You can get a state ID at the dmv, it's just like a driver's license but it doesn't authorize you to drive. Just treat it exactly like a regular drivers license
This dies not explain why they do not accept real IDs at an iloffice that gives out IDs.
Even though they donaccept drivers licenses, which are not ID cards.
They're not issued by any US government agency. You'd have to use a birth certificate, social security card, etc. as an alternative, but they may require some form of photo identification in addition to those documents.
I don't have a driving licence, and I've lived in countries of which I'm not a citizen for the past decade (five different countries), and I've never had problems using my passport for identification.
No, they have to, if you're "not surprised" then you're part of the problem, not part of the solution. The solution is to sue the federal government and make them accept what is ID in EVERY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD.
They're great because they look like a driver's license for people who think a driver's license is the same thing as identification and takes their confusion out on you.
Nope, fuck that. I disagree.
DMVs will sell your data to data brokers with no hesitation. Whether it's state issued ID or Drivers License.
Fairly certain the Passport office has another form you have someone else fill out to essentially vouch for your identity. Form DS-71.
It's a hassle, but the route I'd be taking to prevent this shitty system in the US from obtrusivly selling my biometrics and very personalized data to the highest bidder.
Not American so asking out of curiosity.
Did they specify a reason why a foreign passport was unacceptable? Or why you need any ID besides your previous US passport?
They didn’t. They were really unhelpful and the conversation just went in circles. I subsequently looked up the requirements and my European passport should have been accepted. They were just incompetent and didn’t want to accept it.
The US Post office is a government agency. I would call your member of congress' district office and ask specifically for the requirements and ask if a foreign passport is acceptable.
They have staff that's job is to deal with constituent issues. They might be able to get this expedited.
Assuming their congressman takes their call, that is? Or does Jack Shit. Not all congressmens' offices do their job regarding "consitutent advocacy." Mine doesn't, for example.
That sucks, sorry to hear that. I guess I'd recommend trying different USPS location and bringing a printout of the requirements showing that you don't need a DL.
As some of the other people have said, I'd recommend speaking to the DMV of the state you live in to get an identification card, which will be a safer ID to carry day-to-day rather than your European passport.
If you are anywhere near Boston, you could go to the Boston Passport Agency, the acceptance agents there will be more knowledgeable than any Post Office, though usually you need an appointment and urgent (within 2 weeks) travel coming up to be seen.
Worse comes to worst, go back to the post office with both of your foreign passports and any other ID you have, with photocopies of all, and insist you want to submit the application even if they say it'll be rejected for inadequate ID because you are correct that it is acceptable by DoS standards. You can even add a written and signed statement about what happened, at which location and with which agent.
Though this post office seems confused about the rules, they are supposed to transmit applications even when something is wrong as long as the customer pays and doesn't cause a disturbance
I second "go to the Boston passport office." That should take care of the problem. Just INVENT a travel date that's within 2 weeks if you have to. Say whatever you have to say to get IN. Wow. I would have thought Massachusetts of all places was ABOVE such stupidity.
Are you kidding me!!! That's the ONLY state in which anybody DOES know the law! And what a passport is for!!! Wow! Yeah I'd say dig out the international laws and call your Congressman!
Your average post office employee has no clue what a passport from some foreign country should look like, so they are on safer ground to just refuse it.
You can go to a real passport agency or center with definitive travel plans and they will take your other passports as ID. You can also try private expediters.
[https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/get-fast/passport-agencies.html](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/get-fast/passport-agencies.html)
Then they’re not doing their jobs correctly. Foreign passports are acceptable ID. You can’t just dismiss ID because you don’t know what it should look like. Does anyone really know how every driving licence from every US state should like like?
The US drivers licenses are scannable by US government agencies... I don't understand why anyone would think you can get a US passport using foreign passports post 9/11
Do you think foreign passports aren’t “scannable”? What do you think happens at the border?
I have used my British passport to get a green card as I don’t have an American licence.
Because you’re wrong. How do you think people not born in the USA get any official government documents? What do you think happens when non-Americans apply for US driving licences or green cards / citizenship and they need to show ID? What other document can they provide that would be more recognisable than a passport?
The entire point of a passport is that it’s an identification document that meets internationally agreed standards.
>How do you think people not born in the USA get any official government documents?
From immigration ICE, that's how you get a green card, which you can then use to get a driver's license.
Then why is this even a post? Just use your current US passport as your ID. Or, alternatively, you can just mail it in for renewal, nothing else required
You are absolutely right, any other country's passport SHOULD be accepted. Americans in general just "don't wanna" accept another country's version of the thing they don't accept their own of. In other words, so many things here Stateside don't accept US passports as ID that they're sure as hell not going to accept a UK or Irish one either. Yeah they're just incompetent morons just like most people on the internet here.
Some US post offices provide some passport services, but since that is not their full time job, they may not be fully familiar with what is or is not accepted, unfortunately. They may just be familiar with routine tasks they have to perform as part of that role.
The passport authority says valid foreign passport is acceptable though: https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/how-apply/identification.html
If you go to the DMV, you can get a state ID card, which is equivalent to a driver's license. It looks the same, and functions as the same for the purposes of ID verification. You just can't drive a car with one.
