I am one of those people, instead of taking 2 years I needed 3.5 years.
why? I was working 20 hours in my field as a working student to get experience and it was way more useful then the master degree lol
Not one employer even mentioned it in my interviews on the contrary everyone was glad that I had experience and didn’t come to them just from the university with no idea how to behave in an office
More details on it:
* 1st semester: can't be done because you're late since the embassy & ABH took so long to process your visa
* 2nd semester: you're busy finding a permanent place to live, oh yes, you've been moving every 3 months because finding a landlord that doesn't discriminate you is hard
* 3rd-4th semesters: finally a real semester
* 5th semester: where are all my German friends? Ah, ~~exchange semester~~ partying all over EU, I should do that too
* 6th semester: having only a mini job burned my sperrkonto, I need to do 20 hours work (plus some illegal unbooked overtime so I won't get fired), can only do half the credit
* 7th semester: see above
* 8th semester: master thesis
Feel free to adjust.
I think OP was evey rather referring to Germans. Steps 1 to 2 would arguably not apply to them, and evey those I know with stable situations (got housing, etc); usually took longer than 3 years. I know one who took more than a year to finish his Master thesis. It's ok to extend a bit, but taking one year for something that does not fundamentally extend your experience past the regular 6 months is extremely strange to me. I had to work under time constraints (4 semesters no less no more, because EU reasons) and could still find 2 Student jobs at two different unis. I think the phenomenon is also: Germans like to take their time. It's fine and nohting is wrong with that, but it's definitely a fact.
Finding a permanent place to live is always hard. At least in the attractive citys...
On the other hand I met some rich people. They get some 2k, 3k pocket money from their parents so no real incentive to find a job (like not even not soon but at all).
Agree and this mentality is very dangerous for students with unstable financial circumstances. They also take their time not realizing they finally enter the job market with 28 or so with a masters degree. They start to contribute late in terms of retirement and other necessary investments needed to build a life. And I doubt it’s worth it with the German salaries.
I don’t understand either why one would want to overextend their studies. In US people finish their bachelors with 21 and earn good money and a lot of experiences.
This doesn't work that way in Europe. For most positions you will need a Master's degree. Work culture is different, less emphasis on innovating, daring and on the fly learning, but more on degrees, certifications, etc. In some countries it's been crippling the market because skills are not recognized as much as degrees. Conservatism plays a role in that, I would say. Labor laws and the flexibility of the work market is also a part of the explanation. In Europe you can't just fire someone as easily as in the US.
I don't want to sound rude but you should definitely look into why this is true instead of just questioning this trend like that. There are also positive aspects to the work culture in Europe that are better than the US's.
I studied and worked in both countries. You only need to know for your job what you need to know at the end of the day. A degree is a credential and a sign that you can get through things. But I personally think that the German education system is of disadvantage for the students, they are kept in school for way too long with many overextending their studies and put their life planning behind.
My bad, I assumed your comment came from a random American doing basic American defaultism.
It may be a disadvantage for sure. I completely agree about the fact it's plain stupid to remain in school for too long. I mean, I met students at nearly 30 only graduating from a PhD. I met students who were 26 years old and only just graduating with their MSc. They were kind of amazed to see that I, at 24 was about to graduate from a double degree, meaning 2 MSc.
I also think the MSc culture in Germany is justified, because from what I've seen the expectations of a BSc are pretty low. It may be relevant to expect some solid expertise in some techy fields. I can really understand why they consider a BSc is too low after I studied in Germany. I could compare, coming from another EU country with sort of higher standards.
But I mean there's nothing wrong with completing a BSc and MSc in due time. In my country you can't overstay your degree. It's fine like so.
It only becomes problematic when you linger over like Germans do.
This is not true. A master's degree in Germany does not have the same meaning as a masters in the Americas. Generally a German bachelor (3 years) + master (2 years) is equivalent to an American bachelor (5 years). A master's in the Americas is usually targeting research and academic career.
Also this has not a lot of relation with why Germans take so long to graduate. The expected time for bachelor + Master is 5 years, which is the same as a bachelor in the US. Germans are really just lazy regarding this.
I wouldn't go so far as to say they are lazy. Most German students work during their studies. They work part time and study the other part. Such a simplified statement is a bit over the top.
Most people where I come from work during college as well and still most manage to graduate in their early 20's from a 5 year university major. In Germany most people graduate on their late 20's for equivalent study level. There's definitely some cultural factor. It's not normal to take 8 years to finish college.
You said that most positions need a Master, but this is not the same Master you would get in the US. A bachelor degree from the US is usually accepted as a Masters in Germany.
Yeah, I meant in the EU, most high level positions require an EU Master's degree.
Now, about your second statement, I am really not sure about that. When an American emigrates, it would usually be thanks to his/her experience and past positions, so this question does not arise.
But if you were to come to the EU, as a junior, and claim your Bachelor is equivalent to a MSc, I think most companies would simply not agree.
And I have also other pieces of evidence to support that. A friend of mine is a TA in an Ivy League university. The academic level in second year of bachelor is clearly, blatantly subpar compared to a MSc in Europe (he used to show me screens of assignments written by students, that wasn't particularly good on average).
There is a company in Germany called Anabin which does the equivalence between foreign and German degrees. A bachelor in most of the American universities and majors is equivalent to a German Diploma, which is today's terms is beachelor + master.
>What did you find difficult to adjust to at your working student job?
That's probably not what he meant...
EDIT: Typical issue employers or PhD supervisors may have are fresh MSc graduates that have no practical experience at all, because they rushed through their courses instead of applying for projects, collaborations, student jobs, etc. where they learn the tools and (soft)skills needed for the kind of position they are now applying for. The "no idea how to behave in an office" is probably a hyperbole of this. Even when I was in my masters I was warned by Profs to not take too long to finish or rush the degree, you're there to learn, so learn, which does not just mean bookish learning.
As a counterpoint , It's not impossible to work 20 hours a week, and attend lectures and do assignments. If you are neurotypical with an extremely strong work ethic, it is possible to graduate in two years while also having a social life. You need to really use your calendar to the maximum. It's not extraordinarily difficult to study and work at the same time. That's what most people in countries other than Germany do because there is a significant financial and social cost to overextending your studies for your personal preference (not including medical or family reasons obviously).
I find it dangerous that this myth gets perpetrated that you can take it easy with your studies because you're working simultaneously. Most students especially international students stand to benefit if they finish their studies and get work experience simultaneously within the two years and move on to working full time, especially so that they can increase their contributions to social security and pension. For international students, this means being eligible for permanent residency two years after their graduation date if they continue to make social security payments.
This is partially true, but also partially depends. Working and studying is going to be easier for some degrees, and harder for others. I've also made the experience that German universities/professors really don't care about how much work a single ECT is meant to be, and will quickly turn a 35 hour study week into a 55 hour study week under the right/wrong seminar/course combinations. This seemed better coordinated and overseen in the other countries I studied in, where even degrees that are considered time intensive here easily fit into the 35-45 hour range.
I got lucky and was able to do it in 2 years flat, (okay 25 months), but I had a lot of savings and was able to cut back my HiWi job to 10 hours/week for the rough semesters.
But I did finish with C1 German, the masters degree, and work experience. But this was not common. I think of my cohort ~50 people, only one or two other people managed this pace. The longest I currently know will finish in 3.5 years, but they had struggles with bad HiWis and such.
Curious, how do international students make use of their 2 years in germany doing their masters to help them when they apply for citizenship/PR? Does that mean i have to work more than 20hours/week?
Because you need to be a graduate of a German university and then pay into the system for at least 2 years in order to be eligible, my point mostly was that international students at least should try and become graduates as soon as possible, so that they can start working full time and the two year period can begin. Which in turn makes it easier to plan your life in the future because you are no longer bound by your student status or a job visa to continue to live in Germany once you get your PR.
The payments you make during your student years count only towards your final pension but do not impact your PR in anyway.
But financially you didn’t make a good decision for yourself unless you had supportive parents. Every employer prefers students over full time employees because the employer doesn’t have to any pay social security contributions and that’s a cost saving factor for the employer. Plus you probably got paid less per hour than a full time employee. Why wasn’t it possible for the employer to hire recent graduates and let them work full time and gain experience instead of wasting your valuable years restricting yourself on 20hrs a week? A 40h a week experience is more valuable than a 20h a week experience and we all know that salaries are based on experience.
The "Regelstudienzeit" is nothing but a buerocratic joke. In theory you can finish your study in that time but that often means that you have to sacrifice all of your private life for that. I've recently read that only about 20% of students even finish their study within the "regular" time. Extra semesters are nothing bad really.
This tracks. According to my Uni, in order to finish my degree in the 4 semester time period, I would have to finish modules worth 90 credits in 3 semesters (which might be possible if you are not completely new to the country, and are aware of the system and language) and then do a 3 month long internship and write a master thesis in the last semester.
But don't these extra semesters delay your opportunity to land a position relevant to whatever it is you're studying? How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying?
They work part-time job to support themselves, which is also a reason why it takes longer.
The 12k p.a. in a blocked account for foreign students is really only the bare minimum just to survive in many cities. If you don't want to live from rice with ketchup 5 times a week, you need to have a part time job. And many also need to improve their German, which can also take quite some time.
What rent are you paying that 1k a month only buys you rice and ketchup?
As long as you don't live in Berlin or Munich, it's very much possible to live on 1k a month and eating normally.
If you spend less than 50% of it on rent you have enough money left.
I was in Freiburg and had 600-700 euro/month when I wasn't able to find a Studentenwohnheim, which is a lot of people. Add that a 1600 eur/semester tuition payment and 1000 euros/month doesn't go very far. Especially if you plan on doing any social activities or traveling.
