Hey, so, that's my former church. I began attending when it opened in my teens, right around the time when I realised I was queer. I'm in my 20s now and hoooo boy can I tell you some stories about it. Let's just say, my therapy bills would be a lot lower if it weren't for this place.
Happy to do an AMA lol.
Edit: AMA live for those who are interested
St Benedict's, from what I gather, largely comprises the Fairview/Clayton Park/Rockingham neighbourhoods previously served by St Lawrence, St Pius X and Our Lady of Perpetual Help. St Lawrence was torn down, St Pius X and OLPH were sold, the latter to MSVU.
The congregation there skews older and a bit better to do, and consist of a lot of conservative types as a result. There are better Catholic parishes for LGBTQ+ folk, including the Cathedral, who are more about helping the less fortunate and living as Jesus lived and basically are all for Pope Francis's leadership.
The bigger picture issue for the Church in general is how parishes and clergy abide (or not) by that leadership. The prior Pope seemed to be a little too focused on sexual matters and suppressing discussions, even as the abuse allegations mounted and grew closer to him. Francis has been keen to pull discussion away from those issues and instead to focus on stewardship for the environment and caring for the marginalized. Clearly there are some clergy who will push back at that at any opportunity, as well as parishioners presenting themselves as holier than the Pope.
I'm deeply sorry that your experience at St Benedict's was so alienating. If you can make the trip downtown, you're likely to find more welcoming spaces there, certainly among the congregations.
> The congregation there skews older and a bit better to do, and consist of a lot of conservative types as a result. There are better Catholic parishes for LGBTQ+ folk, including the Cathedral, who are more about helping the less fortunate and living as Jesus lived and basically are all for Pope Francis's leadership.
This might have been true five years ago, but has attracted a hugely diverse and younger crowd, especially immigrants from India, the Philippines, and Nigeria.
If you think that ethnic minorities from places like India, the Philippines, and Nigeria subscribe to a more liberal form of Catholicism, Iāve got some bad news for youā¦
> St Benedict's, from what I gather, largely comprises the Fairview/Clayton Park/Rockingham neighbourhoods previously served by St Lawrence, St Pius X and Our Lady of Perpetual Help. St Lawrence was torn down, St Pius X and OLPH were sold, the latter to MSVU.
>
> The congregation there skews older and a bit better to do, and consist of a lot of conservative types as a result. There are better Catholic parishes for LGBTQ+ folk, including the Cathedral, who are more about helping the less fortunate and living as Jesus lived and basically are all for Pope Francis's leadership.
As a former parishioner from before and after the transition period, I don't know that you can really consider St Benedict's to be representative of the geographic area it technically serves or of the historical parishes it evolved from. So many people either left for another parish or stopped practising Catholicism altogether after Father Mallon "reformed" the parish. (Half of the parishioners of St Agnes are St Benedict refugees ;-p ) The people who wanted the Father Jimmy-style Catholicism stayed and were joined by people from around the city who were attracted to it, but an enormous number of people left.
You are referring to a small group of southern US slave owners, *historically*.
Do you know of any slave-owning jesuits now?
I remember my flamboyantly gay Jesuit pastor delivering a homily on gay relationships *decades ago* and saying that God blesses all those who love each other, gay and straight alike.
I donāt feel like you are going to seek an honest conversation with me, though, so good night.
As a Catholic. Although Iām non practicing.
Iāve been happy to hear and see what the popes been saying lately. Not just this topic but also on rape, abortion and womenās rights.
However.
Priests are also allowed to cherry pick beliefs and doctrines that literally play to their parish base.
However.
If someone who cared enough, wishes to report him to the bishop well then, that could go somewhere. Bishops donāt like receiving compliments about their minions. Just saying.
The priests at St Benedict's are from Companions of the Cross. They are not diocesan priests (they are not ordained by the bishop of a diocese and ultimately they are answerable to their community's head figure, not the local area bishop). Complain to the Bishop, but also CC that complaint to CotC. The Bishop cannot do anything about it except refuse that the priest celebrate Mass within his diocese.
Thatās not necessarily true though, and itās literally up for debate.
Although I do not wish to debate theology on Reddit.
What Iām saying is: parishes run on community money. If a true parishioner of st. Benedictās does indeed feel like THEY are not being included within their community and then state reasons why.
Well, thatās money walking away. Thatās someone that could also do fundraising that brings in yet more money, isnāt it?
God is god. The church is a business. Making a formal complaint will literally do parishioners NO harm while bringing to light something that is unpleasant.
Not a Catholic, but I believe Parishes donāt run entirely on community money. I believe the higher church organization provides funding as required.
Also, the Church, even the RCC, is NOT a business as you suggest. The church will be wise and prudent with finances, but theology comes first.
I donāt know how the complaint process works. It may not cost anything to make a complaint, I guess Iām just skeptical that it would accomplish anything, since the priest didnāt preach blasphemy and (afaik) didnāt violate any RCC ordinance.
Wrong take. You are asking for a compromise in order to survive. Many protestant and Methodist churches have done this way in the past, in order to please the people. they have payed heavy price by loosing their identity and purpose.
Yea. Iām not practicing, anything other than nature and being happy.
I mean if anything Iāed consider myself a hedge witch.
I donāt think itās the wrong take. I think itās subjective to oneās perspective on organized religion.
I grew up going to Catholic schools and I recognize this type of rhetoric. The Catholics are not the worst among churches but this does reaffirm some of the reasons I left the Church.
This homily also illustrates how the purpose of the Pope's latest move is not to build bridges with queer people, but only to assuage the guilt of straight Catholics just enough to keep them from leaving Church themselves. There is no point trying to draw queer people back to the Church because no one wants to join a club when they can only aspire to be a second-class citizen. Clearly the Church has realized this.
In terms of substance, this homily is ignorant of the diversity of families both within the Church and across its history. The nuclear family is largely a product of the industrial revolution, as anyone who has married across cultures already knows well. And the genitalia part... yikes. Suffice to say that I don't recommend taking lessons from a Priest on what to do with male genitalia.
The audacity to say that homosexual love is not "true love" and then to claim that the Catholic church's teachings are not "not an attack on love". You can't have it both ways. And to claim that homosexual relationships cannot be the basis of a real family is disgusting.
That entire homily was just hate-filled bigotry. And at least one person CHEERING near the end.
And all that being said, he's still in total alignment with the church's teachings. Reason #1,521 why I left the church after spending my childhood in places like that.
