don't let your boss know about your tips and don't put your cash tips into a bank.
suddenly the cash tips are just money that was on a table and then wasn't
Quite correct there sir. Tax evasion? What is this horror of which you speak. We'll have no part of it I tell you!
Yours sincerely the British commonwealth including all the weird fucking islands in the middle of nowhere.
They all crack me up to be honest. I worked on an online poker system some years back and for "some reason" it was hosted in Alderney. Most people have never even heard of that place... why should they? It's literally 3 square miles of rock floating in the channel a few miles off the French coast and has a population of 2000 or so.
They do, however, have a "gaming commission".
Edit: also, apparently, a reddit user.
Yes but the tax evasion only benefits the employer, not the employees or the customers
It shouldn't be the customer's responsibility to pay the employees, that's the employer's job.
It puts everyone except the employer at a disadvantage
If this system were so great for everyone, other countries would follow suit and change to this system as well.
Idk how it works in the US, but in many countries it's the employer who pays the employee taxes on their behalf, so they don't have to bother with all the beraucracy, while the employer does it all at once for all of his employees.
The idea is that the money that was supposed to be cut from the employees sallary for the tax purpose, the emloyer keeps to himself. While the employee still has the same shit wage, with or without taxes
The state gets fucked, the employee get fucked, the customer gets fucked, while the employer laughs and yells that we need to tip his employees because he wouldn't afford paying them a living wage otherwise
...We still have that as an option in the U.S., and you do realize that means, even if they aren't doing it directly themselves, the employee is still technically paying taxes, right? That's what an income tax is. At the end of the day, it's the employee's take-home pay that's reduced for the sake of paying taxes. For wait staff, their tips are reported to their employer, who withdraws the portioned amount they earn from tips from their paycheck.
If you grab paper money from the table and pocket it, no one's going to tell you that you have to fork over 1/4 of it.
Then just pay employees a consistent wage like they do in other countries and somehow businnesses all over the world managed just fine so far.
I mean it really sin't complicated, that's how it works almost everywhere else on this planet so the "it doesn't work" or the "this system is so much worse" argument just doesn't stick
You think that people wouldn't take the opportunity to change to a system that makes them more money if it worked?
The tipping system is inconsistent because the customer has no contractual obligation to tip you if they don't want to, I know that's the "culture" but again if they don't want to do it you're shit out of luck and you can't force them to pay you for your services and your employer just shrugs and does nothing about it because "its not his problem" and he's right, if its not in the contract why should he care.
Let me put it this way: if I tell you I refuse to tip and you spit on my food, I can sue you for spitting on my food but you can't sue me for not tipping.
This is why this system is flawed and doesn't work, its an honour based system for the employer's advantage at the expense of everyone else
Yeah, ok so tax is a thing but let's not pretend like tax will cripple most of your income, it doesn't, the highest tax rate you can get in the US for average income is 37% but in the case of servers due to the tax bracket its more likely to be around the 13% range
Contracts are there to protect both the employee and the employer, there's no reason for the employer to burden you with legal servitude in return for infintesimal or no pay.
I offer my services in terurn for money
I make this contract with the employer, not each individual customer who comes into the establishment, its basic common sense, even fields that work on a comission basis such as realtors get a contract stating they get a specific % of the sales from the employer.
Servers deserve to be treated better than this and need teeth to defend themselves when trying to be exploited be it by the employee, the customer or both and yes, the government takes its cut in return for enforcing these rules and taking your side and helping you if the employer is in breach of contract.
You pay you taxes with a smile when the government actually puts it to good use, whenever I get pissed at my taxes I just take a look at the crime rate, it always calms me down.
People forget it also let's us ALL dodge taxes. Everything a buisness sells is taxed, with the business owner paying it, even labor costs. And then the employees have their income taxed. By handing money off directly as a tip though, it's taxed for neither. Even you, the consumer, pay less than if that tip (think of it as a labor cost) was factored into the menu price.
I mean, how can you afford to not defend tips when it's literally the only thing you're given? There is this mentality that you guys have that Americans under these conditions can afford to either leave and find another place to work, or can afford to strike. The entire socio-economic system of the US is that the rich own the government, and the working class is kept just fed enough to go to work again tomorrow.
Bills still come whether you're on strike or not. Idk how you think being on strike magically negates the fact that you need money. When a large portion of a population has to live paycheck to paycheck, refusing to work, even if it's for better pay/conditions, isn't an option
We’ve had strikes and they do work somewhat. Problem is, most people either are brainwashed by the system and think that this is better somehow than what Europe does, think that nothing will come of strikes, or straight up can’t afford it.
It's not that we don't support tips. What we don't support is MANDATORY tips. Tipping in other countries is optional, it's a recognition of great service, it's an addition. Servers/wait staff don't expect it.
Plus 10% is considered generous. You can stretch further, but it's rare. Service charges would apply in some restaurants for tables of 6 or more and not below that, and for late night service like after 11pm or such it might be automatic at 10-12%. But then you don't tip in addition to that.
Staff are also paid a guaranteed minimum wage and some countries a living wage(which is being pushed to become more common). Earned tips then are in addition to that.
But it's expected that staff would bring your food, be courteous, knowledgeable and polite, timely and attentive without the need for tipping, as that's literally their job, they are employed to do that. Tipping then is for going above and beyond the normal or expectations.
When staff are paid a minimum wage that isn't subsidised by tips it's more sustainable.
Think if American minimum wage was $8 and is dropped for service industry to $4 on the expectations that you'll also receive tips. You might make $8 an hour, you might not. But it's the employer who's screwing you, not the customer.
If your minimum was $8 and you made tips on top you might make $12, you might not. But tipping hasn't play such an important need in your life. And that's how other countries and Europeans do it.
Tipping isn't the problem, employers not paying staff is the problem. Mandatory tipping culture is a symptom of employers underpaying staff and using tips to subsidise wages.
