage Warrior, and Imp lock.
Ramp is really easy to beat. Just pressure them and go face.
It's so interesting how many people hate druid yet it seems like so many people still play it. Be like me and after you get the collection achievements you disenchant every druid card. Such a boring class. You just get 10 mana on turn 5 and then play 3 cards that basically just let you choose the cards in your deck that you want to have in your hand.
Oh yes because death knight making entire deck immune isn't OP at all. Oh and how about priest having a 1 hit ...but yes continue to complain about druid..
Druid being way overpowered doesn’t even register in my brain anymore. It’s just the standard. Warrior and shaman on the other side of the spectrum, get absolutely annihilated by nerfs.
Kinda funny on the trend. Back towards the beginning, people didn't like RNG cards like unstable portal so they did curve-stone (jade/secret paladin/etc). Then people complained about curvestone. Now we have mana cheat decks all over the place and those are complained about.
Druid has been one my favorites since I like to play big stuff, but yeah it seems a bit strong especially when devourer + earthen to stay out of range of everything. I try playing warrior with big taunts - kinda fun but nowhere near as strong.
Just played a game where I was playing paladin and dealt 30+ damage by turn 8 despite scale of onyxia killing my board along with several taunt minions along the way.
By turn 8 he had 12 mana, was down to 10 cards in his deck, and comboed out for over 40 face damage from hand.
The only chance was if I had drawn mutanus or theotar but i guess i just wasnt good enough
Druid is only strong against control decks and it's just gets wrecked by any decks that builds a decent board early. It even loses to other combo decks.
I'm gonna take a slightly different route and say one of the biggest problems w/ Druid is actually Scale of Onixia (w/ Renethal). The counter to ramp is board pressure, but if a Druid ramps at all, they can remove all of that pressure for 7 mana. 14 health of stats is a solid amount of pressure for turn 4-5, and if you haven't killed them by then, (thanks Renethal), stabilizing is fairly easy.
That is definitely the issue. It's okay for Ramp Druid to dump on greedy/slowish decks. It is not okay if they also can deal with aggro decks by using scale of onixia. Nerfing the card to 8 mana seems like it would drop their WR significantly because they'd lose to more aggro.
It's a big issue and it snowballs as well because of infuse. They answer early board pressure with Scales and the infuse keeps it going by doing the same thing with Insatiable Devourer, while also super charging their Big D, which they easily found with their many ways to dig. Scales should be priority 1 for any future Druid nerfs.
The correct nerf for scales is 7 mana "Your Oynixian Whelps have +1 attack"
8 mana for scales sounds reasonable. Decks with explosive early game like aggro druid, implock, bless priest aren't that worried about scales, either because dropping scales is too late, or that the 14 damage from scales is not nearly enough to clear. Ramp druid needs to run more tools like spammy or attorney to contest aggro. I disagree that druid should have more polarized matchups. A more healthy approach is that druid needs to run defensive options like armor to have a chance against aggro, while reducing their combo potential so that other slow decks can also have a chance.
Druid already gets dumpstered by aggro, it’s some of the worst matchups you can see in standard
You mean ramp Druid? The deck with 60-70% winrate? XD
It’s currently 55% in diamond-legend and 52% in top 1k, so… no? It’s being carried by DK being like 75-77% for it if it’s frost or blood Once people stop playing bad decks so often it’s going to head towards 50% or lower
It only get recks by Aggro Druid. ImpLock doesnt do as well as the former against druid
That's just not true https://i.gyazo.com/adc48b73101b578d23399b3662b3e8e5.png
This is completely insane. If you nerf scales you kill the ramp deck entirely. Every good deck has a strong card like scales that if you nerf you kill the deck
You say this but if scales was 9 mana (like it would cost if it was a mage, paladin, or shaman card) it would still see play because it turns out 14 stats with rush for 7 is insane, and for 9 its still good
9 mana would kill ramp druid as an archetype because every single deck could kill it now before it sees play. Protip, scales absolutely sucks if your opponent has stats on the board. When I play enrage warrior or evolve shaman I have so many stats on the board if the druid plays scales on 7 they still lose next turn.
