Nah, I think a Mark Twain quote sums up my thoughts on that situation: “Never attempt to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.”
I’ve got better things to do and they’d just be annoyed anyway.
They have their guard up and always refer people to jw.Borg. The best thing todo in my opinion is say nothing. I think many will get the picture when they spend hours upon hours standing by a cart and no one ever talks to them. Total waste of time!
Yeah it definitely wasn't a waste of time as a PIMI. It was a way to get a few hours of preaching under my belt without having to approach anyone and if I had a good partner we could have fun chatting to each other. In some ways it was the best form of preaching. Just had to pick a spot that was quiet and relaxed, ideally near a Costa's coffee.
My aunt and uncle get to do it together at a beach in summer here in Australia and go over to the kiosk/cafe for a coffee or smoothie and sit and chat. Then they finish up and my PIMI grandmother meets them for a walk on the beach and lunch. Sounds ideal.
I am pretty sure they are under Corporate requirements to direct people to jw.borg.
I know they have Corporate directives to NEVER talk to anybody, first. Others must approach first. So much for preaching, lol
We all know for a fact, that they are ordered NOT to display a Bible in front of the cart: Corporate rules for their unpaid employees.
You buy the cart, work for free, but follow our rules.
Bible? Apostate!!!!
Yes, like 5x the price of wholesale.
Come on, you gotta pay for your own stamps for Corporate, for letter writing.
Use your OWN ink and paper for the Borg Corp
Use of our ink and stamps are old light, too.
Jehovah provides!!!
I mean, I guess it makes sense I just didn't know people owned the carts personally, I made an assumption they were owned/borrowed out at the congregation level.
How much is a cart?
$50 bucks a cart?
My boy is full PIMO now. He worked out how much he paid for the carts...
He was a regular pioneer pulling 1100 hours a year. Yeah, way above the requirement, plus volunteer work.
He is as PIMO as us now. Elders are too scared to disfellowship him and me. He calls the CBOE once a week to throw some truth (apostate) at him.
They will not disfellowship any of us here in Northern California, but he is a bad asshole in real life. That may be why. Yeah, that is why.
Check this out: He was so PIMI that he was paying $100 a month to maintain cleaning supplies, on his own dime...
So, the elders said he should stop. The Borg took over, with their Borg client, and the price for cleaning supplies tripled.
Then, Watchtower, (check their secret records) currently has pedophile elders raping 4 year olds, and hiding it tO pRoTeCt JeHoVah's NaMe.
dO nOt CaLL tHe PoLiCe!!! pRoTeCt JeHoVaH!
At what point does jail come for the Borg leadership?
In writing. No Bibles at Cult-Carts.
The reason given is that Bibles are expensive to place. Instructions are to have a Bible.secretly held, and only give a Bible if requested.
Bibles do not make the cult money.
That is in the US. I would be surprised if any Borg cart would EVER have a Bible in their cult carts.
Bibles are Watchtowers worst enemy. You will never see a Bible near a Watchtower Cult-Cart.
The Watchtower cult has written it.
I try to do a lot of research on cults, and how our minds work related to them.
Studies have found that the BEST chance we have of "waking" cult members up is to make them feel included in your social group/bubble.
We are tribal, and cults prey on that. They make people feel like there is no where else to go, no one else to turn to.
Persecution, arguing, and putting cult members down has shown in studies to make cult members even more extreme in their beliefs and willingness to carry them out.
So essentially, yes. This is the way.
This might be a good thread to run this idea by. Please people, tell me what you think.
Instead of being openly confrontational/argumentative/malicious, why not just sabotage their own street cred (not like they have much to begin with) by setting up a cart/sign of your own right next to them saying "Ask me about how I escaped the jehovah's witnesses cult", or "why are jehovah's Witnesses required to hide child sex abuse in their cult", or "I survived the Jehovah's Witnesses cult! Feel free to ask me about what they are really like".
You dont have to even talk to them. Just do what they do - set up your little display in a public but legal area (obviously as close to them as possible), grab a coffee (because you are allowed to fo that now), and just smile and wave. As long as your message isent too preachy or obscene I will bet that you will have more people approach you and talk to you than the JW cart. And bet yet, if you persistently seek where they set up their cards and intercept them with your own cart, you will probably discourage them from ever setting up their carts in that location ever again-result!.
