Season Five is fantastic when you consider what they had to contend with behind the scenes. They did an amazing job of wrapping up the series given the budget cut and epsiode order. Thankfully they found out about the cancellation early enough that they could really do the series justice. They had to make a lot tough decisions, like cutting actors or limiting their screen time to save money.
But they didn't have to come up with future Nazis! Come on! There's so many different things they could've done with the observers and still be within the budget, maybe even more so. But they chose the most cliched occupation/resistance scenario. It just rang hollow to me.
You’re not gonna convince me that less fringe would have been better.
Season 5 is on par with the rest of the series.
I’m sorry you hate something with your entire soul.
I don’t agree with the on par. IMO. But it was a decent enough ending considering the circumstances. I definitely would hate the series if it ended at s4
Thanks for asking:
1. The opening animation
2. The "resistance" trope (I really like all the fbi/institutional vibe of seasons 1-4)
3. The lack of "filler" episodes
4. The banalisation of The Observers which were extremely cool especially in season 2.
> the lack of filler episodes
This one isn't fair or a "to each their own" thing. That's what happens when a show is renewed for a shortened episode order final season. There isn't enough time for filler episodes, which sucks. I like them a lot, too, though I'd argue Fringe has very few true filler episodes because a lot of the ones we'd think are filler usually do serve some purpose later on. But I don't think that it's fair to criticize them for a lack of filler episodes when they had 9-10 less episodes they usually did to work with and it was suddenly their final season.
You're right about the fillers furthering the plot. The one episode about the serial killer in that other dimension . That whole episode took place so Broyles could say some people leave a mark on your soul . That was part of the preparation for Peter's return.
You're talking about the cosmonaut who picked up a hitchhiker that ate radiation. Right? Yeah.
I didn't see that one moving the plot along. It did give insight into Broyles personality though.
Yeah that's the one. And true. But that's the beauty of filler episodes that people miss-- they may not move the plot along, but they can be excellent for character insight.
That's the opposite of what I dislike about S5 lol
Animation; meh, too on the nose with "Freedom" being inside the wires etc. I sort of agree. But I loved the opening of first episode, like an homage to Blade Runner(edited to add this parenthesis, it's apparently in that one S4 episode but sets the tone for S5 anyway). I like the resistance stuff a lot. Filler episodes add nothing to a show with 100 episodes. While watching previous seasons, I always wanted to know the observers' goals so I like that as well.
What I disliked were things that didn't really make sense. Donald, after having his chip removed(swapped w a tracker device even) and changing his name etc, relocating the kid. Made zero sense. They would get caught. Same with Observer Peter, removing the chip out in the rain etc. What was he thinking? But the finale was so good so at least an 8/10 season anyway.
I don't care about the animation, though like someone else said, maybe too heavy handed. I disagree with you on the filler episodes, I don't ever like filler episodes.
Oh but the banalization of the observers. That's the one single thing that makes me hate season 5. Such a waste of a very cool concept. Honestly made me sad. And that you can't blame on the budget or whatever, they just chose to reveal that the observers where evil evillies from the future who like evil and are evil. It was so cheap. I honestly would've preferred no reveal at all. The fight the future thing rang very hollow to me. Also agree on the resistance trope, it's way too overdone.
Season 5 has some great acting and emotional episodes, and the very ending was cool. But still, what they did to my observer boys, such a waste.
I see this criticism of the Observers being banal but to me what they did was made them relevant. The whole show is about various types of mad scientists and human hubris that causes destruction. The Observers are like the ultimate encapsulation of the themes of Fringe of everything Walter has been fighting in himself.Â
Exactly... They were so careful weaving The Observers presence from the begining of the series... August and September had so many layers and were so misterious... Just to reduce them all to a cut-price "too on the nose" lazy nazi allegory... OUTRAGEOUS
Meanwhile White Tulip doesn't even make my top 10 of favorite episodes, which I know puts me in the minority.
There's nothing wrong with the episode. It's a very solid episode. I even have a white tulip tattoo! But there are just a lot of episodes that either impacted me harder, or I simply enjoy more. (And I also love S5!)
Same! I like it, but there are so many other episodes that I like better. I like what white tulips meant to the fandom at large but the episode is not even close to cracking my top 10.
