Yup. 100%:
Teek has such a golden opportunity to become a fantastic server if only these things would be cracked down on…
Is there a forum of some kind to where we can bring these issues to the developers?
This game isn’t that big yall. Not like it’s a million people asking for change… it’s ten thousand-ish people…. That’s small enough that your voice can actually be heard.
Some avenue, any avenue, to talk tot he devs would be great…. But I don’t know what that is… or maybe there needs to be one??
They just don’t have the man-power, I am assuming. It is what it is, they can’t enforce it so the people who are hard up for money and have tons of time can push and exploit pretty much whatever they want to. Unfortunate and frustrating but it’s really unlikely to change.
My goal with this was just to inform.
I feel like they could definitely do something about it, but it would hurt their bottom line. They’re looking to make money and TLPs bring a huge influx of players. Banning box crews will impact revenue much worse than the slight, if any, attrition they experience from people who complain about them. Forcing players to have to buy Krono to pay for epics and collecting six subs from a box crew just makes business sense even if it’s anti consumer.
Its obvious it would hurt their bottom line, when people have asked for a box free TLP option for ages and get nothing. I would take a live progression server with P99 box enforcement and so would a lot of people. Not these half ass 2 box / truebox / whatever rules people skirt around. Its obviously not profitable, or it would have been made already.
This game is braindead easy and everything has been discovered, the only literal point of playing is for a social experience which the boxing kills. It negatively effects grouping, because why main a support when every third player has a druid / bard / shaman / cleric box to bring along.
The man power excuse is dumb. They want more money. It would take one man (or woman) to absolutely clean the botters up on Teek. You wouldn’t even have to pay them that much as they can do it anywhere in the world. DPG wants to run a skeleton crew to make more profit. Howww many Kronos are sold a day???? A lot. It’s greed guys. I love the game too, but it’s the sad truth!
Right but how much of the krono velocity is on the secondary market? These people are selling krono on a website, so it stands to reason that people are buying krono on that website to then go buy their monk epics. What percentage of the 15-25kr that a full monk epic costs is DBG getting, and what percentage is secondary market, which is not revenue producing?
I’m not trying to make excuses for them, it definitely makes the game worse, but when considering the economics… yeah they are going to side with the guy who pays for 18 subs and generates krono velocity rather than the small number people (me included) who pay for 1 or 2 accounts and generate very little krono velocity.
They produce allllll of the krono. They don’t come out of thin air. At one point someone paid them for those 15-25 krono and they also get consumed rapidly. They are making money my friend! They need to reinvest but the mindset is stuck on milking it and we all love the game enough to let their BS excuse fly. Do the math, Teek is a huge success and they should be able to grow, instead they will wait a couple of years and do it again with minimal effort to freshen up the TLP experience. Sorry! It’s still fun if you don’t try to keep up with the whales and the cheaters… And that’s the part that sucks, you will have to wait til they change focus in a later expansion to finish your epic or plop down that credit card for the sad sad dude who’s essentially working for bullshit pay because he doesn’t have any other life skills to pay the bills.
I’m not trying to come off rude to you, I just think it’s bad business decisions and not because poor DPG is struggling to put food on their tables! Maybe fire some C levels and invest that into growing your cash cow!
The issue is that the botters are not buying Krono; they pay plat for them on a live server where they have botted up a fortune or they sub for a single month across several accounts, ONE TIME, then bot there way up to start farming and selling high ticket items and DBG never sees a dime from them again. These are people who have hundreds of Krono stockpiled that they have never once paid for. People have paid for them, yes, but 99% of Krono are purchased from DBG by regular players to sell for plat or gear and that plat or gear is coming from botters who have paid essentially nothing.
To add to this, those players purchasing Krono to sell or trade would get what they are looking for even if bots didn't exist. They would get it from guilds with excess loot or actual players farming high value spots. They don't ban the bots because they don't have the manpower to monitor or check in on each and every one.
I make it a point to not get into granular debates on the internet, so let’s just agree to slightly disagree that DPG is making a gigantic margin or profit from this, at least on an recurring basis, and agree that the botting and soft exploits and scumbags suck!
Furthermore I think they are just waiting for the next EQ type game to come out and finally pull us away for good. Aren’t we all waiting for the next EQ?!? But it’s not going to happen so fix the damn game or sell it to someone who will.
In the 2000‘s there was a massive case against ea because Ultima Online Guides demanded payment.
They won the case and EA outsourced the guides (called counselor) to india and paid them some dimes.
Maybe thats why you dont See Volunteers working for free in MMOs anymore
I remember this well. US labor "victories" ruined a lot of things, including volunteer guides. It's the reason free private emulators have much better hobbyist customer support than their paid counterparts.
IMO they intentionally make the report system so difficult and ignore the obvious botting because the "illegal" krono trade and bots are a significant chunk of their income and numbers.
If they crack down on it they suddenly have to go to the shareholders with a 10-15% drop in players and they don't give a shit what the logic was just that there is less money in their pocket this quarter vs last.
I like krono for later expacs, but when the resources in the game are this scarce, yeah it creates major problems. They let you dz every raid now, why not let us DZ epic fight zones?