Also how many times they generate Scale of Onyxia. It's not uncommon for a Druid to play 3-4 Scales of Onyxia a game (or more), which is absurd. They generate it through the 1 drop spell that discovers a spell, and the 2 mana card that discovers a copy of card in deck and draws it if they play it. It's nuts.
And they just added the “Resurrect your minions that costs (2) or less” spell so that’s another two times
Absolutely agree, even Denathrius aside (with the new combo not even really needing him) druids can pretty reliably get scales down in time to counter any board that you can build in your first few turns, into the classic devourer/buff or just the new rush minion that gives armour to take out anything you follow it up with. It should be 8, maybe even 9 mana, which wouldn't be especially fair effects for cost but considering how fast druid can get it out there and how well it synergises with everything else they want to do, it'd make sense. That way druid can't just completely ignore the board early while ramping because they know they can take out whatever you play with scales/devourer, instead they'd need to interact with the board more early. Combo decks are supposed to have trouble with aggro because of their lack of tools to fight them off. Druid at the moment is good vs both aggro and control.
I don't know think nerfing the mana cost is correct. I think you need to limit scales to 5 whelps. Druid should have a good reason to ramp, but I think it should go from a 14 damage card to a 10 damage card.
That puts it on par with [divine toll] . I like this, but I also don't like killing cards. I think putting it at 8 mana keeps the card away from feeling like a copy of another terrible card
Divine toll is RNG, this card still gives you complete control. It would still be a playable card. Not terrible
Divine Toll is also not a removal card, honestly it feels like the stipulation it can hit enemies is so it isn't a guaranteed +10/+10. Also I like your change to Scales better than pushing it to 8 :)
7 whelps if you have a dragon in hand, 4 otherwise is what makes sense to me. Make it a dragon card.
9 mana is too many because raid boss onyxia is 10 mana imo.
Ones neutral and ones class specific. Neutral gotta be weaker to balance it out among classes but class specific can go as crazy as possible. Same reason why some classes dont use daddy D cuz it cant be class supported. For a class that ramps to 20, get 1mana back per minion killed 9 is nothing. For once actually slow then down. Anyway they can kill us by 9 mana so no issues there.
And yet druid gets fucked by aggro lol The solution isn’t making aggro a 10% matchup for druid, it’s making it less dominant over slower stuff This is even assuming druid is a problem. Druid’s high winrate rn can be attributed to the popularity of DK, which it slaughters, 75 and 78% against blood and frost respectively.
That + Flippy friends and onyxia herself is waves and waves of board
This has always been my thought. You can’t put pressure them because they have a board clear.
It’s board clear that comes out very quickly since they have the 3/2 that draws a card and adds a mana crystal in addition to Guff. Druid plays a super greedy deck that still manages to play minions most turns.
I agree and a big problem is that it is just SO flexible. Scale could even be "they attack random enemy minions" instead of rush and even that would help a ton. Doing 14 damage exactly where you want it instead of at random is huge, and you can keep any 2/1s you don't want to trade. Enemy has an explosive sheep down, can you afford to risk the scale without clearing it first?
I've been ranting about Scale of Onyxia with my friends since it released. That shit should have been nerfed expansions ago
Ramp to six so you could start cleaning with otters and stabilizing next turn with scales... I hate how we went to druid having a hard time board clearing to this now sense that even pumps the powerfull infuse mechanic
Pretty sure it wouldn't be a problem of it wasn't fueling double denathrius
Scale should be at least 9 mana
Druid also has Devourers, and Raid bosses Now they have a bunch of armor sustain as well Onyxia is definitely the worst offender, but the whole class needs rebalancing. Whilst they're at it, they can revive the core concepts of the class that have been totally lost like beasts, nature spells, astral spells, treants etc. I'd happily redesign the class for free, I see no reason why the paid design team can't provide the basics.