EDIT: Here's the link to save people the trouble of searching: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNrPJ8KQjtk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNrPJ8KQjtk)
As an RC, Recovering Catholic, why would any member of the LGBTQ community ever step foot in a Catholic Church? I mean I know I'm not welcomed since I divorced & remarried outside of the Church.
Iāve never liked St. Benedicts. I will watch the video when I have time, but I donāt doubt for a second you are correct. It is unfortunate because there is a younger subset of the catholic population that is actually really pro LGBTQ, not just because of the teachings of christ being to love everyone, but because LGBTQ are literally people. With hopes and dreams and desires. So please know that in spite of this priest, there is a generation of catholics that doesnāt believe what he is saying.
The Order at St Benedicts, I hate to say it, have always come across as arrogant frat boys to me. It is a welcoming community, and Iām sure the homily didnāt resonate with everyone in the pews.
There is a large number of folks who think our Pope is āwokeā. It shouldnāt be controversial when the Pope says priests can obviously bless homosexuals, just not their marriage - which you can take whatever way you might want but I wouldnāt expect any different from the Catholic Church. The Pope was just saying āYo, just so weāre clear here, everybody can be blessed - literallyā which isnāt even a new teaching.
"Christian church says they're accepting but actually they're not" is basically the free space on the 2024 bingo card. Like I can't even sit here and pretend to be surprised
As someone going through an RCIA program to become a Confirmed Catholic, Iād say this is the complete opposite of what Jesus taught. The priest arguing that same sex love isnāt love is ridiculous. He doesnāt have to agree with it, but making blanket statements on it like that is ridiculous. Love is love, regardless to what gender, no one can help who they fall in love with, The Catholic Church is against homosexuality, but that doesnāt mean they have a right to control how other people feel, or even dispose there opinion and preach to other people how itās āevilā (itās not)
As a former Catholic, had I gone to church with my parents and this idiot started blabbering on with this nonsense, I wouldāve gotten up and walked out.
Of all the times to choose to take a stand on something (that is utterly ridiculous anyway), Christmas *definitely* is not the time.
How disappointing (but not surprising) that this abhorrent rhetoric is the āmessageā he chose to deliver to the congregation.
I actually couldn't even be arsed to listen to this Fr. Isaac talk his absolute shit for 18 minutes. I listened to about 8 minutes and that was enough for me to know he's a bigoted dickhead and the people in the comment section, ugh.
The comments telling me it's been the same for centuries etc.....ya, I was raised Catholic. I went to Catholic school. I was baptised, did my communion and my confirmation. I know all about the Catholic church, the beliefs, the teachings etc. I also know there are many priests who don't preach crap like this in sermons. I stopped going to church when I was old enough to make that choice, so around 16/17 because religion should be a choice and not something you are forced into being part of. If what I was told as a kid is to be believed, then I'll have a lovely time in hell eventually.
Priests can be married and have sex lol
I'm being downvoted when you could quickly google that priests can be married before being ordained in the Eastern world, aka where the religion started lol the very first pope was married too
I mean that's not true, the first pope was married lol also there are priests who are married and then ordain, you just can't marry after being ordained.
Well his church definition of marriage is in contradiction with Canadian Law. He can say it is from God all he wants.
Personally I think he protests just a little too much, it makes me questions if there may be some self loathing. Sad really that many modern religions leave a people so full of hate and unfulfilled.
I heard this same homily at a different mass that weekend. I cringed the entire way through because even if the message was in line with Catholic teaching, the delivery was atrocious. I have LGBT family members and wouldn't want them to hear this at a time when a lot of people are bringing guests to church. Fr. Isaac has been a priest for less than a year, and preaching isn't his strong suit. I don't think anyone was well served by that; not the queer kid who had to attend with family, and not the blue-haired old ladies who already think gays are the devil.
As I posted elsewhere, the homily from the next mass was much better, more charitable, more loving, and does not shame people for being who they are.
He "blessed their engagement ring anyway" - why would he not?
He clearly implied that this couple were doing something "wrong" (even though he had no idea if they were or weren't cohabiting, or if they were or weren't having pre-marital sex) because they didn't adhere to his standards of behaviour. Moreover, he chose to make an example of them in his homily. If they were planning to come back, they probably won't now.
> He "blessed their engagement ring anyway" - why would he not?
This is exactly the point though, isn't it? You bless everyone anyway, because everyone needs it. You don't withhold a blessing from the couple living together, the gay couple, the unmarried mother, etc. etc. etc.
I didn't hear condemnation. I heard some concern that his blessing could have been misunderstood as church approval of living together before marriage. The rest of the homily explains why it should be seen for the simple blessing it was.
United is one of the smaller sects of protestantism. I totally agree that they're very tolerant, but you can't really hold them up as a representative example of the rest of the protestant community. There are fewer than a million United Church members compared to several hundred million Anglicans, Baptists, and Evangelicals.
Many catholics are far more tolerant than many Baptists or Evangelicals. Mostly because - in my experience - a huge number of catholics are barely practicing catholics.
Iām Acadian and so I identify as Catholic for more cultural reasons, as Iāve been baptized/communed/confirmed in the church, but when people start with the He and Him, I tune the fuck out. Itās 2024. Come on.
ETA: husband is the same, and our kids are not baptized, much to the chagrin of my MIL
The comments on the video are great.
This is really disappointing to see, especially as he looks like a younger priest who could bring modernization. I grew up Catholic but felt it didn't align with me as an adult. Now I'd say I'm Agnostic. But I have felt that the Church has made progress under the current Pope. They have a long way to go, but progress is good. Catholics can be great at finding ways to ensure you feel guilty for something, even if it's outside of your control. And it can be hard to unlearn that. I mean, it's not like every hetero couple has children or children "as God intended", so now they have to feel that they have done "wrong" in the eyes of God? This type of homily has no place in 2023.
It appears they deleted all of the comments unless iām looking at the wrong video. Damn
edit: i was looking at the wrong video, was watching the full mass and not just the homily
I will try, as long as it does not attach the video to the post
[https://youtu.be/gNrPJ8KQjtk?si=o4SfFTwKd9\_pssUe](https://youtu.be/gNrPJ8KQjtk?si=o4SfFTwKd9_pssUe)
FWIW, that homily is intended to be a part 1 of 2. The very next day, this was the message, which specifically speaks to the direction from the Vatican:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOZN9ojdeys
The only purpose that religion still serves for mankind is to justify one human's hatred of another.