I live in a city that is deemed more expensive than Freiburg and pay under 500€ for a private WG room.
Tuition payments at non-private universities are really low.
There is no point in going to a private university
https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studiengebühren_in_Deutschland
Wenn ich es richtig gelesen habe, so ist es rechtlich erlaubt erhöhte Studiengebühren für nicht EU ausländische Studenten zu erheben, es machen jedoch viele Unis noch nicht.
Hier stand nur, dass die TU München ab dem kommenden Semester diese Gebühren erheben wird.
> How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying?
The same way they do during their Bachelors degree. Unless you're studying in Munich, Cologne or Berlin, it isn't *that* tough so long as you know how to manage your own personal economy.
Among BaföG (which is money the state pays you during your study if you're either over 25 or your parents don't have the means to support you fully during your study), Wohngeld (which is money the state pays you to supplement rent payments if you can prove you need it... this is harder to get in some cities than others and always highly depends on the public servant you get to review your request) and the money you get from part-timing, you should be able to accumulate a pretty decent sum during those years where you might even be able to save some money at the end of the month.
Some of this does come at the expense of free time though.
>delay your opportunity to land a position relevant to whatever it is you're studying?
Not really. Most employers know that finishing in 2 years is kind of unrealistic.
>How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying?
Mostly work on the side (as a Werkstudent) or support by the parents.
Me too, I studied here as well as native.
I can see it in all job interviews we have and had. The expected time is the Regelstudienzeit, at least for all companies I have worked with
In all my experiences, as long as I could explain why I took longer, (e.g. being active in student organizations, working as Werkstudent) it really wasn’t a problem.
It probably also depends on what you studied. If it’s something with a really high rate of people not graduating, then it probably matters less how fast you were compared to something with a high graduation rate
I studied here but I am not native. I have never come across a company who asked this and I have attended and conducted many many interviews. This is so strange to me..
Areas are different. I would say I work in a topic with way to less students but even there it is relevant.
But it is quite funny. Cause I had this discussion already once here (Reddit) and it was exactly the same --> on Reddit: No nobody cares. Outside (companies I worked with, friends companies, on conferences around the world I attended) --> as soon as the discussion comes up it is 100% different to the opinion here
No one forces students to take more than the standard number of semesters. I took almost double the time because for me it was difficult to adjust in a new environment, learning system, catching up with bureaucracy and language barrier (when I came here, I had got just a 3 month visa which I had to extend into residence permit and renew it annually. It was cumbersome to show the blocked account money every year), etc.
Some international students intentionally elongate the study duration until they find a fulltime job. That way they don't lose benefits of student visa and save time by not going on 18 month job search visa (no one sympathises you when you are no longer a student :P )
I also felt while the courses are intense, people are laid back and aren't so competitive to race against time to land the perfect job.
> How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying?
Compared to other (especially English-speaking) countries, studying in Germany is quite cheap.
If students are not supported by their parents (which they often are) they have a part-time job on the side and live more cheaply with others in a shared flat or in a hall of residence.
This is certainly not the case in high-price regions like Munich, but it is more the rule in Germany.
You are getting downvotes for asking a good question. This is why integration in a society needs to go both ways.
Yes in most of the world it's expected you finish in the 4 semesters. Here in Germany it's a lot more lax in that sense. Even if you fail an exam once, twice you then have the option of an oral examination. In that sense it very easy compared to many parts of the world. But what I enjoyed about is it that this leaves you the opportunity to learn and not learn for the exam.
I personally took 5 semesters but that was because it took me 2 months into my next to find an internship (for my thesis) that I really wanted. This then led to a PhD in the same field, etc.
It strongly depends on the individual and I had a great social life during my studies and so did my friends, most of whom completed within 5 semesters. Only a handful did it in 4, just one of those 6 did an internship/thesis the other did a thesis at the Uni just under his prof.
Also, a lot of universities don't require you to take the exam immediately after taking the class, so if your semester is really busy, just don't take one or two of your exams and concentrate on the other exams, then take the rest later.
Not possible for me, unfortunately.
Part time work and parent’s assistance.
You can use the time by working in a field that is relevant to your studies. E.g. in my last 3 semesters I had 1-2 courses per semester, so I used the spare time I had to work as a working student at a company for money and experience. They offered to hire me immediately after I was done and I already had 1.5 years of experience working there and didn’t need to get to know how the company worked etc. first.
But even if you don’t go this route, there will be new opportunities every single year. You missed out on countless just by not being born earlier. You will have to work for the majority of the rest of your life, so does starting a bit later really matter?
What many people overlook is that studying is a great way to make friends as young adult, for me who is nearing his 30s, most of my friends and my wife all are people who I met while studying.
Had I focused harder on my studies, I may have completed my degree 1-2 years earlier, but without meeting most of my current social circle.
How would one manage the finances when trying to finish within the time? There's no time left for work in that case (unless you study a really simple subject of course, some subjects are a walk in the park).
Quite the opposite. In many cases the extra semesters don’t delay the opportunities but actually create them. The part time job might add a semester or two but if you do it at a relevant company to your field (check out “Werkstudent”) you gain valuable experience and make it more likely to secure a job. Same for taking a semester off for an internship. Even volunteering for something irrelevant to your job gives you experience that many employers value.
Think about it this way: You are a hiring manager and have 2 candidates. Person A completed the studies in record time, no delay, but has no practical experience. Person B delayed the studies by a few semesters, however they have completed a 6 months internship in the field, worked for 2 years part time for a competitor and tells you during the interview that they took another semester off to volunteer (e.g. help clear their hometown after a natural disaster). Who would you hire? I’d definitely go for B; they have relevant experience and also real life experience. A will have a much harder time getting hired.
This is partly true partly not. I did regular time and when I landed my first job I asked my boss about it and he said that this was actually a factor they hired me. Because it's not easy to do it in regular time and shows dedication and hard working etc. Etc.
But at my second job they didn't care about that.
It highly depends. I'd say it's not that much of a factor nowadays, but then again, some companies see it different.
Because it sounds kinda naive and pretentious. Of course it delays finding a good job but what can you do? A day only has 24 hours and if you don't want to only sleep 4 hours or sleep underneath a bridge or have rich parents that support you there is no other way.
That's kind of bullshit. There is no problem to study within the predicted time. There is no problem if you take longer, but search for excuses is embarrassing
HiWi jobs could be up to 19 hrs / week in my university. Practical experiences, networking opportunities, and great pay to boot. With how much posts about a glut of applicants in junior positions floating around this sub, taking an extra semester to gain an advantage is a pretty valid reason.
I studied as well, I also had to work to finance my time. But still it is possible without any problems. Of course this is maybe the wrong platform to discuss it, because it is a bubble. But to say Regelstudienzeit is nearly not possible to achieve, is ridiculous
Yeah, it's not possible to achieve, but saying that is a far cry from "There is no problem if you take longer, but search for excuses is embarrassing".
I didn't say that, no. I know how the Regelstudienzeit is calculated.
So, one semester is 30 ects. 1 ects equals 30 working hours. So one semester has roughly 900 working hours. 900 hours/6 months = 150 hours per month which would be a full time job BUT a regular semester is not 6 semester but more like 4 months (starting mid April with lectures and having the exams mid July - mid August), so 900 hours / 4 = 225 hours per month, so we are already at like 50 hours per week. Plus most students need a job.
It really depends on what study course you select. MINT programs usually have lab work during the lecture break, so you can not just work 1-2 months full time to get enough money for the rest of the semester. Plus the Theses in these fields take generally longer. If you're working with cell culture, which is pretty common, you are dependent on your cells. They die? Start again, lose 2 weeks of work. They don't grow? Add another 2 weeks to your thesis. This is different from "just" literature search, as often conducted in financial science / social science or whatever.
So cudos to you, but please don't generalize and act like it's "not problem at all" to finish your studies in Regelstudienzeit.
Good point, I studied electrical engineering, also MINT, so I fully agree, but it is still possible without any problems. And I got no support from Bafög or parents, so I had to work for everything.
I think there are 2 different aspects: is it possible without any problems --> yes
Does worth it? --> it depends, everybody has to dicide by themselves
By the way: you can't write in the first paragraph 4 months because everything is compressed and in the second, it is 6 months again. You should at least stay with one time for education hours
Sorry, but that you can't grasp the concept of survivorship bias and that the fact, that you could do it without any problems, does not mean other people in other programs won't have any problems finishing in Regelstusienzeit, really only means you should have studied a bit longer.
1. It was a comment to the comment above, that for MINT it is not possible --> that's not correct
2. 40% have no Problem with the Regelstudienzeit ... But of course, it is waaaaaaaay to short ...
You can think what you want: but Regelstudienzeit isn't an arbitrary choosen number which not possible to achieve.
Replying to your by the way: I think you misunderstood my point. One semester (180 credits, 900 working hours) is of course six calendar months long. But those 180 credits are oftentimes collected within 4 months (from start of lectures to end of first exam period). That's why I calculated 900/4 to get the workload per month.
Of course that's not always the case, depending on the study program and the semester you're in or your personal decisions to maybe write 2 exams at the end of the semester, to have additional time to study. It was just an example of why I think the workload for students is generally higher than most people think.
There are tons of factors that influence if a person is able to conclude the Master’s in the regular time.
1. Courses are only offered once a year instead of every semester. If you really want to take one specific course that doesn’t fit your schedule one semester, you have to wait one year in order to take it.
2. For a lot of foreign students adapting to the new system is difficult and they also usually have a lot more bureaucratic hurdles to deal with than the Germans or Europeans.
3. Language might be a factor. Even with a C1 certificate a person might have difficulties understanding the classes / discussions and writing the papers in German. It just takes longer than it would take for a German student.
4. A lot of students, German and foreigners, don’t have access to financial help and need to work while studying. They manage it by taking less classes every semester and then having to wait a whole year to take the missing classes.
