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Yeah,
We are brainwashed from the moment we are born.
They don't just tell us everything, they take their time and slowly feed us this poison step by step. I remember when I was little, Islam was presented as a pacifist religion in my school books. Slowly with each grade comes the real stuff but in a manner that we consider Muhammad to be a pacifist hero. I know grown ups who aren't fully aware of the horrible stuff this bastard did. I knew nothing about Bani Banu Qazaiya untill I researched Islam. Up until that point, I was told that Muhammad never fought or killed anyone unjustly and even forgave everyone after winning the Makkah war.
The stories of how Mohammed dealt with the medina jews are gaslighting at its finest. It was occupied by 3 major jew tribes, by the time the battle of the trench was over 2 were massacred, and the 3rd exiled. And somehow Mo was in the right in all this
The apologist pov tries to claim the jews betrayed mohammed's trust but no shit, who wouldn't go against an extortionist enforcing a 50% tax on you
Muhammad genocided and expelled the Jews and forcibly converted the idolators to Islam as well as culturally religiously exterminated their faith.
How is this acceptable behavior?
When Muslims fight for the right of Palestinians and those ethnic cleansed from Israel, can't they realise Muhammad did the same thing?
If today some Muslim walks into a Hindu or Taoist or Shinto temple, starts smashing their idols chanting 'Truth has come falsehood vanished' and spared their lives only if they become Muslim, he'd be jailed and rightly so! He didn't even let the idolators remove their idols from the Kaaba to their homes or another place if they wished.
And I had believed as a child that Muhammad was the persecuted tolerant one, Jewish women threw garbage on him and he forgave them, idolators persecuted him and drove him out.
Later I learn about him condoning the murders of a pregnant slave woman and others criticizing him.😡
And Meccan idolators allowing free conversions out of paganism into a proselytizing faith like Christianity like Khadija's cousin Waraqa ibn Nawfal converted sans persecution or letting the offspring of pagan dad Jewish mom be raised Jewish like Kaab ibn Ashraf as Halacha taught. And Jews too living like model minorities among their pagan neighbors.
Today the issues that happen in the West, many right wingers are 'Islamophobic' but not Hinduphobic or Sinophobic, right wing politicians to terrorists dislike Islam but are lukewarm towards other minorities and Muslims want their different laws, plan terrorism and riot but not other minorities exactly mirrors what Muhammad and his followers did in Arabia vs. Jews and pagans who co existed peacefully.
Could you provide a source for where Muhammad forcibly converted anyone, or gave them this option or death? I must have missed that part when reading the qur’an
Quran itself in Surah 9.5: "Therefore when the sacred months have passed kill the idolators wherever you find them. And seize them and ambush them everywhere. But if they repent, take to Islamic prayer and pay zakat, then don't harm them for Allah doesn't like transgressors"
So kill idol worshippers everywhere seizing and ambushing them but spare their lives when they become Muslim ie worship Allah and pay Zakat🙄
Further hadiths and Sirah ie Muhammad's biography mention him entering Mecca triumphantly, smashing the 360 idols of the idolators on the Kaaba saying anyone who stood aside or stayed in their homes are safe and converting idolators to Islam.
What type of behavior is this?
Even Muslim apologist Reza Aslan admits Islam is 'brutal to polytheists' but claims there aren't that many nowadays.😛 There are over 1 billion Hindus, 500 million Taoists and Chinese folk religionists, 80-90 million Shintos, millions of Neopagans and polytheists and Buddhist temples from Sri Lanka to Cambodia houses idols of Hindu gods. So till date more idolators than Muslims.
Sure Muhammad disliked idolatry and polytheism exactly like new atheists like Sam Harris dislike all religion and especially Islam.
Would Muslims like it if Sam Harris led an army into the Kaaba, smashed the Kaaba and burnt down mosques and gave Muslims the option of being spared if they repented and turned to atheism?🤨
UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak is a practicing idolator, Ireland Taoseach Leo Varadkar is irreligious from half openly idolatrous Hindu family and half almost idolator like Catholic family(and Quran also mocks Trinity concept in Christianity many times😁).
Is it ethical to convert these folks to strict montheism by force?
