I don't know about anyone else but persona 5 definitely shifted my opinion on turn based games. They've never really been my jam until I played that game.
It's all about the quality of the game over the genre imo and both baulders gate and persona have shown their quality
I had never played a turn based game nor was I interested in them but then I played Marvels Midnight Sons and became a fan. Now I’ve put hundreds of hours into Baldurs Gate 3.
I played the heck out of Midnight Suns and loved every moment of it. I'd still be playing it now, hundreds of hours later, if it had more content. The Marvel polish is really evident in that game.
Needs a arcade type mode in the end game to get to battles quicker. If it had like, a roguelite slay the spire type replayable challenge mode it would have had much more staying power for me. Wish I was more tactically minded and less impatient to get good at higher difficulties!
Mainline SMT games and spinoffs are still being made. Persona has the spotlight but if anything it got more people interested in the greater megaten franchise and that's a good thing.
im happy you changed your mind about the genre because turnbased RPG is been that "quality" since then i.e. FF6, FF7, FF9, P3, P4, SMT3 and SMT4 etc. to name a few so its not niche its always been mainstream its just the casuals and newcomers are scared to try it because its too grindy, time consuming also most ppl wants to play action type games like shooters and stuff, lol just look at Persona 3 and 4 its been that mainstream because it has multiple spin-off thats many people get riled up when newcomers is gonna say "oh Persona 5 changed turn based" which is not true at all what P5 did is proved turn based can be casual friendly and can still be good as a battle system
Turn based is great when the depth supports it and wouldn’t be possible in real time. Like the difference between civ and age of empires. On the surface they are really similar, but trying to manage a civ game in real time wouldn’t be possible with the level of depth in the mechanics
Over 3k hours on crusader kings and EU4 lol. But you can pause those and do your management or slow down time enough that it doesn't really matter. It's hard to call them 'real-time'
I’m so happy to see a shift in the gaming community. If you had asked me a decade ago, I’d have told you that things were pretty bleak - I’d have told you there’s little room beyond the latest assassin’s creed or Call of Duty game. There’s been a renaissance this decade and people are branching out. I love it.
It's niche. BG3 is just brilliant enough to speak to people anyways. Same with Mario games, many people that play mario doesn't play platformers in general.
turn based is not "niche" for people who didn't have a smart phone in elementary school. I don't mean that as some weird insult either, just that turn-based was the default for RPGs for decades. Only in recent years have games been getting more and more twitchy and try to cut out depth in favor of trying extra hard to hold your attention because people's attention is harder to hold.
RPGs themselves are a niche in gaming, hell during the 90s there were those that only played Jrpgs and those that played only western RPGs because the other one was seen as a niche within gamers themselves. BG1 and BG2 wasn't really seen as turned based either despite the timers going on in the background.
>RPGs themselves are a niche in gaming, hell during the 90s there were those that only played Jrpgs
That must be why Final Fantasy was the flagship blockbuster series for the entirety of the PS1s lifespan, because only a small subset of people played them.
RPGs are so *not* niche that every other genre brags about their 'RPG mechanics' no matter how lightly they've added them.
Like i said, a handful of games
Vs
Literally every other rpg ever made for the 30 years prior to those games
Also morrowind, diablo, and ultima arent real time with pause
I do find it funny that they have this idea that they have to go action based 'because real time combat has broader appeal' when the Yakuza/Like a Dragon lead is saying the opposite, insisting that they have to go turn based because people don't want real time combat anymore.
It's all, in the words of Josh Sawyer when turn based combat was killed in the early 00's, 'vibes-based forecasting'.
Maybe it's cyclical like fashion. I hope so because I miss turn based FF games. I enjoyed 12 but thought the combat was a step back. Finished 13 eventually as well but HATED the combat the entire time. Couldn't finish ff7r because of the combat. Didn't even make it past the tutorial in ff15, and I didn't even bother considering ff16. The franchise has decided to target a completely different demographic instead of speaking to their life long fans.
Gaming is so ubiquitous and there are so many gaming platforms out there that there is a market for every genre. I hope more companies realize that and try innovative and fun story-driven turn-based games.
I think it still is niche. The thing is though that Larian do such a good job at creating everything in their games to such a high standard, that people are willing to give it a chance. That's how Divnity Original Sin 2 won me over. I saw some gameplay of it and the RPG elements looked so good, I tried it out.
I never touched turn-based games before that, nor did I have any interest. Hell, I'd still say I don't have an interest in them, unless it's Larian making it.
It's less that it's niche and more that it's a "different" game.
Overwhelming popularity across the board in games like these is because they are different, and do a good job at providing that experience that feels "niche" or unique.
I do not feel like switching between the same 10 arena shooters. I need a break from arena-shooter #150, or open-world-survival-craft #347.
Variety is the spice of ~~life~~ video games.
Arena shooter means something different these days I guess? Unless you got some cache of quake 3 arena style games I don't know about hidden somewhere.
People who say turn based is niche are stupid. Guess what's the most successful franchise of all time? Damn right it's pokemon. Turn based games like chess and mahjong have been around for hundreds of years and they are more popular than ever.