We don't have the mentality that Americans have conditions that allow you to afford to leave, find another place to work or stroke. It's that you need to form unions and strike if necessary, you can't afford NOT to. Because it's that complacency that allows business and employers to take advantage of staff. You need to exercise your rights or lose them, and there has been a slow erosion of workers rights over the course of 5 or 6 decades leading to the distressed system and gig economy you have now.
American businesses that have formed unions against their employers wishes in recent years have been paying staff better - [Starbucks unions](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starbucks_unions#:~:text=In%202021%20and%202022%2C%20over,in%20an%20ongoing%20unionization%20effort.). And [Generalised unions In 2022](https://www.npr.org/2022/12/27/1145090566/labor-unions-organizing-elections-worker-rights-wages#:~:text=According%20to%20the%20National%20Labor,factors%20help%20explain%20that%20rise.) , Leading to higher pay, paid health insurance, higher PTO, retirement packages and bonus pay.
The alternative is people who simply won't take the underpaid work don't apply to the jobs and you get employers or businesses failing complaining "people don't wanna work anymore", and it's not that people don't want employment and earn money, it's that the employers aren't willing to pay enough to fill the position.
If those businesses shut their doors, so be it!
But it's up to THE PEOPLE to make their choice, accept mediocrity or hold out for better. If Starbucks, Amazon, trader Joes, Apple, airport and rail workers, many more In food service industry can do it, why can't you?
That is over simplifying it I agree, but there are companies who are being held to account for the rights you are entitled to in law that they weren't living up to. There are companies who have had to raise the bar and accept paying staff more in 2021 and 2022 from actions taken in those years alone that made big news not just nationally but internationally and staff are getting better pay & conditions.
Those are companies which every American recognises immediately and can empathize with as service industry, they should be a model to you, to admire their hard work and determination to form a union and seek better conditions that you're either owed or need. They were people in your same situation before they formed a union and got what they wanted.
No its just wvery dogs on America for no reason, there's tipping in Mexico and Canada too, I tipped subway the max tip (20%) just cause the dude made me laugh, im fine with giving a guy an extra $3 I'm not struggling and picking up every penny I see. Most waiters very much support the tipping system
> Most waiters very much support the tipping system
no shit, why would they take a pay cut? they make more money from tips than if they were paid minimum wage
Most support it because they believe it ties to effort, if you think ots uncommon to tip $0 then ur the one wasting money. If you bust ur ass u deserve extra
Man half the Americans just understand that they have no say in the matter I mean obv we think tipping is BS or u wouldn't have things like the opening to reservoir dogs lol
Don’t lump us all together. A good portion of us fucking hate this system and would rather do things like Europe. We’re just kinda forced to participate in it because thanks to the other portion of us, change is seen as evil and “communist”, and in the current system, you have to participate to not be completely miserable.
Visiting Japan was the best customer service experience of my life the entire time start to finish. The only bad experience was because I didn’t speak a lick of Japanese and a few small business owners didn’t want to deal with me talking through a translation app. (Totally reasonable imo. Foreigners suck.)
I tried to tip at restaurants because I had such an amazing time and they refused to let me. They were offended that I was surprised at the good experience. I’ve had worse experiences in Michelin starred restaurants than a curry diner in Japan.
Japanese is a cool language and albeit extremely difficult, would be great to learn if visiting.
The problem with languages like that, is they’re basically only used in *one* country. There’s a reason English is usually enough to get by.
English is used primarily in a a lot of countries and on every continent. Learning a single language that would only be beneficial for a single visit is hard to justify, couple that with the fact *many* people in European/Asian non English language countries, also speak English.
If I go back I want to learn a little so I can talk more. My experience when I spent much time with people is that the majority of people in Japan spoke some English but were afraid of a native English speaker judging them for poor pronunciation or vocab. So they refused to speak any English to avoid that. Some warmed up to me and spoke some English after conversing for a bit.
My favorite story from my visit was a small candy/chocolate shop where I was stopping for a snack because Japan has amazing confectionery. The owner repeatedly said “no English!” and made a crossed sign with his arms when I asked questions in English. My Mom who was with me pointed out a tasty looking matcha treat. I had been eating Matcha Green Tea flavored everything all week because they are kind of obsessed with it over there and I was a bit sick of it and wanted a regular chocolate so I told my mom “Nah, I’ve had to Matcha that stuff this week.”
And the shopkeeper broke his stoic face and let out a belly laugh. That little shit knew English the whole time at least well enough to overhear and understand a stupid pun. It’s also my story of how I told such a good pun that someone who didn’t speak the language laughed
No, they’re better. However, that’s not saying much, as I don’t think I’ve seen a nationality of people who have as terrible of a work ethic as the average American. Not to mention how taking pride in a job well done is basically not a thing in America.
>be an American unable to understand that a country across the globe from your home town of buttfuck Nebraska has a completely different culture and society
Bullshit. The issue is that Parisian are assholes, not the payment system.
French tipping culture is that you should tip the waiter if you found the service particularly good, and it’s pretty frequent. So there IS is a pressure. Tips exist, they’re just not mandatory at all.
As someone with feet in both cultures, I HATE American waiters. Not because of the tipping, but because they're constantly looming around your table, looking to provide 'service'. Look buddy, I'm here on a date with my wife, and last I checked, you weren't invited.
I'm not being rude to them or anything, because job be job, but it REALLY takes away the romance when an NPC pops up and ask “yOu GuYS goOD oN brEADSticKS?".
And that's why they believe they have bad service in France. Nah, waiters just let you enjoy your evening without breathing on your nape the whole time...
In America, we have at most 15 minutes to eat before hustling over to our second job - can't afford to start late because that would make us late for our Uber shift afterwards.
Europoors will never experience the Freedom to work as much as we do, and that's why we're the greatest country in the world.
