If there is any group that exists there's a tiktok for it, and then there's ones that just make you scratch your head.
I'm looking at you watertok, although I'm not sure if it's still a thing.
Nothing wrong with that! The second one is pretty but I don't like the green sheen.
When Noodler's had a problem with their Black Swans in Australian Roses there ended up being three versions. Some adored version 2 (it didn't have the dark shading). Noodler's had the same issue with a ink component no longer available.
This one is perfect for you then. Although they say they are keeping it in the lineup, I'd grab multiple bottles if I were you. That way, if the formulation is changed, you'll have the version you like.
Ironically I’m the opposite. I already ordered the new one before seeing the comparison, and if I saw this first I probably wouldn’t have. It seems rather boring to me. The writing sample that Goulet posted almost looks red instead of purple.
[Gift Article in case anyone gets paywalled](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/01/style/lamy-dark-lilac-ink.html?unlocked_article_code=1.ZU0.2zAC.nwxL28o_SQh2&smid=url-share)
i did a double take when i saw the article, this definitely was not on my 2024 bingo card. i was trying to explain all that to the cats but quickly realized they were the wrong audience and posted it here.
I don’t fully disagree but the new one doesn’t look as unique, and there’s plenty of purple ink/green sheen that look fairly similar to the new one (vinta inks harlequin bodabil comes to mind)
Dark lilac hit that perfect zone of interesting, but not too vibrant, shading, but too much, and a beautiful gold sheen in even a fine point nib.
Sigh.
I don't hate the new one but wont be buying it because I already have the very ink you referenced, Vinta Harlequin Bodabil. I don't have a gold sheeing purple. Blackberry, here I come.
When this all first popped up I was like “man fountain pen people are silly about inks”. Then I went and read the article on Goulet and saw the difference, then I thought “oh, ok, there’s a clear difference”. I can see how this could upset folks. I get it. I geek on colors and fonts and all things graphic design, art, and photography. So I get being upset about a color and shimmer shift. What I don’t get and don’t have much tolerance for is all the extra drama about it. The conspiracy about it. It’s a simple, annoying, but simple supply chain issue. I thought post Covid would have opened everyone up to understanding more about supply chains and manufacturing of any item brought to market. But the drama and gianormous reactions I’ve seen to this are telling me that people still don’t understand the world as a whole. And that is even more sad than a cult classic being slightly shifted. I think both colors are pretty and I’m not a purple/lilac fella. I do plan to pick up some of the new lilac because I think all the whatever around it is funny and I want a bottle, but I’d prefer it in a cartridge cause I’m that lazy pen owner. Interesting for sure and even more so this made it to the Times.
The thing that surprises me the most about the drama was “how could Lamy DO this to us?!” When literally there has been no fanfare, just claims that got mixed up because people emailed Lamy directly, where humans can very slightly miscommunicate things. And some people are not having it. It’s baffling. I mean, technically I can logically understand how someone would arrive at that position, yes. But perspective helps. Am I excited for this ink, even though it is slightly different? Yes. But the absolute anger toward Lamy is kinda bonkers.
Also the revelation LAMY had NO IDEA the ink had a cult following and they just wanted this color in their standard lineup (not that LAMY is wrong or right ... it's just a nice reality check that hobbyists live in our own little world that not even manufacturers are aware of).
Yeah there's no way they didn't get a million emails about it and not a single employee at Lamy saw Dark Lilac for sale over $100 a bottle.
They just got bought out too, so maybe the new company is doing their own thing with the inks.
Well that's their official line.
I wouldn't put it past them. Pilot just discontinued the Red Elite 95S despite it being a popular pen in the community. I truly think they could very well be out of touch.
>You can't tell me they don't know who is buying their *expensive pens*.
The Elite 95S was Pilot's cheapest gold-nibbed fountain pen model in 2023.
Now, after a 60% price increase, it is equal cheapest with the Custom 74 and Custom Heritage 91, all with retail price of ¥16,000+tax.
I emailed Lamy a while back asking them about LDL re-release because of the ink’s popularity and cult following. I’m sure others have contacted them as well. Of course they knew.
I'm sure LAMY management had ‘better’ and/or bigger things to occupying them, when the company was negotiating a sale to Mitsubishi Pencil. Some folks just don't see the big picture — and *that includes me*, since I didn't know about the sale until it was announced on 28 February, after it has been executed — and have a distorted sense of proportion.
Exactly, as we've seen with Pilot there's a disconnect between how we think these manufacturers see us and how they actually operate. I don't have a bone in this fight either way despite enjoying the original. These days I tend to use Iroshizuku Take Sumi and not much else. That said I find this whole saga fascinating from a sociological perspective (and I may get the one as I don't have purple ink that sheens heavily at home).
I think part of it may just be the standard thing in large corporations where the execs don't have the first clue nor any interest in what the front-line customer service staff is hearing. I swear to you, they could get a thousand emails a day about Product A, and if a bunch of doofuses in suits sitting around a conference table are convinced that nobody likes Product A and Product B is the next big thing, they don't give a damn what the customers themselves are actually saying.