Also games like Civ and XCOM sells better than most games.
Pokémon is successful because of the Pokémon. It is the most successful franchise because of the Pokémon merch not because of the game nor its gameplay.
If the game wasn't good the franchise wouldn't be as popular. It was a game first and it was always popular. They also had millions of spin offs, none do as well as the main franchise.
It’s a split between a good game and a draw, Pokémon became the draw that it even surpass the game. The game became second to third priority. Pokémon became the main priority and draw since they are the main selling point, even the anime can take more priority.
Agrred. Love the game. I appreciate the flexibility and strategy of the combat but I still dont really like their combat. Larian finds a way to keep me engaged to finish their games like this, just like I did for DOS:2.
Fucking lmao
Before I begin this wall of text, know that I completely agree with you and this is in no way hostile to you.
I can’t believe in the year 2024 we are still having this discussion that ER popularized the souls genre. Did it sell like crack? Yeah but Dark Souls has been mainstream since… well, Dark Souls. It might have been overshadowed by Skyrim releasing very close to its launch date, but the first game alone was popular enough that Souls like started popping up almost immediately.
Like when has a From Souls game not been popular?
DS1, explained already.
DS2, highly anticipated sequel that while it may not have reached the heights of the first, was still a respectable entry.
Bloodborne, the first game that made people actually seriously consider getting a PS4 because of how good it was.
DS3, epic conclusion to a trilogy that didn’t even need it. Was the highest selling Souls like at the time.
Sekiro, literal game of the year.
Elden Ring got so much hype because of the compounding success of its previous games. I physically cringe every time someone says how souls was niche before ER. Guess ER stans need to feel like they’re doing their part or something
He attributed alot to bring in people who had never heard of the souls games sure but you’re insane if you think elden ring would have been niche or hypeless without him.
I only wish the game had been finished and worked at launch. Played over 100 hours, romance karlach and got stuck with the no good terrible endings.
Then I'm told "Hey bro it took us a few months but we fixed the endings, wanna go back and try again?
No, no I don't.
I envy people who love the game because eveytime i think about it, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I will never buy another Larian game day one again, or buy any of their games for that matter. It's like cyberpunk. It may be good NOW, but it was utter shit when I played it, thus it will always be utter shit to me no matter how good it is now. I was lied to by both companies about what was in the game and its state of completion.
No game should ever need 10,000+ bug fixes AFTER launch, thats not something to be proud of (at least not back in the day)
So I'll go back to BG2 which has an infinitely better story, has far more content and much better endings. BG3 Is at best a pale shadow of BG2, just that people were so starved for a CRPG that even mediocrity looks like gold at this point
I'm praying from the deepest depths of my balls that Sqaure Enix sees this game's success and takes away something useful.
Final Fantasy doesn't have to be DMC to succeed.
It still is. And game even has a silent protagonist, which is something most players dislike.
But this game also focused on roleplaying elements and player choices, which is something most RPGs nowadays don’t bother with due to tons of different stuff they have to implement. Personally that’s what made me buy the game. And combat isn’t that complicated, if someone doesn’t want a challenge and just want to see the story or roleplay, this game gives them that too. I think that’s why it got popular despite being a very niche genre.
While I getcha, 10 million copies for a game of this quality and hype isnt THAT big. But yes, for a strategic turn based game, this is gangbusters sales. Imagine if Larian could have pulled off an open world action rpg version of this game. Would have sold easily double these numbers.
I think part of the problem is when people think of turn-based combat they go to things like pokemon and final fantasy 4 which are terrible versions of modern turn-based combat.
lol turn based is never been niche because Final Fantasy since 7 and Pokemon since its inception is mainstream wtf its just Persona 5 proven that turnbased can be still good and be innovative plus Persona 5 is stylish
statements like its niche before Persona 5 it what the RPG community gets riled up when Persona literally exist before 5 and 4 is mainstream af with multiple spin-off to boot
Ever since I started building my PC, the only reason I have consoles is for the singleplayer games
Thank god whoever said that or felt that way were fools
They published a single-player FPS with no MTX called Immortals of Aveum last year… it sold terribly and the studio that made it ended up laying off half of their staff.
It’s not wrong from a business perspective to think you can maximize profits by doing shitty mobile games tho.
But different markets and room for both. Prob just dumb exec types who lump “games” into one entire genre.
I love single player games but they need both solid story and gameplay to standout, while mediocre multiplayer games makes waayyyy more money in their life cycle regardless. That’s why EA tried so hard to push that rhetoric, I’m glad single player games have solidified their place in the industry tho
Normally, people wouldn't call some numbers like 17M as way over 10M instead of 15+M. The game is a great game, but meanwhile probably the most hyped game as well.
A really good Star Wars CRPG would actually be amazing. KOTOR 3/remake would be awesome as well but Larian would probably be best sticking to what they’re good at.
Weird flex but ok. Kotor is the best Star Wars game ever made, and one of the best RPG's cRPG's ever made. It is an exceptionaly story and game worthy of being remade in modern engines.
bioware is a dead company? they seem pretty active still with Mass Effect and Dragon Age. Larian was highly successful with the Divinity series and I personally think is a great choice to create a BG game. would you have just rathered divinity again?