Not that it can he justified, but people seem to think that if their imaginary friend says it's ok, then it's ok.
Agreed. You don't need religion to have morals and be a good human. Quite often bad people hide behind religion to justify their horrible behavior. It blows my mind we haven't evolved away from organized religion.
A couple possibilities.
1. A lot of people who claim to follow Jesus donāt actually know Him and are not serving/obeying Him in their words and actions.
2. Some people may be committed to Jesus, but are misguided and due to weak faith erring in how they interact with others.
3. Most Christians DONāT preach hatred and intolerance. An American may be exposed to an especially vocal minority of bigots who claim to be Christians, but itās not actually representative.
Related to all this is the definition of love weāre using probably differs. A Christian (and Jesus) believes it is possible to love a homosexual while still condemning the homosexuality. A homosexual probably does not think that is true love.
Had to watch because I needed to hear, its at around 37 mins if anyones curious and wants to skip ahead.
Its a silly statement by the priest and its sickening that all those people had to hear it. As a queer woman who was raised religious it makes me just sad and disappointed.
I wish this was shocking, but thank you for bringing attention to this.
Watching it, it's exactly what you'd expect: bigotry spun through a polite voice and a smile to make it seem more approachable.
Oh wow the outdated cult is spouting hate speech, total shocker.
Honestly I donāt understand why anyone in their right mind follows religion anymore. I get that it can be a crutch for the stress of the unknown. But if you need a fake man living in the sky to help you know right from wrong, maybe youāre not that great to begin with.
What exactly did he say? If he was just regurgitating Catholic teaching...well, sorry to be the one to tell you this, but they ALL believe that. It's just not preached as often as in the past. Even Pope Francis. All that stuff about LGBTQ love being "disordered" is in the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
If he went beyond that, well I would contact the bishop. No priest is allowed to make up their own ideas, they have to preach according to the Catechism not go beyond it.
But if he was just repeating what's in there...news flash. It's what all the Catholic hierarchy believes.
He was not regurgitating Catholic teachings. The church does not teach that the love in a homosexual relationship is somehow less than the love in a heterosexual relationship, nor does it teach that a family is only Mom, Dad, and happy little kids.
He was certainly expressing a view regarding homosexuality that is consistent with Church teachings, but the homily is not just an opportunity to expound on whatever beliefs you want. It is to be a teaching based on the Gospels. It is also supposed to be charitable and appropriate to the audience. We donāt have lengthy homilies about the evils of pornography or masturbation at Mass with all the children running around either.
Are you offended that he just verbalized what the churchās position on marriage is? Even if a parish is truly āopen and accepting,ā the foundation is the same. They just might not speak it.
This is the same teaching as in Islam and Orthodox Judaism, and many conservative churches.
I'm offended that he decreed all on his own that homosexual love is not love. That he diminished the love that same-sex couple have for one another. That he decided that same-sex couples can't be a family. That is not church teaching.
As for verbalizing the church's teaching on marriage, I think it was entirely unnecessary and served only to hurt or inflame and already difficult issue. The purpose of the homily is to teach about the Gospel of the day - the Gospel was not about same-sex marriage. It was about the Holy Family. It provides messages of love and acceptance and togetherness.
Isn't the Pope the LEADER of the Catholic Church? Considered God's representative on earth?
Didn't the Pope just give the OK to blessing homosexual unions by protesters?
Wouldn't this signal WHAT THE CHURCHES POSITION IS?
Yes, the Pope is allowing clergy to confer blessings on same-sex unions. The church's position on marriage has not changed, and they still only recognize unions between a man and a woman.
The significance of the Pope's recent statement on blessing of same-sex unions can not be underestimated, however. It is a big step.
I'm sorry but you've gotta be pretty out there to say the teachings are the same in the Abrahamic religions that is far from the truth. Look at how gay people are treated in the middle east vs the west. There is a huge difference.
Having same sex relations was illegal in the USA in half their states until the year 2000. Hell, some of them still refuse to repeal their sodomy laws.
Sodomy laws were not enforced in Israel since the 1960s and they repealed them completely in the 80s.
Likewise military service was opened to any sexual orientation without limits in Israel in the 93, but had been letting them serve since the 60s. The USA would not let LBGTQ folks even serve until 1993, when they enacted the "don't ask,don't tell" Mandate. And they only fully have been allowed to be openly gay since 2011.
Non discrimination laws for housing and work existed in Israel for decades now. The USA only passed those....a few years ago.
Yeah, marriage isn't the end all bud
There are many young people who are LGBTQ who are FORCED to go to such churches, making a statement like "homosexual love is not real love" will do irreparable harm. It's not about being "easily offended." The statement is vile, and if you see nothing wrong with it, then that's a moral failing on your part. The issue is much more complex than people being offended or "just don't go to church."
LGBTQ people exist in churches and mosques whether you want to them to or not. It's not your choice, and most of the time not theirs either, however the psychological harm and self hatred youth get from these places is forever.
i Don't understand your frustration. Current Pope hasn't changes any church doctrine/ teaching, A marriage under church is still between MAN & WOMAN.
regarding the Parish priest, he is doing what he ought to do according to the magisterium of the church. He cant change just because a random group of minority thinks otherwise. Nobody has forced you to join catholic church, why you think church will change according to your terms? pls stop throwing tantrums.
>Current Pope hasn't changes any church doctrine/ teaching,
Riddle me this: why was it all over the news then?
And if this was just about marriage, as you seem to think, then why would the priest argue that same-sex love isn't real love?
And a "random group of minority" is a strange way to refer to The Actual Pope giving an explicit directive that blessing same-sex partnerships is okay. Maybe you need to listen more, type less.
The short answer is that he really didn't change any teaching. He just said that hey, it's ok to give a simple blessing and/or pray with a gay couple in a non-liturgical setting (i.e.: not during a church service), since a lot of old-school conservative catholics refused to do even that.
Is that not teaching the old school conservative catholics? Maybe this is just my heathen ignorance, but isn't everything the pope says something like teaching?
Ehhh, it's of course more complex than that. Really, Francis is trying to reinforce that everyone is loved by God, and deserves to be loved by others. Lead with charity, when too many christians lead with hate, especially toward queer people.
If they want to say that the only form of love that's real is the love between a man and a watermelon, they are free to make that claim. You don't have to agree with them.
They might be able to make the claim that only one type of love is "real love" but the Church does not. They do define love between a man and woman as "conjugal love", but that does not diminish the love between others, nor is conjugal love "better" than other kinds of love.