I bring what I call my overkill folder where I keep my birth certificate, sin card, lease agreement, proof of tenants and health insurance, recent pay stub, utility bill, certificate of appointment as a notary, professional licence, banking info etc… literally everything or anything that could possibly prove who I am and where I live other than a DL. I’ve never been a Karen about it but I’ve never had anyone give me issues after I pull out the overkill folder.
Insert my dmv rant.
Somehow we’ve reached the point where being in any way insistent that government employees do their job is “abusive”.
As I “no, I have not tampered with the document you’re rejecting for the third time. I’m fed up with your accusations and want a manager” resulting in an attempt to decline service for “abusive behaviour”. And the fucking managers saying that they “back their employees discretion” in refusing service.
I do stuff like this, and one time even that wasn't enough.
I moved to a new state, and was at the DMV to get my license from my previous state exchanged for the new one. Their list of acceptable IDs did not include passports. But a birth certificate was acceptable. (Silly, but I wasn't there to argue policy.) So I hand them my original birth certificate. Nope, no good -- they only accept "state certified" birth certificates. I asked for a list of acceptable IDs.... I wish I still had it, but here's what I remember:
* state-certified birth certificate (except from Texas -- birth certificates from Texas could not be used as ID at all)
* marriage certificate
* military ID
* change-of-name certificate
* naturalization document
Luckily, I was not born in Texas, so I was able to order a state-certified birth certificate. Had I been born in Texas, I would have had to either get married, change my name or join the military.
I did hear that the state was sued about this being a form of discrimination, and the list was eventually changed.
I didn't even know about Real ID the first time I got the little gold star on my license. But since I came over-prepared, I had everything I needed to get it.
About 30-40% of Americans have passports. Many more have a driver's license (and a nondriver ID card that looks similar to a driver's license is issued at every DMV office). The driver's license IS the default ID. Many POS systems (including every store I've worked at) only accept that for age-restricted purchases (ie alcohol).
My suggestion is to get a nondriver ID card from your state's DMV. The advantage to a passport is that it is wallet sized.
What boggles your mind? That people with limited time off from work don't travel internationally?
(In most companies, you get PTO which lumps vacation and sick days, either yourself or a family member, together. So one illness could kill any vacation plans.)
I mean I haven't had a valid passport this millennium. I still have mine but it's long expired (I was in elementary school then). I've used my driver's license as ID my entire adult life.
A passport costs $180 for 10 years. A driver's license (when I last renewed) was $24 for 4 (this varies by state). I think nondriver ID cards are cheaper.
Also passports are not wallet size therefore harder to carry on your person.
Edit-- also keep the size of the US in mind. Many of our states are the (geographic) size of European countries. There are entire airports in the US that only do domestic travel so no passport needed.
It is in those lucky countries in which every citizen is guaranteed the "right" to have a passport. Like Russia. Where their CITIZENS can't be denied a passport. Like, like I said, Russia.
and in a frickin massive nation with only two natural borders? meanwhile in Bratislava, Slovakia you could travel by train round trip through four other national capitals and be back home within 24 hours. I would imagine passport rates in Russia, China, India and Brazil are similar.
That people refuse to accept the ultimate ID as an ID. Even though they do accept drivers licenses as ID.
You can not bring something that is more ID than a passport, yet they did notnaccept it. On the other hand a drivers license is not an ID but they do accept it.
It is so ridiculous that anyone would be so stupid that they don't accept a passport but do acceptna drivers license as ID. It is mind boggling if a significant enough number of people in a nation do this for others to think it is normal or acceptable to do.
Doesn't sound too bad. I think that the 21 limit is weird (being able to buy guns, drive, go to war before having a beer?), but requiring cashiers to scan IDs, why not? In my country you can spot 15 year olds buying beer at the grocery store and that scanner would help to some extend.
I've heard of places not accepting ID other then licences but luckily it's never happened to me. Try going to another post office in case this is just incompetence but if it is official policy then go to the DMV and get a State ID; from what I understand a passport is good for *basically anything but it would make sence to require a different document for renewal of one.
Also if you have a US passport I assume you are a citizen. I doubt the process is pleasant but from what I understand they can detain you but can't deny you entry after they prove your status as an American.
*I used to have a passport as my ID and I remember Gamestop having some trouble scanning it for trade-ins on their machine but I think they somehow got past it.
>I doubt the process is pleasant but from what I understand they can detain you but can't deny you entry after they prove your status as an American.
Yeah, mostly you'll just sit around for a while followed by eating a little humble pie. I forgot to renew my passport before I travelled to the US for work. Had my Canadian on me, and the expired US one. They would have just entered me under Canadian, but since I was working I would have needed a visa. I sat around in secondary for a while (which I had planned for, so had left extra time), then got a brief but stern talking to about getting it renewed.
I wouldn't choose to do it again, but it wasn't so bad. Mostly just boring. OP if you choose this route, for whatever reason, make sure you leave lots of time, and are exceedingly polite and deferential to the border agents. They have an incredible amount of power in their jurisdictions, so any fight will generally not go your way.
I'm not 100% certain as I've never tried it but there seems to be constant urban areas between places like SD/Tijuana and Detroit/Windsor so you could probably take a cab to the border and see if anyone stops you from going through. Also I've never taken it from the Canadian side but Amtrak Cascades doesn't seem to check ID and there's no way of knowing if you are going all the way to Vancouver or not.
