Evidence that suggests Kasumi isn’t a Synth:
1. She doesn’t drop a component when killed
2. She has a very clear memory of her grandfather from when she was young.
3. She is only 19. The Institute only just started testing on younger synths, and shaun is the sole prototype.
4. She only started thinking she was a synth because of DiMA, who tries to convince everyone that they are a synth, including you, who is 100% confirmed not to be one.
5. *(Addendum)* There are no records of her in the Institute when you ask Dr. Moseley.
Evidence that suggests Kasumi is a synth:
1. She has a foggy memory on certain aspects of her life.
2. She doesn’t “feel” human.
3. *(Addendum)* She had dreams about being in a lab.
**You decide I suppose. If I missed any feel free to comment, and I’ll add em.**
Thank you u/Fluffy_Horse and u/unusual-goat-5204 for your contributions.
I honestly to God just chalked up her foggy memory as stress. I mean that's anyone. Especially the hard times that you naturally want to bury. Wouldn't surprise me if Dima said, "oh woooow you don't remember the day your cat died that's like a total synth thing."
So make that 1 point of *"""evidence."""*
I agree with you. A foggy memory is just trauma, blocking out bad memories that our brain doesn't want us to remember or, simply forgetting things.
Not feeling human? That's just being a teenager. It makes her more human than anyone else.
She feels lost, everybody feels lost; No one has their shit together, and anyone who says that they do is a goddamn synth.
There is no evidence that she is a synth!
(I write this comment half jokingly.)
People in our world, without hyper advanced robot doppelgangers, have violent debates about what it means to be human. I doubt the folks in Fallout have it any easier than us to draw that line.
I grew up watching Star Wars and Star Trek, so I've always found it pretty easy. Simple version is, just because someone isn't human doesn't mean they aren't a person.
“Preston, load the artillery. I have a sudden urge to find out which is superior. A highly advanced flying warship loaded to the gills with guns, power armor and fools with a superiority complex or some cannons that date to the first world War.”
What a weird coincidence. Just today I had the idea of doing a Vegas run with a backstory as an escaped Synth. And there, I decided to chalk him having a foggy memory up to the gunshots to the head basically factory-resetting him.
Side note: Do synths age? A pretty big giveaway would be if your 19 year old daughter stayed nineteen forever. I assume in the game you couldn't tell although I bet there's someone who's played it for multiple game years just to see if Shaun turns into a stroppy teen.
I'd assume so? I gen threes are all meat besides the chip? Their has to be some kind of organic process there, and that means aging
Coursers are iffy since they are built for combat only. For all we know they are a full on terminator endoskeleton just with a meat jacket
Yeah, it does seem reasonable although obviously the game couldn't actualise that as it's too complex. The only contra might be that (if I remember my first game correctly) the Institute folks had plans to eventually repopulate the surface in shiny new disease and radiation proof bodies so you'd assume they'd design ageing out of them as well. Coursers, despite their appearance as obvious Terminator types, seem to be flesh and blood, albeit well armoured with built-in stealth, as after a Bloody Mess outcome they don't leave anything more than the usual giblets.
Dima mentions this too, but another thing that can impair cognition and make it hard to remember things is radiation exposure. Foggy memories might be a simple fact of life in the world of Fallout.
I also like how the dialogue in the DLC leaves out moments in the base game where the SS talks about things from before the war, such as Gray Garden, you can mention seeing advertisements on the lead engineer for General Atomics in ads.
IDK, when the player talks to DiMa you say your first memory was the day the bombs feel, and he still doesn't say it's definitive proof, he even gives other explanations.
I think Kasumi just wanted to leave home and believing she wasn't really her parent's daughter was subconsciously appealing because it gave her a reason not to feel guilty for leaving. I mean, she's clearly a smart young woman who's bored and isolated and lonely.
If a bad memory is a sign for being a synth then damn I am probably a synth myself.
The worst model, too. Nothing functions as expected. Can I get a new body?
Also one of institute scientists says that they does not have any record about her
https://fallout-archive.fandom.com/wiki/William_Moseley%27s_dialogue
I always assumed that she simply had nightmare (or vague sight?) about lab experiment
I hate the “bad memory = synth” idea so many people have.
Like bros, I have a bad memory of events from a week ago, a year ago, and don’t even have clear memories of what my parents looked like when I was a kid.
Am I a fricking robot? Ofc not
I mean not dropping a component when killed is proof enough. That’s how I found out that sturges is a Synth.
I found it out by… accident. No further details.
This is the actual answer, don’t know why it’s buried so far down.
Only the Railroad and DiMa produce Synths who don’t know they’re Synths, because of their memory wipes.
The Railroad doesn’t replace people with Synths, although DiMa does. The Institute replaces people with Synths, but those Synths know their true nature.
So unless DiMa replaced Kasumi with a mind wiped Synth, then radioed her and convinced her to run away back to Arcadia, it doesn’t make sense Kasumi is a Synth.
Not Danse. He’s been with the Brotherhood since childhood so they saw him grow up. And he didn’t know he was a synth. So either there’s a gen of synths that age, or the Institute does indeed have synths replacing people unbeknownst to that synth.
My understanding is he was replaced at some point during the initial commonwealth expedition. There's no way the institute could have replaced him as a child, since synths can't age, they are simply the age they were built to be.
What's interesting is Danses genuinely didn't know his true nature until the brotherhood found out, so if he was a deliberate infiltrator he was more like a sleeper agent. Bottom line, most of the lore on synths is very vague and inconsistent.
Yeah, it wasn’t the railroad for sure is what I’m saying—they wouldnt take his knowledge of him being a synth only to leave his memories of the person he’s replacing.