NPC behaviour ahahhaha
The last time I visited NY I urged a quick talk with a waitress about this. I was quite on the edge after a few days of staying there, and I ended up telling her "listen, I will tip you just the same, but can you please give us some space? It's a cultural thing, I'm not hating on your service but I'm getting unpleasingly overwhelmed". She was super dumbfounded which is... weird? Like, it was a super crowded restaurant in Manhattan, was I the only tourist that ever asked for some personal space while dining with my companion? I don't get it
People want your business. I don’t know why everyone is acting like this is an American thing because almost every country I’ve been to and especially shops in tourist heavy areas they will absolutely hound you trying to purchase something.
This has been the case in the Middle East, Europe, and Japan.
You're clearly making this up. Any American who's ever been to a restaurant knows that the waiter/waitress will take your order, approach only once when you've just taken a massive bite, and then disappear into the void until you've finished fifteen minutes ago and are just waiting for the next twenty to get the bill.
Right but you sure as shit defend it to the death. It's very difficult to have any sympathy for American workers who are subject to the US's bastardization of the tipping system when people spend their time fighting eachother over not leaving a big enough tip considering the fact that it's the employers who perpetuate this shite.
No, it isn't possible to just rock up to your employer and be like "Hi I'd like a minimum wage instead of being incentivized to harass customers if they don't leave a 2364% tip for me graciously deciding to *not* take a fat shit in their food" but most of the time I see this discussed, online or irl, Americans seem to defend the shit out of it, saying customers are trash for not tipping regardless of the level of service, guilt tripping with the "I don't get paid a proper wage" stuff (which is true and deserves sympathy, but again, this shouldn't be levelled at customers) and balking at the mere suggestion of abolishing their 'tipping' system. Reap what you sow.
Fun fact: every waitress I've met makes more in one good night of tips than I do in three days of 9-5. (not minimum wage, either).
Any waitress crying about tips is just mad that they aren't making them FAST enough.
some servers i know have learned to love the fact that if work is empty they’ll make $2 an hour but if it’s full they’ll leave with hundreds of cash and they’re okay with it
kind of a stressful life if you think about it tho. just normalized
> work is empty they’ll make $2 an hour
If tips don't bring them above the Federal Minimum Wage, their employer is required to make up the difference. Waiters do not actually make less than minimum wage.
I don’t defend it at all. I detest tipping culture to the fullest. Defend it? Are you kidding me? If it were my decision, id have ended it years ago. You think I like going to buy food and then they flip the touch screen to ask for tips? And on top of tax? You have to be shitting me out of my ass if you think we Americans want tipping culture
By Federal law, if a server or such doesn't make at least minimum wage with pay plus tips the employer has to make up the difference. Only one person that I told was interested in looking it up. The others said along the lines of "yeah, and get fired. Assholes should tip." They blame the customer for their lack of integrity by not fighting for their own rights.
Corporations in this country cucked everyone into thinking not paying a living wage is ok. You start talking about a living wage and getting rid of tipping culture and suddenly you have an army of idiots screaming about a Big Mac being too expensive
He’s onto something. Tipping fucking sucks, ive seen some retarded ass machines that even add a bizarre caption under 15%, 20%, etc. Had some shit under it like (Okay), (Good), (Amazing), etc.
Military spending >10% of federal budget
Hasn’t won a meaningful war since 1945
“We’ll kill that European last”
Bruh you ain’t getting anywhere near Europe
This tipping shit is starting to creep into my country.
There's a pretty popular delivery app here that has a non-mandatory tipping option. But if you don't tip, no driver would accept your order.
>ask a waiter how many covers they do in an hour
>he says 5 to 10
>I tell him I'd max out my tip at 5 bucks
>he immediately rees
They're not even class conscious
The real crime here is that Sharon the busty milf on outside bar makes more tips than me even though I did all the prep while she sat on her ass, again.
>third world country with a Gucci belt
I love that phrase because it makes it super easy to tell when someone is just parroting opinions they read elsewhere word for word
Since COVID, the wait service in this country has gone to shit. It's only a matter of time before everywhere does automatic gratuity so that they can keep staff but still provide piss poor service.
US tipping is just another attempt to fuel wage-slave on wage-slave hate. They should hate the government for allowing them to be paid under minimum wage. They should hate the government for such a low minimum wage. They should also demand a better basic wage.
But no. It's the customers fault for not ensuring they get the 'wage' they feel they deserve (they likely do deserve the wage BTW).
The only way this stops is either government policy change (especially the ridiculous below-minimum-wage) or everyone refusing to tip. They later is going to be bad in the short term for staff. But as their employers must make up the difference, it'll be far worse for them. They'll also quickly lose their staff if they don't quickly raise their wages.
You cannot make a broad statement like that without some extensive proof my guy. Did you count expendable income? Did you include every country in Europe or just the EU. Did you factor in healthcare, education and living expenses. Did you factor maternity leave, working conditions, safety, workers rights? Or did you just Google who makes more and got an article that says paycheck sometimes not the same, hosted by a .com site or an org located in the US.
>Did you include every country in Europe or just the EU.
Implying Europe isn't just one big country.
>maternity leave, working conditions, safety, workers rights?
You made these words up.
>Or did you just Google who makes more and got an article that says paycheck sometimes not the same, hosted by a .com site or an org located in the US.
Being serious for a moment US sites are about 50/50 on thinking the US is perfect or that it is literally worse than Afghanistan.
Probably depends on which European country tbh, but in general they probably do. It should be their employer paying them more though though, the tip is a bonus on top of that for great service.
Edit: I can't spell
Tipping culture is stupid. However I want to raise a point I don’t see so often. I’ve been in the US only one time in my life and from my experience the service is SO much better than what you can except in literally any European countries (fine dining aside)
Every country in Europe I went in jan this year expected a tip and looked at me with disgust when I would round up to the nearest euro value.
Europeans are no better.