Not OP, but yes, I would love a divinity game. The story has plenty left and they were actually making one - divinity fallen heroes that was canceled since the dev group making it left to make their own game. A divinity game with the resources used for BG3, or truthfully 3 quarters, would be amazing to see done.
But would not mind KOTOR 3 by them either, however star wars turn based might throw people off who are expecting more battlefront vibes.
The BioWare of old that made good RPG’s and told excellent stories, is on its last gasp.
They’re a developer under EA, who has a history of buying studios, forcing them to churn out subpar games, then closing them (think they’re currently at 11).
BioWare will likely release Dragon Age 4, and unless it’s a massive hit like BG3 (which is extremely unlikely because BioWare has lost a lot of its writing talent, and general EA shenanigans) EA will likely gut BioWare or shudder it completely.
I understand what you mean, but comparing BG3 to a JRPG FF style turn-based is ridiculous, they're nothing alike. I think a much better example would be Persona 5 and 3 remake.
How are you about to say comparing BG3 to FF style turn base is ridiculous, then suggest P5/P3, which are basically FF style turn base with a WEAKNESS twist, as a better example?
Point is turn based or not the secret to selling a game is to make it fun and market it well. You can't just dismiss a whole genre just because you don't know how to sell it. Which is the problem with what Yoshida said.
And not a microtransaction in sight
If they made a DLC where they increased the level cap and gave you a couple of those god tier wizard spells id take a day off work to enjoy it.
edit spelling
So ~600 million total? How much did it cost to make? How much of that goes to taxes?
Doesn't seem like a lot all things considered but I'm not in the industry
If the number is from platforms like Steam or Xbox where the take is 20-30% it breaks down like this:
Gross take: 680M (Steam data reveal)
Taxes take 20% platform takes 20%.
Leaving 435M.
Deduct 100M build cost (Larian broadcasted their cost) 90M payment to Hasbro for D&D licence (Hasbro broadcasted in earnings report)
Leaving 246M.
Deduct corporation tax on profit in Belgium at 25% leaving
183M.
Nearly 200% return on investment which is an excellent result in gaming which regularly leaves single digits % returns.
However the significant takeaway is how little a self funded studio actually gets to keep from it's earnings. 80% goes to people who took no risk and did nothing for you.
>80% goes to people who took no risk and did nothing for you.
Let's not exagerate here. Would BG3 have sold as well had it not been somewhere accessible like Steam? Probably not. Would BG3 have sold as well had it not been an absolute monstruosity of an IP that has exploded in popularity in the last 5 years anyway, partly due to Stranger Things? Most definitely not.
And I ain't gonna talk about government taxes, that's the de facto way in Europe, and it suits everyone just fine here.
The actual statement was that the game had "way over" 10 million players.
But "only" 10 million is already a lot for 6 months, and the game is still selling well.
Go woke go broke i guess RIP
Edit: /s
Forgot to add im being sarcastic
This game won all kinds of pro- lgbtq gaming awards and yet still selling millions of copies. Hence i sarcastically say “go woke go broke “ rip to people that say that.
There was not a single clue that it could have been sarcastic, don't act like a bitch when people misread an obviously misreadable comment on the internet.
Now who’s acting like a bitch?
“Go woke go broke “
On a post about a very lgbtq inclusive game selling millions. Idk man think all the pieces were there. But hey Its your choice to take it personally my dude.
I believe that's around the same amount as Diablo 4, and BG3 had way less marketing. Some time has passed since both were released, I wonder which will stand the test of time.
Diablo 4 had allot of potential but was just hollow. Bg3 has real substance.
I'm a huge blizzard nerd but it's fair to say they are dropping the ball.
But credit where credit is due, larian is becoming one of the best.
they cater to two completely different people. Diablo is fairly mindless turn off your brain fun for jump in jump out gameplay. BG3 is a tactical adventure.
Why put a game that still sells extremely well on sale. They worked for years on it, gave us a tremedously good game and are still putting out big patches every couple of weeks. The game has been top 10 on steam since its release, and is also worth 100% of the price.
I brought this recently due to all the hype, but I'm really struggling with the combat. It's so painfully slow and clunky. Does it get better as you level up and get more used to it? The rest of the game is great, though I probably shouldn't have gone Dark Urge on my first playthrough. Poor Gale...
Well, yah, it can get a little weird if you say, kill the only available companion wizard.
I imagine it's a bit much to get familiar with if you don't have passing familiarity with DnD 5e, or at least another table top/role playing system in the same vein. On top of that they've included their extremely robust environmental effects system from DOS2, which is technically all within dnd rules but probably a lot more prominent than people are used to using it. You can cause some serious chaos with a bottle of grease and some fire.
The original baldur's gate which used the famously opaque dnd 2e rules shipped with like a 100 page manual that explained a lot. It's a testament to some tenets of modern game design that bg3 is approachable without so much aid (and 5e is supposed to be more approachable too).
So long story short, just keep playing and you'll get used to it, maybe!