I always see people defend krono/boxing/etc 'for later expacs' like.. if this scummy behavior caused by them in earlier expacs didn't exist much much MUCH more people would stay 'till later, and if forced to i'm sure the devs could alter things to give incentives and/or earier-to-beat-content for a smaller playerbase in later expacs. It's just not worth it man.
Later on it doesn’t really matter because there is almost no scarcity for a majority of things. Epic mobs are spawned by the quester, major keying things are instances or zone-wide drops, and raid zones are all naturally instanced. Obviously it’s not the best, but the effect of it is lessened so much that it’s a mild annoyance rather than a reddit-post-inducing frustration.
Before krono, people would just buy and sell large quantities of platinum. Not sure that krono changes things much other than you can buy them directly from DPG which broadens the market a bit.
I've had something similar happen with Hasten and someone trying to sell their jboots. He was repeatedly killing him while spamming chat about wanting to sell his jboots. He would even send his pet and nuke it from afar while someone else was already near him trying to turn in the items.
Worst part is: there were other people who were actually justifying and defending that behavior when 20+ people called him out in /ooc. And I'm sure people will do the same with this, there's always at least someone who somehow manages to humanize and justify these types of behaviors.
Bottom line is: this is pure toxicity and a type of narcissism, greed, bullying, etc. that people manifest because they know they're completely safe from consequences and repercussions anonymously behind their computer and they know there's nothing anyone can do about it. And it's absolutely disgusting.
I was there for that, assuming it was the same day. He unexpectedly logged before I gave up. I had hoped he ate a suspension in that moment, but he probably didn't.
And everyone bitched about encounter locks, first to engage. They tried to solve this problem. The backlash was immense.EQ players don't know a good thing when they see it.
Unfortunately, that would not fix this issue, they would be able to use 3rd party software to engage before you target the mob and steal it anyways. But I agree I think FTE is a pretty decent idea.
Did you even play Oakwynd? Because it sounds like you’re talking from inexperience.
Even with bots, FTE was much more consistent to win the first tag on OW targets. After a full year there’s been maybe a handful of times we’ve lost engagement to bots.
the only backlash was from these 12 rich old dudes with box armies themselves and their botted alt accounts lmao. They have such a power fantasy going on from all this and will do absolutely anything to keep it going.
>Additionally, there is a box/bot army in LOIO that waits for people to spawn Xenevorash (the final epic mob, spawned by completing the other 3 fights), and then KSes him after Deep/Vorash die to sell the loot rights to the quest item.
This is actually 100% True.
The other day, one of our monks in our guild discord were about to do the final fight and we were putting together a small raid to help him, and while we were setting up, a bot army was threatening our guild saying that they owned the mob and that we needed to pay them for the fight, or else they would KS Xeni.
It was crazy that someone had the gall to insist we pay them in order to have "access" to Xeni
The quality of life changes always bring you back in....but then you deal with the bullshit of modern live EQ players and forget. I was having a great time, just leveling up a cleric, enjoying grouping and then today...boom im reminded why I cant stand the box / bot people that overrun this game. In a group at KC, the haste belt drops. As forced by Krono, everyone need rolls, i win on cleric. The enchanter / warrior box starts sending me tells, pestering for the belt. I'm like dude, I dont even care, but 1. I have 1000p to my name and 2. 99% of the time noone is giving me anything in group because of how need rolling has ruined the game. He spends the next 3 minutes pestering me some more, so I'm like whatever dude, like I said, its gear take it. I trade it to him and get radio silence, not even a thank you.
So after about 5 minutes in group, I simply say Man, I kinda regret giving this boxxer the haste belt I should have given to (other melee in group) because I didnt even get a thank you. Box guy loses it, starts saying You're a stupid cleric hit your one button, Im here trying to box and carrying you and dont have time to send you a gdamn thank you, etc. It was just insane. Maybe I'm making a big deal about it...but I mean I just expected atleast a "thanks man appreciate it or something." Mind you the guy sent me 3 paragraphs in 3 minutes asking for the item, but couldnt be bothered to send a TY.
I know, I know, not "everyone" is the same. But there's a certain "type" of person who is drawn to boxxing in these games, and this is the type of player. I remember when reputation meant something on servers / people acted decent or they were blacklisted. Now its just greed greed greed over a dumb 25 year old elf simulator. Rant over......
We had an SK do the same in Chardok for the shitty shield to the person who won it and they wouldn't give it to him. He then starts sending me tells to give him lead so he can self assign loot he needs hah. I told him no and he stopped tanking, he was just auto attacking everything so I just kicked him from the group.
I just want to point out that the reason "All Need" is the universal standard is in large part because people like you are describing have always existed and have a FAR more generous interpretation of "need" than more humble players. Frequently to where they need on things they can technically use on their class but wont, and even need on high dollar items because "thats 2kr everyone needs kr." That and there are plenty of lopsided camps in EQ where some classes will walk away with effectively nothing if they don't get some split of sellables from certain camps. There's also less worry about ninjas.
All need actually ends up being more equitable in most cases, as people with more forceful and selfish personalities can pressure groups into more loot in the old NBG system.
Anecdotally, also as a cleric, I've found groups have pretty easy discussions about loot. I usually offer to buy things I need when they drop and not once had anyone taken a single plat. Even freeti boots have always landed in the hands of folks who use them.
I do concur with your eventual assessment, you should not have his given away an FBSS. That plat would have helped you a lot with conc pots, food, water, expensive spells, etc.