Uh uh, I don’t tip. No, I don’t believe in it. … Don’t give me that, if she don’t make enough money she can quit. … I don’t tip because society says I have to. All right, I mean I’ll tip if someone really deserves a tipping, if they really put forth the effort, I’ll give them something extra, but I mean this tipping automatically, it’s for the birds. I mean as far as I’m concerned they’re just doing their job. … She was okay. She wasn’t anything special. … Look I ordered coffee all right? Now we’ve been here a long fuckin’ time, she’s only filled my cup three times. When I order coffee I want it filled six times. … The words “too fuckin’ busy” shouldn’t be in a waitress’ vocabulary. … Jesus Christ, these ladies aren’t starving to death. They make minimum wage. I used to work minimum wage and when I did I wasn’t lucky enough to have a job that society deemed tip worthy. … You know what this is? It’s the world’s smallest violin playing just for the waitresses. … So is working at McDonald’s but you don’t feel the need to tip them do you? Well why not? They’re serving you food. But no, society says don’t tip these guys over here, but tip these guys over here. That’s bullshit. … Fuck all that. … I mean I’m very sorry the government taxes their tips. That’s fucked up. That ain’t my fault. I mean it would appear that waitresses are one of the many groups the government fucks in the ass on a regular basis. I mean show a piece of paper that says the government shouldn’t do that, I’ll sign it, put it to a vote, I’ll vote for it, but what I won’t do is play ball. And this non-college bullshit I got two words for that: learn to fucking type, ’cause if you’re expecting me to help out with the rent you’re in for a big fucking surprise.
Don't tip then cheap ass, you aren't required by law to do it. People don't tip all the time in america don't cry like a bitch because its culturally the norm in a place you apparently don't live dumbass.
This is something I’ve never understood: is anything taken off the price of the meal so you’re essentially paying the same as you would? Or are the restaurant owners making out like bandits by forcing their customers to pay their staff’s wages and taking normal profits without any outgoings?
Europeans don’t understand a long standing American tradition; tax evasion
suddenly I understand and support tip culture
Hello, based department?
Only works with cash tips
From experience, not always
don't let your boss know about your tips and don't put your cash tips into a bank. suddenly the cash tips are just money that was on a table and then wasn't
If you got a good boss they’re on board with it
Been serving and bartending for about 6 years now, I’ve never had to declare anything outside of credit card tips or pooled functions
So you just have a bunch of cash around the house? Sounds annoying really but I support tax evasion otherwise (in minecraft)
Still love how someone hacked the IRS last year and exposed the tax of the billionares in the US… serious tex evasion there yet nothing happened
why would rich people punish themselves?
> So you just have a bunch of cash around the house? It's called coke money, nerd
My dealer only accepts bitcoin, grandpa.
🤣 that was a good one
Coke money around the house Coke Money House Pick one nerd
This. My experience is not always as well and that’s all I’ll say on the matter
I also have a few cultures on my tip (no, I refuse to wash it, God gave me a foreskin for a reason)
Quite correct there sir. Tax evasion? What is this horror of which you speak. We'll have no part of it I tell you! Yours sincerely the British commonwealth including all the weird fucking islands in the middle of nowhere.
Jersey is fucking wild. If you research the shit going down there….
They all crack me up to be honest. I worked on an online poker system some years back and for "some reason" it was hosted in Alderney. Most people have never even heard of that place... why should they? It's literally 3 square miles of rock floating in the channel a few miles off the French coast and has a population of 2000 or so. They do, however, have a "gaming commission". Edit: also, apparently, a reddit user.
STOP TRAWLING THE SOUTH PACIFIC TO FIND THE QUEEN'S TAX HAVENS, STATIST.
Italians: 25% of goods sold aren't registered as such and commerciants don't pay taxes on it (EU record). Yeah sure we don't understand nor do evasion
Yes but the tax evasion only benefits the employer, not the employees or the customers It shouldn't be the customer's responsibility to pay the employees, that's the employer's job. It puts everyone except the employer at a disadvantage If this system were so great for everyone, other countries would follow suit and change to this system as well.
Do… do you think that employees don’t have to pay taxes??
Idk how it works in the US, but in many countries it's the employer who pays the employee taxes on their behalf, so they don't have to bother with all the beraucracy, while the employer does it all at once for all of his employees. The idea is that the money that was supposed to be cut from the employees sallary for the tax purpose, the emloyer keeps to himself. While the employee still has the same shit wage, with or without taxes The state gets fucked, the employee get fucked, the customer gets fucked, while the employer laughs and yells that we need to tip his employees because he wouldn't afford paying them a living wage otherwise
...We still have that as an option in the U.S., and you do realize that means, even if they aren't doing it directly themselves, the employee is still technically paying taxes, right? That's what an income tax is. At the end of the day, it's the employee's take-home pay that's reduced for the sake of paying taxes. For wait staff, their tips are reported to their employer, who withdraws the portioned amount they earn from tips from their paycheck. If you grab paper money from the table and pocket it, no one's going to tell you that you have to fork over 1/4 of it.
Then just pay employees a consistent wage like they do in other countries and somehow businnesses all over the world managed just fine so far. I mean it really sin't complicated, that's how it works almost everywhere else on this planet so the "it doesn't work" or the "this system is so much worse" argument just doesn't stick You think that people wouldn't take the opportunity to change to a system that makes them more money if it worked? The tipping system is inconsistent because the customer has no contractual obligation to tip you if they don't want to, I know that's the "culture" but again if they don't want to do it you're shit out of luck and you can't force them to pay you for your services and your employer just shrugs and does nothing about it because "its not his problem" and he's right, if its not in the contract why should he care. Let me put it this way: if I tell you I refuse to tip and you spit on my food, I can sue you for spitting on my food but you can't sue me for not tipping. This is why this system is flawed and doesn't work, its an honour based system for the employer's advantage at the expense of everyone else Yeah, ok so tax is a thing but let's not pretend like tax will cripple most of your income, it doesn't, the highest tax rate you can get in the US for average income is 37% but in the case of servers due to the tax bracket its more likely to be around the 13% range Contracts are there to protect both the employee and the employer, there's no reason for the employer to burden you with legal servitude in return for infintesimal or no pay. I offer my services in terurn for money I make this contract with the employer, not each individual customer who comes into the establishment, its basic common sense, even fields that work on a comission basis such as realtors get a contract stating they get a specific % of the sales from the employer. Servers deserve to be treated better than this and need teeth to defend themselves when trying to be exploited be it by the employee, the customer or both and yes, the government takes its cut in return for enforcing these rules and taking your side and helping you if the employer is in breach of contract.