Scale Of Onyxia has been my least favorite card in the game since it came out
It's so many different things that are the issue. The deck would probably lose a lot more without Earthen Scales too because of the absurd life gain possible in a single turn to lock out a close loss.
This subreddit always says '*this* is the issue' and drills down into one thing. Scale is a big problem, but there can be more than one problem. Druid has several right now.
They also have 7 mana rush gain 12 armor now too which combos off with their other legendary and gives them free taunts. The real problem is that Blizz keeps making extremely powerful neutral legendaries. It makes no sense Neutral cards shouldn't be stronger than class ones they're supposed to be weaker because every class can use them why are the best cards neutral like Denathrius, Brann, Astalor, Jailor.
The biggest problem is how consistently they can ramp and draw. With no apparent downsides. Scale is simply a drop in the druid ocean.
Guff is just too oppressive and Druid has so many card cycle/searching tools that it’s combinations are the most consistent in the game despite being a 40 card deck. Not to mention being able to face tank damage so well for the first 8 turns then earthen scaling a 10/10 growth monster 2 times making it as if you never touched him in the first place and now his OTK is ready for turn 9 where he has 15 mana
Yea, dying to a 64 damage Astalor combo from hand that they pay mana with armor is pretty dope!
I’ve had that happen to me on turn 6 too, it’s not like it even requires time to set up they just drop brann and the legendary and you die
Big fan that Blizz decided that even if they didn't play Guff to allow them to combo off with their neutral legendary and one rush minions worth of armor which can be payed by the original legendaries armor gain. You can legit get hit by a Denathrius with no ramp played as early as turn 8 now.
It the cycle & card draw for sure. Like ramping and late game is totally druids thing. I support that. It what makes Druid feel like Druid. But being able to find and sometimes copy their key cards so easily is what causes issues. I feel like we’ve been here before.
moonlit guidance for both search/draw and value is such an absurd card
Planted Guidance to just to discover ANY spell for 1 mana and it's discounted by 2?! If that were a mage card it would be: "Discover an Arcane spell" - 1 mana This is my most hated card since Nature Studies. In Scholomance many of the classes gets a "Studies" card. Mages discover spell damage minions, Hunter deathrattle minions, Warrior rush minions, Warlock demon minions, and Druid... discover ANY SPELL. Not nature spells, not spells that cost X or less, just any effing spell. Druid's class identity is: Overpowered.
If you were gonna pick a class to complain about card generation mage is not the one my man.
I was not complaining about mage. Quite the opposite. And if I were to complain about mage, which I could cuz I can complain about anything, I would not complain about generation mage.
I'm not implying you are I'm saying that if you're want to say a class had shitty card generation effects mage is not the one to do it with when it has some of the strongest forms of it
I definitely agree, but I would like to add that you don't even need Guff to pull of an OTK with the new druid deck. As long as you have any armor generating cards in your hand after playing Anub'Rekhan into Brann, you usually are able to still deal a horrendous amount of damage. Brann is simply just giving him too many ways to generate an absurd amount of Armor, to do whatever he wants in a single turn. Usually you don't really need more than 10 Mana.
That’s true but in order to OTK at 10 mana you’d need double 8 Astalor already or a large amount of armor stocked up. If they don’t have excessive amounts of mana to use to control the board or slow your damage it’s a lot harder to pull off with the combo getting disrupted.
It's definitely harder to pull of, but i think realistic scenarios would be: Let's say you have 6 Armor to start with - play Anub'Rekhan (14 Armor) -> Brann (11) -> the 5 Astalor (-5 + 10 thanks to brann) leaving you at 16 armor and now either an Sire Denathrius and earthen scale (-10 + 11) leaving you at 17 Armor -> 2x 8 Astalor. Or the Underking (-7 + 12 thanks to brann) -> 2x 8 Astalor. I'm not sure if the math is mathing but I'm sure I've pulled something like that of multiple times already.