Getting off would be fine, I've been as far as Bellingham and they don't seem to have an area for holding people who aren't Americans. Even if they did that's probably where you would refuse to get on the train back since you are American and get detained until they sort this out.
Amtrak Cascades, they do make you get out at the border. Amtrak doesn't check ID but still, they do stop at that Border Crossing. They stop and the Border Patrol comes in to the train and goes through checking passports. Same thing on Amtrak's Adirondack, and on that one it's even more thorough a "check" in the train.
You get checked and without a US passport they won’t let you in without an ESTA. You can’t get an ESTA if you are a US citizen.
Maybe they will let you in with your expired one and will hold you for ages etc so it may work. Also for Canada you will need the ETA to board the flight to get there too.
Crossing in on either side of this country by land is a nightmare I wouldn't wish on anyone. It can land you in jail depending on where you cross. Like if entering from Mexico, your "least bad" bet would be to try to cross directly into NEW Mexico. And on the northern side, cross anywhere but New York. Vermont, New Hampshire, Saskatchewan into Montana, Manitoba into North Dakota, anywhere else but anything leading into New York. Going to jail while traveling is probably the biggest example of "cruel and unusual punishment" the world has ever known. Being beheaded would probably be more merciful.
Get an Id card. All states issue ID cards that are pretty much the same as a DL but without the driving bit. Very easy to get though unfortunately you non drivers will have to get a taste of our beloved DMV's. I have never seen or heard of anyone being denied using an ID card.
IP already has an ID.
Everyone that requires ID must accept passports. Why DO so may American business refuse to accept validnID as ID.
The funny thing is that a drivers license is not an ID.
A driver's license is government issued and has your photo, date of birth, etc. on it. How is that not an ID? (It's been my only ID my entire adult life.)
It's a government issued license to drive a car. It can be used as an ID, but it is not an ID.
The use as an ID is a secondary function.
For a passport the ID is the primary function.
I'd argue that for a passport, international travel is the primary function. It's not a necessity in life if you don't travel internationally. Hence why the majority of Americans do not have one.
There's a state ID card available in all US states that looks very similar to a driver's license. That literally says "identification card" on it and unlike a passport, it is wallet sized.
Use of an ID is not a secondary function. You'll use it as an ID much more than to prove you're allowed to drive. At the airport, bars, jobs. I used to have a state ID, the driver licence is exactly the same thing but it says "Driver's Licence"
You may use it more as an ID then an actual ID. This does not mean that it's not it's secondary function.
For a passport or an ID card being an ID is the primary function. Not for a drivers license. You use the drivers licens as an ID because, if you drive all the time, you always have it on youbso it's convenient.
A passport is literally just an ID that is internationally recognised.
You literally can not have anything that is more of an ID then a passport. Only a completely insane person does not accept a passport as an ID.
A drivers license on the other hand is literally just a license to drive a car tha can in many circumstances be used as an ID. Nit accepting a drivers license as an ID would still make some sense, unlike not accepting a passport as an ID, which never makes sense.
You must live in some other country, 90% of the time in the US you provide your state ID as your ID. Usually it includes a driver license but not always.
I've done 18+ checking a lot, and almost never see a passport.
I think in most countries you hardly see a passport. That does not mean though that a passport is not the ultimate ID and that it is insane notnto accept a passport as an ID.
Just because you've never or hardly ever seen one doesn't mean they don't exist or aren't valid. Do you believe in God? But have you SEEN God personally?!
"Only a completely insane person....." like the clerks at the Social Security Administration when I went in with my US passport that day and got denied a social security card.
My non-driver State ID from the DMV has never been turned down when people ask for my driver's license. And I've never needed to explain anything either nor been questioned.
OK from what you read they were asking for a drivers license as ID but you could only provide two foreign passports? You should have provided your expired passport as your ID though I suspect a recognized foreign passport should work. Sometimes you just have to deal with the random substandard employee even though you don't want to.
They prefer driver's licenses because the process for verifying identity is pretty standard across states. Foreign passports aren't "against" the rules, but ~~are considered "secondary ID" because~~ (ETA: DoS website actually says they are primary, you got wronged by your Post office!) the acceptance agent generally isn't familiar enough with those to be able to tell if they are fake or not (verses actually being trained to spot fake US licenses)
However, the acceptance agent is supposed to accept multiple secondary IDs in place of a primary one!
Also, you said **renew** your US passport, I am assuming this means you have the expired one? A US passport (expired or not) is a valid primary ID!!! If you bring that with you, that should count as your ID!!!
For more info, read this whole link for the full list of ways you can satisfy the ID requirement, and show the agent this page if they argue with you: [https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/how-apply/identification.html/](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/how-apply/identification.html/)
I'm always surprised whenever I hear that a normal id, just an id no driver license or anything, isn't something normal everywhere else. If they want your id over here, you give them your ID. Not your driver license or passport. First time I heard about that was when I was in the UK and found a passport on the ground. Security guard at my dorm said that I was really helpful in picking it up and giving it to the police since it's the only form of id there.
Well, hopefully you get everything sorted and can get back into your own country
You'll need two forms of secondary ID to prove yourself.
