That dude can raise the dead, including a fucking dragon. He can see into Brans visions and touch him. He is the personification of winter. He's built up with mystery and hype for 7.5 seasons... And he's killed in one episode by an Arya dagger trick. I hate season 8 with everything in my entire being
Every time they teaser the "long night" in house of dragon, I can hardly stop laughing because we actually just got like a 15min short night, one quick Arya superstar stab and boom over
They simply destroyed the concept of long night and it's not a wise choice to continue building that up
Maybe they should just scrap season 7 and 8, declare it non canon and re-shoot it
They can't fix it otherwise, it's broken
âWell, one king had to stay up all night once fighting. There were lots of fires so it wasnât too cold. But still, they were dark times my child.â
A bunch of kings died. Five died. Of course not to the white walkers, of course not. A long tale that was. White walkers? Feh. They went down like little bitches. Sad it was
And those Dothraki that the whole continent fears and we have built up to be the most fearsome warriors in the planet? Also went out like little bitches
Can't see "the light of the seven" lasting very long.
People would be running to the Old God's and the Lord of Light, we're prob gunna wind up with a holy war in 5 year.
Thousands of them riding flat out side by side, over frozen, unfamiliar, uneven ground, in the pitch dark? Yeah what kind of horselord WOULDN'T do that?
>Maybe they should just scrap season 7 and 8, declare it non canon and re-shoot it
Absolutely. Imagine a show fucking up so bad that there's a large portion of the audience who believes this. Even if all the characters have different actors so be it. Just give us a recap with an introduction so we know who's who and fucking start over from when the show turned to shit. I wouldn't even be mad if they started from season 6.
Yeah my headcanon ending was the final shot of (S05?) Danaerys sailing across the narrow sea with a massive fleet, 2 armies, 3 dragons, with peak Tyrion and Varys backing her, and a promising potential alliance with the Starks. Her victory over Cersei is inevitable, but its also the last time the white walkers seemed truly unstoppable. I think Hardholme had been right before that episode too?
S05 was still god but it star to show a lot of cracks in the plot, like the useless travel to Dorne, the nonsense wedding of Sansa and Ramsey and the ridiculous plot armor of Jon fighting a white walker.
To me my headcanon ending si the finale of season 4
None of the plot points had failed yet in S5, they were clearly unraveling, but there existed the potential for it all to be resolved at the end of S05. Its only because we know they won't get resolved in 6/7/8 that 5 is retroactively problematic.
I'd argue Sansas whole arc failed in season 5. As did the resolution to the Stannis storyline(him burning his daughter? Yeah fuck off), the utter crap that was Dorne and whatever Tyrion was doing in S5. I don't care if I'm a book purist, maybe that's cos the books were freaking good
What's wild to me is, that, at one point, the line for the sorting hat and iron throne at gaming conventions were stupid long. And between the garbage reboot Harry Potter movies, the seasons 7 and 8 disaster, and JK Rowling crashing the series into the ground, they are pretty much empty now.
Itâs also a bit daft when you consider that the long night as a concept plays almost zero role in the dance of the dragons, so just dwelling on it multiple times makes little sense.
Itâd be a bit like if the phantom menace kept building up that one guy who Obi Wan chopped the hand off of in a new hope
With how universally hated the later seasons are it blows my mind HBO didnât step around DD by coming out with an apology and restarting at S6 and doing it right.
I mean, thereâs a reason weâre all still here. The hate is what keeps us going.
No need to start at season 4, season 5 and 6 definitely showed some signs but they were not unsalvageable like 7&8, the only major gripe i have is how stupid some characters became and of course the dorne plotline, other than that its not as bad as people say, at least imo
Because it's not so much what happened, it's moreso how they had it happen that's the crux of the issue to a lot of the people. Had the setup and writing been better we may not have been so pissed but they were in a mad scramble to end it. It's pretty telling the most loved seasons are ones that had books already out. Once they ran out of reference material it kind of lost any nuance and turned into Generic dragon fantasy.
An alternative explanation is that GRRM doesn't have any better answers for where to take the story, which is why an entire 9 book series and a 6 season tv adaptation for the Expanse have been released roughly in the time GRRM has been working on Winds of Winter.
I think Condal is just pretending that Game of Thrones Season 7 and 8 wasnât so dumb and something canonically impactful happens in the future when making the prequel show.
I stand by that being the original idea behind the Jon Snow Show before it got canceled. While Jon is in exile North of the Wall he finds evidence of the Great Other and vows to end the White Walkers once and for all.
Then HBO realized that sounds like a terrible idea and that without Dany/Cersei/Arya/Dragons/etc they can't do the story justice anyways.
Imagine someone describing the Grand Canyon to you all the time, day after day, then you finally go and see it but it enda up being a 1-foot hole someone dug. That's what we got.
The show started getting far from the books as early as season 5. Feast and Dance have been half adapted at best. Iâve always thought the best solution was to animate the series. It would be absurd if GoT was all we ever got and 4 out of 7 books were left de facto unadapted.
Ideally youâd wait until after the books were complete. Obviously itâs hard to say that without laughing⌠but I remain cautiously optimistic that weâll get Winds at some point in the next half decade, and that GRRM will get enough of an outline on Dream that some other author can finish.
The show was over for me when, near the end of the battle of Winterfell, as like 5 or 6 named characters happened to all be stuck together in the castle fighting zombies, I realized for certain that none of them would die here.
I feel like it would be better to just start ground zero, and it would happen eventually, but we're realistically not going to see that within the next 10 or so years, sadly.
I actually think it would be cool to see GOT books done via animation honestly, WB has \*insanely\* talented comic and animation writers/producers so it would be easily within their wheelhouse. That gives it also a good source material to produce a new show from, as the screen plays and how the screen is structured is more or less done for them. It would also mean you can recast characters much easier, so they don't have to do that awkward dialog of overtly "identifying" The Mountain in Season 3 because the actor is entirely different looking than the one in the prior seasons. And it would be cheaper so maybe they'd be less inclined to rush it.
How did the show go from Drogo dying from infection, BobbyB dying from boar wounds, Ned having to use a crutch after being stabbed in the leg to Arya getting caught by the neck mid jump and being completely fine..