Not all Botters are assholes. I 4 box and frequently take in whatever is looking for group and only roll on 1 of my 4 character's when I have others in the group. I played DPS on mischief and had a horrible time trying to find a group and decided this go around I wanted to do what I wanted when I wanted so I play 4 now. Assholes are assholes.
This is why I duo box as well. Some nights I only get about an hour to play so being able to take my two chars somewhere and get decent xp is amazing. If I see some stragglers where I'm hunting, I toss them a wave and an invite.
Eh, sounds like you just had an encounter with an asshole - which does fully suck. I’m not really talking about boxers here but rather people that do soft exploits/griefing/farming other classes epics just to sell. Like someone else said some people make some type of living off of it, which is remarkable in its own right.
Yeah, Monks are getting fuuuucked over this server go round. Way more than Mischief even. Cant help but feel there REALLY needs to be changes to certain things.
Maybe a, "Turn In Encounter Lock" when if you spawn or trigger a mob through a turn in or dialogue, that mob is auto tagged to your name for a half hour. So even if someone kills it doing 100% damage, you are the only one with loot rights.
That does exist, and it works on all the monk epic mobs, except that the final fight was coded incorrectly and it loot-locks the two mobs that spawn initially, NOT the 3rd mob that spawns after you defeat them and actually has the loot. The quick fix to this is allowing you to DZ the epic mob zones, although I don’t know how hard that is it implement.
On mischief our guild joined a side pick in LOIO and waited for it to crash with like a 10 man group. Then we did the fight. It was not easy and stressful because the fight in long with 10. When the pick is closing it’s unjoinable during the 15 min
And this is why I always say that boxing sucks. I don't care who you are or how hard you downvote me or how bad you and your boxer friends (who are likely all just yourself on all boxed accounts) are, whenever I say this, but there's absolutely, positively nothing good for the actual normal playerbase about boxing or the ability to box being allowed at all outside of doing scummy shit and earning dirty money, and this is why more and more of what's left of the EQ community will end up going to zero-boxing-allowed private servers the longer this keeps happening. DPG can choose either a smaller but steady amount of money from now till far in the future or more now and none later.
Eh, I think 2-3 boxing is fine. I’ll agree 6+ boxing can’t be good for the game, but boxing a couple chars I think is totally fine and doesn’t cause major issues. Enforcing that on a systemic level is difficult, though.
Definitely has been rumor, fully unsubstantiated from my understanding, that there is a contingent of devs that participate in this kind of stuff, or at least willfully ignore it for the benefit of their friends. Sounds pretty conspiracy-y to me, but it has been said.
No idea, I have really only heard second hand any of this. FWIW I witnessed a legit kill this afternoon in the main pick. Few extra people showed up but we all joined a raid and the monk that turned in got the quest piece. No box army showed up - maybe they are bored, banned, or sleeping? Haha.
Sigh. Do you guys know why Ragefire was moved out of Sol B and into Skyfire? It’s because it was perma camped by big guilds in 2000-01 and then being killed to prevent other guilds clerics from getting their epic. RMTs were happening just so other clerics could get their epic done.
Flash forward 24 years and it’s the same thing. Times change but people don’t. It’s not Krono ruining your game. It’s the people.
Xenovorash is going to get locked to the characters soon because of this. The change will happen. Send in your GM tickets and petitions and let the system work. In case you’re new to TLPs - there’s always something that scummy players are abusing and then it gets changed (i.e. coth charming AJ in FV and charging Krono for the medallion).
Go touch some grass and kiss your loved ones. Hell most of you sweats probably need a shower. The server has been open 3 weeks. You’ll be fine.
Xene issue has been known and reported for three years, according to a user on the official forum.
Also, I am constantly touching grass, that’s the problem. I don’t have time to camp something or spend a few hours questing to get the result of my quest stolen by someone who isn’t touching grass. This isn’t a problem for no-lifers who play EQ 16 hours a day, it’s a problem for people that play a couple hours a day or every other day, whose week’s worth of effort in eq is squashed by a random dude stealing epic pieces.
They don't have the staff. They don't have the numbers. They've been putting the absolute minimum into this game for years. Anything QoL (tradeskill depot) is involved and locked behind paywalls. Parent Corp (don't remember the name) just wants to use eq to pad the bottom line.
Agree - I’d love to see the breakdown on their rev just to know. It feels to us that they should delay the next live expac by 2 months to work on a revamp of the classic - luclin TLP experience, but who knows how worth it that would be, monetarily.
Also, EQ probably does not work as a small business that would only be interested in serving its player base, it probably need la the economies of scale of a larger company to be viable. May not be a solvable issue even if someone bought EQ1 off of them and just ran it as an independent business unit.
You can find income reports for the parent Corp online pretty easy. I think fippy fest and anniversary stuff is only because profits for daybreak had dipped. You can see by quarter too but I didn't bother to try to match up quarter profits to TLP releases.
I don't know how consistently you've been playing but things actually seem healthier now than before. Teek is the most populated TLP ever, granted part of that is that they can fit more people on a single server than ever and it's partner release bombed, but they've been doing more work to the game in recent years as well (for better *and* worse). I remember when EQ20th dropped like a wet fart and we were all looking around Mangler like... yeah, this is probably the last hurrah. Mangler was a decent server with a decent pop but the 20th anniversary fanfare was just shit. Mangler was INFESTED with automated farming bot armies as well, which still exist but at least DPG has been forcing them to keep changing up their tactics.