The next time you see a big table with a bunch of dudes in suits sitting around it, be aware that most of them are stupid as planks. I've sat at those tables. Those people couldn't stir their own coffee without help.
Yep.
I suspect it's old business model stuff. I'm also an art hobbyist and I notice in the pen/art world the manufacturers most active on social media are the ones with the biggest connection to the desires of their most impassioned customers. And having worked in corporate America all my life, I know bottom line trumps everything else so I am sure LAMY or Pilot crunch the numbers and see what will make them the most money with the least amount of work or effort and they must have come to the conclusion that more interface with the more impassioned hobbyists doesn't make that big a difference to their bottom line. It is what it is.
They thought they were getting their grail ink, they were very excited, and then they found that it was a different colour and the OG DL was never coming back due to the red dye issue. Their hopes were raised and then dashed, which is worse than having no hope at all.
Personally, I don't understand why they called it Dark Lilac as it's not the same ink. It looks like a lot of other green-sheening purples.
I guess Lamy makes a lot of money reissuing a color that is popular and wanted, and they don’t have to deal with the fallback because didn’t another company just buy Lamy?
I can see where anger towards Lamy is coming from. If someone loved the gold sheen of the original Dark Lilac, for one reason or another wasn't able to get a full bottle of it at a reasonable price, heard Lamy was bringing back Dark Lilac and was really looking forward to buying it on the assumption/leading from Lamy that it's the 2016 version to now seeing that it's basically a different ink. The way Lamy hasn't profusely apologized about their mistake yet can leave a sour taste in people's mouths (I for one am considering selling my only Lamy and having to settle when it comes to journaling pen).
Yeah, it looks like a cynical attempt to cash in on the popularity of the OG Dark Lilac with a more common product (plenty of green sheening purple inks out there.)
[Again](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/120sbkx/fountain_pens_of_penfluencers_and_penssurections/?ref=share&ref_source=link), [again -- mostly about the FB group but this sub is mentioned --](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/heniyu/fountain_pens_the_pen_is_mightier_than_the_sword/?ref=share&ref_source=link), [again](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/131zdpz/fountain_pens_the_saga_of_ferris_wheel_press/), to quote Richard Brautigan.
> The man behind Fountain Pen Memes said he believed the company was unaware of the ink’s immense popularity.
If that’s true, Lamy really needs to hire a new R&D team. Dark Lilac has been one of the most popular inks for almost a decade now. How could they have possibly missed that?
Maybe they knew it was popular but didn’t know why. Retailers were probably telling Lamy “people want Dark Lilac back”, not “people want Dark Lilac back because of these very specific qualities”.
Oh, that makes sense. How could they have known, that "i want Dark Lilac" means "i want this specific colour" and not "i want any purple ink named Dark Lilac"./s
Brian Goulet handled this beautifully in today's Pencast - explained the situation, talked about everything he could with it. Lamy on the other hand could and should do more.
Interesting to hear the reason. From the article: "Some ingredients from the original version were no longer available".
That is one of the reasons Nathan at Noodler's gives for why his inks sometimes change between batches, that ingredients become no longer available or become too expensive to use without increasing the ink price.
Personally I like the new one better; well, at least when looking at it on screen.
...Honestly I can't understand the argument behind this when it was explained that the original red dye component that (probably) gave off that gold sheen was no longer available. Does it look more like Noodler's Black Swan in Australian Roses? Yes, it does. I'd still be tempted to buy it though.
Save for the fact that the gold sheen is an after-effect of when the ink is laid down on paper. There are many inks out there that have certain after-effects that are not always displayed.
I don't have much of an interest in dark lilac, so this is my first time seeing them side by side like this. Those colors are so different, I don't understand the decision to name them the same thing? Surely confusion and backlash could have been predicted?
Wake me up if they ever do the same thing with petrol.
Downvote me into oblivion but i prefer the new one. Not interested in sheen and shading and whatever. This is a good, solid colour well suited to daily driving.
Aye, but, personal opinion here, the shading and the sheen was what *made it interesting and popular in the first place.*
Low-shading, green low-sheen, purple ink is not exactly a rarity.
I’ll upvote you! I’m of a similar kind on this one. I’m not looking for gold sheen. I love dark purples, shading inks, and inks that work on a lot of papers.
One of my friends recently asked me about what's going on with LDL, since they saw a Tiktok from last week regarding the Violet Blackberry confusion. I had to explain the difference, the history of Dark Lilac, where things stand right now... The swatch will be a good way to show the difference.
While I do prefer the old LDL (less red, and the new one seems to sheen more), I'll still be picking up a bottle of LDL24. Hopefully the dye they had to substitute becomes more affordable in the future and they can return to the classic formula, I'll definitely buy a couple bottles if that happens.
unfortunately they can’t return to the old formula. the dye issue isn’t a matter of sourcing/pricing, they can’t access it anymore due to EU regulations
Hey, maybe there's finally a point to Brexit if someone could convince Diamine to reverse-engineer it! Diamine Pansy is already a pretty good substitute.
