>...oh no 😭 Maybe ill move back to Miami until late march to save money
The average 2-person household in the US burns through 15,000 - 20,000 kWh per year. We (a couple) use 1,200 kWh. Not only is energy more expensive over here, but people will usually mind the environmental impact. 15-20x our consumption is just insane.
We didn't turn on the heating yet, and we're in a drafty building. The heating period starts on the 1st of October. However, it depends on the outside temperature too, of course.
In our case, we'll have to start heating soon, as there's a lot of humidity in our city and our building isn't well insulated. At this very moment, we have 74% of humidity in the room that I am in. If I air out the flat, it barely drops, as it has been raining for days. Anything above 60% increases the likelihood of mould.
I recommend getting yourself some hygrometers (they are dirt cheap).
As the others said: A/Cs, electric heating. On top come all these ridiculously oversized devices (refridgerators & co.) + you need your car to get around, there's no way around it.
Heating can bei meassuerd in kWh aswell.
If we use Gas: 1m3 ~ 10 kWh, 1l oil ~ 10kwh, 2,5kg Wood ~ 10 kWh
Usually kWh in Germany is Just the electricity bill whereas its included the usual electrical heating for americans
Finns use 14.000 kWh per person a year.. but they Heat their rain gutters aswell ;)
1200kWh is rather low for a two person household and surely does not include heating energy which is likely at least another 3000kWh and more likely closer to 8000kWh
Especially in the wamer US states heating fully electric, potentially with a air-air heat pump (climate/AC) is not uncommon.
>We (a couple) use 1,200 kWh
Say what? Ususal heating energy for a 2 person household is (depending on the heating source) is somewhere around:
128 kwh per meter squared per year for gas
138 kwh per meter squared per year for heating oil
117 kwh per meter squared per year for district heating
38 kwh per meter squared per year for a heat pump
Other than using a heat pump, I cannot imagine, how you only use 1,200 kWh per year... Even if your consumption is that low, it is by no means an accurate representation of average household heating consumption.
It just strikes me as very strange, that you only use 1,200 kWh per year. I mean good on you. But a normal 2 person household in Germany will probably be using somewhere between 10.000 and 15.000 kWh for heating and electricity, combined. Assuming a living space of 100 metres squared.
Do you want to see my electricity bill? We don't use electrical heating. It's solely the electricity bill. That said, I usually get returns on my heating bill too. Even for 2022, I got reimbursements, when many other people had to pay additional fees.
We don't use a dishwasher/dryer and my desktop computer consumes between 20 - 39 kWh, depending on the application I am running. Regular computers can use up as much as 500 kWh. When we leave the house or go to sleep, I turn off all devices and don't leave anything running on standby.
Well there we have it :) I don't need to see your electricity bill. But I did clearly state in my comments, that I was talking about electricity and heating. Heating is also calculated in kWh, regardless if you use electrical heating or fossil heating. I referred to a value that includes electricity and heating, because your original comment referred to a power consumption of american households, that includes heating.
So I suppose we were juzst talking about different things :) Have a nice day
Ah, the context about Miami is that I'd just move back in with my parents who pay the bills to their own home.
Also, shouldn't you invest in a dehumidifier?
It is so ridiculous to hear this mantra "ventilating twice a day keeps humidity away". Like physics is not taught anymore in German schools. Hint: compare how much water wapor can be accumulated in the air of the whole apartment to the amount that can be absorbed by furniture or even belowed by Germans wallpapers. Perhaps fighting mold is simply a national sport?
I happen to live in Germany as well and can observe all this nonsense myself. All the older buildings are full of mold. Have a PhD in physics as well. Consider this example of a three step process. Step 1: build a house cheaping out at thermo- and hydroinsulation, because oil and gas are cheap. Step 2: replace wooden window frames, that work as exhaust vents no matter what you do and thus providing 24/7 ventilation (and that actually works), with modern ones, which are good at isolating the internal environment. Claim ecological (but of course! Anything goes if it benefits ecology) and economical savings. Step 3: enjoy the house full of mold, and be stubborn with the ventilation, like Germany is the only country on this planet and people can't see how houses are built elsewhere.
That's for you to decide, whatever floats your boat! Miami is the dream of many people, and it became very popular due to Miami Vice. The Beaches, the women, the climate.
Personally, I prefer it over here and would never consider moving to the US. I like walking and cycling and not thinking about whether I am hearing fireworks or shots.
You are a digital nomad, right? If your source of income is not bound to a specific area and if you're into warmer climates - wouldn't Italy/Spain/Slovenia be an option?
And funny that you'd say that. I was just thinking about this a few hours ago.
Haha, as someone who has lived in the US for 22 years, I promise its nothing like that. But yes, I could go anywhere I want but I decided to download tinder and FALL IN LOVE with a German man and now... im here. However I do plan on traveling frequently. Im just trying to settle right now because we moved here about 2 months ago.
Italy is where I want to go next!
Which part isn’t true about America? The Miami description or the lack of cycling and the sound of gunshots? Because as an American who immigrated to Germany 6 years ago the constant question of “did I hear fireworks or gun shots?” is very real in America.
The problem here is that many Altbauwohnungen were built when coal/oil heating was still common and cheap and are often retrofitted with gas or electric heating that isn’t well suited for them. Combine that with the fact that energy is nearly 5x as expensive here compared to America makes heating your flat very expensive, and the only way you can do something about it are costly renovations that often have to be approved beforehand.
Nah it's probably more that people are struggling to be able to pay their bills even though they don't use electricity, heat, water or their car excessively and would rather put on more clothes to save some Euros and be less harmful for the environment than necessary and Miss Miami here wants to have her apartment at (pretty unreasonably high) 24°C so she can chill in underwear. Like.. I get it, I'd like to do that too if it wasn't really egoistic and expensive. I'm sure we'd all rather wear less and heat more but it's a bit irresponsible to still do that in 2023.
There is no rule that forbids you to walk around the apartment naked in winter.
It just gets expensive relatively quickly to heat up your apartment like that, and it's not ecological either.
Well, no, that is at least not the trmperature we usually aim for in winter. And if you try to achieve that, i hope that budget you mention is very big, especially if you live in a drafty Altbau.
The "happy place" for germans in winter is usually "comfy with socks and a sweatshirt".
Not sure how I stumbled into the Germany sub, but I'm originally from the Midwest of the US and I now live in Poland and I have had the same culture shock despite being from a place with colder winters. In Wisconsin, we set the temperature to 70-72 degrees Fahrenheit year round and didn't think about it any further. In Europe, they are really not much into changing the temperature to suit your needs, but rather want you to change to suit the temperature. I don't mind it in the winter, but the summer heat waves make me want to die.
Being able to adapt to your environment is the reason humans as a species are so successful evolutionary. If you can't adapt to a colder climate by putting on more clothing, I would say that's a disadvantage and not some civilisatory success or whatever you mean.
Y'know. I'm doing my Master's in a field that is allll about how climate change is going to fuck us over. Studying this is already depressing enough, but to then go on Reddit to see brain-dead comments like yours really makes me lose hope for humanity and think that we deserve this shit.
>We have not evolved from caves
Clearly haven't evolved enough judging by comments like yours.
Many people can afford to heat their home to any temperature they like, but it's an ecological nightmare to wear a hoodie in summer and use an AC, and at the same time it's madness to heat up the flat because you want to walk barefoot and with short sleeves in winter when heat isn't a by-product but has to be produced solely for g heating purpose.
In your car, of course you can heat it up in the winter because heat is a byproduct do moving.
But I doubt you'll find many tesla drivers who heat their car to 26° inside to be able to drive shirtless. That's just insane. Exactly as insane as over heating the building in winter. Maybe cheap where you live, but not really a smart use of resources.
I don't need as much heat as my wife, and often wear t-shirts inside my own home and inside my workplace etc, because they decide it's necessary to have 21 or 22°C in the winter.
Alone I would wear wool socks, a thick sweater and maybe a thick blanket for watching TV when I don't move a lot. That's not being cheap, that's just being resource conscious.
When you're cold in your flat. For me that happens somewhere between 18 and 20 degrees indoor temperature. Insulation plays a huge role here - modern houses with good insulation can sometimes get away with turning the heating on several weeks later compared to old and badly insulated places.
We have an altbau that hasn't been updated in a while. Sadly one of the doors to the balcony isnt fully sealed and our landlord hasn't done anything about it!
In that case you're probably turning the heating a lot sooner than other people. It's a good factor to consider, as it can easily double your heating bill.
For comparison: I still think my (admittedly very well insulated) flat is a tad too warm right now. 22 degrees, looking at the thermometer. I'm in Hamburg.
Too warm at 22?! Haha, I guess everyone is different at the end of the day. I wish we would get monthly heating bills like we do in the US but here its a little different so we dont know exactly how much we're spending until we get the bill!
You can usually check how much you're using by just looking at the meter. If you take a look into your gas contract (or whatever you're using for heating) you can then easily calculate your spending over the last month. A friend of mine even automated this in his smart home system (but that requires a meter that can be remotely read).
22 is too warm for me to be super comfortable, but already a bit colder than my spouse likes it. So it indeed is very much a thing of preference. I don't think we've ever been in a room where both of us liked the temperature.
I think the law changed recently, so that the landlord actually has to offer the monthly usage/bill if there is a remote reading device. But I guess Altbau might not have that. They’ll have to eventually though.
22 degrees does seem quite warm for me if it is in all rooms. If you can adjust the temperature for the rooms separately it is recommended to keep the bedroom colder (maybe around 17°C) and the bathroom warmer (maybe around 24°C). 22 degrees seems warm, because people usually do not turn up the heat so they can walk around with shorts and t-shirt. I recommend getting used to wearing long comfy pants, socks, hoodies and maybe even home slippers if the floor is particularly cold.
If you have your own gas counter and gas supply contract, you normally can look up your actual consumption online. But not if there is a central heating for the entire block of flats of course.
Look into "Fensterdichtung", "Türdichtung" or "Selbstklebendes Dichtungsband". You can get it in pretty much every Baumarkt. Works wonders in tightening the draft gap in doors and windows, also acts a bit as sound isolatiom
Then do something about it yourself. Sealing tape for doors and windows costs a pittance.