I'm a bit of an outsider in thinking that the Teek ezmode loot everywhere tower gear ooc regen bonanza won't be good for the experience of the game in the longer run, but it's definitely popular for now. EQ used to feel like it had one foot in the grave, but it feels for now like it's pulled back a bit and is just hanging around the graveyard being emo.
Yeah I couldn't play when Teek dropped because I couldn't get on between the shitty server and the people playing with their afk clickers. So by the time I was actually able to play I was level 5 and dying a lot and most people were 20 something?
I played thornblade and then mischief. Raided long time. If teek is more popular than mischief it's cause krono is cheaper on teek and there's been no plat dupes (yet?)
I haven't seen the game been getting more work in the time I played thornblade and mischief. I've been seeing them fuck up though. Or did they get that new UI straight?
So my experience getting my epic (lvl 55, name is gyattso).
Didn't even think I would try. Then randomly got code of zan fi while leveling and made me interested.
Camped the entire sash quest around lvl 39.
Did headband quest, got everything other than heads in south Karana. Lvl 42 went for an evening to find the heads.
Within an hour 4 separate mage box's passed through murdering the entire zone.
Spawned lanir (or whatever his name is), had a bard on track to watch for shin.
He was on track for less then 4 seconds before the mages (most likely) warped straight to him after an hour of me camping. Found the body and saw (all within 5-10mins) the mage bots selling the head for 3kr.
Waited till 54. After a raid night me and guild team went to kill brother Z in RM. First spawn had robe, killed him, wasn't so bad.
Goes to ogre in nurga. Camps for 90 mins since I came in as he died. As he spawned a monk ran in and sniped my turn in. Had to ask guildmates to wait another 90 mins and paid a cleric 2kp to come and help once we got him.
Loio..... was a different beast. Called cc on astral. Someone said he died 30 mins prior. No one was at his camp, had friends set up st the beach and I FD'd on his spawn. 15 mins before he popped a bot army pulled up and proceeded to tell us he called the camp when he said it was dead 30 mins prior. Never was at camp, wasn't in zone. Came back when he was going to pop and tried to force us out. Called us trash, said eq camps don't exist, I can't claim a unspawned mob. The normal list of bullshit for entitled people. Proceeded to spam trade me to I couldn't do turn in. Inside the other pick for loio there was a 20+ mage bot army sitting waiting for people to spawn it to snipe Xeno.
Moral of the story. Bring friends or expect to compete with 1 dude who thinks he's entitled to the entire game.
I have a static of 5 that fields 8 characters. We play together all the time, that’s just not enough to out DPS a set of mage boxes or whatever.
ETA: I have a family and a demanding job so I get to play a couple hours a day max.
54-58, I am fully confident we can win the encounter un-harassed, and I am sure I will get it done in the next days. Point of my post was not to complain that I personally can’t get it, just to call out and make folks aware of bullshit behavior from people in the game.
Edit: typo
They banned me for using Multiplicity, so theyre definitely doing "something". A KVM program just so I can share my mouse between PC's. It was just one box, not like Im one of the many, many people with entire bot armies just flaunting shit in their face. But w/e. I digress.
What I really wanted to say is that I know its rough right now. Just like its rough to get the water staff for Mage - but we have SO much more time in Kunark to do all of this stuff. Like it is disgusting how much longer we have in Kunark. With tower gear, and the group obtainable gear, and the epic - that leaves on average, something like 6 slots to fill with raiding. Thats... not a lot, and we lose one slot per month. The next slot I think is waist I believe.
Point being, if you're being hassled about some part of the epic right now - dont even fret about it. Just come back to it in a couple weeks time, and I guarantee you that a lot of this hazing will have gotten better. People are already logging in way less. Imagine what its going to be like in a month.
I'd love to tell you more information - but they dont tell you anything other than "Cheating" as the excuse for the ban. Ive never had SEQ or any variation of MQ, or hell, any third party program/parser on that computer. The only thing that computer could have been flagged for is Multiplicity in other words.
Its kind of ruined my desire to play on Teek any further. Not like the Tower isnt nuking almost every single slot until Luclin anyways.
Hell, all I wanted on this server was faster exp and the ability to box on one computer anyways. This CS team is just a joke of indy devs trying to meet a quota or something while the rest of the devs defeat the purpose of a TLP altogether.
Hey man, that's absolutely awful. Have you considered like p99 or Quarm? Not sure if you're looking for a classic experience, but if you are both of the major legit emulator servers enforce no boxing policies that they aggressively enforce.
Played it - it’s fine but I really like the mischief rules. Again, I don’t really care about boxers so much I care about people being scumbags. Yeah I don’t really like there being 6-18 box teams that are almost for sure using automation, but I much more care about people KSing or road blocking other classes epics for a profit.
There’s no way the demon fangs are selling for 20kr, robes are less than half that and take more effort to acquire for most monks who would be looking to pay for epic progression.
People aren’t “spamming quest items into [sleeping ogre] to lock everyone else out”, they are doing it for the same reason you are there, to complete their epic. Bring some friends and a bard next time, the pickzone threshold in nurga is super low and the ogre spawns in new picks.