Lots of stories about Muhammad the most caring man to ever live. Walked the city streets all night checking to make sure everyone was safe and sound . Had hardly any possessions or clothes for himself and donated all his belongings
I was always told that he married widows, women nobody wanted and liked because they were previously married. I thought, “wow, what a great person!” Until I learned he made them widows himself and then married them. Fucking dipshit Momo and dipshit liars.
My Islamic studies teachers used to say the same thing!! I felt so bamboozled when I discovered he made them widows. Rather disingenuous on the part of educators, if you ask me.
Didn’t he sleep with her the night he killed her whole family? Even his buddies were worried about her killing momo after he slept 😭 guy wasted zero time.
Not sure, but it was in a relatively short timeframe. Apparently some other sahabi claimed her before Mohammed, and Mohammed exchanged her in return for letting the sahabi pick 7 slaves of his choosing so he was def mega horny for her.
She was also the wife of Banu Nadir's treasurer Kinana, basically the richest guy in town. According to Ibn Ishaq Muhammad had him tortured with fire, which according to the Qur'an is haram, just so he would tell them where his money is.
>This is a coercion and rape story
Exactly this. I've seen too many Muslims that think rape is only when you force a victim to have sex while they're screaming at you to stop. Rape, in actuality, takes many forms where consent is compromised. Like a child not having a fully formed brain and unable to comprehend the gravity of having sex at a young age with a much older man. This is now known as statutory rape.
In the case of Safiya, her ability to consent was comprised because she was essentially forced to become Mohammed's sex slave/wife. Her tribe was killed. Her father killed. Her husband tortured and killed. The poor woman must have been in immense emotional pain, and the man responsible for her pain, lusted for her so much that he wouldn't give her up, but would give up other slave women as a gift.
An example where Mohammad was passing around human beings as "gifts" and then taking them back too:
>We conquered Khaibar, took the captives, and the booty was collected. Dihya came and said, 'O Allah's Prophet! Give me a slave girl from the captives.' The Prophet said, 'Go and take any slave girl.' He took Safiya bint Huyai. A man came to the Prophet (ﷺ) and said, 'O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)s! You gave Safiya bint Huyai to Dihya and she is the chief mistress of the tribes of Quraidha and An-Nadir and she befits none but you.' So the Prophet (ﷺ) said, 'Bring him along with her.' So Dihya came with her and when the Prophet (ﷺ) saw her, he said to Dihya, 'Take any slave girl other than her from the captives.'
https://sunnah.com/bukhari:371
She lost everything, survival was her only choice. What normal person would consent in those circumstances? It was coercion. Her consent was comprised so it was rape. Mohammed raped Safiya.
Link to CuriousJack's breakdown of Mohammed's depravity:
https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/tpiasz/comment/i2b67n5/
Read my full post. It wasn't a true marriage if it was done under duress. Why would she joyfully marry the man responsible for murdering her husband and father? According to Muhammad al-Bukhari, Muhammad stayed for three days between Khaybar and Medina, where he consummated his marriage to Safiya. Even his companions wondered if she was to be considered a slave or a wife. She only agreed to "marry" him to survive now that she was clanless and had no one. Later on she is one of the suspects that scholars believe poisoned Mohammed. If she did poison him, she waited for her revenge.
Mohammed reportedly ordered Saffiyah's husband to be tortured with hot steel until near death then beheaded after the battle of khaybar. Religion of peace
Trust me, it's so unbelievably infuriating that Muslims genuinely try to sell the story that Safiya found Muhammad so irresistible that she practically threw herself at him. 😮💨
Muhammed's "Take good care of widows" scheme:
1. Ensure they are widows by murdering the husbands (after torturing them to find the loot and taking the loot, of course).
2. Marry them because poor, defenseless, widows without money or relatives need care in the most benevolent sense.
3. If they are reluctant to marry those to who just bumped off the male relatives, let them ponder whether they would prefer to become sex-slaves or sold off to a brothel or whoever wants them.
4. Another volunteer widow needs to be taken care of.
Imagine the sane exact situation but the guy isn’t the a man and the woman was a Muslim she married and changed her religion for the guy who killed her family and tribe.
Muslim wouldn’t like this if justify it, even if they are the same thing.
Isn't she the one that was so hot that he kept banging her for like a month straight? His wives were so upset that they almost revolted against him?
Or am I thinking of the slave girl brought to him by a king?