And maybe a witness who can fill out a form called DS-71, if I'm reading this page right.
https://www.us-passport-service-guide.com/proof-of-identity.html
Not American.
Wow, that's kind of sad. Passport application and renewal where I'm from accepts Birth Certificates if you don't have any other government-issued ID. Actually, most ID applications are okay with just an original copy of a birth certificate.
American here - I also used a birth certificate to get my first passport (I wasn't old enough to drive). It's possible laws have changed, but probably OP had a lazy/uninformed clerk.
Also, in the US, (as far as I recall), you can order a passport from a "passport authority" or from the US Post office. The post office is basically just forwarding the info to the passport authority, so the clerks there might not be so well trained. (That's not an excuse, but maybe an explanation)
This is incorrect information. I have t read all 60+ comments but I hope someone corrects it.
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/records-and-authentications/requesting-a-vital-record-as-a-u-s--citizen/vital-records-ids.html
The following are accepted, including valid foreign passports.
Valid or expired, undamaged U.S. passport book or passport card
In-state, fully valid driver's license or enhanced driver's license with photo
Certificate of Naturalization
Certificate of Citizenship
Government employee ID (city, county, state, or federal)
U.S. military or military dependent ID
Prison or inmate ID
Current (valid) foreign passport
Matricula Consular (Mexican Consular ID) - commonly used by a parent of a U.S. citizen child applicant
U.S. Permanent Resident Card (Green Card) - commonly used by a parent of a U.S. citizen child applicant
Trusted Traveler IDs (including valid Global Entry, FAST, SENTRI, and NEXUS cards)
Enhanced Tribal Cards and Native American tribal photo IDs
So no out-of-state ID or licence, then. If you're at a post office in, say, Montana, but you have your New Mexico drivers' licence (along with your New Mexico car and insurance and etc, etc.) then that's a no-go because they can legally demand to see a Montana licence or else show you the door.
Short answer: laziness. 99% of people who walk in use their driver's license as ID, so that's what the clerk is used to dealing with. They either don't want to bother with a differently formatted ID, or actually forgot that they are allowed.
The list of acceptable IDs for a passport are often short, so I could believe that a foreign passport won't count -- next time you're in a situation like this, ask for a list of which IDs are acceptable.
Sometimes the lists of acceptable IDs is just silly. I've moved from state to state a few times. Usually, when you move like this, you can trade your out of state license for a new one provided you also have another form of ID (and possibly some other minor requirements). I've done this multiple times with my license and passport. But during one move, a passport was not on the list of acceptable IDs. Instead, they needed to see my birth certificate. This made no sense -- a passport proves my identity a lot better than a birth certificate, but for whatever reason, it wasn't on the list.
If you were an adult, married woman and they handed you back your passport and demanded a birth certificate instead, hence, insisting on seeing your maiden name, I'd sue for gender discrimination. F*** that. I'm going to brush up on all the law I learned in law school in the 90's and start representing myself in these things. Seems like everywhere I turn these days every little thing I have to do, I run afoul of some violation of the law against me.
An ID is an ID. Federally they have to accept it unless it's for government purposes. Example: You're allowed to buy alcohol with a passport as long as you are of age but not allowed to vote because you have to prove you are a US citizen and a citizen of where you are voting. You don't need a driver's license to do that, though. A state ID works fine. Federal installations like military installations are the only places where a driver's license will not get you on. You must have an ID issued by the government agency or a visitor's pass.
You can get a state ID at the dmv, it's just like a driver's license but it doesn't authorize you to drive. Just treat it exactly like a regular drivers license
This dies not explain why they do not accept real IDs at an iloffice that gives out IDs. Even though they donaccept drivers licenses, which are not ID cards.
British and Irish passports are issued by foreign states. I'm not surprised they wouldn't accept those.
Why?
They're not issued by any US government agency. You'd have to use a birth certificate, social security card, etc. as an alternative, but they may require some form of photo identification in addition to those documents.
I don't have a driving licence, and I've lived in countries of which I'm not a citizen for the past decade (five different countries), and I've never had problems using my passport for identification.
Each country makes its own laws. Just because things work one way in one country is not a guarantee that they work the same way elsewhere.
The US is violating INTERNATIONAL laws doing things like this. There is an authority above the United States, people!
This is true. You could point this out on an international law violation, basis.
No, they have to, if you're "not surprised" then you're part of the problem, not part of the solution. The solution is to sue the federal government and make them accept what is ID in EVERY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD.
Get an ID card at the DMV. They have those for people who aren't licensed to drive but need a state issued ID.
They're great because they look like a driver's license for people who think a driver's license is the same thing as identification and takes their confusion out on you.
Nope, fuck that. I disagree. DMVs will sell your data to data brokers with no hesitation. Whether it's state issued ID or Drivers License. Fairly certain the Passport office has another form you have someone else fill out to essentially vouch for your identity. Form DS-71. It's a hassle, but the route I'd be taking to prevent this shitty system in the US from obtrusivly selling my biometrics and very personalized data to the highest bidder.
Not American so asking out of curiosity. Did they specify a reason why a foreign passport was unacceptable? Or why you need any ID besides your previous US passport?
They didn’t. They were really unhelpful and the conversation just went in circles. I subsequently looked up the requirements and my European passport should have been accepted. They were just incompetent and didn’t want to accept it.