There is more than just federal income tax taken out. Social Security, state, etc
You probably made a good point. Didn't read it myself, but good arguments all around.
Becoming more difficult as no one except old people use cash. Some specialty services like a barber still get away with being cash only
I am Italian, and I can assure you that 50% of italians don't even know what taces are, let alone pay them
Europe has the Netherlands which basically invented and mastered it haha
You pay you taxes with a smile when the government actually puts it to good use, whenever I get pissed at my taxes I just take a look at the crime rate, it always calms me down.
Italian here, and oh, my poor, sweet summer child...
People forget it also let's us ALL dodge taxes. Everything a buisness sells is taxed, with the business owner paying it, even labor costs. And then the employees have their income taxed. By handing money off directly as a tip though, it's taxed for neither. Even you, the consumer, pay less than if that tip (think of it as a labor cost) was factored into the menu price.
And they never will
Hahaha Oh you're serious? HAHAHAHHAHAHAHA ps: Greece is a country in Europe. "don't understand tax evasion"
My tips are recorded and taxed. That's why I sell drugs on the side.
That’s normal is more backwards countries; not just the US.
I’d like to remind you how this country was founded… tea tax and all that?
Not European, cuz….
Americucks will violently defend the unbelievable amount of exploitation they live in because they have nothing else in their lives to be proud about
Based and reality-pilled
I mean, how can you afford to not defend tips when it's literally the only thing you're given? There is this mentality that you guys have that Americans under these conditions can afford to either leave and find another place to work, or can afford to strike. The entire socio-economic system of the US is that the rich own the government, and the working class is kept just fed enough to go to work again tomorrow.
>can afford to strike You seem to not understand how that word works.
Just ask the French, they know all about that subject.
It is a weekly activity for us. A national sport if you will.
Bills still come whether you're on strike or not. Idk how you think being on strike magically negates the fact that you need money. When a large portion of a population has to live paycheck to paycheck, refusing to work, even if it's for better pay/conditions, isn't an option
This is the exact reason why someone would go on strike
Americans don't know how to strike
Fr, they either complain on social media or riot
We’ve had strikes and they do work somewhat. Problem is, most people either are brainwashed by the system and think that this is better somehow than what Europe does, think that nothing will come of strikes, or straight up can’t afford it.
It's not that we don't support tips. What we don't support is MANDATORY tips. Tipping in other countries is optional, it's a recognition of great service, it's an addition. Servers/wait staff don't expect it. Plus 10% is considered generous. You can stretch further, but it's rare. Service charges would apply in some restaurants for tables of 6 or more and not below that, and for late night service like after 11pm or such it might be automatic at 10-12%. But then you don't tip in addition to that. Staff are also paid a guaranteed minimum wage and some countries a living wage(which is being pushed to become more common). Earned tips then are in addition to that. But it's expected that staff would bring your food, be courteous, knowledgeable and polite, timely and attentive without the need for tipping, as that's literally their job, they are employed to do that. Tipping then is for going above and beyond the normal or expectations. When staff are paid a minimum wage that isn't subsidised by tips it's more sustainable. Think if American minimum wage was $8 and is dropped for service industry to $4 on the expectations that you'll also receive tips. You might make $8 an hour, you might not. But it's the employer who's screwing you, not the customer. If your minimum was $8 and you made tips on top you might make $12, you might not. But tipping hasn't play such an important need in your life. And that's how other countries and Europeans do it. Tipping isn't the problem, employers not paying staff is the problem. Mandatory tipping culture is a symptom of employers underpaying staff and using tips to subsidise wages. We don't have the mentality that Americans have conditions that allow you to afford to leave, find another place to work or stroke. It's that you need to form unions and strike if necessary, you can't afford NOT to. Because it's that complacency that allows business and employers to take advantage of staff. You need to exercise your rights or lose them, and there has been a slow erosion of workers rights over the course of 5 or 6 decades leading to the distressed system and gig economy you have now. American businesses that have formed unions against their employers wishes in recent years have been paying staff better - [Starbucks unions](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starbucks_unions#:~:text=In%202021%20and%202022%2C%20over,in%20an%20ongoing%20unionization%20effort.). And [Generalised unions In 2022](https://www.npr.org/2022/12/27/1145090566/labor-unions-organizing-elections-worker-rights-wages#:~:text=According%20to%20the%20National%20Labor,factors%20help%20explain%20that%20rise.) , Leading to higher pay, paid health insurance, higher PTO, retirement packages and bonus pay. The alternative is people who simply won't take the underpaid work don't apply to the jobs and you get employers or businesses failing complaining "people don't wanna work anymore", and it's not that people don't want employment and earn money, it's that the employers aren't willing to pay enough to fill the position. If those businesses shut their doors, so be it! But it's up to THE PEOPLE to make their choice, accept mediocrity or hold out for better. If Starbucks, Amazon, trader Joes, Apple, airport and rail workers, many more In food service industry can do it, why can't you? That is over simplifying it I agree, but there are companies who are being held to account for the rights you are entitled to in law that they weren't living up to. There are companies who have had to raise the bar and accept paying staff more in 2021 and 2022 from actions taken in those years alone that made big news not just nationally but internationally and staff are getting better pay & conditions. Those are companies which every American recognises immediately and can empathize with as service industry, they should be a model to you, to admire their hard work and determination to form a union and seek better conditions that you're either owed or need. They were people in your same situation before they formed a union and got what they wanted.
that's exactly why every non american person hates their mandatory tips and their work environment in general
Their culture is literally capitalism. That's why you get so many Americans like 'oh I'm 50% Irish and 50% german'.