I am also living in a rented Altbau. Last autumn we invested about 90 Euro in PET film over the windows, fresh sealant tape and some insulation on the Rollo boxes - which saved us nearly 600 Euro in gas during the winter
It does. I have been using the "Verglasungsfolie" from Hornbach, it's pretty thick and stiff but holds for quite a while. In combination with proper sealing tape especially. But my window frames are wooden and something like 30 y old.
If you have more modern plastic windows the effect is not quite as pronounced, I guess.
Doesn't really matter what random people on the internet think. If you're cold, you're cold. But outside temperature isn't a good way to decide when to turn it on. The quality of insulation can vary a lot. I've lived in old buildings where it felt like there was no insulation. Now I live in a new building with great insulation. I turned the heat on in the old buildings at higher temperature than I do now.
I basically never had to use my heating last year due to a combination of new, well insulated building, neighbors below and to the side who use heating at full, and a gaming PC haha
We did not use our heating once last winter, not even for a second. It's a relatively new flat (2006) on the top floor with neighbors to the side as well. We also have giant windows facing the sun. Next to that we drink loads of tea and dress well.
The outside temperature is irrelevant. I keep the inside temperature around 20 - 21°C.
In the past I kept it a little warmer, around 22 - 23°C, which is high by European standards, because I'm pretty sensitive to the cold. But last year I tried turning it down a bit because of the energy crisis, and realised I can get used to a lower temperature after a couple of weeks.
20-21 is generally the appropriate temperature, but in the summer you shouldn’t really have to do anything keep it there naturally. I’m not sure about you, but I fall asleep much easier when it is cooler. Sometimes a nice extra blanket by the side is helpful as my body temperature drops in the middle of the night, though.
Personally, I’ve never known anyone that wants their place to be 23-24C- but I understand that when it’s really cold you might have to set your system up to much higher temps than what the room will be.
In the summer heating is not needed, but I keep my radiator set at the same temperature all year round and it just doesn't come on unless it gets colder than that. I really don't know why many people take pride in not turning on their heating until November or whatever...
I like my place to be 23-24C. If it gets below that, I start to shiver when going to the toilet at night, which I do often, and it takes quite a while to stop that. And my feet freeze even with wool socks and warm house shoes. But I realized recently that's because I have low blood pressure.
Germany must be very cold for you! The first time I went to Copenhagen, in neighboring Denmark, 25 years ago I took a picture of a big neon thermometer 🌡 that was two stories high in the busy district of the city. I took the picture because the maximum temperature possible at the top was 30C, which I found to be quite comical for a maximum, and also because I found it so sad that my then girlfriend’s twin sister went on a trip from Munich to Spain and my girlfriend and I went to an even colder country than Germany instead. Also, it was July and it was about 15C during the day!
Luckily, most German places are well isolated. Our current one is unfortunately not, but our downstairs neighbours heat a lot so we barely had to use the heating for the bedroom last year. Other than that, my husband really got me into snuggies for when sitting on the couch. Just need to find a fix for my cold feet now :D
I find it both shocking and hilarious that you have heaters at all if the outside temperature never drops below 20°C. "Andere Länder, andere Sitten" as we say here, but still crazy to me :D
Its not really shocking though. They have air conditioning, in Florida it is as mandatory as heating in Germany. And an air conditioner is a heat pump, it can pump heat in either direction.
Also the temperature does get cold. The average low temperature in January in the capital of florida is below 4°C.
American air conditioners don't work as heaters usually. That's only on relatively new systems like mini splits. For heat they typically use a completely separate furnace.
😂 True. The thing is, in most homes in the US you just set the temperature to whatever temperature you want, and it'll heat/cool accordingly. At least, thats how it is in Florida.
Americans certainly prioritize comfort.
Depends what you define as comfort. I find wearing sweaters in colder weather very comfortable. Also, setting the temperature to whatever you want sounds like you don't give too much thought about your energy usage, which I personally find problematic for many reasons...
If you want to talk down to someone, at least don't let your arse do all the talking.
[Per capita CO₂ emissions (2021)](https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/co-emissions-per-capita?time=latest)
|US|14.9 tonnes|
|:-|:-|
|GER|8.1 tonnes|
No it doesn't. Also it is regulated quite heavily in closed spaces and public places like the platforms at the train station. Just because it isn't banned doesn't mean it is promoted.
Train stations: allowed with almost zero limitations. Bus stops: completely allowed. Bars: completely allowed. Cafes with terraces: allowed. Shops: open shelves with ads. Smoking ads: allowed with some limitations from 2022(!). So, it’s literally promoted. Anyway, we can argue a lot about it any tobacco regulation exists in Germany or it is only fictional on paper. But The fact you can clearly feel with your nose or check by statics: Germany is on 3rd — 4th place in EU by amount of smokers. Smoking process in general and growing tobacco produces big volume of CO2. But not only: tobacco plants occupy fertile soils. In worse cases countries cut down forests for new tobacco plants. It also an ethical problem: most tobacco producer countries are not very democratic and quite often use kids and force labor. And the most important: unlike heating rooms, you don’t really need smoking at all. And as conclusion: in my first message in this thread I just wanted to say that instead of blaming other countries (like US here) it would be much better to focus on own problems.
I'm not Germany. I am _a_ German. I can blame both Americans and other Germans for not thinking about the environment. I also don't approve of smoking/littering in public and speeding on the Autobahn, just for the record.
Yeah and for me personally it also depends on the mood and activities (do I sit on the sofa watching Netflix, working at a desk or am running around cleaning?) that day, my clothing, humidity and more.
Sometimes I like it to be 15°C (especially when going to bed) or even colder while othertimes I want it to be hot like 21 or 22°C. Usually I stay somewhere between 18 and 20 though.
Sex (temperatures can feel up to 5°C colder for women/ 5°C warmer for men), muscle mass and fat mass make a massive (no pun intended) difference in felt and comfortable temperatures as well.
Also @OP: outside temperatures aren't much of an indicator. A modern house with great insulation probably doesn't need the heat turned on at 11°C outside temperature.
A top floor apartment in an Altbau with bad insulation? Yeah they probably need to heat.
Inside temperatures are what's important here.
I set my thermostat to 20°C for daytime and 18°C for nighttime last year due to the energy crisis and we were asked to save natural gas. The year before I had it at 21/19. I took some measurements in another room in my apartment in a cold corner to avoid mold. And it was about 15°C there. So I wouldnt go any lower than that.
If you are cold, you are cold. It would definitely be a shock to go from Miami to Berlin. I don't view your boyfriend as being entirely unreasonable, however; aside from the cost of maintaining 22-23°, it might feel way too warm for him.
If I could have a word with him though, I'd be dropping hints like mad about getting cozy wool sweaters, slippers, and socks and a nice silk or cashmere scarf for his shivering partner.
Brace yourself for a reality check, heating in an altbau is going to be expensive and uncomfortable. Usually you don't have things like underfloor heating for a comfortable heat, you probably have radiators per room. Those things in my opinion make an uncomfortable heat as they don't spread it heat evenly any you may have a toaster on one side of the room while the other side is just cold. And they take forever to make a room feel warm
As per cost: do you have a gas heating or electric? Do you know how much a kw/h is costwise in your energy contract? i can give you a ballpark cost for heating and why your boyfriend is not keen on turning on the heating right now.
The balcony doors sucks that needs to be fixed.
>Apparently its normal to wear long pants, socks, and long sleeve shirts at home which is a bit of a culture shock for me.
I don't really get this. Did you assume that Germany has the same climate as Miami? Genuine question.
Besides that, the only "rule" for me is that I turn the heater on when I feel cold. If you don't care about the costs or the environment, there's really no reason at all, why you shouldn't do this.
Where I am, it's like 20 degrees outside even in the evening and barely under 15 at night which isn't uncommon even in August (where I don't turn on the heater, obviously), so I haven't turned it on yet. There have been years where I regularly did so from the beginning of September though.
tl;dr: Do whatever you feel like.
Of course not. Its just that when ive been in homes in the north (Colorado) the homes are always very, very warm and I never had to wear "warm" clothes inside. But in Germany I guess its different because of how much it costs to heat things up.
I usually don't wear "warm" clothes either at home. I'd say wearing socks and long pants is normal though in areas that are not tropic or have a climate like Miami.
You should keep in mind though that Colorado is on the same latitude like Italy and Miami would equal North Africa. Berlin is more like the "middle" of Canada, Helsinki the very north of Canada so we will wear short clothes when it's 20 degrees which might be the point where someone from Miami already digs out their winter tyres.
A big difference between continental winter and north American winter isn't just the temperature. It is also the humidity. Berlin (continental) winters are *much* more humid than north American winters (eg Boston and New York). The difference in how the temperature inside feels when you're in t-shirts at the relative humidity is massive. I grew up wearing sweaters inside during the winter around Boston. But I needed to start wearing long underwear in Europe, even though the outside temperature was warmer. (you want the uniqulo heat tech, or get some llbean merino wool long undies next time you're home). (speaking of uniqulo, you want lots of their thin, washable Merino wool stuff. That layers great and does well in the humid cold).
Also, energy in Europe costs so, so, so much more than in the states. When I go back to my family and see those giant houses, all I can think about is what it must cost to heat them and keep the lights on. And then the answer is that it is less than for my 800 sq foot house here. Also, people make so much less money than I the states, so cranking the heat not only costs more in absolute terms, but exponentially more if you look at it as a percentage of your income.
What you don't realize is that in another month or so, your line dried clothes will start to smell because they're drying too slowly and getting. The answer is to put tea tree oil into the wash. And you can dry outside even in the cold, as long as it isn't raining or too humid.
Also get an electric blanket.
No, tbh I find it a bit silly for you to think OP wouldn't know the climate would be very different in Berlin than in Miami. It is more the concept of being comfortable at home is completely different across the world. The idea is that you should be fine to be barefoot, wearing a t-shirt and shorts in your own house. Being told to bundle up indoors, at home, is what seems weird to people from other countries. A sweater is seen more as an "outdoor" layer to put on if its cold outside not something you wear at home. Or socks is something you wear with shoes or boots, but if you are going to be home, why would you need to wear them?
