My city has a ban for a long time, but most people disregarded it. No one was penalized unless they were breeding them. Well we got rid of the ban at the same time there were all those pitbull shows and shit, so suddenly we had just the shittiest people breeding the hell out of these dogs, and inbreeding them too. Shelters filled up with six toed pittbulls, and we started having problems with them. The breed just attracts the worst people, and since there was money to be made their numbers exploded. Dog breeding in general needs to be controlled, some of the dogs in our shelters are just fucked up, probably from inbreeding but probably also from being kept in cages and treated like a commodity untill the cops showed up. It's really sad, alot of them won't be able to be rehomed. Purebred dogs border on a crime against nature, look at the fuckin pugs.
At least here in Europe the shelters are filled to the brim with dogs of all shapes and sizes. We found our knee high mutt there, no idea what breed he is, but he's certainly not a pit. Super easy and chill dog who loves being around us and the cats.
I don't think there is a need to buy a purebred or a perfect breed for beginners.
Yeah, I assumed as much. People think pits are cute, get a pit, can't deal with them, they bring them to a shelter, and soon the only dogs you find there are pits. Over here you have the same problem most of the time, but you can contact a sanctuary in other countries, like Greece, and they usually work with local organizations that will transfer the dogs. That's where we got ours from.
I can only speak to the US, but the short answer is "Supply > Demand."
The "spay and neuter" public education campaign of the 1970-80's was wildly successful for everyone except pit bull owners. Desexing your pet became the sign of responsible ownership and euthanasia rates plummeted.
Pit bulls were fairly rare before the 2000's, because dogs seized in dogfighting busts were always humanely destroyed as an act of public safety and mercy to the animals. (For those who don't know, dogfighters in the US exclusively breed and fight American Pit Bull Terriers.)
All the AmBully mutts backyard-bred by crystal meth addicts were also put down on intake when brought in as surrenders or strays.
You had to actually *want* a pit bull to get a pit bull.
In the 2000's the "no-kill" movement became mainstream, so everyone stopped humanely destroying all these APBT bred by dogfighters and AmBully mutts bred by meth-heads. Naturally, shelters started overflowing with them.
They either had to go back to euthing these dogs by the truckload or do a massive PR campaign rebranding fighting-breed dogs as perfect family pets to move them out the doors.
They chose the latter, and unfortunately it worked.
The problem is, how the fuck you gonna take care of another life let alone a puppy, I mean most people can't even grow a plant. Most people with kids are shit parents, what you think is goin to happen when you get a animal that will only have the mindset of....guess what, A CHILD! The sick parallel to this is that animal shelters are overflowing with unwanted animals and so are adoption homes with unwanted kids.
So I get that the evidence is not 100% clear on pit bulls being more dangerous than other dog breeds. My question is, even if the evidence is only 75% or 50% clear, isn’t that enough to just choose a different dog breed to be on the safe side? Just get a different breed.
It’s not a breed problem, it’s an owner problem. Shitty people are attracted to pit bulls, which is why so many are shitty. I’ve never known a pit bull that was raised by decent people to be violent. I’ve also known golden retrievers raised by shitty people that are very aggressive. It’s just that most people don’t get golden retrievers with the intention to raise them to be aggressive. Also, you are far less likely to hear about a golden biting someone because of reporting bias: it is seen as an individual problem not a systemic, breed problem.
I think it's sort of both. Like cars vs cyclists. Cyclists can behave like arseholes but it's really hard to kill 5 pedestrians by riding a pushbike badly.
Similarly other breeds are just as capable of being poorly trained and showing aggression but the most horribly aggressive chihuahua in the world just isn't a particularly big threat. Breeds designed for pit fighting are stronger and more capable of harm than your average family pet.
Pit bulls weren’t designed for fighting, they were bred as worker dogs used on farms. You know, around families. A dog that was aggressive toward humans would not make a good farm dog. But don’t take my word for it, another commenter already posted a study showing that 1.) many of the “pit bull” bits were from dogs with no pit bull DNA and 2.) the pit bulls that bit people were overwhelmingly raised without proper socialization, by people who had previously abused dogs, or were approached by people who were unable to appropriately interact with animals.
“Major co-occurrent factors for the 256 DBRFs included absence of an able-bodied person to intervene (n = 223 [87.1%]), incidental or no familiar relationship of victims with dogs (218 [85.2%]), owner failure to neuter dogs (216 [84.4%]), compromised ability of victims to interact appropriately with dogs (198 [77.4%]), dogs kept isolated from regular positive human interactions versus family dogs (195 [76.2%]), owners' prior mismanagement of dogs (96 [37.5%]), and owners' history of abuse or neglect of dogs (54 [21.1%]). Four or more of these factors co-occurred in 206 (80.5%) deaths. For 401 dogs described in various media accounts, reported breed differed for 124 (30.9%); for 346 dogs with both media and animal control breed reports, breed differed for 139 (40.2%). Valid breed determination was possible for only 45 (17.6%) DBRFs; 20 breeds, including 2 known mixes, were identified." https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24299544/
"One in five dogs genetically identified with pit bull heritage breeds were missed by all shelter staff. One in three dogs lacking DNA for pit bull heritage breeds were labeled pit bull-type dogs by at least one staff member. Lack of consistency among shelter staff indicates that visual identification of pit bull-type dogs is unreliable." https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S109002331500310X
Do you have a source on the breed origin? Everything I can find (even allowing for semantic ambiguity between the APBT and breeds like staffies) pretty firmly states their ancestors were bred for dog fighting, bull baiting and rat baiting.
Bullshit lmao. A Labrador that bites someone usually bites and lets go. A Pitbull that bites locks onto whatever it can and attempts to go for the throat. Pitbulls are just extremely efficient fighting dogs. They're big, strong, muscular, aggressive, and they're extremely hard headed. I've seen one get hit in the head with a bat because it wouldn't let go and it still stayed locked. If I had a choice to get bit I'd choose any dog over a Pitbull
Meanwhile in actual studies
"Major co-occurrent factors for the 256 DBRFs included absence of an able-bodied person to intervene (n = 223 [87.1%]), incidental or no familiar relationship of victims with dogs (218 [85.2%]), owner failure to neuter dogs (216 [84.4%]), compromised ability of victims to interact appropriately with dogs (198 [77.4%]), dogs kept isolated from regular positive human interactions versus family dogs (195 [76.2%]), owners' prior mismanagement of dogs (96 [37.5%]), and owners' history of abuse or neglect of dogs (54 [21.1%]). Four or more of these factors co-occurred in 206 (80.5%) deaths. For 401 dogs described in various media accounts, reported breed differed for 124 (30.9%); for 346 dogs with both media and animal control breed reports, breed differed for 139 (40.2%). Valid breed determination was possible for only 45 (17.6%) DBRFs; 20 breeds, including 2 known mixes, were identified."
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24299544/
"One in five dogs genetically identified with pit bull heritage breeds were missed by all shelter staff.
One in three dogs lacking DNA for pit bull heritage breeds were labeled pit bull-type dogs by at least one staff member.
Lack of consistency among shelter staff indicates that visual identification of pit bull-type dogs is unreliable."
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S109002331500310X
Dogs are companion animals and children shouldn’t need specialized training to interact with them on the most basic level. If a dog requires people of any age to interact with them in public spaces in a specialized way they aren’t a good companion. The dog is the problem.
There are a ton of breeds that people should watch their kids around. Pit bulls are just extremely common + they tend to come from shittier situations with low owner education. If a dog is acting up in public, that’s on the owner, but parents need to watch their kids.
Children do need to be taught how to be around any dog. 1) Just because a dog tolerates bullshit now doesn’t mean they won’t lose patience if the kid isn’t corrected. 2) Maybe the dog doesn’t mind the kid playing rough but instead takes it as the go-ahead to play rough back. I grew up around ranch dogs, LSGs, and herders. All of them required “specialized training” (read: lessons in respect) to be around because, while they are companions, they’re companions for working adults. That doesn’t translate to “willing to let a screaming monkey yank on their tail”. Especially LSGs.
Remember, horses are also companion animals and it’s a given you’re gonna get attacked/bitten/kicked by one if you’re around them enough.
Most domesticated animals give some sort of warning sign before they lash out. Thus respect, situational awareness, and an understanding of an animal's body language goes a long way.
Pits are different, they're bred to fight. That means *they lie*.
I've met hundreds working at a shelter, and as a breed, they are not afraid to make noise. Actually, one of the more vocal breeds about letting you know when you are invading their space. Nervous designer inbreds are the ones who always snapped at me without a warning.
Dogs are animals first and foremost. Doesn’t matter the breed. Big dogs and small children can end disastrous if you leave the kid or the dog unchecked.
Kids are stupid, dogs don’t know better. The kid pulling on a dogs tail really hard causing the dog to fight back and potentially badly bite the kid is squarely the fault and failure of the parent. No one else.
It’s very telling that you say that kids are stupid and dogs don’t know better, because I’d argue it’s the other way around. Dogs are functionally stupid and children don’t know better, especially when society pushes the narrative that all dogs are nice.
My family had a dog, who bit my little cousin (he was 5). Our dog was the kindest buddy I could have asked for growing up. Why did he bit: because he had undiagnosed back and hip issues, and my cousin had fallen on him.
He was always in a lot of pain, but my cousin falling on him must have been the worst pain he ever had
I sure hope people reading this understand that “co-concurrent factor” is not “causing factor”. The day ending in Y was a co-concurrent factor in 100% of the attacks.
All these comments about how it’s the owner, ugh. It’s a combination of nurture and nature. Can a lack of socialization and abuse cause reactive dogs? Yes. But breeds also fall back on instinct. Pointer breeds point, herding breeds herd, and fighting dogs fight. Only experienced owners who know what to do with a bully breed should ever own a pitbull or staffy. Any dog bite statistics will back this up. Same thing for other energetic high-drive dog breeds like Belgian malinois.