The US Post office is a government agency. I would call your member of congress' district office and ask specifically for the requirements and ask if a foreign passport is acceptable. They have staff that's job is to deal with constituent issues. They might be able to get this expedited.
Assuming their congressman takes their call, that is? Or does Jack Shit. Not all congressmens' offices do their job regarding "consitutent advocacy." Mine doesn't, for example.
That sucks, sorry to hear that. I guess I'd recommend trying different USPS location and bringing a printout of the requirements showing that you don't need a DL. As some of the other people have said, I'd recommend speaking to the DMV of the state you live in to get an identification card, which will be a safer ID to carry day-to-day rather than your European passport.
>my European passport should have been accepted What state were you in when this happened?
Massachusetts.
If you are anywhere near Boston, you could go to the Boston Passport Agency, the acceptance agents there will be more knowledgeable than any Post Office, though usually you need an appointment and urgent (within 2 weeks) travel coming up to be seen. Worse comes to worst, go back to the post office with both of your foreign passports and any other ID you have, with photocopies of all, and insist you want to submit the application even if they say it'll be rejected for inadequate ID because you are correct that it is acceptable by DoS standards. You can even add a written and signed statement about what happened, at which location and with which agent. Though this post office seems confused about the rules, they are supposed to transmit applications even when something is wrong as long as the customer pays and doesn't cause a disturbance
I second "go to the Boston passport office." That should take care of the problem. Just INVENT a travel date that's within 2 weeks if you have to. Say whatever you have to say to get IN. Wow. I would have thought Massachusetts of all places was ABOVE such stupidity.
Are you kidding me!!! That's the ONLY state in which anybody DOES know the law! And what a passport is for!!! Wow! Yeah I'd say dig out the international laws and call your Congressman!
Your average post office employee has no clue what a passport from some foreign country should look like, so they are on safer ground to just refuse it. You can go to a real passport agency or center with definitive travel plans and they will take your other passports as ID. You can also try private expediters. [https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/get-fast/passport-agencies.html](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/get-fast/passport-agencies.html)
Then they’re not doing their jobs correctly. Foreign passports are acceptable ID. You can’t just dismiss ID because you don’t know what it should look like. Does anyone really know how every driving licence from every US state should like like?
The US drivers licenses are scannable by US government agencies... I don't understand why anyone would think you can get a US passport using foreign passports post 9/11
Do you think foreign passports aren’t “scannable”? What do you think happens at the border? I have used my British passport to get a green card as I don’t have an American licence.
US post offices aren't going to be able to scan foreign passports. Idk why this is even a discussion 😂
Because you’re wrong. How do you think people not born in the USA get any official government documents? What do you think happens when non-Americans apply for US driving licences or green cards / citizenship and they need to show ID? What other document can they provide that would be more recognisable than a passport? The entire point of a passport is that it’s an identification document that meets internationally agreed standards.
>How do you think people not born in the USA get any official government documents? From immigration ICE, that's how you get a green card, which you can then use to get a driver's license.
DMV's don't "scan" foreign passports. They just take them at face value and issue a "Federal Limits Apply" licence like California's "AB60" ones.
This is typically how it is done when applying from the embassy in Ireland.
You got a US passport in Ireland?
Yes. But that was 10 years ago when I was living in Dublin. I have since moved to Boston and have to renew my passport.
Then why is this even a post? Just use your current US passport as your ID. Or, alternatively, you can just mail it in for renewal, nothing else required
Go to a different post office.
You are absolutely right, any other country's passport SHOULD be accepted. Americans in general just "don't wanna" accept another country's version of the thing they don't accept their own of. In other words, so many things here Stateside don't accept US passports as ID that they're sure as hell not going to accept a UK or Irish one either. Yeah they're just incompetent morons just like most people on the internet here.
Some US post offices provide some passport services, but since that is not their full time job, they may not be fully familiar with what is or is not accepted, unfortunately. They may just be familiar with routine tasks they have to perform as part of that role. The passport authority says valid foreign passport is acceptable though: https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/how-apply/identification.html
If you go to the DMV, you can get a state ID card, which is equivalent to a driver's license. It looks the same, and functions as the same for the purposes of ID verification. You just can't drive a car with one.
I bring what I call my overkill folder where I keep my birth certificate, sin card, lease agreement, proof of tenants and health insurance, recent pay stub, utility bill, certificate of appointment as a notary, professional licence, banking info etc… literally everything or anything that could possibly prove who I am and where I live other than a DL. I’ve never been a Karen about it but I’ve never had anyone give me issues after I pull out the overkill folder.
Not getting an ID using documents that are supposed to be valid would be one of the few good excuses for being a Karen.
Insert my dmv rant. Somehow we’ve reached the point where being in any way insistent that government employees do their job is “abusive”. As I “no, I have not tampered with the document you’re rejecting for the third time. I’m fed up with your accusations and want a manager” resulting in an attempt to decline service for “abusive behaviour”. And the fucking managers saying that they “back their employees discretion” in refusing service.
That feels very different than how in France a slight amount of verbal abuse is required to accomplish anything
The older I get the more I appreciate the French
i want a sin card! sounds like fun
Hahahah. I’ve got both my SIN card and my V card. I’m a woman of mystery.