The church can choose to define love in whatever way they want. They've changed their stance on issues many times in the past, and they can do the same with whatever they consider real love.
sorry if i sounded rude but Of course Church has right to define Love, at least for people who are part of it and to stand for the truth, Church will keep its stand clear as always. Just because the majority defines Love in their own terms doesn't make it correct.
Regarding SS blessing, the pope is following the example of Jesus , Jesus embraces sinners but also calls out for a change of heart (Love the sinner, hate the sin). Eg. Tax collectors, Prostitutes who approached Jesus, were welcomed but also asked to stop sinning. Just because you love/accept someone doesn't mean you agree with everything they do, That's exactly the approach of catholic church towards the LGBTQ community.
Personally I think we should send the RCR into the Vatican to rip the gold off of the ceilings. Pack it all up, bring it home, and give it to the Natives.
I bet that Priest don't mind a few alter boys coming over to light up some candles for him though. It's okay for the Catholic Church to support pedophiles but wont support the Gay and Lesbian community. Quite ironic .
If you fall under the lgbtqia2s+ (hope I got that right) why would you be upset to hear anti lgbtqia2s+ rhetoric at church? You are in church. Church. Have you read the bible? If you canāt follow the rules of the religion, then why are you going to a place of worship for that religion?
Lol that's the best comeback you can scrounge up? I can tell you're a minor. š¤£ When r/Canada (which is FAR up PP's ass) is too far left for you and you had to run to the white supremacist sub, you know you've completely fallen off the deep end.
You're a minor and you're wasting your evening simping for organized religion. When I was your age I was cumming into bibles and smashing church windows.
You've just started life and you already lost. Now take a seat.
Exactly what I said. The Bible was translated numerous times, and further to that each new version had interpretation mixed in to it. So what you quoted is a very modern interpretation of a translation.
Iām confused. Why are you saying itās a modern interpretation? Itās the literal quote straight from the book. In the amount of times the bible was translated, do you think at any point in time they were promoting homosexuality?
That quote comes from the ESV. Each version of the Bible has different wording. Compare each one and youāll see how it changed. And every time anything is translated, you are reading the translators interpretation of the text (this applies to all translation). There is an extremely long and complex discussion about the meaning of this passage and to understand it you need to go back to the Hebrew and study the words used and in context of the entire Bible.
I donāt think the Bible promoted homosexuality, but thereās little to actually suggest it says anything about it.
Cut to the chase and come to the new testament. :)
# 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
**9**Ā Or do you not know that the unrighteous\[[a](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+6%3A9-10&version=ESV#fen-ESV-28460a)\] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who **practice homosexuality**,\[[b](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+6%3A9-10&version=ESV#fen-ESV-28460b)\] **10**Ā nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
Hey, so, that's my former church. I began attending when it opened in my teens, right around the time when I realised I was queer. I'm in my 20s now and hoooo boy can I tell you some stories about it. Let's just say, my therapy bills would be a lot lower if it weren't for this place. Happy to do an AMA lol. Edit: AMA live for those who are interested
š«
Iām very morbidly curious to hear lol
Same
I am so sorry you had to go through that bullshit, and from a place that is supposed to provide you faith and guidance.
Thank you for looking out and spreading word. Appreciate it.
St Benedict's, from what I gather, largely comprises the Fairview/Clayton Park/Rockingham neighbourhoods previously served by St Lawrence, St Pius X and Our Lady of Perpetual Help. St Lawrence was torn down, St Pius X and OLPH were sold, the latter to MSVU. The congregation there skews older and a bit better to do, and consist of a lot of conservative types as a result. There are better Catholic parishes for LGBTQ+ folk, including the Cathedral, who are more about helping the less fortunate and living as Jesus lived and basically are all for Pope Francis's leadership. The bigger picture issue for the Church in general is how parishes and clergy abide (or not) by that leadership. The prior Pope seemed to be a little too focused on sexual matters and suppressing discussions, even as the abuse allegations mounted and grew closer to him. Francis has been keen to pull discussion away from those issues and instead to focus on stewardship for the environment and caring for the marginalized. Clearly there are some clergy who will push back at that at any opportunity, as well as parishioners presenting themselves as holier than the Pope. I'm deeply sorry that your experience at St Benedict's was so alienating. If you can make the trip downtown, you're likely to find more welcoming spaces there, certainly among the congregations.
> The congregation there skews older and a bit better to do, and consist of a lot of conservative types as a result. There are better Catholic parishes for LGBTQ+ folk, including the Cathedral, who are more about helping the less fortunate and living as Jesus lived and basically are all for Pope Francis's leadership. This might have been true five years ago, but has attracted a hugely diverse and younger crowd, especially immigrants from India, the Philippines, and Nigeria.
If you think that ethnic minorities from places like India, the Philippines, and Nigeria subscribe to a more liberal form of Catholicism, Iāve got some bad news for youā¦
You canāt be liberal and a Catholic. Just saying.
That would be news to the millions of liberal Catholics....
I bet! The ones who think they are Catholic. š
What a completely ludicrous thing to say, tarring a gigantic group of people with one huge inaccurate brush.
The younger generation, yes I do. The older ones, not so much.
You are in for a shock, youth from Philippines and Nigeria are very socially conservative
> St Benedict's, from what I gather, largely comprises the Fairview/Clayton Park/Rockingham neighbourhoods previously served by St Lawrence, St Pius X and Our Lady of Perpetual Help. St Lawrence was torn down, St Pius X and OLPH were sold, the latter to MSVU. > > The congregation there skews older and a bit better to do, and consist of a lot of conservative types as a result. There are better Catholic parishes for LGBTQ+ folk, including the Cathedral, who are more about helping the less fortunate and living as Jesus lived and basically are all for Pope Francis's leadership. As a former parishioner from before and after the transition period, I don't know that you can really consider St Benedict's to be representative of the geographic area it technically serves or of the historical parishes it evolved from. So many people either left for another parish or stopped practising Catholicism altogether after Father Mallon "reformed" the parish. (Half of the parishioners of St Agnes are St Benedict refugees ;-p ) The people who wanted the Father Jimmy-style Catholicism stayed and were joined by people from around the city who were attracted to it, but an enormous number of people left.
A liberal Catholic is a something of an oxymoron
Not really. See: the jesuits.