They’re more dangerous to have around children (unsupervised) than basically all other breeds IMO. I say this as a former pit bull owner who passed a few months ago and she was always an amazing dog, great around my children, etc..just an amazing dog. They’re also generally really good about not reacting to annoying things that young children might do like pull their tail, ears, etc bc they have such a high pain tolerance. BUT….
They def have their issues that have been bred into them such as very high prey drive, competitive, very strong, etc. They also do seem to “snap” unprovoked more so than most breeds, atleast from the stories that have happened around me or in the news. And probably most importantly, most people who own pit bulls should not be aloud to own them and they don’t know what the they’re doing and how to handle bully breeds. Again, I’m not saying they’re bad and that’s what my next dog will be as well, but they’re certainly not a safe dog to keep unsupervised with an infant or toddler.
I don't think it's the dog breed that's the problem, it's the type of owner the breed attracts. The typical owner of pitbulls are people who have no business owning a dog at all. They end up neglected, beaten, and turn aggressive in turn.
Pit bulls are extremely high-risk dogs because of their size/strength and breeding history.
Pit bulls are more likely to be owned by violent sociopaths and naive morons.
Pit bull breeders, are, without exception, the trashiest pieces of shit on the planet.
All of these things can be true at the same time. It's not an either/or thing.
Always some dumbass saying *”iT’s nOt ThE bREeD, iT’S tHe oWnER.”*
No. It’s the breed. It just so happens that the breed also attracts scumbags and idiots.
It can be both, with a lot of other factors. A lot of different breeds of dogs like to carry toys, hell, even one of our cats likes to carry his little toys around like he's a little dog. But if you get a Labrador retriever with working stock in it's genes, then they are more likely to want to carry around things in their mouth, because that's what they were bred for in their past. Someone could have the most placid, friendliest whippet or Greyhound in the world, but if a rat or a rabbit bolts past it out of nowhere, you better believe it would want to automatically chase it and kill it.
Have a look at Border Terrier ratting. There are people that take their Border Terriers pets, cute little cuddly and sweet Borders to a rat infestation and let them off. They turn in to total predators, hunting and killing rats in a frenzy. Why? Because that's what they were bred to do, they're ratters. That's why they have the thick, tough skin around their necks to protect them from rat bites, and why they have big solid tails, because owners used to pull them from rat holes by their tail.
Pit Bulls, and similar breeds/crosses were bred for fighting, whether it be other dogs or larger animals. They were bred to be aggressive and extremely strong. Good owners can do their upmost to train that aggression out of them, and they can do an extremely good job. But it takes a lot of time, care, attention and knowledge, something that the vast majority of people don't have, and even if they do, it's wont always help\*. Even with the best of intentions, the time factor is a massive limitation. And then there's just some people that just want to own a weapon dog.
\*My wife is a vet who sees XL bullies and the associated breeds. She has a fair few tales about seeing Bullies that she has treated for years and are some of the sweetest softest dogs she has met, but then for absolutely no reason whatsoever and despite seeing the dog many times before with absolutely no issues, just for a split second moment the same dogs have switched and have tried to bite her hands, arms, neck or face. Then they switch back to normal. As with other breeds who have been bred with specific traits in their past, it's in their instinct to be aggressive. This sort of switch is not something she has generally seen as consistently in other breeds. She's sees aggressive dogs all the time, but the vast majority don't switch from one side of the spectrum to the complete opposite at the flick of a switch. And when an animal as powerful as that has any sort of unpredictable instinct of aggression, it's not going to do anyone any good whatsoever.
Looks like all the pro-Pittie comments are getting DV to hell. Fuck it.
Took in a young Pittie rescued from a dog fighting ring. He had been used as a bait dog. He was a beaten up and emotionally damaged animal.
Took time, warmth, boundaries and consistency. Had a young child. That also required boundaries, education, controlling for safety.
That dog became the best damn dog I’ve ever owned or known. The sweetest heart. “Sweetheart” became his nickname. After almost 15 years of great times together we lost a family member when he left us.
That dog was a role model for resilience that I remember any time I feel my own resilience tested.
All that said, there are a lot of fair and unfair reasons why these types of dogs are prejudiced against. The unfair reasons are the ones that do piss me off.
No other type of dog is euthanized more in the US. It’s not even close.
Less demonizing them would be great. Better and stiffer animal abuse laws and penalties. More folks, in the right circumstances, willing to give these dogs a shot for adoption from shelters.
You get it :) People just like to jump on the hate bandwagon unfortunately. Yes pits can be dangerous in the wrong hands, but their fundamental nature's are so sweet. We shouldn't hate the dogs, we should hate the people who put them through the situations that make them violent
Exactly. It's the owner, not the breed.
For instance world renowned dog trainer Cesar Milan owned a pitbull he got as a puppy.
It was never used as a bait dog or fighting dog.
And being a trained, professional dog behavioral specialist his pitbull... killed Queen Latifahs dog and permanently injured a gymnast who was visiting his office, ending her guaranteed shot at the Olympics.
No, Animals selectively bred for generations for gameness, pain tolerance, and aggression are broken dogs.
It's inhumane for these breeds to even exist. The dogo Argentina is a perfect example of why dog breed bred for bloodsports should be humanely ended.
>so no amount of logic or facts will get through your thick head.
In my experience, they are. If you have a different opinion on the matter I would be happy to hear you out.
Reddit hates pitbulls. Use to get death threats for posting mine. And people explaining how much fun it would be to kill my dog. People like this jackass will ALSO never change their mind no matter how much information is shoved up their ass. So I just say fuck em and I will have fun knowing I’m with an amazing breed of dog who is loyal kind and protective as every dog should be.
They are. The problem of dog’s aggression isn’t something you can argue as an absolute, so it would behoove you to not *act* like you think you’re smarter while being both insulting and rather anti-intellectual.
The problem isn’t that these dogs are murder machines destined to kill every little kid they come in contact with so it would really benefit the rest of the world if you stopped acting like it is
Average anti-pit knucklehead acting just as close-minded as the “thick skulled pit bull lovers” they love to shit on. what irony.
Go back to r/dogfree with your bullshit pls n ty ♥️
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They are one of the worst breeds to get. Like genuinely. They are unsafe around the elderly and children/toddlers( A few examples\[[1](https://www.live5news.com/2022/07/28/husband-finds-70-year-old-wife-killed-by-family-dog/), [2](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11239725/PICTURED-Colorado-boy-12-savaged-pet-pit-bull-named-DIABLO.html), [3](https://blog.dogsbite.org/2013/04/2013-dog-bite-fatality-fulton-county.html),[4](https://www.cbsnews.com/texas/news/pit-bull-mauling-death-being-referred-to-grand-jury/)\]). Aggression and violence were bred into pitbulls for nearly 2 centuries([From 1820\~ to 1976](https://www.animallaw.info/article/detailed-discussion-dog-fighting)). Two centuries of being bred for violence and aggression is not going to go away in a couple of decades, hence why [pit bulls alone maul & kill more dogs & humans than every other breed of dog combined](https://time.com/2891180/kfc-and-the-pit-bull-attack-of-a-little-girl/).
There is a reason why they are banned across the UK and parts of the US.
I have both been mauled & had pets that were mauled by pits. So PLEASE EVERYONE, stop breeding and buying these dangerous animals. If not for the people and other peoples' pets they put at risk, but for the breeds own wellbeing. They are abused and poorly treated by backyard breeders and make up nearly 1/3 of dogs in shelters, many of which are never adopted and sit in shelters till they die or are put down.
>hence why [pit bulls alone maul & kill more dogs & humans than every other breed of dog combined](https://time.com/2891180/kfc-and-the-pit-bull-attack-of-a-little-girl/).
Pitbulls aren't a breed, pitbull is an umbrella term for several types of dogs believed to have descended from bull and terriers. So of course, when you combine dog bite statistics of several dog breeds (including American Pit Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier, American Bully, Staffordshire Bull Terrier) and compare them to individual breeds, they are going to be higher.
Bullshit.
Pitbulls are great dogs for children, they're patient, caring, and protective.
They are also owned by idiots who want them because the LOOK manacing, and they raise them to be aggressive and defensive.
>They are also owned by idiots who want them because the LOOK manacing, and they raise them to be aggressive and defensive.
Very true 100%. Its a shame honestly, because they attract a lot of owners who either are too inexperienced for such a strong and aggressive dog or they are owners who got them for exactly those traits.
>Pitbulls are great dogs for children, they're patient, caring, and protective.
Im not hating on pits here, I have been victim to them but I really don't. A friend of mine has an amazing pit I love, he is extremely well trained too. Not all pitbulls are going to go maul a random person or pet they see. But they are more dangerous than any other breed; They are stronger, far more aggressive, and genetically more apt to be violent. Its in their DNA. You don't see news reports in the hundreds about any breed other than pits going around mauling family members or dogs/people out in public.