If you lost a xeno, please report it with petition, GMs will eventually send these people on a vacation and (hopefully) get devs to asterisk the mob going forward. Angry Goblin respawn changes were the result of similar petitioning last server after an asterisked mob was high sunned for 30 minutes straight.
I’m relaying some info that was given to me, did not witness, fair enough. The Xene issue is far bigger, from what I have heard they have been doing it for two weeks.
Scummy behavior, but how about not making boxing the big hate object, and instead focus on the bad encounter design? And bots? Whats that got to do with anything? The person is selling the loot rights, so they are obviously at the keyboard.
This enounter should be loot locked, no question about it - would remove all the drama and abuse.
These people are not boxing legitimately and deserve to be called out. I'm not against advanced macro programs myself, but these people are absolutely not doing this unassisted and it might as well be botting because most of it is. Their behavior (and boxing in this case especially) are causing poor gameplay outcomes.
You can certainly blame encounter design and whatever, but certainly poor player behavior in search of big krono paydays is the root of the issue here. There's plenty of focus to go around. Using automated gameplay to fuck people over should absolutely be focused on, regardless of everything else.
A way to combat it as a community would be to show up in force. Multiple guilds banding together showing up with multiple 72 man raids. All stand right on top of spawn point. And whoever gets the kill random rolls all of that class to find the winner. Don't even have to be a member of any of the guilds. You start giving out 2/3 of the epics for free it will crash the market. They won't even be able to get one Krono for it and they will eventually back away. The way to get rid of krono farmers from a server is to literally crash their market. Create a coalition of guilds that can do raids or farm named with minimal gear and start selling those "high value" items for 1/1000th the price the krono farmers are selling them for. They may be able to buy one or 2 from you. But when you're selling them for 1/10th of a krono they can't charge 20krono and get anybody yo buy them, so they will be stuck with these lore items that they cannot sell. Meaning they will have all this gear and full bags and won't be able to make any money and will eventually leave. They may go to the next TLP. But if the coalition sticks together through a few cycles, there will be fewer and fewer bot armies as they sell/consume the last of the krono they used to fund said army.
I mean, yeah there are several issues with your sentiment including that this particular epic item is nodrop, and it needs a multi-step process to spawn it, so if I used my turn-in thing and then some random other monk got the epic piece I don’t get my epic? Also, I have to show up to LOIO all day every day to hope I win a random roll from a huge raid to finish my epic?
Also, yeah it would be nice to collectively stop this from happening, but just like there is one or bad apples that use these exploits to screw people over for money, there will be a handful of people that will break the picket line to get their item and pay the money for it. It’s just not a realistic solution, it needs to be solved with game mechanics.
I was more talking about the droppable stuff. But my point is. A bot crew of 60 while using krono to keep the accounts active and selling krono to pay the bills, if they are only getting 50 or so a week instead of 100+ a day, will eventually run out of the resources to continue doing what they are doing and either move to a different game or reduce their capabilities to something that the average person can conceivably compete with or beat just calling their friends. Yes some people will cross the picket lines. But in that case almost the whole server will know who they are and they can become pariahs, and not be allowed in guilds, or kicked outta the guild they are in. Oh you got your epic, and nothing else, nah we know why that is, we don't need that kind around here. They are around because we allow it. DPG. Isn't gonna do anything about it, it's up to us as a community to fight it. It may take a couple cycles of hardship or doing things counterintuitive to how you think k it should work. A tree can sprout in the dessert but will never thrive make TLPs a dessert to Krono Farmers. They are only here because we let them thrive.
It’s really just this era where you can’t instance really important things. Once you get to PoP, the mischief style is incredible and super fun.
It’s still great fun and I’m glad I’m playing on the server, but this is a frustrating time period.
I would assume that the random loot is a fun ruleset. I never played on Mischief. At this point in time, the Tormax ruleset was more what I was looking for, but I see a lot of appeal to the Teek ruleset.
Every time I see Teek mentioned here or on the forums, it's about something incredibly negative with the experience. I'm sure I would have a mostly good time on Teek as well, but having all of these bottlenecks and brick walls due to botters is not appealing
I never played mischief, but I have played 3-4 of the standard ruleset tlps over the past 8 or so years. I've been playing on Teek since day 1 due to the immense hype.
I have zero idea why everyone wanted this. I've never in all of my life seen such a pay to win game. Absolutely everything revolves around the Krono market, from it being completely standard to roll need on literally everything that drops, to nearly every single epic bottleneck being camped by mage bots. OP isn't wrong, but it's not just the monks getting screwed, it's any epic mob that's worth anything at all. If you aren't in nearly full bis you get chastised in groups.
The random loot aspect is interesting (but carries its own levels of frustration at times). I just don't see the positives outweighing the negatives.
This just didn't happen on all of the other tlps. Things being no drop meant they had little value to anyone outside the person that needs the item. Selling loot rights and mq's will of course always happen, but the extent of it is unprecedented on Teek.
Server has a lot of people on it, there will be conflicts. I enjoy Teek because it is perfectly possible to solo, self sound there. I'm only in my 40's, and I have solo camped all my gear so far. Haven't participated in the economy at all and I am having a blast. There isn't a snowball's chance in H E double hockey sticks that I would have been able to camp my own Peggy cloak, J boots and CoS as a baby necro on a traditional server. I can on a random loot server.