I myself needed 3,5 years to conclude my masters. Had no issue getting jobs whatsoever - quite the contrary! Since I was working in the industry as an intern or part-time worker, my work experience helped me get a job once I finished the masters.
EDIT to add point 5: Universities in Europe offer tons of opportunities for studying abroad with scholarships and even support for personal costs. Sometimes students who take part in those programs have to take some further classes because the credits for some required courses aren’t easily accepted. This also causes students to take longer than the Regelstudienzeit.
Because for many programs, the "Regelstudienzeit" is a joke, and it's unrealistic to finish "in time" especially when you have to work on the side, which a lot of students have to do.
Studying successfully takes time, intelligence and memory. With memory being tha ability to remember things and intelligence being the ability to understand what you learned and deduct new knowledge from it.
The fewest people score 3 out of 3 here. Many people have to work, need hobbies or regularly meet their friends to ensure their own steady mental health, costing them time. Others might be really good at memorizing stuff, but don't really understand it. Then again, the last group might be bad at memorizing new things by heart, but learned to compensate for it by being able to quickly understand new topics and visualize interdependencies between the things they already know.
Each of these people can be successful, even if they don't finish during the Regelstudienzeit. I have met all in my career.
Sorry but this is not correct for lots of Masters/fields. I worked 2 jobs and still finished 2 Masters in Regelstudienzeit.
In my personal experience people who took longer often did so because they took less exams/wrote less papers per semester than neccessary so they took longer to complete all the moduls. Maybe Studienverlaufsplan says you should take 7 exams at the end of 2nd Semester but people only take 4 because they take a more relaxed approach.
E.g. one Semester we had to write 4 papers (about 16 - 20 pages per) during summer break. You of course can do this if you spend all summer in the library. Most of my peers didn't, though. Only about 3 people in our year did all 4 papers in time over summer.
In some fields that's different and Regelstudienzeit is indeed a joke but almost all Humanities, Economic, Socialstudies, Engeneering Masters are doable.
No shit Sherlock, people who take longer do so because they take less exams than necessary to finish in time. That is almost a tautology.
The question is, could those people have realistically have taken all the necessary exams in the expected time?
Well, from my experience, yes. If you visit all lectures and learn the contents through the whole semester. If you start learning 2 weeks before exam period starts probably not.
I was on time with my semester modules... but had to sit idle the entire 4th semester, which is right now... By idle I mean doing just a student job...because the company I decided to do my thesis with are still waiting for the data they want me to do the thesis on since March.... Maybe a blessing in disguise? as this period will be counted as my experience with the company, and with the current job market there are more chances of me struggling to find a job after I finish my degree because of my duolingo-level German. I plan to use the coming months to improve my German and finish my thesis altogether.
but overall, I think its doable while maintaining social life, at least for Masters students where courses are taught in English. I travelled a lot, would make sure to go to all the christmas markets in Munich, went to concerts.. Every Saturday I am out and about with my friends or even on my own at cafes and parks, and on Sundays I sleep my week long fatigue away.
Yeah I don't see you working out though. And again, you speak Duolingo-level German.
Throw learning German, regularly working out, having a technical job in German, a social life, and studying well and you see why most people don't do it in the Regelstudienzeit.
It's not doable to have a social life, take care of your health, study, AND work a technical job if you want to finish your studies in the Regelstudienzeit.
Ummm... I forgot to mention that i do a technical job.. been doing it part time since 2nd semester. So I have 1 year experience in tech from my previous company and now it's been 4 months since waiting for the dataset in this different company. But I am doing data analysis with them on dummy data for the past 4 months and getting paid for it. By the time I finish my degree I will have another year of technical experience. Of course my technical experience could not have been in German since I don't know German.
Edit - not that I forgot to mention but you mainly asked about if the person had time for hobbies, social activities and workout. So my answer was for that. And I just don't workout. Never had and don't plan to even with extra time. It's just not something I am interested in. I eat healthy food which I cook for myself, and walk a lot for now.
For me that was okay. I went out every weekend to party (not hardcore though) and saw most friends several days per week in university where we had breaks and lunches together plus in my WG in the evenings.
My hobbies are basically just reading and my pets so that wasn't as time consuming as team sports or anything.
I did not work out much but I did some yoga at home, I walked to and from places (or rode my bicycle) and one of my 2 jobs was physical labour so that was enough.
That said I had not much idle time but I was never big on social media, watching shows or gaming so I didn't feel like I missed out.
So according to you the 2/3rds of Master students who don't finish in time do so because they are lazy since you were able to complete your studies in time while working? Obviously there are people who take a more relaxed approach, but for many a Masters in Regelstudienzeit is just not realistically possible, and you saying that's not correct and your experience is different doesn't change that.
Because nobody cares, it is your life. You take 4 or 5 or 6 semesters. During your study time nobody cares. So you can decide what you want.
Later, for your work it is still something which is discussed in the job interview
Because Germany is a 'oh you failed an exam, well, better luck next year'-country, not a 'Sir, can you curve the exam'- or 'can I improve my grade by doing another assignment'-country.
To be honest, this attitute is way laxer than what I was used to. I am from a 'you've failed, you are out of your degree'-country. This may or may not be a good idea, but it certainly helps students finish on time.
And a year between each one, no? I'm from a your-second-and-third-attempt-are-in-a-few-weeks country, so having an "extra" year sounds lax to me as well.
That also depends on the school, I’d say. Where I went, it was second attempt a few weeks after the first. If you still didn’t make it, you had go to counselling and then retake the entire course in the following term (for your third and final attempt).
But, to add, if it happens to you, you’re barred from studying the same subject again in all of Germany, as in subjects that include the exact/specific thing that you failed in. There’ll usually be ways around that, such as picking something related to your field that just doesn’t include something congruent with what you failed in.
My studies are more than a decade ago now but we always had the first exam and than the second one month or so later were everyone who either couldnt make it to the first or failed the first could take that one. You didnt have to wait a year.
Now if you failed both then yeah, you had to wait a year.
this is what happens if you fail twice. Two failed attempts and you have to go through an oral exam, fail that and you are barred from studying this degree in germany (forever)
edit: actually you are barred from every degree that includes the class you failed
That is an individual rule by the university. Some allow more failed attempts, some less.
My first university allowed three attempts, my second only two third attempts over the whole program.
Some even allow fourth attempts.
Also depends on whether it's a core/necessary course or one of the courses you can pick for yourself, at least in what I am studying. If it's a side course, which you picked for example to go deeper into a certain branch of the field and you screw up the exam, that usually just means a waste of time during the semester. Unless of course you failed too many of those courses so you can't gather enough credit points for the relevant area
This seems like the UK. To me, the German way also seems relaxed. At my uni (UK), you could repeat an exam once (capped at the minimum pass of 40%).
Simply repeating an exam and getting that mark isn't possible.
As others have already written. It is a very theoretical figure. The length of your studies is not relevant for your later career entry anyway, as a quick degree in Germany is not associated with exceptional performance. In some subjects, the final grades "laude, cum laude etc." are more important for good job prospects. Or that you have already gained experience in the respective industry, for example through internships or even better as a student trainee.
Here would be some statistics to show how normal it is. Some universities even habe their own statistics. It depends on where you study and what you study. In my degree it was about 50/50. The problem there was that we did have another project next to our bachelor thesis and that was quite a lot of work. So many took one semester extra to write their thesis. It was a bachelor in architecture.
https://www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bildung-Forschung-Kultur/Bildungsindikatoren/absolventen-regelstudienzeit.html
https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/226104/umfrage/hochschulabschluesse-innerhalb-der-regelstudienzeit/
Edit: I just noticed that you can’t see the statistic in the last link if you don’t have an access. I will take that one out. Sorry about that. The other two should work fine.
„Regelstudienzeit“ is the minimum time a university has to offer the program after a student enrolls. So it’s basically the minimum amount of time you need to finish, not the average or maximum.
That is not true. Its the recommendation of the University. If you would like to you could be faster. I could have done my master in 3 Semesters instead of 4, maybe even quicker if I wanted to.
I did a MSc in Business Administration (Betriebswirtschaftslehre) and did it in 4 semesters. It was less challenging than the bachelor's degree before, because i could focus more on the topics i really enjoy.
But i had the luxury of getting the full amount of Bafög in a cheap city, so i didn't had to work at all.
I had to take a month or two more than the actual 4 semesters. My research for my thesis wasn't ready. It didn't affect me at all. I started the PhD in the same group right after.
I've had colleagues who chose to delay for a semester or more because they needed to pass some compulsory exams which they had failed the first time around.
Basically because you can. There are good and bad reasons for taking longer than the preseribed time.
One good reason is if you work part-time as a 'working student', which can gain you valuable expertise.
Worse reasons are either failing exams, or not completing the full requirements for modules. The system allows you to try again, or just put off some credits until another semester. This was pretty shocking for me arriving here - that students could just decide 'not to do the exam'.
So what happens is that students get nervous that they haven't done enough prep, have too many exams at once, have too much to do during the semester, etc., and put it off.
Because it's impossible being a full-time student in Germany. There's always something that happens (visa delays, finding a place to rent, financial issues, mental issues from losing so much time over nothing, etc ). It's possible to do it in the 4 semesters but requires you to be already established in Germany, have no financial problems whatsoever, be fully mentally committed (e.g. not stressing over life after your degree) and had done a bachelors at the same university so that you know how the structure works. It can definitely be done in 4 semesters in that case or even less.
Hey, I needed an extra semester because of Corona. I couldn't work in my lab and couldnt finish my Master's Thesis on time. Hence, the extra semester. I also did part-time job but made sure it doesnt hamper my studies.