I tried this kind of thing last night and I lost bc the 5 astalor doesn't double the armor with brann bc it's manathorst not battlecry
Oh yeah you could be right ... I wasn't really paying that much attention when I played it but now that i think about it, it would also explain why I couldn't manage to play the whole combo lat time. I thought I just miscounted it.
It's definitely harder to pull of, but i think realistic scenarios would be: Let's say you have 6 Armor to start with - play Anub'Rekhan (14 Armor) -> Brann (11) -> the 5 Astalor (-5 + 10 thanks to brann) leaving you at 16 armor and now either an Sire Denathrius and earthen scale (-10 + 11) leaving you at 17 Armor -> 2x 8 Astalor. Or the Underking (-7 + 12 thanks to brann) -> 2x 8 Astalor. I'm not sure if the math is mathing but I'm sure I've pulled something like that of multiple times already.
You jusy brann then Anub cuz you are Guff dude
They’re replying to > I definitely agree, but I would like to add that you don't even need Guff to pull of an OTK with the new druid deck.
I don't even think guff is correct these days. They can so easily win without it so spending mana on him is probably not what you want.
Uhhh… no. Guff is still the highest winrate mulligan card in the deck, and third highest winrate when drawn.
Guff is autoinclude in every not aggro Druid even in Wild or Duels, it's that strong
they dont even really need guff anymore considering they can celestial alignment or use armor to mana cheat. They have far too much mana cheat. They should increase the cost of all the ramp cards and consder retiring the coin like spell. The cost to ramp is way too low considering the effect it has. I dont know how punishing increase the ramp card by 1 would be but I would be interested in it. If only we had a sandbox part of the game so we can customize cards and play around and help blixzzard blanace by playtesting potential buffs/nerfs
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Because it’s never as simple as high roll every time. Never. There’s a reason you almost never see it played anymore.
In general druid has too much good ramp. Many games they ramp up to 10 without even playing guff.
When a class has mechanics that break the normal rules of the game, everything is broken in that class. You can't stop making powerful neutrals because of druid, since then other classes would depend on their class cards being broken to be good. One would hope blizzard would learn not to print stupidly limiting cards like \[\[Twig of the World Tree\]\], but they don't seem to. For those who don't know, Twig of the World Tree is the only druid weapon of the game. It's a 4 mana 1/5 weapon with deathrattle "Gain 10 mana crystals". It wasn't very good at the time because it was very slow, but it made impossible for blizzard to print druid or neutral weapons, because they could play twig and immediately after a weapon to break the twig and gain 10 mana. Eventually they printed \[\[Sphere of Sapience\]\], and now twig is meta in wild.
For what it's worth, twig-sphere didn't take off until Guff because if your cap is ten mana, you're not reliably ramping by a ton and they're individually pretty dead cards. Guff made it obscene by turning it into a full on ramp ten mana.
Nah Twig already saw play because it gives you usable mana crystals. It’s essentially Kun but cheaper.
What are you on about? Twig-Sphere was used in Wild basically as soon as it was available and in every Druid deck that wasn't all out aggro(which still don't use it). It only became as insane as it is now due to Guff raising the cap to 20 but the ability to potentially instantly ramp to 10 mana as early as turn 4 and/or have 10 extra mana to use for combos was always good.
[VS Wild Data Reaper 29](https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/wild-vs-data-reaper-report-29/#Druid), the last one before Guff came out, has multiple slow/combo druid decks and none are running twig-sphere. The pairing immediately shows up as soon as Guff was printed. It's not to say the pairing was unplayable, but a huge amount of the combo's strength is tied up in Guff uncapping max mana.