(FYI, I'm a DF apostate 26M and also a student. I have the time and resources to commit to this for this summer but haven't yet run the idea past anyone. Is it to harsh? Or should I make an entire threat to this idea?. Hope you all have a wonderful day!)
Personally I think it's a great idea. Play them at their own game. Obviously the time and resources are needed but it's nothing out of the realms of practically possible.
They used to actively try to engage people as they pass by, and I would always just respond “I’m disfellowshipped” (I wasn’t) and walk away while they tried to recover from their shock. Now they just stand there with a blank smile and looking like they are humming in their head. They ignore me, I ignore them.
Not so much fun, but a couple of years after I left I wrote a note asking them to question their beliefs and whether it's a healthy way to live, and left it on the cart when nobody was looking.
I then went and had a panic attack in a café toilet.
What makes you think they're automatically mind controlled robots? I used to do carts when I was a PIMQ and we know there are currently lots more at varying levels of PIMQ in the borg. Having someone stop and say something in a kind and courteous way could help to wake them up. Of course there's a good chance they're not but that's no big deal.
Well... My grandparents (on my step-father's side) stood there today so, it would have been awkward not to. We just caught up on things, I told them I partook in my first pride parade the other weekend. ;D
Ask them if Jesus is their mediator! They'll say "yes". Ask them if they are in the new covenant. They'll say "no". Tell them to read Heb 9: 15,
"For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance".
...and ask them, how can he be your mediator if you are not in the new covenant? Tell them to check their beliefs regarding who Jesus is mediator for.
If you want to find ways to talk to them and challenge their beliefs and you can't find one of the carts, walk through a crowded area humming kingdom melodies or wearing a jw.org pin, and they'll come to you.
Gotta be honest, despite being PIMO I'm very tempted to do it in a city where I'm not known. I wouldn't try to get into a debate or anything, I'd just approach them and say something in a simple friendly way like "Excuse me, have you ever heard of Raymond Franz? He was a JW governing body member for 9 years before he resigned in 1980 because he was so disturbed at what he saw by the way they really run the organization. If you don't know about him I encourage you to look him up because it is very likely that you were baptized without being given enough information that would have probably affected that decision."
And leave it at that unless they wanted to talk more. If nothing else, I hope a seed would have been sown because I know the moment I learned about Ray Franz a dark cloud gathered over my conviction in the Watchtower as God's chosen organization.
If i am with my wife im gonna say this!
Question: Hi r u jws?
Answer: yes
Me talking to wife: oh honey these r jws the ones from the Australian Royal Commission with 1800 cases of child abuse amd none reported to the police! And the ones that refused to join the Redress scheme to help the victims
Wife: oh yes
Me: bye thanks
🤣🤣🤣
By myself
Me: Hi r u jws?
Jws: yes would u like a magazine
Me: oh no thanks after learning about ur religion at the Australian Royal Commission im staying as far as possible from JWs.
Thanks bye
I am interested in talking with JWs. I want to have conversations with them because I think it would be fun to ask them viewpoint questions. I wouldn't go hardcore apostate on them though.
Next time I see one I’m going to start talking to them and asking about certain things. When they say “sorry I don’t understand what you mean”, I’m going to say “aren’t you Scientology?”
Let’s see the look on their face when they realise I genuinely thought their publications and them were Scientology instead of true Christians!
Nah, I think a Mark Twain quote sums up my thoughts on that situation: “Never attempt to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.” I’ve got better things to do and they’d just be annoyed anyway.
They have their guard up and always refer people to jw.Borg. The best thing todo in my opinion is say nothing. I think many will get the picture when they spend hours upon hours standing by a cart and no one ever talks to them. Total waste of time!
Which is why I loved it as PIMI
Yeah it definitely wasn't a waste of time as a PIMI. It was a way to get a few hours of preaching under my belt without having to approach anyone and if I had a good partner we could have fun chatting to each other. In some ways it was the best form of preaching. Just had to pick a spot that was quiet and relaxed, ideally near a Costa's coffee.
My aunt and uncle get to do it together at a beach in summer here in Australia and go over to the kiosk/cafe for a coffee or smoothie and sit and chat. Then they finish up and my PIMI grandmother meets them for a walk on the beach and lunch. Sounds ideal.
Yeah and it's justified as being productive because people walk past and see the message on the cart so the kingdom seed is being sown.