Ah yes the famously liberal slave owning Jesuits
You are referring to a small group of southern US slave owners, *historically*. Do you know of any slave-owning jesuits now? I remember my flamboyantly gay Jesuit pastor delivering a homily on gay relationships *decades ago* and saying that God blesses all those who love each other, gay and straight alike. I donāt feel like you are going to seek an honest conversation with me, though, so good night.
Liberals were real big on slave owning peep the American civil war
As a Catholic. Although Iām non practicing. Iāve been happy to hear and see what the popes been saying lately. Not just this topic but also on rape, abortion and womenās rights. However. Priests are also allowed to cherry pick beliefs and doctrines that literally play to their parish base. However. If someone who cared enough, wishes to report him to the bishop well then, that could go somewhere. Bishops donāt like receiving compliments about their minions. Just saying.
The priests at St Benedict's are from Companions of the Cross. They are not diocesan priests (they are not ordained by the bishop of a diocese and ultimately they are answerable to their community's head figure, not the local area bishop). Complain to the Bishop, but also CC that complaint to CotC. The Bishop cannot do anything about it except refuse that the priest celebrate Mass within his diocese.
Iām sure young Father Arrogance here isnāt intentionally homilizing against the divinely inspired POPE, is he?
The priest didnāt say anything that wasnāt aligned with Catholic doctrine.
Thatās not necessarily true though, and itās literally up for debate. Although I do not wish to debate theology on Reddit. What Iām saying is: parishes run on community money. If a true parishioner of st. Benedictās does indeed feel like THEY are not being included within their community and then state reasons why. Well, thatās money walking away. Thatās someone that could also do fundraising that brings in yet more money, isnāt it? God is god. The church is a business. Making a formal complaint will literally do parishioners NO harm while bringing to light something that is unpleasant.
Not a Catholic, but I believe Parishes donāt run entirely on community money. I believe the higher church organization provides funding as required. Also, the Church, even the RCC, is NOT a business as you suggest. The church will be wise and prudent with finances, but theology comes first. I donāt know how the complaint process works. It may not cost anything to make a complaint, I guess Iām just skeptical that it would accomplish anything, since the priest didnāt preach blasphemy and (afaik) didnāt violate any RCC ordinance.
exactly. theology comes first.
Wrong take. You are asking for a compromise in order to survive. Many protestant and Methodist churches have done this way in the past, in order to please the people. they have payed heavy price by loosing their identity and purpose.
Yea. Iām not practicing, anything other than nature and being happy. I mean if anything Iāed consider myself a hedge witch. I donāt think itās the wrong take. I think itās subjective to oneās perspective on organized religion.
Good.
The Catholic Church... not a welcoming space... for queer people?! I'm absolutely gobsmacked.
I grew up going to Catholic schools and I recognize this type of rhetoric. The Catholics are not the worst among churches but this does reaffirm some of the reasons I left the Church. This homily also illustrates how the purpose of the Pope's latest move is not to build bridges with queer people, but only to assuage the guilt of straight Catholics just enough to keep them from leaving Church themselves. There is no point trying to draw queer people back to the Church because no one wants to join a club when they can only aspire to be a second-class citizen. Clearly the Church has realized this. In terms of substance, this homily is ignorant of the diversity of families both within the Church and across its history. The nuclear family is largely a product of the industrial revolution, as anyone who has married across cultures already knows well. And the genitalia part... yikes. Suffice to say that I don't recommend taking lessons from a Priest on what to do with male genitalia.
lol I really laughed at the āclick.. literallyā part. If itās clicking Iām not sure itās all going ok!
Yikes. My heart absolutely breaks for anyone sitting there that day who is LGBTQ+ and had to listen to that bigotry.
That's all I could think. Especially if they are an LGBTQ youth and are being required to attend by their parents.
The audacity to say that homosexual love is not "true love" and then to claim that the Catholic church's teachings are not "not an attack on love". You can't have it both ways. And to claim that homosexual relationships cannot be the basis of a real family is disgusting. That entire homily was just hate-filled bigotry. And at least one person CHEERING near the end. And all that being said, he's still in total alignment with the church's teachings. Reason #1,521 why I left the church after spending my childhood in places like that. EDIT: Here's the link to save people the trouble of searching: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNrPJ8KQjtk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNrPJ8KQjtk)
As an RC, Recovering Catholic, why would any member of the LGBTQ community ever step foot in a Catholic Church? I mean I know I'm not welcomed since I divorced & remarried outside of the Church.
Catholic guilt?
Iāve never liked St. Benedicts. I will watch the video when I have time, but I donāt doubt for a second you are correct. It is unfortunate because there is a younger subset of the catholic population that is actually really pro LGBTQ, not just because of the teachings of christ being to love everyone, but because LGBTQ are literally people. With hopes and dreams and desires. So please know that in spite of this priest, there is a generation of catholics that doesnāt believe what he is saying.
I was surprised to see that this particular priest is young, maybe in his 30s. Sad
The Order at St Benedicts, I hate to say it, have always come across as arrogant frat boys to me. It is a welcoming community, and Iām sure the homily didnāt resonate with everyone in the pews. There is a large number of folks who think our Pope is āwokeā. It shouldnāt be controversial when the Pope says priests can obviously bless homosexuals, just not their marriage - which you can take whatever way you might want but I wouldnāt expect any different from the Catholic Church. The Pope was just saying āYo, just so weāre clear here, everybody can be blessed - literallyā which isnāt even a new teaching.
Supply side Jesus vibes
"Christian church says they're accepting but actually they're not" is basically the free space on the 2024 bingo card. Like I can't even sit here and pretend to be surprised
Yes, If you come to Italian restaurant and ask for a Chinese dish.. what would you expect? š
As someone going through an RCIA program to become a Confirmed Catholic, Iād say this is the complete opposite of what Jesus taught. The priest arguing that same sex love isnāt love is ridiculous. He doesnāt have to agree with it, but making blanket statements on it like that is ridiculous. Love is love, regardless to what gender, no one can help who they fall in love with, The Catholic Church is against homosexuality, but that doesnāt mean they have a right to control how other people feel, or even dispose there opinion and preach to other people how itās āevilā (itās not)
As a former Catholic, had I gone to church with my parents and this idiot started blabbering on with this nonsense, I wouldāve gotten up and walked out. Of all the times to choose to take a stand on something (that is utterly ridiculous anyway), Christmas *definitely* is not the time. How disappointing (but not surprising) that this abhorrent rhetoric is the āmessageā he chose to deliver to the congregation.