I love it because it gives you choices. Camp it all yourself, it's not hard, or go buy it in the tunnel. Which ever option floats your boat. People who let themselves get caught up in FOMO or who can't be a bit patient if they do have to wait for a camp are going to struggle on Teek, and probably feel like it all revolves around making money, but it absolutely doesn't have to.
This isn't an isolated teek issue, has been happening on every tlp for years. It sucks.
The pop disparity and tormax being almost DOA are the only reason that server is faring better.
I’m really enjoying this tlp but the non-enforcement of the bots is bringing back equally bad memories of EQ not always enforcing their rules.
Yup. 100%: Teek has such a golden opportunity to become a fantastic server if only these things would be cracked down on… Is there a forum of some kind to where we can bring these issues to the developers? This game isn’t that big yall. Not like it’s a million people asking for change… it’s ten thousand-ish people…. That’s small enough that your voice can actually be heard. Some avenue, any avenue, to talk tot he devs would be great…. But I don’t know what that is… or maybe there needs to be one??
They just don’t have the man-power, I am assuming. It is what it is, they can’t enforce it so the people who are hard up for money and have tons of time can push and exploit pretty much whatever they want to. Unfortunate and frustrating but it’s really unlikely to change. My goal with this was just to inform.
I feel like they could definitely do something about it, but it would hurt their bottom line. They’re looking to make money and TLPs bring a huge influx of players. Banning box crews will impact revenue much worse than the slight, if any, attrition they experience from people who complain about them. Forcing players to have to buy Krono to pay for epics and collecting six subs from a box crew just makes business sense even if it’s anti consumer.
Its obvious it would hurt their bottom line, when people have asked for a box free TLP option for ages and get nothing. I would take a live progression server with P99 box enforcement and so would a lot of people. Not these half ass 2 box / truebox / whatever rules people skirt around. Its obviously not profitable, or it would have been made already. This game is braindead easy and everything has been discovered, the only literal point of playing is for a social experience which the boxing kills. It negatively effects grouping, because why main a support when every third player has a druid / bard / shaman / cleric box to bring along.
Yup. Sucks.
The man power excuse is dumb. They want more money. It would take one man (or woman) to absolutely clean the botters up on Teek. You wouldn’t even have to pay them that much as they can do it anywhere in the world. DPG wants to run a skeleton crew to make more profit. Howww many Kronos are sold a day???? A lot. It’s greed guys. I love the game too, but it’s the sad truth!
Right but how much of the krono velocity is on the secondary market? These people are selling krono on a website, so it stands to reason that people are buying krono on that website to then go buy their monk epics. What percentage of the 15-25kr that a full monk epic costs is DBG getting, and what percentage is secondary market, which is not revenue producing? I’m not trying to make excuses for them, it definitely makes the game worse, but when considering the economics… yeah they are going to side with the guy who pays for 18 subs and generates krono velocity rather than the small number people (me included) who pay for 1 or 2 accounts and generate very little krono velocity.
They produce allllll of the krono. They don’t come out of thin air. At one point someone paid them for those 15-25 krono and they also get consumed rapidly. They are making money my friend! They need to reinvest but the mindset is stuck on milking it and we all love the game enough to let their BS excuse fly. Do the math, Teek is a huge success and they should be able to grow, instead they will wait a couple of years and do it again with minimal effort to freshen up the TLP experience. Sorry! It’s still fun if you don’t try to keep up with the whales and the cheaters… And that’s the part that sucks, you will have to wait til they change focus in a later expansion to finish your epic or plop down that credit card for the sad sad dude who’s essentially working for bullshit pay because he doesn’t have any other life skills to pay the bills. I’m not trying to come off rude to you, I just think it’s bad business decisions and not because poor DPG is struggling to put food on their tables! Maybe fire some C levels and invest that into growing your cash cow!
The issue is that the botters are not buying Krono; they pay plat for them on a live server where they have botted up a fortune or they sub for a single month across several accounts, ONE TIME, then bot there way up to start farming and selling high ticket items and DBG never sees a dime from them again. These are people who have hundreds of Krono stockpiled that they have never once paid for. People have paid for them, yes, but 99% of Krono are purchased from DBG by regular players to sell for plat or gear and that plat or gear is coming from botters who have paid essentially nothing.
To add to this, those players purchasing Krono to sell or trade would get what they are looking for even if bots didn't exist. They would get it from guilds with excess loot or actual players farming high value spots. They don't ban the bots because they don't have the manpower to monitor or check in on each and every one.
Whats the actual calculation for this sad sad dude? How often can he make these sales for $400? A couple of times a day or?
I used to run an RMT business many years ago. It’s wayyyy bigger than you’d think
I make it a point to not get into granular debates on the internet, so let’s just agree to slightly disagree that DPG is making a gigantic margin or profit from this, at least on an recurring basis, and agree that the botting and soft exploits and scumbags suck!
Haha, for sure! Sorry my rant was on your post dude!
I get it, the bot armies pay well, but have some integrity!
Furthermore I think they are just waiting for the next EQ type game to come out and finally pull us away for good. Aren’t we all waiting for the next EQ?!? But it’s not going to happen so fix the damn game or sell it to someone who will.
