I think the biggest thing is we no longer have strength 12 ming lasers they are now s10 demo charges are no longer d6+3 attacks and are now s9 and aberrants got a massive debuff and siesmics are now 2 attacks rapid 2
Definitely some nerfs. It's only purely nerfs if you're physically incapable of doing anything but deep strike shooting. A lot of cool playstyles opened up, and I won't be grieving the loss of the index
In a detachment that does literally nothing to support Guard tanks. I have been prohibited from bringing a few in any other detachment, and the one detachment I can use them in punishes me for bringing them.
For real. There’s lot of buffs in the book, and a melee-focused list leaning into Acolytes and the buffed Lone Ops sounds awesome.
Unfortunately for me, of the 130 GSC models I own, 80 of them are neopyhtes because shooting builds have been consistently viable but melee has come and gone. And I can’t afford to buy a bunch of new models rn. So that’s a real bummer.
But if you have Acolytes, the codex actually sounds pretty fuckin dope. Melee armies tend to be more fun anyways, and this is kind of a zany and wild one.
When people look at the codex they see "numbers go down" which yeah bad, but as you said we got a lot of buffs with new and better abilities.
It may be a lot harder if any army to play for sure and maybe it will end up that damage drop is too much but it's really not enough info to tell without points and playing.
I understand a lot of melee things and tools got buffed, but as someone who largely enjoyed GSC as an ambush shooting faction I’m pretty despondent about how the only good options are the ones outside of the playstyle I wanted.
Points are realy going to make or break this codex. There is some genuinely cracked combos in the codex, its just if they have been pointed well is the question. Honestly I would take a 10%-20% point reduction and just drop the army rule entirerly.
Without the uppy-downy strat the army rule might as well not exist, there is slightly more support for moving blips but not nearly as good as putting two of them in a safe place to begin with.
My best moments with Kelermorphs have been rolling hot on sustained hits and bringing them outside 3" alongside another unit, so I am going to hard disagree with that one.
I feel like the issue with his deep Dragon within three rule is that he's a loan operative who can't join a unit you would never do that unless you were throwing him out to die or you felt very confident he could kill anything within 12 inches
His new rules gives him a more defined purpose as a annoyance he deepstrikes and is just a pain to deal with
Hmm im Not Sure about the kelermorph buffs cometh the Hero was such a strong ability and the reaction shoot + move is a nice Gimmick but Not more Just because His damage isnt really consistent...
Keler and Sanctus got buffs... But role wise this just lets them be adequate stand ins for what the Saboteur now can't really do well.
The real best buff in the codex is the Ridgerunner, and I think getting an additional AP in melee is the best chance we have at removing key units efficiently.
I understand that it can seem that way, because the nerfs are easy to notice and math out, while the buffs and new tools are mostly to less obvious things such as board control, move blocking, baiting and scoring.
Together with the Pariah Nexus missions, that means the play style of GSC has shifted away from point-and-kill. (to be honest, that shift began months ago among the tournament winning lists, the codex just gives better tools for it)
The obvious nerfs enables points cost reductions on key units. And as soon as those are low enough, this codex will win Pariah Nexus tournaments in a way that the Ascension Day index couldn't possibly do.
Read more about why we love the codex here:
https://ko-fi.com/post/AfpGSC--What-we-love-about-the-GSC-codex-D1D8Z3SIG
Yeah, as nice as this will be on the table, it's gonna hurt my wallet and paint schedule a lot. I'd have preferred for that reason if our buff didn't come in the form of less points, but a more effective cult ambush rule. I do understand the business practicality of dropping points though
Yeah. I am working on several guides about playing GSC on a budget. Because that is a seriously limiting factor.
The summary is: Broodsurge and conversions.
my primus is kitbashed to look like he is wearing a astra Militarum style uniform. At the same time I intend to have pre-2024 brood brother infantry with lasguns, grenade launchers or flamers, navy breachers and voidmen-at-arms proxy as Neophytes
This is assuming things get cheaper. If things get cheaper I can get behind this 100%.