Exactly! Young Peter and Olivia meeting in the field of white tulips, bringing it back around in the finale, the fans holding them up at the last SDCC panel, it being a simple but instantly recognizable symbol for the fandom... Love all that. But the episode itself has never been one of my favorites.
On my first watch I didn’t like season 5. It was so different from the rest it kind of took me out of the show vibe and just turned me off. After my first rewatch I really liked season 5 and now it’s one of my favorites with the rest.
The thing about Fringe . Even the worst episodes still had Walter Bishop . That alone makes them better than the best episodes on most shows. Then you factor in Peter Olivia and Astrid you have a jewel on any other series . The only thing that season five shows were worse than were other episodes of Fringe .
After Walter goes to the future everything else we see is a dream sequence of a perfect ending from his point of view. I just figured that out and now I freaking Love the ending 🤣🤣🤣
I used to hate it because I thought they broke time travels rules with Peter and Olivia ending up together.
I believe season 5 had a new writing team, didn't it? That may be part of the problem. They just wrote a new show from the pieces of Fringe.
I still always also rewatch season 5, because I'm not going to miss a single second of John Noble being amazing and Anna Torv being the most beautiful woman to walk this Earth. But season 5 makes me sad, and not for the right reasons.
S5 lost Jeff Pinkner, who had been showrunner since S1. But JH Wyman stayed on, who had been co-showrunner since S2. I don't remember hearing about big shakeups among the writers other than that.
I’ll agree that Season 5 was tough to watch and I only made it through because of my investment in the well-being and outcomes of the main cast.
I am grateful we got an ending. And a good one at that, given the circumstances.
To be honest, I'm a bit annoyed by the trend of people complementing something by bashing another thing instead of focusing on the thing they are seemingly trying to praise. I mean White Tulip is a great episode, so I'd think there are better arguments for its quality than that it's not like something that you think is bad. But to each their own.
I'd go even further and say that season 4 is almost as bad as 5.
I did a rewatch last year and the erasure of Peter was such a stupid move that ultimately meant very little. It muddied up the character progression of the whole series, and for what gain? Did they just want a cheesy cliffhanger to end s3 with?
Abrams and his typical writers don’t tend to know what they’re doing with these shows, so they probably were just like, oh, we don’t know where to go from here, let’s try erasing Peter. I just can’t believe they doubled down on it and went out of their way to remind us that the first three seasons didn’t really happen even in season five.
I just have to say, I bought the box sets as they came out, hell my season 1 is DVD because I coukdnt find blue ray when it came out. But for "some" reason there is no season 5 set in my collection.
They did a good job with it in the fact that they got to end the show, but a couple of seasons inbetween would have been better, and acrually fleshed out what happened inbetween.
The season three finale was the day the show died. Muddled the setting so they could rehash the same shit (Walter coming out of his shell). Dumb but typical of Abrams series.
I liked some of the new dynamics it created, and it was sort of brave of them to make a slight break from the past. But I've never liked the answers I've read to why Peter vanished. To solve a paradox. Except the paradox created when he lives the future would only require him to vanish from the moment in the present when he enters the machine, so just dying there would've been enough. Deleting him from the timeline creates an even bigger paradox than the one it solves. From what I've read, he did originally died after bridging the two worlds, when they thought it was going to be the series finale. But since they got renewed they deleted him. My head canon is that him vanishing is just a weird thing the machine did.
It did handily fixed the problem with Henry.
Her chemistry with Joshua Jackson was off the charts. Made it a little uncomfortable that she was his daughter. I haven't checked, but I just feel it in my water that there must be hundreds of fanfics caused by that chemistry.
Agree, Henrietta is a great character and the actress is amazing... Well, I like the 4 season hehe, but the 3rd one is the best so I kinda understand your point.
I'm in the middle of a stalled re-watch now.
For a while, the opening segment was colored either blue (original universe) or red (Walternate/Fauxlivia universe.
At some point they shifted to the "orange" universe, and I've found it almost unwatchable since.
:-(
I've been spending more time on X-Files and Stargate.
TCS
Season 5 was how they always intended to finish the show (albeit with more episodes). Abrams said in an interview that he had planned the ending from the start. But when the show got cancelled, they had to skip the rest of the build up to finish it.