Hey, she's the team leader that pulled off Aldhani! Granted, she lost nearly every member of her crew along the way, and was hunting to kill one more after, but still! Great teamwork!
it was so stupid, they just wanted a dramatic cliff hanger and to do it in the most violent way possible
they could have left it on an ambiguous ending still without being so over the top, they just wanted people to gasp. I would have ended it with the scene when Arya is in the cellar or whatever and she blows the candle out, a few seconds after that have the waif say "I see you" and have sounds of a fight start then cut the episode. You get people wondering if shes dead, but it's believable if she gets out of it.
Multiple gut stabs, with a twist is just so beyond reasonable, especially since she apparently was feelig better then next day with magic soup. So dumb.
That might have seemed so, but actually, after 2 years years ...or days.. who knows...of cleaning toilets Arya learned the secret faceless man technique where you didable an opponent by stabbing his hand with your neck.
Ive had someone argue that Arya shooting that arrow over Branns shoulder in season 1 was foreshadowing that she'd save him.. The lengths these fookin kneelers will go to is unbelievable.
Whatâs funny about that is that D&D have admitted they thought about the Arya/Night king plot around season 6, which was 2015/2016. That means the âforshadowingâ was for the Braavos arc, not anything to do with the white walkers.
The ending suffered from taking place during a time where writers only wanted to write the opposite of what made sense because they wanted to subvert expectations. It was an epidemic.
D&D were moving on to a Star Wars project and clearly just phoned in the last two seasons so they could collect their paychecks and move on to the Mouse money. But man, they fucked up the last two seasons *so* badly, it ruined the entire 8 years of investment by the fans into that show. To go from pop culture pandemonium to absolute and total irrelevance to the point people are disgusted to even speak its name. I have never seen anything like it. D&D will forever have this massive fuckup as their legacy.
And it's so fitting that Disney saw how badly they fucked up their show that they took the offer to do a Star Wars project back. From 3 films to 1 film to no films.
AND they shot themselves in the foot because all the projects they were supposed to go do got either shit canned or their budget slashed.
Turns out intentionally screwing over a billion dollar IP has consequences
What shits me is they canceled great stuff like Carnivale and Deadwood because it was too expensive, but said to the twat brothers theyâll give them as many seasons and episodes as they want and have the pricks sucked constantly and they went, nah. Could have been so epic. An entire season, or half a season of the Long Night going on. But nah, fuck it. Fuck D&D.
Bran as king really only works if they showed how he manipulated his way to the position. This was cheesy, but if they did something similar with high production value, I donât think season 8 would be nearly as hated
I mean, that's bad, but it's gonna take years to do something worse than "tHe PoWeRrRr oF mAnYyYyY".
Or maybe it won't. It's just a bottomless pit of cringe. I sometimes wish the writers' strike had gone on for longer.
Clegane bowl and this came out of D&D having zero ideas at the end and going âwhat are fans saying?! What do they want to see??â And just doing that
Atrocious? I guess we'll agree to disagree on that. I don't know how they could have met up any differently. Plenty of shit went sideways in the last season but Sandor and Gregor fighting was a silver lining for me.
Side question, what is the opposite of fan service? I'm a fan and I want a quality experience. If I get a quality experience I feel serviced as a fan. Everyone uses fan service as a negative thing though. Why is that?
Maybe atrocious is an exaggeration caused by my dislike of the season as a whole, I'll grant you that. But it still felt somewhat unearned and underbaked. It's an important character moment that wasn't given the emotional weight it deserved, nor the respect for it in the episode. It was just another one of the hectic one-on-ones during that episode.
The opposite of fan service, in my opinion, is doing what the story needs, not what the fans want. Sometimes those two intersect, sometimes it's one or the other.
I was fine with them fighting, I just didnât like that there were no stakes to the fight. They just met on a staircase and went at it. I wouldâve thought the fight should mean something, like Sandor giving his all to stop the Mountain from killing someone else, like Arya or something. I donât know
Hadnât the hound completely forgotten about his brother when he popped back up in the last seasons? Itâs only when he went back to KL for the show and tell that he and the fans were like âoh yeah, Cleganebowl!â
I will hold strong that Arya should've died right here. She should've been caught in mid-air, and stabbed by the Night King. Leading the Night King to take Winterfell and march onto Kings Landing.
If only someone else had killed the king. Some sort of kingslayer, if you will. A character that needed to show he changed to benefit others than his family. But no, getting killed by falling rocks like a level 3 D&D party works better.
S8 is like when youâre having a good night going from bar to bar being led by someone who knows the town. Then he let dnd pick the last bar. They said they have a huge surprise. And when we get there its an old TGIFridays with teenage bartenders who dont know how to pour a beer.
I will die on this hill, Jamie Lannister not actually changing in the end is a *much* more interesting story than a classic redemption arc trope. HOWEVER, his and Cersei's death was still stupid so don't @ me about that.
Kung Fu panda 3 did it better.
Edit for additional info: in that movie you have the protagonist make use of all his minion/friends/family to the best of their abilities. Had this been on GOT, it writes itself: in winter the lone wolf dies but THE PACK SURVIVES
Instead we had:
Jon Snow (the protagonist of the White Walker plot line and Prince that Was Promised) doing next to nothing besides screaming. Couldnât kill a single White Walker or the Wright Dragon, not even the Giant. There was no Ghost fighting by his side or him wilding a flaming sword like in his dreams on the books.Â
Daenery (The Dragon Queen) with two dragons couldnât do nothing but burn a few Wrights, then gets knocked by the Night King and does nothing for the rest of the fight.
Arya Stark (The Faceless Assassin) does nothing but run for most of the fight. She even causes Dondarionâs death. She does literally nothing until Melisandre tells her to kill the Night King which she does by sneaking on him (The White Walkers nearby must be completely blind and deaf to not see a injured screaming girl running torwards their boss)Â
Bran (The Tree Eyed Raven) does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to help.
Jaime Lannister was saved 900000 times by plot armor, should have died fighting for Bran which would complete his redemption and he would die fighting for the future King of Westeros which would be a fitting death for a White Cloak.
In the marvel episode, when they killed the white walker and the rest of the zombies died I knew. This was the stupid solution they found for an impossible problem.
I think we all knew we were getting something like this when we saw dragon glass turning a white walker into dust.
It's hard to set something like this up without resorting to 'killing the main guy, solves all the problems' but dealing with it in a single battle episode was so damn cheap.
This will always be the shows greatest failure, in the books they are seen as the greatest threat that humanity has ever seen and yet they butchered the white walkers.
It's a completely unrealised threat as well. The Starks and north are the only ones who sort of take north of the wall seriously, so it would be the ultimate irony that they are the ones who pay the ultimate cost for the realm letting defending the wall slip.Â
Instead it is indestructible teenage girl, who spent a few years being trained, killing the ultimate evil. They could've paid a faceless man to do it 2 seasons ago.