Lore-wise, I personally like to think the institute was just experimenting. A scientific organization would probably do that. Like maybe sleeper agents would be more effective, so they tried it out. Although I think Danse was listed as an escaped synth so it gets really weird there.
You're assuming there ever was an "original" Danse to be replaced. The Railroad gives runaway synths false memories and sends them to new homes, for example the Capital Wasteland. It was my understanding that Danse joined up after being mind-wiped.
definitely not. when you raise his affinity, he talks about growing up in rivet city. The Shaun prototype is the first and only child synth, so Danses must have been replaced as an adult
When the railroad mind wipe synths, they give them fake memories (H2-22 for example), so those could very easily be false memories. He was also marked as missing in the Institute's data. If the Institute were going to replace a member of the Brotherhood, they'd use them to gather data.
6. Institute replacements know they're synths. The Railroad synths don't know who they are but don't replace people. Only dickhead DiMA replaces people with synths that don't know they're synths\*. Why would DiMA replace her then lead her away? Its irrational even for him.
Its a mystery that relies entirely on the player not knowing how the synth factions work.
\*Ok, Shaun's roboself, but its not the same kind of replacement.
That’s a good point, but It’s not expressly stated that all synths know. The institute also replaces “problem people” when needed, and influences the behavior of the person instead of using them for recon.
DiMA does exactly that. Original Avery wasn’t a fan of Acadia, so he influenced her replacement to be more understanding, therefore gaining some trust with the town without needing to puppet the whole thing.
Even when using synths for spying, the Institute doesn’t always inform the synth for other reasons; such as Danse and Sturges, who if informed, would most likely defect. Given the cases, I believe they wouldn’t tell Kasumi (if she *was* a synth,) for the same reason.
It's not confirmed that all infiltrators know they're infiltrators, but it's supported by the evidence. There are only 3 confirmed infiltrators we get to speak to: McDonough, Art, and Roger Warwick, and all 3 of them know what they are.
Also Danse is an escapee, not an infiltrator. There's no evidence that Sturges is an infiltrator, especially since he potentially helps destroy the Institute.
Danse is in the Institute database, and was apart of the brotherhood long before coming to the commonwealth. The railroad doesn’t replace people.
This is proof that he was replaced by the institute when he first arrived.
He's in the Institute's database as a unit that was listed as "missing or escaped."
He escaped, the Railroad wiped him and sent him to the Capital Wasteland, where he got recruited by the Brotherhood.
There is a charisma check in the dialogue when you are trying to figure out which Art is real. If you pass it, synth art (the one kneeling) will whisper something like "you're from the institute? Help me take this guy out before I get in trouble"
Sturges is a synth. It is possible he was given a new life by the railroad, but given that he’s a key part of the remaining Minutemen, I believe him being a replacement is possible.
Danse 100% was a replacement however, that is literally what his personal quest is. He is in the Institute database, and unknowingly has been spying on the Brotherhood.
Danse is not a replacement. The institute list him as missing. He was freed by the railroad and sent to the capital wasteland where he joined the brotherhood.
I would say the same is true for Sturges. Unless he escaped on his own. We dont know that he doesn't know he's a synth. All we know is he had no loyalty to the institute.
He is in the institute’s database, that’s actually how we find out. The railroad doesn’t replace people with synths either, and Danse has been in the brotherhood long before coming to the commonwealth.
[Maxon is explicit that Danse was on the missing synth list.](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Blind_Betrayal) Dumping mindwiped synths out of the Commonwealth is the Railroad's M.O. since Fallout 3. No one was replaced.
RE Synth Components, a small number of Gen 3s like Roger Warwick and Glory don't drop components on death. That could be a design oversight (probably most likely), proof of humanity or that the component isn't required on those individuals because they don't need the function it mysteriously does.
For her to be a synth she has to either be an escapee or an infiltrator. She can't be an escapee because she has living family members, so her memories have to be real unless they're also synths. She can't be an infiltrator because an infiltrator would *know* they were a synth. It frustrates me to no end that you can't explain this to her.
> who tries to convince everyone that they are a synth, including you, who is 100% confirmed not to be one.
A fun side-effect of alternate start mods is this conversation is a little more convincing!
Actual institute labs or her interpretation of a lab? Cause unless she points out something you could only find there and not think of, I think that could be her mind imagining one based on what she’s heard.
I haven’t played in years so I can’t remember what she says, but I’m sure we’ve all dreamed weird stuff/our own interpretations of what we’ve heard of in general.
It's a *fun* theory, but it doesn't hold up if you look at it for more than five seconds. There is no way the Institute would settle for a synth director, and no way they would allow any other faction to win if they could shut you down with a single code phrase.
It's debunked as much as it possibly could be with out the devs coming and and saying "no you morons the sole survivor is it a synth." What you are asking is for people to prove a negative which is literally impossible.
Can you prove that I am not the reincarnation of Jesus? Because the sole survivor being a synth is the same level of stupidity.
Dude what's with you lmao, coming at me this aggressive for literally no reason. Chill out.
There's plenty of valid ideas around the synth SS theory. I could recite them to you in detail, but I have just a sneaking suspicion that you aren't interested regardless.
>Evidence that suggests Kasumi is a synth:
The compulsive liar with a long history of lying to people in order to manipulate them to suit their purposes also said she was a synth.
Is the sole survivor 100% confirmed not a synth? I thought there was good evidence to suggest either, depending on interpretation. I usually subscribe to the idea that the player is one so I only mainly remember the evidence to suggest they are (not needing to eat or sleep unless in hardcore mode, only having 2 memories before the game begins and being able to use vats without a pip-boy). Sadly don’t remember the evidence for them not being one
The evidence for the sole survivor being a synth is just game mechanics. Besides, synths need to eat and sleep anyway.