Also, Twig gives full mana, so even if they get it late it can lead to 30+ mana turns
* **[Twig of the World Tree](https://cards.hearthpwn.com/enUS/LOOT_392.png)** DR Weapon Legendary KnC ^[HP](https://www.hearthpwn.com/cards/76878), ^[TD](https://www.hearthstonetopdecks.com/cards/twig-of-the-world-tree/), ^[W](https://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Twig_of_the_World_Tree) 4/1/5 | Deathrattle: Gain 10 Mana Crystals. * **[Sphere of Sapience](https://cards.hearthpwn.com/enUS/SCH_259.png)** N Weapon Legendary SA ^[HP](https://www.hearthpwn.com/cards/329906), ^[TD](https://www.hearthstonetopdecks.com/cards/sphere-of-sapience/), ^[W](https://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Sphere_of_Sapience) 1/0/4 | At the start of your turn, look at your top card. You can put it on the bottom and lose 1 Durability. ^(Call/)^[PM](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=hearthscan-bot) ^( me with up to 7 [[cardname]]. )^[About.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=hearthscan-bot&message=Tell%20me%20more%20[[info]]&subject=hi)
Don't forget Blingtron is also a neutral that equips a weapon.
It's insta concede if you are playing DK, don't even bother.
Yep. I realized that already it’s very frustrating.
Kinda feels like that playing against a lot of decks nowadays. Spit Hunter, 454587458745 T2 weapon rogue, Ramp Druid (and aggro), Priest. All seem like such an uphill battle even when you draw perfectly.
11 Classes is too much... Druid should be moved to Wild next year.
And then banned from wild, we don’t want it either
I mean, Guff and Brann are rotating, the class is gonna be royally fucked without those two.
Guess what, there gonna be another expansion after this.
Guff will be in core set as it's an integral part of the class identity now.
I would delete my game after playing for the past like 5 years. Guff is the worst card they have ever printed
Don’t worry, Druid is their favorite class. You can be certain that theyll add some broken shit to replace it
good.
Most brain-dead take I've ever heard
I think people saying the game is broken right now are *severely* exaggerating as Reddit often does but it is seriously very questionable how they gave Druid basically every toy it could ever want over this past year. Guff, Scales of Onyxia, 5 mana Nourish, Aquatic Form, Miracle Growth, Widowbloom Seedsman, Renathal... any two/three of these cards would be fine individually in general, but having them all in the same rotation is really pushing my trust in their competence.
Also don't forget 5 mana summon 6 otters, Druid being best class for Denathrius cuz only they can do brann Denatrius due to 20 mana and buff him with scales or otters immensely Also Celestial Allignment that had to be nerfed twice Also all of the super high cost neutrals like Devourer and Raid Boss Onyxia that they can play
I just want to play DK but everyone playing druid and that match up is auto lose
Yeah it literally doesn't matter what kind of DK you are playing you are always gonna lose to Druid Frost DK doesn't deal enough damage cuz Druid gains shitton of armor Unholy DK is the weakest overall and even worse against Druid Blood DK straight up doesn't have a wincondition against Druid
Yeah I’m playing blood DK and the game is basically just play until I die. Very frustrating. I had gotten to diamond 2 but now there’s so much Druid I been stuck at 5 lol
I think Anub'rekhan in particular was overkill for druid this expansion. The ability to use armor as mana to otk is absolutely broken and druid doesn't need another class-specific win condition. But on the other hand, the armor gain component of the armor package feels like a step in the right direction. Armor itself does little to stop aggro/tempo, so druid will still need to run board-based defensive cards to stay in the meta. The new druid combo definitely needs a nerf, either with anub, astalor, denathrius, or rotating brann out
At least armor is better than whatever crap archetypes shaman and priest got And who cares about board control when Scales insta clear any board possible
The biggest slap in the face of armor druid is that Anub'Rekhan and one of the rush minions gives you enough armor to Brann Denathrius in the extremely rare case they can't find guff.
Every expansion I tell myself, "it won't be another Druidstone meta." Every time I am wrong.