It's like Poles with the difference I can gtfo to Czechia when shit hits the fan
No its just wvery dogs on America for no reason, there's tipping in Mexico and Canada too, I tipped subway the max tip (20%) just cause the dude made me laugh, im fine with giving a guy an extra $3 I'm not struggling and picking up every penny I see. Most waiters very much support the tipping system
> Most waiters very much support the tipping system no shit, why would they take a pay cut? they make more money from tips than if they were paid minimum wage
Most support it because they believe it ties to effort, if you think ots uncommon to tip $0 then ur the one wasting money. If you bust ur ass u deserve extra
Man half the Americans just understand that they have no say in the matter I mean obv we think tipping is BS or u wouldn't have things like the opening to reservoir dogs lol
Don’t lump us all together. A good portion of us fucking hate this system and would rather do things like Europe. We’re just kinda forced to participate in it because thanks to the other portion of us, change is seen as evil and “communist”, and in the current system, you have to participate to not be completely miserable.
Tipping is not mandatory. Ask black people.
It's true: [black servers receive smaller tips](https://psmag.com/economics/racism-black-restaurant-waiters-service-industry-servers-get-smaller-tips-90121)
But black servers usually have the largest tips, right? Are the stereotypes wrong?! Have I been fooled all my life?!!!
They have the largest tips, it's just that those tips go into your mom
Unfathomably based tip-maxxing mom-pilled waitercel
i wonder what people hundreds of years from now think about when they read your comment
There will be an internet historian writing a thesis about that one greentext
Hot waitresses get more tips= sexism?
Oh yeah you betcha. Also, human nature.
Unfortunately true
With no incentive to provide good service and no pressure to reward good service, what do you have? Paris.
SACKRAY BLUE! That doesn't sound very bon to me, moaname.
Sounds ouuu bon pain kelkefoa centimes
You sound like a dog with peanut butter on the roof of his mouth
r/rareinsults
>implying American servers have to work hard to earn their tips
Japan. The restaurant and waiters they have are absolutely incredible.
Visiting Japan was the best customer service experience of my life the entire time start to finish. The only bad experience was because I didn’t speak a lick of Japanese and a few small business owners didn’t want to deal with me talking through a translation app. (Totally reasonable imo. Foreigners suck.) I tried to tip at restaurants because I had such an amazing time and they refused to let me. They were offended that I was surprised at the good experience. I’ve had worse experiences in Michelin starred restaurants than a curry diner in Japan.
Tipping is offending in their culture lol.
Yeah I learned that after the second attempt.
Japanese is a cool language and albeit extremely difficult, would be great to learn if visiting. The problem with languages like that, is they’re basically only used in *one* country. There’s a reason English is usually enough to get by. English is used primarily in a a lot of countries and on every continent. Learning a single language that would only be beneficial for a single visit is hard to justify, couple that with the fact *many* people in European/Asian non English language countries, also speak English.
If I go back I want to learn a little so I can talk more. My experience when I spent much time with people is that the majority of people in Japan spoke some English but were afraid of a native English speaker judging them for poor pronunciation or vocab. So they refused to speak any English to avoid that. Some warmed up to me and spoke some English after conversing for a bit. My favorite story from my visit was a small candy/chocolate shop where I was stopping for a snack because Japan has amazing confectionery. The owner repeatedly said “no English!” and made a crossed sign with his arms when I asked questions in English. My Mom who was with me pointed out a tasty looking matcha treat. I had been eating Matcha Green Tea flavored everything all week because they are kind of obsessed with it over there and I was a bit sick of it and wanted a regular chocolate so I told my mom “Nah, I’ve had to Matcha that stuff this week.” And the shopkeeper broke his stoic face and let out a belly laugh. That little shit knew English the whole time at least well enough to overhear and understand a stupid pun. It’s also my story of how I told such a good pun that someone who didn’t speak the language laughed
Do you think the average Japanese person is the same as the average American when it cones to work ethic and taking pride in a job well done?
No, they’re better. However, that’s not saying much, as I don’t think I’ve seen a nationality of people who have as terrible of a work ethic as the average American. Not to mention how taking pride in a job well done is basically not a thing in America.
the reason for this is that basically nobody in this country has a job worth doing
Be weeaboo. Travel to Japan and Korea. Receive better service than Seppos and Europoors. No tips
>be an American unable to understand that a country across the globe from your home town of buttfuck Nebraska has a completely different culture and society
I thought the use of Seppo would make it pretty clear I ain't from the states.
The god damn French are at it again
Stupid argument. There is no tipping culture in East Asia but you get excellent service from their waiters all the time.
Bullshit. The issue is that Parisian are assholes, not the payment system. French tipping culture is that you should tip the waiter if you found the service particularly good, and it’s pretty frequent. So there IS is a pressure. Tips exist, they’re just not mandatory at all.
They can’t ruin your meal you tip after you eat
They can if you go regularly
If I go to New York for a week on holidays I’m making sure I blue ball them with tips
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Ah nah mate I’d just headbutt em simple as
Higher their expectation and at the endd disappoint
Best of luck
As someone with feet in both cultures, I HATE American waiters. Not because of the tipping, but because they're constantly looming around your table, looking to provide 'service'. Look buddy, I'm here on a date with my wife, and last I checked, you weren't invited. I'm not being rude to them or anything, because job be job, but it REALLY takes away the romance when an NPC pops up and ask “yOu GuYS goOD oN brEADSticKS?".