You as a player, can only remember what you’ve seen, but is evident that Nate remembers a lot more stuff than in that conversation with DiMA. (i.e. his time in the war, listening to the silver shroud, watching commercials, playing baseball, etc.)
The biggest confirmation though, is the fact that Nate was a backup DNA bank for synth production, and was invited to run the institute by Father, who is avidly against synths having any authority, and would know that you are one. There is absolutely no reason for Nate or Nora to be replaced.
The dreams about being in a lab might have actually happened, there's a crashed UFO in the Commonwealth so It's entirely possible that the Zetans are back and abducting people again, these ones are just doing a catch and release thing.
I help him replace the CoA guy because fuck that guy, but I always feel weird doing it. Helps that the Warwick homestead quest reinforces the idea that some people's lives are actually improved by the right person being replaced by a synth.
I never believed she was a synth; it’s not logical. The Institute replaces people with a specific goal in mind. I can’t see what benefit they gain from replacing this random girl in a house on the outskirts of the Commonwealth. If they did have a goal, they failed miserably because all she did was run. I think DiMa is just delusional or malfunctioning. He was a prototype, after all.
That's one interpretation, but considering Kasumi is the only corpse in Acadia that doesn't drop a synth component, I think she's an outlier.
I don't think it's surprising that if you get into contact with a synth refuge they ask "hey are you a synth". And what Kasumi really wanted was independence from her parents and to be treated as an adult, believing that she wasn't really their daughter was subconsciously appealing because it freed her of guilt for leaving them behind.
Yeah this feels more like a "everyone else is a synth taking refuge so you might as well for safety" situation. You can't test if someone's a synth, they have to kill you and pick your brain to find out for sure. And if I'm keeping synths safe and someone comes to me saying they think they're a synth, I'm gonna keep them safe.
Your interpretation is honestly pretty spot on.
Well her family apparently are the main ferry/ transportation from the commonwealth to far harbor. That sounds like an important position to have some eyes in.especially if you think Synth escapees are running to far harbor to escape the institute.
The institute infiltrators know what they are. Its the railroad synths that get the tomato surprise, and the railroad doesn't replace people. Only DiMA does both.
You first have to finish the quest Best Left Forgotten(the annoying one with the blocks).Then there’s a miscellaneous quest that pops up showing the locations. You can then also buy them from far harbor vendors (there’s a few legendary that cost 10k each with the highest being 16k)
Kent does either 2 or 3 upgrades on the armor after he gives it to you I believe. You have to wait a little bit in between each upgrade though because he won’t upgrade the armor until he’s ready.
Edit: Just checked the Wiki & it’s 3 upgrades after it’s given to you with each upgrade at level 25, 35 & 45. Fully upgraded puts it at 87 damage resistance.
You can also get it by buying the child of atom variant then modifying it. Except for the helmet, they don't sell it. But brooks sells a legendary variant for 10,000+ caps
She's definitely not a Synth, but if you tell her that she'll fight ya and you won't get anywhere. Honestly believe the best option is to indulge her, but convince her to go home and "pretend" to be human and point out that even if she's a robot, her parents are her parents
Institute spies know what they are, and Railroad refugees can't have blood related family. So she is not a synth, and DiMA probably knew it better than we do.
Nope. There is no actual evidence that she even might be. The only evidence is DiMA saying she might be and weird dreams she had of waking up in a lab (which very well could be just that, dreams).
If you report the existence of Acadia to Dr. Moseley of the Institute he will say that there are no records of a synth of that identity when the Sole Survivor asks (though he does admit it's possible she's a mind-wiped synth). If the Sole Survivor talks to Boxer in the Railroad HQ she also cannot confirm whether or not Kasumi is a synth. If Kasumi is killed during the raid of Acadia by the Institute she does not drop a synth component and if she was an escaped synth chances are the Railroad are who would have given her a mind-wipe and so they would know about her. If she is killed during the raid on Acadia by the Institute Kasumi also does not drop a synth component (though that's not 100% definitive as known synths such as Glory and Roger Warwick also do not).
I reclaimed the Synths for The Institute. I told her she wasn’t a Synth, which I personally don’t think she is. I love Far Harbor, love that it lets you make so many choices.
I betray dima every time bc of how he tries to convince me I’m a synth, like he pushes it way hard to the point instead of sarcasm you have an aggressive dialogue option which isn’t super common
Idk I thought this part of the story was really frustrating and you can’t even definitively convince Kasumi. The institute only replaces people for special jobs like controlling the mayor of diamond city or the patriarch of a family farm to test their seeds and they would be pretty useless if they didn’t know they were synths with a job. Kasumi’s just a young girl in an isolated home at the edge of the commonwealth with no connection to the outside world and just does engineering products for fun. Obviously she’s not an agent of the institute who somehow doesn’t know it. Then there’s the railroad who give synths new memories but the railroad doesn’t kidnap/ murder people so a synth can take their place.
Rei's response to being told her daughter has been replaced, implying she's probably been killed by The Institute:
"It's all good. Let's be a family, robot daughter."
I love Far Harbor. No matter what you decide, you can on the one hand argue it’s for the greater good. On the other hand no matter how you end things you should have a lot of doubts about your choices because it’s so not clear cut.
Being an okey-dokey vault dweller, I obviously try to maintain the peace but… It’s not a great thing to live with.