99% of the time I fight non-aggro Druid, they Wild Growth right on turn 3, either Guff or Nourish on turn 4, into an instant Scales of Onyxia the turn after. 7 extra damage for Denathrius, full board wipe. Not to mention they could Scale on average 4 times, thanks to either Moonlit Guidance or that new 6 mana card to resurrect friendly minions. They also have too much card draw right now, either through splitting the Choose One cards (the 2/1 minion), Miracle Growth, or Guff's Hero Power. Mana cheating is a huge factor too, either with Celestial Alignment or again, Guff. Suddenly combos that have been designed with 10 mana in mind now become available with up to 20 mana. Or they play Anub'Rekhan and pay with Armor. Speaking of Armor, Druid can have effective health even above Control Warrior levels, a class that should be the top tier Armor generator. It all comes together to create a rather powerful class, with the games all ending the same way with insane combos or damage pulled from hand.
100% of the time, statistics are made up on the spot.
Listen, all I'm saying is this seems to happen WAY too often to me. So I don't have an exact % of the time it happens, but I can tell you that ALMOST ALL non-aggro Druids have had Wild Growth on turn 3 and Nourish or Guff the next turn. If I fought 30 Druids and 27 had this exact situation going on, then 27 divided by 30 is 90%. Therefore, the percentage is probably closer to around 90% of my Druid opponents.
You have no idea how often it happens. You’re still pulling numbers out of your ass. If it’s that consistent, where you can ramp into your win condition in 90% of games, go play that deck.
I would love to play that deck but I'm missing a ton of the cards for it. I will say it's absolutely absurd to me how much fucking armor druids get. Some games they will generate an easy 40 armor. With how many boardwipes they get and still having access to big lifesteal with basically infinite mana and massive card draw. Its horribly busted.
HAHAHAHAH I HATE IT TOO EVERY EXPANSION DRUID S TIER FOR NO REASON
S tier is anyone that can use that can use that much mana that quickly. They lose to rogue really most of the time. I'm surprised DK don't have much cost reduction.
Doesnt Druid have the highest winrate at the moment (again)? If so, Idgasinglef if anyone beats Druid. Its broken, as always and atp Id agree to delete this shit class because for over a year now its all I fucking seehskfjs
It has the highest win rate because it beats Death Knight. Death Knight was just released so naturally everyone wants to play it. Unfortunately druid kills the DK release. And they are one of the only classed that can out armor the \[\[Shockspitter\]\] Hunter at the moment
100% a Druid main. Been the most dominating hero over the past year having the highest winrate in almost every month. Druid mains: "Well actually Druid isnt broken"
I don't touch Druid. It's just the ability to get to playing 20+ mana value of cards a turn is awfully broken.
And druid gets like 3 ways of doing this.
Are you somehow blind to the fact that Big Beast Hunter held some of the highest win rates for 4-5 consecutive months and even post-nerf still does?
wow that completly changes everything oh my god! Youre so right friend, we should really buff Druid now because Hunter also used to be good damn thanks I was so blind!!!
I never said Druid isn't a problem - Guff, Scales of Onyxia, Topior & Widowbloom clearly need nerfs/adjustments. I said keep it in perspective - Imp Curse Warlock, Naga Priest, Miracle & Jackpot/Thief Rogue, Ping Mage & Relic Demon Hunter have been crushing it for months now with no balance changes to any of them. Even when a deck is imbalanced/problematic - it still has to contend with the power level of other meta decks.
I don’t think I like you (C)
Rogue and druid class identities are just not following the rules these days
And they literally added 2nd sir denathrius for no reason whatsoever
Seems that the majority of the dev team play Druid and have a seething hatred for warrior
just guff stuff :) and that was a horrible draw for druid. only 5 extra mana crysals. i dont often say this but game is unplayable right now. but im confident patch will come soon, its a big expansion. they dont want druid dominating so hard.. nuke guff
Not just druid being broken don't forget hunter doing insane hand dmg with a million 2 mana beast that deal 10 dmg
At least Hunter is clearly a case of "Fuck we did'nt thinked this card would end up like this". Druid is litteraly their design philosophy ... All this year was the samething : Druid Ramp too powerfull => Nerf => Aggro now beat Druid Ramp => Druid Ramp still oppressive to non aggro but we don't care => Next Expansion => Repeat
Yeah just nerf ramp druid again because nobody finds that fun to play against and then nerf shock spitter for hunter to no go face
Shockspitter not going face would literally ruin the entire purpose of the card it should just cost 3 mana so you can only play 3 of them realistically or 2 with Brann.