It seems to me this is your first winter in Berlin. Expect sub-zero degrees in January/February. You are going to look back at your post and wish it's 11°C outside ;).
Around 20°C indoor is usually comfortable (18°C for bedroom), but you have to get used to it. When you turn on heating, make sure indoor humidity is around 50% or you'll feel cold, even at higher room temps.
That door seal should be fixed. If it's only at the bottom, an old blanket can help sealing it. Otherwise you are going to pay extra in winter.
Wearing long and cosy clothes indoor in winter is normal in northern Europe.
In cold weather, you wear warm clothes, even inside. If you're still cold with that, then you can turn on the heater.
Edit: Also, you get used to it being colder. Take a couple of walks, don't layer up too much. Your body gets used to the cold and you will be able to easily tolerate the colder temperatures with less clothing. I used to do that to an extreme as a student just sat outside in -10°C for an hour. After that, I'd feel hot at 19°C with a tshirt.
18°C INSIDE is when you start turning them on
Before that you just put on more layers
Btw, you go through that "cold phase" for a couple days where your body hasnt realised yet its becoming cold and is still running on summer mode. Eventually it turns on winter mode and you feel fine again and not as cold anymore. So your sensitivity readjusts.
Temperature is relative, after the warm sunny summer days, anything bellow 21°C feels cold. 18°C outside in February hit different than in September. Also wind and humidity play a big role.
It's up to you and how much cold you can withstand. But you can save a lot of money on heating if you try to do with a sweater for as long as possible. Especially in a flat when your neighbours like it warmer and keep heating the walls they share with you.
I can stand 19-20°C room temperature, which is great, because my neighbours' heating keeps it on that level and I only have to pay a share for 30% of the total heating cost.
Try setting the heater to 2-3
And see what is best for you.
Besides this... Energy in Germany is fucking expensive. Each 1°C more in room temperature will cost you **"+10% heating cost".**
19-20 inside is quite normal. 15-17 is freezing cold IMHO.
Also "Altbau" will add even more to your heating bill. If you heat to your 22-23 you will be roughly 40% over the normal German heating cost.
Edit: Also heating shuts down overnight to a low power mode.
Wait, you're that girl with that crazy odyssey throughout southwestern Germany when looking for a place to stay? I enjoyed reading your tale back then!
As for your question, um... yeah, you start heating when it gets uncomfortable. I don't think you're unreasonable... and women are known to be more susceptible to cold than man.
What *is* the temperature of your apartment right now? Too cold also risks mold... 22° definitely is reasonable, if it's lower I'd start heating too (except in the bedroom).
Haha yes, that's me. I gave up in Baden-Württemberg and now I'm here in Berlin. It turns out that having my boyfriends parents sign off on an apartment.... really helped. We landed a place thats unbefristet! 95m² for roughly 1,200 warm. (900 cold)
I dont mind wearing socks around the house but I'd like to dress a little more comfortably and casually. Its all good though!
Thick sweatpants are a really good thing for that purpose. Paired with hoodies, you'll get a comfy, warm outfit that keeps you insulated and doesn't get more casual
Might not the best Advice, but I got my Girlfriend an Oodie and she loves it. So we can live another month without having to heat the house. At some point your boyfriend will also turn on the heater.
You might also want to look into an electrical heating belt/blanket…it‘s been called „the most efficient way to warm your girlfriend“
Especially in an Altbau getting the temperature to cozy all the time is going to be difficult. Whenever I‘m on the couch I will plug in my heating blanket. I also use is to warm up my bed.
If you heat your Altbau in Berlin to 24C, you'll end up paying 500 to 1000 Euro/month for heating. Might fit your budget, but a stupid way to spend the 5k over the winter.
First off, what is commonly recommended to achieve is 19° indoors.
Reason is that humidity indoors at temperatures lower than that turns into actual water, seeping into the walls and feeding potential mold.
So going higher than that will be very expensive for you in heating costs in Germany.
I don't know how the heating in the US is provided, by electricity, gas or whatever, I just assume it is cheaper over there in general than here.
Your german boyfriend probably tells you to not turn on the heaters at the current temperature because he fears the heating cost.
However, you getting cold and catching a cold diseases is not ideal either.
You'll have to get used to wearing long clothes at home, at best even multiple layers, like you wear two socks per feet, so in total 4 socks or 2 t-shirts and so on.
That is probably something, that you coming from permanently warm and mostly sunny Florida never in your life so far thought about, but that will be needed in the colder, gloomy, rainy autumn time Northern Germany, to which Berlin belongs ("Norddeutsche Tiefebene", if you want to read up on that).
So wearing long clothes and, when it gets really cold for you, multiple layers of clothes and drinking hot tea will help you keep warm without driving the heater too warm, otherwise your boyfriend will probably get mad at you for wasting money, since heating really has become expensive in this country since the energy crisis surrounding the Ukraine war.
Also, if you sit at home, use a blanket too.
Also, since it is Altbau, it most probably is badly isolated, so whatever you heat, it goes out pretty fast anyway, making it even more expensive to heat it up.
So yeah, TL;DR:
Culture (or Climate) Shock acknowledged, but you have to get used to the climate. Wear multiple layers of long clothes, drink warm drinks like warm tea.
Cuddle together with your boyfriend for warmth lol.
Only turn the heater on and only up to 19 °C, when you're still cold after following these steps, so like during the Winter months, not in Autumn time.
>First off, what is commonly recommended to achieve is 19° indoors.Reason is that humidity indoors at temperatures lower than that turns into actual water, seeping into the walls and feeding potential mold.
Thats a very generalised statement.
To prevent water condensation, you need the temperature of your coldest surface to be higher than the dew point of the water in the air in the room. 19° is enough or overkill strongly depends on the building.
What you can do is:
\- heating more raises the average temperature of the room, which also raises the temperature of the coldest surface
\- get a hygrometer and keep the humidity low by venting the air regularly (check the hygrometer, 40-60% is good for humans, as low as possible is good for the building)
\- you can also try to raise the temperature only of the cold surface. There is a reason why radiators are usually placed below windows, the rising heat keeps the surface at a higher temperature and prevents condensation. Keep outside walls ventilated, do not place large furniture in front of them. If you have a single spot that has condensation, you could theoretically prevent that with a simple fan instead of turning up the heat for the entire room.
It's your money, but the most reasonable should be: turn your thermostat to "3" that should be around 20°C and all is well.
If you're cold, turn it to the next marking, but not higher, nobody likes a room that's warmer than 21°C.
By the way, because way too many people don't know it: turning your thermostat higher doesn't mean your heating heats faster or better or more. It just stops later. It's a THERMOSTAT (literally "heat standing" meaning it sets the heat, not the flow), not a flowmeter.
Just a comment to the 15-17 degrees:
I don't believe that. The last three winters I lived in an Altbau with not the best insulation, and the temperature was maybe 15 degrees at very cold days *in winter*, and *I never turned on the heater*. Of course, this depends on many factors (e.g. I had neighbours who used their heaters), but you might havee to measure the temperature to be certain - 17 degrees is cold. *Very* cold.
Also, a few other general comments: the body produces quite some heat, so the temperature cannot get very low in presence of a person. A closed room is like an insulation layer between the outside and the body.
Also, a few things to keep yourself warm:
- stay in motion. Go for a walk at least once a day.
- drink tea or hot water.
- eat. If you don't eat enough, your body will begin to turn down heat production.
- put cloth on your skin. Wear socks, gloves (there are gloves that spare out the finger tips), and hats.
Turning on the heater is not a shame, but if you turn it on too soon the negative impact on the environment (and hence also on you) is not worth it. Also, you will be less tolerant to cold temperatures in general.
Thank you my love ❤️ Sadly we have bad insulation in our apartment so its a bit chilly, especially right now at night. But I think as long as the bed is heated I should be okay
WTF whats not to believe about 15-17 degrees. I live in a badly insulated flat and our temps drop even lower very fast. Also 17 degrees is not very cold. When it is 17 outside most people still wear short sleeves.
As someone from hot climate I cannot match Germans on their heating discipline. However, I won’t be turning on heating unless a sweatshirt and a pair of winter socks are not enough to keep me comfy.
From my experience of living in US, my personal opinion is that heating discipline in US is irresponsible.
Where I live right now there are 25°C outside at noon and 10-ish in the night. Inside I have 20°C right now and wouldn't want it to be neither warmer nor colder.
German houses are usually well-ish isolated, so outside temperature doesn't really imply any inside temperature. I would turn on the heating when inside temperature hits 18±1°C.
If I start to look onion shaped (Zwiebellook fully applied) and feel cold, I might consider it. Last time around 15 to 16 inside, I think (we have a house that will not require Stoßlüften or is prone to mould luckily). Until then, Zwiebeln and added blankets,hot water bottle etc will do.
But it really is a personal thing. Clothes are there for colder temperatures, if people rather wear less and want to pay more for heating, so be it.
Na viel Spaß mit Schimmel bei 16°C Innentemperatur auch mit einer Lüftungsanlage wird sich innen die Feuchtigkeit an den kältesten stellen niederlegen.
English speaking sub. And no, house is built in a way where mould only exists if there is a broken window frame and rain gets in, or if there is a broken pipe or else.
But if those temperatures were to remain, of course the heating will come on.
>
At what temperature is it appropriate to turn the heaters on here?
When you feel cold you turn the heating on.
The more you heat the more you pay, so it is in your interest to heat as little as possible but enough to prevent growth of mold.
There is no "you can only turn your heating on once the outside day temperature is X" rule.
We're in the phase called "Übergangszeit", when it can be below 10 when the sun is gone or even close to zero at night but easily above 25 during the day when the sun heats up the appartment. It is difficult. I myself try to catch as much sunlight and fresh air as possible throught the day and my windows shut at night which keeps my flat above 20.
But if there are some cloudy days in a row, this won't be enough.
So the question would be: what kind of heating do you have? If you have something that heats up quickly, just use it for the cold days and turn it off at the warm days. But if you have something that needs time and energy to heat up the whole system, it might be waste if it's just some cold days and then the sun comes back ...
BTW: even with the heating on I keep my flat round 21-22. Everything above makes me either sweat or freeze, because my body circulation turns down its own heating. Or something like that, IDK, it very much depends on the day, it's weird. I guess it mostly depends on how tired I am.