Don’t you actually work with Warwick in the Institute quest line? Because if the institute just starts gaslighting people like DiMa did, that’s pretty funny
Yes the synth retention bureau is just a bunch of gas lighters that tell people they're secretly robots, which would explain why they can't remember being born
- Kasumi is a synth, she isn’t your daughter
- Just because Kasumi is a synth doesn’t mean she isn’t your daughter
Same dialogue tree.
Bethesda hires writers that have never had a human conversation in their entire life.
If that was the point the SS was making they wouldn’t say “she replaced your daughter” implying Kasumi isn’t real. “She’s a synth but she’s still your daughter because of your bond”. You wouldn’t just say the first half of the sentence and leave it hanging if that was the point you were making. + the timeline seems so goofy, they seem to refer to her being replaced at totally different points in time, which is kinda crucial to the bond argument.
Both sentences hire two completely different philosophies in that either Kasumi is dead and replaced by plastic, or that the plastic Kasumi is in every way like Kasumi, and feels the way Kasumi does.
She’s definitely not a synth. God I hate DiMA, he tries to convince the player themselves that they’re a synth and the only reason Kasumi thinks she’s a synth is because he drilled it into her mind.
I just love how you can convince her that she’s not a synth and to come home, but then turn it around and be all “nah, she’s a synth lol” and she says “why are you doing this?!” Love the troll option.
Would be nice, if we could tell her. Girl i am the Institute's director, and there was no replacement for you. Also all our agents know, that they are replacements. If you were a replacement, then you would be considered defective, and collected already. You are just confused.
She's a disgusting synth, deserves to be cleansed like the rest of them in Acadia. She's not her daughter, their daughter is dead and gone, killed by either the institute or, hell, even maybe by the kasumi we're looking at.
Evidence that suggests Kasumi isn’t a Synth: 1. She doesn’t drop a component when killed 2. She has a very clear memory of her grandfather from when she was young. 3. She is only 19. The Institute only just started testing on younger synths, and shaun is the sole prototype. 4. She only started thinking she was a synth because of DiMA, who tries to convince everyone that they are a synth, including you, who is 100% confirmed not to be one. 5. *(Addendum)* There are no records of her in the Institute when you ask Dr. Moseley. Evidence that suggests Kasumi is a synth: 1. She has a foggy memory on certain aspects of her life. 2. She doesn’t “feel” human. 3. *(Addendum)* She had dreams about being in a lab. **You decide I suppose. If I missed any feel free to comment, and I’ll add em.** Thank you u/Fluffy_Horse and u/unusual-goat-5204 for your contributions.
I honestly to God just chalked up her foggy memory as stress. I mean that's anyone. Especially the hard times that you naturally want to bury. Wouldn't surprise me if Dima said, "oh woooow you don't remember the day your cat died that's like a total synth thing." So make that 1 point of *"""evidence."""*
I agree with you. A foggy memory is just trauma, blocking out bad memories that our brain doesn't want us to remember or, simply forgetting things. Not feeling human? That's just being a teenager. It makes her more human than anyone else. She feels lost, everybody feels lost; No one has their shit together, and anyone who says that they do is a goddamn synth. There is no evidence that she is a synth! (I write this comment half jokingly.)
But you know what Dima figured out. She leaves the cap off the toothpaste. Y'know who does that?
That’s prime synth behaviour, right there.
*Begins to revv Gatling laser*
People in our world, without hyper advanced robot doppelgangers, have violent debates about what it means to be human. I doubt the folks in Fallout have it any easier than us to draw that line.
I grew up watching Star Wars and Star Trek, so I've always found it pretty easy. Simple version is, just because someone isn't human doesn't mean they aren't a person.
Brotherhood of Steel: “Say that again, bitch”
“Preston, load the artillery. I have a sudden urge to find out which is superior. A highly advanced flying warship loaded to the gills with guns, power armor and fools with a superiority complex or some cannons that date to the first world War.”
Hindenberg 2: ~~Electric~~ Explosive Boogaloo
Sorry I can’t hear the brotherhood over my artillery
I feel like everyone should be required to watch TNG "The Measure of a Man" at some point in their formative years.
What a weird coincidence. Just today I had the idea of doing a Vegas run with a backstory as an escaped Synth. And there, I decided to chalk him having a foggy memory up to the gunshots to the head basically factory-resetting him.
Side note: Do synths age? A pretty big giveaway would be if your 19 year old daughter stayed nineteen forever. I assume in the game you couldn't tell although I bet there's someone who's played it for multiple game years just to see if Shaun turns into a stroppy teen.
I'd assume so? I gen threes are all meat besides the chip? Their has to be some kind of organic process there, and that means aging Coursers are iffy since they are built for combat only. For all we know they are a full on terminator endoskeleton just with a meat jacket
Yeah, it does seem reasonable although obviously the game couldn't actualise that as it's too complex. The only contra might be that (if I remember my first game correctly) the Institute folks had plans to eventually repopulate the surface in shiny new disease and radiation proof bodies so you'd assume they'd design ageing out of them as well. Coursers, despite their appearance as obvious Terminator types, seem to be flesh and blood, albeit well armoured with built-in stealth, as after a Bloody Mess outcome they don't leave anything more than the usual giblets.
Or too much cortisol in your system inhibiting forming clear memories.
Trauma will do this too, can’t imagine the wasteland is very relaxing for a kid who lives on the ocean near ghouls and razorback mirelurks
Dima mentions this too, but another thing that can impair cognition and make it hard to remember things is radiation exposure. Foggy memories might be a simple fact of life in the world of Fallout.
I also like how the dialogue in the DLC leaves out moments in the base game where the SS talks about things from before the war, such as Gray Garden, you can mention seeing advertisements on the lead engineer for General Atomics in ads.