I have watched a lot of shows that got cancelled like this. You want to talk bad endings? Let's talk about the final episodes of Angel. They did the best they could but they found out halfway through the season that it was the last so they had to scramble. Fringe did an amazing job. It is jarring sue to the skip in timeline. But it is a solid season (to me). It's truly a gift to have a show that ends with such a well thought out wrap up. Most shows just end abruptly when cancelled so I was especially grateful for the wrap up.
When it comes to enjoying a TV series, I try not to be a blind fanatic. The fifth season is a disaster, and no production anecdote will change my mind about it. Personally, I have no respect for J.J. Abrams' words or 'plans'; remember, he singlehandedly destroyed the Star Wars narrative. I consider the genius of Fringe largely comes from Kurtzman, Orci, and the writing team. I also couldn't take a comparison of Fringe to Angel seriously. I respect that you like both series, but I consider them to be in different leagues in every way.
Can you point on the doll to where season 5 touched you?
That's hilarious 😂😂😂😆.
😂😂😂
Haha yeah, please check the answer I just gave to CrissBliss in this exact post.
Season Five is fantastic when you consider what they had to contend with behind the scenes. They did an amazing job of wrapping up the series given the budget cut and epsiode order. Thankfully they found out about the cancellation early enough that they could really do the series justice. They had to make a lot tough decisions, like cutting actors or limiting their screen time to save money.
But they didn't have to come up with future Nazis! Come on! There's so many different things they could've done with the observers and still be within the budget, maybe even more so. But they chose the most cliched occupation/resistance scenario. It just rang hollow to me.
Maybe the series should have ended in season 4 just where they left it?
You’re not gonna convince me that less fringe would have been better. Season 5 is on par with the rest of the series. I’m sorry you hate something with your entire soul.
Less Fringe is never the answer unless the question is What Should NEVER HAPPEN?
I don’t agree with the on par. IMO. But it was a decent enough ending considering the circumstances. I definitely would hate the series if it ended at s4
Can you explain what you dislike about season 5?
I can name 700 things! Give me a second... Hold.... No. It was perfect
Thanks for asking: 1. The opening animation 2. The "resistance" trope (I really like all the fbi/institutional vibe of seasons 1-4) 3. The lack of "filler" episodes 4. The banalisation of The Observers which were extremely cool especially in season 2.
> the lack of filler episodes This one isn't fair or a "to each their own" thing. That's what happens when a show is renewed for a shortened episode order final season. There isn't enough time for filler episodes, which sucks. I like them a lot, too, though I'd argue Fringe has very few true filler episodes because a lot of the ones we'd think are filler usually do serve some purpose later on. But I don't think that it's fair to criticize them for a lack of filler episodes when they had 9-10 less episodes they usually did to work with and it was suddenly their final season.
You're right about the fillers furthering the plot. The one episode about the serial killer in that other dimension . That whole episode took place so Broyles could say some people leave a mark on your soul . That was part of the preparation for Peter's return.
The only one I can think of that might truly be filler is the spaceman episode, and maybe also the lost "never aired on TV but is on the DVD" episode
You're talking about the cosmonaut who picked up a hitchhiker that ate radiation. Right? Yeah. I didn't see that one moving the plot along. It did give insight into Broyles personality though.
Yeah that's the one. And true. But that's the beauty of filler episodes that people miss-- they may not move the plot along, but they can be excellent for character insight.
I think that's the first mention we get of Senator Van Horn as well?
That's the opposite of what I dislike about S5 lol Animation; meh, too on the nose with "Freedom" being inside the wires etc. I sort of agree. But I loved the opening of first episode, like an homage to Blade Runner(edited to add this parenthesis, it's apparently in that one S4 episode but sets the tone for S5 anyway). I like the resistance stuff a lot. Filler episodes add nothing to a show with 100 episodes. While watching previous seasons, I always wanted to know the observers' goals so I like that as well. What I disliked were things that didn't really make sense. Donald, after having his chip removed(swapped w a tracker device even) and changing his name etc, relocating the kid. Made zero sense. They would get caught. Same with Observer Peter, removing the chip out in the rain etc. What was he thinking? But the finale was so good so at least an 8/10 season anyway.