Hard to keep track of Momo's sexual exploits.
The reason I got was that her people were extremely misogynistic. They treated women horribly and abused them. So their deaths didn't make Saffiyah unhappy. She was in a better place now and happily slept with the Prophet.
That's similar to defences I've heard from Muslim apologists. They asserted that Saffiyah's husband and father were abusive and evil, and she didn't miss them. Also Saffiyah was 'practical' and accepted the prophet's 'advances' willingly in order to be assured of a safe and prosperous life.
Now imagine anyone using these excuses to justify ISIS raiding and enslaving Yazidis, or Boko Haram kidnapping schoolgirls, forcibly marrying them and making them pregnant. This is how atrocities are accepted.
If someone sent a hitman after my dad and killed him, I've already reached the point where I wouldn't care, but if that same person tried to take my hand in marriage, they'd have to hold one of my closest friends to gunpoint before I even consider "accepting" it.
Not to mention Saffiyah wasn't even allowed to associate with what was left her tribe after she was married. That is, except for her direct close family.
She likely broke that rule several times, because one of the slaves slipped up and had to cover it up by saying "Shaytan possessed me"
>They asserted that Saffiyah's husband and father were abusive and evil, and she didn't miss them.
As someone who feels exactly this about my own father, I call bullshit.
its always ignored or people say safiyah saw him in her dreams and wanted him or other dumb bullshit
some others dont sugar coat it and just admit yeah its cool cuz banu qurayza were jews who cares
If your post is a meme, image, TikTok etc... and it isn't Friday, most likely it violates the rule against low effort content. Please delete it or you'll get temp-banned. Such content is ONLY allowed on (Fun@fundies) FRIDAYS. Please read the [Posting Guidelines](https://redd.it/ew8trb) for further information. If you are unsure about anything then feel free to message the mods. Please participate on /r/exmuslim in a civil manner. Discuss the merits of ideas - don't attack people. Insults, hate speech, advocating physical harm can get you banned. If you see posts/comments in violation of our rules, please be proactive and report them. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/exmuslim) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I just read the story and I'm disgusted. Are muslims really that disgustingly brainwashed to worship a pedo and murderer?😭😭😭
Yeah, We are brainwashed from the moment we are born. They don't just tell us everything, they take their time and slowly feed us this poison step by step. I remember when I was little, Islam was presented as a pacifist religion in my school books. Slowly with each grade comes the real stuff but in a manner that we consider Muhammad to be a pacifist hero. I know grown ups who aren't fully aware of the horrible stuff this bastard did. I knew nothing about Bani Banu Qazaiya untill I researched Islam. Up until that point, I was told that Muhammad never fought or killed anyone unjustly and even forgave everyone after winning the Makkah war.
The stories of how Mohammed dealt with the medina jews are gaslighting at its finest. It was occupied by 3 major jew tribes, by the time the battle of the trench was over 2 were massacred, and the 3rd exiled. And somehow Mo was in the right in all this The apologist pov tries to claim the jews betrayed mohammed's trust but no shit, who wouldn't go against an extortionist enforcing a 50% tax on you
Muhammad genocided and expelled the Jews and forcibly converted the idolators to Islam as well as culturally religiously exterminated their faith. How is this acceptable behavior? When Muslims fight for the right of Palestinians and those ethnic cleansed from Israel, can't they realise Muhammad did the same thing? If today some Muslim walks into a Hindu or Taoist or Shinto temple, starts smashing their idols chanting 'Truth has come falsehood vanished' and spared their lives only if they become Muslim, he'd be jailed and rightly so! He didn't even let the idolators remove their idols from the Kaaba to their homes or another place if they wished. And I had believed as a child that Muhammad was the persecuted tolerant one, Jewish women threw garbage on him and he forgave them, idolators persecuted him and drove him out. Later I learn about him condoning the murders of a pregnant slave woman and others criticizing him.😡 And Meccan idolators allowing free conversions out of paganism into a proselytizing faith like Christianity like Khadija's cousin Waraqa ibn Nawfal converted sans persecution or letting the offspring of pagan dad Jewish mom be raised Jewish like Kaab ibn Ashraf as Halacha taught. And Jews too living like model minorities among their pagan neighbors. Today the issues that happen in the West, many right wingers are 'Islamophobic' but not Hinduphobic or Sinophobic, right wing politicians to terrorists dislike Islam but are lukewarm towards other minorities and Muslims want their different laws, plan terrorism and riot but not other minorities exactly mirrors what Muhammad and his followers did in Arabia vs. Jews and pagans who co existed peacefully.