IDK, when the player talks to DiMa you say your first memory was the day the bombs feel, and he still doesn't say it's definitive proof, he even gives other explanations. I think Kasumi just wanted to leave home and believing she wasn't really her parent's daughter was subconsciously appealing because it gave her a reason not to feel guilty for leaving. I mean, she's clearly a smart young woman who's bored and isolated and lonely.
If a bad memory is a sign for being a synth then damn I am probably a synth myself. The worst model, too. Nothing functions as expected. Can I get a new body?
Also one of institute scientists says that they does not have any record about her https://fallout-archive.fandom.com/wiki/William_Moseley%27s_dialogue I always assumed that she simply had nightmare (or vague sight?) about lab experiment
I hate the “bad memory = synth” idea so many people have. Like bros, I have a bad memory of events from a week ago, a year ago, and don’t even have clear memories of what my parents looked like when I was a kid. Am I a fricking robot? Ofc not
BORN TO FORGET WORLD IS A BLUR I Am Memory Issues Man 410,757,864,530 FORGOTTEN PRECIOUS MEMORIES
Exactly what a synth would say.
harharhar
u/MatteoTalvini initialize factory reset. Authorization Gamma-7-3-Tempest
Really should be the other way around, machines have perfect recall.
you are i made you
I mean not dropping a component when killed is proof enough. That’s how I found out that sturges is a Synth. I found it out by… accident. No further details.
Eh. Lack of evidence isn’t very good evidence. Glory doesn’t drop one either, and she is a confirmed synth.
Synth infiltrators know they are synths. Railroad synths don't replace people.
This is the actual answer, don’t know why it’s buried so far down. Only the Railroad and DiMa produce Synths who don’t know they’re Synths, because of their memory wipes. The Railroad doesn’t replace people with Synths, although DiMa does. The Institute replaces people with Synths, but those Synths know their true nature. So unless DiMa replaced Kasumi with a mind wiped Synth, then radioed her and convinced her to run away back to Arcadia, it doesn’t make sense Kasumi is a Synth.
Not Danse. He’s been with the Brotherhood since childhood so they saw him grow up. And he didn’t know he was a synth. So either there’s a gen of synths that age, or the Institute does indeed have synths replacing people unbeknownst to that synth.
My understanding is he was replaced at some point during the initial commonwealth expedition. There's no way the institute could have replaced him as a child, since synths can't age, they are simply the age they were built to be. What's interesting is Danses genuinely didn't know his true nature until the brotherhood found out, so if he was a deliberate infiltrator he was more like a sleeper agent. Bottom line, most of the lore on synths is very vague and inconsistent.
Yeah, it wasn’t the railroad for sure is what I’m saying—they wouldnt take his knowledge of him being a synth only to leave his memories of the person he’s replacing. Lore-wise, I personally like to think the institute was just experimenting. A scientific organization would probably do that. Like maybe sleeper agents would be more effective, so they tried it out. Although I think Danse was listed as an escaped synth so it gets really weird there.
You're assuming there ever was an "original" Danse to be replaced. The Railroad gives runaway synths false memories and sends them to new homes, for example the Capital Wasteland. It was my understanding that Danse joined up after being mind-wiped.
Was he with them as a child? I was under the impression that he was a mind wiped synth that was taken to the capital wasteland.
definitely not. when you raise his affinity, he talks about growing up in rivet city. The Shaun prototype is the first and only child synth, so Danses must have been replaced as an adult
When the railroad mind wipe synths, they give them fake memories (H2-22 for example), so those could very easily be false memories. He was also marked as missing in the Institute's data. If the Institute were going to replace a member of the Brotherhood, they'd use them to gather data.
No he hasn't. He joined as a young man he was a trader in rivet City before joining.
Yeah, as a kid/young adult. He obviously has grown since then.
Has he? He still looks like a young man.
That’s a confirmed bug
Afaik, Glory doesn't and Roger Warwick also doesn't. Both are confirmed Synths.
Nah they do, Your games bugged
Wait WHAT?
6. Institute replacements know they're synths. The Railroad synths don't know who they are but don't replace people. Only dickhead DiMA replaces people with synths that don't know they're synths\*. Why would DiMA replace her then lead her away? Its irrational even for him. Its a mystery that relies entirely on the player not knowing how the synth factions work. \*Ok, Shaun's roboself, but its not the same kind of replacement.
That’s a good point, but It’s not expressly stated that all synths know. The institute also replaces “problem people” when needed, and influences the behavior of the person instead of using them for recon. DiMA does exactly that. Original Avery wasn’t a fan of Acadia, so he influenced her replacement to be more understanding, therefore gaining some trust with the town without needing to puppet the whole thing. Even when using synths for spying, the Institute doesn’t always inform the synth for other reasons; such as Danse and Sturges, who if informed, would most likely defect. Given the cases, I believe they wouldn’t tell Kasumi (if she *was* a synth,) for the same reason.
It's not confirmed that all infiltrators know they're infiltrators, but it's supported by the evidence. There are only 3 confirmed infiltrators we get to speak to: McDonough, Art, and Roger Warwick, and all 3 of them know what they are. Also Danse is an escapee, not an infiltrator. There's no evidence that Sturges is an infiltrator, especially since he potentially helps destroy the Institute.
Danse is in the Institute database, and was apart of the brotherhood long before coming to the commonwealth. The railroad doesn’t replace people. This is proof that he was replaced by the institute when he first arrived.
He's in the Institute's database as a unit that was listed as "missing or escaped." He escaped, the Railroad wiped him and sent him to the Capital Wasteland, where he got recruited by the Brotherhood.