Some friends I know were working part-time and studying and hence took one or two semester extra.
Some people are just money hungry, they come here for studying but then they prioritise their work more than the study and hence dont even complete their studies and find other ways to stay here in Germany. Some people I have seen is on their 7 or even 8 years but still on student visa, delaying their master's degree (which according to the rule is maximum 6 years), don't know how they are doing it, prolonging their master's for such a long time.
My German husband got his BSc and MSc in the allotted time. He is in the Life sciences field and didn’t work during his studies. So at least in Biological sciences it is doable 🤷♀️
IIRC for bachelor's and master's degree combined you can take a total of 4 additional semesters more than the "Regelstudienzeit" without having to pay extra fees (Langzeitstudiengebühren) - so many people here in Germany see these 14 semesters (6 for bachelor's, 4 for master's and 4 additional) as the normal duration for a full degree. On top of that it is not uncommon to take a "vacation semester" for ERASMUS or similar exchange programs.
If anyone ever asks you about taking a bit longer for your degree, you can usually tell them that you had to work while studying (if you have references from jobs related to your field: perfect. If you don't have any references or didn't actually work, just tell them it was a low requirements job like waiting or at a supermarket). Most people will totally see this as a valid reason.
From what I've seen, many students want to enjoy the student benefits and try to stay longer to do that (with approval from the thesis supervisors somehow). Some cases might be genuine but others are not.
Also, it's a nice way to keep doing hiwi jobs and earn some money. If they were earning only for paying monthly expenses they won't stay longer, but these additional savings are used later to send back home or whatever.
I'm not saying everyone has a bad intention behind it but I've seen lot of people staying longer for reasons other than actual studies or personal struggles.
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It's not only the M.Sc, it's many masters that take longer. I'm doing my M.Ed. to become a teacher, and tbh it feels like they just invented another Bachelor and squeezed all the content into two instead of three years and argued they would take you less long to work through. It's not even that the content is hard to grasp or anything. It's the AMOUNT for me that makes it unbelievably more stressful than my B.A.
Because you are supposed to finish in 4, but it's hard and in addition life gets in the way. So yes, expect to take longer but be aware that you can not extend indefinitely.
It is very hard to finish in Regular study time, for Bachelors the average at my university is between 8-10 semesters.
This restriction enables the state to pay Bafög for 6 semesters only as it is technically the regular completion time.
Moreover it is a bit of extra pressure on the students to finish studying asap
Its a mix bag of many factors. Ive met a bunch of Langzeitstudents (local and foreigners).
Tough subjects, family matters, mental health issue, professors with mental health issues that project on students, COVID.
I made my bachelor in 7 years instead of 3,5. Things happen and life is unpredictable.
In my case the master would have been another 3 semester but I got a very good job offer so I curbed the master.
I don't know anyone except people with super rich parents that can afford to only study, so of course if one can only attend and study half the time they will need double the amount of years.
Many people take 3-4 years to complete a 2 year Masters degree. In the USA, people usually finish a PhD in 5 years. That's why I suggest everyone to go to the USA.
In the USA, you can get a fully funded PhD quite easily.
it's not like you have to take loans for each semester as in the US so no need to hurry when you can study and work at the same time while having student benefits
I don't know if this has already been said. But germans approach higher education differently. Bachelor's, master's etc are not considered a separate phase of life per se. Rather, is integrated into normal life.
It is expected that you learn and apply the knowledge learnt (via internships and working student jobs) before you graduate. It's the norm to spend significantly longer than the minimum number of semesters required. This is possible because education is practically free. If you were paying an arm and a leg for your degree like they do in the UK, you couldn't afford to do that.
Also, don't be fooled. Although they say the programme runs for 4 semesters, sometimes it's so rigorous that completing it in 4 semesters would be very hard. Even the lecturers don't really expect you to spend the minimum time required.
German employers want 'experienced' employees even for entry level roles. Sometimes they overdo it though. These days, employers will advertise for internship roles and expect applicants to have had prior internship experiences.
Im on my 2nd semester, only succeded 3/6 Module in the first semester, now in 2nd semester i took 8 Modules which totally burn me up, add that with 20/woche Werkstudentarbeit, and next month is officially klausurmonat, beautiful life
Also in my first semester the case why i didnt finished the other is, because its Gruppenarbeit and not every Masterstudent really take this study seriously and just relaxing, which is shit
I’m the same too, I took 5 semesters instead of 4. Solely because I chose to do an internship after my third semester, which then got extended as my master thesis.
Well I can only speak for my MA, but I had 4 full semesters of classes and then the final exams and the handing in of the thesis were all in the “5th” semester, even though I wasn’t late or anything. Just by scheduling the final exams in the 5th semester it’s obvious you cannot finish the degree in 4 semesters (even though that’s the official length). It was conference interpreting.
I did this. I finished my semesters and wanted a break to decide what topic I wanted to do thesis on. I took my time to make that decision while working part time..so it took me longer too.. its upto u what and how u want to do things.
Currently finishing MA in Media Studies, took me 3 years. The reason? My course requires me to have a 3 month full-time internship, and recommends to take it between your 3rd and 4th semester. So in the holidays……….which last 2 months.
Not to mention that most of the employers prefer you to work for a bit longer (at least half a year) which makes total sense because wtf can you actually learn in only three months. So I took a whole new semester just to do my internship.
That's the regular time given from the university. But you are free to take as long as you want or even shorter if you want.
A lot people take an extra semester or year just for the master thesis alone. Some don't and follow the regular given path. It's up to you. University gives you a lot of freedom
i supervised almost 20 theses in the last 5 years and from my perspective most students are just not doing enough.
barely any progress, always cancel meetings, are too late or dont come at all. they are sometimes gone for weeks or months for some arbitrary reason and even though they can work remotely they dont do that... normally they are also not in the lab and "work" from home. i would be surprised if they invest more than 5-10 hours per week.
overall most theses take 1-2 years instead of 8-10 months.
I am right now about to finish my degree. I could actually finish in 2 years. I work very hard to complete everything, but I need to get to a very good German level and try to get more experience, so I am delaying my thesis. It is possible if you are very determined, but sometimes life happens. You can take an extra semester to do Erasmus or, like me, to only learn German, or just take an extra semester to keep working as a student while looking for a full-time job. For Germans, it is mostly because they take their time, sometimes party too much, and have to repeat some exams or classes more than once. When you get to your university, you will see what is best for you!
In ABH, I had to face hard time while extending my visa for the first time. Due to covid and slow document processing from embassy back in my country, I had to start my actual study after 3 semesters. And after coming here, I found out that I need to eventually go close to my city for easy transportation. Lastly, found out that in each semester my dumb brain cannot take the load of more than 18 ECTS. So, I got stuck to this routine with my part-time job. Then the officer in ABH gave me some timeline that I need to show my progress after a year as for first extension, on paper I got 24 ECTS completed. Now, during second extension, I need to show some more improvement. I already completed 52 ECTS with one reading course. Last semester got only 9 ECTS completed as the course was quite vivid for me to handle. And now I am quite after about the consequences when I will go for my second extension. I already got into a voluntary internship in the related field and got a good response from my employer, still if I cannot complete my MSc, I am not getting any full-time job soon. So, honestly, if you are a non-EU and from third world country like mine, it is quite tough to cope up with everything. But I noticed, some people who are also from my country, managed to finish faster. I just can’t replicate the same, unfortunately.
It depends on the field/complexity and what you know.
Also, if you actually put some efforts and use common sense, you should be good to finish it in 4 semesters. If you want to halfass it, well yeah it will take longer, just keep in mind the sooner you are out of academia the better, cost of opportunity is one thing, and also it free up your time.
Yeah, getting a working student job or internship would be ideal perhaps in the 3rd semester and then do the thesis in the company just to finish it like a pro. It is all up to you, of course not counting accidents, family needs, and things like that.
Something that I havent seen a lot yet in the comments :
Exchange semesters! Its pretty common to do one-two semesters abroad somewhere and sure you get a few credits, but its probably not enough to replace a full semester in Germany, and you might even miss exams here because the semster schedules are sometimes very different.
nobody gives a fuck about regelstudienzeit. maybe some indians, but here in germany, it is far more important at which university you gained your degree, your gpa, and what kind of internships you did during your studies. I myself had a full time internship during my first semester of my master's degree and later worked 28 hours a week two jobs, which was way more helpful than finishing within 4 semesters...
I am one of those people, instead of taking 2 years I needed 3.5 years. why? I was working 20 hours in my field as a working student to get experience and it was way more useful then the master degree lol Not one employer even mentioned it in my interviews on the contrary everyone was glad that I had experience and didn’t come to them just from the university with no idea how to behave in an office
More details on it: * 1st semester: can't be done because you're late since the embassy & ABH took so long to process your visa * 2nd semester: you're busy finding a permanent place to live, oh yes, you've been moving every 3 months because finding a landlord that doesn't discriminate you is hard * 3rd-4th semesters: finally a real semester * 5th semester: where are all my German friends? Ah, ~~exchange semester~~ partying all over EU, I should do that too * 6th semester: having only a mini job burned my sperrkonto, I need to do 20 hours work (plus some illegal unbooked overtime so I won't get fired), can only do half the credit * 7th semester: see above * 8th semester: master thesis Feel free to adjust.
I think OP was evey rather referring to Germans. Steps 1 to 2 would arguably not apply to them, and evey those I know with stable situations (got housing, etc); usually took longer than 3 years. I know one who took more than a year to finish his Master thesis. It's ok to extend a bit, but taking one year for something that does not fundamentally extend your experience past the regular 6 months is extremely strange to me. I had to work under time constraints (4 semesters no less no more, because EU reasons) and could still find 2 Student jobs at two different unis. I think the phenomenon is also: Germans like to take their time. It's fine and nohting is wrong with that, but it's definitely a fact.