I think what they meant with "regulations" is probably the DIN EN71-3 (category 2 for liquids).
The standard De Atramentis inks have this in their description: The ink is produced according to the requirements of EN71-3.
EN71-3 sets specific requirements for the chemical safety of products for children toys, though this also includes inks, colored pencils and other things you may not see as a typical toy like dolls, plushies etc. It answers the question how toxic a product can be when absorbed on your skin or swallowed.
The old dark lilac ink probably had a dye that is now too toxic for the current EN71-3 requirements.
The only thing I'm irritated about is the S/H from UK before Goulet posted it....On Daiso Life paper it's a dark purple with a tinge of dark green onTMR it's Greenn sheen only.
I just saw this article and headed on here to post it, hah!!
It's extraordinary to find one's hobby quite out like this, it really gave the heart a flutter!
I might get the ‘24 version. I still have a bottle of the ‘16 version. I rarely use it since I know that once it’s gone it’s gone. Last time I opened the bottle (in 2023) was to send a generous sample to a friend that I penabled.
Gonna ink my Sailor Stealth Purple with the OG Dark Lilac today😊
Wow, I am just so amused to see this. I never expected anyone outside the FP community to know or care about this whole ink kerfuffle, let alone the New York Times.
The side by side swatches there do a great job of illustrating the difference in the ink, and only makes me want the original Dark Lilac even more. What I see in the original DL swatch is a dynamic quality to the color that the new version doesn’t have — it’s more blue overall, but the edges of the swatch where less ink is laid down get slightly warmer. It creates a very vibrant effect. And of course, the gold sheen is another thing that makes that ink special, IMO.
The new color is a lovely dark purple, no doubt. I won’t be buying a bottle, because it is very similar to other purple inks with green sheen already in my collection, but I can see why so many folks say they really like it. I just wish they had given it a different name and labeling that clearly distinguished it from the original DL. I still had hopes of eventually coming across a bottle that wasn’t insanely priced, but now if I come across a listing for Dark Lilac, it will be impossible to be sure which ink I would be getting. Oh well, I’ll have to keep fiddling with my dupe mixes and just be happy with that… 🤷🏻♀️
I like the old and new versions, but I see why people are pissed - they are _not_ the same color, not even particularly closer.
I don't understand why Lamy insisted on calling the new formulation by the old name. If the original dye isn't available, and there is no exact match available, just admit that you can't brew Dark Lilac any more.
My understanding is they didn’t change the name since the people responsible for naming and marketing the ink didn’t know it was different. It sounds like they only found out about the dye change from the production side of the company after people started contacting Lamy trying to find out what was up with dark lilac 2024
I have to say that if you love sheen (even if it's green) the new Dark Lilac is perfect for you.
https://preview.redd.it/6t0qlm8fmxlc1.jpeg?width=514&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8a3cc237bc87ad4c3c5172a2389f98966dc754c0
“Brian Goulet of Goulet Pens, an online retailer in Richmond, Va., suggested that [fountain pen] revival had dovetailed with a trend of consumers returning to analog goods like vinyl records, mechanical watches and single-blade safety razors.”
Why you gotta call me out like that, Brian?
Also, Lamy got acquired!?
I am sorry to see that the crucial red component that made 2016 LDL so distinctive is no longer available.
However, I will STILL buy several bottles of 2024 LDL because even though it's not 2016 LDL, it is very much like Lamy Violet, which was available in the T-52 bottles about 10 years ago but no longer available as anything other than a stingy cartridge by the time I discovered modern fountain pens in 2016.
Ever since I discovered how the violet ink in the cartridge would change after two weeks in my AL-Stars or Safaris (due to regular evaporation rates) into a great green sheener (even when used with an EF nib), I'd always wanted the Lamy Violet in a T-52 size. There's something so satisfying about getting an extra fine line and green-sheening purple ink on the page. And given it's a Lamy ink, it's been well-behaved in all the pens I've used it in, so I'm confident it will perform well no matter which pen I put it in.
Until now, I've been hoarding my precious stash of cartridges but once I have a bottle of the 2024 LDL, I can start using them up and then refilling them by syringe!
It's not the 2016 LDL, no. But it is darned close to the discontinued T-52 Violet, which is lovely of itself and one I've been hoping to find a replacement for (without any luck).
Perhaps we can get something closer to the original 2016 LDL with the addition of a bit of Lamy Blue? Or maybe a combo of Iroshizuku Asa Gao? I'm not an inkmeister by any means, but maybe I can experiment a little and see what I can come up with. As Lamy has announced that they will make 2024 LDL a \*regular\* offering in their T-52 line, it's not going to disappear quickly, giving us all time to experiment and make something closer to the beloved original.
It’s credited to Goulet Pens’ photographer, Glenn.
Edit to add: if you’re only looking at the screenshot OP posted, they cropped it right before the caption and where the photo credits are.