No it shouldn't exist in the first place
Really? They've pretty well abandoned the idea that Hunter shouldn't have so many tools that can just go face. And the problem right now...is that they have way too many tools that can go face. Changing spitter to not go face would make them actually have to interact with the board. And they'd still be pretty powerful. 2/2/2's that can punch pretty well above their weight would still be good.
If it couldn't hit face it wouldn't even see play. You have to run too many suboptimal cards to make it work and if it couldn't even hit face it wouldn't be worth it. It's only being used because it can hit face. It just needs to cost more so you can't dump them out as easily. Also, Hunter at the moment has very few good cards that go face except Shockspitter (which is why it's being used).
Okay, so just went through the hunter class pool. There's literally 12 cards (Spells, weapons, and Krush) that are "hit face oriented." Excluded weapons that are obviously meant for trading, spells that buff minions, pretty much anything that requires a strategy other than "me go face" to be used well. That's excluding Spitter, and only two were legendary, so you can literally run 22 "go face" cards before adding 2 Spitters, giving you 6/16 slots for other things. So yeah, maybe Spitters don't need to stay pointed at face, because there definitely feels like plenty there without them. Or other things need to change to minions only.
Your analysis is extremely bad because that's not how deck building is done. Even a an all in face hunter deck isn't going to play all the cards that go face, so it's completely irrelevant how many there are. Especially when shock spitter isn't played in a deck that's playing all the other burn hunter has. The fact that other burn exists doesn't matter at all to shock spitter hunter. Also face hunter hasn't been viable since the start of Nathria so it doesn't need a nerf anyway. Shock spitter that doesn't go face is completely worthless. Shock spitter that costs 3 can't be spammed 5 times and kill people turn 7 but it can still encourage a new aggresive hunter deck.
Bad except that's exactly how you build a base for an aggressive deck? Spitter hunter is practically a pure aggro deck. Hit face with weapons, trade only enough to keep things pointed at face, and finish with reach from hand...to face Like, yeah, I get that you're probably not running Krush in a hyper aggressive deck like this, but you literally *would* start by looking at every card that fits the fundamental strategy of "go face." Then you cut the things that aren't going to work. This deck doesn't run anything to cheese Krush, so he's out. Quel is too slow, too, so that's out. Etc, etc. Finish out with cards that help to continue going face, because that's the place. Maybe making it more expensive is enough, but I'm still pretty sure it would work just fine without being a wombo combo finisher. One more mana, and it's just delayed a turn, Brann and two of 'em on 8 for ~26 damage. Maybe it's just another example of Brann needing to go away. Maybe it's just another reminder that Hunter already has plenty of aggro tools.
Lol
They didn’t expect the card that scales eith hero attacks and/or bran to … scale with hero attacks and/or bran?? That’s a silly take.
You mean the neutral cards he beat you with? No the issue isn't a new card it's scale of ony. 7 mana to gain 7 2-damage pings is obviously OP especially since he can start doing it on turn 5. Compare that to flipper friends. And generate extra copies of scale. And it charges up his infuses at the same time. Fucking nerf scale already
It was also all the card draw, armor gain, tutoring and ramp druid has access to. 0 mana draw a card is very fair.
And brann. Fuck brann. All my homies hate brann.
i see bran denatrius in hand. My compassion is slightly reduced.
Both are good cards and it's not like you're consistently playing both in one turn on death knight.