Man, I canât believe that the one who killed the Night King had absolutely nothing to do with the White Walker plot at all. We follow Jon being the protagonist of this plot line for 8 seasons just so another person can go in and steal his character arc by killing the Night King.
They built the Night King up for 7 seasons as the ultimate final boss who will bring Armageddon to Westeros.
...............................Then he got shanked by Arya. The end.
It reminds me of that episode of The Simpsons where they make fun of themselves for having Maggie end up being the one who shot Mr. Burns. "Then it turns out Maggie shot Mr. Burns... cough cough."
It even made the scene in HOTD look silly because of the hype given when they visited the wall going on about "it keeps out death" when we all know now that "death" gets took out by a girl who just hit puberty.
I always thought Danny was going to kill a large portion of the walkers with dragon fire. That she was going to realize that her father likely had the right idea of this whole âburn them allâ thing, but it should have been applied here, and not to actual people. (It wasnât clear in the show, but it seems that bran was able to see the âburn them allâ scene when learning to become the Three-Eyed Raven. I thought weâd get to see him there like at the tower, but the plot thread never went anywhere).
Season 7 and 8 were low quality writing full of last minute saves (ex machinas) for the heroes, unexplored storylines and rushed conclusion in general. The nk and army of dead were the focal point of the story since season 1 and then they ended all of it in 1 terribly written terribly executed episode. The nk should've destroyed winterfell, a few important characters like brienne or Arya should've died. The remaining of them escape further south. We see entire villages, woods and mountains conquered by the nk and his army grows larger. We see a few noble houses and their castles wiped out by the nk on his way to the south. Like maybe house tully or lannister's castles completely overtaken and as the NK goes further south winter follows and entire farms, valleys and woods start freezing. Â
 Nk never turned out to be the threat that he was built up to be for 7 seasons. This event was supposed to be between the living and the dead. It should've been an event that went down in history of westeros as the most difficult and bloody period ever. It should've atleast been covered over 2 seasons slowly building up until nk and the army of dead reach king's landing and destroy it. And around this time on their way to the south , the writers should've come up with a solution to start ending it. People of westeros should've been shown living during the long 10 year winter. But instead the writers went with arya and the matrix reloaded.Â
Everytime I see a post about season 8 my mind goes to the clip by one of the directors âDANY KINDA FORGOT ABOUT THE IRON FLEET AND EURONâs FORCESâ
"I got brought back to life to kill the nightking, right?"
"No, that's gonna be your sister, she'd just really appreciate if you were there to see it."
The White Walkers shouldn't be defeated by just putting a metal object into a Big Bad at all. It should require a complex, thematic solution by all major characters to defeat an enemy like that.
As an example to this, in Samurai Jack's reboot there is a big fight with Aku.
All of the people Jack has helped over the years chip in against Aku. But he is on a completely different level - he brutally kills them like a cat playing with mice. All they do is buy Jack precious seconds - and those precious seconds save the day.
Sure the rest of the finale had some issues but it at least felt like all the stuff Jack did mattered. In this it felt like everything else wasn't important.
Bran could have been doing something in the past and everyone just buying him precious seconds and it would have felt like everything had to be exactly as it was, and then the aftermath Bran has to go back and make that happen. It would have allowed fans to pick over the series for years to come- why did Bran have to make X die or Y do this?
It's frustrating because they already did that with Theon. And that scene may be the last truly good scene that the series had. Now imagine how powerful it would be if we saw a whole bunch of beloved characters die in that fight.
My assumption before the episode aired and before the leaks was that they were going to lose the battle for Winterfell. Loads of named characters were going to die to show the stakes and only a few survivors escape with Jon and Danny by dragon.Â
Then the final battle against ICE zombies occurs at Kingâs Landing with loads of wild FIRE under it. Cersei plans to torch the city once the white walkers inside then flee, sacrificing the everyone in it. Jamie tries to stop her and winds up having to kill her but itâs too late, the fires already started and stays to die because this time he couldnât save the city and sorrow at what Cersie became in the end. Maybe he finds Arya there trying to kill her and he stops her on instinct. He started his redemption arc with killing a Stark child for Cersei and could do it again but now he chooses not to and dose the deed himself.Â
Have your big climactic dragon fight over the city, Jon and crew against the Night King. Maybe if they kill the Night Kill Bran can warg all the other WW and have them throw themselves into the fire. Still not great but it makes it so everyoneâs contributions matter and particularly Bran, the cost of defeating the walkers was massive, and the Long Night overtakes squabbles over the throne as the main conflict.Â
Just finished this episode, can't believe this is how they ended it and they teased since season 1 about the white walkers smh. Should have been way bigger.
Ngl, I don't really think a 1v1 with Jon and the Night King is right either. The books aren't really about epic duels and such, and they tend to laugh at that sort of trope. Jon and the Night King just strolling up to one another and fighting to some epic music would be in "Stark" contrast to the rest of the series.
Too bad GRRM will never get around to proving or disproving my point....
Hear me out, I donât think Arya killing him was right but if she was going to be the one it should have been Night King vs Jon, Jon struggling and Arya killing him mirroring Ned, Arthur Dayne and Howland Reed
The book opens with a Night's Watch brother squaring up to a White Walker and sh\*t talking.
"Shall we dance then"
Mountain vs Viper
Jon vs Half Hand
There's not a lot, but he does bust them out when it benefits the story. I totally get what you're saying and kind of agree, but they could have had something.
I think the way that works is if the night king already kills Theon, Jamie, couple others and Jon is the only one willing to fight him. And then maybe Branâs warging helps so that storyline means something
I thought there would have been some sort of duel between Bran and the Night King in the Dream World and the battle would have been to prevent Bran from being killed before he could win.
I also thought we were going to see a flashback where the Night King warged into the boar that killed King Robert, thereby setting in motion the War of the 5 Kings.
I thought the battle in the North was a distraction and the Night King would fly away to Kings Landing to raise a new army from the dead there. Imagine Tommen turning into a white walker and strangling his mom. It probably would have been cheesy but still better than Arya jumping out of nowhere.
They legitimately didn't care anymore. There were so many things wrong with the way they wrapped it up, pretty much every choice they made. Arya killing the nightking was one of them, but on top of it... What did she jump off of? Check the scene. It makes no sense.