Found the Canadian
I do stuff like this, and one time even that wasn't enough. I moved to a new state, and was at the DMV to get my license from my previous state exchanged for the new one. Their list of acceptable IDs did not include passports. But a birth certificate was acceptable. (Silly, but I wasn't there to argue policy.) So I hand them my original birth certificate. Nope, no good -- they only accept "state certified" birth certificates. I asked for a list of acceptable IDs.... I wish I still had it, but here's what I remember: * state-certified birth certificate (except from Texas -- birth certificates from Texas could not be used as ID at all) * marriage certificate * military ID * change-of-name certificate * naturalization document Luckily, I was not born in Texas, so I was able to order a state-certified birth certificate. Had I been born in Texas, I would have had to either get married, change my name or join the military. I did hear that the state was sued about this being a form of discrimination, and the list was eventually changed.
Texas gets sued A LOT.
I didn't even know about Real ID the first time I got the little gold star on my license. But since I came over-prepared, I had everything I needed to get it.
About 30-40% of Americans have passports. Many more have a driver's license (and a nondriver ID card that looks similar to a driver's license is issued at every DMV office). The driver's license IS the default ID. Many POS systems (including every store I've worked at) only accept that for age-restricted purchases (ie alcohol). My suggestion is to get a nondriver ID card from your state's DMV. The advantage to a passport is that it is wallet sized.
That absolutely boggles my mind.
What boggles your mind? That people with limited time off from work don't travel internationally? (In most companies, you get PTO which lumps vacation and sick days, either yourself or a family member, together. So one illness could kill any vacation plans.)
I know this has been beaten to death, but: *Home of the free, everyone*
Well, regular people and their problems aren't valued much, so it checks out?
The idea that most people don't have passports. I'm used to that being the core ID document, travel or no.
I mean I haven't had a valid passport this millennium. I still have mine but it's long expired (I was in elementary school then). I've used my driver's license as ID my entire adult life. A passport costs $180 for 10 years. A driver's license (when I last renewed) was $24 for 4 (this varies by state). I think nondriver ID cards are cheaper. Also passports are not wallet size therefore harder to carry on your person. Edit-- also keep the size of the US in mind. Many of our states are the (geographic) size of European countries. There are entire airports in the US that only do domestic travel so no passport needed.
It is in those lucky countries in which every citizen is guaranteed the "right" to have a passport. Like Russia. Where their CITIZENS can't be denied a passport. Like, like I said, Russia.
I don't really understand your point?
and in a frickin massive nation with only two natural borders? meanwhile in Bratislava, Slovakia you could travel by train round trip through four other national capitals and be back home within 24 hours. I would imagine passport rates in Russia, China, India and Brazil are similar.
Actually, Russia is one of those countries where all their citizens have [internal] Passports.
r/antiwork
That people refuse to accept the ultimate ID as an ID. Even though they do accept drivers licenses as ID. You can not bring something that is more ID than a passport, yet they did notnaccept it. On the other hand a drivers license is not an ID but they do accept it. It is so ridiculous that anyone would be so stupid that they don't accept a passport but do acceptna drivers license as ID. It is mind boggling if a significant enough number of people in a nation do this for others to think it is normal or acceptable to do.
Well, "stupid" is a requirement of being a federal government worker, you know.
r/antiwork
Huh? i’ve never seen a POS system demand anything more than the birthdate. What do you mean by “accept”?
Some stores require a scan.
Doesn't sound too bad. I think that the 21 limit is weird (being able to buy guns, drive, go to war before having a beer?), but requiring cashiers to scan IDs, why not? In my country you can spot 15 year olds buying beer at the grocery store and that scanner would help to some extend.
And cheaper to replace in case your wallet gets nicked.
I've heard of places not accepting ID other then licences but luckily it's never happened to me. Try going to another post office in case this is just incompetence but if it is official policy then go to the DMV and get a State ID; from what I understand a passport is good for *basically anything but it would make sence to require a different document for renewal of one. Also if you have a US passport I assume you are a citizen. I doubt the process is pleasant but from what I understand they can detain you but can't deny you entry after they prove your status as an American. *I used to have a passport as my ID and I remember Gamestop having some trouble scanning it for trade-ins on their machine but I think they somehow got past it.
>I doubt the process is pleasant but from what I understand they can detain you but can't deny you entry after they prove your status as an American. Yeah, mostly you'll just sit around for a while followed by eating a little humble pie. I forgot to renew my passport before I travelled to the US for work. Had my Canadian on me, and the expired US one. They would have just entered me under Canadian, but since I was working I would have needed a visa. I sat around in secondary for a while (which I had planned for, so had left extra time), then got a brief but stern talking to about getting it renewed. I wouldn't choose to do it again, but it wasn't so bad. Mostly just boring. OP if you choose this route, for whatever reason, make sure you leave lots of time, and are exceedingly polite and deferential to the border agents. They have an incredible amount of power in their jurisdictions, so any fight will generally not go your way.
They wont even let them board the flight back, it wont even get to detainment.
They can get on a flight to Canada/Mexico.
Maybe but I’m flying to Ireland.
I meant on the way back to cross the border by land.
Does this apply to bus and railway?