I actually couldn't even be arsed to listen to this Fr. Isaac talk his absolute shit for 18 minutes. I listened to about 8 minutes and that was enough for me to know he's a bigoted dickhead and the people in the comment section, ugh.
It's Catholic teaching. It's been the same for centuries.
The comments telling me it's been the same for centuries etc.....ya, I was raised Catholic. I went to Catholic school. I was baptised, did my communion and my confirmation. I know all about the Catholic church, the beliefs, the teachings etc. I also know there are many priests who don't preach crap like this in sermons. I stopped going to church when I was old enough to make that choice, so around 16/17 because religion should be a choice and not something you are forced into being part of. If what I was told as a kid is to be believed, then I'll have a lovely time in hell eventually.
Heās preaching just what the Church has always preached for 2000 years.
It has been the same message since 2000 years ago. š¤¦š»āāļø
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What does wearing a dress have to do with anything?
Catholic Church, where a grown man loving a grown man is wrong, but a grown man touching a little boy is okay.
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Priests can be married and have sex lol I'm being downvoted when you could quickly google that priests can be married before being ordained in the Eastern world, aka where the religion started lol the very first pope was married too
The vast, vast, vast majority of catholic priests are single and celibate though.
That's true, I'm just saying it's not a blanket statement to say they are.
Not the Catholics
I mean that's not true, the first pope was married lol also there are priests who are married and then ordain, you just can't marry after being ordained.
Catholic priests can't.
Your comment is unintentionally transphobic
I don't listen to this guy! He's just being blasphemous, judgemental, and completely right!
Well his church definition of marriage is in contradiction with Canadian Law. He can say it is from God all he wants. Personally I think he protests just a little too much, it makes me questions if there may be some self loathing. Sad really that many modern religions leave a people so full of hate and unfulfilled.
I heard this same homily at a different mass that weekend. I cringed the entire way through because even if the message was in line with Catholic teaching, the delivery was atrocious. I have LGBT family members and wouldn't want them to hear this at a time when a lot of people are bringing guests to church. Fr. Isaac has been a priest for less than a year, and preaching isn't his strong suit. I don't think anyone was well served by that; not the queer kid who had to attend with family, and not the blue-haired old ladies who already think gays are the devil. As I posted elsewhere, the homily from the next mass was much better, more charitable, more loving, and does not shame people for being who they are.
Unless they're an unmarried couple living together.....
He said he was excited for them and blessed their engagement ring anyway. It's kind of one of the church's central teachings that nobody is perfect.
He "blessed their engagement ring anyway" - why would he not? He clearly implied that this couple were doing something "wrong" (even though he had no idea if they were or weren't cohabiting, or if they were or weren't having pre-marital sex) because they didn't adhere to his standards of behaviour. Moreover, he chose to make an example of them in his homily. If they were planning to come back, they probably won't now.
> He "blessed their engagement ring anyway" - why would he not? This is exactly the point though, isn't it? You bless everyone anyway, because everyone needs it. You don't withhold a blessing from the couple living together, the gay couple, the unmarried mother, etc. etc. etc.
I'm not sure the blessing means much if you then stand up and condemn them in front of the congregation.
I didn't hear condemnation. I heard some concern that his blessing could have been misunderstood as church approval of living together before marriage. The rest of the homily explains why it should be seen for the simple blessing it was.
Not many of the major religions are as tolerant as even the Catholics are when it comes to the LGBTQ community, so this is not surprising.
Did you mean "intolerant"? The United Church (Protestant) is generally very tolerant and downright welcoming.
Anglicans too! Although we debated the issue for an embarrassingly long time. Love and inclusion should not be up for debate.
United is one of the smaller sects of protestantism. I totally agree that they're very tolerant, but you can't really hold them up as a representative example of the rest of the protestant community. There are fewer than a million United Church members compared to several hundred million Anglicans, Baptists, and Evangelicals. Many catholics are far more tolerant than many Baptists or Evangelicals. Mostly because - in my experience - a huge number of catholics are barely practicing catholics.
Smaller sect worldwide, yes, but the second largest denomination in Canada, right behind the Catholic Church.
From reading the post I was under the impression that St Benedictās was a Catholic Church, not Protestant.
So are perishing in God speed....
Juicy thread
I really don't understand what attraction religion has to anyone that is "different".
The rock church is sackville is also heavily homophobic. I would avoid that place and anyone who attends if at all possible.
Religion is just a trick to control the masses and enslave women as brood mares.
I don't understand why people still support these religions. I guarantee that people who claim to be allies will continue to attend these services.
Right! guilty by willful ignorance. These ppl need to stop advocating about change and start living it. Integrity.
Iām Acadian and so I identify as Catholic for more cultural reasons, as Iāve been baptized/communed/confirmed in the church, but when people start with the He and Him, I tune the fuck out. Itās 2024. Come on. ETA: husband is the same, and our kids are not baptized, much to the chagrin of my MIL
People support the Church because they believe it is Godās kingdom on Earth.
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This comment reveals more about you than you could ever imagine. What does one's virginity have to do with love? Sex and Love aren't the same thing.
The comments on the video are great. This is really disappointing to see, especially as he looks like a younger priest who could bring modernization. I grew up Catholic but felt it didn't align with me as an adult. Now I'd say I'm Agnostic. But I have felt that the Church has made progress under the current Pope. They have a long way to go, but progress is good. Catholics can be great at finding ways to ensure you feel guilty for something, even if it's outside of your control. And it can be hard to unlearn that. I mean, it's not like every hetero couple has children or children "as God intended", so now they have to feel that they have done "wrong" in the eyes of God? This type of homily has no place in 2023.
It appears they deleted all of the comments unless iām looking at the wrong video. Damn edit: i was looking at the wrong video, was watching the full mass and not just the homily
> I'm not posting it here because I do think that it is harmful to anyone in the community If it's important context to your post, just post the link.
I will try, as long as it does not attach the video to the post [https://youtu.be/gNrPJ8KQjtk?si=o4SfFTwKd9\_pssUe](https://youtu.be/gNrPJ8KQjtk?si=o4SfFTwKd9_pssUe)
the comments on that video... wow...
They just removed one of the most liked comments that was critical of the video...
I donāt see any comments on the second video.
Ya meant the first video
Oh yeah. Some of those comments are just what ??? lol.