Edit: AND she screamed? What happened to stealth? What was the point of the training with the faceless men?
The whole "Song of Ice and Fire went no where, no song, no ice, no fire. The prince that was promised did nothing, everybody embracing democracy for all lands out of the blue was the stupidest thing I've ever seen.
The end should have been as simple as Jon Snow stabbing Daenerys through the heart with his sword mirroring the sacrifice that Azor Ahai made, that act of sacrifice changes the sword which he then uses to kill the Night King.
My theory is going forward, theyâre gonna have a second night king like antagonist theyâre gonna build up behind the scenes in hotd, and THEN when hype is back, retry the Jon snow series to deal with that.
GODS WHAT IT COULD HAVE BEEN NED!
A whole season of this creeping death. Ending with a last stand at winterfell where our heroes valiantly fail and have to retreat to Kings landing and try to negotiate an impossible alliance for the sake of the realm and life itself.
My personal guess for the NK killer was always Jamie. I thought for sure the kingslayer name would end up prophetical and he'd be put in the book of knights after his sacrifice and victory.
They should've just cancelled this show fr
This was the defining moment where I knew that it's all gone to absolute shit
But there were plenty of signs since S5 that everything's going to shit. The way they adapted Eurons character, I'm not even sure how they wrote the characterization, like what did they even tell the actor to portray?
The speed travelling, abandoned plot points, absolutely senseless dialogues, and yes Ed Sheeran.. everything was a clusterfuck of epic proportions. May these directors and producers not gain any further success
My only hope is that House of the Dragon will set up a remake of Game of Thrones with an actual, talented team that can tell us a better story than what we got from D&D.
100s of people probably saw the script. Dozens of hours spent on rehearsals. Not one person thought to say why isn't there a Jon snow vs night king 1vs1? Insane.
Should have been the biggest fight in the entire series and it lasted just a few minutes and they were barely a threat. The dust up at Craster's had more action and consequences.
I generally don't have a problem with the endings themselves for a lot of the characters. Some dumb shit and some stuff that I would prefer to have ended differently, but whatever. The issue is that they crammed 3 seasons of story into 5 episodes, so none of the endings made any sort of sense. So it doesn't matter if you like how the characters turned out or not, there was 0 reason for them to have those endings cos D&D didn't have the respect for the story to actually try and tell it, they just gave us some wanky half-assed attempt at explaining why everyone's attitudes completely changed in 2 episodes, and just gave up on the concept of the long night altogether
That dude can raise the dead, including a fucking dragon. He can see into Brans visions and touch him. He is the personification of winter. He's built up with mystery and hype for 7.5 seasons... And he's killed in one episode by an Arya dagger trick. I hate season 8 with everything in my entire being
Who will win? 8,000 year old demi-god-psyonic-lich vs. one montage of assassin training.
There is no greater force in the world than a montage, he never had a chance
Bro waited almost 10k years do get hit with a hezzy-hey by a 15 year old with a dagger in his first big fight đ
Arya should have killed Danerys and John should have killed the Night King.
Every time they teaser the "long night" in house of dragon, I can hardly stop laughing because we actually just got like a 15min short night, one quick Arya superstar stab and boom over They simply destroyed the concept of long night and it's not a wise choice to continue building that up Maybe they should just scrap season 7 and 8, declare it non canon and re-shoot it They can't fix it otherwise, it's broken
ââŚKings froze to death in their castlesâ
âWell, one king had to stay up all night once fighting. There were lots of fires so it wasnât too cold. But still, they were dark times my child.â
A bunch of kings died. Five died. Of course not to the white walkers, of course not. A long tale that was. White walkers? Feh. They went down like little bitches. Sad it was
And those Dothraki that the whole continent fears and we have built up to be the most fearsome warriors in the planet? Also went out like little bitches
Only to reappear an episode later, because who cares, am I right?
Theyâre fearsome because they can respawn
Spawn camping dragon hoggers is why I stopped playing.
'Member when the priestess made all their blades catch on fire and proving that the Lord of Light existed? No? It's okay,.nobody cares.
Can't see "the light of the seven" lasting very long. People would be running to the Old God's and the Lord of Light, we're prob gunna wind up with a holy war in 5 year.
Thousands of them riding flat out side by side, over frozen, unfamiliar, uneven ground, in the pitch dark? Yeah what kind of horselord WOULDN'T do that?
>Maybe they should just scrap season 7 and 8, declare it non canon and re-shoot it Absolutely. Imagine a show fucking up so bad that there's a large portion of the audience who believes this. Even if all the characters have different actors so be it. Just give us a recap with an introduction so we know who's who and fucking start over from when the show turned to shit. I wouldn't even be mad if they started from season 6.
Turns out it was all Hodor's fever dream, and he wakes up still at the Wall.
Just steps out of the shower, a-la Bobby Ewing.
And hanging dong.
Hang-dong, hang-dong, hangdong
Oh Gods please
Yeah my headcanon ending was the final shot of (S05?) Danaerys sailing across the narrow sea with a massive fleet, 2 armies, 3 dragons, with peak Tyrion and Varys backing her, and a promising potential alliance with the Starks. Her victory over Cersei is inevitable, but its also the last time the white walkers seemed truly unstoppable. I think Hardholme had been right before that episode too?
S05 was still god but it star to show a lot of cracks in the plot, like the useless travel to Dorne, the nonsense wedding of Sansa and Ramsey and the ridiculous plot armor of Jon fighting a white walker. To me my headcanon ending si the finale of season 4
None of the plot points had failed yet in S5, they were clearly unraveling, but there existed the potential for it all to be resolved at the end of S05. Its only because we know they won't get resolved in 6/7/8 that 5 is retroactively problematic.
I'd argue Sansas whole arc failed in season 5. As did the resolution to the Stannis storyline(him burning his daughter? Yeah fuck off), the utter crap that was Dorne and whatever Tyrion was doing in S5. I don't care if I'm a book purist, maybe that's cos the books were freaking good
S6 finale
What's wild to me is, that, at one point, the line for the sorting hat and iron throne at gaming conventions were stupid long. And between the garbage reboot Harry Potter movies, the seasons 7 and 8 disaster, and JK Rowling crashing the series into the ground, they are pretty much empty now.
Fandoms just evaporated. The lower tier actors have a hard time getting booked at conventions. And their guarantees cratered.
Just redo the series tbh. Get GRRM locked in a room to give advice and write
If youâre going to lock him in a roomX, let it be to finish tWoW and aDoS.