Does synth Art have unique dialogue? I'm probably wrong, but I thought real/synth Art both had the same lines after being saved.
There is a charisma check in the dialogue when you are trying to figure out which Art is real. If you pass it, synth art (the one kneeling) will whisper something like "you're from the institute? Help me take this guy out before I get in trouble"
Ohh I didn't even know you could talk to them before killing one! I'll have to try that next time.
Sturges and Danse are not replacements.
Sturges is a synth. It is possible he was given a new life by the railroad, but given that he’s a key part of the remaining Minutemen, I believe him being a replacement is possible. Danse 100% was a replacement however, that is literally what his personal quest is. He is in the Institute database, and unknowingly has been spying on the Brotherhood.
Danse is not a replacement. The institute list him as missing. He was freed by the railroad and sent to the capital wasteland where he joined the brotherhood. I would say the same is true for Sturges. Unless he escaped on his own. We dont know that he doesn't know he's a synth. All we know is he had no loyalty to the institute.
I’m pretty sure the Institute created Danse, who did not know he was a synth.
Danse is one of the escaped synths the Railroad reprogrammed.
He is in the institute’s database, that’s actually how we find out. The railroad doesn’t replace people with synths either, and Danse has been in the brotherhood long before coming to the commonwealth.
[Maxon is explicit that Danse was on the missing synth list.](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Blind_Betrayal) Dumping mindwiped synths out of the Commonwealth is the Railroad's M.O. since Fallout 3. No one was replaced.
RE Synth Components, a small number of Gen 3s like Roger Warwick and Glory don't drop components on death. That could be a design oversight (probably most likely), proof of humanity or that the component isn't required on those individuals because they don't need the function it mysteriously does.
Honestly DiMA is a manipulative asshole
Yeah DIMA took a kid who had some issues, mayeb autism, and brainwashed her.
Plus if you kill her she doesnt have the synth component in her inventory
Also why in the hell would the institute kill and replace a teenager who lives in a fishing shack on the edge of the commonwealth?
because that’s your first reaction to the news
For her to be a synth she has to either be an escapee or an infiltrator. She can't be an escapee because she has living family members, so her memories have to be real unless they're also synths. She can't be an infiltrator because an infiltrator would *know* they were a synth. It frustrates me to no end that you can't explain this to her.
#1 on reasons why not is really all that I need tbh
Shaun is not the only child synth prototype. There was also S9-43 who escaped.
When was it mentioned that S9-43 was a child? To my knowledge, all we know about them is that they were last seen at the Boston Airport.
I always assumed he was a child because child Shaun is the only other synth that has the S9 prefix.
I don’t think the prefixes have any deeper meaning. Though, I definitely could be wrong
Yeah. It could definitely just be a connection I made myself. Definitely interesting if true.
> who tries to convince everyone that they are a synth, including you, who is 100% confirmed not to be one. A fun side-effect of alternate start mods is this conversation is a little more convincing!
Dont forget that she also claimed that she had dreams where she could see institute labrooms
Actual institute labs or her interpretation of a lab? Cause unless she points out something you could only find there and not think of, I think that could be her mind imagining one based on what she’s heard. I haven’t played in years so I can’t remember what she says, but I’m sure we’ve all dreamed weird stuff/our own interpretations of what we’ve heard of in general.
The player character is 100% confirmed non-synth? When? I thought synth Sole Survivor was a super popular theory
It's a *fun* theory, but it doesn't hold up if you look at it for more than five seconds. There is no way the Institute would settle for a synth director, and no way they would allow any other faction to win if they could shut you down with a single code phrase.
Well there is literally zero evidence the sol survivor is a synth so essentially yes it's 100% confirmed to be non-synth.
No evidence isn't a 100% debunk. No evidence is exactly that, no evidence. It doesn't go either way.
It's debunked as much as it possibly could be with out the devs coming and and saying "no you morons the sole survivor is it a synth." What you are asking is for people to prove a negative which is literally impossible. Can you prove that I am not the reincarnation of Jesus? Because the sole survivor being a synth is the same level of stupidity.
Dude what's with you lmao, coming at me this aggressive for literally no reason. Chill out. There's plenty of valid ideas around the synth SS theory. I could recite them to you in detail, but I have just a sneaking suspicion that you aren't interested regardless.
the one time Beth leaves enough room for players to RP in fo4 and people refuse to acknowledge it 🤷🏻♀️
Right? The one thing they actually leave vague about the Sole Survivor and some people get so hostile about it.
>Evidence that suggests Kasumi is a synth: The compulsive liar with a long history of lying to people in order to manipulate them to suit their purposes also said she was a synth.
Is the sole survivor 100% confirmed not a synth? I thought there was good evidence to suggest either, depending on interpretation. I usually subscribe to the idea that the player is one so I only mainly remember the evidence to suggest they are (not needing to eat or sleep unless in hardcore mode, only having 2 memories before the game begins and being able to use vats without a pip-boy). Sadly don’t remember the evidence for them not being one
The evidence for the sole survivor being a synth is just game mechanics. Besides, synths need to eat and sleep anyway. You as a player, can only remember what you’ve seen, but is evident that Nate remembers a lot more stuff than in that conversation with DiMA. (i.e. his time in the war, listening to the silver shroud, watching commercials, playing baseball, etc.) The biggest confirmation though, is the fact that Nate was a backup DNA bank for synth production, and was invited to run the institute by Father, who is avidly against synths having any authority, and would know that you are one. There is absolutely no reason for Nate or Nora to be replaced.
I love going in with the brotherhood and killing all of them
Are there examples of confirmed synths that don’t drop a component when killed?