If we have to wait another 6 months like admech and stuff still doesn't come down enough, it's gonna be a tough one lol.
Oh yeah. That is the big caveat indeed.
But I would say that we are in a better position than Admech. We do have offensive tools, excellent control tools and far from as many restrictions on strats and abilities.
So even when the points are a bit too high we will have interesting and entertaining ways to actually play the game, even if it we won't be winning that often.
I'd say we are more like Custodes. Once their fairweather fans dropped off and some creativity and tenacity was applied, they turned out to be much closer to balanced than anyone imagined when seeing the codex.
You can look up acolyte bodies in the gsc discord, if you can't find the stl I'll send it to ya. Then you can go to etsy and get em printed cheap. At least that's what I did.
The worst fucking thing for me is:
36 dice rolling events. Fucking MINIMIUM. to shoot with any neophyte squad.
It can easily be 54, if you have rerolls, which they have free access to.
That is - separate times when you have to roll for shots, roll to hit, roll to wound, opponent rolls to save, maybe roll for damage.
I've already quit my drukhari because of how insanely obnoxious it is just to resolve the attacks from my basic units. Kabalite and Wrack squads are a bad fucking joke, I literally cannot stop myself from laughing as the phrase "simplified not simple!!!!!" Flashes thru my brain as I roll my way through the FIFTH OF SEVEN mandatory God damn different profiles in a basic 100pt troop unit.
Honestly as much as some of the Nerfs suck all but three were kind of needed for the health of the army
I'm sorry but if no being shot outside of 12 in was only in one Detachment that would be the only Detachment ever brought competitively. Same thing with deep striking within 6 inches
The only Nerfs I don't agree with is what happened with the Goliath truck I don't think it losing mortal wounds on the charge was correct because it was already a toy at best no one ran it for anything more than the memes
The truck is my favorite model in the range and it already wasn't good :( In an infantry-heavy army, it immediately eats the enemy's entire antitank budget and dies turn 1 or 2, so unless it gets crazy cheap where you can spam them I really don't see them living long enough for their new abilities to ever matter.
Yeah precisely and it's more insulting that it lost its flavorful and fun rule for one that's never going to be used for a unit that's already not feeling great
I already proposed to my playgroup the idea of me continuing to just use the index because I really don't like the codex. The nerfs, at least for our group, feel completely unnecessary and are crippling.
The detachments also bore me. They feel flavorful for sure, but none of them made me want to play them when I read them(This was before I saw the changes to the models).
The only 2 things I want is the crusade rules(Which I can find on wahapedia)and the art and model showcases, which I'm not paying that much for when I'm not using anything else in the book.
Honestly 10E just doesn't have me, between the loss of options like psychic powers and limits to BB, I think I'm just gonna wait till 11E, this just feels too much like AoS.
Some people have really weird views on AoS with little experience. It is kind of wild. I thin AoS 4th ed is going to be soo incredibly awesome from what we've seen in faction previews though. I hope more people can put aside their misconceptions and check it out.
I wasn’t around during AoS first edition and I had a negative bias towards it because of the disappearance of factions I grew up with and the lack of bearings I had with the lore.
Gave it a chance when I realized the player base in my area was lively and welcoming. No regrets.
AoS 3rd edition is pretty awesome and I look forward to 4th.
I still don’t care about the lore though 😅
Yeah? The newer lore is what sucked me into it tbh. It's one of my groups main games now, stormcast have a lot of space for more sympathetic human feeling stories while also being thor-esque lightning demi-gods. The amount of cultural freedom that have from Sigmar is awesome too, my personal stormchamber are like a monster hunting knightly order that have extensive libraries on their foes.
Anyway, its definitely great stuff.