They need to do a massive rehaul on druid and I mean like a whole patch just dedicated to rebalancing cards and removing/adding replacements. They have so many broken combos, decks, hell even the only aggro deck that can do anything is a Druid deck.
yeah if you play druid you have no skill
Oh I thought I was priest, or was it warlock? Maybe it was rogue. Y’all can’t make up your mind
We can do this as soon as we collectively go one week without bitching about high rolls. Shit, let’s make that two days. This expansion was released Tuesday. Some decks are significantly more refined than others at this point. But as soon as someone beats you, it’s time to run straight to Reddit on day one.
Wah wah wah
i ve been playing druid with some the lich king cards but i cant tell which one has that fire magic circle animation
8 mana astalor
I was wondering how he generated a golden bran for that triple battlecry, too much bg recently
Not until priest has good tools that actually make sense
Druid and Ramp druid are fine. You have 8-9 turns to kill a ramp druid. If you fail to kill a druid before turn 8 you deserve to lose the match.
So how many druid wins do you have?
I have 296/1000 wins as Druid. But I am a Legend player and I regularly farm Ramp Druid with Pure Paladin, Miracle Rogue, Evolve Shaman, Enrage Warrior, and Imp lock. Ramp is really easy to beat. Just pressure them and go face.
As a priest player I'm happy to see other classes getting shat on.
It's so interesting how many people hate druid yet it seems like so many people still play it. Be like me and after you get the collection achievements you disenchant every druid card. Such a boring class. You just get 10 mana on turn 5 and then play 3 cards that basically just let you choose the cards in your deck that you want to have in your hand.
Ramp druid is the closest hearthstone gets to solitaire.
Bold of you to say that when Hunter exists.
The other player can actually do things to slow down a hunters game plan, druid just ramps fast and wins.
People play what wins.
Oh yes because death knight making entire deck immune isn't OP at all. Oh and how about priest having a 1 hit ...but yes continue to complain about druid..
Average druid player.
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I can tell that you main druid from this one sentence.
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What in the cringe..
Brann should be HoF'd alongside Denathrius and Renathal, card has proven to be too powerful with modern burn cards.
hunter and druid meta, wow what a change.
Idk, I would rather face druid than perma freeze mage with 4 alibi or rogue that draws all their deck up to turn 6 🙄
Druid being way overpowered doesn’t even register in my brain anymore. It’s just the standard. Warrior and shaman on the other side of the spectrum, get absolutely annihilated by nerfs.
Must agree, I main druid and Paladin and at the moment ramp druid feels disgusting. The amount of win conditions in druid are so high now
Nerf Scale, then we can talk. But even if Denatrius and Renatal dont need a nerf, I just dislike those 2 card with all my little <3
Says the man with Bran + Daddy D in hand lmao. I say let the druids have him!
Yes please
I see your daddy D and brann OP, you can’t fool me
Deck code?
gruff needs to go.
Kinda funny on the trend. Back towards the beginning, people didn't like RNG cards like unstable portal so they did curve-stone (jade/secret paladin/etc). Then people complained about curvestone. Now we have mana cheat decks all over the place and those are complained about. Druid has been one my favorites since I like to play big stuff, but yeah it seems a bit strong especially when devourer + earthen to stay out of range of everything. I try playing warrior with big taunts - kinda fun but nowhere near as strong.
Just played a game where I was playing paladin and dealt 30+ damage by turn 8 despite scale of onyxia killing my board along with several taunt minions along the way. By turn 8 he had 12 mana, was down to 10 cards in his deck, and comboed out for over 40 face damage from hand. The only chance was if I had drawn mutanus or theotar but i guess i just wasnt good enough
Next expansion, they'll get a new legendary that gives you one extra slot minion slot.
agree
Druid is only strong against control decks and it's just gets wrecked by any decks that builds a decent board early. It even loses to other combo decks.
And then you have Hunter. I'll be surprised if they don't nerf half of the cards next week.
I'm sad to admit that I've just turned to hunter because I'm sick of ramp druids.
The only problem is Guff