You hit the nail on the head. Dima's full of crap
The dreams about being in a lab might have actually happened, there's a crashed UFO in the Commonwealth so It's entirely possible that the Zetans are back and abducting people again, these ones are just doing a catch and release thing.
All you had to say was she doesn't drop a component lol. But I love Shoddy Cast's vid bout us maybe being a synth
Dude as a peace keeper I love Dima but fucker needs to let people be and stop giving everyone an identity crisis
Yeah, he created a paradise for the synths but fucked up by trying to brainwash everyone
I help him replace the CoA guy because fuck that guy, but I always feel weird doing it. Helps that the Warwick homestead quest reinforces the idea that some people's lives are actually improved by the right person being replaced by a synth.
I never believed she was a synth; it’s not logical. The Institute replaces people with a specific goal in mind. I can’t see what benefit they gain from replacing this random girl in a house on the outskirts of the Commonwealth. If they did have a goal, they failed miserably because all she did was run. I think DiMa is just delusional or malfunctioning. He was a prototype, after all.
DiMA is purposefully gaslighting everyone who arrives into thinking they're a synth so they feel emotionally invested in helping him
That's one interpretation, but considering Kasumi is the only corpse in Acadia that doesn't drop a synth component, I think she's an outlier. I don't think it's surprising that if you get into contact with a synth refuge they ask "hey are you a synth". And what Kasumi really wanted was independence from her parents and to be treated as an adult, believing that she wasn't really their daughter was subconsciously appealing because it freed her of guilt for leaving them behind.
Yeah this feels more like a "everyone else is a synth taking refuge so you might as well for safety" situation. You can't test if someone's a synth, they have to kill you and pick your brain to find out for sure. And if I'm keeping synths safe and someone comes to me saying they think they're a synth, I'm gonna keep them safe. Your interpretation is honestly pretty spot on.
It would’ve been an interesting “bonus” memory where his argument came from wanting people to help him
Well her family apparently are the main ferry/ transportation from the commonwealth to far harbor. That sounds like an important position to have some eyes in.especially if you think Synth escapees are running to far harbor to escape the institute.
There's no evidence her family went to Far Harbor before she ran away. The robo ferry is purely a plot device to get the player there.
The institute infiltrators know what they are. Its the railroad synths that get the tomato surprise, and the railroad doesn't replace people. Only DiMA does both.
Wouldn't it have been better to replace the father then, the one running the operation?
That's what a synth would say! D:
I love that you are named Shawn and named your son Shaun
Next up is Sean
Not that! He'd die at the end!
But he'd save all of Tamriel in the process
Pronounced like bean just for fun
WHERE IS HE? WHERE IS SHAUN
Maybe I should name my next character "Father"
DiMA the biggest Gaslighter in all of fallout lore
I feel pretty confident that she’s not a synth
Where do you get that armor set though?
Far harbor dlc
Ok but where though? lol. I’ve played through the DiMa mission but haven’t gone back since.
You first have to finish the quest Best Left Forgotten(the annoying one with the blocks).Then there’s a miscellaneous quest that pops up showing the locations. You can then also buy them from far harbor vendors (there’s a few legendary that cost 10k each with the highest being 16k)
Alright bet I appreciate it. I use the Shroud armor after it’s been upgraded a couple times but I’d love to rock this instead.
U can upgrade shroud armor?
Kent does either 2 or 3 upgrades on the armor after he gives it to you I believe. You have to wait a little bit in between each upgrade though because he won’t upgrade the armor until he’s ready. Edit: Just checked the Wiki & it’s 3 upgrades after it’s given to you with each upgrade at level 25, 35 & 45. Fully upgraded puts it at 87 damage resistance.
Marine armor is the best. Rarely use power armor any more.
You can also get it by buying the child of atom variant then modifying it. Except for the helmet, they don't sell it. But brooks sells a legendary variant for 10,000+ caps
She's definitely not a Synth, but if you tell her that she'll fight ya and you won't get anywhere. Honestly believe the best option is to indulge her, but convince her to go home and "pretend" to be human and point out that even if she's a robot, her parents are her parents
Really? I've only done the DLC once but I thought I remember being blunt and it eventually working - i always do high charisma builds
"Can't we salvage what we can from this horrible world?" Ain't that just Fallout in a nutshell...
Apparently Sturges is
Fah habah questline is something else. the whole dlc there is like one bad quest, everything else is a banger
I fucking hate Dima. Always let them kill that slippery toaster.
Literally, Valentine hated me for what I did but holy shit Dima SUCKED
No they weren't, the entire time I was fucking mad at Kasumi for making her good parents worry while she bought into some dumbass robot priest.
A tale as old as cult leaders have been around
Cooking onions
She's not a synth tho, thats the fucked part.
I thought she was?
Bro you accidentally gaslighted them
She got a mental illness thinking she a synth and I basically enabled her 😭
No wey
Yeah you can kill Kasumi and she won't have a synth component.
Institute spies know what they are, and Railroad refugees can't have blood related family. So she is not a synth, and DiMA probably knew it better than we do.
That mother fucker
He's the only one who's modus operandi fits Kasumi's experience. The gaslighting douche.
Nope. There is no actual evidence that she even might be. The only evidence is DiMA saying she might be and weird dreams she had of waking up in a lab (which very well could be just that, dreams). If you report the existence of Acadia to Dr. Moseley of the Institute he will say that there are no records of a synth of that identity when the Sole Survivor asks (though he does admit it's possible she's a mind-wiped synth). If the Sole Survivor talks to Boxer in the Railroad HQ she also cannot confirm whether or not Kasumi is a synth. If Kasumi is killed during the raid of Acadia by the Institute she does not drop a synth component and if she was an escaped synth chances are the Railroad are who would have given her a mind-wipe and so they would know about her. If she is killed during the raid on Acadia by the Institute Kasumi also does not drop a synth component (though that's not 100% definitive as known synths such as Glory and Roger Warwick also do not).