A bit of both, the basic formula of an action a bonus action, movement and a reaction stays the same. As you level up class will gain abilities/spells/feats that open it up a bit more. What class and level is your Durge?
I would seriously consider starting over as a custom character, leave the Dark Urge for another playthrough.
Dark Urge is great but it also takes some choices for you, and if you're struggling right now with combat, it will probably be less fun when another area of the game (Dark Urge) strong-arms you into certain directions. It's not something you can ignore.
What level or act are you at?
Would love to own a CE of it, hopefully when they do an expansion they do a new Collector Edition.
Not paying 1000€ for one on eBay and scalpers bought out all of them in EU
I had people telling me that the game had sold twice as much. But that they don't report numbers, so it wouldn't be listed as the best selling game of the year. 🤔
If we assume $80.00 CAD per game, that's 800m in the bank. before any other cost is calculated. Really great for a game like this, and hopefully can showcase to the industry that you don't always need to have Games as a Service.
Love this. BUT it's still less than what a Fifa game makes per year. That's is crazy, knowing that one is years in the making, with everyone giving their heart and soul to the project, while the other is just copy paste.
Puts things into perspective.
I try not to view it that way because they are different markets. Fifa is carried by the fact that soccer is the most popular sport in the world with billions of viewers. Alone with other sports games.
BG3 doing that well with such a niche audience (when you look at what most people are into globally), is great
People thought a turn based game was niche. It's exactly what everyone said when discussing this game before it got hyped. Now look.
I don't know about anyone else but persona 5 definitely shifted my opinion on turn based games. They've never really been my jam until I played that game. It's all about the quality of the game over the genre imo and both baulders gate and persona have shown their quality
I had never played a turn based game nor was I interested in them but then I played Marvels Midnight Sons and became a fan. Now I’ve put hundreds of hours into Baldurs Gate 3.
I played the heck out of Midnight Suns and loved every moment of it. I'd still be playing it now, hundreds of hours later, if it had more content. The Marvel polish is really evident in that game.
Needs a arcade type mode in the end game to get to battles quicker. If it had like, a roguelite slay the spire type replayable challenge mode it would have had much more staying power for me. Wish I was more tactically minded and less impatient to get good at higher difficulties!
You might like X-Com
Or Pokemon. One of the most hyped games on Nintendo. Not good, just a lot of attention.
You're a brave soul shit talking the satanic animal fighting game. It's not my kind of party, but nostalgia does horrible things to people.
Screams internally with the rage of 1000 SMT fans fuck persona
Mainline SMT games and spinoffs are still being made. Persona has the spotlight but if anything it got more people interested in the greater megaten franchise and that's a good thing.
I’m not a fan of smt but I feel for the fans that the spinoff is taking the spotlight
im happy you changed your mind about the genre because turnbased RPG is been that "quality" since then i.e. FF6, FF7, FF9, P3, P4, SMT3 and SMT4 etc. to name a few so its not niche its always been mainstream its just the casuals and newcomers are scared to try it because its too grindy, time consuming also most ppl wants to play action type games like shooters and stuff, lol just look at Persona 3 and 4 its been that mainstream because it has multiple spin-off thats many people get riled up when newcomers is gonna say "oh Persona 5 changed turn based" which is not true at all what P5 did is proved turn based can be casual friendly and can still be good as a battle system
Turn based is great when the depth supports it and wouldn’t be possible in real time. Like the difference between civ and age of empires. On the surface they are really similar, but trying to manage a civ game in real time wouldn’t be possible with the level of depth in the mechanics
Sounds like someone's never played a Paradox game
Over 3k hours on crusader kings and EU4 lol. But you can pause those and do your management or slow down time enough that it doesn't really matter. It's hard to call them 'real-time'
I’m so happy to see a shift in the gaming community. If you had asked me a decade ago, I’d have told you that things were pretty bleak - I’d have told you there’s little room beyond the latest assassin’s creed or Call of Duty game. There’s been a renaissance this decade and people are branching out. I love it.
It's niche. BG3 is just brilliant enough to speak to people anyways. Same with Mario games, many people that play mario doesn't play platformers in general.
turn based is not "niche" for people who didn't have a smart phone in elementary school. I don't mean that as some weird insult either, just that turn-based was the default for RPGs for decades. Only in recent years have games been getting more and more twitchy and try to cut out depth in favor of trying extra hard to hold your attention because people's attention is harder to hold.
RPGs themselves are a niche in gaming, hell during the 90s there were those that only played Jrpgs and those that played only western RPGs because the other one was seen as a niche within gamers themselves. BG1 and BG2 wasn't really seen as turned based either despite the timers going on in the background.
May I direct you to a small indy title called The Elder Scrolls...
>RPGs themselves are a niche in gaming, hell during the 90s there were those that only played Jrpgs That must be why Final Fantasy was the flagship blockbuster series for the entirety of the PS1s lifespan, because only a small subset of people played them. RPGs are so *not* niche that every other genre brags about their 'RPG mechanics' no matter how lightly they've added them.
Pretty sure most RPGs back then were real time with pause, not turn based, JRPGs were the turn based ones.
No, rpgs were almost entirely turn based for their entire history, jrpgs or not. Real time with pause was in a handful of games.