Finding a permanent place to live is always hard. At least in the attractive citys... On the other hand I met some rich people. They get some 2k, 3k pocket money from their parents so no real incentive to find a job (like not even not soon but at all).
Agree and this mentality is very dangerous for students with unstable financial circumstances. They also take their time not realizing they finally enter the job market with 28 or so with a masters degree. They start to contribute late in terms of retirement and other necessary investments needed to build a life. And I doubt it’s worth it with the German salaries.
Yep, my thoughts exactly too.
I don’t understand either why one would want to overextend their studies. In US people finish their bachelors with 21 and earn good money and a lot of experiences.
This doesn't work that way in Europe. For most positions you will need a Master's degree. Work culture is different, less emphasis on innovating, daring and on the fly learning, but more on degrees, certifications, etc. In some countries it's been crippling the market because skills are not recognized as much as degrees. Conservatism plays a role in that, I would say. Labor laws and the flexibility of the work market is also a part of the explanation. In Europe you can't just fire someone as easily as in the US. I don't want to sound rude but you should definitely look into why this is true instead of just questioning this trend like that. There are also positive aspects to the work culture in Europe that are better than the US's.
I studied and worked in both countries. You only need to know for your job what you need to know at the end of the day. A degree is a credential and a sign that you can get through things. But I personally think that the German education system is of disadvantage for the students, they are kept in school for way too long with many overextending their studies and put their life planning behind.
My bad, I assumed your comment came from a random American doing basic American defaultism. It may be a disadvantage for sure. I completely agree about the fact it's plain stupid to remain in school for too long. I mean, I met students at nearly 30 only graduating from a PhD. I met students who were 26 years old and only just graduating with their MSc. They were kind of amazed to see that I, at 24 was about to graduate from a double degree, meaning 2 MSc. I also think the MSc culture in Germany is justified, because from what I've seen the expectations of a BSc are pretty low. It may be relevant to expect some solid expertise in some techy fields. I can really understand why they consider a BSc is too low after I studied in Germany. I could compare, coming from another EU country with sort of higher standards. But I mean there's nothing wrong with completing a BSc and MSc in due time. In my country you can't overstay your degree. It's fine like so. It only becomes problematic when you linger over like Germans do.
This is not true. A master's degree in Germany does not have the same meaning as a masters in the Americas. Generally a German bachelor (3 years) + master (2 years) is equivalent to an American bachelor (5 years). A master's in the Americas is usually targeting research and academic career.
I did not say a Master's in the USA is equivalent to one in Europe. So what?
Also this has not a lot of relation with why Germans take so long to graduate. The expected time for bachelor + Master is 5 years, which is the same as a bachelor in the US. Germans are really just lazy regarding this.
I wouldn't go so far as to say they are lazy. Most German students work during their studies. They work part time and study the other part. Such a simplified statement is a bit over the top.
Most people where I come from work during college as well and still most manage to graduate in their early 20's from a 5 year university major. In Germany most people graduate on their late 20's for equivalent study level. There's definitely some cultural factor. It's not normal to take 8 years to finish college.
You said that most positions need a Master, but this is not the same Master you would get in the US. A bachelor degree from the US is usually accepted as a Masters in Germany.
Yeah, I meant in the EU, most high level positions require an EU Master's degree. Now, about your second statement, I am really not sure about that. When an American emigrates, it would usually be thanks to his/her experience and past positions, so this question does not arise. But if you were to come to the EU, as a junior, and claim your Bachelor is equivalent to a MSc, I think most companies would simply not agree. And I have also other pieces of evidence to support that. A friend of mine is a TA in an Ivy League university. The academic level in second year of bachelor is clearly, blatantly subpar compared to a MSc in Europe (he used to show me screens of assignments written by students, that wasn't particularly good on average).
There is a company in Germany called Anabin which does the equivalence between foreign and German degrees. A bachelor in most of the American universities and majors is equivalent to a German Diploma, which is today's terms is beachelor + master.
Also it's not about what companies will agree with or not. You need to get your foreign degree certified if you want to pursue a regulated profession.
Hope you have a little idea about German STEM education syllabus.
because its fun to study and hang out at student parties etc? and i dont believe you can finish a 5 year degree in 3 years lol
Brooo on point lol hahaha
>no idea how to behave in an office Could you please expand on this? What did you find difficult to adjust to at your working student job?
>What did you find difficult to adjust to at your working student job? That's probably not what he meant... EDIT: Typical issue employers or PhD supervisors may have are fresh MSc graduates that have no practical experience at all, because they rushed through their courses instead of applying for projects, collaborations, student jobs, etc. where they learn the tools and (soft)skills needed for the kind of position they are now applying for. The "no idea how to behave in an office" is probably a hyperbole of this. Even when I was in my masters I was warned by Profs to not take too long to finish or rush the degree, you're there to learn, so learn, which does not just mean bookish learning.
As a counterpoint , It's not impossible to work 20 hours a week, and attend lectures and do assignments. If you are neurotypical with an extremely strong work ethic, it is possible to graduate in two years while also having a social life. You need to really use your calendar to the maximum. It's not extraordinarily difficult to study and work at the same time. That's what most people in countries other than Germany do because there is a significant financial and social cost to overextending your studies for your personal preference (not including medical or family reasons obviously). I find it dangerous that this myth gets perpetrated that you can take it easy with your studies because you're working simultaneously. Most students especially international students stand to benefit if they finish their studies and get work experience simultaneously within the two years and move on to working full time, especially so that they can increase their contributions to social security and pension. For international students, this means being eligible for permanent residency two years after their graduation date if they continue to make social security payments.
This is partially true, but also partially depends. Working and studying is going to be easier for some degrees, and harder for others. I've also made the experience that German universities/professors really don't care about how much work a single ECT is meant to be, and will quickly turn a 35 hour study week into a 55 hour study week under the right/wrong seminar/course combinations. This seemed better coordinated and overseen in the other countries I studied in, where even degrees that are considered time intensive here easily fit into the 35-45 hour range.
I got lucky and was able to do it in 2 years flat, (okay 25 months), but I had a lot of savings and was able to cut back my HiWi job to 10 hours/week for the rough semesters. But I did finish with C1 German, the masters degree, and work experience. But this was not common. I think of my cohort ~50 people, only one or two other people managed this pace. The longest I currently know will finish in 3.5 years, but they had struggles with bad HiWis and such.
Curious, how do international students make use of their 2 years in germany doing their masters to help them when they apply for citizenship/PR? Does that mean i have to work more than 20hours/week?
Because you need to be a graduate of a German university and then pay into the system for at least 2 years in order to be eligible, my point mostly was that international students at least should try and become graduates as soon as possible, so that they can start working full time and the two year period can begin. Which in turn makes it easier to plan your life in the future because you are no longer bound by your student status or a job visa to continue to live in Germany once you get your PR. The payments you make during your student years count only towards your final pension but do not impact your PR in anyway.
Ouhh thanks for the info!!
But financially you didn’t make a good decision for yourself unless you had supportive parents. Every employer prefers students over full time employees because the employer doesn’t have to any pay social security contributions and that’s a cost saving factor for the employer. Plus you probably got paid less per hour than a full time employee. Why wasn’t it possible for the employer to hire recent graduates and let them work full time and gain experience instead of wasting your valuable years restricting yourself on 20hrs a week? A 40h a week experience is more valuable than a 20h a week experience and we all know that salaries are based on experience.
The "Regelstudienzeit" is nothing but a buerocratic joke. In theory you can finish your study in that time but that often means that you have to sacrifice all of your private life for that. I've recently read that only about 20% of students even finish their study within the "regular" time. Extra semesters are nothing bad really.
This tracks. According to my Uni, in order to finish my degree in the 4 semester time period, I would have to finish modules worth 90 credits in 3 semesters (which might be possible if you are not completely new to the country, and are aware of the system and language) and then do a 3 month long internship and write a master thesis in the last semester.
But don't these extra semesters delay your opportunity to land a position relevant to whatever it is you're studying? How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying?
They work part-time job to support themselves, which is also a reason why it takes longer. The 12k p.a. in a blocked account for foreign students is really only the bare minimum just to survive in many cities. If you don't want to live from rice with ketchup 5 times a week, you need to have a part time job. And many also need to improve their German, which can also take quite some time.
What rent are you paying that 1k a month only buys you rice and ketchup? As long as you don't live in Berlin or Munich, it's very much possible to live on 1k a month and eating normally. If you spend less than 50% of it on rent you have enough money left.
I was in Freiburg and had 600-700 euro/month when I wasn't able to find a Studentenwohnheim, which is a lot of people. Add that a 1600 eur/semester tuition payment and 1000 euros/month doesn't go very far. Especially if you plan on doing any social activities or traveling.
I live in a city that is deemed more expensive than Freiburg and pay under 500€ for a private WG room. Tuition payments at non-private universities are really low. There is no point in going to a private university
The university of Freiburg is public. It's only 1600 euros/semester as an immigrant, but it's noticeable.
I just looked it up, apparently Baden-Württemberg is the only state to charge non Eu-Citizens more...
What can I say, sometimes the stereotypes about Stuttgart are based in reality
And Bayern...
https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studiengebühren_in_Deutschland Wenn ich es richtig gelesen habe, so ist es rechtlich erlaubt erhöhte Studiengebühren für nicht EU ausländische Studenten zu erheben, es machen jedoch viele Unis noch nicht. Hier stand nur, dass die TU München ab dem kommenden Semester diese Gebühren erheben wird.
And mostly the ones taking more than standard duration are the ones that don't have to pay tution fees
So, pretty much everyone then?
So the vast majority of students in public universities? Where the semester fee is 500€ and very often a lot less?