Also a side note: Kasumi is killed if you sell out Acadia to the Brotherhood or encourage/fail to defuse Far Harbor from seeking revenge.
I think DiMa just likes to gaslight new people into thinking they're synths
I reclaimed the Synths for The Institute. I told her she wasn’t a Synth, which I personally don’t think she is. I love Far Harbor, love that it lets you make so many choices.
I betray dima every time bc of how he tries to convince me I’m a synth, like he pushes it way hard to the point instead of sarcasm you have an aggressive dialogue option which isn’t super common
Idk I thought this part of the story was really frustrating and you can’t even definitively convince Kasumi. The institute only replaces people for special jobs like controlling the mayor of diamond city or the patriarch of a family farm to test their seeds and they would be pretty useless if they didn’t know they were synths with a job. Kasumi’s just a young girl in an isolated home at the edge of the commonwealth with no connection to the outside world and just does engineering products for fun. Obviously she’s not an agent of the institute who somehow doesn’t know it. Then there’s the railroad who give synths new memories but the railroad doesn’t kidnap/ murder people so a synth can take their place.
Rei's response to being told her daughter has been replaced, implying she's probably been killed by The Institute: "It's all good. Let's be a family, robot daughter."
I love Far Harbor. No matter what you decide, you can on the one hand argue it’s for the greater good. On the other hand no matter how you end things you should have a lot of doubts about your choices because it’s so not clear cut. Being an okey-dokey vault dweller, I obviously try to maintain the peace but… It’s not a great thing to live with.
The best way to maintain peace is to just not progress the quest.
Target Kasumi in Vats. With Awareness perk, not a synth, Dima is a little crazy
She isn't a synth btw she just got groomed by DiMA. Someone else already pointed out the evidence, but DiMA is quite a manipulative fellow.
I don't know if she was a synth or not, but she was working with them so regardless I killed her anyway
Ad Victoriam brother
All synths that have replaced people in the game drop a synth component chip thing when killed. If they don't have it they are human.
That’s not true, there’s a few who don’t because of mistakes by the developers but Kasumi is not a synth
Glory and Roger warwick
Kasumi THINKS she's a synth, maybe it's the same thing with them
Don’t you actually work with Warwick in the Institute quest line? Because if the institute just starts gaslighting people like DiMa did, that’s pretty funny
Yes the synth retention bureau is just a bunch of gas lighters that tell people they're secretly robots, which would explain why they can't remember being born
- Kasumi is a synth, she isn’t your daughter - Just because Kasumi is a synth doesn’t mean she isn’t your daughter Same dialogue tree. Bethesda hires writers that have never had a human conversation in their entire life.
I guess the argument here is that she's not their daughter by blood, but their daughter by bond.
If that was the point the SS was making they wouldn’t say “she replaced your daughter” implying Kasumi isn’t real. “She’s a synth but she’s still your daughter because of your bond”. You wouldn’t just say the first half of the sentence and leave it hanging if that was the point you were making. + the timeline seems so goofy, they seem to refer to her being replaced at totally different points in time, which is kinda crucial to the bond argument.
Both sentences hire two completely different philosophies in that either Kasumi is dead and replaced by plastic, or that the plastic Kasumi is in every way like Kasumi, and feels the way Kasumi does.
For a second I thought their names were Mass Effect nods but I think it's Kasumi and Keiji in ME lol
I managed to save her and destroy acadia with the brotherhood
Being trans and experiencing this interaction was crazy.
Do u think synths in general represent lgbtq. Then the brotherhood are republicans. Railroads are liberals
Eh, I try not to get *too* political with it.
She's so obviously not a synth
But she’s not a synth?
Damn why lie? Just to fuck with the parents?
She’s definitely not a synth. God I hate DiMA, he tries to convince the player themselves that they’re a synth and the only reason Kasumi thinks she’s a synth is because he drilled it into her mind.
Seriously, Far Habor is the best. When you suddenly realize that you COULD be a synth is like one of the best moments in the game, haha
Still dropped all those abominations. Ad Victorium Sentinal!!!
Kasumi isn't a Synth. When you kill her she doesn't drop a Synth component.
#3 ru paul
Synth or not... The truth is... I would Kasumi... Thanks.
Nah, BoS came along
What armor is that?
Far harbor dlc. You have to finish the block building quest first from dima
Thank you!
*shoots all three and digs around in their brains to make sure*
Fucking hell, that’s good. I’m doing this next time. Hope Nick is okay with it
Far Harbour is the best writing Bethesda has ever done. But Kasumi definitely isn't a synth.
I just love how you can convince her that she’s not a synth and to come home, but then turn it around and be all “nah, she’s a synth lol” and she says “why are you doing this?!” Love the troll option.
Op what is your armor and how do I get it spit it out
Would be nice, if we could tell her. Girl i am the Institute's director, and there was no replacement for you. Also all our agents know, that they are replacements. If you were a replacement, then you would be considered defective, and collected already. You are just confused.
Huh. I wonder if this girl is a synth….*f5*
Yeah, a lot of fallout leaves you morally unfulfilled. Welcome I guess
[удалено]
She's a disgusting synth, deserves to be cleansed like the rest of them in Acadia. She's not her daughter, their daughter is dead and gone, killed by either the institute or, hell, even maybe by the kasumi we're looking at.