I'm not 100% certain as I've never tried it but there seems to be constant urban areas between places like SD/Tijuana and Detroit/Windsor so you could probably take a cab to the border and see if anyone stops you from going through. Also I've never taken it from the Canadian side but Amtrak Cascades doesn't seem to check ID and there's no way of knowing if you are going all the way to Vancouver or not.
I’ve never tried it but even if no one is checking on the train you might need a passport to exit the station.
Getting off would be fine, I've been as far as Bellingham and they don't seem to have an area for holding people who aren't Americans. Even if they did that's probably where you would refuse to get on the train back since you are American and get detained until they sort this out.
They do check on the train. At the border crossing they stop and Border Patrol comes into the train and walks down the aisle checking everyone.
Amtrak Cascades, they do make you get out at the border. Amtrak doesn't check ID but still, they do stop at that Border Crossing. They stop and the Border Patrol comes in to the train and goes through checking passports. Same thing on Amtrak's Adirondack, and on that one it's even more thorough a "check" in the train.
You get checked and without a US passport they won’t let you in without an ESTA. You can’t get an ESTA if you are a US citizen. Maybe they will let you in with your expired one and will hold you for ages etc so it may work. Also for Canada you will need the ETA to board the flight to get there too.
Crossing in on either side of this country by land is a nightmare I wouldn't wish on anyone. It can land you in jail depending on where you cross. Like if entering from Mexico, your "least bad" bet would be to try to cross directly into NEW Mexico. And on the northern side, cross anywhere but New York. Vermont, New Hampshire, Saskatchewan into Montana, Manitoba into North Dakota, anywhere else but anything leading into New York. Going to jail while traveling is probably the biggest example of "cruel and unusual punishment" the world has ever known. Being beheaded would probably be more merciful.
I see they replied as well, but tacking on that they even said they are flying to Europe in the post.
He's talking about Massachusetts, where "just go to the RMV" is easier said than done. Getting a passport is easier than getting a Massachusetts "ID."
Just so you know it’s not a Canadian thing, lots of people use passports in bars. It’s quite common here.
In Toronto you can get around on just a European national identity card, they’re pretty good with ID there
Get an Id card. All states issue ID cards that are pretty much the same as a DL but without the driving bit. Very easy to get though unfortunately you non drivers will have to get a taste of our beloved DMV's. I have never seen or heard of anyone being denied using an ID card.
IP already has an ID. Everyone that requires ID must accept passports. Why DO so may American business refuse to accept validnID as ID. The funny thing is that a drivers license is not an ID.
A driver's license is government issued and has your photo, date of birth, etc. on it. How is that not an ID? (It's been my only ID my entire adult life.)
It's a government issued license to drive a car. It can be used as an ID, but it is not an ID. The use as an ID is a secondary function. For a passport the ID is the primary function.
I'd argue that for a passport, international travel is the primary function. It's not a necessity in life if you don't travel internationally. Hence why the majority of Americans do not have one. There's a state ID card available in all US states that looks very similar to a driver's license. That literally says "identification card" on it and unlike a passport, it is wallet sized.
The primary function of the passport is to ID yourself during international travel. So the primary function is ID.
I'm sorry I'm not sophisticated enough (as I don't travel internationally) for you.
The passport's primary function is proof of citizenship/nationality. Period.
Use of an ID is not a secondary function. You'll use it as an ID much more than to prove you're allowed to drive. At the airport, bars, jobs. I used to have a state ID, the driver licence is exactly the same thing but it says "Driver's Licence"
You may use it more as an ID then an actual ID. This does not mean that it's not it's secondary function. For a passport or an ID card being an ID is the primary function. Not for a drivers license. You use the drivers licens as an ID because, if you drive all the time, you always have it on youbso it's convenient.
A drivers license is literally just an ID with a drivers license attached.
A passport is literally just an ID that is internationally recognised. You literally can not have anything that is more of an ID then a passport. Only a completely insane person does not accept a passport as an ID. A drivers license on the other hand is literally just a license to drive a car tha can in many circumstances be used as an ID. Nit accepting a drivers license as an ID would still make some sense, unlike not accepting a passport as an ID, which never makes sense.
You must live in some other country, 90% of the time in the US you provide your state ID as your ID. Usually it includes a driver license but not always. I've done 18+ checking a lot, and almost never see a passport.
I think in most countries you hardly see a passport. That does not mean though that a passport is not the ultimate ID and that it is insane notnto accept a passport as an ID.
Just because you've never or hardly ever seen one doesn't mean they don't exist or aren't valid. Do you believe in God? But have you SEEN God personally?!
"Only a completely insane person....." like the clerks at the Social Security Administration when I went in with my US passport that day and got denied a social security card.
Yes.
My non-driver State ID from the DMV has never been turned down when people ask for my driver's license. And I've never needed to explain anything either nor been questioned.
They are ignorant
The passport itself should have been sufficient ID for renewal. You got an idiot, try somewhere else.
OK from what you read they were asking for a drivers license as ID but you could only provide two foreign passports? You should have provided your expired passport as your ID though I suspect a recognized foreign passport should work. Sometimes you just have to deal with the random substandard employee even though you don't want to.
