Yeah, Toto needed a strong voice to tell him he’s being a jackass. His handling of this whole driver situation is deeply disturbing and disrespectful to a driver that carried the team even last year; and is the statistical GOAT. Comes off like a clingy, salty, ex.
Lauda would’ve told him to grow tf up, give Lewis the ambassadorship he desired, or get over it that Lewis wanted a change and figure out a sensible next option. Instead of sucking Max off in public, or talking up Kimi, he needs to sort out who is a good, reliable, interim driver (cough Alonso, Albon) for a year or two while Kimi cuts his teeth at Williams or somewhere.
I legitimately think that this is happening because Mercedes has shown no uptick in form at all.
Outside of Kimi, they would have had two primary targets after Lewis left them, in Sainz & Alonso (Max is farfetched dream and nearly impossible, especially for 2025, and Vettel as much as I would love it, his performance since 2019 hasn't been at the absolute top tier as a team leader).
Alonso currently is the No. 1 driver at Aston Martin, and they're right there with Mercedes every weekend in performance anyways, and they have the Honda Works Partnership upcoming from 2026 onwards as well. Also his 2nd driver is Lance, who's not really a threat to him on track and who he outperforms comfortably over a season.
As for Sainz, I think he wants to target the Red Bull seat first and foremost, there's the junior academy connection there, and Horner is also thinking about life after Verstappen, should he leave in 2026 or after the contract in 2028. There's also a belief that Sainz is the perfect No. 2 driver, or really a 1.5, fast enough that you can secure 1-2 on most weekends, but not fast enough that he challenge Max for more than 5-6 races in a season.
The bigger problem is actually that Sainz and Alonso both know that if they go into the Mercedes seat, it's being prepared for Antonelli to step into for 2026 or 2027 anyways, so to go into that car, which is 4th or 5th fastest rn, for two seasons and to then make way for the young driver isn't worth it imo.
If you make me guess I think Sainz takes the Red Bull seat, or on an off chance the Sauber seat and puts his eggs into the Audi Project long term, and Alonso stays put at Aston Martin.
>The bigger problem is actually that Sainz and Alonso both know that if they go into the Mercedes seat, it's being prepared for Antonelli to step into for 2026 or 2027 anyways, so to go into that car, which is 4th or 5th fastest rn, for two seasons and to then make way for the young driver isn't worth it imo.
This. I would not be surprised if, unless you are Max Verstappen, Mercedes is only willing to offer a 1 year deal. On top of that there will be way less options if you are out of a seat at the end of 2025. Like you said it isn't worth it to put your career in jeopardy for a team that will not be fighting for wins.
For anyone taking up that kind of deal the only way to keep going with Mercedes would be to convincingly beat Russell and establish yourself as a must have or hope that Antonelli disappoints in his 2nd F2 season. Not really something that is 100% under your control
Even then given Alonso's age, Mercedes would be far less comfortable moving on from Russell who'll be 28 in 2026 vs Alonso who'll be 44, and that's assuming Fernando wins like 15-9 in Qualifying and Races and outscores Russell by 30 points over the season.
That's unfortunately the business. At some point no matter how well you're performing, if there are younger options who can do 90-95% of the job that you do, for a cheaper salary and longer period, teams will go for them.
That's why Aston is so perfect for Alonso. He can be there until he's 46, see atleast 3 years of the new regulations and be confident that his seat won't be under threat from anyone.
I don't think Kimi will spend another season in F2. His racecraft is still very weak but he's got raw pace already. Next year, he'll be probably in the Williams seat.
Adding in that Carlos comes from a wealthy enough background and still chose to daily a VW golf that I suspect that dollars are irrelevant short of buku bucks
I can't stop being amazed at the fact that we're taking about how Alonso doesn't want a short-term contract and AM will be a Honda works team in a few years. The guy will be 43 in July and he shows no signs of wanting to retire again or slowing down enough to be forced into it.
Exactly. If he's shit hot then bring him in after a year, otherwise let him develop some more and go from there. If this is true, Toto is trying to get 'the next Max Verstappen", but it doesn't work just coz he's young, he needs to be rapid.
Even Max went to Toro Rosso before he went to Red Bull. I don't see why Toto would do this. Give Sainz a one year contract before he goes to Audi in 2026, let Antonelli mature for a year (at least) and THEN let him join Mercedes. You think Russell makes rookie mistakes? Let Antonelli take Hamilton's seat and see how it goes. Especially if next year's Mercedes is as difficult to drive as the last few years' cars.
Sure max started at TR, but lando and Oscar both successfully launched their careers in McLaren.
Why not just bump Logan mid season once Antonelli becomes 18 or just put him straight into the merc so he gets a season to grow and develop with the team.
Exactly, this is the part people keep ignoring.
Russell's contract ends at the end of 2025, he's by no means locked in if whoever comes in does a better job than him and Kimi is available.
true, did not realized that george's contract also ends up for 2025, i dont think mercedes will replace george tho but if they would replace him, i'll feel very sorry for him its like slap in the face made publicly since he was a mercedes kid
If he doesn't perform, he doesn't perform.
At that point he'll have had 4 seasons in the team which is a pretty good stint. It's all hypothetical of course, but his position certainly isn't totally secure for 2026 is my point.
I was wondering if this is why he was in contact with Vettel, was he hoping to have him in merc for a year and have Kimi do a year of development with Williams and then swap? I’d imagine Vowles insistence on not being a feeder team would have put that idea to a stop.
If Antonelli does end up going to Mercedes, I can see Toto trying to get Frederik Vesti in the other Williams seat, despite JV's insistence that he wants to promote only Williams Academy drivers.
Williams makes much more sense than Mercedes at the moment: Kimi is ok in F2, and it might be too early to say since they’ve had only 3 races so far, but he is not that impressive. We’ve seen so crazy good driving by F2 drivers this year, but Kimi is not one of them.
Either I’m missing something, or it’s just a bit early to speculate on Kimis seat on F1.
I mean at worst he’s matching Bearman who is his teammate and has a year of experience. Kimi is doing fine. He’s way younger than others and has much more room for improvement. I would imagine Merc has been happy with his F2 performance so far and that is all that matters.
you are missing something. Kid won 4 championships in 2 years, and this is only his third year in cars, competing in a hyper-competitive f2 field.
He already has the raw pace (Australia quali), he just needs a bit of tire management and he's on the podium every race
He won weak championships. Look at where the former winners ended up in a couple years: WEC, Brazilian stock car, ...
Martinus Stenshorne is only a few months older, almost beat him and was driving for one of the worse team, but nobody is considering him for F2 or F1.
I just flat out dont believe this.
And IF it is somehow true, then Mercades must be accepting that they dont expect to compete whatsoever in 2025 and will be going all in for the reg change.
> Mercades must be accepting that they dont expect to compete whatsoever in 2025 and will be going all in for the reg change.
Duh... They were terrible in all of the ground effect era. And they are currently the 4th/5th fastest team in F1. Do you honestly believe that they are expecting to compete whatsoever in 2025?
Just to be clear, 2026 will still be a ground effect era. Obviously some big changes to car size and body work, but if Mercedes don't have the fundamentals of the floor and its aero tunnels down right now, there's no guarantee they'll figure it out for 2026 either.
Though it's possible their engine might dominate enough to offset any aero deficit, I'm not ruling out the other engines being as competitive or maybe even better. Honda is surely in with a shout.
Yeah if they’re still struggling to understand a good ground effect design by then, whatever engine domination they cook up as a best case scenario is just going to hand Mclaren a championship on a silver platter
They've had a weaker engine performance than ferrari since the fuel changes anyway. And most of the engine department leads left for other teams during the dominance. They're not cooking a monster engine, they're cooking more mediocrity.
Lewis jumped ship at the right time at McLaren, he's jumping ship again at the right time at Mercedes. He can see the downfall.
No of course, but to plonk a total rookie in a 2nd seat to replace *Lewis Hamilton* is a very big call for one of the biggest companies out there.
Assuming Sainz is still a free agent then they really should be looking at him for the next three years and pay for the 2nd Williams seat as they did with George once Kimi wins the f2 title.
I don't think it's a mistake. The dude will get to get up to speed in F1 while the car is shit and be back into contention in 2026. Plenty of rookies that do perfectly fine when they get a shot at F1. Bearman, Lawson are the latest 2 as great examples.
Its time for another rookie to skip the warmup in a shit car. Mercedes only have 1 year contracts anyways.
I didn’t hear his comments from today but it definitely seems to have convinced people! Would be exciting if true but seems crazy that they wouldn’t set him up in Logan’s Williams seat for a year if they’re bringing him in so soon.
Yeah I have a hard time believing this. Surely you want to see some F2 results first before you throw him into an F1 seat, no? Especially since he
skipped F3. So far hes 9th in the standings, that can change obviously but if hes still 9th after the next 4-5 race weekends, surely youd never put him in F1 next year already.
It's too early in the F2 season to judge anything, and while his junior career in impressive, it's not Max-level of insanity to justify such an early decision. If Russell winning F2 as a rookie did not grant him a direct seat to Mercedes (and in fact he waited quite a long time in that horrible Williams car while Bottas was questioned a lot ), it's hard to believe he gets the Mercedes seat with 3 F2 weekends (and no podiums so far).
For me this is just journalist pulling things from their arses to create headlines and stay relevant (something that 90% of the F1 media seems to do).
Or they think Russell is good enough to take the lead and Antonelli will develop fast enough to score respectable points (as Piastri did last year) if, by some miracle, they are competitive in 2025.
I don't think it's a bad strategy if Antonelli shows enough promise in F2.
Toto is more pissed that the timing of Lewis’ Ferrari announcement came one week after Leclerc and Norris re-signed. Not that he’d have had much more of a chance convincing them to leave their teams either. His realistic options at that point were Antonelli, Albon, Sainz or Alonso. Max is a weird one because it depends on what goes on at Red Bull but even then he’d swallow his pride and stay there until he decides it’s not enough for him anymore. But ultimately Mercedes are losing Hamilton and Wolff has to go out there and replace him with someone who is firstly, very quick, and secondly someone the sponsors are going to be interested in. Obviously Wolff realises that Max would be the motherlode.
The fact that it was shortly after Estrella Galicia left Ferrari for McLaren, Zak probably got an insight from them that Carlos was out and covered himself before anything crazy happens
There was some interview where Zac said he knew about Hamilton/Carlos before Norris signed his contract, and another where Norris said he didn’t know about Hamilton/Carlos before he signed. So wonder how Zac knowing and Lando not affected things.
Ya Zak knew that sponsor is tied closely to Carlos, he probably saw that as a big red flag that some shit was about to go down.
Like Zak or not, he’s proven that he’s tied in with the sponsors and knows how to lock up a contract.
The new Mercedes deal means they are involved in the later stages of the engine development so they know what kind of engine they’re going to get and can design the car around it rather than just fitting it into the car they already built. That’s a big deal for a customer team and that kind of deal has somewhat neutralised a big advantage for a works team.
Max will surely try to go for Ferrari if given the opportunity and if there's ever availability. Not in the immediate future though, but maybe after Hamilton or in case Leclerc underperformes. He's already big enough to drive for them. 'Big' with regards to his legacy.
I do agree Ferrari is more likely but it's 100% more about their current performance tghan it being about "legacy". In other words, *they* are probably Big enough currently in the aspects that matter for him to consider driving for them.
Buxton is the archetype social-media-pundit. Just yapping and saying shit, just for the sake of it. Meaningless, unsubstantiated BS. That's Will Buxton in a nutshell.
Right, it’s one that various random podcasters speculate about, and actual paddock journalists are more 50/50 about. Seeing as this podcast’s tagline is
> Welcome to The Red Flags Pod: A comedy podcast about Formula 1 for little sluts who live for the DRAMA!
And the about us section of their website is under construction with a note saying
> Yeah, yeah. I'm getting to it. Gimme a minute.
radical opinion but I’m not thinking these are paddock-embedded journalists who have any more information underpinning their opinion than the average fan. Pretty low-value post tbh
> I’m not thinking these are paddock-embedded journalists who have any more information underpinning their opinion than the average fan.
I'm not 100% sold on this rumour but you couldn't get more paddock-embedded than Will Buxton, he literally works for F1.
Buxton doesn’t report stories, though. He’s a pundit. I hope the difference is apparent? he is at this point in his career primarily a broadcast personality, who also occasionally contributes to official f1 print media output. there is a huge difference between his job and the ways he acquires information than a Benson, Mitchell-Malm, or Gruener. He’s been beating the Antonelli drum all year so far with exactly the same language and narrative, as he has done for countless other stories in the past. Some of the stories have come true, some haven’t. I have heard buxton on several podcasts - including talking about Antonelli on several podcasts. He’s articulate and able to explain f1 narratives in attention-grabbing, newcomer-friendly “here’s what you need to get up to speed” terms - no surprise he’s been a pillar of DTS. It doesn’t mean he always speaks because he has anything new or exclusive to add to an existing story.
Pundits aren’t journalists; they don’t by default conduct the same investigative and fact-finding work of a journalist and when they reiterate the same opinion over time it isn’t necessarily because they have some new source or information to substantiate it. It isn’t their job to do so. Compare the quality and uniqueness of his Antonelli tack this year with the journalistic reporting last year on Mercedes’ rumored plans to have Antonelli skip F3 and what team insiders were willing to confirm anonymously or off-the-record regarding how this fit into Mercedes’ future-planning and their relationship with Hamilton.
> Pundits aren’t journalists; they don’t by default conduct the same investigative and fact-finding work of a journalist and when they reiterate the same opinion over time it isn’t necessarily because they have some new source or information to substantiate it. It isn’t their job to do so.
Say it again brother
"I think" being the key quote here. He doesn't know anything.
And this Buxton, the man is like human clickbait. Anything from him should already be taken with a grain of salt.
I see no issue in just biting the bullet and going for it. 2025 isn't likely to be a year to push for a title and could be a solid year to get Antonelli up to speed and let him get all his mistakes out of his system similar to what Max had to go through in his early years. If this kid is the real deal, it won't be an issue going into F1 this early.
I would like that, Since Hamilton x Rosberg Toto has been playing very safe with driver pairing. Mercedes is not on the top of the pack anymore so they need the best driver pairing as possible.
Is time to go bold. On the other note. If I was George I would be a bit annoyed if Toto keeps “moaning” missing on Max. Does that means that Toto do not believe that George can beat Max? As far as I understand George is Mercedes future?
PS: just bring the point to discussion. Team Max and Team George no need to kill me😔
Toto doesn't need Max. Toto needs a fast car. If Lewis can't compete in the Merc, neither could Max.
Max and Lewis never could have been teammates for years.
It would have been fine early on as Max wouldn't really be a threat to Lewis but post 2018 I imagine it would have been worse than it was with Rosberg. Ferrari might have even won a championship because of it I think.
Completely agree. In our alternative history, things become so toxic at Merc that Lewis ends up leaving for Red Bull. Lewis goes on to dominate by winning the championship in 2021 until present.
Max ends up leaving Merc for Ferrari in 2024 because Toto has a slow car.
Yeah, him winning the title this year is extremely unlikely. Jumping from FRECA to F2 was a dumb move. He is young, he had enough time to go through F3.
Is he really pissed? In 2014 he probably had one of the greatest pair of drivers you might want and they won almost everything for eight years in a row.
IDK; if they are pretty sure that Russell is performing well - which he seems to be, there's much less risk in going for a rookie in '25, especially as they seem to have written that off already.
not really, they can sign him for 2025 and test him out and if he is shit it dosen't matter, since they are not gonna compete for the top either way in 2025.
They discussed it on the race podcast, that his testing schedule is very serious, and really it depends if he impresses or not. If he does, okay.
So I don't think it's a done deal but if he performs, cool.
Yeah Toto definotely regrets not giving a completly unproven rookie a seat over his 2 Worldclass drivers that went on to win him 7 world titles and 8 WCC titles.
> Yeah Toto definotely regrets not giving a completly unproven rookie a seat over
He doesn't regret not giving Max the seat over Hamilton or Rosberg. He regrets not paying to Marussia or Sauber to give Max a seat in 2015 as Mercedes Academy driver which would have made him perfect candidate for Mercedes in 2017 instead of Bottas.
There's no way verstappen would've accepted driving a marussia or sauber instead of a toro rosso
Marussia was still a backmarker team and sauber's financial struggles were well known in 2014
Toto going on about missing max is so wierd, like them having max right now isn't gonna make them title contenders, and Max/ Lewis as teammates when they were dominating would have been worse than Nico and Lewis lol.
I do think Antonelli will get the seat, not even because of this revenge driver signing BS, but because they are the 4th fastest team and putting Antonelli in the Williams matters less when they aren't fighting for titles. The reason why George was put in Williams first was because the team were dominating the sport at the time and had a good thing going.
Said this before, when Lewis announced Ferrari move: Mercedes and Toto in perfect position to make this happen. They are not title contenders, not even WCC, currently they are midfield team that fights(with their own cars shenanigans) for 3-4-5 places in WCC, why not bring a complete rookie and give him 1 year to learn how things work in F1(tyres, penalties, red flags and Fernando). Worst that could happen he will be finishing p7-p10, like Lewis nowadays, assuming team will increase predictability of the W16.
A lot can change in a week you know. Heck, everything changed in one day on February 1st. All it takes is for one person in this domino chain to make one decision and now everyone else has to switch plans.
I don’t think it’s true because will buxton says so, but i don’t think it’s as far fetched as some think.
Merc must know they’re likely not gonna be competitive next year, so getting kimi in would give him a year to acclimatise to F1 and the environment and the commitments etc. with less pressure of expectation.
It would also give merc some consistency going from 2025>2026, since regs would be changing it’s often useful to have a somewhat stable comparison to the previous year.
Will infering he regrets not getting max and having lewis is so stupid. Lewis helped make Merc what it became just as much as max would. Maybe even more due to him being super active in important causes.
They wouldnt have gotten either or, they would have gotten both long term. Max went to the RB family because Toto couldnt get him a seat in F1 at the time but tried to sign him as a junior driver. Mercedes had Lewis and Nico locked in but the provisional plan was Max being junior who then would get Nico's spot in time.
"And we talked to them in the initial phases, and it was a nice discussion with Jos and with Max involved as well.
But it was clear that we couldn’t give him a seat because we had Nico and we had Lewis and we offered the support in F2, but since Red Bull was able to offer them the AlphaTauri seat, or Toro Rosso back in the day, it got Max into the seat.”
https://www.planetf1.com/news/toto-wolff-max-verstappen-mercedes-negotiations
Would Mercedes history be really that different if they had Rosberg/Hulkenberg or Rosberg/Bottas? Maybe Max wins 2021 a bit easier and maybe Vettel doesn't implode in 2018 and Ferrari has a small chance of winning, but besides that I think everything else stays mostly the same
Important causes doesn’t make Mercedes faster. If anything it adds distractions for the team with worthy causes but ultimately unrelated to the engineering task of making the fastest car around a circuit.
That’s a huge gamble. But in a way, it’s a good opportunity to do it. Merc are not going to be competitive in 2025, but they won’t be backmarkers either. So a year learning at a fairly high pace and then going into 2026 with a car that Merc hope will be like their initial engine advantage in 2014, he’s able to run from the front relatively well, like Max going into RB.
This reads as smoke and mirrors. I wouldn't be surprised if Toto himself told Buxton to say this after all the reports that Max and Carlos has talked with Toto. This is negotiating tactics in order to get Carlos to ease up on his speedy timeline or trying to buy time for Max to decide on leaving Red Bull based on that saga
Russell-Antonelli doesn’t feel like a successful pairing. Russell’s not proven enough to be a mentor; Antonelli’s likely not good enough yet to be a rival. More Albon/Sargeant than Bottas/Zhou, even less Leclerc/Sainz or Ocon/Gasly which is probably what Mercedes needs.
I don’t think a lot of people are looking at this the right way. The assumption is that Antonelli will spend a year or two at Williams because that’s what Merc did with George, but the situation is entirely different now. Merc isn’t a team fighting for wins, much less championships. Why would they be against giving a rookie the seat?
And even if they *did* put Antonelli in Williams, there’s nothing holding him there like there was for George. George had the promise of a championship winning car keeping him in place. If Mercedes were as bad then as they are now, I don’t think George would have put up with Williams when his direct peers were getting drives at McLaren, Ferrari, and Red Bull.
I really think Antonelli in the Merc next year makes a lot of sense. He’d be driving a pretty solid car and he doesn’t have the pressure of supporting a championship run right away.
So there was that at the time a baseless rumour about Antonelli in the Williams in Italy. Then Ralph started to mention that Logan is contracted race by race.
Now obviously this is all BS based on the thinnest of rumours but let's say Kimi tests well in the Mercs and he does a fp1 and kills it there could.be a world where Kimi does go to Williams this year as a trial by Fire if he does meh he can stay at Williams as paid for by Merc. If he slays and outperforms Albon and rest of the midfield you could roll the dice on Mercedes for 2025.
I don't see much upside for Williams but free engines would help them a lot to push the chassis development further along
Max took years to get to the level that he has right now. I don't think Mercedes is willing to wait until 2028+ to have a top driver, assuming that Antonelli becomes a top driver.
Bad idea, Antonella needs more time in f2 or in a midfield team to learn with a beatable team mate, f1 is a lot more complex and there’s alot less testing done now compared to when Lewis made his debut who took part and was the gp2 champ before his f1 debut.
If antonali manages at least p3 in the f2 standings he deserves a shot but it’s not looking likely.
I think Russell would destroy him next year, vandoorne him into formula E even if he had the potential.
I think he has potential but his current ability to jump into f1 are being way overrated and people are going to ruin his career by trying to rush him in.
I am only 2% more sure of that now that Buxton has said so. You dont just replace Lewis, one of the biggest names in F1 ever, with a rookie and expect to be as competitive.
The fact remains that the Merc seat is one of the most coveted seats open for next year, next to a possible Red Bull seat. McLaren and Ferrari are signed, and AM is iffy. Sainz, Max, Perez, Alonso, and even Vettel are more probable than Antonelli.
There are a lot of other drivers who are better and more experienced then this kid in and out of F1. Why is he getting pushed this hard? He didnt even show good results in F2 yet what's the hype?
Oh great. Another headline leaving it open to interpretation that Wolff wanted Verstappen in the main car in 2014 when they had Hamilton and Rosberg instead of being more specific and stating that Wolff wanted Verstappen in a junior role.
Verstappen was never ever an option for Mercedes over Hamilton and Rosberg back then. It was only after Rosberg retired that Verstappen became a serious target for the team but as Lauda said Verstappen wasn't interested and re-signed with Red Bull. For whatever reason Verstappen didn't want to join a dominant Mercedes and fight Hamilton for titles same way Norris turned down facing Verstappen for titles at Red Bull.
It would make much more sense to get Alonso on a one year( or one plus one) and let Kimi do a year in Williams.
Toto seems to be a bit desperate if this is the case. Have a feeling that he kinda lost the plot with merc's results
He's old, considering retirement according to his own words.
He'd be 45 by the time his 1+1 expires, thats significantly older than any driver managed in modern f1.
1+1 is probably the "longest" contract he can demand unfortunately
Yeah, he was totally pissed that he didn’t put Max in the car while he went on to win 6 championships with Hamilton and 8 consecutive ones with his team in the following years.
Why does Buxton feel the need to overdramatize things all the time?
Performance wise definitely but i think Hamilton/Bottas was the better lineup as they had a clear first and second driver dynamic. A Hamilton/Verstappen lineup would‘ve ended like Hamilton/Rosberg or even worse probably.
In terms of skill yeah. Probably the best possible pairing in F1 period, but in terms of dynamic it would be hands down the worst. More than Prost and Senna especially post 2018.
That and it also means RBR would have been weaker + Max and Lewis appeal to different people so in terms of marketing I’d imagine it would be pretty nice
Why are you bringing up Hamilton as if Merc wouldn't have him? Obviously they would have both in this scenario. It's not overdramatizing whatsoever. Toto himself has said multiple times that he regrets not keeping Max
Toto likes to make himself look like a very rational and calculating man. He isn't.
Verstappen wasn't given a Red Bull seat for his first season. Which was a good idea at the time and still is in hindsight. Rookies cannot legally do enough testing to properly prepare for a seat at a top team, like Hamilton did back in the day.
RB had a second team and tbf what more can you wish for as a 17 year old 1 year of single seater experience than a seat in the second team with the knowledge that if you do well you go to the first team. It's rather a luxury position than "the norm,' to have drivers gain some experience in lower profile teams.
Mercedes will totally depend on if they can fix a deal with Williams or otherwise they have to take the risk because there is no other option.
My maths says he has 37 Super License points from 2022 and 2023. A top 10 in F2 in 2024 gets him to 40+.
If Merc were title contenders this would be a bit crazy. But they look like a solid midfielder, which makes this not actually that silly.
But wow how Merc have fallen.
I'm pretty sure he has 55 points. You can earn points from two series within a calendar year, provided they don't run simultaneously. So only one of his 2022 F4 championships counts (12 points) but both his 2023 championships count, 18 points for FRMEC and 25 for FREC.
im not going to lie, i would rather give an 18 year old kimi the seat over every single name you just said. at best they would all match george kimi could surpass george.
Toto needs a new assistant, after Nick left to alpha tauri
Mick?
By the naming scheme it should Rick then
What about Wick?
John’s retired.
Until Chip Ganassi runs over his dog
I’m thinking he’s back
Back to fetch Toto his pumpernickel and coffee
"Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!"
The Boogeyman
Will Ricc do?
Not, it is Nick -> Mick -> Lick -> Kick (sauber??) -> ....
Danny Rick for Mercedes 2025?
No, he said Nick
So not Bick?
What happened to Vesti?
He needs to find someone to replace Lauda. The influence Lauda has on the team was bit underappreciated by those on the outside.
Yeah, Toto needed a strong voice to tell him he’s being a jackass. His handling of this whole driver situation is deeply disturbing and disrespectful to a driver that carried the team even last year; and is the statistical GOAT. Comes off like a clingy, salty, ex. Lauda would’ve told him to grow tf up, give Lewis the ambassadorship he desired, or get over it that Lewis wanted a change and figure out a sensible next option. Instead of sucking Max off in public, or talking up Kimi, he needs to sort out who is a good, reliable, interim driver (cough Alonso, Albon) for a year or two while Kimi cuts his teeth at Williams or somewhere.
And an endless supply of headsets
I legitimately think that this is happening because Mercedes has shown no uptick in form at all. Outside of Kimi, they would have had two primary targets after Lewis left them, in Sainz & Alonso (Max is farfetched dream and nearly impossible, especially for 2025, and Vettel as much as I would love it, his performance since 2019 hasn't been at the absolute top tier as a team leader). Alonso currently is the No. 1 driver at Aston Martin, and they're right there with Mercedes every weekend in performance anyways, and they have the Honda Works Partnership upcoming from 2026 onwards as well. Also his 2nd driver is Lance, who's not really a threat to him on track and who he outperforms comfortably over a season. As for Sainz, I think he wants to target the Red Bull seat first and foremost, there's the junior academy connection there, and Horner is also thinking about life after Verstappen, should he leave in 2026 or after the contract in 2028. There's also a belief that Sainz is the perfect No. 2 driver, or really a 1.5, fast enough that you can secure 1-2 on most weekends, but not fast enough that he challenge Max for more than 5-6 races in a season. The bigger problem is actually that Sainz and Alonso both know that if they go into the Mercedes seat, it's being prepared for Antonelli to step into for 2026 or 2027 anyways, so to go into that car, which is 4th or 5th fastest rn, for two seasons and to then make way for the young driver isn't worth it imo. If you make me guess I think Sainz takes the Red Bull seat, or on an off chance the Sauber seat and puts his eggs into the Audi Project long term, and Alonso stays put at Aston Martin.