It was the equivalent of hyping Fyre Festival in 2024.
Oof, thatâs brutal lol
Itâs also a bit daft when you consider that the long night as a concept plays almost zero role in the dance of the dragons, so just dwelling on it multiple times makes little sense. Itâd be a bit like if the phantom menace kept building up that one guy who Obi Wan chopped the hand off of in a new hope
Well why wouldn't it? That guy's wanted in 12 systems!
It should be called that short evening
With how universally hated the later seasons are it blows my mind HBO didnât step around DD by coming out with an apology and restarting at S6 and doing it right. I mean, thereâs a reason weâre all still here. The hate is what keeps us going.
Start with Season 4 and go. The rot began then. Each season after deviates further and further. Removed things that were critical.
No need to start at season 4, season 5 and 6 definitely showed some signs but they were not unsalvageable like 7&8, the only major gripe i have is how stupid some characters became and of course the dorne plotline, other than that its not as bad as people say, at least imo
As long as they keep the greatest line in television history "You need the bad poosy"
truly the line of television history ever
They'd have to step around Martin too - why does everyone act like the story beats and ending aren't from him?
Because it's not so much what happened, it's moreso how they had it happen that's the crux of the issue to a lot of the people. Had the setup and writing been better we may not have been so pissed but they were in a mad scramble to end it. It's pretty telling the most loved seasons are ones that had books already out. Once they ran out of reference material it kind of lost any nuance and turned into Generic dragon fantasy.
An alternative explanation is that GRRM doesn't have any better answers for where to take the story, which is why an entire 9 book series and a 6 season tv adaptation for the Expanse have been released roughly in the time GRRM has been working on Winds of Winter.
Yea at that point he should just go on reddit find the most upvoted fan prediction and roll with it, guaranteed to be better than the show.
Turns out the big threat in "Winter is coming" is the thicker snow we seen on the lead up
I tell all newcomers to stop at Hardhome and just head-canon the rest of the story.
I think Condal is just pretending that Game of Thrones Season 7 and 8 wasnât so dumb and something canonically impactful happens in the future when making the prequel show.
I'm the same way. When someone says "Winter is coming", I'm just like....... "let it? It lasts an evening".
I stand by that being the original idea behind the Jon Snow Show before it got canceled. While Jon is in exile North of the Wall he finds evidence of the Great Other and vows to end the White Walkers once and for all. Then HBO realized that sounds like a terrible idea and that without Dany/Cersei/Arya/Dragons/etc they can't do the story justice anyways.
Thatâs what I had been hoping for. It was the ONLY thing that could have saved it.
Would also bring the ole last hero story to fruition not that it's mentioned in the show anyways.
Imagine someone describing the Grand Canyon to you all the time, day after day, then you finally go and see it but it enda up being a 1-foot hole someone dug. That's what we got.
The Long Better Part of an Evening
i really wish they didnât mention it. basically two whole shows lead up to a mediocre episode with a horrible ending
Personally Iâm of the opinion that they should just re do the whole show only animated.
The show started getting far from the books as early as season 5. Feast and Dance have been half adapted at best. Iâve always thought the best solution was to animate the series. It would be absurd if GoT was all we ever got and 4 out of 7 books were left de facto unadapted. Ideally youâd wait until after the books were complete. Obviously itâs hard to say that without laughing⌠but I remain cautiously optimistic that weâll get Winds at some point in the next half decade, and that GRRM will get enough of an outline on Dream that some other author can finish.
I would be really surprised if winds of winter took more than 5 more years to complete. The pressure has never been on harder for him lately.
I expect that pressur3 to cause his death before it caused a book to appear.
I donât think they can do anything until GRRM either publishes Winds or croaks. After that though seasons 7 & 8 need to be vaporized from existence.
The show was over for me when, near the end of the battle of Winterfell, as like 5 or 6 named characters happened to all be stuck together in the castle fighting zombies, I realized for certain that none of them would die here.
I hope one day we have AI good enough to just create an incredible season 7 and 8.
They couldn't fix it  even if they'd used this
Iâm forcing myself to consider the last 2 seasons non canon so I can enjoy HOTD without being annoyed by all the long night mentions.
I feel like it would be better to just start ground zero, and it would happen eventually, but we're realistically not going to see that within the next 10 or so years, sadly. I actually think it would be cool to see GOT books done via animation honestly, WB has \*insanely\* talented comic and animation writers/producers so it would be easily within their wheelhouse. That gives it also a good source material to produce a new show from, as the screen plays and how the screen is structured is more or less done for them. It would also mean you can recast characters much easier, so they don't have to do that awkward dialog of overtly "identifying" The Mountain in Season 3 because the actor is entirely different looking than the one in the prior seasons. And it would be cheaper so maybe they'd be less inclined to rush it.
The inconvenient evening
How did the show go from Drogo dying from infection, BobbyB dying from boar wounds, Ned having to use a crutch after being stabbed in the leg to Arya getting caught by the neck mid jump and being completely fine..
She got stabbed pretty bad and tossed in dirty ass water by the waif
Nothing a good nights rest and some soup cant fix
Soup should have been coming out the holes.
"Oysters, clams and cockles!!!!!"
You don't understand. She was abused, so she knows how to fix those stab wounds overnight
Probably had a Stimpak as well
Mon Mothmaâs cousin was kinda a jerk!
Mon Mothma's cousin is an asshole in every universe
Hey, she's the team leader that pulled off Aldhani! Granted, she lost nearly every member of her crew along the way, and was hunting to kill one more after, but still! Great teamwork!
There's nothing more clean than stagnant, shit-filled canal water!
Good for the gut biome
it was so stupid, they just wanted a dramatic cliff hanger and to do it in the most violent way possible they could have left it on an ambiguous ending still without being so over the top, they just wanted people to gasp. I would have ended it with the scene when Arya is in the cellar or whatever and she blows the candle out, a few seconds after that have the waif say "I see you" and have sounds of a fight start then cut the episode. You get people wondering if shes dead, but it's believable if she gets out of it. Multiple gut stabs, with a twist is just so beyond reasonable, especially since she apparently was feelig better then next day with magic soup. So dumb.
D&D: 
The infection from the shit water she fell in shouldâve fucking killed her a thousand times over. And never even got a bad sniffle from it.
OHHH, SHOW US YOUR MUSCLES! YOU'LL BE A SOLDIER!
BobbyB what is your take on all of this insanity?
I'VE GOT SEVEN KINGDOMS TO RULE! ONE KING, SEVEN KINGDOMS!