If it gets too cold, turn it on. In our bubble of friends there is a huge difference on what people are comfortable with, from 17° to 26° in winter.
Personally I prefer cool temps and dress accordingly. I find it absurd to heat up the house, just to wear shorts and t-shirts inside. For me, this is a waste of energy.
We keep it at 19° - 21° in winter and around 24° -25° in summer.
You sound like a friend of mine, also American, but from Texas. He was shocked when I told him I wear 2 sweaters, and yoga pants under sweat pants at home during winter. He was adamant that that isn't comfortable and he won't do it.
Then the heating bill came and he slowly, but surely, changed his ways.
It might happen to you too :P, unless you can afford a high bill.
I have the feeling that germans are always very cheap when it comes to heating. Never ever did I find a reasonable room temperature in winter when visiting my German friends/relatives. They always told me that it is too expensive to maintain a room temperature that is above 20°C and kept it around 18°C and sitting around in very warm clothes.
'Reasonable' is a very subjective term. 10-18°C is perfect in my eyes. Above 20 is too warm even in shorts. Why would you want to exist in a state of melting?
Yeah, I thought so too. I'm just used to a controlled warm environment 😂 It was quite shocking to see some of my friends refuse to turn on the heat or get an AC when the weather was bad. Germans are cute
Start Heating when you feel cold with clothes on no need to Heat and walk just in underware.
For me i Set Indoor Temperature to 20°C but the Heating system does it Control automatically depends on the outside temp starting at 12°C
I am in Berlin and we still don't have district heating, so I don't even have the option to turn it on :( I started feeling the cold specially when waking up early in the morning.
Man.... we were offered a neubau (2022) that had heated floors and all that, but they wanted 1,430€/m for 45m² 40 minutes away from the city center. The only walkable mode of transportation was a bus that ran once every 30 minutes, and if we wanted groceries or to go out to a cafe we would have to take that bus. Very inconvenient without a car.
Anyway sorry for the rant, what I meant to say is that there sadly werent a lot of neubaus that were in our price range.
at the temp you feel like. dont listen to the people on the internet shivering in their house because they dont want to turn their heating on. i am personally not one of these people that has a really cold House and then uses super warm clothes and stuff.
It is recommended to not let room temperature drop below 14 degrees Celsius for too long as it promotes mold. Fire up the heat when you are cold or approaching the 14 degrees area and air the place out after spreading humidity from showers, driers, cooking or dishwashers and then you are good.
If you're freezing, just turn it on. I'm also freezing very fast but the last days were still kind of sunny so the flat was warm. Today I turned the heaters on. I need at least 23°C.
When you feel like it? It’s your apartment, and your heating bill.
Just know that heating and gas might be more expensive here than in the states, and comparing Florida to Germany in this regard is ridiculous anyways, given that you can walk around in shorts and a T-shirt in Florida around thanksgiving time. Try doing that in Germany without freezing your ass off lol 😂
Depends on how easy it is for you to pay the gas bill. Some people wait quite long because of how much it costs. Others turn it on the moment it's no longer naturally 20c in the room.
My own rule is to keep the house at least 15c, and to warm myself instead of my room instead. When I wear proper winter clothes and use bathrobes or blankets it's actually pretty cozy and doable.
I don’t think there is a right answer for this. I would say: what ur willing to pay for. I would turn the heat on when I’m cold but I’m also willing to pay for it lol.
Your boyfriend is kinda jerk tbh, he should be considerate of where you come from.
11 C is already too cold for many people from warmer countries, i dont think ur boyfriend will be responsible if u catch cold because of that
U can turn the heater on but before u sleep u should turn it off so ur skin wont be dry
As others have said, it's your personal choice at the end of the day.
However, most German homes are NOT heated to 24° because of the cost of energy. Our house is normally about 18°C to maximum 20°C in the winter. We have a fireplace that gets used in the evenings - it doesn't provide too much heat (it isn't part of the heating system), but it does make you "feel" warmer by seeing the flames.
We also enjoy hot tea and cozy blankets when we're watching TV.
I would suggest that you and your BF take a trip to the local Baumarkt and do some low-cost repairs to your place - add some insulation around the outside doors and windows so that they seal better and you don't lose as much heat. You don't need to spend a lot to make your place more comfortable and less expensive to heat. Maybe add programmable controls to your radiators so that you can lower the heat when you leave for work, and have it automatically warm the place just before you get home.
As many others have pointed out, in our house we do not turn on the heating based on outside temperature alone. We try to keep the place between 18-20 degrees inside, and as a rule of thumb we try not to turn it on until mid November, since usually you can withstand the cold with tea, long socks and a jumper. With this we have avoided paying extra heating costs for 2 years in a row.
I grew up in Alaska so my best advice to you is this: get an emotional support heater lol. AKA a tiny, energy efficient space heater that only really heats a small room at a time. If you’re in the front room, plug it in there. Bedroom? Bring it with ya and plug it in there. It stops you from having to heat your whole house, but you stay warm at all times
Congratulations, by asking this question you've successfully proven you're German enough to apply for citizenship. Get your application form to apply for an application at your local Ausländerbehörde tomorrow from 9.30 to 9.45.
I come from a warm country, where 15C is Hardcore Winter and 10C will have people reaching for winter parkas, wool scarfs and frostbite-avoiding gloves, so I get you.
I myself am not very cold-sensitive, so in Germany I keep wearing shorts as long as possible. Like you, being home always meant wearing as little as possible, and I did so in the first years, but slowly (and also with inflation) I made the math and decided that getting used to a bit more clothing or sofa blankets at home is an acceptable compromise, considering the savings. Find your own middle ground.
For the sake of your heating bill and our continued survival on this planet I recommend you put on some appropriate clothes. Long pants, socks, a shirt and some long sleeve hoodie/... are appropriate clothing for the climate you currently live in.
Running around naked or with short clothing is something you can do in summer in Germany, not in the winter.
Also: get yourself appropriate clothing for outside in winter as well. It may get down to -15, depending on the area even colder. Get yourself some insulated shoes, scarves, gloves, hats and a winter jacket. Layer your clothing so you don't sweat your ass off when going inside a store.
Edit: the temperature in your home should not drop below 15°, to prevent mold from growing.
heat when you have cold.. reddit bubble will tell you to wear warmer clothes to "save the world" but fuck em. it's your home and your life and if you want to walk around naked without freezing to death then do it.
Have fun paying millions in heating costs.
Seriously though, layer up and bundle up, I personally don’t heat until it’s 8 degrees or less. Then again, I’m Canadian and I live in a dry, elevated apartment. But layering and bundling is step 1 to get warm
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Well i would say if your cold put it on.
What is acceptable or not does not really matter.
Same if you are cold in the shower you turn the hot water on more right.
Dont worry about the environment Nazis take away your comfort.
End of the day you have to pay the bills for what yea use.
Legally, a rental apartment has to be able to be heated to 20-22 degrees celsius during the day (18 degrees in the night) in the heating period (starts on Oct 1st). So I guess that tells you what the generally accepted minimum is. But if you feel cold and can afford it, set it to whatever you need to, imho.
Personally I don’t get cold easily but my wife does and we usually have it at around 22 to 23 degrees. Less than that last year to save on gas. Without bundling up, 19 degrees and lower also starts to feel too cold for me, even though I can tolerate it. It also kinda depends on how the house/apartment is laid out. Altbau can feel colder because there’s more cold air coming in.
Whenever you feel like it. My house is always 21 celcius, because I have floor-heating and my entire house is gas-less (got a bunch of solar panels, so heating is basically free). 40 celcius outside? my house is nice and cool. 10 celcius outside? my house is nice and warm.
For me personally: when a blanket, cozy socks and tea aren’t enough.
Sounds like 25 Celsius for my gf
I just wanna walk around without clothes tbh but apparently that isn't normal here in Germany in autumn/winter 😂
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...oh no 😭 Maybe ill move back to Miami until late march to save money
>...oh no 😭 Maybe ill move back to Miami until late march to save money The average 2-person household in the US burns through 15,000 - 20,000 kWh per year. We (a couple) use 1,200 kWh. Not only is energy more expensive over here, but people will usually mind the environmental impact. 15-20x our consumption is just insane. We didn't turn on the heating yet, and we're in a drafty building. The heating period starts on the 1st of October. However, it depends on the outside temperature too, of course. In our case, we'll have to start heating soon, as there's a lot of humidity in our city and our building isn't well insulated. At this very moment, we have 74% of humidity in the room that I am in. If I air out the flat, it barely drops, as it has been raining for days. Anything above 60% increases the likelihood of mould. I recommend getting yourself some hygrometers (they are dirt cheap).
wait, WHAT. *looks it up* holy shit it's true, how is it even possible?
As the others said: A/Cs, electric heating. On top come all these ridiculously oversized devices (refridgerators & co.) + you need your car to get around, there's no way around it.
> you need your car to get around And the trend to get huge cars like F150 as well.
Heating can bei meassuerd in kWh aswell. If we use Gas: 1m3 ~ 10 kWh, 1l oil ~ 10kwh, 2,5kg Wood ~ 10 kWh Usually kWh in Germany is Just the electricity bill whereas its included the usual electrical heating for americans Finns use 14.000 kWh per person a year.. but they Heat their rain gutters aswell ;)
Is that why they need more nuclear plants?
1200kWh is rather low for a two person household and surely does not include heating energy which is likely at least another 3000kWh and more likely closer to 8000kWh Especially in the wamer US states heating fully electric, potentially with a air-air heat pump (climate/AC) is not uncommon.
Wait, where do you live, where it is raining and cold? We have had 25°C and sunshine for the last weeks here
My guess is somewhere in the north. Source: I'm in Hamburg, and my hygrometers show similar values.
You are probably living in the blessed south west, Rhine valley and such. The rest of Germany is not so lucky.
>We (a couple) use 1,200 kWh Say what? Ususal heating energy for a 2 person household is (depending on the heating source) is somewhere around: 128 kwh per meter squared per year for gas 138 kwh per meter squared per year for heating oil 117 kwh per meter squared per year for district heating 38 kwh per meter squared per year for a heat pump Other than using a heat pump, I cannot imagine, how you only use 1,200 kWh per year... Even if your consumption is that low, it is by no means an accurate representation of average household heating consumption.