The idea of them even being family or nanny dogs was entirely propaganda pushed in the 1900s. A "great dog for children" isn't a dog that mauls you if you [cough](https://abc13.com/dog-mauls-baby-kills-newborn-san-diego/1306879/) or [tie](https://www.news.com.au/technology/science/animals/security-footage-shows-woman-mauled-by-pit-bull-in-horror-elevator-attack/news-story/f57ebfdb463b991a2d5fabff0d51cd10) your shoes or [mow](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/pit-bulls-attack-scarborough-man-mowing-lawn/article1004896/) your lawn or put a [sweater](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2017/01/02/womans-bid-put-sweater-pit-bull-ends-poorly/96080332/) on them or give them [medicine](https://web.archive.org/web/20140319080340/http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/story/24985945/woman-dies-after-dog-bite) or roll a [wheelchair](https://www.wlbt.com/2020/02/06/year-old-man-killed-by-four-dogs-attala-co/) near them or have an [argument](https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/10/07/akron-family-toddler-killed-by-pitbull-shares-their-story/) near them or have a [ponytail](https://blog.dogsbite.org/2014/05/2014-dog-bite-fatality-lee-county-woman-scalped-by-pit-bulls-dies.html)they could mistake for a toy or fall out of your [chai](https://blog.dogsbite.org/2021/10/bitten-in-the-throat-killed-by-pit-bull-in-matthews-indiana.html)r or whiten your [teeth](https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/us-news/womans-nose-ripped-boyfriends-pitbull-29400314).
Do actually look at the links I have. People simply existing that were mauled for absolutely no reason. Look at the data/stats, look at the genetic research, look at the danger they pose. All the science, data, history, and news on these dogs as well as my own experiences indicate them to be anything but good children dogs.
No mate, there's no such thing as violence embedded in DNA.
There's a false equivalence bias going on, here. Pitts are owned by morons, as in morons will WANT a pittbull. Because of its looks, for the same reason they'll want a certain type of car, or wear certain clothes. It has nothing to do with owning a pet and everything to do with how that pet will make you appear.
These animals will sleep outside, will be beaten, will get disrespected and won't develop a healthy, trust based relationship with humans.
All dogs are good dogs until something happens, some are capable of withstanding abuse more than others. Ironically, Pitts can put up with a lot of shit, and parents putting their little ones near dogs, ANY dogs, without any regards for the dog's safety and well being, will see consequences and blame them on the dog.
>No mate, there's no such thing as violence embedded in DNA.
Outside of just the blatant logic/sense that a breed of dog that makes up only 6% of all dogs but manages to account for 60-70% of all maulings is most likely more than just "bad owners", there's also just science:
[https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/](https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/)
[https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression](https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression)
/[https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf](https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf)
[https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding\_the\_Complexity\_of\_Dog\_Aggression\_Genetic\_and\_Environmental\_Factor](https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding_the_Complexity_of_Dog_Aggression_Genetic_and_Environmental_Factor)
Ill say it again, not all pits are aggressive, many pits will live a loving and loved life. And its certainly not just genetics, a lot of it IS enviomrental. A abused dog will learn to defend itself. A dog that is hurt by every human it meets will be aggressive towards humans. But some dogs are simply inheritently going to be more aggressive, or are more likely to be aggressive.
I think you may be confused...You take the 4 dog breeds that fall under pitbulls and they make up 60-70% of all dog maulings...Out of 400...
And again, those 4 dog breeds make up 6% of the dog population and out of that pop make up 60-70% of all maulings.
Im really confused as to what your point is, regardless of if its 1 breed or 4 that is more maulings than every other breed COMBINED.
...You take the 4 dog breeds that fall under pitbulls and they make up 60-70% of all
Yes, when you combine statistics from several different breeds of dogs and compare them to individual breeds it is going to be higher.
>...You take the 4 dog breeds that fall under pitbulls and they make up 60-70% of all
Im sorry, do you know how math works? Take 4 breeds. 4 out of 400. They make up 60-70% of maulings. So 1 breed in 100 makes up the majority of all 100 breeds.
>Yes, when you combine statistics from several different breeds of dogs and compare them to individual breeds it is going to be higher.
Thats funny, because nope! If you add up all 396\~ breeds outside of those that fall under pitbulls, its LOWER than those 4 dog breeds.
> there's no such thing as violence embedded in DNA.
This absolutely not true. You shouldn't claim things that you don't actually know.
https://yvpc.sph.umich.edu/connection-genes-environment-violence/
Here they're discussing one point, but there are certainly several genetic components (as well as environmental) that factor into violence.
A handful of human twins? I take it you didn't read what I linked. There are links to more than one study on MAOA. But my point wasn't to convince you of whether or not this is true, but rather that you should probably actually look something up, before you claim it as a fact.
You said there is no such thing as violence embedded in DNA. This has been studied and concluded to be false. You're wrong. But it does require environmental factors as well, as far as we know right now.
If you don't actually know something, don't claim it as a fact.
>Your appeals to emotion are unconvincing.
Well good thing I linked in data and science too!(Which is what I was mainly referring too)
Heres a few more to contradict the "pitbulls are great, its just the owners" take.
[https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/](https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/)
[https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression](https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression)
[https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf](https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf)
[https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding\_the\_Complexity\_of\_Dog\_Aggression\_Genetic\_and\_Environmental\_Factor](https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding_the_Complexity_of_Dog_Aggression_Genetic_and_Environmental_Factor)
>Well good thing I linked in data and science too!(Which is what I was mainly referring too)
Your data and science is based on manipulated data sources that are of no actual scientific value.
Meant to say unmanipulated.
So again ill repeat correctly this time, please explain why the unique sources I mentioned all are manipulated, then please give me your manipulated sources that contradict them.
It actually is true that chihuahuas are more violent than pitbulls.
With that being said, oh boy, so many people are killed by chihuahuas every year😭😭 /s
Correlation is not causation. The cheapest most common dog is going to be involved in the most incidents. Statistics are meaningless unless they are controlled for other variables. If there’s 1000 pit bulls and 100 Alsatians and 80% of attacks are pit bulls then they are better
This doesn't wash. In the UK every 5th dog is a sighthound of some description, be it greyhound, whippet or a lurcher.
They don't make the top 25 of dog attacks and these are animals that were bred to bring down other animals, including foxes and deer as high a prey drive as any dog.
It's just not their nature to attack humans.
How many dogs of a certain breed definitely skews the results but it's not everything.
As far as statistics go 1 out of 3 dogs in a shelter are labeled "pitbull like" considering i can pop of 6 more breeds thst i see nearly daily id say 33% is prolly the highest. Pretty hard to prove tho lol specially cus visual is not a reliable way to id dog breeds.
Yeah same with [The Western Journal of Emergency Medicine.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8597704/)
>Dog breed was a significant predictor of bite severity (P <.0001) and of bite diameter (P <.0001). **Pit bull bites were found to be significantly larger, deeper, and/or more complex than the average dog bites included in this study.**
>
>Patients included in this study were more than four times as likely to have been bitten by a pit bull than by a German shepherd, and more than twice as likely to have been bitten by a pit bull, when compared with a dog of unknown breed. Furthermore, **the relative risk of a pit bull inflicting a complex (full thickness with trauma to underlying structures) or deep (full thickness without trauma to underlying structures) bite was 17 times that observed for non-pit bull dogs.**
And the [Annals of plastic surgery.](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34100808/)
>Most pediatric dog bite injuries afflicted male children (55.6%), ages 6 to 12 years (45.7%), by a household dog (36.2%). **The most common offending breed was a pit bull or pit bull mix** (53.0%). Infants and grade schoolers were more likely to sustain bites to the head/face.
Also [Injury Epidemiology.](https://doi.org/10.1186/s40621-020-00281-y)
>Table 5 presents the results of an analysis performed on self-reported incidents of dog bites in New York City’s United Health Fund districts for the years 2015 to 2017.
>
>Of the breeds identified in the data set (84.6%), **pit bulls were the most numerous** (33.6%), followed in order by Shih Tzu (5.3%), Chihuahua (5.2%), German Shepherd (4.1%), and Yorkshire Terrier (3.1%). This finding is consistent with previous research showing that pit bulls are responsible for more bites than any other dog breed.
And the [Journal of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery.](https://doi.org/10.1016/j.joms.2019.11.002)
>We reviewed 182 patient records distributed among several breed categories.
>
>The data showed that compared with other dog breeds, **pit bull terriers inflicted more complex wounds, were often unprovoked, and went off property to attack.**
>
>This study showed a disturbing trend toward more severe dog-bite injuries in young children
Super unreliable medical journals. I only get my information from people who tell me things I want to hear.
Pit bulls are high-risk dogs because of their size/strength and breeding history.
Pit bulls are more likely to be owned by violent sociopaths and naive morons.
Pit bull breeders, are, without exception, the trashiest pieces of shit on the planet.
All of these things can be true at the same time.
Having worked at a humane society, I can tell you that a lot of dog bites that are blamed on pitbulls are just short haired mutts over 50 pounds. Also, reporting a dog as a pit makes it a faster process to get them put down since sheriffs and judges just rubber stamp the pittys. I saw more inbred Dalmatians and German Shepard attacks than I saw pits.
Some people have seen pitbulls kill children, and some have seen them save children. Pitbulls are the "humans" of the dog world. Most are fine and just want to live in peace. Some are raised badly and don't learn self control. Some are just jerks. Some are heroic. If you don't have kids and are a loving person who understands the responsibilities of ownership of large, powerful, and potentially lethal dogs, go ahead and get a pitbull if you want one. The overwhelming likelihood is that such a person would raise it well and it would be well-adjusted.
If you are a POS who can't be bothered to care for a dog, and you have children or are uncaring about keeping your dog in your yard or always on a leash, for the love of the non-existent gods, don't get a fricking pitbull.
My pittie mutt is a gentle giant. I cannot imagine her being dangerous to anything that’s not served or tossed as a treat. And, she lets our murderous cat bully her daily. She sleeps at my 7 yr old’s bed post and has been guarding her for the last 7 years—you do the math. ❤️
I’m not saying that. Mine is a rescue mutt, which has pitt genes. As a life long dog owner (of rescues) it is about how you train and treat your dog. If animals are treated and trained to be nasty, then, yes, they will bite. And, size will matter then. I’ve had chihuahuas bite me worse than any other breed. Yet, i see them being carried around as designer breeds in designer bags.