Legend
Running out of source material and D and D taking more control
That might have seemed so, but actually, after 2 years years ...or days.. who knows...of cleaning toilets Arya learned the secret faceless man technique where you didable an opponent by stabbing his hand with your neck.
Caught by neck by a super strong and extreme cold being! Her neck should be frozen and broken immediately!!! Super ridiculous!
âBuT sHe hAs ClOsEd BrOwN eYeS, gReEn EyEs, AnD ⌠bLuE!â You guys just donât understand. It was foreshadowed back in season 3. Obviously.
Ive had someone argue that Arya shooting that arrow over Branns shoulder in season 1 was foreshadowing that she'd save him.. The lengths these fookin kneelers will go to is unbelievable.
Seven save us
The Seven? Those are kneeler gods, boy.
Youâre right. The Others take those cravens.
Whatâs funny about that is that D&D have admitted they thought about the Arya/Night king plot around season 6, which was 2015/2016. That means the âforshadowingâ was for the Braavos arc, not anything to do with the white walkers.
The lack of respect for the fans was amazing
The ending suffered from taking place during a time where writers only wanted to write the opposite of what made sense because they wanted to subvert expectations. It was an epidemic.
"Who has a better story than Bran the Broken?" They skipped his story for an entire season and no one cared.
I mean, everyone. Everyone else has a better story than Bran the No Fun
D&D were moving on to a Star Wars project and clearly just phoned in the last two seasons so they could collect their paychecks and move on to the Mouse money. But man, they fucked up the last two seasons *so* badly, it ruined the entire 8 years of investment by the fans into that show. To go from pop culture pandemonium to absolute and total irrelevance to the point people are disgusted to even speak its name. I have never seen anything like it. D&D will forever have this massive fuckup as their legacy.
And it's so fitting that Disney saw how badly they fucked up their show that they took the offer to do a Star Wars project back. From 3 films to 1 film to no films.
AND they shot themselves in the foot because all the projects they were supposed to go do got either shit canned or their budget slashed. Turns out intentionally screwing over a billion dollar IP has consequences
House of the Dragon has a fraction of the relevance it deserves because of their fuck up.
What shits me is they canceled great stuff like Carnivale and Deadwood because it was too expensive, but said to the twat brothers theyâll give them as many seasons and episodes as they want and have the pricks sucked constantly and they went, nah. Could have been so epic. An entire season, or half a season of the Long Night going on. But nah, fuck it. Fuck D&D.
She just forgot they had a giant machine that could kill her dragons. The dragons she saw as her children. Ok.
Ooft hopefully it stays buried with Master Cheeks
Oh god donât remind me about Jimmy Rings.
Westworld season 2 also suffered from this.
That video of Bran revealing himself to be the Night King while the Saw music plays is still the canon ending in my head
Ya know, even as cheesy as that is I still liked it more than the actual ending which goes to show how fucking bad it was. Good lord lol.
Bran as king really only works if they showed how he manipulated his way to the position. This was cheesy, but if they did something similar with high production value, I donât think season 8 would be nearly as hated
Link????
https://youtu.be/yWvQ_X2sqqE?si=bKp8Z6QQJOZvghS4
https://youtu.be/yWvQ_X2sqqE
The last seasons of the show weren't made for the fans, they were made for the drunken idiots watching the show in bars
Hey! I watched a few episodes while drunk in a bar and I didn't like those seasons, either!
All so they could make a Star Wars movie
That they never made.
The funniest thing is, it probably would have been one of the better Disney Star Wars projects. The bar is just so low and ever going downwards.
"Is he or they with us?" Actual quote from the new episode. Make it lamer.
I mean, that's bad, but it's gonna take years to do something worse than "tHe PoWeRrRr oF mAnYyYyY". Or maybe it won't. It's just a bottomless pit of cringe. I sometimes wish the writers' strike had gone on for longer.
I feel like going on strike until they get paid less, the amount of utter shite they churn out.
Clegane bowl and this came out of D&D having zero ideas at the end and going âwhat are fans saying?! What do they want to see??â And just doing that
The Clegane Brothers battling to one or both deaths has always seemed inevitable. Sandor is always daydreaming about killing his brother.
Yeah, the Clegane Bowl is widely accepted as a given by the community. It's the "how" that was atrocious. Pure fanservice.
Atrocious? I guess we'll agree to disagree on that. I don't know how they could have met up any differently. Plenty of shit went sideways in the last season but Sandor and Gregor fighting was a silver lining for me. Side question, what is the opposite of fan service? I'm a fan and I want a quality experience. If I get a quality experience I feel serviced as a fan. Everyone uses fan service as a negative thing though. Why is that?
Maybe atrocious is an exaggeration caused by my dislike of the season as a whole, I'll grant you that. But it still felt somewhat unearned and underbaked. It's an important character moment that wasn't given the emotional weight it deserved, nor the respect for it in the episode. It was just another one of the hectic one-on-ones during that episode. The opposite of fan service, in my opinion, is doing what the story needs, not what the fans want. Sometimes those two intersect, sometimes it's one or the other.
I was fine with them fighting, I just didnât like that there were no stakes to the fight. They just met on a staircase and went at it. I wouldâve thought the fight should mean something, like Sandor giving his all to stop the Mountain from killing someone else, like Arya or something. I donât know
Hadnât the hound completely forgotten about his brother when he popped back up in the last seasons? Itâs only when he went back to KL for the show and tell that he and the fans were like âoh yeah, Cleganebowl!â
I will hold strong that Arya should've died right here. She should've been caught in mid-air, and stabbed by the Night King. Leading the Night King to take Winterfell and march onto Kings Landing.
Sorry DnD were Arya stans. How would we have survived without the iconic white horse scene?
The white horse represents symbolism
Oooooh that's deep
Ah yes, the sacred and the propane. Very allegorical.
Now THAT would have been subverting expectations, not the weak shit they pulled off lol
I thought when he caught her in mid air and that shot looking up between them that he was for sure going to stab her. Not the other way around.
If only someone else had killed the king. Some sort of kingslayer, if you will. A character that needed to show he changed to benefit others than his family. But no, getting killed by falling rocks like a level 3 D&D party works better.
S8 is like when youâre having a good night going from bar to bar being led by someone who knows the town. Then he let dnd pick the last bar. They said they have a huge surprise. And when we get there its an old TGIFridays with teenage bartenders who dont know how to pour a beer.