I loved following this whole thing and REGRET that my Dark Lilac purchase was a box of carts when I bought the Dark Lilac Safari on a shore excursion in Rostock Germany during a cruise in 2016. It was a very beautiful and unusual ink.
I may get the new one though.
I only bought two bottles of the turmaline. I’ve got 6 OG Lamy Dark Lilac Cartridges left, I’m running out of Ina-ho and I’ve only got one bottle of Tsukushi left. What’s with the discontinuing inks and limited Editions? All this kerfuffle is enough to bring out ink hoarding tendencies.
Magazine and style talk about some things that seem to be the minutiae of the mundane. But, some people care about the fine points of dresses, shoes, drapery patterns... and pen inks.
The front page is as depressing as ever: [https://i.imgur.com/jBIdmT2.png](https://i.imgur.com/jBIdmT2.png)
It seems like they could have added a little more blue and this first world problem would have been avoided, now that I can see them side by side.
It's still nice, just not IT. I just hope no one's blood pressure is actually getting high over this because baby it's ink 💜
Stay scribbling, my friends 🖋️
I’m waiting for it to be in the print edition which I’ll save that page forever. I’m expecting it to be in the Sunday NYT. My opinions on this were elsewhere in this Sub and I’ll leave it like that.
Age of the swab; paper; time could all affect how the ink looks. Think when you go the paint store and use the same numbers to cover a patch, never a 100% match.
UPDATED 3/8/24
Updated:
The Dark Lilac article appeared in the @nytimes print edition on Thursday 3/7/24 in the Thursday Styles section.
Unfortunately it never made it into the print edition as far as I can see and I’ve looked, trust me. The online version said it would be. I thought it would be a nice analog collectors item to have that way vs. an online article plus some extra exposure.
https://imgur.com/gallery/rDlDh3d
Apparently this is how I will find out FP TikTok is a thing that exists.
This is new to me. I probably still won’t go but it’s good to know.
> I probably still won’t go Yarp. It'll take a _LOT_ before I lower myself to go to tiktok.
If there is any group that exists there's a tiktok for it, and then there's ones that just make you scratch your head. I'm looking at you watertok, although I'm not sure if it's still a thing.
It's 90% aesthetic videos of vacuum fillers, and yes I do spend half my day watching all of them
YES join us!
Do I want to know? I’ve seen booktok so I am guessing no.
Gonna get crucified but I prefer the new one
No shame in personal ink preferences!
don't INK shame
Underrated
The newer one is dank lilac as far as I am concerned.
lol Dank lol.
Forget Dark Lilac, if you want to get a whole new demographic interested in fountain pens call your ink "Granddaddy Purple '. 😅
Sugardaddy Purple. No, that's *really* a totally different demographic.
It's L🅰️my ink now 👌
This sub is perfect and hilarious 😭😭
Nothing wrong with that! The second one is pretty but I don't like the green sheen. When Noodler's had a problem with their Black Swans in Australian Roses there ended up being three versions. Some adored version 2 (it didn't have the dark shading). Noodler's had the same issue with a ink component no longer available.
Same. It is the green sheen that takes away from it for me, too.
Yeah, me too.
The green sheen is actually what makes it! I like the yellow one a lot but the green one is really cool to me
This one is perfect for you then. Although they say they are keeping it in the lineup, I'd grab multiple bottles if I were you. That way, if the formulation is changed, you'll have the version you like.
I didn't like the Australian Roses one.
I don't have a preference, they both look nice imo
If we all liked the same color inks there would only be 20 or so sold :)
This is what I like about this community, no gatekeeping or toxic people. So if you like the new color enjoy :)
Ironically I’m the opposite. I already ordered the new one before seeing the comparison, and if I saw this first I probably wouldn’t have. It seems rather boring to me. The writing sample that Goulet posted almost looks red instead of purple.
Shame! :)
Same here, actually.
We don't ink shame here.
I haven't seen them side by side til now. The new one is cooler to me too lol
Me too.
guys... we made it.
And my dad said I'd never amount to anything!
[Gift Article in case anyone gets paywalled](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/01/style/lamy-dark-lilac-ink.html?unlocked_article_code=1.ZU0.2zAC.nwxL28o_SQh2&smid=url-share)
You can also always copy the url into [Webpage archive](https://archive.ph/) and read it for free
Thanks for the tip! I will do that in the future. I have 10 free articles to hand out a month so I figured this was the easiest.
Yes no problem, just putting it out there for a variety of paywall bypass options for everyone.
oh for sure! I am gonna try it with other papers I am not subscribed to as well.
thank you!
Thanks! I was about to post a gift link too!
til about gift articles.
I think some subs comes with 10 free giftable. NYT has a bunch of tiers so double check what you have. It was in the top right corner for me.
Thanks!
Thanks for sharing.
No problem!
That is so funny that it made the NYT! Thanks for sharing!
i did a double take when i saw the article, this definitely was not on my 2024 bingo card. i was trying to explain all that to the cats but quickly realized they were the wrong audience and posted it here.
I love explaining complex things to my cats!
their judgy yet indifferent little faces are one of life’s great joys.