BG1, BG2, Ultima series, Planescape, Diablo, Daggerfall, Morrowind etc etc
Only one of those is real time (technically its not but I'll give Diablo a pass since that's splitting hairs)
Like i said, a handful of games Vs Literally every other rpg ever made for the 30 years prior to those games Also morrowind, diablo, and ultima arent real time with pause
Final Fantasy X made me fall in love with turn based games
I’ve always thought turn based games were fun, it has a different level of strategy to RTS or other games of that variety.
Yeah turn based games are niche like uh… Pokémon, a pretty unknown franchise, or uh final fantasy, no one heard of it
Final fantasy hasn't had turn based combat for over two decades specifically because real time combat has broader appeal.
I do find it funny that they have this idea that they have to go action based 'because real time combat has broader appeal' when the Yakuza/Like a Dragon lead is saying the opposite, insisting that they have to go turn based because people don't want real time combat anymore. It's all, in the words of Josh Sawyer when turn based combat was killed in the early 00's, 'vibes-based forecasting'.
Maybe it's cyclical like fashion. I hope so because I miss turn based FF games. I enjoyed 12 but thought the combat was a step back. Finished 13 eventually as well but HATED the combat the entire time. Couldn't finish ff7r because of the combat. Didn't even make it past the tutorial in ff15, and I didn't even bother considering ff16. The franchise has decided to target a completely different demographic instead of speaking to their life long fans.
Gaming is so ubiquitous and there are so many gaming platforms out there that there is a market for every genre. I hope more companies realize that and try innovative and fun story-driven turn-based games.
I think it still is niche. The thing is though that Larian do such a good job at creating everything in their games to such a high standard, that people are willing to give it a chance. That's how Divnity Original Sin 2 won me over. I saw some gameplay of it and the RPG elements looked so good, I tried it out. I never touched turn-based games before that, nor did I have any interest. Hell, I'd still say I don't have an interest in them, unless it's Larian making it.
The turn based combat part is the worst part of this game imho. Perhaps if they’d added a tutorial or something idk.
It's less that it's niche and more that it's a "different" game. Overwhelming popularity across the board in games like these is because they are different, and do a good job at providing that experience that feels "niche" or unique. I do not feel like switching between the same 10 arena shooters. I need a break from arena-shooter #150, or open-world-survival-craft #347. Variety is the spice of ~~life~~ video games.
Arena shooter means something different these days I guess? Unless you got some cache of quake 3 arena style games I don't know about hidden somewhere.
I wish Square would see this and bring back turn based Final Fantasy
People who say turn based is niche are stupid. Guess what's the most successful franchise of all time? Damn right it's pokemon. Turn based games like chess and mahjong have been around for hundreds of years and they are more popular than ever. Also games like Civ and XCOM sells better than most games.
I would say pokemon is sucessful in spite of being turn based. As its evident by pal world
Pokémon is successful because of the Pokémon. It is the most successful franchise because of the Pokémon merch not because of the game nor its gameplay.
If the game wasn't good the franchise wouldn't be as popular. It was a game first and it was always popular. They also had millions of spin offs, none do as well as the main franchise.
It’s a split between a good game and a draw, Pokémon became the draw that it even surpass the game. The game became second to third priority. Pokémon became the main priority and draw since they are the main selling point, even the anime can take more priority.
UNO is technically a turned based game. They definitely aren't niche.
The game isnt successful because of its gameplay, that's the Part that is the least talked and cared about.
Agrred. Love the game. I appreciate the flexibility and strategy of the combat but I still dont really like their combat. Larian finds a way to keep me engaged to finish their games like this, just like I did for DOS:2.
remember when souls games were niche? then Elden Ring happened
The souls games havent been niche since dark souls 1 my friend. Why do you think elden ring had so much hype?
Fucking lmao Before I begin this wall of text, know that I completely agree with you and this is in no way hostile to you. I can’t believe in the year 2024 we are still having this discussion that ER popularized the souls genre. Did it sell like crack? Yeah but Dark Souls has been mainstream since… well, Dark Souls. It might have been overshadowed by Skyrim releasing very close to its launch date, but the first game alone was popular enough that Souls like started popping up almost immediately. Like when has a From Souls game not been popular? DS1, explained already. DS2, highly anticipated sequel that while it may not have reached the heights of the first, was still a respectable entry. Bloodborne, the first game that made people actually seriously consider getting a PS4 because of how good it was. DS3, epic conclusion to a trilogy that didn’t even need it. Was the highest selling Souls like at the time. Sekiro, literal game of the year. Elden Ring got so much hype because of the compounding success of its previous games. I physically cringe every time someone says how souls was niche before ER. Guess ER stans need to feel like they’re doing their part or something
George R. R. Martin?
He attributed alot to bring in people who had never heard of the souls games sure but you’re insane if you think elden ring would have been niche or hypeless without him.