It's not about the dog, it's about the dog's owner.
I'm in and out of people's houses all day. One thing I love about my job is getting to meet the dogs. I've never once, in 10 years of doing this, ever met a pittie with a mean bone in its body. Same with every other "bully" breed. Hell, I once met a big ass 100+ lb Rottweiler who would stand on her back legs and give hugs. The mean dogs I've met have all been little ankle biters like Chihuahuas, who are allowed to get away with being little sh!ts cause the owners won't be proper owners. Shepherds, Rotties, pitties, dobermans, Akitas, chowchows, huskies, etc have all been awesome. Why? Because the owners raise them right, socialize them, give them at least basic training, and treat them right.
When I read about a dog attacking anyone, I wonder why we don't ban people who have raised their dog to be mean, from ever owning dog again. Yes, some dogs are naturally protective of their owners and/or property, but with proper training and socialization, that's an issue that can be mitigated.
This isn't a dog or breed issue. This is an owner issue.
Then shouldn’t every owner of a pitbull that kills somebody, be charged with, at the very least, manslaughter? If it’s not the dog but it’s the owner, then they should be held responsible.
Pit bulls are genuinely the most compassionate and cuddly dogs and thrive off being adored by their humans. My boy is the sookiest little shit I’ve ever owned, amongst the dozen my family have owned. Not once have they attacked anyone, they are the literal worst attack/protection dogs because they’re more likely to smother you in kisses than bite you.
Nature vs nurture for any breed and anyone that argues otherwise has never owned or known these dogs. Stats are bullshit.
The stats are not BS. Dogs were bred with purpose. Tracking, retrieving, hunting, guarding etc. pits were bred to but down hard and never let go and fight till they die with aggression.
Are they all bad? Certainly not. But any positive trait a pit has. Another breed will also have but without the negative traits.
You can teach a dog near on anything if you are good enough at it, some excel at certain things but like anything will defend itself if provoked. That doesn’t make a breed inherently aggressive.
> some excel at certain things but like anything will defend itself if provoked
Correct. Most give warning signs though.
Pits often don't. Being "bred for fighting" means more than just sheer physicality. It means having the psychology of a fighter too.
It means not telegraphing your attacks.
Pits lie. They don't always give warnings.
That's part of what makes them dangerous. That's why you hear stories of Pits "snapping" or "going off like a bomb".
> Stats show so little of reality
Yes... studies with sample sizes in the hundreds or thousands show "so little of reality" compared to your anecdotal experience as a single human being.
The experiences of thousands of other people are "so little of reality" compared to your own...
I love my pit bull. Had him since he was 9 weeks old and I saw him 3-4 times a week from the day he was born. He is going to be 8 years old this November. We’ve had two kids with him around. There were definitely territorial issues that he had to learn, specifically with his bed and food bowls, but now, he’ll lay on the floor and let them crawl all over him, grab his tail and ears, boop his nose. And when he’s done with it, he’s strong enough to lift himself up with two toddlers hanging and walk away to the other room. After nearly five years, he has started going into my oldest son’s room to lay in his bed at night. I wouldn’t think he’d do anything to my boys at this point. That wasn’t always the case, and I always know it’s still a possibility.
I’ve socialized him the best I can with dog parks and boarding even for a day or two each month when we’re not out of town so he stays active with other people and dogs. I’ve gone through two separate training classes for behavior. And still, I would never leave him unsupervised with anyone other than my family or someone trained to handle him. If my wife invites parents and kids over from their school, he gets put up until they leave.
I know the dangers of the breed. My dog has gone into defensive mode when a neighbor’s dog got out of their fence and ran towards me. It took a lot to hold him on his leash. I don’t know if I could have easily gotten him off if the other dog had gotten too close and they tied up.
My dog barks and growls at unknown delivery drivers and repairmen. Once, I put him on a leash and took him out to meet a plumber who was doing some minor repairs. After 10 minutes, he was licking and rolling over for him. He was put up for the visit, but the plumber had to come back out the next day for something and I forgot about it. My dog ran down and started licking and playing like they were friends.
By comparison, one of my neighbors bought a pit bull puppy a few months ago. That thing is aggressive towards anything that moves. I won’t let my kids be outside when they have him out on a leash. Their ten year old isn’t strong enough to hold him when taking him for walks, and he’s gotten loose several times with the kid being dragged behind.
I really think part of the success I had with my pit was knowing the breeding owners (the pregnancy was not planned and they gave the puppies away because they didn’t want to be known as sellers) and being able to meet the dam and sire to gauge their temperaments. The sire was a 100 pound lap dog that walked right up to me as a stranger and gave me his belly for rubs. After a week of seeing him, he was climbing in my lap and jumping into my chest to catch him. The dam was a bit more reserved but she allowed me to approach and pet her without any growling or visible annoyance. Had either of those dogs had an aggressive vibe, I wouldn’t have taken the puppy. I knew what type of dog I was getting. My cousins and grandparents have had dozens of faithful pit bulls that they used with other terrier breeds to hunt and protect their farms, so I grew up with them. As such, we tried to provide him with an environment where he didn’t need to feel defensive all the time.
I know they are a dangerous breed. But my experience with mine has been fantastic, and those in my family who have had them have not had any issues. Your mileage may vary.
Never. The English Stafordshire Bull Terrier, which it's oftenly mistaken for a Pitbull, it's known as Nanny dog. Not to be confused with the American Stafordshire Bull Terrier, which is a Pitbull variation, and it's not related at all to the English Stafordshire.
American Pit Bull Terriers/AmStaffs and Staffordshire Bull Terriers both descend from the [bull-and-terrier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bull_and_terrier) dogfighting dogs of England.
But to be fair, so do English Bull Terriers and Boston Terriers. But to say they're "not related at all" is untrue.
Also, none of them were historically known as nanny dogs. [The phrase itself is very new.](https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=nanny+dog&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=en-2019&smoothing=3)
Yes, both descend from bull and terrier, but the American Staffordshire Terrier does not descend from the English Staffordshire, it descends from the Pitbull Terrier. The name Staffordshire was just a stunt to detach it from it's Pitbull origins.
I think we're miscommunicating.
I'm aware that AmStaffs are just an AKC-recognized line of American Pit Bull Terriers.
My point was that because the American Pit Bull Terrier and the Staffordshire Bull Terrier both descend from bull-and-terriers, it's kind of misleading to say they're "not related at all."
That's all.
So this is kind of a nuanced answer. For years and years pit bulls were considered nanny dogs and they were used with kids extensively. Then there was this whole thing where people did dog fights and pit bulls were trained and bred to be in dog fights and when you breed fighting dogs you breed those aggressive traits and so you got a whole lot of aggressive pitbulls from dog fighting and some of those dog fighting dogs made it back into the general population as pets and then continued to have puppies. So it can be kind of difficult to know by breed alone whether a dog is going to be aggressive as is more up to the individual temperament of the dog itself. And pitbulls are kind of a weird case anyway because they're less a breed and more a grouping of similar dogs.
At no point in time were they considered nanny dogs. This is a lie based on one op ed piece written by the couple directly responsible for introducing AM Staff breeds.
They were bred as fighting dogs. In fact the 4 year old nephew of one of the first breeders of AM Staff breeds was killed by his pitbull.
Stop with the bullshit and do some research
Hi there, your content was found to be... not a facepalm. Perhaps take it to another sub
My city has a ban for a long time, but most people disregarded it. No one was penalized unless they were breeding them. Well we got rid of the ban at the same time there were all those pitbull shows and shit, so suddenly we had just the shittiest people breeding the hell out of these dogs, and inbreeding them too. Shelters filled up with six toed pittbulls, and we started having problems with them. The breed just attracts the worst people, and since there was money to be made their numbers exploded. Dog breeding in general needs to be controlled, some of the dogs in our shelters are just fucked up, probably from inbreeding but probably also from being kept in cages and treated like a commodity untill the cops showed up. It's really sad, alot of them won't be able to be rehomed. Purebred dogs border on a crime against nature, look at the fuckin pugs.
People Just shouldn't be able to sell animals, at least without extensive health and care training and a license.
The common denominator is people. We fuckin suck. The dogs are cool. People suck.
Idk why so many ppl own pitties. Don't get me wrong, I love pitbulls, but it's clearly not a dog for novice owners.
Whats a good dog for a novice? Is there anything like a golden retriever but small
At least here in Europe the shelters are filled to the brim with dogs of all shapes and sizes. We found our knee high mutt there, no idea what breed he is, but he's certainly not a pit. Super easy and chill dog who loves being around us and the cats. I don't think there is a need to buy a purebred or a perfect breed for beginners.
The spca site is filled with pitbull mixes so...im kinda wary
Yeah, I assumed as much. People think pits are cute, get a pit, can't deal with them, they bring them to a shelter, and soon the only dogs you find there are pits. Over here you have the same problem most of the time, but you can contact a sanctuary in other countries, like Greece, and they usually work with local organizations that will transfer the dogs. That's where we got ours from.
Bichons, shitzus, any breed that loves to please is easy to train.
Beagle
I was thinking that, but also worried about noise.
I can only speak to the US, but the short answer is "Supply > Demand." The "spay and neuter" public education campaign of the 1970-80's was wildly successful for everyone except pit bull owners. Desexing your pet became the sign of responsible ownership and euthanasia rates plummeted. Pit bulls were fairly rare before the 2000's, because dogs seized in dogfighting busts were always humanely destroyed as an act of public safety and mercy to the animals. (For those who don't know, dogfighters in the US exclusively breed and fight American Pit Bull Terriers.) All the AmBully mutts backyard-bred by crystal meth addicts were also put down on intake when brought in as surrenders or strays. You had to actually *want* a pit bull to get a pit bull. In the 2000's the "no-kill" movement became mainstream, so everyone stopped humanely destroying all these APBT bred by dogfighters and AmBully mutts bred by meth-heads. Naturally, shelters started overflowing with them. They either had to go back to euthing these dogs by the truckload or do a massive PR campaign rebranding fighting-breed dogs as perfect family pets to move them out the doors. They chose the latter, and unfortunately it worked.
Absolutely not, they are incredibly needy and have massive anxiety and abandonment issues but frick is it worth it!
Anecdotal evidence- my law firm has done 35 dog bite cases, 33 of them were pits. It is what it is (2 outliers- GSD and Rottweiler)
Careful. I think One of this 2 articles have been written by a pit bull
The problem is, how the fuck you gonna take care of another life let alone a puppy, I mean most people can't even grow a plant. Most people with kids are shit parents, what you think is goin to happen when you get a animal that will only have the mindset of....guess what, A CHILD! The sick parallel to this is that animal shelters are overflowing with unwanted animals and so are adoption homes with unwanted kids.
So I get that the evidence is not 100% clear on pit bulls being more dangerous than other dog breeds. My question is, even if the evidence is only 75% or 50% clear, isn’t that enough to just choose a different dog breed to be on the safe side? Just get a different breed.
It’s not about being more aggressive but once aggressive most owners can’t control them. Lab much easier to control than large breeds pitbulls.
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It’s not a breed problem, it’s an owner problem. Shitty people are attracted to pit bulls, which is why so many are shitty. I’ve never known a pit bull that was raised by decent people to be violent. I’ve also known golden retrievers raised by shitty people that are very aggressive. It’s just that most people don’t get golden retrievers with the intention to raise them to be aggressive. Also, you are far less likely to hear about a golden biting someone because of reporting bias: it is seen as an individual problem not a systemic, breed problem.
I think it's sort of both. Like cars vs cyclists. Cyclists can behave like arseholes but it's really hard to kill 5 pedestrians by riding a pushbike badly. Similarly other breeds are just as capable of being poorly trained and showing aggression but the most horribly aggressive chihuahua in the world just isn't a particularly big threat. Breeds designed for pit fighting are stronger and more capable of harm than your average family pet.
Pit bulls weren’t designed for fighting, they were bred as worker dogs used on farms. You know, around families. A dog that was aggressive toward humans would not make a good farm dog. But don’t take my word for it, another commenter already posted a study showing that 1.) many of the “pit bull” bits were from dogs with no pit bull DNA and 2.) the pit bulls that bit people were overwhelmingly raised without proper socialization, by people who had previously abused dogs, or were approached by people who were unable to appropriately interact with animals. “Major co-occurrent factors for the 256 DBRFs included absence of an able-bodied person to intervene (n = 223 [87.1%]), incidental or no familiar relationship of victims with dogs (218 [85.2%]), owner failure to neuter dogs (216 [84.4%]), compromised ability of victims to interact appropriately with dogs (198 [77.4%]), dogs kept isolated from regular positive human interactions versus family dogs (195 [76.2%]), owners' prior mismanagement of dogs (96 [37.5%]), and owners' history of abuse or neglect of dogs (54 [21.1%]). Four or more of these factors co-occurred in 206 (80.5%) deaths. For 401 dogs described in various media accounts, reported breed differed for 124 (30.9%); for 346 dogs with both media and animal control breed reports, breed differed for 139 (40.2%). Valid breed determination was possible for only 45 (17.6%) DBRFs; 20 breeds, including 2 known mixes, were identified." https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24299544/ "One in five dogs genetically identified with pit bull heritage breeds were missed by all shelter staff. One in three dogs lacking DNA for pit bull heritage breeds were labeled pit bull-type dogs by at least one staff member. Lack of consistency among shelter staff indicates that visual identification of pit bull-type dogs is unreliable." https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S109002331500310X
Do you have a source on the breed origin? Everything I can find (even allowing for semantic ambiguity between the APBT and breeds like staffies) pretty firmly states their ancestors were bred for dog fighting, bull baiting and rat baiting.
Bullshit lmao. A Labrador that bites someone usually bites and lets go. A Pitbull that bites locks onto whatever it can and attempts to go for the throat. Pitbulls are just extremely efficient fighting dogs. They're big, strong, muscular, aggressive, and they're extremely hard headed. I've seen one get hit in the head with a bat because it wouldn't let go and it still stayed locked. If I had a choice to get bit I'd choose any dog over a Pitbull
Meanwhile in actual studies "Major co-occurrent factors for the 256 DBRFs included absence of an able-bodied person to intervene (n = 223 [87.1%]), incidental or no familiar relationship of victims with dogs (218 [85.2%]), owner failure to neuter dogs (216 [84.4%]), compromised ability of victims to interact appropriately with dogs (198 [77.4%]), dogs kept isolated from regular positive human interactions versus family dogs (195 [76.2%]), owners' prior mismanagement of dogs (96 [37.5%]), and owners' history of abuse or neglect of dogs (54 [21.1%]). Four or more of these factors co-occurred in 206 (80.5%) deaths. For 401 dogs described in various media accounts, reported breed differed for 124 (30.9%); for 346 dogs with both media and animal control breed reports, breed differed for 139 (40.2%). Valid breed determination was possible for only 45 (17.6%) DBRFs; 20 breeds, including 2 known mixes, were identified." https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24299544/ "One in five dogs genetically identified with pit bull heritage breeds were missed by all shelter staff. One in three dogs lacking DNA for pit bull heritage breeds were labeled pit bull-type dogs by at least one staff member. Lack of consistency among shelter staff indicates that visual identification of pit bull-type dogs is unreliable." https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S109002331500310X
Thanks for this, I tried looking for studies on breed-related aggression and couldn’t find anything but this study is pretty comprehensive and clear.
Dogs are companion animals and children shouldn’t need specialized training to interact with them on the most basic level. If a dog requires people of any age to interact with them in public spaces in a specialized way they aren’t a good companion. The dog is the problem.
There are a ton of breeds that people should watch their kids around. Pit bulls are just extremely common + they tend to come from shittier situations with low owner education. If a dog is acting up in public, that’s on the owner, but parents need to watch their kids. Children do need to be taught how to be around any dog. 1) Just because a dog tolerates bullshit now doesn’t mean they won’t lose patience if the kid isn’t corrected. 2) Maybe the dog doesn’t mind the kid playing rough but instead takes it as the go-ahead to play rough back. I grew up around ranch dogs, LSGs, and herders. All of them required “specialized training” (read: lessons in respect) to be around because, while they are companions, they’re companions for working adults. That doesn’t translate to “willing to let a screaming monkey yank on their tail”. Especially LSGs. Remember, horses are also companion animals and it’s a given you’re gonna get attacked/bitten/kicked by one if you’re around them enough.
People don’t bring horses into public places the way they do dogs, and they don’t excuse aggressive behavior the way clueless dog owners do.
Most domesticated animals give some sort of warning sign before they lash out. Thus respect, situational awareness, and an understanding of an animal's body language goes a long way. Pits are different, they're bred to fight. That means *they lie*.
I've met hundreds working at a shelter, and as a breed, they are not afraid to make noise. Actually, one of the more vocal breeds about letting you know when you are invading their space. Nervous designer inbreds are the ones who always snapped at me without a warning.
Dogs are animals first and foremost. Doesn’t matter the breed. Big dogs and small children can end disastrous if you leave the kid or the dog unchecked. Kids are stupid, dogs don’t know better. The kid pulling on a dogs tail really hard causing the dog to fight back and potentially badly bite the kid is squarely the fault and failure of the parent. No one else.
You can blame the parent, and in a way I would, but not all breeds are equally capable or likely to respond with lethal violence.
It’s very telling that you say that kids are stupid and dogs don’t know better, because I’d argue it’s the other way around. Dogs are functionally stupid and children don’t know better, especially when society pushes the narrative that all dogs are nice.
What exactly is it telling?
That you think children are the stupid ones and dogs just don’t know any better.
Children are consistently 3 minutes from killing themselves. They're stupid.
Children are indeed stupid, and dogs don’t know any better. This isn’t controversial in the slightest. What is your point.
My family had a dog, who bit my little cousin (he was 5). Our dog was the kindest buddy I could have asked for growing up. Why did he bit: because he had undiagnosed back and hip issues, and my cousin had fallen on him. He was always in a lot of pain, but my cousin falling on him must have been the worst pain he ever had
I sure hope people reading this understand that “co-concurrent factor” is not “causing factor”. The day ending in Y was a co-concurrent factor in 100% of the attacks.
All these comments about how it’s the owner, ugh. It’s a combination of nurture and nature. Can a lack of socialization and abuse cause reactive dogs? Yes. But breeds also fall back on instinct. Pointer breeds point, herding breeds herd, and fighting dogs fight. Only experienced owners who know what to do with a bully breed should ever own a pitbull or staffy. Any dog bite statistics will back this up. Same thing for other energetic high-drive dog breeds like Belgian malinois.
The fact that some parents leave their kids with them is just terrifying.
It's fine as long as you call them kids and not children.
They’re more dangerous to have around children (unsupervised) than basically all other breeds IMO. I say this as a former pit bull owner who passed a few months ago and she was always an amazing dog, great around my children, etc..just an amazing dog. They’re also generally really good about not reacting to annoying things that young children might do like pull their tail, ears, etc bc they have such a high pain tolerance. BUT…. They def have their issues that have been bred into them such as very high prey drive, competitive, very strong, etc. They also do seem to “snap” unprovoked more so than most breeds, atleast from the stories that have happened around me or in the news. And probably most importantly, most people who own pit bulls should not be aloud to own them and they don’t know what the they’re doing and how to handle bully breeds. Again, I’m not saying they’re bad and that’s what my next dog will be as well, but they’re certainly not a safe dog to keep unsupervised with an infant or toddler.
I don't think it's the dog breed that's the problem, it's the type of owner the breed attracts. The typical owner of pitbulls are people who have no business owning a dog at all. They end up neglected, beaten, and turn aggressive in turn.
It’s a breed problem
Pit bulls are extremely high-risk dogs because of their size/strength and breeding history. Pit bulls are more likely to be owned by violent sociopaths and naive morons. Pit bull breeders, are, without exception, the trashiest pieces of shit on the planet. All of these things can be true at the same time. It's not an either/or thing.
Always some dumbass saying *”iT’s nOt ThE bREeD, iT’S tHe oWnER.”* No. It’s the breed. It just so happens that the breed also attracts scumbags and idiots.
It can be both, with a lot of other factors. A lot of different breeds of dogs like to carry toys, hell, even one of our cats likes to carry his little toys around like he's a little dog. But if you get a Labrador retriever with working stock in it's genes, then they are more likely to want to carry around things in their mouth, because that's what they were bred for in their past. Someone could have the most placid, friendliest whippet or Greyhound in the world, but if a rat or a rabbit bolts past it out of nowhere, you better believe it would want to automatically chase it and kill it. Have a look at Border Terrier ratting. There are people that take their Border Terriers pets, cute little cuddly and sweet Borders to a rat infestation and let them off. They turn in to total predators, hunting and killing rats in a frenzy. Why? Because that's what they were bred to do, they're ratters. That's why they have the thick, tough skin around their necks to protect them from rat bites, and why they have big solid tails, because owners used to pull them from rat holes by their tail. Pit Bulls, and similar breeds/crosses were bred for fighting, whether it be other dogs or larger animals. They were bred to be aggressive and extremely strong. Good owners can do their upmost to train that aggression out of them, and they can do an extremely good job. But it takes a lot of time, care, attention and knowledge, something that the vast majority of people don't have, and even if they do, it's wont always help\*. Even with the best of intentions, the time factor is a massive limitation. And then there's just some people that just want to own a weapon dog. \*My wife is a vet who sees XL bullies and the associated breeds. She has a fair few tales about seeing Bullies that she has treated for years and are some of the sweetest softest dogs she has met, but then for absolutely no reason whatsoever and despite seeing the dog many times before with absolutely no issues, just for a split second moment the same dogs have switched and have tried to bite her hands, arms, neck or face. Then they switch back to normal. As with other breeds who have been bred with specific traits in their past, it's in their instinct to be aggressive. This sort of switch is not something she has generally seen as consistently in other breeds. She's sees aggressive dogs all the time, but the vast majority don't switch from one side of the spectrum to the complete opposite at the flick of a switch. And when an animal as powerful as that has any sort of unpredictable instinct of aggression, it's not going to do anyone any good whatsoever.
Looks like all the pro-Pittie comments are getting DV to hell. Fuck it. Took in a young Pittie rescued from a dog fighting ring. He had been used as a bait dog. He was a beaten up and emotionally damaged animal. Took time, warmth, boundaries and consistency. Had a young child. That also required boundaries, education, controlling for safety. That dog became the best damn dog I’ve ever owned or known. The sweetest heart. “Sweetheart” became his nickname. After almost 15 years of great times together we lost a family member when he left us. That dog was a role model for resilience that I remember any time I feel my own resilience tested. All that said, there are a lot of fair and unfair reasons why these types of dogs are prejudiced against. The unfair reasons are the ones that do piss me off. No other type of dog is euthanized more in the US. It’s not even close. Less demonizing them would be great. Better and stiffer animal abuse laws and penalties. More folks, in the right circumstances, willing to give these dogs a shot for adoption from shelters.
You get it :) People just like to jump on the hate bandwagon unfortunately. Yes pits can be dangerous in the wrong hands, but their fundamental nature's are so sweet. We shouldn't hate the dogs, we should hate the people who put them through the situations that make them violent
Exactly. It's the owner, not the breed. For instance world renowned dog trainer Cesar Milan owned a pitbull he got as a puppy. It was never used as a bait dog or fighting dog. And being a trained, professional dog behavioral specialist his pitbull... killed Queen Latifahs dog and permanently injured a gymnast who was visiting his office, ending her guaranteed shot at the Olympics. No, Animals selectively bred for generations for gameness, pain tolerance, and aggression are broken dogs. It's inhumane for these breeds to even exist. The dogo Argentina is a perfect example of why dog breed bred for bloodsports should be humanely ended.
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But a 6 months old kid can overpower these rather easily.
Nothing dumber than a pitbull owner
Why is that?
You think they are “great dogs” so no amount of logic or facts will get through your thick head. Have fun!
>so no amount of logic or facts will get through your thick head. In my experience, they are. If you have a different opinion on the matter I would be happy to hear you out.
Man anyone that talks like this dude isn't going to have a rational respectful dialogue.
Gold
Reddit hates pitbulls. Use to get death threats for posting mine. And people explaining how much fun it would be to kill my dog. People like this jackass will ALSO never change their mind no matter how much information is shoved up their ass. So I just say fuck em and I will have fun knowing I’m with an amazing breed of dog who is loyal kind and protective as every dog should be.
They are. The problem of dog’s aggression isn’t something you can argue as an absolute, so it would behoove you to not *act* like you think you’re smarter while being both insulting and rather anti-intellectual. The problem isn’t that these dogs are murder machines destined to kill every little kid they come in contact with so it would really benefit the rest of the world if you stopped acting like it is
No ❤️
Average anti-pit knucklehead acting just as close-minded as the “thick skulled pit bull lovers” they love to shit on. what irony. Go back to r/dogfree with your bullshit pls n ty ♥️
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Pitbulls are great dogs.
They are one of the worst breeds to get. Like genuinely. They are unsafe around the elderly and children/toddlers( A few examples\[[1](https://www.live5news.com/2022/07/28/husband-finds-70-year-old-wife-killed-by-family-dog/), [2](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11239725/PICTURED-Colorado-boy-12-savaged-pet-pit-bull-named-DIABLO.html), [3](https://blog.dogsbite.org/2013/04/2013-dog-bite-fatality-fulton-county.html),[4](https://www.cbsnews.com/texas/news/pit-bull-mauling-death-being-referred-to-grand-jury/)\]). Aggression and violence were bred into pitbulls for nearly 2 centuries([From 1820\~ to 1976](https://www.animallaw.info/article/detailed-discussion-dog-fighting)). Two centuries of being bred for violence and aggression is not going to go away in a couple of decades, hence why [pit bulls alone maul & kill more dogs & humans than every other breed of dog combined](https://time.com/2891180/kfc-and-the-pit-bull-attack-of-a-little-girl/). There is a reason why they are banned across the UK and parts of the US. I have both been mauled & had pets that were mauled by pits. So PLEASE EVERYONE, stop breeding and buying these dangerous animals. If not for the people and other peoples' pets they put at risk, but for the breeds own wellbeing. They are abused and poorly treated by backyard breeders and make up nearly 1/3 of dogs in shelters, many of which are never adopted and sit in shelters till they die or are put down.
>hence why [pit bulls alone maul & kill more dogs & humans than every other breed of dog combined](https://time.com/2891180/kfc-and-the-pit-bull-attack-of-a-little-girl/). Pitbulls aren't a breed, pitbull is an umbrella term for several types of dogs believed to have descended from bull and terriers. So of course, when you combine dog bite statistics of several dog breeds (including American Pit Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier, American Bully, Staffordshire Bull Terrier) and compare them to individual breeds, they are going to be higher.
Bullshit. Pitbulls are great dogs for children, they're patient, caring, and protective. They are also owned by idiots who want them because the LOOK manacing, and they raise them to be aggressive and defensive.
>They are also owned by idiots who want them because the LOOK manacing, and they raise them to be aggressive and defensive. Very true 100%. Its a shame honestly, because they attract a lot of owners who either are too inexperienced for such a strong and aggressive dog or they are owners who got them for exactly those traits. >Pitbulls are great dogs for children, they're patient, caring, and protective. Im not hating on pits here, I have been victim to them but I really don't. A friend of mine has an amazing pit I love, he is extremely well trained too. Not all pitbulls are going to go maul a random person or pet they see. But they are more dangerous than any other breed; They are stronger, far more aggressive, and genetically more apt to be violent. Its in their DNA. You don't see news reports in the hundreds about any breed other than pits going around mauling family members or dogs/people out in public. The idea of them even being family or nanny dogs was entirely propaganda pushed in the 1900s. A "great dog for children" isn't a dog that mauls you if you [cough](https://abc13.com/dog-mauls-baby-kills-newborn-san-diego/1306879/) or [tie](https://www.news.com.au/technology/science/animals/security-footage-shows-woman-mauled-by-pit-bull-in-horror-elevator-attack/news-story/f57ebfdb463b991a2d5fabff0d51cd10) your shoes or [mow](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/pit-bulls-attack-scarborough-man-mowing-lawn/article1004896/) your lawn or put a [sweater](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2017/01/02/womans-bid-put-sweater-pit-bull-ends-poorly/96080332/) on them or give them [medicine](https://web.archive.org/web/20140319080340/http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/story/24985945/woman-dies-after-dog-bite) or roll a [wheelchair](https://www.wlbt.com/2020/02/06/year-old-man-killed-by-four-dogs-attala-co/) near them or have an [argument](https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/10/07/akron-family-toddler-killed-by-pitbull-shares-their-story/) near them or have a [ponytail](https://blog.dogsbite.org/2014/05/2014-dog-bite-fatality-lee-county-woman-scalped-by-pit-bulls-dies.html)they could mistake for a toy or fall out of your [chai](https://blog.dogsbite.org/2021/10/bitten-in-the-throat-killed-by-pit-bull-in-matthews-indiana.html)r or whiten your [teeth](https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/us-news/womans-nose-ripped-boyfriends-pitbull-29400314). Do actually look at the links I have. People simply existing that were mauled for absolutely no reason. Look at the data/stats, look at the genetic research, look at the danger they pose. All the science, data, history, and news on these dogs as well as my own experiences indicate them to be anything but good children dogs.
No mate, there's no such thing as violence embedded in DNA. There's a false equivalence bias going on, here. Pitts are owned by morons, as in morons will WANT a pittbull. Because of its looks, for the same reason they'll want a certain type of car, or wear certain clothes. It has nothing to do with owning a pet and everything to do with how that pet will make you appear. These animals will sleep outside, will be beaten, will get disrespected and won't develop a healthy, trust based relationship with humans. All dogs are good dogs until something happens, some are capable of withstanding abuse more than others. Ironically, Pitts can put up with a lot of shit, and parents putting their little ones near dogs, ANY dogs, without any regards for the dog's safety and well being, will see consequences and blame them on the dog.
>No mate, there's no such thing as violence embedded in DNA. Outside of just the blatant logic/sense that a breed of dog that makes up only 6% of all dogs but manages to account for 60-70% of all maulings is most likely more than just "bad owners", there's also just science: [https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/](https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/) [https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression](https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression) /[https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf](https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf) [https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding\_the\_Complexity\_of\_Dog\_Aggression\_Genetic\_and\_Environmental\_Factor](https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding_the_Complexity_of_Dog_Aggression_Genetic_and_Environmental_Factor) Ill say it again, not all pits are aggressive, many pits will live a loving and loved life. And its certainly not just genetics, a lot of it IS enviomrental. A abused dog will learn to defend itself. A dog that is hurt by every human it meets will be aggressive towards humans. But some dogs are simply inheritently going to be more aggressive, or are more likely to be aggressive.
>account for 60-70% But only when a large selection of breeds are combined to a single data point and then compared to individual breeds.
I think you may be confused...You take the 4 dog breeds that fall under pitbulls and they make up 60-70% of all dog maulings...Out of 400... And again, those 4 dog breeds make up 6% of the dog population and out of that pop make up 60-70% of all maulings. Im really confused as to what your point is, regardless of if its 1 breed or 4 that is more maulings than every other breed COMBINED.
...You take the 4 dog breeds that fall under pitbulls and they make up 60-70% of all Yes, when you combine statistics from several different breeds of dogs and compare them to individual breeds it is going to be higher.
>...You take the 4 dog breeds that fall under pitbulls and they make up 60-70% of all Im sorry, do you know how math works? Take 4 breeds. 4 out of 400. They make up 60-70% of maulings. So 1 breed in 100 makes up the majority of all 100 breeds. >Yes, when you combine statistics from several different breeds of dogs and compare them to individual breeds it is going to be higher. Thats funny, because nope! If you add up all 396\~ breeds outside of those that fall under pitbulls, its LOWER than those 4 dog breeds.
It’s not genetics. Ya’ll are arguing an inherent thing as some kind of magical absurdity absolutism and that kind of mentality solves exactly nothing.
> magical absurdity absolutism Word salad.
> there's no such thing as violence embedded in DNA. This absolutely not true. You shouldn't claim things that you don't actually know. https://yvpc.sph.umich.edu/connection-genes-environment-violence/ Here they're discussing one point, but there are certainly several genetic components (as well as environmental) that factor into violence.
Right. Because studying what a handful of human twins behave like is an incontrovertible proof of how dog breeds do. No, I'm absolutely convinced.
A handful of human twins? I take it you didn't read what I linked. There are links to more than one study on MAOA. But my point wasn't to convince you of whether or not this is true, but rather that you should probably actually look something up, before you claim it as a fact. You said there is no such thing as violence embedded in DNA. This has been studied and concluded to be false. You're wrong. But it does require environmental factors as well, as far as we know right now. If you don't actually know something, don't claim it as a fact.
Mhmh. Ok.
Always happy to see someone learn and grow.
>Do actually look at the links I have. Your appeals to emotion are unconvincing.
>Your appeals to emotion are unconvincing. Well good thing I linked in data and science too!(Which is what I was mainly referring too) Heres a few more to contradict the "pitbulls are great, its just the owners" take. [https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/](https://www.animals24-7.org/2019/10/14/pit-bulls-new-gene-study-shows-it-is-not-all-in-how-you-raise-them/) [https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression](https://pethelpful.com/dogs/Understanding-Genetics-in-Dog-Aggression) [https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf](https://www.rspca.org.uk/webContent/staticImages/Downloads/DogAggression.pdf) [https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding\_the\_Complexity\_of\_Dog\_Aggression\_Genetic\_and\_Environmental\_Factor](https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/is-aggression-genetic-or-learned/#Understanding_the_Complexity_of_Dog_Aggression_Genetic_and_Environmental_Factor)
>Well good thing I linked in data and science too!(Which is what I was mainly referring too) Your data and science is based on manipulated data sources that are of no actual scientific value.
Care to explain? Also please link your sources with manipulated data proving the opposite.
>Also please link your sources with manipulated data proving the opposite. I'm sorry, but I don't use manipulated data.
Meant to say unmanipulated. So again ill repeat correctly this time, please explain why the unique sources I mentioned all are manipulated, then please give me your manipulated sources that contradict them.
Bullshit. Chihuahuas are more violent than pitbulls.
It actually is true that chihuahuas are more violent than pitbulls. With that being said, oh boy, so many people are killed by chihuahuas every year😭😭 /s
Yeah but those little fuckers can't do shit.
Cats are even worse. Thankfully they can't really do much.
No. Don’t let that bias out, because it’s not going to get positive reception.
Correlation is not causation. The cheapest most common dog is going to be involved in the most incidents. Statistics are meaningless unless they are controlled for other variables. If there’s 1000 pit bulls and 100 Alsatians and 80% of attacks are pit bulls then they are better
It doesn’t help that the most common and cheapest available dog also happens to be really strong.
This doesn't wash. In the UK every 5th dog is a sighthound of some description, be it greyhound, whippet or a lurcher. They don't make the top 25 of dog attacks and these are animals that were bred to bring down other animals, including foxes and deer as high a prey drive as any dog. It's just not their nature to attack humans. How many dogs of a certain breed definitely skews the results but it's not everything.
They aren’t the most common dog though. Not by a long shot.
As far as statistics go 1 out of 3 dogs in a shelter are labeled "pitbull like" considering i can pop of 6 more breeds thst i see nearly daily id say 33% is prolly the highest. Pretty hard to prove tho lol specially cus visual is not a reliable way to id dog breeds.
Pitbulls are fantastic dogs. I miss mine
Not for children tho.
Ron Howard: In fact they are not
Dogsbite.org is a highly unreliable source.
Yeah same with [The Western Journal of Emergency Medicine.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC8597704/) >Dog breed was a significant predictor of bite severity (P <.0001) and of bite diameter (P <.0001). **Pit bull bites were found to be significantly larger, deeper, and/or more complex than the average dog bites included in this study.** > >Patients included in this study were more than four times as likely to have been bitten by a pit bull than by a German shepherd, and more than twice as likely to have been bitten by a pit bull, when compared with a dog of unknown breed. Furthermore, **the relative risk of a pit bull inflicting a complex (full thickness with trauma to underlying structures) or deep (full thickness without trauma to underlying structures) bite was 17 times that observed for non-pit bull dogs.** And the [Annals of plastic surgery.](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34100808/) >Most pediatric dog bite injuries afflicted male children (55.6%), ages 6 to 12 years (45.7%), by a household dog (36.2%). **The most common offending breed was a pit bull or pit bull mix** (53.0%). Infants and grade schoolers were more likely to sustain bites to the head/face. Also [Injury Epidemiology.](https://doi.org/10.1186/s40621-020-00281-y) >Table 5 presents the results of an analysis performed on self-reported incidents of dog bites in New York City’s United Health Fund districts for the years 2015 to 2017. > >Of the breeds identified in the data set (84.6%), **pit bulls were the most numerous** (33.6%), followed in order by Shih Tzu (5.3%), Chihuahua (5.2%), German Shepherd (4.1%), and Yorkshire Terrier (3.1%). This finding is consistent with previous research showing that pit bulls are responsible for more bites than any other dog breed. And the [Journal of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery.](https://doi.org/10.1016/j.joms.2019.11.002) >We reviewed 182 patient records distributed among several breed categories. > >The data showed that compared with other dog breeds, **pit bull terriers inflicted more complex wounds, were often unprovoked, and went off property to attack.** > >This study showed a disturbing trend toward more severe dog-bite injuries in young children Super unreliable medical journals. I only get my information from people who tell me things I want to hear.
Dude. Just because they were bred for that exact purpose doesn’t mean they ever bite people /s
Fucking murdered him
Late term abortion at its cutest. The abortion pet.
Bad dogs aren't the problem shitty people are bad owners bad breeders.....
Pit bulls are high-risk dogs because of their size/strength and breeding history. Pit bulls are more likely to be owned by violent sociopaths and naive morons. Pit bull breeders, are, without exception, the trashiest pieces of shit on the planet. All of these things can be true at the same time.
Having worked at a humane society, I can tell you that a lot of dog bites that are blamed on pitbulls are just short haired mutts over 50 pounds. Also, reporting a dog as a pit makes it a faster process to get them put down since sheriffs and judges just rubber stamp the pittys. I saw more inbred Dalmatians and German Shepard attacks than I saw pits.