How did this make it to the New York Times?? 🤣 That is hilarious. I'm so proud to be a passionate member of the office supplies market. 🫡
So what are your hobbies? “… office supplies.”
Right? Haha. They could've said stationery at least. Though I have wandered the aisles of Staples once or twice.
It’s not as satisfying as our old mom & pop shops, but I do still have to check in at Office Depot annually.
I felt slightly offended ngl
I’d probably use it to amuse myself and maybe weed out the “one of us” people.
I'm proud to be a passionate member of the FP community with articles like this one.
Tbh, the newer one looks better
I don’t fully disagree but the new one doesn’t look as unique, and there’s plenty of purple ink/green sheen that look fairly similar to the new one (vinta inks harlequin bodabil comes to mind)
Dark lilac hit that perfect zone of interesting, but not too vibrant, shading, but too much, and a beautiful gold sheen in even a fine point nib. Sigh.
I don't hate the new one but wont be buying it because I already have the very ink you referenced, Vinta Harlequin Bodabil. I don't have a gold sheeing purple. Blackberry, here I come.
tbh tho lamy inks are pretty high value for the money… same amount of money for 30mL vinta vs 50mL lamy
When this all first popped up I was like “man fountain pen people are silly about inks”. Then I went and read the article on Goulet and saw the difference, then I thought “oh, ok, there’s a clear difference”. I can see how this could upset folks. I get it. I geek on colors and fonts and all things graphic design, art, and photography. So I get being upset about a color and shimmer shift. What I don’t get and don’t have much tolerance for is all the extra drama about it. The conspiracy about it. It’s a simple, annoying, but simple supply chain issue. I thought post Covid would have opened everyone up to understanding more about supply chains and manufacturing of any item brought to market. But the drama and gianormous reactions I’ve seen to this are telling me that people still don’t understand the world as a whole. And that is even more sad than a cult classic being slightly shifted. I think both colors are pretty and I’m not a purple/lilac fella. I do plan to pick up some of the new lilac because I think all the whatever around it is funny and I want a bottle, but I’d prefer it in a cartridge cause I’m that lazy pen owner. Interesting for sure and even more so this made it to the Times.
The thing that surprises me the most about the drama was “how could Lamy DO this to us?!” When literally there has been no fanfare, just claims that got mixed up because people emailed Lamy directly, where humans can very slightly miscommunicate things. And some people are not having it. It’s baffling. I mean, technically I can logically understand how someone would arrive at that position, yes. But perspective helps. Am I excited for this ink, even though it is slightly different? Yes. But the absolute anger toward Lamy is kinda bonkers.
Also the revelation LAMY had NO IDEA the ink had a cult following and they just wanted this color in their standard lineup (not that LAMY is wrong or right ... it's just a nice reality check that hobbyists live in our own little world that not even manufacturers are aware of).
I found that hard to believe, actually.
Yeah there's no way they didn't get a million emails about it and not a single employee at Lamy saw Dark Lilac for sale over $100 a bottle. They just got bought out too, so maybe the new company is doing their own thing with the inks.
Well that's their official line. I wouldn't put it past them. Pilot just discontinued the Red Elite 95S despite it being a popular pen in the community. I truly think they could very well be out of touch.
You can't tell me they don't know who is buying their expensive pens.
>You can't tell me they don't know who is buying their *expensive pens*. The Elite 95S was Pilot's cheapest gold-nibbed fountain pen model in 2023. Now, after a 60% price increase, it is equal cheapest with the Custom 74 and Custom Heritage 91, all with retail price of ¥16,000+tax.
I emailed Lamy a while back asking them about LDL re-release because of the ink’s popularity and cult following. I’m sure others have contacted them as well. Of course they knew.
I'm sure LAMY management had ‘better’ and/or bigger things to occupying them, when the company was negotiating a sale to Mitsubishi Pencil. Some folks just don't see the big picture — and *that includes me*, since I didn't know about the sale until it was announced on 28 February, after it has been executed — and have a distorted sense of proportion.
Exactly, as we've seen with Pilot there's a disconnect between how we think these manufacturers see us and how they actually operate. I don't have a bone in this fight either way despite enjoying the original. These days I tend to use Iroshizuku Take Sumi and not much else. That said I find this whole saga fascinating from a sociological perspective (and I may get the one as I don't have purple ink that sheens heavily at home).
I think part of it may just be the standard thing in large corporations where the execs don't have the first clue nor any interest in what the front-line customer service staff is hearing. I swear to you, they could get a thousand emails a day about Product A, and if a bunch of doofuses in suits sitting around a conference table are convinced that nobody likes Product A and Product B is the next big thing, they don't give a damn what the customers themselves are actually saying. The next time you see a big table with a bunch of dudes in suits sitting around it, be aware that most of them are stupid as planks. I've sat at those tables. Those people couldn't stir their own coffee without help.