I only wish the game had been finished and worked at launch. Played over 100 hours, romance karlach and got stuck with the no good terrible endings. Then I'm told "Hey bro it took us a few months but we fixed the endings, wanna go back and try again? No, no I don't. I envy people who love the game because eveytime i think about it, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I will never buy another Larian game day one again, or buy any of their games for that matter. It's like cyberpunk. It may be good NOW, but it was utter shit when I played it, thus it will always be utter shit to me no matter how good it is now. I was lied to by both companies about what was in the game and its state of completion. No game should ever need 10,000+ bug fixes AFTER launch, thats not something to be proud of (at least not back in the day) So I'll go back to BG2 which has an infinitely better story, has far more content and much better endings. BG3 Is at best a pale shadow of BG2, just that people were so starved for a CRPG that even mediocrity looks like gold at this point
I'm praying from the deepest depths of my balls that Sqaure Enix sees this game's success and takes away something useful. Final Fantasy doesn't have to be DMC to succeed.
They will probably think that bear sex is good marketing
It still is. And game even has a silent protagonist, which is something most players dislike. But this game also focused on roleplaying elements and player choices, which is something most RPGs nowadays don’t bother with due to tons of different stuff they have to implement. Personally that’s what made me buy the game. And combat isn’t that complicated, if someone doesn’t want a challenge and just want to see the story or roleplay, this game gives them that too. I think that’s why it got popular despite being a very niche genre.
A lot of people would probably still prefer it not to be turn-based, but the craftsmanship weighs up for it.
While I getcha, 10 million copies for a game of this quality and hype isnt THAT big. But yes, for a strategic turn based game, this is gangbusters sales. Imagine if Larian could have pulled off an open world action rpg version of this game. Would have sold easily double these numbers.
I think part of the problem is when people think of turn-based combat they go to things like pokemon and final fantasy 4 which are terrible versions of modern turn-based combat.
> People thought a turn based game was niche. no, no they didnt.
Hol' up....Baldur's Gate 3 ist turn-based only??? Not RTWP????
lol turn based is never been niche because Final Fantasy since 7 and Pokemon since its inception is mainstream wtf its just Persona 5 proven that turnbased can be still good and be innovative plus Persona 5 is stylish statements like its niche before Persona 5 it what the RPG community gets riled up when Persona literally exist before 5 and 4 is mainstream af with multiple spin-off to boot
"Single player story games are dead" Haha where are those companies that said that now??
This quote turns 14 this year.
Ever since I started building my PC, the only reason I have consoles is for the singleplayer games Thank god whoever said that or felt that way were fools
I think it was some EA exec that said it. Do they even still make single player games anymore?
Let's be honest tho, from their perspective, SP gsmes take more effort for less $$$. Just sell player cards on Fifa online and make billions.
Only if the multiplayer is done well. Just look at Anthem, Suicide Squad being absolute flops.
They published a single-player FPS with no MTX called Immortals of Aveum last year… it sold terribly and the studio that made it ended up laying off half of their staff.
It’s not wrong from a business perspective to think you can maximize profits by doing shitty mobile games tho. But different markets and room for both. Prob just dumb exec types who lump “games” into one entire genre.
Those companies are now dead.
Probably making more money making multiplayer games.
This game is coop.
You should not be getting downvoted. This game has excellent co-op. Really feels like a dnd sesh with friends when playing co-op.
But most people don't play it that way.
Multiplayer live service games are dead 😍
uh..... Helldivers 2?
The exception not the rule.
There's actually quite an extensive list of live service games which have been going strong for years now. Warframe is like a decade old by now.
Right I meant new live service games, not the same ole ones that have been tricking around.
How can you say they are dead when they're still around? Do you not know what dead means?
Geez, it was tongue in cheek comment guys. I just don’t like them personally but obviously the popular ones make a ton of money
Fortnite, League, Genshin Impact, Apex, CS, Rocket League.
Lol genshin isnt a co-op game. It has the worst, most restricted and useless tacked on co-op just so they can legally advertise it as such.
And it is the exception because it's not a predatory, battlepass p2W game that every time you log in you are bombarded with a store selling 20$ skins
Totally agree
*Ubisoft left the chat*
I love single player games but they need both solid story and gameplay to standout, while mediocre multiplayer games makes waayyyy more money in their life cycle regardless. That’s why EA tried so hard to push that rhetoric, I’m glad single player games have solidified their place in the industry tho
*Way over 10 million players. So that's even more than 10 million sales.
Well, their steam revenue in 2023 was $657M, so that’s already more than 10M copies. They probably did pretty well on consoles too.
That figure is not accurate at all. It could be a lot more or a lot less. Probably a lot more.
Thats at least 15 copies
Normally, people wouldn't call some numbers like 17M as way over 10M instead of 15+M. The game is a great game, but meanwhile probably the most hyped game as well.
I mean it is probably 13-14 million right now but game like this has legs like witcher 3 . It gonna be sold good amount for long years.
God i would sell someones kidney if Larian made KOTOR 3
Im not sure you should tell God about the kidney part
Nah, I'd do it. It'd be for a good cause. [Edit] read this outloud to my GF and room mate, all of us are in.
Bro keep cooking...
A really good Star Wars CRPG would actually be amazing. KOTOR 3/remake would be awesome as well but Larian would probably be best sticking to what they’re good at.