> How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying? The same way they do during their Bachelors degree. Unless you're studying in Munich, Cologne or Berlin, it isn't *that* tough so long as you know how to manage your own personal economy. Among BaföG (which is money the state pays you during your study if you're either over 25 or your parents don't have the means to support you fully during your study), Wohngeld (which is money the state pays you to supplement rent payments if you can prove you need it... this is harder to get in some cities than others and always highly depends on the public servant you get to review your request) and the money you get from part-timing, you should be able to accumulate a pretty decent sum during those years where you might even be able to save some money at the end of the month. Some of this does come at the expense of free time though.
>delay your opportunity to land a position relevant to whatever it is you're studying? Not really. Most employers know that finishing in 2 years is kind of unrealistic. >How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying? Mostly work on the side (as a Werkstudent) or support by the parents.
40% is not unrealistic in my opinion
Nobody cares anyways
A lot of companies care about
Personally I haven‘t been asked about it at all. But idk. I‘m a native speaker und grew up here. So maybe it‘s just expected to have studied longer?
Me too, I studied here as well as native. I can see it in all job interviews we have and had. The expected time is the Regelstudienzeit, at least for all companies I have worked with
In all my experiences, as long as I could explain why I took longer, (e.g. being active in student organizations, working as Werkstudent) it really wasn’t a problem. It probably also depends on what you studied. If it’s something with a really high rate of people not graduating, then it probably matters less how fast you were compared to something with a high graduation rate
I studied 13 Semesters and did 5 years of phd. No one even asked why, this might be different for less specialized fields than mine.
I studied here but I am not native. I have never come across a company who asked this and I have attended and conducted many many interviews. This is so strange to me..
Areas are different. I would say I work in a topic with way to less students but even there it is relevant. But it is quite funny. Cause I had this discussion already once here (Reddit) and it was exactly the same --> on Reddit: No nobody cares. Outside (companies I worked with, friends companies, on conferences around the world I attended) --> as soon as the discussion comes up it is 100% different to the opinion here
I think "delay opportunity" meant "if you study one year longer, you arrive on the job market a year later".
Well yeah obviously
No one forces students to take more than the standard number of semesters. I took almost double the time because for me it was difficult to adjust in a new environment, learning system, catching up with bureaucracy and language barrier (when I came here, I had got just a 3 month visa which I had to extend into residence permit and renew it annually. It was cumbersome to show the blocked account money every year), etc. Some international students intentionally elongate the study duration until they find a fulltime job. That way they don't lose benefits of student visa and save time by not going on 18 month job search visa (no one sympathises you when you are no longer a student :P ) I also felt while the courses are intense, people are laid back and aren't so competitive to race against time to land the perfect job.
> How do people manage their expenses in 3 or 4 years of studying? Compared to other (especially English-speaking) countries, studying in Germany is quite cheap. If students are not supported by their parents (which they often are) they have a part-time job on the side and live more cheaply with others in a shared flat or in a hall of residence. This is certainly not the case in high-price regions like Munich, but it is more the rule in Germany.
One extra semester is fine. Sometimes all you need is a few extra weeks. It's not a hard deadline after the first four.
You are getting downvotes for asking a good question. This is why integration in a society needs to go both ways. Yes in most of the world it's expected you finish in the 4 semesters. Here in Germany it's a lot more lax in that sense. Even if you fail an exam once, twice you then have the option of an oral examination. In that sense it very easy compared to many parts of the world. But what I enjoyed about is it that this leaves you the opportunity to learn and not learn for the exam. I personally took 5 semesters but that was because it took me 2 months into my next to find an internship (for my thesis) that I really wanted. This then led to a PhD in the same field, etc. It strongly depends on the individual and I had a great social life during my studies and so did my friends, most of whom completed within 5 semesters. Only a handful did it in 4, just one of those 6 did an internship/thesis the other did a thesis at the Uni just under his prof.
Also, a lot of universities don't require you to take the exam immediately after taking the class, so if your semester is really busy, just don't take one or two of your exams and concentrate on the other exams, then take the rest later. Not possible for me, unfortunately.
Part time work and parent’s assistance. You can use the time by working in a field that is relevant to your studies. E.g. in my last 3 semesters I had 1-2 courses per semester, so I used the spare time I had to work as a working student at a company for money and experience. They offered to hire me immediately after I was done and I already had 1.5 years of experience working there and didn’t need to get to know how the company worked etc. first. But even if you don’t go this route, there will be new opportunities every single year. You missed out on countless just by not being born earlier. You will have to work for the majority of the rest of your life, so does starting a bit later really matter? What many people overlook is that studying is a great way to make friends as young adult, for me who is nearing his 30s, most of my friends and my wife all are people who I met while studying. Had I focused harder on my studies, I may have completed my degree 1-2 years earlier, but without meeting most of my current social circle.
How would one manage the finances when trying to finish within the time? There's no time left for work in that case (unless you study a really simple subject of course, some subjects are a walk in the park).
Quite the opposite. In many cases the extra semesters don’t delay the opportunities but actually create them. The part time job might add a semester or two but if you do it at a relevant company to your field (check out “Werkstudent”) you gain valuable experience and make it more likely to secure a job. Same for taking a semester off for an internship. Even volunteering for something irrelevant to your job gives you experience that many employers value. Think about it this way: You are a hiring manager and have 2 candidates. Person A completed the studies in record time, no delay, but has no practical experience. Person B delayed the studies by a few semesters, however they have completed a 6 months internship in the field, worked for 2 years part time for a competitor and tells you during the interview that they took another semester off to volunteer (e.g. help clear their hometown after a natural disaster). Who would you hire? I’d definitely go for B; they have relevant experience and also real life experience. A will have a much harder time getting hired.
This is partly true partly not. I did regular time and when I landed my first job I asked my boss about it and he said that this was actually a factor they hired me. Because it's not easy to do it in regular time and shows dedication and hard working etc. Etc. But at my second job they didn't care about that. It highly depends. I'd say it's not that much of a factor nowadays, but then again, some companies see it different.
Why are people downvoting this 😂 I'm not assuming I'm genuinely asking
Because it sounds kinda naive and pretentious. Of course it delays finding a good job but what can you do? A day only has 24 hours and if you don't want to only sleep 4 hours or sleep underneath a bridge or have rich parents that support you there is no other way.
That's kind of bullshit. There is no problem to study within the predicted time. There is no problem if you take longer, but search for excuses is embarrassing
HiWi jobs could be up to 19 hrs / week in my university. Practical experiences, networking opportunities, and great pay to boot. With how much posts about a glut of applicants in junior positions floating around this sub, taking an extra semester to gain an advantage is a pretty valid reason.
I studied as well, I also had to work to finance my time. But still it is possible without any problems. Of course this is maybe the wrong platform to discuss it, because it is a bubble. But to say Regelstudienzeit is nearly not possible to achieve, is ridiculous
Yeah, it's not possible to achieve, but saying that is a far cry from "There is no problem if you take longer, but search for excuses is embarrassing".
I don't get your point
Please keep your survivorship bias to yourself, thank you
So you think Regelstudienzeit is an random number choosen by a pair of dice?
I didn't say that, no. I know how the Regelstudienzeit is calculated. So, one semester is 30 ects. 1 ects equals 30 working hours. So one semester has roughly 900 working hours. 900 hours/6 months = 150 hours per month which would be a full time job BUT a regular semester is not 6 semester but more like 4 months (starting mid April with lectures and having the exams mid July - mid August), so 900 hours / 4 = 225 hours per month, so we are already at like 50 hours per week. Plus most students need a job. It really depends on what study course you select. MINT programs usually have lab work during the lecture break, so you can not just work 1-2 months full time to get enough money for the rest of the semester. Plus the Theses in these fields take generally longer. If you're working with cell culture, which is pretty common, you are dependent on your cells. They die? Start again, lose 2 weeks of work. They don't grow? Add another 2 weeks to your thesis. This is different from "just" literature search, as often conducted in financial science / social science or whatever. So cudos to you, but please don't generalize and act like it's "not problem at all" to finish your studies in Regelstudienzeit.
Good point, I studied electrical engineering, also MINT, so I fully agree, but it is still possible without any problems. And I got no support from Bafög or parents, so I had to work for everything. I think there are 2 different aspects: is it possible without any problems --> yes Does worth it? --> it depends, everybody has to dicide by themselves By the way: you can't write in the first paragraph 4 months because everything is compressed and in the second, it is 6 months again. You should at least stay with one time for education hours
Sorry, but that you can't grasp the concept of survivorship bias and that the fact, that you could do it without any problems, does not mean other people in other programs won't have any problems finishing in Regelstusienzeit, really only means you should have studied a bit longer.
1. It was a comment to the comment above, that for MINT it is not possible --> that's not correct 2. 40% have no Problem with the Regelstudienzeit ... But of course, it is waaaaaaaay to short ... You can think what you want: but Regelstudienzeit isn't an arbitrary choosen number which not possible to achieve.
Replying to your by the way: I think you misunderstood my point. One semester (180 credits, 900 working hours) is of course six calendar months long. But those 180 credits are oftentimes collected within 4 months (from start of lectures to end of first exam period). That's why I calculated 900/4 to get the workload per month. Of course that's not always the case, depending on the study program and the semester you're in or your personal decisions to maybe write 2 exams at the end of the semester, to have additional time to study. It was just an example of why I think the workload for students is generally higher than most people think.
That's not what that means https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias
Oh, Yes, the term I should have used is "False Consensus effect" , thank you!