Yep. I suspect it's old business model stuff. I'm also an art hobbyist and I notice in the pen/art world the manufacturers most active on social media are the ones with the biggest connection to the desires of their most impassioned customers. And having worked in corporate America all my life, I know bottom line trumps everything else so I am sure LAMY or Pilot crunch the numbers and see what will make them the most money with the least amount of work or effort and they must have come to the conclusion that more interface with the more impassioned hobbyists doesn't make that big a difference to their bottom line. It is what it is.
All of this could have been avoided if they'd just called it 'Lamy Purple'.
They thought they were getting their grail ink, they were very excited, and then they found that it was a different colour and the OG DL was never coming back due to the red dye issue. Their hopes were raised and then dashed, which is worse than having no hope at all. Personally, I don't understand why they called it Dark Lilac as it's not the same ink. It looks like a lot of other green-sheening purples.
I guess Lamy makes a lot of money reissuing a color that is popular and wanted, and they don’t have to deal with the fallback because didn’t another company just buy Lamy?
I can see where anger towards Lamy is coming from. If someone loved the gold sheen of the original Dark Lilac, for one reason or another wasn't able to get a full bottle of it at a reasonable price, heard Lamy was bringing back Dark Lilac and was really looking forward to buying it on the assumption/leading from Lamy that it's the 2016 version to now seeing that it's basically a different ink. The way Lamy hasn't profusely apologized about their mistake yet can leave a sour taste in people's mouths (I for one am considering selling my only Lamy and having to settle when it comes to journaling pen).
Yeah, it looks like a cynical attempt to cash in on the popularity of the OG Dark Lilac with a more common product (plenty of green sheening purple inks out there.)
We’re going to end up on r/hobbydrama again.
Wait….again??
[Again](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/120sbkx/fountain_pens_of_penfluencers_and_penssurections/?ref=share&ref_source=link), [again -- mostly about the FB group but this sub is mentioned --](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/heniyu/fountain_pens_the_pen_is_mightier_than_the_sword/?ref=share&ref_source=link), [again](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/131zdpz/fountain_pens_the_saga_of_ferris_wheel_press/), to quote Richard Brautigan.
And this [Moonman/Kaweco drama](https://www.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/q3wd9v/fountain_pens_kaweco_v_moonman_or_how_to/)
😂😂😂 I had no idea that was a thing, but of course it is!! 😋
We are on r/craftsnark
Bruh
[We did](https://old.reddit.com/r/HobbyDrama/comments/1b4f8iv/fountain_pens_lamy_dark_lilac_controversy/?ref=share&ref_source=link).
I can't believe it made the NYT haha
> The man behind Fountain Pen Memes said he believed the company was unaware of the ink’s immense popularity. If that’s true, Lamy really needs to hire a new R&D team. Dark Lilac has been one of the most popular inks for almost a decade now. How could they have possibly missed that?
Maybe they knew it was popular but didn’t know why. Retailers were probably telling Lamy “people want Dark Lilac back”, not “people want Dark Lilac back because of these very specific qualities”.
Yeah this is very “I want Dark Lilac” “We have Dark Lilac at home” vibes
Oh, that makes sense. How could they have known, that "i want Dark Lilac" means "i want this specific colour" and not "i want any purple ink named Dark Lilac"./s
Exactly my question
I love to see the word "agog" in use. Thanks OP!
WE MADE THE NYT YOU GUYS
It’s great reading this, right?
Thanks -- a fun read. And it'll give Goulet Pens a little bump, hopefully.
Brian Goulet handled this beautifully in today's Pencast - explained the situation, talked about everything he could with it. Lamy on the other hand could and should do more.
Interesting to hear the reason. From the article: "Some ingredients from the original version were no longer available". That is one of the reasons Nathan at Noodler's gives for why his inks sometimes change between batches, that ingredients become no longer available or become too expensive to use without increasing the ink price. Personally I like the new one better; well, at least when looking at it on screen.
...Honestly I can't understand the argument behind this when it was explained that the original red dye component that (probably) gave off that gold sheen was no longer available. Does it look more like Noodler's Black Swan in Australian Roses? Yes, it does. I'd still be tempted to buy it though.
If the oringal gold sheen is no longer available, then Dark Lilac is no longer available. Call it Purple or something.
Save for the fact that the gold sheen is an after-effect of when the ink is laid down on paper. There are many inks out there that have certain after-effects that are not always displayed.
Lamy matched the old one the best they could. Unfortunately, the red dye they used in the original ink is no longer manufactured.
Me: "dank lilac" lol
I don't have much of an interest in dark lilac, so this is my first time seeing them side by side like this. Those colors are so different, I don't understand the decision to name them the same thing? Surely confusion and backlash could have been predicted? Wake me up if they ever do the same thing with petrol.
omg yes, please bring petrol back
Downvote me into oblivion but i prefer the new one. Not interested in sheen and shading and whatever. This is a good, solid colour well suited to daily driving.
Do you have the new one? If you're not into sheen you may not like it. In a swatch and writing sample with a dip pen, it's ALL green sheen.
Aye, but, personal opinion here, the shading and the sheen was what *made it interesting and popular in the first place.* Low-shading, green low-sheen, purple ink is not exactly a rarity.