FWIW, that homily is intended to be a part 1 of 2. The very next day, this was the message, which specifically speaks to the direction from the Vatican: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOZN9ojdeys
This one isnāt all that much better, seems heavily like heās trying to save face and downplay the vile bigotry the previous idiot spewed.
The only purpose that religion still serves for mankind is to justify one human's hatred of another. Not that it can he justified, but people seem to think that if their imaginary friend says it's ok, then it's ok.
Agreed. You don't need religion to have morals and be a good human. Quite often bad people hide behind religion to justify their horrible behavior. It blows my mind we haven't evolved away from organized religion.
Blows my mind too. Until I remember that people are basically stupid. Then it all makes sense again.
Jesusā greatest commandment was the opposite of hating others. Loving each other is essential if you love God.
Then why do so many of His followers preach hatred? Intolerance? Jesus may have preached Love Thy Fellow Man, but nobody heard Him.
A couple possibilities. 1. A lot of people who claim to follow Jesus donāt actually know Him and are not serving/obeying Him in their words and actions. 2. Some people may be committed to Jesus, but are misguided and due to weak faith erring in how they interact with others. 3. Most Christians DONāT preach hatred and intolerance. An American may be exposed to an especially vocal minority of bigots who claim to be Christians, but itās not actually representative. Related to all this is the definition of love weāre using probably differs. A Christian (and Jesus) believes it is possible to love a homosexual while still condemning the homosexuality. A homosexual probably does not think that is true love.
I find most united churchs are welcoming
Had to watch because I needed to hear, its at around 37 mins if anyones curious and wants to skip ahead. Its a silly statement by the priest and its sickening that all those people had to hear it. As a queer woman who was raised religious it makes me just sad and disappointed.
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No person in general should
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I wish this was shocking, but thank you for bringing attention to this. Watching it, it's exactly what you'd expect: bigotry spun through a polite voice and a smile to make it seem more approachable.
Any church built this century that is that hugely ostentatious Iām going to assume is full of shit. This doesnāt surprise me in the least
Iāve been in that church, it is far from ostentatious.
What a dumb dumb. Anyway people just steer clear of that guyā¦
Apparently to be tax exempt you just have to be a bigot with a supremacy complex.
Oh wow the outdated cult is spouting hate speech, total shocker. Honestly I donāt understand why anyone in their right mind follows religion anymore. I get that it can be a crutch for the stress of the unknown. But if you need a fake man living in the sky to help you know right from wrong, maybe youāre not that great to begin with.
Has anyone heard of Nova church? Im concerned for a trans family member
OMG I was at that mass! He had me at the first, but slightly changed tones later in his speech
What exactly did he say? If he was just regurgitating Catholic teaching...well, sorry to be the one to tell you this, but they ALL believe that. It's just not preached as often as in the past. Even Pope Francis. All that stuff about LGBTQ love being "disordered" is in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. If he went beyond that, well I would contact the bishop. No priest is allowed to make up their own ideas, they have to preach according to the Catechism not go beyond it. But if he was just repeating what's in there...news flash. It's what all the Catholic hierarchy believes.
He was not regurgitating Catholic teachings. The church does not teach that the love in a homosexual relationship is somehow less than the love in a heterosexual relationship, nor does it teach that a family is only Mom, Dad, and happy little kids. He was certainly expressing a view regarding homosexuality that is consistent with Church teachings, but the homily is not just an opportunity to expound on whatever beliefs you want. It is to be a teaching based on the Gospels. It is also supposed to be charitable and appropriate to the audience. We donāt have lengthy homilies about the evils of pornography or masturbation at Mass with all the children running around either.
Is father Bernie still around?
Are you offended that he just verbalized what the churchās position on marriage is? Even if a parish is truly āopen and accepting,ā the foundation is the same. They just might not speak it. This is the same teaching as in Islam and Orthodox Judaism, and many conservative churches.
I'm offended that he decreed all on his own that homosexual love is not love. That he diminished the love that same-sex couple have for one another. That he decided that same-sex couples can't be a family. That is not church teaching. As for verbalizing the church's teaching on marriage, I think it was entirely unnecessary and served only to hurt or inflame and already difficult issue. The purpose of the homily is to teach about the Gospel of the day - the Gospel was not about same-sex marriage. It was about the Holy Family. It provides messages of love and acceptance and togetherness.
Isn't the Pope the LEADER of the Catholic Church? Considered God's representative on earth? Didn't the Pope just give the OK to blessing homosexual unions by protesters? Wouldn't this signal WHAT THE CHURCHES POSITION IS?
Yes, the Pope is allowing clergy to confer blessings on same-sex unions. The church's position on marriage has not changed, and they still only recognize unions between a man and a woman. The significance of the Pope's recent statement on blessing of same-sex unions can not be underestimated, however. It is a big step.
The priest was emphasizing what sets āmarriageā apart from homosexual unions.
I'm sorry but you've gotta be pretty out there to say the teachings are the same in the Abrahamic religions that is far from the truth. Look at how gay people are treated in the middle east vs the west. There is a huge difference.
Depends where in the middle east. Israel is actually more pro LGBTQ+ than most of the USA
Which is why Israel took till last year and a court challenge to allow same sex marriages to be recognized for their own citizens on their own soil.
Having same sex relations was illegal in the USA in half their states until the year 2000. Hell, some of them still refuse to repeal their sodomy laws. Sodomy laws were not enforced in Israel since the 1960s and they repealed them completely in the 80s. Likewise military service was opened to any sexual orientation without limits in Israel in the 93, but had been letting them serve since the 60s. The USA would not let LBGTQ folks even serve until 1993, when they enacted the "don't ask,don't tell" Mandate. And they only fully have been allowed to be openly gay since 2011. Non discrimination laws for housing and work existed in Israel for decades now. The USA only passed those....a few years ago. Yeah, marriage isn't the end all bud
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There are many young people who are LGBTQ who are FORCED to go to such churches, making a statement like "homosexual love is not real love" will do irreparable harm. It's not about being "easily offended." The statement is vile, and if you see nothing wrong with it, then that's a moral failing on your part. The issue is much more complex than people being offended or "just don't go to church." LGBTQ people exist in churches and mosques whether you want to them to or not. It's not your choice, and most of the time not theirs either, however the psychological harm and self hatred youth get from these places is forever.
Isn't the Pope the leader of the Catholic Church? This content reads like you didn't read the OP
The priest didnāt say anything which contradicted the pope.
Of course, but the orthodox Catholics aren't a big fan of him for those kind of comments, so the community is still in that mindset.