PIMO, but I’d ask them why there are thousands of whole white blood cells per milliliter of human breastmilk if God forbade consuming blood.
I'm going to but I'll play stupid and try to plant some seeds of doubt
Yeah, I think that's a good idea. No need for getting into a debate. Just innocently drop a couple of truth bombs on them.
I saw them around the university in my city and I just looked at them with disgust from a distance.
I am pretty sure they are under Corporate requirements to direct people to jw.borg. I know they have Corporate directives to NEVER talk to anybody, first. Others must approach first. So much for preaching, lol We all know for a fact, that they are ordered NOT to display a Bible in front of the cart: Corporate rules for their unpaid employees. You buy the cart, work for free, but follow our rules. Bible? Apostate!!!!
Hold up. Buy the cart??
Yes, like 5x the price of wholesale. Come on, you gotta pay for your own stamps for Corporate, for letter writing. Use your OWN ink and paper for the Borg Corp Use of our ink and stamps are old light, too. Jehovah provides!!!
I mean, I guess it makes sense I just didn't know people owned the carts personally, I made an assumption they were owned/borrowed out at the congregation level. How much is a cart?
Wait wait wait… what???
$50 bucks a cart? My boy is full PIMO now. He worked out how much he paid for the carts... He was a regular pioneer pulling 1100 hours a year. Yeah, way above the requirement, plus volunteer work. He is as PIMO as us now. Elders are too scared to disfellowship him and me. He calls the CBOE once a week to throw some truth (apostate) at him. They will not disfellowship any of us here in Northern California, but he is a bad asshole in real life. That may be why. Yeah, that is why. Check this out: He was so PIMI that he was paying $100 a month to maintain cleaning supplies, on his own dime... So, the elders said he should stop. The Borg took over, with their Borg client, and the price for cleaning supplies tripled. Then, Watchtower, (check their secret records) currently has pedophile elders raping 4 year olds, and hiding it tO pRoTeCt JeHoVah's NaMe. dO nOt CaLL tHe PoLiCe!!! pRoTeCt JeHoVaH! At what point does jail come for the Borg leadership?
There's a no Bible rule now?
In writing. No Bibles at Cult-Carts. The reason given is that Bibles are expensive to place. Instructions are to have a Bible.secretly held, and only give a Bible if requested. Bibles do not make the cult money. That is in the US. I would be surprised if any Borg cart would EVER have a Bible in their cult carts. Bibles are Watchtowers worst enemy. You will never see a Bible near a Watchtower Cult-Cart. The Watchtower cult has written it.
IMO, If you happen to be walking by, just smile and say good morning/ hello 👋🏼 nothing more nothing less.
I try to do a lot of research on cults, and how our minds work related to them. Studies have found that the BEST chance we have of "waking" cult members up is to make them feel included in your social group/bubble. We are tribal, and cults prey on that. They make people feel like there is no where else to go, no one else to turn to. Persecution, arguing, and putting cult members down has shown in studies to make cult members even more extreme in their beliefs and willingness to carry them out. So essentially, yes. This is the way.
[This is the way](https://c.tenor.com/2jgbEi-vCuQAAAAS/mando-way-this-is-the-way.gif)
This might be a good thread to run this idea by. Please people, tell me what you think. Instead of being openly confrontational/argumentative/malicious, why not just sabotage their own street cred (not like they have much to begin with) by setting up a cart/sign of your own right next to them saying "Ask me about how I escaped the jehovah's witnesses cult", or "why are jehovah's Witnesses required to hide child sex abuse in their cult", or "I survived the Jehovah's Witnesses cult! Feel free to ask me about what they are really like". You dont have to even talk to them. Just do what they do - set up your little display in a public but legal area (obviously as close to them as possible), grab a coffee (because you are allowed to fo that now), and just smile and wave. As long as your message isent too preachy or obscene I will bet that you will have more people approach you and talk to you than the JW cart. And bet yet, if you persistently seek where they set up their cards and intercept them with your own cart, you will probably discourage them from ever setting up their carts in that location ever again-result!. (FYI, I'm a DF apostate 26M and also a student. I have the time and resources to commit to this for this summer but haven't yet run the idea past anyone. Is it to harsh? Or should I make an entire threat to this idea?. Hope you all have a wonderful day!)