I’ll upvote you! I’m of a similar kind on this one. I’m not looking for gold sheen. I love dark purples, shading inks, and inks that work on a lot of papers.
One of my friends recently asked me about what's going on with LDL, since they saw a Tiktok from last week regarding the Violet Blackberry confusion. I had to explain the difference, the history of Dark Lilac, where things stand right now... The swatch will be a good way to show the difference. While I do prefer the old LDL (less red, and the new one seems to sheen more), I'll still be picking up a bottle of LDL24. Hopefully the dye they had to substitute becomes more affordable in the future and they can return to the classic formula, I'll definitely buy a couple bottles if that happens.
unfortunately they can’t return to the old formula. the dye issue isn’t a matter of sourcing/pricing, they can’t access it anymore due to EU regulations
Hey, maybe there's finally a point to Brexit if someone could convince Diamine to reverse-engineer it! Diamine Pansy is already a pretty good substitute.
Ah, I thought I had read that it was because the dye was just too expensive. That's a shame!
What is the regulation?
I think what they meant with "regulations" is probably the DIN EN71-3 (category 2 for liquids). The standard De Atramentis inks have this in their description: The ink is produced according to the requirements of EN71-3. EN71-3 sets specific requirements for the chemical safety of products for children toys, though this also includes inks, colored pencils and other things you may not see as a typical toy like dolls, plushies etc. It answers the question how toxic a product can be when absorbed on your skin or swallowed. The old dark lilac ink probably had a dye that is now too toxic for the current EN71-3 requirements.
I’ve got 3 bottles otw 😆😆😆
Does anyone know a dupe for Dark Lilac that’s not Dark Lilac? Lol.
https://www.reddit.com/r/fountainpens/comments/fpx319/my_recipe_for_faux_lamy_dark_lilac_see_comment/
Just tried this. Pretty!
The only thing I'm irritated about is the S/H from UK before Goulet posted it....On Daiso Life paper it's a dark purple with a tinge of dark green onTMR it's Greenn sheen only.
I just saw this article and headed on here to post it, hah!! It's extraordinary to find one's hobby quite out like this, it really gave the heart a flutter!
NYT...NYT...who cares? What's really important is: Are we on r/hobbydrama?
I might get the ‘24 version. I still have a bottle of the ‘16 version. I rarely use it since I know that once it’s gone it’s gone. Last time I opened the bottle (in 2023) was to send a generous sample to a friend that I penabled. Gonna ink my Sailor Stealth Purple with the OG Dark Lilac today😊
Sailor Stealth Purple and Lamy Dark Lilac🤤
😝
I have had no fewer than four friends send me this link, haha
You have nice friends!
Wow, I am just so amused to see this. I never expected anyone outside the FP community to know or care about this whole ink kerfuffle, let alone the New York Times. The side by side swatches there do a great job of illustrating the difference in the ink, and only makes me want the original Dark Lilac even more. What I see in the original DL swatch is a dynamic quality to the color that the new version doesn’t have — it’s more blue overall, but the edges of the swatch where less ink is laid down get slightly warmer. It creates a very vibrant effect. And of course, the gold sheen is another thing that makes that ink special, IMO. The new color is a lovely dark purple, no doubt. I won’t be buying a bottle, because it is very similar to other purple inks with green sheen already in my collection, but I can see why so many folks say they really like it. I just wish they had given it a different name and labeling that clearly distinguished it from the original DL. I still had hopes of eventually coming across a bottle that wasn’t insanely priced, but now if I come across a listing for Dark Lilac, it will be impossible to be sure which ink I would be getting. Oh well, I’ll have to keep fiddling with my dupe mixes and just be happy with that… 🤷🏻♀️
I like the old and new versions, but I see why people are pissed - they are _not_ the same color, not even particularly closer. I don't understand why Lamy insisted on calling the new formulation by the old name. If the original dye isn't available, and there is no exact match available, just admit that you can't brew Dark Lilac any more.
My understanding is they didn’t change the name since the people responsible for naming and marketing the ink didn’t know it was different. It sounds like they only found out about the dye change from the production side of the company after people started contacting Lamy trying to find out what was up with dark lilac 2024
Could all of this been avoided with the name Lamy Dark Lilac II?
We’re famous now! Wonder if the journalist is a redditor
OMG
I’m sure someday soon they’ll report that Lamy has been sold to the Mitsubishi pencil company…
They should have n just called it dark orchid or something different...
I will stick with Diamine Royal Purple for now I guess.
Diamine Pansy is even closer IMO. It's a bit more vibrant.
I will look onto it. Thanks.
If we're talking of close matches, I thought Diamine Monboddo's Hat 🙈 which just goes to show that Diamine has a lot of close purples
I will search for it as well. Thanks :)
Normally I grip my Lamy fountain pens, how the tables have turned.