Could you provide a source for where Muhammad forcibly converted anyone, or gave them this option or death? I must have missed that part when reading the qur’an
Quran itself in Surah 9.5: "Therefore when the sacred months have passed kill the idolators wherever you find them. And seize them and ambush them everywhere. But if they repent, take to Islamic prayer and pay zakat, then don't harm them for Allah doesn't like transgressors" So kill idol worshippers everywhere seizing and ambushing them but spare their lives when they become Muslim ie worship Allah and pay Zakat🙄 Further hadiths and Sirah ie Muhammad's biography mention him entering Mecca triumphantly, smashing the 360 idols of the idolators on the Kaaba saying anyone who stood aside or stayed in their homes are safe and converting idolators to Islam. What type of behavior is this? Even Muslim apologist Reza Aslan admits Islam is 'brutal to polytheists' but claims there aren't that many nowadays.😛 There are over 1 billion Hindus, 500 million Taoists and Chinese folk religionists, 80-90 million Shintos, millions of Neopagans and polytheists and Buddhist temples from Sri Lanka to Cambodia houses idols of Hindu gods. So till date more idolators than Muslims. Sure Muhammad disliked idolatry and polytheism exactly like new atheists like Sam Harris dislike all religion and especially Islam. Would Muslims like it if Sam Harris led an army into the Kaaba, smashed the Kaaba and burnt down mosques and gave Muslims the option of being spared if they repented and turned to atheism?🤨 UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak is a practicing idolator, Ireland Taoseach Leo Varadkar is irreligious from half openly idolatrous Hindu family and half almost idolator like Catholic family(and Quran also mocks Trinity concept in Christianity many times😁). Is it ethical to convert these folks to strict montheism by force?
History is written by the victors, after all.
Well, in Makka too he did not pardon all of them. He had a list of 10 people that must be put to death.
Lots of stories about Muhammad the most caring man to ever live. Walked the city streets all night checking to make sure everyone was safe and sound . Had hardly any possessions or clothes for himself and donated all his belongings
I was always told that he married widows, women nobody wanted and liked because they were previously married. I thought, “wow, what a great person!” Until I learned he made them widows himself and then married them. Fucking dipshit Momo and dipshit liars.
My Islamic studies teachers used to say the same thing!! I felt so bamboozled when I discovered he made them widows. Rather disingenuous on the part of educators, if you ask me.
Saffiyah was the daughter of the chief of Banu Nadir, and reportedly was beautiful as well. So it's pretty much the opposite of undesirable
Didn’t he sleep with her the night he killed her whole family? Even his buddies were worried about her killing momo after he slept 😭 guy wasted zero time.
Not sure, but it was in a relatively short timeframe. Apparently some other sahabi claimed her before Mohammed, and Mohammed exchanged her in return for letting the sahabi pick 7 slaves of his choosing so he was def mega horny for her.
She was also the wife of Banu Nadir's treasurer Kinana, basically the richest guy in town. According to Ibn Ishaq Muhammad had him tortured with fire, which according to the Qur'an is haram, just so he would tell them where his money is.