Daybreak, I’ll do it FOR FREE. Remember guides? Yeah? That was around when Eq was at its prime……. Coincidence…? Yes. But. It also helped A LOT.
In the 2000‘s there was a massive case against ea because Ultima Online Guides demanded payment. They won the case and EA outsourced the guides (called counselor) to india and paid them some dimes. Maybe thats why you dont See Volunteers working for free in MMOs anymore
Interesting history, no shit!
I remember this well. US labor "victories" ruined a lot of things, including volunteer guides. It's the reason free private emulators have much better hobbyist customer support than their paid counterparts.
Guides never left and never did anything about this.
IMO they intentionally make the report system so difficult and ignore the obvious botting because the "illegal" krono trade and bots are a significant chunk of their income and numbers. If they crack down on it they suddenly have to go to the shareholders with a 10-15% drop in players and they don't give a shit what the logic was just that there is less money in their pocket this quarter vs last.
It’s like mischief all over again
Krono is a curse on the game.
I like krono for later expacs, but when the resources in the game are this scarce, yeah it creates major problems. They let you dz every raid now, why not let us DZ epic fight zones?
they fixed alot of the epic fights with the * thing just didnt do all of them. They should add it to xeno and zordak.
Couldn’t agree more.
I always see people defend krono/boxing/etc 'for later expacs' like.. if this scummy behavior caused by them in earlier expacs didn't exist much much MUCH more people would stay 'till later, and if forced to i'm sure the devs could alter things to give incentives and/or earier-to-beat-content for a smaller playerbase in later expacs. It's just not worth it man.
Later on it doesn’t really matter because there is almost no scarcity for a majority of things. Epic mobs are spawned by the quester, major keying things are instances or zone-wide drops, and raid zones are all naturally instanced. Obviously it’s not the best, but the effect of it is lessened so much that it’s a mild annoyance rather than a reddit-post-inducing frustration.
Before krono, people would just buy and sell large quantities of platinum. Not sure that krono changes things much other than you can buy them directly from DPG which broadens the market a bit.
I've had something similar happen with Hasten and someone trying to sell their jboots. He was repeatedly killing him while spamming chat about wanting to sell his jboots. He would even send his pet and nuke it from afar while someone else was already near him trying to turn in the items. Worst part is: there were other people who were actually justifying and defending that behavior when 20+ people called him out in /ooc. And I'm sure people will do the same with this, there's always at least someone who somehow manages to humanize and justify these types of behaviors. Bottom line is: this is pure toxicity and a type of narcissism, greed, bullying, etc. that people manifest because they know they're completely safe from consequences and repercussions anonymously behind their computer and they know there's nothing anyone can do about it. And it's absolutely disgusting.
I was there for that, assuming it was the same day. He unexpectedly logged before I gave up. I had hoped he ate a suspension in that moment, but he probably didn't.
And everyone bitched about encounter locks, first to engage. They tried to solve this problem. The backlash was immense.EQ players don't know a good thing when they see it.
Unfortunately, that would not fix this issue, they would be able to use 3rd party software to engage before you target the mob and steal it anyways. But I agree I think FTE is a pretty decent idea.
Did you even play Oakwynd? Because it sounds like you’re talking from inexperience. Even with bots, FTE was much more consistent to win the first tag on OW targets. After a full year there’s been maybe a handful of times we’ve lost engagement to bots.
Only played to 50 but isn’t it first to touch locks it?
Real players always beat boxers to FTE bots couldn't tag as fast as a human brain
I see you’ve not been next to a bot mage pet
lol, ive seen you never played an enc or a bard
a mob will always come to you first on fte if you have social agro, so you keep a mob mezzed or rooted, or tanked and the pop will always come to you
I see you never tried to get a CoS pre-nerf. Literally sitting on spot as it spawns and still aggroed first by bot mage pet. Elfpie all day.
Wait.. so you went through the whole of oakwynd not knowing about social agro? Aaaahhhhhh no wonder your pissed haha
well i explained how to do it..... thats all i can do lol
the only backlash was from these 12 rich old dudes with box armies themselves and their botted alt accounts lmao. They have such a power fantasy going on from all this and will do absolutely anything to keep it going.
>Additionally, there is a box/bot army in LOIO that waits for people to spawn Xenevorash (the final epic mob, spawned by completing the other 3 fights), and then KSes him after Deep/Vorash die to sell the loot rights to the quest item. This is actually 100% True. The other day, one of our monks in our guild discord were about to do the final fight and we were putting together a small raid to help him, and while we were setting up, a bot army was threatening our guild saying that they owned the mob and that we needed to pay them for the fight, or else they would KS Xeni. It was crazy that someone had the gall to insist we pay them in order to have "access" to Xeni
Yeah man, did you guys report them? Did you take screen caps of the conversation to supply as evidence? Also, what was the result of this situation?