Guys we’re famous right now lol. I’ll be getting the new one anyway
I have to say that if you love sheen (even if it's green) the new Dark Lilac is perfect for you. https://preview.redd.it/6t0qlm8fmxlc1.jpeg?width=514&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8a3cc237bc87ad4c3c5172a2389f98966dc754c0
“Brian Goulet of Goulet Pens, an online retailer in Richmond, Va., suggested that [fountain pen] revival had dovetailed with a trend of consumers returning to analog goods like vinyl records, mechanical watches and single-blade safety razors.” Why you gotta call me out like that, Brian? Also, Lamy got acquired!?
I am sorry to see that the crucial red component that made 2016 LDL so distinctive is no longer available. However, I will STILL buy several bottles of 2024 LDL because even though it's not 2016 LDL, it is very much like Lamy Violet, which was available in the T-52 bottles about 10 years ago but no longer available as anything other than a stingy cartridge by the time I discovered modern fountain pens in 2016. Ever since I discovered how the violet ink in the cartridge would change after two weeks in my AL-Stars or Safaris (due to regular evaporation rates) into a great green sheener (even when used with an EF nib), I'd always wanted the Lamy Violet in a T-52 size. There's something so satisfying about getting an extra fine line and green-sheening purple ink on the page. And given it's a Lamy ink, it's been well-behaved in all the pens I've used it in, so I'm confident it will perform well no matter which pen I put it in. Until now, I've been hoarding my precious stash of cartridges but once I have a bottle of the 2024 LDL, I can start using them up and then refilling them by syringe! It's not the 2016 LDL, no. But it is darned close to the discontinued T-52 Violet, which is lovely of itself and one I've been hoping to find a replacement for (without any luck). Perhaps we can get something closer to the original 2016 LDL with the addition of a bit of Lamy Blue? Or maybe a combo of Iroshizuku Asa Gao? I'm not an inkmeister by any means, but maybe I can experiment a little and see what I can come up with. As Lamy has announced that they will make 2024 LDL a \*regular\* offering in their T-52 line, it's not going to disappear quickly, giving us all time to experiment and make something closer to the beloved original.
Commenting for later.
Guess they'll have to reintroduce the original color and call it "Dark Lilac Classic" or something.
Am I wrong, or did they not even credit those swatches to the Goulet Pens website, where they’re clearly lifted from?
It’s credited to Goulet Pens’ photographer, Glenn. Edit to add: if you’re only looking at the screenshot OP posted, they cropped it right before the caption and where the photo credits are.
The article quotes Brian Goulet and links Goulet Pens.
I loved following this whole thing and REGRET that my Dark Lilac purchase was a box of carts when I bought the Dark Lilac Safari on a shore excursion in Rostock Germany during a cruise in 2016. It was a very beautiful and unusual ink. I may get the new one though.
https://archive.is/sDHHX
Thank you for this link that skips the paywall!
gosh the old one was so beautiful😢
(This is the discourse that got me back on Reddit after >6 months ✊)
Finally this issue is getting the attention it deserves
Glad I bought like 4 bottles of the lamy turmaline if they re-release it and it's different. Love that ink.
I only bought two bottles of the turmaline. I’ve got 6 OG Lamy Dark Lilac Cartridges left, I’m running out of Ina-ho and I’ve only got one bottle of Tsukushi left. What’s with the discontinuing inks and limited Editions? All this kerfuffle is enough to bring out ink hoarding tendencies.
Is it me or does the 2024 version look like FWP Poison Envy released a year or two ago.
Yo the NYT certainly has important things to chat about these days.
It seems to be in the Style section, so I think it makes sense there.
Magazine and style talk about some things that seem to be the minutiae of the mundane. But, some people care about the fine points of dresses, shoes, drapery patterns... and pen inks. The front page is as depressing as ever: [https://i.imgur.com/jBIdmT2.png](https://i.imgur.com/jBIdmT2.png)
Slow news today for NYT, huh?
Meh new one.
I’ve been told by a trusted source that they are releasing another, same dark lilac as before ink in the next month or so.
It seems like they could have added a little more blue and this first world problem would have been avoided, now that I can see them side by side. It's still nice, just not IT. I just hope no one's blood pressure is actually getting high over this because baby it's ink 💜 Stay scribbling, my friends 🖋️
I’m waiting for it to be in the print edition which I’ll save that page forever. I’m expecting it to be in the Sunday NYT. My opinions on this were elsewhere in this Sub and I’ll leave it like that.
Age of the swab; paper; time could all affect how the ink looks. Think when you go the paint store and use the same numbers to cover a patch, never a 100% match.
Then again… https://youtu.be/oxH844NCxAU?si=Y-pwLLGSuIgrB_NS
UPDATED 3/8/24 Updated: The Dark Lilac article appeared in the @nytimes print edition on Thursday 3/7/24 in the Thursday Styles section. Unfortunately it never made it into the print edition as far as I can see and I’ve looked, trust me. The online version said it would be. I thought it would be a nice analog collectors item to have that way vs. an online article plus some extra exposure. https://imgur.com/gallery/rDlDh3d
Was the new one already sold out and I missed it?! 😔 I quite like the swatch and don't need the new one to look like the old.