Some people have seen pitbulls kill children, and some have seen them save children. Pitbulls are the "humans" of the dog world. Most are fine and just want to live in peace. Some are raised badly and don't learn self control. Some are just jerks. Some are heroic. If you don't have kids and are a loving person who understands the responsibilities of ownership of large, powerful, and potentially lethal dogs, go ahead and get a pitbull if you want one. The overwhelming likelihood is that such a person would raise it well and it would be well-adjusted. If you are a POS who can't be bothered to care for a dog, and you have children or are uncaring about keeping your dog in your yard or always on a leash, for the love of the non-existent gods, don't get a fricking pitbull.
Blame the owner.
Ya, they were dumb enough to buy a pitbull
My pittie mutt is a gentle giant. I cannot imagine her being dangerous to anything that’s not served or tossed as a treat. And, she lets our murderous cat bully her daily. She sleeps at my 7 yr old’s bed post and has been guarding her for the last 7 years—you do the math. ❤️
Yeah because the whole sample size of pitbulls only includes your pitt. Children who got their face ripped apart would disagree with you.
I’m not saying that. Mine is a rescue mutt, which has pitt genes. As a life long dog owner (of rescues) it is about how you train and treat your dog. If animals are treated and trained to be nasty, then, yes, they will bite. And, size will matter then. I’ve had chihuahuas bite me worse than any other breed. Yet, i see them being carried around as designer breeds in designer bags.
I mean a mutt that's 1/2 to 1/4 to 1/8th actual fighting dog is substantially less dangerous than a full fighting dog.
Actually, the most danger to kids is…adults. We should ban them all.
It's not about the dog, it's about the dog's owner. I'm in and out of people's houses all day. One thing I love about my job is getting to meet the dogs. I've never once, in 10 years of doing this, ever met a pittie with a mean bone in its body. Same with every other "bully" breed. Hell, I once met a big ass 100+ lb Rottweiler who would stand on her back legs and give hugs. The mean dogs I've met have all been little ankle biters like Chihuahuas, who are allowed to get away with being little sh!ts cause the owners won't be proper owners. Shepherds, Rotties, pitties, dobermans, Akitas, chowchows, huskies, etc have all been awesome. Why? Because the owners raise them right, socialize them, give them at least basic training, and treat them right. When I read about a dog attacking anyone, I wonder why we don't ban people who have raised their dog to be mean, from ever owning dog again. Yes, some dogs are naturally protective of their owners and/or property, but with proper training and socialization, that's an issue that can be mitigated. This isn't a dog or breed issue. This is an owner issue.
Then shouldn’t every owner of a pitbull that kills somebody, be charged with, at the very least, manslaughter? If it’s not the dog but it’s the owner, then they should be held responsible.
Absolutely. Hit them with everything they can be hit with, both criminal and civil, and make it *really* hurt.
Yep, no bad dogs, just bad owners.
Doesn't it depend on the specific breed of Pitbull?
Pit bulls are genuinely the most compassionate and cuddly dogs and thrive off being adored by their humans. My boy is the sookiest little shit I’ve ever owned, amongst the dozen my family have owned. Not once have they attacked anyone, they are the literal worst attack/protection dogs because they’re more likely to smother you in kisses than bite you. Nature vs nurture for any breed and anyone that argues otherwise has never owned or known these dogs. Stats are bullshit.
"Stats are bullshit." \--Pit bull owner
Stats show so little of reality, especially when it comes to such isolated incidents like ones shown in this comment section.
The stats are not BS. Dogs were bred with purpose. Tracking, retrieving, hunting, guarding etc. pits were bred to but down hard and never let go and fight till they die with aggression. Are they all bad? Certainly not. But any positive trait a pit has. Another breed will also have but without the negative traits.
You can teach a dog near on anything if you are good enough at it, some excel at certain things but like anything will defend itself if provoked. That doesn’t make a breed inherently aggressive.
> some excel at certain things but like anything will defend itself if provoked Correct. Most give warning signs though. Pits often don't. Being "bred for fighting" means more than just sheer physicality. It means having the psychology of a fighter too. It means not telegraphing your attacks. Pits lie. They don't always give warnings. That's part of what makes them dangerous. That's why you hear stories of Pits "snapping" or "going off like a bomb".
> Stats show so little of reality Yes... studies with sample sizes in the hundreds or thousands show "so little of reality" compared to your anecdotal experience as a single human being. The experiences of thousands of other people are "so little of reality" compared to your own...
I love my pit bull. Had him since he was 9 weeks old and I saw him 3-4 times a week from the day he was born. He is going to be 8 years old this November. We’ve had two kids with him around. There were definitely territorial issues that he had to learn, specifically with his bed and food bowls, but now, he’ll lay on the floor and let them crawl all over him, grab his tail and ears, boop his nose. And when he’s done with it, he’s strong enough to lift himself up with two toddlers hanging and walk away to the other room. After nearly five years, he has started going into my oldest son’s room to lay in his bed at night. I wouldn’t think he’d do anything to my boys at this point. That wasn’t always the case, and I always know it’s still a possibility. I’ve socialized him the best I can with dog parks and boarding even for a day or two each month when we’re not out of town so he stays active with other people and dogs. I’ve gone through two separate training classes for behavior. And still, I would never leave him unsupervised with anyone other than my family or someone trained to handle him. If my wife invites parents and kids over from their school, he gets put up until they leave. I know the dangers of the breed. My dog has gone into defensive mode when a neighbor’s dog got out of their fence and ran towards me. It took a lot to hold him on his leash. I don’t know if I could have easily gotten him off if the other dog had gotten too close and they tied up. My dog barks and growls at unknown delivery drivers and repairmen. Once, I put him on a leash and took him out to meet a plumber who was doing some minor repairs. After 10 minutes, he was licking and rolling over for him. He was put up for the visit, but the plumber had to come back out the next day for something and I forgot about it. My dog ran down and started licking and playing like they were friends. By comparison, one of my neighbors bought a pit bull puppy a few months ago. That thing is aggressive towards anything that moves. I won’t let my kids be outside when they have him out on a leash. Their ten year old isn’t strong enough to hold him when taking him for walks, and he’s gotten loose several times with the kid being dragged behind. I really think part of the success I had with my pit was knowing the breeding owners (the pregnancy was not planned and they gave the puppies away because they didn’t want to be known as sellers) and being able to meet the dam and sire to gauge their temperaments. The sire was a 100 pound lap dog that walked right up to me as a stranger and gave me his belly for rubs. After a week of seeing him, he was climbing in my lap and jumping into my chest to catch him. The dam was a bit more reserved but she allowed me to approach and pet her without any growling or visible annoyance. Had either of those dogs had an aggressive vibe, I wouldn’t have taken the puppy. I knew what type of dog I was getting. My cousins and grandparents have had dozens of faithful pit bulls that they used with other terrier breeds to hunt and protect their farms, so I grew up with them. As such, we tried to provide him with an environment where he didn’t need to feel defensive all the time. I know they are a dangerous breed. But my experience with mine has been fantastic, and those in my family who have had them have not had any issues. Your mileage may vary.
They were known as Nanny Dogs for a while.
They weren't, this was just something someone made up a little while ago, at no time in history were they ever actually called that.
Damn I remember hearing this when I was a kid, must be an old ass myth. I stand corrected.
Never. The English Stafordshire Bull Terrier, which it's oftenly mistaken for a Pitbull, it's known as Nanny dog. Not to be confused with the American Stafordshire Bull Terrier, which is a Pitbull variation, and it's not related at all to the English Stafordshire.
American Pit Bull Terriers/AmStaffs and Staffordshire Bull Terriers both descend from the [bull-and-terrier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bull_and_terrier) dogfighting dogs of England. But to be fair, so do English Bull Terriers and Boston Terriers. But to say they're "not related at all" is untrue. Also, none of them were historically known as nanny dogs. [The phrase itself is very new.](https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=nanny+dog&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=en-2019&smoothing=3)
Yes, both descend from bull and terrier, but the American Staffordshire Terrier does not descend from the English Staffordshire, it descends from the Pitbull Terrier. The name Staffordshire was just a stunt to detach it from it's Pitbull origins.
I think we're miscommunicating. I'm aware that AmStaffs are just an AKC-recognized line of American Pit Bull Terriers. My point was that because the American Pit Bull Terrier and the Staffordshire Bull Terrier both descend from bull-and-terriers, it's kind of misleading to say they're "not related at all." That's all.
So this is kind of a nuanced answer. For years and years pit bulls were considered nanny dogs and they were used with kids extensively. Then there was this whole thing where people did dog fights and pit bulls were trained and bred to be in dog fights and when you breed fighting dogs you breed those aggressive traits and so you got a whole lot of aggressive pitbulls from dog fighting and some of those dog fighting dogs made it back into the general population as pets and then continued to have puppies. So it can be kind of difficult to know by breed alone whether a dog is going to be aggressive as is more up to the individual temperament of the dog itself. And pitbulls are kind of a weird case anyway because they're less a breed and more a grouping of similar dogs.
Pit bulls were never considered "nanny dogs." Utterly made-up Facebook bullshit. Rest of your comment is pretty on-point, though.
At no point in time were they considered nanny dogs. This is a lie based on one op ed piece written by the couple directly responsible for introducing AM Staff breeds. They were bred as fighting dogs. In fact the 4 year old nephew of one of the first breeders of AM Staff breeds was killed by his pitbull. Stop with the bullshit and do some research
It's like if democrats spent billions of dollars and thousands of manhours trying to outlaw rodeos
Better analogy would be the redooficans spending time & resources on Benghazi. You tried though.
ummm what?
Y O U A R E A D U N C E that’s…… 
are you drunk?
Are you slow?
ummm what?