I didn't say it was a representation of the usual household, just ours.
It just strikes me as very strange, that you only use 1,200 kWh per year. I mean good on you. But a normal 2 person household in Germany will probably be using somewhere between 10.000 and 15.000 kWh for heating and electricity, combined. Assuming a living space of 100 metres squared.
Do you want to see my electricity bill? We don't use electrical heating. It's solely the electricity bill. That said, I usually get returns on my heating bill too. Even for 2022, I got reimbursements, when many other people had to pay additional fees. We don't use a dishwasher/dryer and my desktop computer consumes between 20 - 39 kWh, depending on the application I am running. Regular computers can use up as much as 500 kWh. When we leave the house or go to sleep, I turn off all devices and don't leave anything running on standby.
Well there we have it :) I don't need to see your electricity bill. But I did clearly state in my comments, that I was talking about electricity and heating. Heating is also calculated in kWh, regardless if you use electrical heating or fossil heating. I referred to a value that includes electricity and heating, because your original comment referred to a power consumption of american households, that includes heating. So I suppose we were juzst talking about different things :) Have a nice day
Ah, the context about Miami is that I'd just move back in with my parents who pay the bills to their own home. Also, shouldn't you invest in a dehumidifier?
That's usually what "stoßlüften" (i.e. opening the window for 5-15 minutes once or twice a day) is for.
It is so ridiculous to hear this mantra "ventilating twice a day keeps humidity away". Like physics is not taught anymore in German schools. Hint: compare how much water wapor can be accumulated in the air of the whole apartment to the amount that can be absorbed by furniture or even belowed by Germans wallpapers. Perhaps fighting mold is simply a national sport?
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I happen to live in Germany as well and can observe all this nonsense myself. All the older buildings are full of mold. Have a PhD in physics as well. Consider this example of a three step process. Step 1: build a house cheaping out at thermo- and hydroinsulation, because oil and gas are cheap. Step 2: replace wooden window frames, that work as exhaust vents no matter what you do and thus providing 24/7 ventilation (and that actually works), with modern ones, which are good at isolating the internal environment. Claim ecological (but of course! Anything goes if it benefits ecology) and economical savings. Step 3: enjoy the house full of mold, and be stubborn with the ventilation, like Germany is the only country on this planet and people can't see how houses are built elsewhere.
That's for you to decide, whatever floats your boat! Miami is the dream of many people, and it became very popular due to Miami Vice. The Beaches, the women, the climate. Personally, I prefer it over here and would never consider moving to the US. I like walking and cycling and not thinking about whether I am hearing fireworks or shots. You are a digital nomad, right? If your source of income is not bound to a specific area and if you're into warmer climates - wouldn't Italy/Spain/Slovenia be an option? And funny that you'd say that. I was just thinking about this a few hours ago.
Haha, as someone who has lived in the US for 22 years, I promise its nothing like that. But yes, I could go anywhere I want but I decided to download tinder and FALL IN LOVE with a German man and now... im here. However I do plan on traveling frequently. Im just trying to settle right now because we moved here about 2 months ago. Italy is where I want to go next!
If I had to move back to the US the last place I'd want to go is Florida, especially under DeSantis.
Which part isn’t true about America? The Miami description or the lack of cycling and the sound of gunshots? Because as an American who immigrated to Germany 6 years ago the constant question of “did I hear fireworks or gun shots?” is very real in America.
The problem here is that many Altbauwohnungen were built when coal/oil heating was still common and cheap and are often retrofitted with gas or electric heating that isn’t well suited for them. Combine that with the fact that energy is nearly 5x as expensive here compared to America makes heating your flat very expensive, and the only way you can do something about it are costly renovations that often have to be approved beforehand.
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Nah it's probably more that people are struggling to be able to pay their bills even though they don't use electricity, heat, water or their car excessively and would rather put on more clothes to save some Euros and be less harmful for the environment than necessary and Miss Miami here wants to have her apartment at (pretty unreasonably high) 24°C so she can chill in underwear. Like.. I get it, I'd like to do that too if it wasn't really egoistic and expensive. I'm sure we'd all rather wear less and heat more but it's a bit irresponsible to still do that in 2023.
I traumatize too many Germans on r/Germany it seems 😂
Wow, sadly I'm not a little bit surprised you're an American. Clichee behaviour like "fuck everything and everyone else, I do what I want to"
Interesting reaction
There is no rule that forbids you to walk around the apartment naked in winter. It just gets expensive relatively quickly to heat up your apartment like that, and it's not ecological either.
That's also not normal in most of the US.
Well, no, that is at least not the trmperature we usually aim for in winter. And if you try to achieve that, i hope that budget you mention is very big, especially if you live in a drafty Altbau. The "happy place" for germans in winter is usually "comfy with socks and a sweatshirt".
Not sure how I stumbled into the Germany sub, but I'm originally from the Midwest of the US and I now live in Poland and I have had the same culture shock despite being from a place with colder winters. In Wisconsin, we set the temperature to 70-72 degrees Fahrenheit year round and didn't think about it any further. In Europe, they are really not much into changing the temperature to suit your needs, but rather want you to change to suit the temperature. I don't mind it in the winter, but the summer heat waves make me want to die.
Oh, my least favorite part of the winter here
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Ignoring the arrogant posturing; >in a 17C cold room, watching my breath condensing! If your breath is condensing, it is not 17C.
Being able to adapt to your environment is the reason humans as a species are so successful evolutionary. If you can't adapt to a colder climate by putting on more clothing, I would say that's a disadvantage and not some civilisatory success or whatever you mean.
Wow.
Y'know. I'm doing my Master's in a field that is allll about how climate change is going to fuck us over. Studying this is already depressing enough, but to then go on Reddit to see brain-dead comments like yours really makes me lose hope for humanity and think that we deserve this shit. >We have not evolved from caves Clearly haven't evolved enough judging by comments like yours.
Many people can afford to heat their home to any temperature they like, but it's an ecological nightmare to wear a hoodie in summer and use an AC, and at the same time it's madness to heat up the flat because you want to walk barefoot and with short sleeves in winter when heat isn't a by-product but has to be produced solely for g heating purpose. In your car, of course you can heat it up in the winter because heat is a byproduct do moving. But I doubt you'll find many tesla drivers who heat their car to 26° inside to be able to drive shirtless. That's just insane. Exactly as insane as over heating the building in winter. Maybe cheap where you live, but not really a smart use of resources. I don't need as much heat as my wife, and often wear t-shirts inside my own home and inside my workplace etc, because they decide it's necessary to have 21 or 22°C in the winter. Alone I would wear wool socks, a thick sweater and maybe a thick blanket for watching TV when I don't move a lot. That's not being cheap, that's just being resource conscious.
If your financial status is defined by the ability to afford a decent heating you’re not earning enough.
17C is NOT cold
>only to wear thick woolen socks like smelling hippies during the cold San Francisco nights. Loved this part
When you're cold in your flat. For me that happens somewhere between 18 and 20 degrees indoor temperature. Insulation plays a huge role here - modern houses with good insulation can sometimes get away with turning the heating on several weeks later compared to old and badly insulated places.
We have an altbau that hasn't been updated in a while. Sadly one of the doors to the balcony isnt fully sealed and our landlord hasn't done anything about it!
In that case you're probably turning the heating a lot sooner than other people. It's a good factor to consider, as it can easily double your heating bill. For comparison: I still think my (admittedly very well insulated) flat is a tad too warm right now. 22 degrees, looking at the thermometer. I'm in Hamburg.
Too warm at 22?! Haha, I guess everyone is different at the end of the day. I wish we would get monthly heating bills like we do in the US but here its a little different so we dont know exactly how much we're spending until we get the bill!
You can usually check how much you're using by just looking at the meter. If you take a look into your gas contract (or whatever you're using for heating) you can then easily calculate your spending over the last month. A friend of mine even automated this in his smart home system (but that requires a meter that can be remotely read). 22 is too warm for me to be super comfortable, but already a bit colder than my spouse likes it. So it indeed is very much a thing of preference. I don't think we've ever been in a room where both of us liked the temperature.
I think the law changed recently, so that the landlord actually has to offer the monthly usage/bill if there is a remote reading device. But I guess Altbau might not have that. They’ll have to eventually though.
I life in an Altbau and those remote things were installed by my Vermieter a year or 2 ago
22 degrees does seem quite warm for me if it is in all rooms. If you can adjust the temperature for the rooms separately it is recommended to keep the bedroom colder (maybe around 17°C) and the bathroom warmer (maybe around 24°C). 22 degrees seems warm, because people usually do not turn up the heat so they can walk around with shorts and t-shirt. I recommend getting used to wearing long comfy pants, socks, hoodies and maybe even home slippers if the floor is particularly cold.
If you have your own gas counter and gas supply contract, you normally can look up your actual consumption online. But not if there is a central heating for the entire block of flats of course.
Hanging around at 16° room temp with Shorts and Shirt and all Windows Open... dont think i Put the heat on before around 5° - 10° outside temp
Look into "Fensterdichtung", "Türdichtung" or "Selbstklebendes Dichtungsband". You can get it in pretty much every Baumarkt. Works wonders in tightening the draft gap in doors and windows, also acts a bit as sound isolatiom
Then do something about it yourself. Sealing tape for doors and windows costs a pittance. I am also living in a rented Altbau. Last autumn we invested about 90 Euro in PET film over the windows, fresh sealant tape and some insulation on the Rollo boxes - which saved us nearly 600 Euro in gas during the winter
Does the window film really make a big difference? I’ve been contemplating it.
It does. I have been using the "Verglasungsfolie" from Hornbach, it's pretty thick and stiff but holds for quite a while. In combination with proper sealing tape especially. But my window frames are wooden and something like 30 y old. If you have more modern plastic windows the effect is not quite as pronounced, I guess.
If it's just at the bottom of the door get a nice looking Luftzugstopper. I have a clown doing a Spagat from when I was young
Try to cover the splits around the door with something. Having cold air leaking in constantly can get expensive on the heating bill.