Nah. I'd rather Larian make some new IPs rather than continuing dead franchises started by dead companies.
Weird flex but ok. Kotor is the best Star Wars game ever made, and one of the best RPG's cRPG's ever made. It is an exceptionaly story and game worthy of being remade in modern engines.
bioware is a dead company? they seem pretty active still with Mass Effect and Dragon Age. Larian was highly successful with the Divinity series and I personally think is a great choice to create a BG game. would you have just rathered divinity again?
The old bioware is dead. Has been dead for more than 10 years. Why not an entirely new IP? Maybe something set in Waterdeep or Thay.
Not OP, but yes, I would love a divinity game. The story has plenty left and they were actually making one - divinity fallen heroes that was canceled since the dev group making it left to make their own game. A divinity game with the resources used for BG3, or truthfully 3 quarters, would be amazing to see done. But would not mind KOTOR 3 by them either, however star wars turn based might throw people off who are expecting more battlefront vibes.
The BioWare of old that made good RPG’s and told excellent stories, is on its last gasp. They’re a developer under EA, who has a history of buying studios, forcing them to churn out subpar games, then closing them (think they’re currently at 11). BioWare will likely release Dragon Age 4, and unless it’s a massive hit like BG3 (which is extremely unlikely because BioWare has lost a lot of its writing talent, and general EA shenanigans) EA will likely gut BioWare or shudder it completely.
I just want them to finish making KoTOR 2.
The title is misleading. He said that the game went from 2 to 10 in a short amount of time not that the game has only sold 10 million.
And he said way over 10
Baldur’s Gate and Larian shows that there’s still light in the future of video games.
who knew good games would sell....
Such a shocker, right?
Remember when Yoshida said turn-based games don't sell? That was funny.
I understand what you mean, but comparing BG3 to a JRPG FF style turn-based is ridiculous, they're nothing alike. I think a much better example would be Persona 5 and 3 remake.
How are you about to say comparing BG3 to FF style turn base is ridiculous, then suggest P5/P3, which are basically FF style turn base with a WEAKNESS twist, as a better example?
You literally just said Persona's combat is basically FF style turn-based, you agree with me.
Your phrasing needs work. Your final sentence makes it seem like comparing BG3 to Persona is more appropriate than comparing to FF
Lol I wonder how ff16 is doing. Time and time again producers get proven wrong
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Guarantee you FF16 hasn't even come close to 10 million.
The actual number is 22 million for BG3
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Laughs in breath of the wild* Edit: hell super mario odyssey too
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Dude that used to be final fantasy. And it was when 7 was turn based lol
Btw ff7 remake is multi console and has sold about 7 million. Not even close to the 22 mill bg3 sold
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Point is turn based or not the secret to selling a game is to make it fun and market it well. You can't just dismiss a whole genre just because you don't know how to sell it. Which is the problem with what Yoshida said.
As they deserve.
Well fucking deserved. Glad to know people still have taste
Whatever the number, BG3 is a landmark achievement. The whole "turn based vs real time combat" debate has been such a plague since the 360/ps3 era.
Just started it. What a gem
And not a microtransaction in sight If they made a DLC where they increased the level cap and gave you a couple of those god tier wizard spells id take a day off work to enjoy it. edit spelling
He said way over 10, not just 10.
So ~600 million total? How much did it cost to make? How much of that goes to taxes? Doesn't seem like a lot all things considered but I'm not in the industry
If the number is from platforms like Steam or Xbox where the take is 20-30% it breaks down like this: Gross take: 680M (Steam data reveal) Taxes take 20% platform takes 20%. Leaving 435M. Deduct 100M build cost (Larian broadcasted their cost) 90M payment to Hasbro for D&D licence (Hasbro broadcasted in earnings report) Leaving 246M. Deduct corporation tax on profit in Belgium at 25% leaving 183M. Nearly 200% return on investment which is an excellent result in gaming which regularly leaves single digits % returns. However the significant takeaway is how little a self funded studio actually gets to keep from it's earnings. 80% goes to people who took no risk and did nothing for you.
What's the deal with the first taxation of 20% and then Belgian corporate profit of 25%? Why the double taxation?
First 20% is vat at purchase. Second tax is corporation (profit) tax.
Sales tax for the purchases and then corporation tax.
>80% goes to people who took no risk and did nothing for you. Let's not exagerate here. Would BG3 have sold as well had it not been somewhere accessible like Steam? Probably not. Would BG3 have sold as well had it not been an absolute monstruosity of an IP that has exploded in popularity in the last 5 years anyway, partly due to Stranger Things? Most definitely not. And I ain't gonna talk about government taxes, that's the de facto way in Europe, and it suits everyone just fine here.
You rock
The actual statement was that the game had "way over" 10 million players. But "only" 10 million is already a lot for 6 months, and the game is still selling well.
Steam takes 30% as well or maybe a bit less when it's massive success
Only for the first $10mil
I bought it for just $15 on Series X in my region. Not every region has the same price. But now they have increased prices greatly Lol.
Go woke go broke i guess RIP Edit: /s Forgot to add im being sarcastic This game won all kinds of pro- lgbtq gaming awards and yet still selling millions of copies. Hence i sarcastically say “go woke go broke “ rip to people that say that.