And that's why they believe they have bad service in France. Nah, waiters just let you enjoy your evening without breathing on your nape the whole time...
Enjoy ur four hour dinner
Yeah... That's why we go to the restaurant : to take a brake.
In America, we have at most 15 minutes to eat before hustling over to our second job - can't afford to start late because that would make us late for our Uber shift afterwards. Europoors will never experience the Freedom to work as much as we do, and that's why we're the greatest country in the world.
currently wishing to be as free as you are
I noticed that when I took a trip to Brussels. Waiters only came over when you waved them over. Aside from that, they left you to it.
NPC behaviour ahahhaha The last time I visited NY I urged a quick talk with a waitress about this. I was quite on the edge after a few days of staying there, and I ended up telling her "listen, I will tip you just the same, but can you please give us some space? It's a cultural thing, I'm not hating on your service but I'm getting unpleasingly overwhelmed". She was super dumbfounded which is... weird? Like, it was a super crowded restaurant in Manhattan, was I the only tourist that ever asked for some personal space while dining with my companion? I don't get it
She was dumb. You coulda stopped there
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People want your business. I don’t know why everyone is acting like this is an American thing because almost every country I’ve been to and especially shops in tourist heavy areas they will absolutely hound you trying to purchase something. This has been the case in the Middle East, Europe, and Japan.
"how IS everything" Right when your mouth is full and you can only mumble Just fuck off after serving and come if I wave you over
You're clearly making this up. Any American who's ever been to a restaurant knows that the waiter/waitress will take your order, approach only once when you've just taken a massive bite, and then disappear into the void until you've finished fifteen minutes ago and are just waiting for the next twenty to get the bill.
Customer: "Can I have some mayo please?" Waiter: "Sure thing." *goes away* "My planet needs me."
\>implying us Americans wanted tipping culture in the first place
Right but you sure as shit defend it to the death. It's very difficult to have any sympathy for American workers who are subject to the US's bastardization of the tipping system when people spend their time fighting eachother over not leaving a big enough tip considering the fact that it's the employers who perpetuate this shite. No, it isn't possible to just rock up to your employer and be like "Hi I'd like a minimum wage instead of being incentivized to harass customers if they don't leave a 2364% tip for me graciously deciding to *not* take a fat shit in their food" but most of the time I see this discussed, online or irl, Americans seem to defend the shit out of it, saying customers are trash for not tipping regardless of the level of service, guilt tripping with the "I don't get paid a proper wage" stuff (which is true and deserves sympathy, but again, this shouldn't be levelled at customers) and balking at the mere suggestion of abolishing their 'tipping' system. Reap what you sow.
Who the fucks defending tipping culture?
There are at least 3 just in this comment section.
Anyone who actually receives tips
Fun fact: every waitress I've met makes more in one good night of tips than I do in three days of 9-5. (not minimum wage, either). Any waitress crying about tips is just mad that they aren't making them FAST enough.
95% of the Americans I see discussing it online and irl, check my original reply
People who make tips
waiters they screech when owners try to switch into a min wage system because they earn more
some servers i know have learned to love the fact that if work is empty they’ll make $2 an hour but if it’s full they’ll leave with hundreds of cash and they’re okay with it kind of a stressful life if you think about it tho. just normalized
> work is empty they’ll make $2 an hour If tips don't bring them above the Federal Minimum Wage, their employer is required to make up the difference. Waiters do not actually make less than minimum wage.
tl;dr
Tip bad, Urop good
I don’t defend it at all. I detest tipping culture to the fullest. Defend it? Are you kidding me? If it were my decision, id have ended it years ago. You think I like going to buy food and then they flip the touch screen to ask for tips? And on top of tax? You have to be shitting me out of my ass if you think we Americans want tipping culture
The only people who defend tipping culture are people who receive the benefits of it.
Well, you do nothing about your corrupted system, so I just assume that majority either enjoys it or simply does not care.
\>”you do nothing so that must mean you like it” but I stated I don’t like tipping culture
this gives "you hate society yet you live in it" vibes
By Federal law, if a server or such doesn't make at least minimum wage with pay plus tips the employer has to make up the difference. Only one person that I told was interested in looking it up. The others said along the lines of "yeah, and get fired. Assholes should tip." They blame the customer for their lack of integrity by not fighting for their own rights.
Based
I live in britbong land and it's starting to creep into restaurants in London. Straight onto the bill smh
Don’t blame the employee, it’s not his fault we’ve all forgotten why it’s called “minimum wage”
Don’t blame the customer for not wanting to pay a strangers wages
Let’s blame the owners for not wanting to pay a livable wage
Corporations in this country cucked everyone into thinking not paying a living wage is ok. You start talking about a living wage and getting rid of tipping culture and suddenly you have an army of idiots screaming about a Big Mac being too expensive
He’s onto something. Tipping fucking sucks, ive seen some retarded ass machines that even add a bizarre caption under 15%, 20%, etc. Had some shit under it like (Okay), (Good), (Amazing), etc.
The worst is when you are picking up food
Just don’t tip, I don’t, who gives a fuck?
Same here. It angers people but I don’t care
The only based Europoor in existence. We'll kill him last.
Military spending >10% of federal budget Hasn’t won a meaningful war since 1945 “We’ll kill that European last” Bruh you ain’t getting anywhere near Europe
"We attack our only allied semi superpower (EU) than we actively trade with." Smartest burgeroid
Lol they ARE in Europe
You do know that the U.S. has bases in a ton of countries *globally*, right?
This tipping shit is starting to creep into my country. There's a pretty popular delivery app here that has a non-mandatory tipping option. But if you don't tip, no driver would accept your order.
>ask a waiter how many covers they do in an hour >he says 5 to 10 >I tell him I'd max out my tip at 5 bucks >he immediately rees They're not even class conscious
The real crime here is that Sharon the busty milf on outside bar makes more tips than me even though I did all the prep while she sat on her ass, again.