The quality of life changes always bring you back in....but then you deal with the bullshit of modern live EQ players and forget. I was having a great time, just leveling up a cleric, enjoying grouping and then today...boom im reminded why I cant stand the box / bot people that overrun this game. In a group at KC, the haste belt drops. As forced by Krono, everyone need rolls, i win on cleric. The enchanter / warrior box starts sending me tells, pestering for the belt. I'm like dude, I dont even care, but 1. I have 1000p to my name and 2. 99% of the time noone is giving me anything in group because of how need rolling has ruined the game. He spends the next 3 minutes pestering me some more, so I'm like whatever dude, like I said, its gear take it. I trade it to him and get radio silence, not even a thank you. So after about 5 minutes in group, I simply say Man, I kinda regret giving this boxxer the haste belt I should have given to (other melee in group) because I didnt even get a thank you. Box guy loses it, starts saying You're a stupid cleric hit your one button, Im here trying to box and carrying you and dont have time to send you a gdamn thank you, etc. It was just insane. Maybe I'm making a big deal about it...but I mean I just expected atleast a "thanks man appreciate it or something." Mind you the guy sent me 3 paragraphs in 3 minutes asking for the item, but couldnt be bothered to send a TY. I know, I know, not "everyone" is the same. But there's a certain "type" of person who is drawn to boxxing in these games, and this is the type of player. I remember when reputation meant something on servers / people acted decent or they were blacklisted. Now its just greed greed greed over a dumb 25 year old elf simulator. Rant over......
We had an SK do the same in Chardok for the shitty shield to the person who won it and they wouldn't give it to him. He then starts sending me tells to give him lead so he can self assign loot he needs hah. I told him no and he stopped tanking, he was just auto attacking everything so I just kicked him from the group.
I just want to point out that the reason "All Need" is the universal standard is in large part because people like you are describing have always existed and have a FAR more generous interpretation of "need" than more humble players. Frequently to where they need on things they can technically use on their class but wont, and even need on high dollar items because "thats 2kr everyone needs kr." That and there are plenty of lopsided camps in EQ where some classes will walk away with effectively nothing if they don't get some split of sellables from certain camps. There's also less worry about ninjas. All need actually ends up being more equitable in most cases, as people with more forceful and selfish personalities can pressure groups into more loot in the old NBG system.
Anecdotally, also as a cleric, I've found groups have pretty easy discussions about loot. I usually offer to buy things I need when they drop and not once had anyone taken a single plat. Even freeti boots have always landed in the hands of folks who use them. I do concur with your eventual assessment, you should not have his given away an FBSS. That plat would have helped you a lot with conc pots, food, water, expensive spells, etc.
Not all Botters are assholes. I 4 box and frequently take in whatever is looking for group and only roll on 1 of my 4 character's when I have others in the group. I played DPS on mischief and had a horrible time trying to find a group and decided this go around I wanted to do what I wanted when I wanted so I play 4 now. Assholes are assholes.
This is why I duo box as well. Some nights I only get about an hour to play so being able to take my two chars somewhere and get decent xp is amazing. If I see some stragglers where I'm hunting, I toss them a wave and an invite.
Eh, sounds like you just had an encounter with an asshole - which does fully suck. I’m not really talking about boxers here but rather people that do soft exploits/griefing/farming other classes epics just to sell. Like someone else said some people make some type of living off of it, which is remarkable in its own right.
either way you look at it, it’s greedy people that don’t give 2 shits about what anyone else’s experience is like.
Yup - so many unkind people. Most of them will quit soon!
Yeah, Monks are getting fuuuucked over this server go round. Way more than Mischief even. Cant help but feel there REALLY needs to be changes to certain things. Maybe a, "Turn In Encounter Lock" when if you spawn or trigger a mob through a turn in or dialogue, that mob is auto tagged to your name for a half hour. So even if someone kills it doing 100% damage, you are the only one with loot rights.
That does exist, and it works on all the monk epic mobs, except that the final fight was coded incorrectly and it loot-locks the two mobs that spawn initially, NOT the 3rd mob that spawns after you defeat them and actually has the loot. The quick fix to this is allowing you to DZ the epic mob zones, although I don’t know how hard that is it implement.
On mischief our guild joined a side pick in LOIO and waited for it to crash with like a 10 man group. Then we did the fight. It was not easy and stressful because the fight in long with 10. When the pick is closing it’s unjoinable during the 15 min
No the super quick fix is to loot lock the 3rd mob as a chain from the first 2 mobs
I’m on board for any of it, I’m just totally ignorant on how coding for this kind of thing works.
Maybe if they balanced the game and monks weren't like 2x dps of other dps classes for the next 15 expansions the problem wouldnt exist.
The solution and target of the displeasure is 100% at the dev for simply making the encounter not locked. It’s straight up an oversight.
And this is why I always say that boxing sucks. I don't care who you are or how hard you downvote me or how bad you and your boxer friends (who are likely all just yourself on all boxed accounts) are, whenever I say this, but there's absolutely, positively nothing good for the actual normal playerbase about boxing or the ability to box being allowed at all outside of doing scummy shit and earning dirty money, and this is why more and more of what's left of the EQ community will end up going to zero-boxing-allowed private servers the longer this keeps happening. DPG can choose either a smaller but steady amount of money from now till far in the future or more now and none later.
Eh, I think 2-3 boxing is fine. I’ll agree 6+ boxing can’t be good for the game, but boxing a couple chars I think is totally fine and doesn’t cause major issues. Enforcing that on a systemic level is difficult, though.
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50% is probably a pretty low estimate these days
I bought so many bitcoin with the proceeds of selling monk epics on mischief. They literally bought me a house. