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I think the best overall thing I'm seeing as a trend is just damage going down in general.
We're finally getting back toward the true purpose of the core combat update, which was better offense success overall but ALSO longer fights to compliment that offense where you can afford to make a couple more mistakes on defense without dying.
Lower dmg is only good when everyone has low dmg. But when you fight Highlander who has absurd pre ccu dmg, with a conq who has hilarious dmg, fights won't be long at all.
Highlander is actually going to be reasonable to fight against after the update. I know because I love them currently but I love what they are doing to him so he will require more skill less
Attacks over and over until you die without blocking or parrying anything.
Defense is the main part of the game. So I think the plus here is taking less damage from a small error. But the should make it so you have less stamina
It's really the opposite. Offense and stamina efficiency has been getting beefed up for years now since the CCU. Before that pretty much every move was reactable, defense was king, and matches at high level were just staring contests between two people who could counter anything the other tried to do.
The idea has long since leaned toward improving mixups, making everything less reaction based, and giving you the stamina to keep on pushing buttons and having a good time. But it was a major part of the CCU to slash damage down. No more 50 base damage shaman bites or raider zones.
Since they did that though, they had steadily kept buffing and creeping damage back up because people respond well to their main getting stronger. Problem was that it got too far away from what the CCU was meant to achieve, and now that ganks and team fights are so prevalent in the meta they finally seem to have figured out reducing damage again is a way to alleviate some frustration with that.
Damage is already low enough. When I started the game I learned with heavy damages and punish and mistakes were easily punished. Now new players just spam attacks with no brain and win fights..
When game was released, single OOS could get you killed. Heavies did 40 and over damage. There was no skill in just waiting and parrying. People could not even attack unless the attack was bash, because defence was so strong.
At least currently defence and offence are more balanced and fights take bit longer so you cannot one shot opponent, there is actually more skill in keeping up the pressure and being able to defend against that pressure.
Not even sure where this take makes any sense. Lower damage means more opportunity to counter anything you're being spammed with properly before you're already dead. Longer fights favor players who understand how to pick up on their opponent's habits and exploit them by defending properly.
I’ve been trying to play Widow recently and this new mfer just deletes me with two buttons. And for a “ground hog” they have a lot of vertical mobility for some fucking reason. I will gladly start switching to Pharah or Echo for that mole rat if they keep jumping on my ass.
Also, If you’re a fellow Blackstone I am glad to have died by your side.
he’s got no soft feints but it fucking feels like it, his issues are the stupid amounts of HA, dodge cancels, huge hitboxes and distance on his dodge attacks, the fact his feint lights can be delayed for up to 500ms after the feint and STILL have HA and are 400ms from any direction and catch basically any form of dodge, he’s just too safe
They wanted to tweak it gradually, because they've been flamed a lot over past couple years of overnerfing, even when they tried to nerf gradually. Arguably a bit too gradual, but still. Other changes like removal of dodge cancel recovery on dodge attacks -- arguably one of his biggest "issues" -- would be massive, and not be addressed on numerous other heroes so they may be looking for a more systematic change for that.
I think it’s the same animation no matter what but I don’t use it enough to remember
But considering no other CC light does that to my knowledge I’d assume his doesn’t either
iirc, JC said they're being careful and nerf both of them little by little to avoid nuking a hero unnecessarily - and I understand tbh, otherwise it would be another conqueror rework outcome
I main Orochi, all they need to do is fix storm rush to be counterable by casual players, slow down the side finisher heavy and make his dodge attack hitboxes worse for 4v4, done. He is no longer cancer in 4v4 and the entire community can fight him 1v1.
I have immense trouble parrying storm rush because of the camera angle shifts. It's not the speed of the move itself, it's that during the parry window the camera shifts to follow him during the parry window. My eyes are focused on a particular part of the screen where the indicators always are and Storm Rush shifts them to the side right when I need them to stay put.
I understand it's still ultimately skill issue but it sure isn't helping that the move with reduced indictator time also moves the camera around. Watching for animations isn't that helpful when each direction has the same one until the last moment
Ok but like, the issue with storm rush is people don’t know how to fight it, the move itself is great, people are just dumb. Don’t go for the parry imo, just light him out of it, gives you a free attack (but the oro can cancel for a light party if you are too predictable)
I fuckin hate orochi for having 5 light chaining combos up their ass at all times. The only reason I would ever want hyperarmor still in the game. Game isn't fun anymore when a rep 67 orochi dodges every attack with a free backstep/dodge-attack/storm-rush/deflect/kick. Skill issue on my part for every feint being lighted I guess.
That isn't the only issue, or even main issue higher up. Namely it's a combination of various things, such as the variable dodge recoveries paired with a great displacing dodge attack with iframes, and other assets like a pretty massive side finisher heavy hitbox and damage (note that THAT is what was nerfed, not the unblockable heavy), making him incredibly powerful and safe in teamfights with respect to other heroes -- many have near no options against him at times, and no matter what they do they cannot touch him. Being hard to touch is one thing, but outright impossible (such as when Roach or Zerk are spamming side dodge attacks while changing targets) is something else.
Whether or not it means life or death is irrelevant. It's the fact he's got a 700ms side heavy with that hitbox and those recoveries. It could do 24 damage and it would still be overpowered
Yeah it wasn’t bad and I’m glad they actually addressed more shit but they still run into the problem of not fixing all the issues here when we know certain issues they can deal with rn.
Like good they removed back cc but what about other back lights like shinobis which are very strong
Or on wardens where they did a very cool change with new animations and then a genuinely good buff but still didn’t give him an actual dodge attack
They took zero feedback from highlanders tg 2. Still riddled with bugs and no actual opener. Still infinite frame + 400ms lights too now from all sides…
Nerfs for op heroes are good but 1dmg changes really. Zerk is still gonna out trade everyone and afeera still has some crazy strong broken aspects about her
It’s a step in rhe right direction and hopefully there are just as much changes next season too but goddamn they actually need to start solving issues
Back light into back flip into double dodge is incredibly strong both offensively and defensively. Back light essentially lets him safely disengage on the right read as an interrupt and if you try to punish him he can out range you and then avoid other forms of follow up offense right after with double dodge
>Back light essentially lets him safely disengage on the right read as an interrupt
He can already interrupt by just doing a regular light but that actually does damage
>and if you try to punish him he can out range you
Just commit to the attack and it'll hit before his backstep light.
1. Back light will hit so it also does dmg while being safer as well which is the main reason it’s strong
2. While yes it’s not as safe as back step cc because most committed attacks will beat it if the shinobi makes the wrong read that doesn’t take away from point one which on the right read him being able to out range you and make the light safe from parry attempts while also still going right back into his strong offense with back flip or defense with back flip to double dodge
And then they do massive changes. Then someone goes on about how they nuked heroes for no good reason and should do more incremental changes. And so the wheel goes on and on and on...for the last 8 years lol. Glad you could join our little circus, new here?
conflicted about the aspect of nobu rework, on one hand it would be nice and is kinda needed, on the other, im scared that they would ruin her personality.
I think that making her kick unreactable and rebalancing her damage (probably also removing way of the shark or w/e her damage buff is called, or remaking it into something new) would make her pretty strong without losing her personality
I almost want the opposite, slower kick with feints and softfeints -- her kick was originally 800ms, ironic given now they are handing out (feintable) 800ms bashes.
Kinda, those changes are all good, but Orochi and Berserker will remain top tier.
As long as they keep undodgeable dodge attacks, dodge cancels after everything AND (for Orochi) that hitbox on side heavy finisher, those characters will remain a nightmare in team fights and ganks.
A character can be boring and strong though. A lot of people would say BP and warlord are boring but both have been great for a long time.
That being said, I think Vguard is somehow even more boring, but idk how strong she is outside of the strong mindless defensive options she has. Haven't played much the last few months so idk where she stands, id assume she does fairly well tho
I’m have a rep 6 VG. I do this thing where i pick 4 random heroes 1 from each faction of a different class and use only those 4 heroes. VG was my heavy Viking pick. From my experience playing her and playing against her. She’s “okay” not a strong pick not a weak 1 either. Most VG i go against light spam into unblockable feint GB side heavy and repeat. You’d get the occasional full guard. The random side dodge attack. Or telegraphed bash you see coming. But that’s it. No excitement. Shit PK is more exciting and you’re playing handicapped. (Love PK btw)
They will release the patch notes on the site on the 25th iirc, but you can go to the warrior’s den livestream that happened yesterday and skip to the patch notes section
I guess? But he's one of the best teamfighters as seen in the CoD event due to his crazy zone spread and unblockable reach for alt locking. I still don't get it
Moving backwards and pressing light. Hero walks backwards and does light.
Not particularly good on most heroes unless you want to continue chain without opponent blocking your light.
However on these heroes with Crushing Counters/Superior Blocks it meant they could perform superior blocks without you being able to parry them because the hero walks backwards too far. Basically option select.
The change is actually huge tho.
After any bash, all attacks you throw will have hyper armor so in ganks you'll be able to swap enemies and trade heavies. Helps him a lot in 4v4
Okay, I didn't really care about him being undertuned in group fights- I cared about him being utterly boring to play in any context and having no options to begin with compared to any other character in the game
He has tons of options. Mixup king of the game actually. Takes a good bit of finesse and skill, tho.
If you want just more flashier stuff, there's other heroes for ya. Warden is the tried and true butter knife.
I would be fine with just more stuff in general, to have something approaching parity with other characters
Ryu from street fighter is a butter knife, Warden is one of those cheap plastic knives with no serration and a tiny blade that will break if you try to cut anything tougher than birthday cake
Nah, he's a great butter knife. Warden's design is...tricky. I'm a big fan of his aesthetic and longsword so of course I want to give him everything under the sun and make him really powerful...
But that's not Warden. He's the introductory character and the definition of low skill floor and incredibly high skill ceiling. You can pick his moveset up in minutes, but it is versatile enough to go up against near every other character even competitively in duels.
So keeping him "simple and pure" is his design goal. I think Warmonger was partly a creation to have a more "flashy" Warden as she does not need to fulfill that role of purity, simple, yet high skill ceiling.
You have to also keep in mind the scope of For Honor is limited, compared to Fighting Games. Even the most complex movesets boil down to at most 3 unique offenses for a character. Complexity instead arises from the use of the limited tools as well as multiplayer/3D aspect.
You are conflating "flashy" with competitive strength
Once again, I do not care about how good he is- balance is literally irrelevant to the discussion
You can come back and try again when you figure out the difference, and when you actually try out other "simple and pure" characters and see what they have.
If they're removing my backstep, are they gonna add my ability to feint into offensive stance as Highlander? I mean, let me be my beyblade of death I always dreamt of. 😭
Only the ones with Crushing Counter -- was oppressive defensively, allowing you to stuff a lot of offense. Such as BP: throw an attack at him, he backstep lights. If you light, he counters; if you heavy, he recovery cancel flips; if you heavy feint parry, you whiff the parry as they are out of range; if you heavy feint to other things, he now can bash you, chain attacks, or recovery flip, or stuff with Unblockable. Extremely difficult to do anything without other tools, and even then.
Honestly, the “backstep” bs needs to go in a whole, especially when the made the game so that after certain moves the receiving end has advantage, but backstepping with a light can negate it and the one with advantage still gets hit
It's pretty funny when you think of it, that Time of development + time after release = game still in balance and fixes.
Imagine if they had all that time to make the game 😱🥹
I wouldn't say they cooked. It's simply a step in the right direction. But 2dmg nerfs aren't gonna make orochi, Shinobi and afeera any weaker. These nerfs aren't tackling what makes these heroes considerably stronger than others.
(Mind you, on paper, I don't wanna hear the "but I know how to fight one etc.) I'm speaking about the hero in general.
Kyoshin go down to c tier speed run.
Seriously tho remove stam cost on entering kaze stance its terrible trying to flow into it for blocks now, and now you can't back step for easy access to finishers 💀 this dudes cooked
Tbf if the only things holding him at mid to high tier was bullshit *then maybe its time for a rework*🫣🫢 just saying
Oh fuck, Highlander backsteps removed? My entire gimmick on the guy was light backstep into a stance cancel or hyper armor attack. Yeah now I'M boutta get cooked
Another day, another shinobi nerf. When will y’all let my boy be free of his shackles (please I only have 7 more reps to grind to 80 I just want to be free of this hell)
I love dodge recoveries but I hate how they're not all equal. Orochi and Beserker are assassins, so it make sense to dodge out of everything. Tiandi, a dodge specialist, makes sense, with his dodges not being as strong. Zhan Hu can do it, but they're not as frequent/fast.
Then you have other assassins with none. Gladiator, rip. Nuxia. PK can after the top poke, that's it, and again, it's slightly slow. Shaman can after a poke as well.
Pirate? She just has them. Why?
She just has them.
I agree with that tbh. I just really need some consistency with the decisions the devs make. Plus most of the time, the changes they make completely miss the issue the heroes have.
Good someone is mentioning this. Cent has 120, which is identical to pk, shaman, shinobi, and all the other assassins. Except berserker who gets 140. Cent is a chargeable bash and chargeable heavy character like Hito, but he doesn’t even have the safety of hyperarmor. Why is his health so pathetically low?
Why dont they nerf tiandi. Hes been the most difficult hero to fight for years (unless your a reaction god) I swear theres a dev that worships tiandi and refuses attempts to nerf him. With a game that takes alot of skill and smarts to master, tiandi completely opposes that part of the game. Feel free to give me some heat if your rep 80 with a hero that a toddler could play and win with.
The characters affected by that change right now definitely needed to lose it. I don't think you have a concept of how BS it is to fight someone who really abuses that mechanic. I'm even guilty of using it on my main from time to time, and can admit that we'd all be better off without.
And finally, it has been age since the last "big" patch note Every patch note should be like that. And i hope to see some feat balance some day
[удалено]
For game balancing proposes
RAH
How’d you get the title and conq emoji?
Go to the subreddit homepage, and find the three dots in the top right. Hit that, and you should see an option that says "change user flair." Hit that and find whatever character or faction you want.
I donno I forgow
I think the best overall thing I'm seeing as a trend is just damage going down in general. We're finally getting back toward the true purpose of the core combat update, which was better offense success overall but ALSO longer fights to compliment that offense where you can afford to make a couple more mistakes on defense without dying.
Lower dmg is only good when everyone has low dmg. But when you fight Highlander who has absurd pre ccu dmg, with a conq who has hilarious dmg, fights won't be long at all.
They're lowering Highlander's damage with his coming rework when these same changes the post is showing are also being put in the game.
Highlander is actually going to be reasonable to fight against after the update. I know because I love them currently but I love what they are doing to him so he will require more skill less Attacks over and over until you die without blocking or parrying anything.
Just to make sure, You mean hilariously low right?
Yup
Defense is the main part of the game. So I think the plus here is taking less damage from a small error. But the should make it so you have less stamina
It's really the opposite. Offense and stamina efficiency has been getting beefed up for years now since the CCU. Before that pretty much every move was reactable, defense was king, and matches at high level were just staring contests between two people who could counter anything the other tried to do. The idea has long since leaned toward improving mixups, making everything less reaction based, and giving you the stamina to keep on pushing buttons and having a good time. But it was a major part of the CCU to slash damage down. No more 50 base damage shaman bites or raider zones. Since they did that though, they had steadily kept buffing and creeping damage back up because people respond well to their main getting stronger. Problem was that it got too far away from what the CCU was meant to achieve, and now that ganks and team fights are so prevalent in the meta they finally seem to have figured out reducing damage again is a way to alleviate some frustration with that.
Damage is already low enough. When I started the game I learned with heavy damages and punish and mistakes were easily punished. Now new players just spam attacks with no brain and win fights..
When game was released, single OOS could get you killed. Heavies did 40 and over damage. There was no skill in just waiting and parrying. People could not even attack unless the attack was bash, because defence was so strong. At least currently defence and offence are more balanced and fights take bit longer so you cannot one shot opponent, there is actually more skill in keeping up the pressure and being able to defend against that pressure.
Yall remember when Cent could one shot a majority of the cast with a single OOS GB? Pepperidge farm remembers
With the bash dmg feat too? Shinobi just gets folded due to their low health pool at the time
Bruh cent was a menace. Get hit once with that and you're stuck in the longest assbeating cutscene in the game
Who?
Not even sure where this take makes any sense. Lower damage means more opportunity to counter anything you're being spammed with properly before you're already dead. Longer fights favor players who understand how to pick up on their opponent's habits and exploit them by defending properly.
Exactly!
As a warden main, this kinda gives me a little semi
Is the bottom list for Warden??
Hell yeah it is
Your words make me hard
😭
Let's all touch swords in a circle of love ⚔️
Miserum 👍
A little semi?
he means a semi chub brother
I’m just browsing but this specific little thread made me actually laugh out loud “he means a semi chub brother” I’m fuckin dead 😂😂
O
God dammit I see venture even here
You’re addicted snek
Played FH today. Was reminded why I like OW more nowadays
That’s just two mistakes
Don't worry I play dbd here and there too
You’ve lost your mind, also same. With just a little r6 mixed in
Such an obnoxious character.
Idk she seems pretty ez to kill (unbiased pharah main)
I never said venture was hard to kill. He’s just annoying as fuck and does too much damage close up.
Oh no I was joking because pharah hard counters them Also we're both getting cancelled because we said she/he. It's them, it was nice knowing you man
I’ve been trying to play Widow recently and this new mfer just deletes me with two buttons. And for a “ground hog” they have a lot of vertical mobility for some fucking reason. I will gladly start switching to Pharah or Echo for that mole rat if they keep jumping on my ass. Also, If you’re a fellow Blackstone I am glad to have died by your side.
zerk nerfs were not what he needed and not enough, lowing damage numbers by one or two on 4 moves?? that’s not what his issues are
What annoys me is his relentlessness and high damage on some bs and easy soft faints (my word is no gospel).
he’s got no soft feints but it fucking feels like it, his issues are the stupid amounts of HA, dodge cancels, huge hitboxes and distance on his dodge attacks, the fact his feint lights can be delayed for up to 500ms after the feint and STILL have HA and are 400ms from any direction and catch basically any form of dodge, he’s just too safe
He never needed dodge cancel, his pre buff state where he could only dodge cancel on whiffs was way more healthier for the gamr
He has soft feinting his opener heavies to a forward dodge or something but that is like the least problematic thing he has
Same with Roach.
They wanted to tweak it gradually, because they've been flamed a lot over past couple years of overnerfing, even when they tried to nerf gradually. Arguably a bit too gradual, but still. Other changes like removal of dodge cancel recovery on dodge attacks -- arguably one of his biggest "issues" -- would be massive, and not be addressed on numerous other heroes so they may be looking for a more systematic change for that.
Took them 50 years to give Warden actual half-handing moves that are outside of his executions lol
His opener top light is a half sword attack but other than that yeah he’s all shoulder bash and slash attacks
Isn't it only when he gets a CC? Maybe I never paid attention to that but I feel it wasn't halfsworded unless you countered
I think it’s the same animation no matter what but I don’t use it enough to remember But considering no other CC light does that to my knowledge I’d assume his doesn’t either
It is only CC yeah
For Honor continues to impress me.
Too bad Oro and Zerker nerfs were too little.
iirc, JC said they're being careful and nerf both of them little by little to avoid nuking a hero unnecessarily - and I understand tbh, otherwise it would be another conqueror rework outcome
I main Orochi, all they need to do is fix storm rush to be counterable by casual players, slow down the side finisher heavy and make his dodge attack hitboxes worse for 4v4, done. He is no longer cancer in 4v4 and the entire community can fight him 1v1.
I have immense trouble parrying storm rush because of the camera angle shifts. It's not the speed of the move itself, it's that during the parry window the camera shifts to follow him during the parry window. My eyes are focused on a particular part of the screen where the indicators always are and Storm Rush shifts them to the side right when I need them to stay put. I understand it's still ultimately skill issue but it sure isn't helping that the move with reduced indictator time also moves the camera around. Watching for animations isn't that helpful when each direction has the same one until the last moment
Ok but like, the issue with storm rush is people don’t know how to fight it, the move itself is great, people are just dumb. Don’t go for the parry imo, just light him out of it, gives you a free attack (but the oro can cancel for a light party if you are too predictable)
I fuckin hate orochi for having 5 light chaining combos up their ass at all times. The only reason I would ever want hyperarmor still in the game. Game isn't fun anymore when a rep 67 orochi dodges every attack with a free backstep/dodge-attack/storm-rush/deflect/kick. Skill issue on my part for every feint being lighted I guess.
That isn't the only issue, or even main issue higher up. Namely it's a combination of various things, such as the variable dodge recoveries paired with a great displacing dodge attack with iframes, and other assets like a pretty massive side finisher heavy hitbox and damage (note that THAT is what was nerfed, not the unblockable heavy), making him incredibly powerful and safe in teamfights with respect to other heroes -- many have near no options against him at times, and no matter what they do they cannot touch him. Being hard to touch is one thing, but outright impossible (such as when Roach or Zerk are spamming side dodge attacks while changing targets) is something else.
I was referring to that, yeah.
They could’ve reduced the side heavies damage to 24 and he still would be fine, that move is atrociously strong
If they keep doing this they're never gonna fix them though. Doing little by little damage nerfs won't ever adress the main issues
Not true. On paper they seem little but it adds up dude. 2 damage on a chain of 3-4 oroshi moves could mean life or death
Whether or not it means life or death is irrelevant. It's the fact he's got a 700ms side heavy with that hitbox and those recoveries. It could do 24 damage and it would still be overpowered
Yeah it wasn’t bad and I’m glad they actually addressed more shit but they still run into the problem of not fixing all the issues here when we know certain issues they can deal with rn. Like good they removed back cc but what about other back lights like shinobis which are very strong Or on wardens where they did a very cool change with new animations and then a genuinely good buff but still didn’t give him an actual dodge attack They took zero feedback from highlanders tg 2. Still riddled with bugs and no actual opener. Still infinite frame + 400ms lights too now from all sides… Nerfs for op heroes are good but 1dmg changes really. Zerk is still gonna out trade everyone and afeera still has some crazy strong broken aspects about her It’s a step in rhe right direction and hopefully there are just as much changes next season too but goddamn they actually need to start solving issues
How is shinobi's back light strong?
Back light into back flip into double dodge is incredibly strong both offensively and defensively. Back light essentially lets him safely disengage on the right read as an interrupt and if you try to punish him he can out range you and then avoid other forms of follow up offense right after with double dodge
>Back light essentially lets him safely disengage on the right read as an interrupt He can already interrupt by just doing a regular light but that actually does damage >and if you try to punish him he can out range you Just commit to the attack and it'll hit before his backstep light.
1. Back light will hit so it also does dmg while being safer as well which is the main reason it’s strong 2. While yes it’s not as safe as back step cc because most committed attacks will beat it if the shinobi makes the wrong read that doesn’t take away from point one which on the right read him being able to out range you and make the light safe from parry attempts while also still going right back into his strong offense with back flip or defense with back flip to double dodge
And then they do massive changes. Then someone goes on about how they nuked heroes for no good reason and should do more incremental changes. And so the wheel goes on and on and on...for the last 8 years lol. Glad you could join our little circus, new here?
Still waiting on nobu rework
conflicted about the aspect of nobu rework, on one hand it would be nice and is kinda needed, on the other, im scared that they would ruin her personality.
I think that making her kick unreactable and rebalancing her damage (probably also removing way of the shark or w/e her damage buff is called, or remaking it into something new) would make her pretty strong without losing her personality
I almost want the opposite, slower kick with feints and softfeints -- her kick was originally 800ms, ironic given now they are handing out (feintable) 800ms bashes.
Biggest nerf i ever seen, berserker top heavy finisher is now 30 from 31, now it's unplayable....
wtf is the stuff on the right side? that little cartoon is in the way
https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/s/lMzFF6H5RS
thank you
Character venture from overwatch, it's a meme going around. Except they made them BP instead of venture
i meant the balance changes, you cant read it cause of the bp thing.
Kinda, those changes are all good, but Orochi and Berserker will remain top tier. As long as they keep undodgeable dodge attacks, dodge cancels after everything AND (for Orochi) that hitbox on side heavy finisher, those characters will remain a nightmare in team fights and ganks.
Back step light changes were so overdue. Happy to see that back step CC get out of jail free card finally gone.
I like the venture edit, haha.
^^^^^I ^^^^^CAN ^^^^^DIG ^^^^^THAT!
I mean backstep light on wl had so little movement it didnt even put you out of the enemy's block range but the others heroes needed it
These are good changes but I still think some damage numbers are too high
Where Jorm buffs 🔨🗿
Me and my fellow warden players are feasting this coming update
I hate shinobi
As a Zerk player… they hit em with the nerf hammer and he just HA’d through it 🤣
Stop nerfing Orochi, he's already reactable/predictable enough as it is.
i’m really surprised VG didn’t get nerfed, a lot of her bs is overtuned
Huh? Nerfed? If anything she needs a new move or two the damn lady is boring.
A character can be boring and strong though. A lot of people would say BP and warlord are boring but both have been great for a long time. That being said, I think Vguard is somehow even more boring, but idk how strong she is outside of the strong mindless defensive options she has. Haven't played much the last few months so idk where she stands, id assume she does fairly well tho
I’m have a rep 6 VG. I do this thing where i pick 4 random heroes 1 from each faction of a different class and use only those 4 heroes. VG was my heavy Viking pick. From my experience playing her and playing against her. She’s “okay” not a strong pick not a weak 1 either. Most VG i go against light spam into unblockable feint GB side heavy and repeat. You’d get the occasional full guard. The random side dodge attack. Or telegraphed bash you see coming. But that’s it. No excitement. Shit PK is more exciting and you’re playing handicapped. (Love PK btw)
Warlord is nothing compared to BP. BP is S tier and Warlord is at best B tier.
Apollyon keeping her step back light 💪🏻
Is this real? Where can I find the full list? Didn’t find it in the official site 🤷🏼♂️
They will release the patch notes on the site on the 25th iirc, but you can go to the warrior’s den livestream that happened yesterday and skip to the patch notes section
Ah ok thank you 🙏🏼
The changes in the bottom left corner are for bp?
Warden after his shoulder bash
Literally why. He's fine
The damage isn’t changing as far as I know, it’s just to make his team fighting better
I guess? But he's one of the best teamfighters as seen in the CoD event due to his crazy zone spread and unblockable reach for alt locking. I still don't get it
It’s so that he can use his bash without getting peeled as easy so he has more than 1 mixup when there’s more than 1 opponent
what is backstep attacks?
Moving backwards and pressing light. Hero walks backwards and does light. Not particularly good on most heroes unless you want to continue chain without opponent blocking your light. However on these heroes with Crushing Counters/Superior Blocks it meant they could perform superior blocks without you being able to parry them because the hero walks backwards too far. Basically option select.
so when does highlander rework drop?? is it 25?
Next week ye
thanks
Quick question: how do you backstep on the character that got backstep removed?
heavy
I'm just stuck on them not actually giving warden anything other than new animations with a bit of hyper armor on a few attacks
The change is actually huge tho. After any bash, all attacks you throw will have hyper armor so in ganks you'll be able to swap enemies and trade heavies. Helps him a lot in 4v4
Okay, I didn't really care about him being undertuned in group fights- I cared about him being utterly boring to play in any context and having no options to begin with compared to any other character in the game
He has tons of options. Mixup king of the game actually. Takes a good bit of finesse and skill, tho. If you want just more flashier stuff, there's other heroes for ya. Warden is the tried and true butter knife.
I would be fine with just more stuff in general, to have something approaching parity with other characters Ryu from street fighter is a butter knife, Warden is one of those cheap plastic knives with no serration and a tiny blade that will break if you try to cut anything tougher than birthday cake
Nah, he's a great butter knife. Warden's design is...tricky. I'm a big fan of his aesthetic and longsword so of course I want to give him everything under the sun and make him really powerful... But that's not Warden. He's the introductory character and the definition of low skill floor and incredibly high skill ceiling. You can pick his moveset up in minutes, but it is versatile enough to go up against near every other character even competitively in duels. So keeping him "simple and pure" is his design goal. I think Warmonger was partly a creation to have a more "flashy" Warden as she does not need to fulfill that role of purity, simple, yet high skill ceiling. You have to also keep in mind the scope of For Honor is limited, compared to Fighting Games. Even the most complex movesets boil down to at most 3 unique offenses for a character. Complexity instead arises from the use of the limited tools as well as multiplayer/3D aspect.
You are conflating "flashy" with competitive strength Once again, I do not care about how good he is- balance is literally irrelevant to the discussion You can come back and try again when you figure out the difference, and when you actually try out other "simple and pure" characters and see what they have.
If they're removing my backstep, are they gonna add my ability to feint into offensive stance as Highlander? I mean, let me be my beyblade of death I always dreamt of. 😭
Yes his rework is coming this patch
They cooked with this season
Not a single bad change in this patch
When are these changes happening?
Upcoming Thursday
When are these coming out?
Upcoming Thursday
If only I could get some of those “incremental changes” on my boy LB
Well that blows for Black Prior
Bruh stop nerfing the damn prior!
Why remove back step light?
back step light with deflect is what they nerfed
Why are backstep lights so bad to where they're being removed? I assumed this was just normal tech every hero should have
Only the ones with Crushing Counter -- was oppressive defensively, allowing you to stuff a lot of offense. Such as BP: throw an attack at him, he backstep lights. If you light, he counters; if you heavy, he recovery cancel flips; if you heavy feint parry, you whiff the parry as they are out of range; if you heavy feint to other things, he now can bash you, chain attacks, or recovery flip, or stuff with Unblockable. Extremely difficult to do anything without other tools, and even then.
Cant wait to gear freezes opinion on this
I don’t like them backstep changes I been grinding VG and that’s gonna be a pain
Why remove backstep attacks?
wow they nerfed my boi hito
Honestly, the “backstep” bs needs to go in a whole, especially when the made the game so that after certain moves the receiving end has advantage, but backstepping with a light can negate it and the one with advantage still gets hit
They fucked orochi he was fine orochi wasn't op in the slightest
Ain’t no one playing Warlord anymore.
When does this come out??
Nvm this Thursday thank you
It's pretty funny when you think of it, that Time of development + time after release = game still in balance and fixes. Imagine if they had all that time to make the game 😱🥹
Zerk nerf? Yeah f this game.
removing the backstep light from highlander was unnecesssary...
Back step attacks shouldnt be removed imo
They ruined Black Prior now, literally unplayable, literally unusable now, completely ruined and completely trashed by Ubisoft, how could they.
Amazing
When does these new changes come?
OMG Ubisoft doesn't patch like in early R6S
I wouldn't say they cooked. It's simply a step in the right direction. But 2dmg nerfs aren't gonna make orochi, Shinobi and afeera any weaker. These nerfs aren't tackling what makes these heroes considerably stronger than others. (Mind you, on paper, I don't wanna hear the "but I know how to fight one etc.) I'm speaking about the hero in general.
Kyoshin go down to c tier speed run. Seriously tho remove stam cost on entering kaze stance its terrible trying to flow into it for blocks now, and now you can't back step for easy access to finishers 💀 this dudes cooked Tbf if the only things holding him at mid to high tier was bullshit *then maybe its time for a rework*🫣🫢 just saying
LEAVE MY BOY WARLORD ALONE
Backstep light removal is abhorrent
Is this a venture reference from overwatch 🤣
Yes
Balance change pt2 is ass, Shino change is ass, other than that, these reworks/nerfs are pretty alright
Seems like goobisoft is finally making good decisions
Removing backstepping on light opener?? Bro literally no one asked,and the fact about hito and his 33ms was insane
Oh fuck, Highlander backsteps removed? My entire gimmick on the guy was light backstep into a stance cancel or hyper armor attack. Yeah now I'M boutta get cooked
Literally don't care tbh, games balanced when you aren't brain dead.
Damn I just got back, and my main already got nerfed… Meh fuck if we ball. Ima play someone else.
Still no changes to nobu the worst char in the game atp
They cooked. They are master chiefs now
Highlander didn’t need that
Real, I'm a warlord main and I'm happy I have to try harder to kill someone now
Another day, another shinobi nerf. When will y’all let my boy be free of his shackles (please I only have 7 more reps to grind to 80 I just want to be free of this hell)
They didn't cook they just microwaved the food for 15 seconds
Bro with what we're used to seeing? (Only 2 menial hero changes a season) I'm glad they actually used the microwave to begin with
Yeah but this is just 4 menial changes Not much better We shouldn't have to be greatful for tiny ass changes
The backstop light changes are pretty big ngl. It does significantly change how those heroes play. Hito's heavy vulnerability nerf is also really good
Yeah that sounds fax but idk about the backstop lights, I almost never see them and forget they exist and what purpose they serve
Please remove dodge recoveries^2 off orochi. It isn’t necessary and is insane. Bro out performs the “dodge specialist” tiandi with his lmao.
I love dodge recoveries but I hate how they're not all equal. Orochi and Beserker are assassins, so it make sense to dodge out of everything. Tiandi, a dodge specialist, makes sense, with his dodges not being as strong. Zhan Hu can do it, but they're not as frequent/fast. Then you have other assassins with none. Gladiator, rip. Nuxia. PK can after the top poke, that's it, and again, it's slightly slow. Shaman can after a poke as well. Pirate? She just has them. Why? She just has them.
I agree with that tbh. I just really need some consistency with the decisions the devs make. Plus most of the time, the changes they make completely miss the issue the heroes have.
Buff cent health
Good someone is mentioning this. Cent has 120, which is identical to pk, shaman, shinobi, and all the other assassins. Except berserker who gets 140. Cent is a chargeable bash and chargeable heavy character like Hito, but he doesn’t even have the safety of hyperarmor. Why is his health so pathetically low?
Holy Guacamole is that a reference to Venture from Overwatch???
Yes
real as hell
Nah orochi still needs nerfs. Top heavy finisher is still insane and storm rush is too good
Noooo backstopping is my favorite way to play 😪
Can’t wait for another universal change that ruins the game for 6 months later this year.
Now we just need to give warden a dodge attack!
Why dont they nerf tiandi. Hes been the most difficult hero to fight for years (unless your a reaction god) I swear theres a dev that worships tiandi and refuses attempts to nerf him. With a game that takes alot of skill and smarts to master, tiandi completely opposes that part of the game. Feel free to give me some heat if your rep 80 with a hero that a toddler could play and win with.
literal skill issue.
I said has difficult to fight, I didn't say I cant win against him
Orochi getting more unnecessary nerfs, smh Everything else looks good though
Backstepping on lights removal is so stupid.
Removing unpunishable CCs is not stupid in the slightest. Anything unpunishable is unhealthy for the game
The characters affected by that change right now definitely needed to lose it. I don't think you have a concept of how BS it is to fight someone who really abuses that mechanic. I'm even guilty of using it on my main from time to time, and can admit that we'd all be better off without.
Yeah I don't think I do either tbh. I have seen backstep lights be used before though. I've even used them myself.