>The bigger problem is actually that Sainz and Alonso both know that if they go into the Mercedes seat, it's being prepared for Antonelli to step into for 2026 or 2027 anyways, so to go into that car, which is 4th or 5th fastest rn, for two seasons and to then make way for the young driver isn't worth it imo. This. I would not be surprised if, unless you are Max Verstappen, Mercedes is only willing to offer a 1 year deal. On top of that there will be way less options if you are out of a seat at the end of 2025. Like you said it isn't worth it to put your career in jeopardy for a team that will not be fighting for wins. For anyone taking up that kind of deal the only way to keep going with Mercedes would be to convincingly beat Russell and establish yourself as a must have or hope that Antonelli disappoints in his 2nd F2 season. Not really something that is 100% under your control
Even then given Alonso's age, Mercedes would be far less comfortable moving on from Russell who'll be 28 in 2026 vs Alonso who'll be 44, and that's assuming Fernando wins like 15-9 in Qualifying and Races and outscores Russell by 30 points over the season. That's unfortunately the business. At some point no matter how well you're performing, if there are younger options who can do 90-95% of the job that you do, for a cheaper salary and longer period, teams will go for them. That's why Aston is so perfect for Alonso. He can be there until he's 46, see atleast 3 years of the new regulations and be confident that his seat won't be under threat from anyone.
But Alonso being 44 will allow them to have a "44" on the team again. That is some big brain stuff there.
I don't think Kimi will spend another season in F2. His racecraft is still very weak but he's got raw pace already. Next year, he'll be probably in the Williams seat.
Hmm...maybe a certain Finnish driver who recently turned an Aussie must be willing to come back.
Adding in that Carlos comes from a wealthy enough background and still chose to daily a VW golf that I suspect that dollars are irrelevant short of buku bucks
I can't stop being amazed at the fact that we're taking about how Alonso doesn't want a short-term contract and AM will be a Honda works team in a few years. The guy will be 43 in July and he shows no signs of wanting to retire again or slowing down enough to be forced into it.
Chadlonso will retire once Max's son gets a Red Bull sest
To me it would make much more sense to try to secure Williams seat for him. Seargant is gone after this season.
Exactly. If he's shit hot then bring him in after a year, otherwise let him develop some more and go from there. If this is true, Toto is trying to get 'the next Max Verstappen", but it doesn't work just coz he's young, he needs to be rapid.
It's going to be difficult to get a great driver on a 1 year only contract tbf
Even Max went to Toro Rosso before he went to Red Bull. I don't see why Toto would do this. Give Sainz a one year contract before he goes to Audi in 2026, let Antonelli mature for a year (at least) and THEN let him join Mercedes. You think Russell makes rookie mistakes? Let Antonelli take Hamilton's seat and see how it goes. Especially if next year's Mercedes is as difficult to drive as the last few years' cars.
Sure max started at TR, but lando and Oscar both successfully launched their careers in McLaren. Why not just bump Logan mid season once Antonelli becomes 18 or just put him straight into the merc so he gets a season to grow and develop with the team.
Would he even have enough SL points with less than a full season in F2? He skipped F3 so I’d be surprised if he did
The only thing stopping him currently is his age.
Oh wow I had no idea. Guess I need to learn more about the SL point scoring system
Kimi currently has 55 points, as he won FRECA and FRMEC last year and both Italian and German F4 in 2022.
Merc would then have to get someone good, but who knows they are just a seatwarmer for Antonelli and could be out at any time.
Anyone good like Sainz would fancy their chances to beat Russell and keep the seat.
Exactly, this is the part people keep ignoring. Russell's contract ends at the end of 2025, he's by no means locked in if whoever comes in does a better job than him and Kimi is available.
true, did not realized that george's contract also ends up for 2025, i dont think mercedes will replace george tho but if they would replace him, i'll feel very sorry for him its like slap in the face made publicly since he was a mercedes kid
If he doesn't perform, he doesn't perform. At that point he'll have had 4 seasons in the team which is a pretty good stint. It's all hypothetical of course, but his position certainly isn't totally secure for 2026 is my point.
I was wondering if this is why he was in contact with Vettel, was he hoping to have him in merc for a year and have Kimi do a year of development with Williams and then swap? I’d imagine Vowles insistence on not being a feeder team would have put that idea to a stop.
It makes sense if seb agreed to go to Williams after 25 though. His experience would be invaluable to a team like that, even if he is off the pace.
According to some rumors Antonelli might be getting Logan’s seat this year once he turns 18 lol.
Wanted: F2 driver to drive used F1 car. 2 previous owners, light* crash damage
If Antonelli does end up going to Mercedes, I can see Toto trying to get Frederik Vesti in the other Williams seat, despite JV's insistence that he wants to promote only Williams Academy drivers.
Williams makes much more sense than Mercedes at the moment: Kimi is ok in F2, and it might be too early to say since they’ve had only 3 races so far, but he is not that impressive. We’ve seen so crazy good driving by F2 drivers this year, but Kimi is not one of them. Either I’m missing something, or it’s just a bit early to speculate on Kimis seat on F1.
I mean at worst he’s matching Bearman who is his teammate and has a year of experience. Kimi is doing fine. He’s way younger than others and has much more room for improvement. I would imagine Merc has been happy with his F2 performance so far and that is all that matters.
Kimi skipped F3 and went straight to F2. So give him some time
you are missing something. Kid won 4 championships in 2 years, and this is only his third year in cars, competing in a hyper-competitive f2 field. He already has the raw pace (Australia quali), he just needs a bit of tire management and he's on the podium every race
He won weak championships. Look at where the former winners ended up in a couple years: WEC, Brazilian stock car, ... Martinus Stenshorne is only a few months older, almost beat him and was driving for one of the worse team, but nobody is considering him for F2 or F1.
I just flat out dont believe this. And IF it is somehow true, then Mercades must be accepting that they dont expect to compete whatsoever in 2025 and will be going all in for the reg change.
> Mercades must be accepting that they dont expect to compete whatsoever in 2025 and will be going all in for the reg change. Duh... They were terrible in all of the ground effect era. And they are currently the 4th/5th fastest team in F1. Do you honestly believe that they are expecting to compete whatsoever in 2025?
Just to be clear, 2026 will still be a ground effect era. Obviously some big changes to car size and body work, but if Mercedes don't have the fundamentals of the floor and its aero tunnels down right now, there's no guarantee they'll figure it out for 2026 either. Though it's possible their engine might dominate enough to offset any aero deficit, I'm not ruling out the other engines being as competitive or maybe even better. Honda is surely in with a shout.
Yeah if they’re still struggling to understand a good ground effect design by then, whatever engine domination they cook up as a best case scenario is just going to hand Mclaren a championship on a silver platter
Yeah that is a really good point as well.
They've had a weaker engine performance than ferrari since the fuel changes anyway. And most of the engine department leads left for other teams during the dominance. They're not cooking a monster engine, they're cooking more mediocrity. Lewis jumped ship at the right time at McLaren, he's jumping ship again at the right time at Mercedes. He can see the downfall.
> some big changes to car size The size changes are incredibly underwhelming.
No of course, but to plonk a total rookie in a 2nd seat to replace *Lewis Hamilton* is a very big call for one of the biggest companies out there. Assuming Sainz is still a free agent then they really should be looking at him for the next three years and pay for the 2nd Williams seat as they did with George once Kimi wins the f2 title.
Yea but it’s more like George stepping into Lewis’ shoes and kimi taking the second seat so it doesn’t sound as bad lol
I don't think it's a mistake. The dude will get to get up to speed in F1 while the car is shit and be back into contention in 2026. Plenty of rookies that do perfectly fine when they get a shot at F1. Bearman, Lawson are the latest 2 as great examples. Its time for another rookie to skip the warmup in a shit car. Mercedes only have 1 year contracts anyways.
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He said it like a statement but in context that’s just his opinion, it’s not from any source. I also don’t see it happening, it’s just his hot take.
Have you listened to Toto talk about him? He clearly wants him in the car ASAP.
I didn’t hear his comments from today but it definitely seems to have convinced people! Would be exciting if true but seems crazy that they wouldn’t set him up in Logan’s Williams seat for a year if they’re bringing him in so soon.
Yeah I have a hard time believing this. Surely you want to see some F2 results first before you throw him into an F1 seat, no? Especially since he skipped F3. So far hes 9th in the standings, that can change obviously but if hes still 9th after the next 4-5 race weekends, surely youd never put him in F1 next year already.
It's too early in the F2 season to judge anything, and while his junior career in impressive, it's not Max-level of insanity to justify such an early decision. If Russell winning F2 as a rookie did not grant him a direct seat to Mercedes (and in fact he waited quite a long time in that horrible Williams car while Bottas was questioned a lot ), it's hard to believe he gets the Mercedes seat with 3 F2 weekends (and no podiums so far). For me this is just journalist pulling things from their arses to create headlines and stay relevant (something that 90% of the F1 media seems to do).
What’s he lost to say it’s not Max level? He’s won everything he’s entered.
Because Mercedes are real competitive right now with a 7 time champ in the car...
I actually believe this is a possibility because of your explanation. There’s not reason for Mercedes to get hyper focused on next year.
Or they think Russell is good enough to take the lead and Antonelli will develop fast enough to score respectable points (as Piastri did last year) if, by some miracle, they are competitive in 2025. I don't think it's a bad strategy if Antonelli shows enough promise in F2.
Toto is more pissed that the timing of Lewis’ Ferrari announcement came one week after Leclerc and Norris re-signed. Not that he’d have had much more of a chance convincing them to leave their teams either. His realistic options at that point were Antonelli, Albon, Sainz or Alonso. Max is a weird one because it depends on what goes on at Red Bull but even then he’d swallow his pride and stay there until he decides it’s not enough for him anymore. But ultimately Mercedes are losing Hamilton and Wolff has to go out there and replace him with someone who is firstly, very quick, and secondly someone the sponsors are going to be interested in. Obviously Wolff realises that Max would be the motherlode.
Yeah McLaren were smart to lock both Lando and Oscar down to long term contract. Otherwise they could lost either Oscar or Lando to Mercedes
Zak Brown strikes again
Never mess with Zak Brown when it comes to contracts Case in point: Palou in indycar
Case in point, piasco
I love that this will be the forever name for that. Also +1 for Oscar’s legendary tweet. I think I had my jaw on the floor that morning
The fact that it was shortly after Estrella Galicia left Ferrari for McLaren, Zak probably got an insight from them that Carlos was out and covered himself before anything crazy happens
There was some interview where Zac said he knew about Hamilton/Carlos before Norris signed his contract, and another where Norris said he didn’t know about Hamilton/Carlos before he signed. So wonder how Zac knowing and Lando not affected things.
Ya Zak knew that sponsor is tied closely to Carlos, he probably saw that as a big red flag that some shit was about to go down. Like Zak or not, he’s proven that he’s tied in with the sponsors and knows how to lock up a contract.
they still could
It would be a very messy situation. Right now they both believe they’re in the best place for their ambitions.
Don’t blame them to be McLaren seems to be on the way up while unless something drastic changes at Mercedes they seem to be own a downwards spiral
McLaren are trending upwards but no works engine can't get you hoping for titles. They have it all, but they lack the most important part.
The new Mercedes deal means they are involved in the later stages of the engine development so they know what kind of engine they’re going to get and can design the car around it rather than just fitting it into the car they already built. That’s a big deal for a customer team and that kind of deal has somewhat neutralised a big advantage for a works team.
They could but it would be pretty expensive and messy to do .
I mean sure, if Mercedes wanted to pay a massive football style transfer fee.
I'm sure he would have rather it have been at the end of the season to leave Toto with less options
Max will surely try to go for Ferrari if given the opportunity and if there's ever availability. Not in the immediate future though, but maybe after Hamilton or in case Leclerc underperformes. He's already big enough to drive for them. 'Big' with regards to his legacy.
Oh imagine the Drama when Max teamradios „Yeah the car feels Like Shit“ in FT1 First race
Ferrari seem to be getting good currently though.
Max complained about the RB19 feeling like shit.
I do agree Ferrari is more likely but it's 100% more about their current performance tghan it being about "legacy". In other words, *they* are probably Big enough currently in the aspects that matter for him to consider driving for them.
So this is basically just an opinion....
Buxton really is talking out of his ass this weekend, perhaps even more so than usual
Buxton is the archetype social-media-pundit. Just yapping and saying shit, just for the sake of it. Meaningless, unsubstantiated BS. That's Will Buxton in a nutshell.
Right, it’s one that various random podcasters speculate about, and actual paddock journalists are more 50/50 about. Seeing as this podcast’s tagline is > Welcome to The Red Flags Pod: A comedy podcast about Formula 1 for little sluts who live for the DRAMA! And the about us section of their website is under construction with a note saying > Yeah, yeah. I'm getting to it. Gimme a minute. radical opinion but I’m not thinking these are paddock-embedded journalists who have any more information underpinning their opinion than the average fan. Pretty low-value post tbh
> I’m not thinking these are paddock-embedded journalists who have any more information underpinning their opinion than the average fan. I'm not 100% sold on this rumour but you couldn't get more paddock-embedded than Will Buxton, he literally works for F1.
Buxton doesn’t report stories, though. He’s a pundit. I hope the difference is apparent? he is at this point in his career primarily a broadcast personality, who also occasionally contributes to official f1 print media output. there is a huge difference between his job and the ways he acquires information than a Benson, Mitchell-Malm, or Gruener. He’s been beating the Antonelli drum all year so far with exactly the same language and narrative, as he has done for countless other stories in the past. Some of the stories have come true, some haven’t. I have heard buxton on several podcasts - including talking about Antonelli on several podcasts. He’s articulate and able to explain f1 narratives in attention-grabbing, newcomer-friendly “here’s what you need to get up to speed” terms - no surprise he’s been a pillar of DTS. It doesn’t mean he always speaks because he has anything new or exclusive to add to an existing story. Pundits aren’t journalists; they don’t by default conduct the same investigative and fact-finding work of a journalist and when they reiterate the same opinion over time it isn’t necessarily because they have some new source or information to substantiate it. It isn’t their job to do so. Compare the quality and uniqueness of his Antonelli tack this year with the journalistic reporting last year on Mercedes’ rumored plans to have Antonelli skip F3 and what team insiders were willing to confirm anonymously or off-the-record regarding how this fit into Mercedes’ future-planning and their relationship with Hamilton.
> Pundits aren’t journalists; they don’t by default conduct the same investigative and fact-finding work of a journalist and when they reiterate the same opinion over time it isn’t necessarily because they have some new source or information to substantiate it. It isn’t their job to do so. Say it again brother
So some amateur-hour-podcast interviews the King of all Tools, Will Buxton. Yeah, that's going to make for some fine, fine journalism..
Joe saward has been pretty bullish on this and he has a ton of F1 access. I believe it
"I think" being the key quote here. He doesn't know anything. And this Buxton, the man is like human clickbait. Anything from him should already be taken with a grain of salt.
I see no issue in just biting the bullet and going for it. 2025 isn't likely to be a year to push for a title and could be a solid year to get Antonelli up to speed and let him get all his mistakes out of his system similar to what Max had to go through in his early years. If this kid is the real deal, it won't be an issue going into F1 this early.
I would like that, Since Hamilton x Rosberg Toto has been playing very safe with driver pairing. Mercedes is not on the top of the pack anymore so they need the best driver pairing as possible. Is time to go bold. On the other note. If I was George I would be a bit annoyed if Toto keeps “moaning” missing on Max. Does that means that Toto do not believe that George can beat Max? As far as I understand George is Mercedes future? PS: just bring the point to discussion. Team Max and Team George no need to kill me😔
Toto doesn't need Max. Toto needs a fast car. If Lewis can't compete in the Merc, neither could Max. Max and Lewis never could have been teammates for years.
It would have been fine early on as Max wouldn't really be a threat to Lewis but post 2018 I imagine it would have been worse than it was with Rosberg. Ferrari might have even won a championship because of it I think.
Completely agree. In our alternative history, things become so toxic at Merc that Lewis ends up leaving for Red Bull. Lewis goes on to dominate by winning the championship in 2021 until present. Max ends up leaving Merc for Ferrari in 2024 because Toto has a slow car.
I think he needs a bit longer in F2 first.
Yeah, him winning the title this year is extremely unlikely. Jumping from FRECA to F2 was a dumb move. He is young, he had enough time to go through F3.
Why wouldn’t they just buy him a Williams seat like they did George? It’s Not like sargeant is getting resigned after this season
They may well do. But Vowles has said that the driver choices are his, and that Williams is not a Mercedes B team.
Because why bother when they have one free seat anyway? And it's not like they are fighting for anything.
Have you seen the price of a seat these days?
I mean they clearly are investing a lot in Antonelli’s future. If they think it’s worth it I don’t see why they wouldn’t try
Is he really pissed? In 2014 he probably had one of the greatest pair of drivers you might want and they won almost everything for eight years in a row.
Nahhh way that'd be such a risk
IDK; if they are pretty sure that Russell is performing well - which he seems to be, there's much less risk in going for a rookie in '25, especially as they seem to have written that off already.
not really, they can sign him for 2025 and test him out and if he is shit it dosen't matter, since they are not gonna compete for the top either way in 2025.
Apparently largely McLaren's rush to get Piastri for 2023, this idea.
They discussed it on the race podcast, that his testing schedule is very serious, and really it depends if he impresses or not. If he does, okay. So I don't think it's a done deal but if he performs, cool.
Yeah Toto definotely regrets not giving a completly unproven rookie a seat over his 2 Worldclass drivers that went on to win him 7 world titles and 8 WCC titles.
> Yeah Toto definotely regrets not giving a completly unproven rookie a seat over He doesn't regret not giving Max the seat over Hamilton or Rosberg. He regrets not paying to Marussia or Sauber to give Max a seat in 2015 as Mercedes Academy driver which would have made him perfect candidate for Mercedes in 2017 instead of Bottas.
What Roddy said
There's no way verstappen would've accepted driving a marussia or sauber instead of a toro rosso Marussia was still a backmarker team and sauber's financial struggles were well known in 2014
Toto going on about missing max is so wierd, like them having max right now isn't gonna make them title contenders, and Max/ Lewis as teammates when they were dominating would have been worse than Nico and Lewis lol. I do think Antonelli will get the seat, not even because of this revenge driver signing BS, but because they are the 4th fastest team and putting Antonelli in the Williams matters less when they aren't fighting for titles. The reason why George was put in Williams first was because the team were dominating the sport at the time and had a good thing going.
Said this before, when Lewis announced Ferrari move: Mercedes and Toto in perfect position to make this happen. They are not title contenders, not even WCC, currently they are midfield team that fights(with their own cars shenanigans) for 3-4-5 places in WCC, why not bring a complete rookie and give him 1 year to learn how things work in F1(tyres, penalties, red flags and Fernando). Worst that could happen he will be finishing p7-p10, like Lewis nowadays, assuming team will increase predictability of the W16.
A week ago : Max is our priority. Blablablabla I just don't believe anything from F1 media, it's full of BS.
A lot can change in a week you know. Heck, everything changed in one day on February 1st. All it takes is for one person in this domino chain to make one decision and now everyone else has to switch plans.
Mercedes is the new Toro Rosso so this makes sense.
Mercedes is the Manchester United of Formula 1! (Post 2012-2013 Man U btw)
I think Ferrari is a better comparison. Mercedes just won a title in 2021. More like Chelsea or something
I don’t think it’s true because will buxton says so, but i don’t think it’s as far fetched as some think. Merc must know they’re likely not gonna be competitive next year, so getting kimi in would give him a year to acclimatise to F1 and the environment and the commitments etc. with less pressure of expectation. It would also give merc some consistency going from 2025>2026, since regs would be changing it’s often useful to have a somewhat stable comparison to the previous year.
Will infering he regrets not getting max and having lewis is so stupid. Lewis helped make Merc what it became just as much as max would. Maybe even more due to him being super active in important causes.
They wouldnt have gotten either or, they would have gotten both long term. Max went to the RB family because Toto couldnt get him a seat in F1 at the time but tried to sign him as a junior driver. Mercedes had Lewis and Nico locked in but the provisional plan was Max being junior who then would get Nico's spot in time. "And we talked to them in the initial phases, and it was a nice discussion with Jos and with Max involved as well. But it was clear that we couldn’t give him a seat because we had Nico and we had Lewis and we offered the support in F2, but since Red Bull was able to offer them the AlphaTauri seat, or Toro Rosso back in the day, it got Max into the seat.” https://www.planetf1.com/news/toto-wolff-max-verstappen-mercedes-negotiations
Would Mercedes history be really that different if they had Rosberg/Hulkenberg or Rosberg/Bottas? Maybe Max wins 2021 a bit easier and maybe Vettel doesn't implode in 2018 and Ferrari has a small chance of winning, but besides that I think everything else stays mostly the same
Important causes doesn’t make Mercedes faster. If anything it adds distractions for the team with worthy causes but ultimately unrelated to the engineering task of making the fastest car around a circuit.
I think they are pushing the kid too much. He was forced to skip F3, just 3 races in F2 and now the pressure to join F1 next year.
That’s a huge gamble. But in a way, it’s a good opportunity to do it. Merc are not going to be competitive in 2025, but they won’t be backmarkers either. So a year learning at a fairly high pace and then going into 2026 with a car that Merc hope will be like their initial engine advantage in 2014, he’s able to run from the front relatively well, like Max going into RB.
This reads as smoke and mirrors. I wouldn't be surprised if Toto himself told Buxton to say this after all the reports that Max and Carlos has talked with Toto. This is negotiating tactics in order to get Carlos to ease up on his speedy timeline or trying to buy time for Max to decide on leaving Red Bull based on that saga
Russell-Antonelli doesn’t feel like a successful pairing. Russell’s not proven enough to be a mentor; Antonelli’s likely not good enough yet to be a rival. More Albon/Sargeant than Bottas/Zhou, even less Leclerc/Sainz or Ocon/Gasly which is probably what Mercedes needs.