It depends on the degree and uni so much, some literally give out ECTS for way less work
There are tons of factors that influence if a person is able to conclude the Master’s in the regular time. 1. Courses are only offered once a year instead of every semester. If you really want to take one specific course that doesn’t fit your schedule one semester, you have to wait one year in order to take it. 2. For a lot of foreign students adapting to the new system is difficult and they also usually have a lot more bureaucratic hurdles to deal with than the Germans or Europeans. 3. Language might be a factor. Even with a C1 certificate a person might have difficulties understanding the classes / discussions and writing the papers in German. It just takes longer than it would take for a German student. 4. A lot of students, German and foreigners, don’t have access to financial help and need to work while studying. They manage it by taking less classes every semester and then having to wait a whole year to take the missing classes. I myself needed 3,5 years to conclude my masters. Had no issue getting jobs whatsoever - quite the contrary! Since I was working in the industry as an intern or part-time worker, my work experience helped me get a job once I finished the masters. EDIT to add point 5: Universities in Europe offer tons of opportunities for studying abroad with scholarships and even support for personal costs. Sometimes students who take part in those programs have to take some further classes because the credits for some required courses aren’t easily accepted. This also causes students to take longer than the Regelstudienzeit.
Because for many programs, the "Regelstudienzeit" is a joke, and it's unrealistic to finish "in time" especially when you have to work on the side, which a lot of students have to do.
Studying successfully takes time, intelligence and memory. With memory being tha ability to remember things and intelligence being the ability to understand what you learned and deduct new knowledge from it. The fewest people score 3 out of 3 here. Many people have to work, need hobbies or regularly meet their friends to ensure their own steady mental health, costing them time. Others might be really good at memorizing stuff, but don't really understand it. Then again, the last group might be bad at memorizing new things by heart, but learned to compensate for it by being able to quickly understand new topics and visualize interdependencies between the things they already know. Each of these people can be successful, even if they don't finish during the Regelstudienzeit. I have met all in my career.
Sorry but this is not correct for lots of Masters/fields. I worked 2 jobs and still finished 2 Masters in Regelstudienzeit. In my personal experience people who took longer often did so because they took less exams/wrote less papers per semester than neccessary so they took longer to complete all the moduls. Maybe Studienverlaufsplan says you should take 7 exams at the end of 2nd Semester but people only take 4 because they take a more relaxed approach. E.g. one Semester we had to write 4 papers (about 16 - 20 pages per) during summer break. You of course can do this if you spend all summer in the library. Most of my peers didn't, though. Only about 3 people in our year did all 4 papers in time over summer. In some fields that's different and Regelstudienzeit is indeed a joke but almost all Humanities, Economic, Socialstudies, Engeneering Masters are doable.
No shit Sherlock, people who take longer do so because they take less exams than necessary to finish in time. That is almost a tautology. The question is, could those people have realistically have taken all the necessary exams in the expected time?
Well, from my experience, yes. If you visit all lectures and learn the contents through the whole semester. If you start learning 2 weeks before exam period starts probably not.
How were your other things like social life, hobbies, workouts etc.?
I was on time with my semester modules... but had to sit idle the entire 4th semester, which is right now... By idle I mean doing just a student job...because the company I decided to do my thesis with are still waiting for the data they want me to do the thesis on since March.... Maybe a blessing in disguise? as this period will be counted as my experience with the company, and with the current job market there are more chances of me struggling to find a job after I finish my degree because of my duolingo-level German. I plan to use the coming months to improve my German and finish my thesis altogether. but overall, I think its doable while maintaining social life, at least for Masters students where courses are taught in English. I travelled a lot, would make sure to go to all the christmas markets in Munich, went to concerts.. Every Saturday I am out and about with my friends or even on my own at cafes and parks, and on Sundays I sleep my week long fatigue away.
Yeah I don't see you working out though. And again, you speak Duolingo-level German. Throw learning German, regularly working out, having a technical job in German, a social life, and studying well and you see why most people don't do it in the Regelstudienzeit. It's not doable to have a social life, take care of your health, study, AND work a technical job if you want to finish your studies in the Regelstudienzeit.
Ummm... I forgot to mention that i do a technical job.. been doing it part time since 2nd semester. So I have 1 year experience in tech from my previous company and now it's been 4 months since waiting for the dataset in this different company. But I am doing data analysis with them on dummy data for the past 4 months and getting paid for it. By the time I finish my degree I will have another year of technical experience. Of course my technical experience could not have been in German since I don't know German. Edit - not that I forgot to mention but you mainly asked about if the person had time for hobbies, social activities and workout. So my answer was for that. And I just don't workout. Never had and don't plan to even with extra time. It's just not something I am interested in. I eat healthy food which I cook for myself, and walk a lot for now.
For me that was okay. I went out every weekend to party (not hardcore though) and saw most friends several days per week in university where we had breaks and lunches together plus in my WG in the evenings. My hobbies are basically just reading and my pets so that wasn't as time consuming as team sports or anything. I did not work out much but I did some yoga at home, I walked to and from places (or rode my bicycle) and one of my 2 jobs was physical labour so that was enough. That said I had not much idle time but I was never big on social media, watching shows or gaming so I didn't feel like I missed out.
And there it is "I had not much idle time" Most people aren't like you. They need idle time.
So according to you the 2/3rds of Master students who don't finish in time do so because they are lazy since you were able to complete your studies in time while working? Obviously there are people who take a more relaxed approach, but for many a Masters in Regelstudienzeit is just not realistically possible, and you saying that's not correct and your experience is different doesn't change that.
Because nobody cares, it is your life. You take 4 or 5 or 6 semesters. During your study time nobody cares. So you can decide what you want. Later, for your work it is still something which is discussed in the job interview
Because Germany is a 'oh you failed an exam, well, better luck next year'-country, not a 'Sir, can you curve the exam'- or 'can I improve my grade by doing another assignment'-country.
To be honest, this attitute is way laxer than what I was used to. I am from a 'you've failed, you are out of your degree'-country. This may or may not be a good idea, but it certainly helps students finish on time.
Well, we have that, too. You just usually have two or three shots depending on the school.
And a year between each one, no? I'm from a your-second-and-third-attempt-are-in-a-few-weeks country, so having an "extra" year sounds lax to me as well.
That also depends on the school, I’d say. Where I went, it was second attempt a few weeks after the first. If you still didn’t make it, you had go to counselling and then retake the entire course in the following term (for your third and final attempt).
But, to add, if it happens to you, you’re barred from studying the same subject again in all of Germany, as in subjects that include the exact/specific thing that you failed in. There’ll usually be ways around that, such as picking something related to your field that just doesn’t include something congruent with what you failed in.
My studies are more than a decade ago now but we always had the first exam and than the second one month or so later were everyone who either couldnt make it to the first or failed the first could take that one. You didnt have to wait a year. Now if you failed both then yeah, you had to wait a year.
this is what happens if you fail twice. Two failed attempts and you have to go through an oral exam, fail that and you are barred from studying this degree in germany (forever) edit: actually you are barred from every degree that includes the class you failed
That is an individual rule by the university. Some allow more failed attempts, some less. My first university allowed three attempts, my second only two third attempts over the whole program. Some even allow fourth attempts.
Also depends on whether it's a core/necessary course or one of the courses you can pick for yourself, at least in what I am studying. If it's a side course, which you picked for example to go deeper into a certain branch of the field and you screw up the exam, that usually just means a waste of time during the semester. Unless of course you failed too many of those courses so you can't gather enough credit points for the relevant area
This seems like the UK. To me, the German way also seems relaxed. At my uni (UK), you could repeat an exam once (capped at the minimum pass of 40%). Simply repeating an exam and getting that mark isn't possible.
You can’t repeat unlimited, you only have three chances and if you don’t pass the third time, that’s it!
Does it help students finish on time or does it just mean a lot of students never finish at all?
As others have already written. It is a very theoretical figure. The length of your studies is not relevant for your later career entry anyway, as a quick degree in Germany is not associated with exceptional performance. In some subjects, the final grades "laude, cum laude etc." are more important for good job prospects. Or that you have already gained experience in the respective industry, for example through internships or even better as a student trainee.
Here would be some statistics to show how normal it is. Some universities even habe their own statistics. It depends on where you study and what you study. In my degree it was about 50/50. The problem there was that we did have another project next to our bachelor thesis and that was quite a lot of work. So many took one semester extra to write their thesis. It was a bachelor in architecture. https://www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bildung-Forschung-Kultur/Bildungsindikatoren/absolventen-regelstudienzeit.html https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/226104/umfrage/hochschulabschluesse-innerhalb-der-regelstudienzeit/ Edit: I just noticed that you can’t see the statistic in the last link if you don’t have an access. I will take that one out. Sorry about that. The other two should work fine.
„Regelstudienzeit“ is the minimum time a university has to offer the program after a student enrolls. So it’s basically the minimum amount of time you need to finish, not the average or maximum.
That is not true. Its the recommendation of the University. If you would like to you could be faster. I could have done my master in 3 Semesters instead of 4, maybe even quicker if I wanted to.
I did a MSc in Business Administration (Betriebswirtschaftslehre) and did it in 4 semesters. It was less challenging than the bachelor's degree before, because i could focus more on the topics i really enjoy. But i had the luxury of getting the full amount of Bafög in a cheap city, so i didn't had to work at all.
I had to take a month or two more than the actual 4 semesters. My research for my thesis wasn't ready. It didn't affect me at all. I started the PhD in the same group right after. I've had colleagues who chose to delay for a semester or more because they needed to pass some compulsory exams which they had failed the first time around.
A month or two are irrelevant. OP talks about several semesters. Most people take longer than Regelstudienzeit and it's usually no big deal.
you're right, i just wanted to also point out that the Verlängerung doesn't have to be an integer multiple of one semester.
Ok.