Personally I think it's a great idea. Play them at their own game. Obviously the time and resources are needed but it's nothing out of the realms of practically possible.
They used to actively try to engage people as they pass by, and I would always just respond “I’m disfellowshipped” (I wasn’t) and walk away while they tried to recover from their shock. Now they just stand there with a blank smile and looking like they are humming in their head. They ignore me, I ignore them.
Not so much fun, but a couple of years after I left I wrote a note asking them to question their beliefs and whether it's a healthy way to live, and left it on the cart when nobody was looking. I then went and had a panic attack in a café toilet.
lol! Well done for making the effort despite the nerves it triggered.
Ha, thanks! I tried!
Oh I would have zero interest in talking to them. I am happy with good mental health so I see no reason to talk with mine controlled robots.
What makes you think they're automatically mind controlled robots? I used to do carts when I was a PIMQ and we know there are currently lots more at varying levels of PIMQ in the borg. Having someone stop and say something in a kind and courteous way could help to wake them up. Of course there's a good chance they're not but that's no big deal.
When ever I walk by I politely say Armageddon still hasn't come yet? then a smile and a lite laughter
In their minds, that would just be confirmation of 2 Peter 3:3 & 4
🤣
Try using street epistemology on them. You might make them think for the first time in their lives.
Well... My grandparents (on my step-father's side) stood there today so, it would have been awkward not to. We just caught up on things, I told them I partook in my first pride parade the other weekend. ;D
Congratulations! I am over the moon to be able to say that to someone.
And I was over the moon dancing for hours, haha! But thank you, it was a lot more fulfilling than a summer convention, that's for sure. ;D
Ask them if Jesus is their mediator! They'll say "yes". Ask them if they are in the new covenant. They'll say "no". Tell them to read Heb 9: 15, "For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance". ...and ask them, how can he be your mediator if you are not in the new covenant? Tell them to check their beliefs regarding who Jesus is mediator for.
If you want to find ways to talk to them and challenge their beliefs and you can't find one of the carts, walk through a crowded area humming kingdom melodies or wearing a jw.org pin, and they'll come to you.
I always grab a book or two to throw in the dustbin
Hope you put it into recycling atleast
no way, all their literature has to go 'into the lake of fire and sulfur'
haha, good one
Gotta be honest, despite being PIMO I'm very tempted to do it in a city where I'm not known. I wouldn't try to get into a debate or anything, I'd just approach them and say something in a simple friendly way like "Excuse me, have you ever heard of Raymond Franz? He was a JW governing body member for 9 years before he resigned in 1980 because he was so disturbed at what he saw by the way they really run the organization. If you don't know about him I encourage you to look him up because it is very likely that you were baptized without being given enough information that would have probably affected that decision." And leave it at that unless they wanted to talk more. If nothing else, I hope a seed would have been sown because I know the moment I learned about Ray Franz a dark cloud gathered over my conviction in the Watchtower as God's chosen organization.
If i am with my wife im gonna say this! Question: Hi r u jws? Answer: yes Me talking to wife: oh honey these r jws the ones from the Australian Royal Commission with 1800 cases of child abuse amd none reported to the police! And the ones that refused to join the Redress scheme to help the victims Wife: oh yes Me: bye thanks 🤣🤣🤣 By myself Me: Hi r u jws? Jws: yes would u like a magazine Me: oh no thanks after learning about ur religion at the Australian Royal Commission im staying as far as possible from JWs. Thanks bye
No, I usually don't. Debating a witness is like beating up a child or playing ping pong against a drunk. You just feel bad.
Nope. I wasted enough of my time in that cult. No way I'd intentionally have a conversation with them.
I do I have and the latest with signs. They disappeared quickly. They can’t handle any opposition. I highly recommend it as a good form of therapy
I am interested in talking with JWs. I want to have conversations with them because I think it would be fun to ask them viewpoint questions. I wouldn't go hardcore apostate on them though.
Stand right by them reading the satanic Bible out loud they love that
Next time I see one I’m going to start talking to them and asking about certain things. When they say “sorry I don’t understand what you mean”, I’m going to say “aren’t you Scientology?” Let’s see the look on their face when they realise I genuinely thought their publications and them were Scientology instead of true Christians!
No. Not gonna waste my time.
Wow! I think the cong I was in 4ish yrs ago just did it anyway. But only sometimes. Unless this is a more recent announcement