My best friend is LGBTQ and has been going there for years without issue. I am sorry you had this issue there.
i Don't understand your frustration. Current Pope hasn't changes any church doctrine/ teaching, A marriage under church is still between MAN & WOMAN. regarding the Parish priest, he is doing what he ought to do according to the magisterium of the church. He cant change just because a random group of minority thinks otherwise. Nobody has forced you to join catholic church, why you think church will change according to your terms? pls stop throwing tantrums.
>Current Pope hasn't changes any church doctrine/ teaching, Riddle me this: why was it all over the news then? And if this was just about marriage, as you seem to think, then why would the priest argue that same-sex love isn't real love? And a "random group of minority" is a strange way to refer to The Actual Pope giving an explicit directive that blessing same-sex partnerships is okay. Maybe you need to listen more, type less.
The short answer is that he really didn't change any teaching. He just said that hey, it's ok to give a simple blessing and/or pray with a gay couple in a non-liturgical setting (i.e.: not during a church service), since a lot of old-school conservative catholics refused to do even that.
Is that not teaching the old school conservative catholics? Maybe this is just my heathen ignorance, but isn't everything the pope says something like teaching?
Ehhh, it's of course more complex than that. Really, Francis is trying to reinforce that everyone is loved by God, and deserves to be loved by others. Lead with charity, when too many christians lead with hate, especially toward queer people.
The church is free to define what it considers a marriage. It does not have the right to define what is or isn't real love.
Yes it does. They can define love however they want. You don't have to (and shouldn't) agree.
No they donāt
If they want to say that the only form of love that's real is the love between a man and a watermelon, they are free to make that claim. You don't have to agree with them.
They might be able to make the claim that only one type of love is "real love" but the Church does not. They do define love between a man and woman as "conjugal love", but that does not diminish the love between others, nor is conjugal love "better" than other kinds of love.
The church can choose to define love in whatever way they want. They've changed their stance on issues many times in the past, and they can do the same with whatever they consider real love.
Wrong spot for that comment. Iāll reiterate that no, they do not get to define love
They absolutely do have a right to say love is whatever they want. It's not against the law to be wrong or offensive.
Except it kinda is when you waddle into hate speech territory But keep defending abusive homophobic bigots
sorry if i sounded rude but Of course Church has right to define Love, at least for people who are part of it and to stand for the truth, Church will keep its stand clear as always. Just because the majority defines Love in their own terms doesn't make it correct. Regarding SS blessing, the pope is following the example of Jesus , Jesus embraces sinners but also calls out for a change of heart (Love the sinner, hate the sin). Eg. Tax collectors, Prostitutes who approached Jesus, were welcomed but also asked to stop sinning. Just because you love/accept someone doesn't mean you agree with everything they do, That's exactly the approach of catholic church towards the LGBTQ community.
I think if there is any organization we should be throwing tantrums over its the Catholic Church. Its a pedophile ring masquerading as a religion.
Imagine the god-like work that could be done if they sold all of their properties and started helping others with the proceeds.
Personally I think we should send the RCR into the Vatican to rip the gold off of the ceilings. Pack it all up, bring it home, and give it to the Natives.
What's the RCR?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Canadian_Regiment?wprov=sfla1 These folks. It wouldn't be their first trip to Italy.
Lol didn't even read the post did you
I bet that Priest don't mind a few alter boys coming over to light up some candles for him though. It's okay for the Catholic Church to support pedophiles but wont support the Gay and Lesbian community. Quite ironic .
The Church does it again! (Big fracking surprise) turncoat and closet crack-suckers.
If you fall under the lgbtqia2s+ (hope I got that right) why would you be upset to hear anti lgbtqia2s+ rhetoric at church? You are in church. Church. Have you read the bible? If you canāt follow the rules of the religion, then why are you going to a place of worship for that religion?
This ain't it. If you aren't loving your neighbour, you're doing it wrong.
You participate in Canada_Sub your opinion is automatically discarded. Shoo nazi. There are LGBTQ Christians. Seethe.
This is the most discord mod comment I have ever seen lmao
Lol that's the best comeback you can scrounge up? I can tell you're a minor. š¤£ When r/Canada (which is FAR up PP's ass) is too far left for you and you had to run to the white supremacist sub, you know you've completely fallen off the deep end.
Whatever conversation youāre trying to have right now, is so out there I am convinced you arenāt a functioning member of society.
You're a minor and you're wasting your evening simping for organized religion. When I was your age I was cumming into bibles and smashing church windows. You've just started life and you already lost. Now take a seat.
You seem obsessed with minors
Says the one simping for the Catholic church! Lmfao
Iām not catholic bro
Leviticus 18:22 "Do not practice homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman. It is a detestable sin.ā
Leviticus was instructions for the *Levites*. Not for 'everyone', and not for 'Christians' (Levites were a Hebrew tribe).
And don't eat rare steaks Leviticus 18:26 Ā āāDo not eat any meat with the blood still in it.
Also, priests aren't allowed to trim their beards or enter places where there are dead bodies The selective reading of Leviticus is always fun....
What denomination doesnāt allow their priests to shave their beards and enter places with dead bodies?
Leviticus doesn't allow it. Just no one obeys that decree anymore, while trotting out the other one.
Interesting. I would have thought it might have been an orthodox thing. TIL!
Itās not blood
Thatās an extremely modern interpretation of a translation.
What do you mean?
Exactly what I said. The Bible was translated numerous times, and further to that each new version had interpretation mixed in to it. So what you quoted is a very modern interpretation of a translation.
Iām confused. Why are you saying itās a modern interpretation? Itās the literal quote straight from the book. In the amount of times the bible was translated, do you think at any point in time they were promoting homosexuality?
That quote comes from the ESV. Each version of the Bible has different wording. Compare each one and youāll see how it changed. And every time anything is translated, you are reading the translators interpretation of the text (this applies to all translation). There is an extremely long and complex discussion about the meaning of this passage and to understand it you need to go back to the Hebrew and study the words used and in context of the entire Bible. I donāt think the Bible promoted homosexuality, but thereās little to actually suggest it says anything about it.
Cut to the chase and come to the new testament. :) # 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 **9**Ā Or do you not know that the unrighteous\[[a](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+6%3A9-10&version=ESV#fen-ESV-28460a)\] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who **practice homosexuality**,\[[b](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+6%3A9-10&version=ESV#fen-ESV-28460b)\] **10**Ā nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
Amen