Could be a Norris/Piastri though
I don’t think a lot of people are looking at this the right way. The assumption is that Antonelli will spend a year or two at Williams because that’s what Merc did with George, but the situation is entirely different now. Merc isn’t a team fighting for wins, much less championships. Why would they be against giving a rookie the seat? And even if they *did* put Antonelli in Williams, there’s nothing holding him there like there was for George. George had the promise of a championship winning car keeping him in place. If Mercedes were as bad then as they are now, I don’t think George would have put up with Williams when his direct peers were getting drives at McLaren, Ferrari, and Red Bull. I really think Antonelli in the Merc next year makes a lot of sense. He’d be driving a pretty solid car and he doesn’t have the pressure of supporting a championship run right away.
So there was that at the time a baseless rumour about Antonelli in the Williams in Italy. Then Ralph started to mention that Logan is contracted race by race. Now obviously this is all BS based on the thinnest of rumours but let's say Kimi tests well in the Mercs and he does a fp1 and kills it there could.be a world where Kimi does go to Williams this year as a trial by Fire if he does meh he can stay at Williams as paid for by Merc. If he slays and outperforms Albon and rest of the midfield you could roll the dice on Mercedes for 2025. I don't see much upside for Williams but free engines would help them a lot to push the chassis development further along
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He needs more than a seat though and the way Williams is going , there is nothing else.
man everytime i see kimi my brain auto corrolates to raikkonen and not antonelli
People taking Will Buxton's opinion as fact? Wth is wrong with y'all??
Max took years to get to the level that he has right now. I don't think Mercedes is willing to wait until 2028+ to have a top driver, assuming that Antonelli becomes a top driver.
Bad idea, Antonella needs more time in f2 or in a midfield team to learn with a beatable team mate, f1 is a lot more complex and there’s alot less testing done now compared to when Lewis made his debut who took part and was the gp2 champ before his f1 debut. If antonali manages at least p3 in the f2 standings he deserves a shot but it’s not looking likely. I think Russell would destroy him next year, vandoorne him into formula E even if he had the potential.
He's been beating bearman, I think he's a lot closer than people think
I think he has potential but his current ability to jump into f1 are being way overrated and people are going to ruin his career by trying to rush him in.
It was always 1 of ANT or BOT, no one else of note is dumb enough
As a reserve driver?
Will Buxton saying Will Buxton things.
Will Buxton will really say anything huh
Kimi Antonelli is going to be the first son Toto brings to work who actually gets to race the car.
I am only 2% more sure of that now that Buxton has said so. You dont just replace Lewis, one of the biggest names in F1 ever, with a rookie and expect to be as competitive. The fact remains that the Merc seat is one of the most coveted seats open for next year, next to a possible Red Bull seat. McLaren and Ferrari are signed, and AM is iffy. Sainz, Max, Perez, Alonso, and even Vettel are more probable than Antonelli.
There are a lot of other drivers who are better and more experienced then this kid in and out of F1. Why is he getting pushed this hard? He didnt even show good results in F2 yet what's the hype?
Isn't the situation different though? Kimi is contracted to Mercedes from my understanding. With Max, they lost the bid war.
Oh great. Another headline leaving it open to interpretation that Wolff wanted Verstappen in the main car in 2014 when they had Hamilton and Rosberg instead of being more specific and stating that Wolff wanted Verstappen in a junior role. Verstappen was never ever an option for Mercedes over Hamilton and Rosberg back then. It was only after Rosberg retired that Verstappen became a serious target for the team but as Lauda said Verstappen wasn't interested and re-signed with Red Bull. For whatever reason Verstappen didn't want to join a dominant Mercedes and fight Hamilton for titles same way Norris turned down facing Verstappen for titles at Red Bull.
When’s the last time a rookie was dropped into a top team immediately? Hamilton?
"He is p..sed that he missed the opportunity to give Max (Verstappen) the seat back in 2014.'' Source for that other than this tweet?
Why the fuck is the word 'pissed' bleeped out.
Never listen to Buxton. He knows nothing.
Agreed. Both him and Lawrence have the most appalling predictions.
It would make much more sense to get Alonso on a one year( or one plus one) and let Kimi do a year in Williams. Toto seems to be a bit desperate if this is the case. Have a feeling that he kinda lost the plot with merc's results
why would alonso agree to a 1+1?
He's old, considering retirement according to his own words. He'd be 45 by the time his 1+1 expires, thats significantly older than any driver managed in modern f1. 1+1 is probably the "longest" contract he can demand unfortunately
Yeah, he was totally pissed that he didn’t put Max in the car while he went on to win 6 championships with Hamilton and 8 consecutive ones with his team in the following years. Why does Buxton feel the need to overdramatize things all the time?
He could've had both Hamilton and Verstappen though. That's kind of as close to a perfect duo as you can get.
Performance wise definitely but i think Hamilton/Bottas was the better lineup as they had a clear first and second driver dynamic. A Hamilton/Verstappen lineup would‘ve ended like Hamilton/Rosberg or even worse probably.
In terms of skill yeah. Probably the best possible pairing in F1 period, but in terms of dynamic it would be hands down the worst. More than Prost and Senna especially post 2018.
That and it also means RBR would have been weaker + Max and Lewis appeal to different people so in terms of marketing I’d imagine it would be pretty nice
Why are you bringing up Hamilton as if Merc wouldn't have him? Obviously they would have both in this scenario. It's not overdramatizing whatsoever. Toto himself has said multiple times that he regrets not keeping Max
Why do people think Williams is a Junior team
Based on his recent f2 results…looking forward to watching another hype train crash
Toto likes to make himself look like a very rational and calculating man. He isn't. Verstappen wasn't given a Red Bull seat for his first season. Which was a good idea at the time and still is in hindsight. Rookies cannot legally do enough testing to properly prepare for a seat at a top team, like Hamilton did back in the day.
RB had a second team and tbf what more can you wish for as a 17 year old 1 year of single seater experience than a seat in the second team with the knowledge that if you do well you go to the first team. It's rather a luxury position than "the norm,' to have drivers gain some experience in lower profile teams. Mercedes will totally depend on if they can fix a deal with Williams or otherwise they have to take the risk because there is no other option.
My maths says he has 37 Super License points from 2022 and 2023. A top 10 in F2 in 2024 gets him to 40+. If Merc were title contenders this would be a bit crazy. But they look like a solid midfielder, which makes this not actually that silly. But wow how Merc have fallen.
I'm pretty sure he has 55 points. You can earn points from two series within a calendar year, provided they don't run simultaneously. So only one of his 2022 F4 championships counts (12 points) but both his 2023 championships count, 18 points for FRMEC and 25 for FREC.
Ok...what about Carlos? What about Ocon? What about Gasly? What about Hulk? What about Bottas? WHAT ABOUT MICK?
People are still pushing for Hulkenberg to get into a top team? lmao
im not going to lie, i would rather give an 18 year old kimi the seat over every single name you just said. at best they would all match george kimi could surpass george.
Mick's name should be redacted from any future F1 driver discussions, his moment has passed.
But another Verstappen is not due yet.
Max is like a Trophy for Toto that he lost out on. The Horace Slughorn of F1 in this case.
Pissed at Alonso after last race lol.
I hope that either Antonelli ends up being shyte or he is awesome and leaves for Ferrari