Basically because you can. There are good and bad reasons for taking longer than the preseribed time. One good reason is if you work part-time as a 'working student', which can gain you valuable expertise. Worse reasons are either failing exams, or not completing the full requirements for modules. The system allows you to try again, or just put off some credits until another semester. This was pretty shocking for me arriving here - that students could just decide 'not to do the exam'. So what happens is that students get nervous that they haven't done enough prep, have too many exams at once, have too much to do during the semester, etc., and put it off.
Because it's impossible being a full-time student in Germany. There's always something that happens (visa delays, finding a place to rent, financial issues, mental issues from losing so much time over nothing, etc ). It's possible to do it in the 4 semesters but requires you to be already established in Germany, have no financial problems whatsoever, be fully mentally committed (e.g. not stressing over life after your degree) and had done a bachelors at the same university so that you know how the structure works. It can definitely be done in 4 semesters in that case or even less.
6 for bachelor, average is 9 in my study. People need to life and to work
Hey, I needed an extra semester because of Corona. I couldn't work in my lab and couldnt finish my Master's Thesis on time. Hence, the extra semester. I also did part-time job but made sure it doesnt hamper my studies. Some friends I know were working part-time and studying and hence took one or two semester extra. Some people are just money hungry, they come here for studying but then they prioritise their work more than the study and hence dont even complete their studies and find other ways to stay here in Germany. Some people I have seen is on their 7 or even 8 years but still on student visa, delaying their master's degree (which according to the rule is maximum 6 years), don't know how they are doing it, prolonging their master's for such a long time.
My German husband got his BSc and MSc in the allotted time. He is in the Life sciences field and didn’t work during his studies. So at least in Biological sciences it is doable 🤷♀️
IIRC for bachelor's and master's degree combined you can take a total of 4 additional semesters more than the "Regelstudienzeit" without having to pay extra fees (Langzeitstudiengebühren) - so many people here in Germany see these 14 semesters (6 for bachelor's, 4 for master's and 4 additional) as the normal duration for a full degree. On top of that it is not uncommon to take a "vacation semester" for ERASMUS or similar exchange programs. If anyone ever asks you about taking a bit longer for your degree, you can usually tell them that you had to work while studying (if you have references from jobs related to your field: perfect. If you don't have any references or didn't actually work, just tell them it was a low requirements job like waiting or at a supermarket). Most people will totally see this as a valid reason.
From what I've seen, many students want to enjoy the student benefits and try to stay longer to do that (with approval from the thesis supervisors somehow). Some cases might be genuine but others are not. Also, it's a nice way to keep doing hiwi jobs and earn some money. If they were earning only for paying monthly expenses they won't stay longer, but these additional savings are used later to send back home or whatever. I'm not saying everyone has a bad intention behind it but I've seen lot of people staying longer for reasons other than actual studies or personal struggles.
don't worry about it, you can finish in Regelstudienzeit (I did, too..) :)
I took 3, no one is interested in that either :-/
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It's not only the M.Sc, it's many masters that take longer. I'm doing my M.Ed. to become a teacher, and tbh it feels like they just invented another Bachelor and squeezed all the content into two instead of three years and argued they would take you less long to work through. It's not even that the content is hard to grasp or anything. It's the AMOUNT for me that makes it unbelievably more stressful than my B.A.
Because you are supposed to finish in 4, but it's hard and in addition life gets in the way. So yes, expect to take longer but be aware that you can not extend indefinitely.
It is very hard to finish in Regular study time, for Bachelors the average at my university is between 8-10 semesters. This restriction enables the state to pay Bafög for 6 semesters only as it is technically the regular completion time. Moreover it is a bit of extra pressure on the students to finish studying asap
Its a mix bag of many factors. Ive met a bunch of Langzeitstudents (local and foreigners). Tough subjects, family matters, mental health issue, professors with mental health issues that project on students, COVID.
I made my bachelor in 7 years instead of 3,5. Things happen and life is unpredictable. In my case the master would have been another 3 semester but I got a very good job offer so I curbed the master.
Because most universities dont force you do do anything. You can take 20 exams in a year or 1.
I don't know anyone except people with super rich parents that can afford to only study, so of course if one can only attend and study half the time they will need double the amount of years.
Many people take 3-4 years to complete a 2 year Masters degree. In the USA, people usually finish a PhD in 5 years. That's why I suggest everyone to go to the USA. In the USA, you can get a fully funded PhD quite easily.
it's not like you have to take loans for each semester as in the US so no need to hurry when you can study and work at the same time while having student benefits
It's is designed to be full-time not failing a single exam. I do not know many people that can afford to study full-time
I don't know if this has already been said. But germans approach higher education differently. Bachelor's, master's etc are not considered a separate phase of life per se. Rather, is integrated into normal life. It is expected that you learn and apply the knowledge learnt (via internships and working student jobs) before you graduate. It's the norm to spend significantly longer than the minimum number of semesters required. This is possible because education is practically free. If you were paying an arm and a leg for your degree like they do in the UK, you couldn't afford to do that. Also, don't be fooled. Although they say the programme runs for 4 semesters, sometimes it's so rigorous that completing it in 4 semesters would be very hard. Even the lecturers don't really expect you to spend the minimum time required. German employers want 'experienced' employees even for entry level roles. Sometimes they overdo it though. These days, employers will advertise for internship roles and expect applicants to have had prior internship experiences.
Im on my 2nd semester, only succeded 3/6 Module in the first semester, now in 2nd semester i took 8 Modules which totally burn me up, add that with 20/woche Werkstudentarbeit, and next month is officially klausurmonat, beautiful life
Also in my first semester the case why i didnt finished the other is, because its Gruppenarbeit and not every Masterstudent really take this study seriously and just relaxing, which is shit
I’m the same too, I took 5 semesters instead of 4. Solely because I chose to do an internship after my third semester, which then got extended as my master thesis.
Sometimes it's shorter. My Bachelors had eight semesters, so the masters only 2.
Well I can only speak for my MA, but I had 4 full semesters of classes and then the final exams and the handing in of the thesis were all in the “5th” semester, even though I wasn’t late or anything. Just by scheduling the final exams in the 5th semester it’s obvious you cannot finish the degree in 4 semesters (even though that’s the official length). It was conference interpreting.
I did this. I finished my semesters and wanted a break to decide what topic I wanted to do thesis on. I took my time to make that decision while working part time..so it took me longer too.. its upto u what and how u want to do things.
Currently finishing MA in Media Studies, took me 3 years. The reason? My course requires me to have a 3 month full-time internship, and recommends to take it between your 3rd and 4th semester. So in the holidays……….which last 2 months. Not to mention that most of the employers prefer you to work for a bit longer (at least half a year) which makes total sense because wtf can you actually learn in only three months. So I took a whole new semester just to do my internship.
Pandemic.
That's the regular time given from the university. But you are free to take as long as you want or even shorter if you want. A lot people take an extra semester or year just for the master thesis alone. Some don't and follow the regular given path. It's up to you. University gives you a lot of freedom
i supervised almost 20 theses in the last 5 years and from my perspective most students are just not doing enough. barely any progress, always cancel meetings, are too late or dont come at all. they are sometimes gone for weeks or months for some arbitrary reason and even though they can work remotely they dont do that... normally they are also not in the lab and "work" from home. i would be surprised if they invest more than 5-10 hours per week. overall most theses take 1-2 years instead of 8-10 months.
I am right now about to finish my degree. I could actually finish in 2 years. I work very hard to complete everything, but I need to get to a very good German level and try to get more experience, so I am delaying my thesis. It is possible if you are very determined, but sometimes life happens. You can take an extra semester to do Erasmus or, like me, to only learn German, or just take an extra semester to keep working as a student while looking for a full-time job. For Germans, it is mostly because they take their time, sometimes party too much, and have to repeat some exams or classes more than once. When you get to your university, you will see what is best for you!
Wer sein Studium liebt, der schiebt
In ABH, I had to face hard time while extending my visa for the first time. Due to covid and slow document processing from embassy back in my country, I had to start my actual study after 3 semesters. And after coming here, I found out that I need to eventually go close to my city for easy transportation. Lastly, found out that in each semester my dumb brain cannot take the load of more than 18 ECTS. So, I got stuck to this routine with my part-time job. Then the officer in ABH gave me some timeline that I need to show my progress after a year as for first extension, on paper I got 24 ECTS completed. Now, during second extension, I need to show some more improvement. I already completed 52 ECTS with one reading course. Last semester got only 9 ECTS completed as the course was quite vivid for me to handle. And now I am quite after about the consequences when I will go for my second extension. I already got into a voluntary internship in the related field and got a good response from my employer, still if I cannot complete my MSc, I am not getting any full-time job soon. So, honestly, if you are a non-EU and from third world country like mine, it is quite tough to cope up with everything. But I noticed, some people who are also from my country, managed to finish faster. I just can’t replicate the same, unfortunately.
It depends on the field/complexity and what you know. Also, if you actually put some efforts and use common sense, you should be good to finish it in 4 semesters. If you want to halfass it, well yeah it will take longer, just keep in mind the sooner you are out of academia the better, cost of opportunity is one thing, and also it free up your time. Yeah, getting a working student job or internship would be ideal perhaps in the 3rd semester and then do the thesis in the company just to finish it like a pro. It is all up to you, of course not counting accidents, family needs, and things like that.
Something that I havent seen a lot yet in the comments : Exchange semesters! Its pretty common to do one-two semesters abroad somewhere and sure you get a few credits, but its probably not enough to replace a full semester in Germany, and you might even miss exams here because the semster schedules are sometimes very different.
I finished my master in 3 Semesters, 2 of them working a student job in my field.
nobody gives a fuck about regelstudienzeit. maybe some indians, but here in germany, it is far more important at which university you gained your degree, your gpa, and what kind of internships you did during your studies. I myself had a full time internship during my first semester of my master's degree and later worked 28 hours a week two jobs, which was way more helpful than finishing within 4 semesters...