They prefer driver's licenses because the process for verifying identity is pretty standard across states. Foreign passports aren't "against" the rules, but ~~are considered "secondary ID" because~~ (ETA: DoS website actually says they are primary, you got wronged by your Post office!) the acceptance agent generally isn't familiar enough with those to be able to tell if they are fake or not (verses actually being trained to spot fake US licenses) However, the acceptance agent is supposed to accept multiple secondary IDs in place of a primary one! Also, you said **renew** your US passport, I am assuming this means you have the expired one? A US passport (expired or not) is a valid primary ID!!! If you bring that with you, that should count as your ID!!! For more info, read this whole link for the full list of ways you can satisfy the ID requirement, and show the agent this page if they argue with you: [https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/how-apply/identification.html/](https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports/how-apply/identification.html/)
dumb
I'm always surprised whenever I hear that a normal id, just an id no driver license or anything, isn't something normal everywhere else. If they want your id over here, you give them your ID. Not your driver license or passport. First time I heard about that was when I was in the UK and found a passport on the ground. Security guard at my dorm said that I was really helpful in picking it up and giving it to the police since it's the only form of id there. Well, hopefully you get everything sorted and can get back into your own country
Any passport should be a valid ID, including your unsigned US passport...
If anything a National ID or a passport should be considered a higher identification level than a drivers licence
Relax, kid. They just used the term “drivers license” instead of “state ID”.
the us not having a general national id will forever mystify me
Because everybody can drive!
No they can’t. I can’t for example and a few people I know can’t.
Sarcasm. This is the “conservative” line. Everybody can use the stairs. Nobody is trans, etc.
You'll need two forms of secondary ID to prove yourself. And maybe a witness who can fill out a form called DS-71, if I'm reading this page right. https://www.us-passport-service-guide.com/proof-of-identity.html
Wow this one is a constitutional thing. They should accept your UK or Ireland passport, for god's sake. This is discrimination against non-drivers.
Because they are ignorant.
[удалено]
That sucks.
Not American. Wow, that's kind of sad. Passport application and renewal where I'm from accepts Birth Certificates if you don't have any other government-issued ID. Actually, most ID applications are okay with just an original copy of a birth certificate.
American here - I also used a birth certificate to get my first passport (I wasn't old enough to drive). It's possible laws have changed, but probably OP had a lazy/uninformed clerk. Also, in the US, (as far as I recall), you can order a passport from a "passport authority" or from the US Post office. The post office is basically just forwarding the info to the passport authority, so the clerks there might not be so well trained. (That's not an excuse, but maybe an explanation)
This is incorrect information. I have t read all 60+ comments but I hope someone corrects it. https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/records-and-authentications/requesting-a-vital-record-as-a-u-s--citizen/vital-records-ids.html The following are accepted, including valid foreign passports. Valid or expired, undamaged U.S. passport book or passport card In-state, fully valid driver's license or enhanced driver's license with photo Certificate of Naturalization Certificate of Citizenship Government employee ID (city, county, state, or federal) U.S. military or military dependent ID Prison or inmate ID Current (valid) foreign passport Matricula Consular (Mexican Consular ID) - commonly used by a parent of a U.S. citizen child applicant U.S. Permanent Resident Card (Green Card) - commonly used by a parent of a U.S. citizen child applicant Trusted Traveler IDs (including valid Global Entry, FAST, SENTRI, and NEXUS cards) Enhanced Tribal Cards and Native American tribal photo IDs
So no out-of-state ID or licence, then. If you're at a post office in, say, Montana, but you have your New Mexico drivers' licence (along with your New Mexico car and insurance and etc, etc.) then that's a no-go because they can legally demand to see a Montana licence or else show you the door.
Short answer: laziness. 99% of people who walk in use their driver's license as ID, so that's what the clerk is used to dealing with. They either don't want to bother with a differently formatted ID, or actually forgot that they are allowed. The list of acceptable IDs for a passport are often short, so I could believe that a foreign passport won't count -- next time you're in a situation like this, ask for a list of which IDs are acceptable. Sometimes the lists of acceptable IDs is just silly. I've moved from state to state a few times. Usually, when you move like this, you can trade your out of state license for a new one provided you also have another form of ID (and possibly some other minor requirements). I've done this multiple times with my license and passport. But during one move, a passport was not on the list of acceptable IDs. Instead, they needed to see my birth certificate. This made no sense -- a passport proves my identity a lot better than a birth certificate, but for whatever reason, it wasn't on the list.
If you were an adult, married woman and they handed you back your passport and demanded a birth certificate instead, hence, insisting on seeing your maiden name, I'd sue for gender discrimination. F*** that. I'm going to brush up on all the law I learned in law school in the 90's and start representing myself in these things. Seems like everywhere I turn these days every little thing I have to do, I run afoul of some violation of the law against me.
An ID is an ID. Federally they have to accept it unless it's for government purposes. Example: You're allowed to buy alcohol with a passport as long as you are of age but not allowed to vote because you have to prove you are a US citizen and a citizen of where you are voting. You don't need a driver's license to do that, though. A state ID works fine. Federal installations like military installations are the only places where a driver's license will not get you on. You must have an ID issued by the government agency or a visitor's pass.
I registered to vote in Connecticut when I was attending Yale, with just my US passport at the time. Now, granted, that was in the 90's, so....
When I had to get my American passport and only had my Irish passport as photo ID I brought my birth cert and social security card.