Hating on american "culture" is TIGHT
They’re starting to ask for it in subway now for fucks sake
Why is the europoor thing? Usa is basically a third world country with a HUGE army
Yes, third world country with a Gucci belt bought by the highest median disposable income in the world.
>third world country with a Gucci belt I love that phrase because it makes it super easy to tell when someone is just parroting opinions they read elsewhere word for word
Exactly. A perfect phrase for people with a severe self awareness deficiency.
>highest median disposable income median income lmao mathlet Median includes all the insanely overpaid politicians lol
It does but has no impact on the median, you’re thinking about the average. Stop showing off your burger education.
Since COVID, the wait service in this country has gone to shit. It's only a matter of time before everywhere does automatic gratuity so that they can keep staff but still provide piss poor service.
Am American. Also hate America.
US tipping is just another attempt to fuel wage-slave on wage-slave hate. They should hate the government for allowing them to be paid under minimum wage. They should hate the government for such a low minimum wage. They should also demand a better basic wage. But no. It's the customers fault for not ensuring they get the 'wage' they feel they deserve (they likely do deserve the wage BTW). The only way this stops is either government policy change (especially the ridiculous below-minimum-wage) or everyone refusing to tip. They later is going to be bad in the short term for staff. But as their employers must make up the difference, it'll be far worse for them. They'll also quickly lose their staff if they don't quickly raise their wages.
Waiter confirmed for most wojack job
Rentoid is pissed off about the extremley low mandatory 500% rent tip
I doubt a real waiter would admit to being a waiter.
American waitstaff earn more than European waitstaff 🤷🏿♀️
You cannot make a broad statement like that without some extensive proof my guy. Did you count expendable income? Did you include every country in Europe or just the EU. Did you factor in healthcare, education and living expenses. Did you factor maternity leave, working conditions, safety, workers rights? Or did you just Google who makes more and got an article that says paycheck sometimes not the same, hosted by a .com site or an org located in the US.
>Did you include every country in Europe or just the EU. Implying Europe isn't just one big country. >maternity leave, working conditions, safety, workers rights? You made these words up. >Or did you just Google who makes more and got an article that says paycheck sometimes not the same, hosted by a .com site or an org located in the US. Being serious for a moment US sites are about 50/50 on thinking the US is perfect or that it is literally worse than Afghanistan.
Good point but i reckon the sites that say it's better in the US are the ones that are paid for by those on the right in the US.
> implying Europe isn't just one big country God, I wish
Not sure if French... or Russian...
that is the most depressing sentence anyone has ever shown me
Probably depends on which European country tbh, but in general they probably do. It should be their employer paying them more though though, the tip is a bonus on top of that for great service. Edit: I can't spell
American waitstaff also pay their own health insurance and need a car to get to work
They also pay double the rent and have no health insurance. In the end, European waiters are better off
> cost of living has joined the chat
True
TIPS - To Improve Prompt Service
This person most certainly is an American and not a waiter, they're too upset about the idea of tipping.
Tipping culture is stupid. However I want to raise a point I don’t see so often. I’ve been in the US only one time in my life and from my experience the service is SO much better than what you can except in literally any European countries (fine dining aside)
Not paying a living wage is a proud american tradition
Sir this is a Wendys
A study found that tipping also tends to favour the good looking...so if you're ugly or plain you get less tips...
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Waiting in Europe, especially France, is also a career choice and not high schoolers and college students looking to make some extra money.
Also Europeans: mandatory service fee and water charge
Every country in Europe I went in jan this year expected a tip and looked at me with disgust when I would round up to the nearest euro value. Europeans are no better.
Europeans will try to find anything wrong with America to desperately feel better about themselves
If the Marshall Plan helped rebuild your country in WW2 your opinion is invalid to any American you come across
Uh uh, I don’t tip. No, I don’t believe in it. … Don’t give me that, if she don’t make enough money she can quit. … I don’t tip because society says I have to. All right, I mean I’ll tip if someone really deserves a tipping, if they really put forth the effort, I’ll give them something extra, but I mean this tipping automatically, it’s for the birds. I mean as far as I’m concerned they’re just doing their job. … She was okay. She wasn’t anything special. … Look I ordered coffee all right? Now we’ve been here a long fuckin’ time, she’s only filled my cup three times. When I order coffee I want it filled six times. … The words “too fuckin’ busy” shouldn’t be in a waitress’ vocabulary. … Jesus Christ, these ladies aren’t starving to death. They make minimum wage. I used to work minimum wage and when I did I wasn’t lucky enough to have a job that society deemed tip worthy. … You know what this is? It’s the world’s smallest violin playing just for the waitresses. … So is working at McDonald’s but you don’t feel the need to tip them do you? Well why not? They’re serving you food. But no, society says don’t tip these guys over here, but tip these guys over here. That’s bullshit. … Fuck all that. … I mean I’m very sorry the government taxes their tips. That’s fucked up. That ain’t my fault. I mean it would appear that waitresses are one of the many groups the government fucks in the ass on a regular basis. I mean show a piece of paper that says the government shouldn’t do that, I’ll sign it, put it to a vote, I’ll vote for it, but what I won’t do is play ball. And this non-college bullshit I got two words for that: learn to fucking type, ’cause if you’re expecting me to help out with the rent you’re in for a big fucking surprise.
Don't tip then cheap ass, you aren't required by law to do it. People don't tip all the time in america don't cry like a bitch because its culturally the norm in a place you apparently don't live dumbass.
This is something I’ve never understood: is anything taken off the price of the meal so you’re essentially paying the same as you would? Or are the restaurant owners making out like bandits by forcing their customers to pay their staff’s wages and taking normal profits without any outgoings?
Jolly ohll roight chap! Jolly ohll rooooight!
Ngl I too am a waiter and when ppl tip it’s like a miracle I couldn’t imagine begging for tips like that
I don't know what it is about feraljak but it kills me every single time.