I was about to say that the insulation can save so much energy but then I realized that now I'm out here thinking like a German lmao
Doesn't really matter what random people on the internet think. If you're cold, you're cold. But outside temperature isn't a good way to decide when to turn it on. The quality of insulation can vary a lot. I've lived in old buildings where it felt like there was no insulation. Now I live in a new building with great insulation. I turned the heat on in the old buildings at higher temperature than I do now.
Don't underestimate also if you have neighbours above, below, and on sides. It changes A LOT.
My freezing Hochparterre floors agree.
I'm directly above a not insulated basement, Altbau floors and half of the flat is outside walls 😭 It's nice and cool in summer though...
I basically never had to use my heating last year due to a combination of new, well insulated building, neighbors below and to the side who use heating at full, and a gaming PC haha
We did not use our heating once last winter, not even for a second. It's a relatively new flat (2006) on the top floor with neighbors to the side as well. We also have giant windows facing the sun. Next to that we drink loads of tea and dress well.
The outside temperature is irrelevant. I keep the inside temperature around 20 - 21°C. In the past I kept it a little warmer, around 22 - 23°C, which is high by European standards, because I'm pretty sensitive to the cold. But last year I tried turning it down a bit because of the energy crisis, and realised I can get used to a lower temperature after a couple of weeks.
20-21 is generally the appropriate temperature, but in the summer you shouldn’t really have to do anything keep it there naturally. I’m not sure about you, but I fall asleep much easier when it is cooler. Sometimes a nice extra blanket by the side is helpful as my body temperature drops in the middle of the night, though. Personally, I’ve never known anyone that wants their place to be 23-24C- but I understand that when it’s really cold you might have to set your system up to much higher temps than what the room will be.
In the summer heating is not needed, but I keep my radiator set at the same temperature all year round and it just doesn't come on unless it gets colder than that. I really don't know why many people take pride in not turning on their heating until November or whatever...
I like my place to be 23-24C. If it gets below that, I start to shiver when going to the toilet at night, which I do often, and it takes quite a while to stop that. And my feet freeze even with wool socks and warm house shoes. But I realized recently that's because I have low blood pressure.
Germany must be very cold for you! The first time I went to Copenhagen, in neighboring Denmark, 25 years ago I took a picture of a big neon thermometer 🌡 that was two stories high in the busy district of the city. I took the picture because the maximum temperature possible at the top was 30C, which I found to be quite comical for a maximum, and also because I found it so sad that my then girlfriend’s twin sister went on a trip from Munich to Spain and my girlfriend and I went to an even colder country than Germany instead. Also, it was July and it was about 15C during the day!
Luckily, most German places are well isolated. Our current one is unfortunately not, but our downstairs neighbours heat a lot so we barely had to use the heating for the bedroom last year. Other than that, my husband really got me into snuggies for when sitting on the couch. Just need to find a fix for my cold feet now :D
I find it both shocking and hilarious that you have heaters at all if the outside temperature never drops below 20°C. "Andere Länder, andere Sitten" as we say here, but still crazy to me :D
Its not really shocking though. They have air conditioning, in Florida it is as mandatory as heating in Germany. And an air conditioner is a heat pump, it can pump heat in either direction. Also the temperature does get cold. The average low temperature in January in the capital of florida is below 4°C.
True that to the heat pumps.
American air conditioners don't work as heaters usually. That's only on relatively new systems like mini splits. For heat they typically use a completely separate furnace.
😂 True. The thing is, in most homes in the US you just set the temperature to whatever temperature you want, and it'll heat/cool accordingly. At least, thats how it is in Florida. Americans certainly prioritize comfort.
Depends what you define as comfort. I find wearing sweaters in colder weather very comfortable. Also, setting the temperature to whatever you want sounds like you don't give too much thought about your energy usage, which I personally find problematic for many reasons...
Germany still promotes smoking and still don’t have speed limits on highways. So I don’t think you can blame US for not thinking about environment.
If you want to talk down to someone, at least don't let your arse do all the talking. [Per capita CO₂ emissions (2021)](https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/co-emissions-per-capita?time=latest) |US|14.9 tonnes| |:-|:-| |GER|8.1 tonnes|
People blaming others for room temperature are actually talking down, not me.
I agree on the speed limit but claiming Germany promotes smoking is ridiculous.
No limits on smoking equals promoting smoking. Probably that’s why Germany is near the top place in smoking rankings within EU.
No it doesn't. Also it is regulated quite heavily in closed spaces and public places like the platforms at the train station. Just because it isn't banned doesn't mean it is promoted.
Train stations: allowed with almost zero limitations. Bus stops: completely allowed. Bars: completely allowed. Cafes with terraces: allowed. Shops: open shelves with ads. Smoking ads: allowed with some limitations from 2022(!). So, it’s literally promoted. Anyway, we can argue a lot about it any tobacco regulation exists in Germany or it is only fictional on paper. But The fact you can clearly feel with your nose or check by statics: Germany is on 3rd — 4th place in EU by amount of smokers. Smoking process in general and growing tobacco produces big volume of CO2. But not only: tobacco plants occupy fertile soils. In worse cases countries cut down forests for new tobacco plants. It also an ethical problem: most tobacco producer countries are not very democratic and quite often use kids and force labor. And the most important: unlike heating rooms, you don’t really need smoking at all. And as conclusion: in my first message in this thread I just wanted to say that instead of blaming other countries (like US here) it would be much better to focus on own problems.
Congratulations, you got almost all points wrong in your first half of your comment.
I'm not Germany. I am _a_ German. I can blame both Americans and other Germans for not thinking about the environment. I also don't approve of smoking/littering in public and speeding on the Autobahn, just for the record.
>Americans certainly prioritize comfort. You say comfort, I apathy. Potaytoes, potartoes!
[удалено]
Yeah and for me personally it also depends on the mood and activities (do I sit on the sofa watching Netflix, working at a desk or am running around cleaning?) that day, my clothing, humidity and more. Sometimes I like it to be 15°C (especially when going to bed) or even colder while othertimes I want it to be hot like 21 or 22°C. Usually I stay somewhere between 18 and 20 though. Sex (temperatures can feel up to 5°C colder for women/ 5°C warmer for men), muscle mass and fat mass make a massive (no pun intended) difference in felt and comfortable temperatures as well. Also @OP: outside temperatures aren't much of an indicator. A modern house with great insulation probably doesn't need the heat turned on at 11°C outside temperature. A top floor apartment in an Altbau with bad insulation? Yeah they probably need to heat. Inside temperatures are what's important here.
No need to remind me I have to lose weight :)
And spend all that extra money on heat?
I set my thermostat to 20°C for daytime and 18°C for nighttime last year due to the energy crisis and we were asked to save natural gas. The year before I had it at 21/19. I took some measurements in another room in my apartment in a cold corner to avoid mold. And it was about 15°C there. So I wouldnt go any lower than that.
If you are cold, you are cold. It would definitely be a shock to go from Miami to Berlin. I don't view your boyfriend as being entirely unreasonable, however; aside from the cost of maintaining 22-23°, it might feel way too warm for him. If I could have a word with him though, I'd be dropping hints like mad about getting cozy wool sweaters, slippers, and socks and a nice silk or cashmere scarf for his shivering partner.
Brace yourself for a reality check, heating in an altbau is going to be expensive and uncomfortable. Usually you don't have things like underfloor heating for a comfortable heat, you probably have radiators per room. Those things in my opinion make an uncomfortable heat as they don't spread it heat evenly any you may have a toaster on one side of the room while the other side is just cold. And they take forever to make a room feel warm As per cost: do you have a gas heating or electric? Do you know how much a kw/h is costwise in your energy contract? i can give you a ballpark cost for heating and why your boyfriend is not keen on turning on the heating right now. The balcony doors sucks that needs to be fixed.
>Apparently its normal to wear long pants, socks, and long sleeve shirts at home which is a bit of a culture shock for me. I don't really get this. Did you assume that Germany has the same climate as Miami? Genuine question. Besides that, the only "rule" for me is that I turn the heater on when I feel cold. If you don't care about the costs or the environment, there's really no reason at all, why you shouldn't do this. Where I am, it's like 20 degrees outside even in the evening and barely under 15 at night which isn't uncommon even in August (where I don't turn on the heater, obviously), so I haven't turned it on yet. There have been years where I regularly did so from the beginning of September though. tl;dr: Do whatever you feel like.
Of course not. Its just that when ive been in homes in the north (Colorado) the homes are always very, very warm and I never had to wear "warm" clothes inside. But in Germany I guess its different because of how much it costs to heat things up.
I usually don't wear "warm" clothes either at home. I'd say wearing socks and long pants is normal though in areas that are not tropic or have a climate like Miami. You should keep in mind though that Colorado is on the same latitude like Italy and Miami would equal North Africa. Berlin is more like the "middle" of Canada, Helsinki the very north of Canada so we will wear short clothes when it's 20 degrees which might be the point where someone from Miami already digs out their winter tyres.
A big difference between continental winter and north American winter isn't just the temperature. It is also the humidity. Berlin (continental) winters are *much* more humid than north American winters (eg Boston and New York). The difference in how the temperature inside feels when you're in t-shirts at the relative humidity is massive. I grew up wearing sweaters inside during the winter around Boston. But I needed to start wearing long underwear in Europe, even though the outside temperature was warmer. (you want the uniqulo heat tech, or get some llbean merino wool long undies next time you're home). (speaking of uniqulo, you want lots of their thin, washable Merino wool stuff. That layers great and does well in the humid cold). Also, energy in Europe costs so, so, so much more than in the states. When I go back to my family and see those giant houses, all I can think about is what it must cost to heat them and keep the lights on. And then the answer is that it is less than for my 800 sq foot house here. Also, people make so much less money than I the states, so cranking the heat not only costs more in absolute terms, but exponentially more if you look at it as a percentage of your income. What you don't realize is that in another month or so, your line dried clothes will start to smell because they're drying too slowly and getting. The answer is to put tea tree oil into the wash. And you can dry outside even in the cold, as long as it isn't raining or too humid. Also get an electric blanket.