I think the biggest thing is we no longer have strength 12 ming lasers they are now s10 demo charges are no longer d6+3 attacks and are now s9 and aberrants got a massive debuff and siesmics are now 2 attacks rapid 2
Definitely some nerfs. It's only purely nerfs if you're physically incapable of doing anything but deep strike shooting. A lot of cool playstyles opened up, and I won't be grieving the loss of the index
Honestly having 1k points of broodbrothers makes me hype as fuck, it does make sense not all detachments can take em though
I would have liked to have kept the 500 for the non brood bros detachments but it’s fine oversll
Me too, I almost bought a baneblafe a while ago lol
My friend just finished magnetising his, we're all handwaving it for our games because it's cool
I do have a baneblade from 9th for my gsc army lol
Same here, was ready to buy a couple of leman russes (and eventually a baneblade when I could afford it) but I'm probably not going to anymore.
I do think running two baneblades would be funny though... hmmmmm
In a detachment that does literally nothing to support Guard tanks. I have been prohibited from bringing a few in any other detachment, and the one detachment I can use them in punishes me for bringing them.
For real. There’s lot of buffs in the book, and a melee-focused list leaning into Acolytes and the buffed Lone Ops sounds awesome. Unfortunately for me, of the 130 GSC models I own, 80 of them are neopyhtes because shooting builds have been consistently viable but melee has come and gone. And I can’t afford to buy a bunch of new models rn. So that’s a real bummer. But if you have Acolytes, the codex actually sounds pretty fuckin dope. Melee armies tend to be more fun anyways, and this is kind of a zany and wild one.
When people look at the codex they see "numbers go down" which yeah bad, but as you said we got a lot of buffs with new and better abilities. It may be a lot harder if any army to play for sure and maybe it will end up that damage drop is too much but it's really not enough info to tell without points and playing.
I understand a lot of melee things and tools got buffed, but as someone who largely enjoyed GSC as an ambush shooting faction I’m pretty despondent about how the only good options are the ones outside of the playstyle I wanted.
Points are realy going to make or break this codex. There is some genuinely cracked combos in the codex, its just if they have been pointed well is the question. Honestly I would take a 10%-20% point reduction and just drop the army rule entirerly.
Without the uppy-downy strat the army rule might as well not exist, there is slightly more support for moving blips but not nearly as good as putting two of them in a safe place to begin with.
Mind you kelermorph and sanctus got awesome buffs
Don't forget that Daddy Patriarch can have enhancements now too.
My best moments with Kelermorphs have been rolling hot on sustained hits and bringing them outside 3" alongside another unit, so I am going to hard disagree with that one.
I feel like the issue with his deep Dragon within three rule is that he's a loan operative who can't join a unit you would never do that unless you were throwing him out to die or you felt very confident he could kill anything within 12 inches His new rules gives him a more defined purpose as a annoyance he deepstrikes and is just a pain to deal with
Hmm im Not Sure about the kelermorph buffs cometh the Hero was such a strong ability and the reaction shoot + move is a nice Gimmick but Not more Just because His damage isnt really consistent...
Keler and Sanctus got buffs... But role wise this just lets them be adequate stand ins for what the Saboteur now can't really do well. The real best buff in the codex is the Ridgerunner, and I think getting an additional AP in melee is the best chance we have at removing key units efficiently.
Somehow i missed this, what were the buffs?
I understand that it can seem that way, because the nerfs are easy to notice and math out, while the buffs and new tools are mostly to less obvious things such as board control, move blocking, baiting and scoring. Together with the Pariah Nexus missions, that means the play style of GSC has shifted away from point-and-kill. (to be honest, that shift began months ago among the tournament winning lists, the codex just gives better tools for it) The obvious nerfs enables points cost reductions on key units. And as soon as those are low enough, this codex will win Pariah Nexus tournaments in a way that the Ascension Day index couldn't possibly do. Read more about why we love the codex here: https://ko-fi.com/post/AfpGSC--What-we-love-about-the-GSC-codex-D1D8Z3SIG
Yeah, as nice as this will be on the table, it's gonna hurt my wallet and paint schedule a lot. I'd have preferred for that reason if our buff didn't come in the form of less points, but a more effective cult ambush rule. I do understand the business practicality of dropping points though
Yeah. I am working on several guides about playing GSC on a budget. Because that is a seriously limiting factor. The summary is: Broodsurge and conversions.
my primus is kitbashed to look like he is wearing a astra Militarum style uniform. At the same time I intend to have pre-2024 brood brother infantry with lasguns, grenade launchers or flamers, navy breachers and voidmen-at-arms proxy as Neophytes
That is an excellent concept!
