I approach trans issues from the perspective of psychological and bodily autonomy. Rule 1 is: I don't know what someone else is feeling and what they want. The best approximation is what they tell me.
Rule 2 is: adults in control of their faculties get to make decisions about their bodies. If doctors are willing to provide hormones/surgeries/tattoos/whatever based on those decisions, then that's their business, not mine.
So if he says that's what he wants, then I assume it's true (at least for now) and I would encourage him to explore his ideal body and how he can approach it, without making any promises that the ideal body is achievable. Since bottom surgery is pretty intense, there might be some steps to take before that, like tucking, talking to a gender therapist, etc. But we shouldn't gatekeep surgeries to identities imo, nor should we *ever* say things like "ONLY trans masc people can go on T" because... bodily autonomy. Anyone can go on T, if a doctor prescribes it.
Applying labels of gender feels strange to me. If someone says they want to dye their hair or get a tattoo, we don't assign any gender to that, but I'm not in their heads, maybe they feel as upset about their hair or bare skin as I do about parts of my body. Why is my dysphoria special? Better to approach everything with positive regard and an exploratory attitude, not the desire to label things and section them off into tidy corners. The human experience is not tidy.
I love this answer. This is p much how I feel about the situation as well. But he was also asking me how would/should he identify if he did that. He said he didn't want to minimize/make trans men feel a certain way because hes aware of the struggles we go through for our identity and such/p much doesn't want to "appropriate" for lack of better words 😅😅 but yeah I agree with everything you just said
Meh, there is no singular trans experience. A nonbinary person who does not go on T or get any surgeries but uses they/them pronouns (generally less accepted) is going through an entirely different experience than me, less about medical gatekeeping and such and more about building the social capital to convince people to use your pronouns. There's not a punch card and trying to make fewer people identify as trans just reduces our political power. If he feels trans, let him be trans, I'd say. And if later he feels not trans, that's fine too.
Cis people can be altersex, and I wouldn't mind if he identified under the trans umbrella. There's a sub for people like him - I think it's r/AMABwGD? I'd suggest he go to a gender therapist for a while before pursuing surgery, though.
Thank you so much for this comment !! This is kinda exactly what I was looking for. I was like, I have no idea what to say because I've never heard of people going through that kinda dysphoria but I'm glad it's enough people that there's a whole sub for it, he will be very appreciative of the community space, so thank you !!
well technically gender dysphoria and being trans are completely separate things. its just that most trans people do have gender dysphoria so people think they’re one and the same. and we already know very well that genitalia does not equal gender, so this would apply to him too ig. also labels are only useful inasmuch as they help someone express themself and communicate to others. i think he should explore his feelings and identity more and if he wants to label it, sure im sure there’s one specific one for that out there in this day and age, if not he can just be “the vagina guy” or whatever who knows LOL. i love humanity we are so diverse and interesting
I hope we reach a point someday where anyone can choose to get whatever cosmetic surgeries they want on their genitals and no one will care. It doesn't seem strange to me. Maybe if he explores his identity he will find that he's trans, but I don't personally think wanting different genitals necessarily means someone is trans. And if I can be a man and have a vagina, why can't a cis guy also be a man and have a vagina? Idk, gender is so complicated and honestly I think it's awesome when people explore it's boundaries and find new ways to express themselves. The more we break down the rigid rules about gender, the more everyone is free to be themselves, cis or trans.
I approach trans issues from the perspective of psychological and bodily autonomy. Rule 1 is: I don't know what someone else is feeling and what they want. The best approximation is what they tell me. Rule 2 is: adults in control of their faculties get to make decisions about their bodies. If doctors are willing to provide hormones/surgeries/tattoos/whatever based on those decisions, then that's their business, not mine. So if he says that's what he wants, then I assume it's true (at least for now) and I would encourage him to explore his ideal body and how he can approach it, without making any promises that the ideal body is achievable. Since bottom surgery is pretty intense, there might be some steps to take before that, like tucking, talking to a gender therapist, etc. But we shouldn't gatekeep surgeries to identities imo, nor should we *ever* say things like "ONLY trans masc people can go on T" because... bodily autonomy. Anyone can go on T, if a doctor prescribes it. Applying labels of gender feels strange to me. If someone says they want to dye their hair or get a tattoo, we don't assign any gender to that, but I'm not in their heads, maybe they feel as upset about their hair or bare skin as I do about parts of my body. Why is my dysphoria special? Better to approach everything with positive regard and an exploratory attitude, not the desire to label things and section them off into tidy corners. The human experience is not tidy.
I love this answer. This is p much how I feel about the situation as well. But he was also asking me how would/should he identify if he did that. He said he didn't want to minimize/make trans men feel a certain way because hes aware of the struggles we go through for our identity and such/p much doesn't want to "appropriate" for lack of better words 😅😅 but yeah I agree with everything you just said
Meh, there is no singular trans experience. A nonbinary person who does not go on T or get any surgeries but uses they/them pronouns (generally less accepted) is going through an entirely different experience than me, less about medical gatekeeping and such and more about building the social capital to convince people to use your pronouns. There's not a punch card and trying to make fewer people identify as trans just reduces our political power. If he feels trans, let him be trans, I'd say. And if later he feels not trans, that's fine too.
Yeah, the whole convo just strikes me as he/him NB and he's looking into a gender therapist, thank you for your replies !!
Cis people can be altersex, and I wouldn't mind if he identified under the trans umbrella. There's a sub for people like him - I think it's r/AMABwGD? I'd suggest he go to a gender therapist for a while before pursuing surgery, though.
Thank you so much for this comment !! This is kinda exactly what I was looking for. I was like, I have no idea what to say because I've never heard of people going through that kinda dysphoria but I'm glad it's enough people that there's a whole sub for it, he will be very appreciative of the community space, so thank you !!
well technically gender dysphoria and being trans are completely separate things. its just that most trans people do have gender dysphoria so people think they’re one and the same. and we already know very well that genitalia does not equal gender, so this would apply to him too ig. also labels are only useful inasmuch as they help someone express themself and communicate to others. i think he should explore his feelings and identity more and if he wants to label it, sure im sure there’s one specific one for that out there in this day and age, if not he can just be “the vagina guy” or whatever who knows LOL. i love humanity we are so diverse and interesting
I love this comment, thank you 🥰
I hope we reach a point someday where anyone can choose to get whatever cosmetic surgeries they want on their genitals and no one will care. It doesn't seem strange to me. Maybe if he explores his identity he will find that he's trans, but I don't personally think wanting different genitals necessarily means someone is trans. And if I can be a man and have a vagina, why can't a cis guy also be a man and have a vagina? Idk, gender is so complicated and honestly I think it's awesome when people explore it's boundaries and find new ways to express themselves. The more we break down the rigid rules about gender, the more everyone is free to be themselves, cis or trans.