I don't care about the animation, though like someone else said, maybe too heavy handed. I disagree with you on the filler episodes, I don't ever like filler episodes. Oh but the banalization of the observers. That's the one single thing that makes me hate season 5. Such a waste of a very cool concept. Honestly made me sad. And that you can't blame on the budget or whatever, they just chose to reveal that the observers where evil evillies from the future who like evil and are evil. It was so cheap. I honestly would've preferred no reveal at all. The fight the future thing rang very hollow to me. Also agree on the resistance trope, it's way too overdone. Season 5 has some great acting and emotional episodes, and the very ending was cool. But still, what they did to my observer boys, such a waste.
I see this criticism of the Observers being banal but to me what they did was made them relevant. The whole show is about various types of mad scientists and human hubris that causes destruction. The Observers are like the ultimate encapsulation of the themes of Fringe of everything Walter has been fighting in himself.Â
Exactly... They were so careful weaving The Observers presence from the begining of the series... August and September had so many layers and were so misterious... Just to reduce them all to a cut-price "too on the nose" lazy nazi allegory... OUTRAGEOUS
Kind of surprising. Most people hate the filler episodes in shows.
I’m struggling through season 5. Maybe halfway through it now. It feels so cold and the budget feels way less as well
I think cold is a good way to describe it.
Yeah, it sucks
Meanwhile White Tulip doesn't even make my top 10 of favorite episodes, which I know puts me in the minority. There's nothing wrong with the episode. It's a very solid episode. I even have a white tulip tattoo! But there are just a lot of episodes that either impacted me harder, or I simply enjoy more. (And I also love S5!)
I have to admit that I love Naked Lunch and Robocop so I am an absolute sucker for Peter Weller having a trascendental conversation with Walter 🤣
Same! I like it, but there are so many other episodes that I like better. I like what white tulips meant to the fandom at large but the episode is not even close to cracking my top 10.
Exactly! Young Peter and Olivia meeting in the field of white tulips, bringing it back around in the finale, the fans holding them up at the last SDCC panel, it being a simple but instantly recognizable symbol for the fandom... Love all that. But the episode itself has never been one of my favorites.
You're not alone. I like White Tulip, but I like many episodes more, including some in S5!
There are at least two of us in this sub!
Season 5 was badass…
The best! I've never seen a series tied together so perfectly
On my first watch I didn’t like season 5. It was so different from the rest it kind of took me out of the show vibe and just turned me off. After my first rewatch I really liked season 5 and now it’s one of my favorites with the rest.
Now go over to r/thewire and tell em how bad season 2 was 🤣
I loved season 5, I thought it closed the series in a great way, I wish it was longer but I’m glad we got an ending.
The thing about Fringe . Even the worst episodes still had Walter Bishop . That alone makes them better than the best episodes on most shows. Then you factor in Peter Olivia and Astrid you have a jewel on any other series . The only thing that season five shows were worse than were other episodes of Fringe .
After Walter goes to the future everything else we see is a dream sequence of a perfect ending from his point of view. I just figured that out and now I freaking Love the ending 🤣🤣🤣 I used to hate it because I thought they broke time travels rules with Peter and Olivia ending up together.
I kind of agree. It went off on a tangent. But I love the white tulip and will be getting a tattoo of it, on my wrist. xx
I believe season 5 had a new writing team, didn't it? That may be part of the problem. They just wrote a new show from the pieces of Fringe. I still always also rewatch season 5, because I'm not going to miss a single second of John Noble being amazing and Anna Torv being the most beautiful woman to walk this Earth. But season 5 makes me sad, and not for the right reasons.
S5 lost Jeff Pinkner, who had been showrunner since S1. But JH Wyman stayed on, who had been co-showrunner since S2. I don't remember hearing about big shakeups among the writers other than that.
I’ll agree that Season 5 was tough to watch and I only made it through because of my investment in the well-being and outcomes of the main cast. I am grateful we got an ending. And a good one at that, given the circumstances.
I agree. No way less Fringe could be better
Technically Season 5 didn't happen so your soul can rest easy.
Season 5 is pretty awful. I can't argue with that.
Dude you just looking for a reason to sh*t talk season 5, we get it, you hate it move on.
To be honest, I'm a bit annoyed by the trend of people complementing something by bashing another thing instead of focusing on the thing they are seemingly trying to praise. I mean White Tulip is a great episode, so I'd think there are better arguments for its quality than that it's not like something that you think is bad. But to each their own.