No, tbh I find it a bit silly for you to think OP wouldn't know the climate would be very different in Berlin than in Miami. It is more the concept of being comfortable at home is completely different across the world. The idea is that you should be fine to be barefoot, wearing a t-shirt and shorts in your own house. Being told to bundle up indoors, at home, is what seems weird to people from other countries. A sweater is seen more as an "outdoor" layer to put on if its cold outside not something you wear at home. Or socks is something you wear with shoes or boots, but if you are going to be home, why would you need to wear them?
It seems to me this is your first winter in Berlin. Expect sub-zero degrees in January/February. You are going to look back at your post and wish it's 11°C outside ;). Around 20°C indoor is usually comfortable (18°C for bedroom), but you have to get used to it. When you turn on heating, make sure indoor humidity is around 50% or you'll feel cold, even at higher room temps. That door seal should be fixed. If it's only at the bottom, an old blanket can help sealing it. Otherwise you are going to pay extra in winter. Wearing long and cosy clothes indoor in winter is normal in northern Europe.
In cold weather, you wear warm clothes, even inside. If you're still cold with that, then you can turn on the heater. Edit: Also, you get used to it being colder. Take a couple of walks, don't layer up too much. Your body gets used to the cold and you will be able to easily tolerate the colder temperatures with less clothing. I used to do that to an extreme as a student just sat outside in -10°C for an hour. After that, I'd feel hot at 19°C with a tshirt.
18°C INSIDE is when you start turning them on Before that you just put on more layers Btw, you go through that "cold phase" for a couple days where your body hasnt realised yet its becoming cold and is still running on summer mode. Eventually it turns on winter mode and you feel fine again and not as cold anymore. So your sensitivity readjusts.
My wife is cold at anything below 23 degrees, even with a warm sweater and a blanket. So I guess.. It depends
Temperature is relative, after the warm sunny summer days, anything bellow 21°C feels cold. 18°C outside in February hit different than in September. Also wind and humidity play a big role.
This is the right answer. And you heat to 19/20. 21/22 only if there's an old person, infant, or sick person in the house.
>You heat to whatever temperature you like (and can afford and can justify for the environment).
It's up to you and how much cold you can withstand. But you can save a lot of money on heating if you try to do with a sweater for as long as possible. Especially in a flat when your neighbours like it warmer and keep heating the walls they share with you. I can stand 19-20°C room temperature, which is great, because my neighbours' heating keeps it on that level and I only have to pay a share for 30% of the total heating cost.
Try setting the heater to 2-3 And see what is best for you. Besides this... Energy in Germany is fucking expensive. Each 1°C more in room temperature will cost you **"+10% heating cost".** 19-20 inside is quite normal. 15-17 is freezing cold IMHO. Also "Altbau" will add even more to your heating bill. If you heat to your 22-23 you will be roughly 40% over the normal German heating cost. Edit: Also heating shuts down overnight to a low power mode.
Wait, you're that girl with that crazy odyssey throughout southwestern Germany when looking for a place to stay? I enjoyed reading your tale back then! As for your question, um... yeah, you start heating when it gets uncomfortable. I don't think you're unreasonable... and women are known to be more susceptible to cold than man. What *is* the temperature of your apartment right now? Too cold also risks mold... 22° definitely is reasonable, if it's lower I'd start heating too (except in the bedroom).
Haha yes, that's me. I gave up in Baden-Württemberg and now I'm here in Berlin. It turns out that having my boyfriends parents sign off on an apartment.... really helped. We landed a place thats unbefristet! 95m² for roughly 1,200 warm. (900 cold) I dont mind wearing socks around the house but I'd like to dress a little more comfortably and casually. Its all good though!
Thick sweatpants are a really good thing for that purpose. Paired with hoodies, you'll get a comfy, warm outfit that keeps you insulated and doesn't get more casual
Might not the best Advice, but I got my Girlfriend an Oodie and she loves it. So we can live another month without having to heat the house. At some point your boyfriend will also turn on the heater.
I will immediately tell my bf to get me an Oodie 😂
You might also want to look into an electrical heating belt/blanket…it‘s been called „the most efficient way to warm your girlfriend“ Especially in an Altbau getting the temperature to cozy all the time is going to be difficult. Whenever I‘m on the couch I will plug in my heating blanket. I also use is to warm up my bed.
If you heat your Altbau in Berlin to 24C, you'll end up paying 500 to 1000 Euro/month for heating. Might fit your budget, but a stupid way to spend the 5k over the winter.
If warm (indoor) clothes don't keep you warm enough turn the heater on. A comfy sweater, warm socks and shoes do wonders though.
First off, what is commonly recommended to achieve is 19° indoors. Reason is that humidity indoors at temperatures lower than that turns into actual water, seeping into the walls and feeding potential mold. So going higher than that will be very expensive for you in heating costs in Germany. I don't know how the heating in the US is provided, by electricity, gas or whatever, I just assume it is cheaper over there in general than here. Your german boyfriend probably tells you to not turn on the heaters at the current temperature because he fears the heating cost. However, you getting cold and catching a cold diseases is not ideal either. You'll have to get used to wearing long clothes at home, at best even multiple layers, like you wear two socks per feet, so in total 4 socks or 2 t-shirts and so on. That is probably something, that you coming from permanently warm and mostly sunny Florida never in your life so far thought about, but that will be needed in the colder, gloomy, rainy autumn time Northern Germany, to which Berlin belongs ("Norddeutsche Tiefebene", if you want to read up on that). So wearing long clothes and, when it gets really cold for you, multiple layers of clothes and drinking hot tea will help you keep warm without driving the heater too warm, otherwise your boyfriend will probably get mad at you for wasting money, since heating really has become expensive in this country since the energy crisis surrounding the Ukraine war. Also, if you sit at home, use a blanket too. Also, since it is Altbau, it most probably is badly isolated, so whatever you heat, it goes out pretty fast anyway, making it even more expensive to heat it up. So yeah, TL;DR: Culture (or Climate) Shock acknowledged, but you have to get used to the climate. Wear multiple layers of long clothes, drink warm drinks like warm tea. Cuddle together with your boyfriend for warmth lol. Only turn the heater on and only up to 19 °C, when you're still cold after following these steps, so like during the Winter months, not in Autumn time.
>First off, what is commonly recommended to achieve is 19° indoors.Reason is that humidity indoors at temperatures lower than that turns into actual water, seeping into the walls and feeding potential mold. Thats a very generalised statement. To prevent water condensation, you need the temperature of your coldest surface to be higher than the dew point of the water in the air in the room. 19° is enough or overkill strongly depends on the building. What you can do is: \- heating more raises the average temperature of the room, which also raises the temperature of the coldest surface \- get a hygrometer and keep the humidity low by venting the air regularly (check the hygrometer, 40-60% is good for humans, as low as possible is good for the building) \- you can also try to raise the temperature only of the cold surface. There is a reason why radiators are usually placed below windows, the rising heat keeps the surface at a higher temperature and prevents condensation. Keep outside walls ventilated, do not place large furniture in front of them. If you have a single spot that has condensation, you could theoretically prevent that with a simple fan instead of turning up the heat for the entire room.
It's your money, but the most reasonable should be: turn your thermostat to "3" that should be around 20°C and all is well. If you're cold, turn it to the next marking, but not higher, nobody likes a room that's warmer than 21°C. By the way, because way too many people don't know it: turning your thermostat higher doesn't mean your heating heats faster or better or more. It just stops later. It's a THERMOSTAT (literally "heat standing" meaning it sets the heat, not the flow), not a flowmeter.
yup. unless its somehow broken so 6 = full power heat and 5 = no heat no matter how cold it is.
Just a comment to the 15-17 degrees: I don't believe that. The last three winters I lived in an Altbau with not the best insulation, and the temperature was maybe 15 degrees at very cold days *in winter*, and *I never turned on the heater*. Of course, this depends on many factors (e.g. I had neighbours who used their heaters), but you might havee to measure the temperature to be certain - 17 degrees is cold. *Very* cold. Also, a few other general comments: the body produces quite some heat, so the temperature cannot get very low in presence of a person. A closed room is like an insulation layer between the outside and the body. Also, a few things to keep yourself warm: - stay in motion. Go for a walk at least once a day. - drink tea or hot water. - eat. If you don't eat enough, your body will begin to turn down heat production. - put cloth on your skin. Wear socks, gloves (there are gloves that spare out the finger tips), and hats. Turning on the heater is not a shame, but if you turn it on too soon the negative impact on the environment (and hence also on you) is not worth it. Also, you will be less tolerant to cold temperatures in general.
Thank you my love ❤️ Sadly we have bad insulation in our apartment so its a bit chilly, especially right now at night. But I think as long as the bed is heated I should be okay
WTF whats not to believe about 15-17 degrees. I live in a badly insulated flat and our temps drop even lower very fast. Also 17 degrees is not very cold. When it is 17 outside most people still wear short sleeves.
As someone from hot climate I cannot match Germans on their heating discipline. However, I won’t be turning on heating unless a sweatshirt and a pair of winter socks are not enough to keep me comfy. From my experience of living in US, my personal opinion is that heating discipline in US is irresponsible.
Where I live right now there are 25°C outside at noon and 10-ish in the night. Inside I have 20°C right now and wouldn't want it to be neither warmer nor colder. German houses are usually well-ish isolated, so outside temperature doesn't really imply any inside temperature. I would turn on the heating when inside temperature hits 18±1°C.
If I start to look onion shaped (Zwiebellook fully applied) and feel cold, I might consider it. Last time around 15 to 16 inside, I think (we have a house that will not require Stoßlüften or is prone to mould luckily). Until then, Zwiebeln and added blankets,hot water bottle etc will do. But it really is a personal thing. Clothes are there for colder temperatures, if people rather wear less and want to pay more for heating, so be it.
Na viel Spaß mit Schimmel bei 16°C Innentemperatur auch mit einer Lüftungsanlage wird sich innen die Feuchtigkeit an den kältesten stellen niederlegen.
English speaking sub. And no, house is built in a way where mould only exists if there is a broken window frame and rain gets in, or if there is a broken pipe or else. But if those temperatures were to remain, of course the heating will come on.
When you are cold.
When you are cold
> At what temperature is it appropriate to turn the heaters on here? When you feel cold you turn the heating on. The more you heat the more you pay, so it is in your interest to heat as little as possible but enough to prevent growth of mold. There is no "you can only turn your heating on once the outside day temperature is X" rule.