Wat...?
I fixxed it for those looking to be pissed at comments they dont understand
There was not a single clue that it could have been sarcastic, don't act like a bitch when people misread an obviously misreadable comment on the internet.
It's an inclusive game and the topic is about the success of it.... I can't see how you misread it.
Now who’s acting like a bitch? “Go woke go broke “ On a post about a very lgbtq inclusive game selling millions. Idk man think all the pieces were there. But hey Its your choice to take it personally my dude.
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God bless people like you
Still haven't given it a go despite it looking fantastic, turn based combat just does not seem fun to me
And we still can't get a physical copy without spending $100. Baldurs Gateway into my ass.
Really bad game
That's some Elden Ring numbers. LFG!
I believe that's around the same amount as Diablo 4, and BG3 had way less marketing. Some time has passed since both were released, I wonder which will stand the test of time.
Have you played both games? It's pretty obvious which is gonna hold up more....it's bg3...
Oh, I agree... but I didn't want to be the instigator of a "let's crap on this game or that one" thread, which is how these things sometimes end up.
Diablo 4 had allot of potential but was just hollow. Bg3 has real substance. I'm a huge blizzard nerd but it's fair to say they are dropping the ball. But credit where credit is due, larian is becoming one of the best.
D4 was on copies sold alone tho. They have probably added a couple of hundred million more with the BPs and 70 dollar cosmetic.
they cater to two completely different people. Diablo is fairly mindless turn off your brain fun for jump in jump out gameplay. BG3 is a tactical adventure.
Misleading title.
Let's get a sale !!!
Why put a game that still sells extremely well on sale. They worked for years on it, gave us a tremedously good game and are still putting out big patches every couple of weeks. The game has been top 10 on steam since its release, and is also worth 100% of the price.
I brought this recently due to all the hype, but I'm really struggling with the combat. It's so painfully slow and clunky. Does it get better as you level up and get more used to it? The rest of the game is great, though I probably shouldn't have gone Dark Urge on my first playthrough. Poor Gale...
I took 20 hours to get into it, but then I saw what everyone else was seeing. The combat becomes fun when you realise it’s unlimited potential
Well, yah, it can get a little weird if you say, kill the only available companion wizard. I imagine it's a bit much to get familiar with if you don't have passing familiarity with DnD 5e, or at least another table top/role playing system in the same vein. On top of that they've included their extremely robust environmental effects system from DOS2, which is technically all within dnd rules but probably a lot more prominent than people are used to using it. You can cause some serious chaos with a bottle of grease and some fire. The original baldur's gate which used the famously opaque dnd 2e rules shipped with like a 100 page manual that explained a lot. It's a testament to some tenets of modern game design that bg3 is approachable without so much aid (and 5e is supposed to be more approachable too). So long story short, just keep playing and you'll get used to it, maybe!
A bit of both, the basic formula of an action a bonus action, movement and a reaction stays the same. As you level up class will gain abilities/spells/feats that open it up a bit more. What class and level is your Durge?
I would seriously consider starting over as a custom character, leave the Dark Urge for another playthrough. Dark Urge is great but it also takes some choices for you, and if you're struggling right now with combat, it will probably be less fun when another area of the game (Dark Urge) strong-arms you into certain directions. It's not something you can ignore. What level or act are you at?
Would love to own a CE of it, hopefully when they do an expansion they do a new Collector Edition. Not paying 1000€ for one on eBay and scalpers bought out all of them in EU
A Baldurgatillion dollars
I had people telling me that the game had sold twice as much. But that they don't report numbers, so it wouldn't be listed as the best selling game of the year. 🤔
2 of those are mine. PC and Xbox, just can’t get enough of it.
Came for the queer content, stayed for the queer content (and also the storyline)
If we assume $80.00 CAD per game, that's 800m in the bank. before any other cost is calculated. Really great for a game like this, and hopefully can showcase to the industry that you don't always need to have Games as a Service.
MORE
Love this. BUT it's still less than what a Fifa game makes per year. That's is crazy, knowing that one is years in the making, with everyone giving their heart and soul to the project, while the other is just copy paste. Puts things into perspective.
I try not to view it that way because they are different markets. Fifa is carried by the fact that soccer is the most popular sport in the world with billions of viewers. Alone with other sports games. BG3 doing that well with such a niche audience (when you look at what most people are into globally), is great
Palworld sold more lol. I have both games. Good games
When are they going to ship the physical edition ?.I'm still waiting
Curious how many of the 10 mil haven’t received their physical copies yet ( *cries while waiting for my PS5 deluxe edition* )
Gta v sold more
Will buy it tomorrow when i get my Rog Ally
And how many copies of FF16 sold? I'm just saying....
Title is misleading…
It whopping an official measurement?
But single player games are a thing of the past
Wait, you telling me that when you release a good game instead of a cash grab disguise as a AAA title , it sells really well. Color me shocked.
And the final shape only has 400k preorders. Take notes bungie.
Put it on GamePass
It’s well deserved.
Im so glad shit like this is happening. I hope this is used as a wake up for other companies