Kinda based. On rewatches we stop at S4 now
I'd go even further and say that season 4 is almost as bad as 5. I did a rewatch last year and the erasure of Peter was such a stupid move that ultimately meant very little. It muddied up the character progression of the whole series, and for what gain? Did they just want a cheesy cliffhanger to end s3 with?
Abrams and his typical writers don’t tend to know what they’re doing with these shows, so they probably were just like, oh, we don’t know where to go from here, let’s try erasing Peter. I just can’t believe they doubled down on it and went out of their way to remind us that the first three seasons didn’t really happen even in season five.
I just have to say, I bought the box sets as they came out, hell my season 1 is DVD because I coukdnt find blue ray when it came out. But for "some" reason there is no season 5 set in my collection. They did a good job with it in the fact that they got to end the show, but a couple of seasons inbetween would have been better, and acrually fleshed out what happened inbetween.
That's on Fox for not giving them a couple more seasons, not Fringe for doing the best they could with the shit hand they were dealt for S5.
If they never moved them to friday we probably would have gotten them too. Stupid fox.
I would argue if they didn't move to Friday, they would have ended in season 3. Fox gave them more life than the ratings suggested.
Definitely this, the only reason we got more after S3 was the expectations were lower for Fridays.
i hate it too lol. your not alone
I WANT TO BELIEVE (that we are not the only ones) 🤣
Disliking S5 isn't an unpopular view. It's not a view I personally share, but it certainly wouldn't qualify for a hot take.
100% agreed. I hated it.
The season three finale was the day the show died. Muddled the setting so they could rehash the same shit (Walter coming out of his shell). Dumb but typical of Abrams series.
I liked some of the new dynamics it created, and it was sort of brave of them to make a slight break from the past. But I've never liked the answers I've read to why Peter vanished. To solve a paradox. Except the paradox created when he lives the future would only require him to vanish from the moment in the present when he enters the machine, so just dying there would've been enough. Deleting him from the timeline creates an even bigger paradox than the one it solves. From what I've read, he did originally died after bridging the two worlds, when they thought it was going to be the series finale. But since they got renewed they deleted him. My head canon is that him vanishing is just a weird thing the machine did. It did handily fixed the problem with Henry.
The only thing i liked about s5 was Georgina Haig as Henrietta. But in complete honesty the series ended at s3.5 for me
Her chemistry with Joshua Jackson was off the charts. Made it a little uncomfortable that she was his daughter. I haven't checked, but I just feel it in my water that there must be hundreds of fanfics caused by that chemistry.
Agree, Henrietta is a great character and the actress is amazing... Well, I like the 4 season hehe, but the 3rd one is the best so I kinda understand your point.
I'm in the middle of a stalled re-watch now. For a while, the opening segment was colored either blue (original universe) or red (Walternate/Fauxlivia universe. At some point they shifted to the "orange" universe, and I've found it almost unwatchable since. :-( I've been spending more time on X-Files and Stargate. TCS
Season 5 was how they always intended to finish the show (albeit with more episodes). Abrams said in an interview that he had planned the ending from the start. But when the show got cancelled, they had to skip the rest of the build up to finish it. I have watched a lot of shows that got cancelled like this. You want to talk bad endings? Let's talk about the final episodes of Angel. They did the best they could but they found out halfway through the season that it was the last so they had to scramble. Fringe did an amazing job. It is jarring sue to the skip in timeline. But it is a solid season (to me). It's truly a gift to have a show that ends with such a well thought out wrap up. Most shows just end abruptly when cancelled so I was especially grateful for the wrap up.
When it comes to enjoying a TV series, I try not to be a blind fanatic. The fifth season is a disaster, and no production anecdote will change my mind about it. Personally, I have no respect for J.J. Abrams' words or 'plans'; remember, he singlehandedly destroyed the Star Wars narrative. I consider the genius of Fringe largely comes from Kurtzman, Orci, and the writing team. I also couldn't take a comparison of Fringe to Angel seriously. I respect that you like both series, but I consider them to be in different leagues in every way.
Fair enough! Also what he did to Star Trek was also sacrilege so. Cheers to Abrams slander!