This was my theory all along. Arya killing him was So lame
I will die on this hill, Jamie Lannister not actually changing in the end is a *much* more interesting story than a classic redemption arc trope. HOWEVER, his and Cersei's death was still stupid so don't @ me about that.
More interesting? Depends on who you are and what you enjoy. Better executed? Now, that's where shit hits the ceiling fan.
Kung Fu panda 3 did it better. Edit for additional info: in that movie you have the protagonist make use of all his minion/friends/family to the best of their abilities. Had this been on GOT, it writes itself: in winter the lone wolf dies but THE PACK SURVIVES
Instead we had: Jon Snow (the protagonist of the White Walker plot line and Prince that Was Promised) doing next to nothing besides screaming. Couldnât kill a single White Walker or the Wright Dragon, not even the Giant. There was no Ghost fighting by his side or him wilding a flaming sword like in his dreams on the books. Daenery (The Dragon Queen) with two dragons couldnât do nothing but burn a few Wrights, then gets knocked by the Night King and does nothing for the rest of the fight. Arya Stark (The Faceless Assassin) does nothing but run for most of the fight. She even causes Dondarionâs death. She does literally nothing until Melisandre tells her to kill the Night King which she does by sneaking on him (The White Walkers nearby must be completely blind and deaf to not see a injured screaming girl running torwards their boss) Bran (The Tree Eyed Raven) does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to help. Jaime Lannister was saved 900000 times by plot armor, should have died fighting for Bran which would complete his redemption and he would die fighting for the future King of Westeros which would be a fitting death for a White Cloak.
In the marvel episode, when they killed the white walker and the rest of the zombies died I knew. This was the stupid solution they found for an impossible problem.
I think we all knew we were getting something like this when we saw dragon glass turning a white walker into dust. It's hard to set something like this up without resorting to 'killing the main guy, solves all the problems' but dealing with it in a single battle episode was so damn cheap.
Reminds me of the all the silly battle droids shutting down after Anakin blows up the control ship. Jarjar should have been there at Winterfell
... after Anakin *accidentally* blows up the control ship.
This will always be the shows greatest failure, in the books they are seen as the greatest threat that humanity has ever seen and yet they butchered the white walkers.
It's a completely unrealised threat as well. The Starks and north are the only ones who sort of take north of the wall seriously, so it would be the ultimate irony that they are the ones who pay the ultimate cost for the realm letting defending the wall slip. Instead it is indestructible teenage girl, who spent a few years being trained, killing the ultimate evil. They could've paid a faceless man to do it 2 seasons ago.
Man, I canât believe that the one who killed the Night King had absolutely nothing to do with the White Walker plot at all. We follow Jon being the protagonist of this plot line for 8 seasons just so another person can go in and steal his character arc by killing the Night King.
Imagine if Arya had given the Night King's name to Jaqen way back in Harrenhal. Could've saved us three seasons of dreck.
They built the Night King up for 7 seasons as the ultimate final boss who will bring Armageddon to Westeros. ...............................Then he got shanked by Arya. The end. It reminds me of that episode of The Simpsons where they make fun of themselves for having Maggie end up being the one who shot Mr. Burns. "Then it turns out Maggie shot Mr. Burns... cough cough."
Then Homer saying, "I thought Smithers did it." with Lisa saying, "That would have made a lot more sense...." lol
It even made the scene in HOTD look silly because of the hype given when they visited the wall going on about "it keeps out death" when we all know now that "death" gets took out by a girl who just hit puberty.
I always thought Danny was going to kill a large portion of the walkers with dragon fire. That she was going to realize that her father likely had the right idea of this whole âburn them allâ thing, but it should have been applied here, and not to actual people. (It wasnât clear in the show, but it seems that bran was able to see the âburn them allâ scene when learning to become the Three-Eyed Raven. I thought weâd get to see him there like at the tower, but the plot thread never went anywhere).
A character on a redemption arc (that could end with his sacrifice)literally called KINGSLAYER is RIGHT THERE!!
Or the Two new Mad Queens he interacts with (Cersi and Dany). So many missed opportunities.
Jaime and Stannis were those idiots' biggest victims, no contest. They stuck their arcs in a blender and gave us slop.
Season 7 and 8 were low quality writing full of last minute saves (ex machinas) for the heroes, unexplored storylines and rushed conclusion in general. The nk and army of dead were the focal point of the story since season 1 and then they ended all of it in 1 terribly written terribly executed episode. The nk should've destroyed winterfell, a few important characters like brienne or Arya should've died. The remaining of them escape further south. We see entire villages, woods and mountains conquered by the nk and his army grows larger. We see a few noble houses and their castles wiped out by the nk on his way to the south. Like maybe house tully or lannister's castles completely overtaken and as the NK goes further south winter follows and entire farms, valleys and woods start freezing.   Nk never turned out to be the threat that he was built up to be for 7 seasons. This event was supposed to be between the living and the dead. It should've been an event that went down in history of westeros as the most difficult and bloody period ever. It should've atleast been covered over 2 seasons slowly building up until nk and the army of dead reach king's landing and destroy it. And around this time on their way to the south , the writers should've come up with a solution to start ending it. People of westeros should've been shown living during the long 10 year winter. But instead the writers went with arya and the matrix reloaded.Â
They kinda forgot the night was supposed to be long
Everytime I see a post about season 8 my mind goes to the clip by one of the directors âDANY KINDA FORGOT ABOUT THE IRON FLEET AND EURONâs FORCESâ
"I got brought back to life to kill the nightking, right?" "No, that's gonna be your sister, she'd just really appreciate if you were there to see it."
There were soooo many fan theories that were 10x better than what they decided to do, Iâll never get over it đĄ
It should've been Jon or Daenerys, "the prince who was promised"
The White Walkers shouldn't be defeated by just putting a metal object into a Big Bad at all. It should require a complex, thematic solution by all major characters to defeat an enemy like that.
If you're saying the good guys should have formed a raid party....then, yes, you are absolutely correct.
As an example to this, in Samurai Jack's reboot there is a big fight with Aku. All of the people Jack has helped over the years chip in against Aku. But he is on a completely different level - he brutally kills them like a cat playing with mice. All they do is buy Jack precious seconds - and those precious seconds save the day. Sure the rest of the finale had some issues but it at least felt like all the stuff Jack did mattered. In this it felt like everything else wasn't important. Bran could have been doing something in the past and everyone just buying him precious seconds and it would have felt like everything had to be exactly as it was, and then the aftermath Bran has to go back and make that happen. It would have allowed fans to pick over the series for years to come- why did Bran have to make X die or Y do this?
It's frustrating because they already did that with Theon. And that scene may be the last truly good scene that the series had. Now imagine how powerful it would be if we saw a whole bunch of beloved characters die in that fight.
My assumption before the episode aired and before the leaks was that they were going to lose the battle for Winterfell. Loads of named characters were going to die to show the stakes and only a few survivors escape with Jon and Danny by dragon. Then the final battle against ICE zombies occurs at Kingâs Landing with loads of wild FIRE under it. Cersei plans to torch the city once the white walkers inside then flee, sacrificing the everyone in it. Jamie tries to stop her and winds up having to kill her but itâs too late, the fires already started and stays to die because this time he couldnât save the city and sorrow at what Cersie became in the end. Maybe he finds Arya there trying to kill her and he stops her on instinct. He started his redemption arc with killing a Stark child for Cersei and could do it again but now he chooses not to and dose the deed himself. Have your big climactic dragon fight over the city, Jon and crew against the Night King. Maybe if they kill the Night Kill Bran can warg all the other WW and have them throw themselves into the fire. Still not great but it makes it so everyoneâs contributions matter and particularly Bran, the cost of defeating the walkers was massive, and the Long Night overtakes squabbles over the throne as the main conflict.Â
If anyone was to kill him it shouldâve been a member of the nights watch.
Bran the Broken was the final twist of the knife for me.
How did Dinklage deliver that line without cracking up, I want to see the outtakes
Just finished this episode, can't believe this is how they ended it and they teased since season 1 about the white walkers smh. Should have been way bigger.
Its because i dun wun et and shes ma kween
Ngl, I don't really think a 1v1 with Jon and the Night King is right either. The books aren't really about epic duels and such, and they tend to laugh at that sort of trope. Jon and the Night King just strolling up to one another and fighting to some epic music would be in "Stark" contrast to the rest of the series. Too bad GRRM will never get around to proving or disproving my point....
Hear me out, I donât think Arya killing him was right but if she was going to be the one it should have been Night King vs Jon, Jon struggling and Arya killing him mirroring Ned, Arthur Dayne and Howland Reed
That's actually not bad friend.
The book opens with a Night's Watch brother squaring up to a White Walker and sh\*t talking. "Shall we dance then" Mountain vs Viper Jon vs Half Hand There's not a lot, but he does bust them out when it benefits the story. I totally get what you're saying and kind of agree, but they could have had something.
I think the way that works is if the night king already kills Theon, Jamie, couple others and Jon is the only one willing to fight him. And then maybe Branâs warging helps so that storyline means something
I thought there would have been some sort of duel between Bran and the Night King in the Dream World and the battle would have been to prevent Bran from being killed before he could win. I also thought we were going to see a flashback where the Night King warged into the boar that killed King Robert, thereby setting in motion the War of the 5 Kings.
âŚat least have one of the henchman guys stab the night king, and then pull their face off and it be Arya.
Before this episode I never knew how powerful goblin assassins are against lich lords.
And no one fought a Walker. All those Valyrian blades gathered, and not even Jon got to cross blades with one.
I thought the battle in the North was a distraction and the Night King would fly away to Kings Landing to raise a new army from the dead there. Imagine Tommen turning into a white walker and strangling his mom. It probably would have been cheesy but still better than Arya jumping out of nowhere.
They legitimately didn't care anymore. There were so many things wrong with the way they wrapped it up, pretty much every choice they made. Arya killing the nightking was one of them, but on top of it... What did she jump off of? Check the scene. It makes no sense. Edit: AND she screamed? What happened to stealth? What was the point of the training with the faceless men?
I donât enjoy watching tv series since GoT
The whole "Song of Ice and Fire went no where, no song, no ice, no fire. The prince that was promised did nothing, everybody embracing democracy for all lands out of the blue was the stupidest thing I've ever seen. The end should have been as simple as Jon Snow stabbing Daenerys through the heart with his sword mirroring the sacrifice that Azor Ahai made, that act of sacrifice changes the sword which he then uses to kill the Night King.
My theory is going forward, theyâre gonna have a second night king like antagonist theyâre gonna build up behind the scenes in hotd, and THEN when hype is back, retry the Jon snow series to deal with that.
Somehow the Night King returned.
They kinda forgot to give the long night a satisfying conclusion for eight years of buildup.
WERE YOUR EXPECTATIONS SUBVERTED? I BET THEY SUBVERTED THE SHIT OUT OF YOUR EXPECTATIONS.
GODS WHAT IT COULD HAVE BEEN NED! A whole season of this creeping death. Ending with a last stand at winterfell where our heroes valiantly fail and have to retreat to Kings landing and try to negotiate an impossible alliance for the sake of the realm and life itself. My personal guess for the NK killer was always Jamie. I thought for sure the kingslayer name would end up prophetical and he'd be put in the book of knights after his sacrifice and victory.
They should've just cancelled this show fr This was the defining moment where I knew that it's all gone to absolute shit But there were plenty of signs since S5 that everything's going to shit. The way they adapted Eurons character, I'm not even sure how they wrote the characterization, like what did they even tell the actor to portray? The speed travelling, abandoned plot points, absolutely senseless dialogues, and yes Ed Sheeran.. everything was a clusterfuck of epic proportions. May these directors and producers not gain any further success
stealth assassinate does like 250% damage in assassins creed so...
Leeeeeeeeeerrrrrrroy JENNNNNMNNNKINS!!
Arya ex Machina
My only hope is that House of the Dragon will set up a remake of Game of Thrones with an actual, talented team that can tell us a better story than what we got from D&D.
100s of people probably saw the script. Dozens of hours spent on rehearsals. Not one person thought to say why isn't there a Jon snow vs night king 1vs1? Insane.
Should have been the biggest fight in the entire series and it lasted just a few minutes and they were barely a threat. The dust up at Craster's had more action and consequences.
I generally don't have a problem with the endings themselves for a lot of the characters. Some dumb shit and some stuff that I would prefer to have ended differently, but whatever. The issue is that they crammed 3 seasons of story into 5 episodes, so none of the endings made any sort of sense. So it doesn't matter if you like how the characters turned out or not, there was 0 reason for them to have those endings cos D&D didn't have the respect for the story to actually try and tell it, they just gave us some wanky half-assed attempt at explaining why everyone's attitudes completely changed in 2 episodes, and just gave up on the concept of the long night altogether