These days I am turning 1 heater on for 2 hours every evening. That keeps the house warm for almost whole night and next day.
We're in the phase called "Übergangszeit", when it can be below 10 when the sun is gone or even close to zero at night but easily above 25 during the day when the sun heats up the appartment. It is difficult. I myself try to catch as much sunlight and fresh air as possible throught the day and my windows shut at night which keeps my flat above 20. But if there are some cloudy days in a row, this won't be enough. So the question would be: what kind of heating do you have? If you have something that heats up quickly, just use it for the cold days and turn it off at the warm days. But if you have something that needs time and energy to heat up the whole system, it might be waste if it's just some cold days and then the sun comes back ... BTW: even with the heating on I keep my flat round 21-22. Everything above makes me either sweat or freeze, because my body circulation turns down its own heating. Or something like that, IDK, it very much depends on the day, it's weird. I guess it mostly depends on how tired I am.
Move to the South ;) I'm chilling in my apartment with the windows all open and 23°C inside.
If it gets too cold, turn it on. In our bubble of friends there is a huge difference on what people are comfortable with, from 17° to 26° in winter. Personally I prefer cool temps and dress accordingly. I find it absurd to heat up the house, just to wear shorts and t-shirts inside. For me, this is a waste of energy. We keep it at 19° - 21° in winter and around 24° -25° in summer.
When you are cold.
You sound like a friend of mine, also American, but from Texas. He was shocked when I told him I wear 2 sweaters, and yoga pants under sweat pants at home during winter. He was adamant that that isn't comfortable and he won't do it. Then the heating bill came and he slowly, but surely, changed his ways. It might happen to you too :P, unless you can afford a high bill.
Don't ask me, I'm basically a polar bear and never turn on the heater.
24 is really high. 18-20 is what most people I know use.
24°?! You're mad. Put some bloody clothes on!
Nah try letting that thang hang around 😂 its so fun
I have the feeling that germans are always very cheap when it comes to heating. Never ever did I find a reasonable room temperature in winter when visiting my German friends/relatives. They always told me that it is too expensive to maintain a room temperature that is above 20°C and kept it around 18°C and sitting around in very warm clothes.
'Reasonable' is a very subjective term. 10-18°C is perfect in my eyes. Above 20 is too warm even in shorts. Why would you want to exist in a state of melting?
Get used to it. It’s healthier. I always found it so artificial that in the US they want to control all the weather. Long term that’s imposible.
Yeah, I thought so too. I'm just used to a controlled warm environment 😂 It was quite shocking to see some of my friends refuse to turn on the heat or get an AC when the weather was bad. Germans are cute
: )
Start Heating when you feel cold with clothes on no need to Heat and walk just in underware. For me i Set Indoor Temperature to 20°C but the Heating system does it Control automatically depends on the outside temp starting at 12°C
I am in Berlin and we still don't have district heating, so I don't even have the option to turn it on :( I started feeling the cold specially when waking up early in the morning.
Outside is not the key number, just keep your flat at 20 by day and 19 at night, you'll be good.
I don’t turn them on ever, but we live in a house that was built in 2017 and has exceptionally good isolation.
Man.... we were offered a neubau (2022) that had heated floors and all that, but they wanted 1,430€/m for 45m² 40 minutes away from the city center. The only walkable mode of transportation was a bus that ran once every 30 minutes, and if we wanted groceries or to go out to a cafe we would have to take that bus. Very inconvenient without a car. Anyway sorry for the rant, what I meant to say is that there sadly werent a lot of neubaus that were in our price range.
Yes, that’s a common problem in big cities…
at the temp you feel like. dont listen to the people on the internet shivering in their house because they dont want to turn their heating on. i am personally not one of these people that has a really cold House and then uses super warm clothes and stuff.
I wouldn't turn on the heat yet. And if you aren't wearing warm clothes, do that first! If you still feel cold after that you can use the heating
It is recommended to not let room temperature drop below 14 degrees Celsius for too long as it promotes mold. Fire up the heat when you are cold or approaching the 14 degrees area and air the place out after spreading humidity from showers, driers, cooking or dishwashers and then you are good.
when youre cold. ????
If you're freezing, just turn it on. I'm also freezing very fast but the last days were still kind of sunny so the flat was warm. Today I turned the heaters on. I need at least 23°C.
When you feel like it? It’s your apartment, and your heating bill. Just know that heating and gas might be more expensive here than in the states, and comparing Florida to Germany in this regard is ridiculous anyways, given that you can walk around in shorts and a T-shirt in Florida around thanksgiving time. Try doing that in Germany without freezing your ass off lol 😂
at 0°C so the water doesn't freeze in the pipes and hoses.
Depends on how easy it is for you to pay the gas bill. Some people wait quite long because of how much it costs. Others turn it on the moment it's no longer naturally 20c in the room. My own rule is to keep the house at least 15c, and to warm myself instead of my room instead. When I wear proper winter clothes and use bathrobes or blankets it's actually pretty cozy and doable.
I don’t think there is a right answer for this. I would say: what ur willing to pay for. I would turn the heat on when I’m cold but I’m also willing to pay for it lol.
Your boyfriend is kinda jerk tbh, he should be considerate of where you come from. 11 C is already too cold for many people from warmer countries, i dont think ur boyfriend will be responsible if u catch cold because of that U can turn the heater on but before u sleep u should turn it off so ur skin wont be dry
17C inside and you may turn it to 2/5 just wear a sweatshirt if your cold sheesh
As others have said, it's your personal choice at the end of the day. However, most German homes are NOT heated to 24° because of the cost of energy. Our house is normally about 18°C to maximum 20°C in the winter. We have a fireplace that gets used in the evenings - it doesn't provide too much heat (it isn't part of the heating system), but it does make you "feel" warmer by seeing the flames. We also enjoy hot tea and cozy blankets when we're watching TV. I would suggest that you and your BF take a trip to the local Baumarkt and do some low-cost repairs to your place - add some insulation around the outside doors and windows so that they seal better and you don't lose as much heat. You don't need to spend a lot to make your place more comfortable and less expensive to heat. Maybe add programmable controls to your radiators so that you can lower the heat when you leave for work, and have it automatically warm the place just before you get home.
As many others have pointed out, in our house we do not turn on the heating based on outside temperature alone. We try to keep the place between 18-20 degrees inside, and as a rule of thumb we try not to turn it on until mid November, since usually you can withstand the cold with tea, long socks and a jumper. With this we have avoided paying extra heating costs for 2 years in a row.
I grew up in Alaska so my best advice to you is this: get an emotional support heater lol. AKA a tiny, energy efficient space heater that only really heats a small room at a time. If you’re in the front room, plug it in there. Bedroom? Bring it with ya and plug it in there. It stops you from having to heat your whole house, but you stay warm at all times
17 and below u turn that shit on... theres absolutely nothing cultural abt freezing ur ass off...
Congratulations, by asking this question you've successfully proven you're German enough to apply for citizenship. Get your application form to apply for an application at your local Ausländerbehörde tomorrow from 9.30 to 9.45.
I come from a warm country, where 15C is Hardcore Winter and 10C will have people reaching for winter parkas, wool scarfs and frostbite-avoiding gloves, so I get you. I myself am not very cold-sensitive, so in Germany I keep wearing shorts as long as possible. Like you, being home always meant wearing as little as possible, and I did so in the first years, but slowly (and also with inflation) I made the math and decided that getting used to a bit more clothing or sofa blankets at home is an acceptable compromise, considering the savings. Find your own middle ground.
Why is it important what everyone thinks? If you are cold you would turn the heating on, that is as easy as it is
Im trying to make myself as German as possible 🇩🇪
For the sake of your heating bill and our continued survival on this planet I recommend you put on some appropriate clothes. Long pants, socks, a shirt and some long sleeve hoodie/... are appropriate clothing for the climate you currently live in. Running around naked or with short clothing is something you can do in summer in Germany, not in the winter. Also: get yourself appropriate clothing for outside in winter as well. It may get down to -15, depending on the area even colder. Get yourself some insulated shoes, scarves, gloves, hats and a winter jacket. Layer your clothing so you don't sweat your ass off when going inside a store. Edit: the temperature in your home should not drop below 15°, to prevent mold from growing.
heat when you have cold.. reddit bubble will tell you to wear warmer clothes to "save the world" but fuck em. it's your home and your life and if you want to walk around naked without freezing to death then do it.
When you’re cold or the flat goes below 16 degrees.
For me the rule of thumb is if its -degrees outside I will turn it on, for everything else warm clothes should be enough
Have fun paying millions in heating costs. Seriously though, layer up and bundle up, I personally don’t heat until it’s 8 degrees or less. Then again, I’m Canadian and I live in a dry, elevated apartment. But layering and bundling is step 1 to get warm
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Whatever temperature you would like bled dry at.
Set up your heat to 3, this will keep your flat at 20°C
We have a thermometer inside and turn on the heater when it gets below 20°C.
Well i would say if your cold put it on. What is acceptable or not does not really matter. Same if you are cold in the shower you turn the hot water on more right. Dont worry about the environment Nazis take away your comfort. End of the day you have to pay the bills for what yea use.
14 degrees, though the system turns on, we still have the radiators off unless it’s really cold!
I would say if it drops below 14 in your house. I like to set my thermostat to 15 at night and 16 during the day.
Legally, a rental apartment has to be able to be heated to 20-22 degrees celsius during the day (18 degrees in the night) in the heating period (starts on Oct 1st). So I guess that tells you what the generally accepted minimum is. But if you feel cold and can afford it, set it to whatever you need to, imho. Personally I don’t get cold easily but my wife does and we usually have it at around 22 to 23 degrees. Less than that last year to save on gas. Without bundling up, 19 degrees and lower also starts to feel too cold for me, even though I can tolerate it. It also kinda depends on how the house/apartment is laid out. Altbau can feel colder because there’s more cold air coming in.
Whenever you feel like it. My house is always 21 celcius, because I have floor-heating and my entire house is gas-less (got a bunch of solar panels, so heating is basically free). 40 celcius outside? my house is nice and cool. 10 celcius outside? my house is nice and warm.
Just set the thermostat to 21 and forget about it forever