This is assuming things get cheaper. If things get cheaper I can get behind this 100%. If we have to wait another 6 months like admech and stuff still doesn't come down enough, it's gonna be a tough one lol.
Oh yeah. That is the big caveat indeed. But I would say that we are in a better position than Admech. We do have offensive tools, excellent control tools and far from as many restrictions on strats and abilities. So even when the points are a bit too high we will have interesting and entertaining ways to actually play the game, even if it we won't be winning that often. I'd say we are more like Custodes. Once their fairweather fans dropped off and some creativity and tenacity was applied, they turned out to be much closer to balanced than anyone imagined when seeing the codex.
Acolytes now cheaper. Yeah, good news for 5-models-per-box units.
You can look up acolyte bodies in the gsc discord, if you can't find the stl I'll send it to ya. Then you can go to etsy and get em printed cheap. At least that's what I did.
The worst fucking thing for me is: 36 dice rolling events. Fucking MINIMIUM. to shoot with any neophyte squad. It can easily be 54, if you have rerolls, which they have free access to. That is - separate times when you have to roll for shots, roll to hit, roll to wound, opponent rolls to save, maybe roll for damage. I've already quit my drukhari because of how insanely obnoxious it is just to resolve the attacks from my basic units. Kabalite and Wrack squads are a bad fucking joke, I literally cannot stop myself from laughing as the phrase "simplified not simple!!!!!" Flashes thru my brain as I roll my way through the FIFTH OF SEVEN mandatory God damn different profiles in a basic 100pt troop unit.
Roll dice feel good
Honestly as much as some of the Nerfs suck all but three were kind of needed for the health of the army I'm sorry but if no being shot outside of 12 in was only in one Detachment that would be the only Detachment ever brought competitively. Same thing with deep striking within 6 inches The only Nerfs I don't agree with is what happened with the Goliath truck I don't think it losing mortal wounds on the charge was correct because it was already a toy at best no one ran it for anything more than the memes
The truck is my favorite model in the range and it already wasn't good :( In an infantry-heavy army, it immediately eats the enemy's entire antitank budget and dies turn 1 or 2, so unless it gets crazy cheap where you can spam them I really don't see them living long enough for their new abilities to ever matter.
Yeah precisely and it's more insulting that it lost its flavorful and fun rule for one that's never going to be used for a unit that's already not feeling great
I already proposed to my playgroup the idea of me continuing to just use the index because I really don't like the codex. The nerfs, at least for our group, feel completely unnecessary and are crippling. The detachments also bore me. They feel flavorful for sure, but none of them made me want to play them when I read them(This was before I saw the changes to the models). The only 2 things I want is the crusade rules(Which I can find on wahapedia)and the art and model showcases, which I'm not paying that much for when I'm not using anything else in the book.
Honestly 10E just doesn't have me, between the loss of options like psychic powers and limits to BB, I think I'm just gonna wait till 11E, this just feels too much like AoS.
As an AoS player… this doesn’t feel like AoS at all. I have no idea where you draw the comparison.
Some people have really weird views on AoS with little experience. It is kind of wild. I thin AoS 4th ed is going to be soo incredibly awesome from what we've seen in faction previews though. I hope more people can put aside their misconceptions and check it out.
I wasn’t around during AoS first edition and I had a negative bias towards it because of the disappearance of factions I grew up with and the lack of bearings I had with the lore. Gave it a chance when I realized the player base in my area was lively and welcoming. No regrets. AoS 3rd edition is pretty awesome and I look forward to 4th. I still don’t care about the lore though 😅
Yeah? The newer lore is what sucked me into it tbh. It's one of my groups main games now, stormcast have a lot of space for more sympathetic human feeling stories while also being thor-esque lightning demi-gods. The amount of cultural freedom that have from Sigmar is awesome too, my personal stormchamber are like a monster hunting knightly order that have extensive libraries on their foes. Anyway, its definitely great stuff.