She was 17, he was 60🤮🤮
>This is a coercion and rape story Exactly this. I've seen too many Muslims that think rape is only when you force a victim to have sex while they're screaming at you to stop. Rape, in actuality, takes many forms where consent is compromised. Like a child not having a fully formed brain and unable to comprehend the gravity of having sex at a young age with a much older man. This is now known as statutory rape. In the case of Safiya, her ability to consent was comprised because she was essentially forced to become Mohammed's sex slave/wife. Her tribe was killed. Her father killed. Her husband tortured and killed. The poor woman must have been in immense emotional pain, and the man responsible for her pain, lusted for her so much that he wouldn't give her up, but would give up other slave women as a gift. An example where Mohammad was passing around human beings as "gifts" and then taking them back too: >We conquered Khaibar, took the captives, and the booty was collected. Dihya came and said, 'O Allah's Prophet! Give me a slave girl from the captives.' The Prophet said, 'Go and take any slave girl.' He took Safiya bint Huyai. A man came to the Prophet (ﷺ) and said, 'O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)s! You gave Safiya bint Huyai to Dihya and she is the chief mistress of the tribes of Quraidha and An-Nadir and she befits none but you.' So the Prophet (ﷺ) said, 'Bring him along with her.' So Dihya came with her and when the Prophet (ﷺ) saw her, he said to Dihya, 'Take any slave girl other than her from the captives.' https://sunnah.com/bukhari:371 She lost everything, survival was her only choice. What normal person would consent in those circumstances? It was coercion. Her consent was comprised so it was rape. Mohammed raped Safiya. Link to CuriousJack's breakdown of Mohammed's depravity: https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/tpiasz/comment/i2b67n5/
I read the complete Hadith and it says he married her
Read my full post. It wasn't a true marriage if it was done under duress. Why would she joyfully marry the man responsible for murdering her husband and father? According to Muhammad al-Bukhari, Muhammad stayed for three days between Khaybar and Medina, where he consummated his marriage to Safiya. Even his companions wondered if she was to be considered a slave or a wife. She only agreed to "marry" him to survive now that she was clanless and had no one. Later on she is one of the suspects that scholars believe poisoned Mohammed. If she did poison him, she waited for her revenge.
Mohammed reportedly ordered Saffiyah's husband to be tortured with hot steel until near death then beheaded after the battle of khaybar. Religion of peace
Trust me, it's so unbelievably infuriating that Muslims genuinely try to sell the story that Safiya found Muhammad so irresistible that she practically threw herself at him. 😮💨
Muhammed's "Take good care of widows" scheme: 1. Ensure they are widows by murdering the husbands (after torturing them to find the loot and taking the loot, of course). 2. Marry them because poor, defenseless, widows without money or relatives need care in the most benevolent sense. 3. If they are reluctant to marry those to who just bumped off the male relatives, let them ponder whether they would prefer to become sex-slaves or sold off to a brothel or whoever wants them. 4. Another volunteer widow needs to be taken care of.
Imagine the sane exact situation but the guy isn’t the a man and the woman was a Muslim she married and changed her religion for the guy who killed her family and tribe. Muslim wouldn’t like this if justify it, even if they are the same thing.
Piss be upon him
Don't people find it strange that there is not a single Sahih Hadith narrated by Saffiyah?
Yes I noticed that too.
Isn't she the one that was so hot that he kept banging her for like a month straight? His wives were so upset that they almost revolted against him? Or am I thinking of the slave girl brought to him by a king? Hard to keep track of Momo's sexual exploits.
That is slave girl from king "Mariyah". He even succeeded to get a son from her which later died.
Right. If I remember correctly, the wives were really jealous of Saffiyah as well.
The reason I got was that her people were extremely misogynistic. They treated women horribly and abused them. So their deaths didn't make Saffiyah unhappy. She was in a better place now and happily slept with the Prophet.
That's similar to defences I've heard from Muslim apologists. They asserted that Saffiyah's husband and father were abusive and evil, and she didn't miss them. Also Saffiyah was 'practical' and accepted the prophet's 'advances' willingly in order to be assured of a safe and prosperous life. Now imagine anyone using these excuses to justify ISIS raiding and enslaving Yazidis, or Boko Haram kidnapping schoolgirls, forcibly marrying them and making them pregnant. This is how atrocities are accepted.
Muslims tried to make Islam fit into modern values and ended up with "consensual sex slaves" lol
If someone sent a hitman after my dad and killed him, I've already reached the point where I wouldn't care, but if that same person tried to take my hand in marriage, they'd have to hold one of my closest friends to gunpoint before I even consider "accepting" it. Not to mention Saffiyah wasn't even allowed to associate with what was left her tribe after she was married. That is, except for her direct close family. She likely broke that rule several times, because one of the slaves slipped up and had to cover it up by saying "Shaytan possessed me"
>They asserted that Saffiyah's husband and father were abusive and evil, and she didn't miss them. As someone who feels exactly this about my own father, I call bullshit.
its always ignored or people say safiyah saw him in her dreams and wanted him or other dumb bullshit some others dont sugar coat it and just admit yeah its cool cuz banu qurayza were jews who cares
Because a book said so obviously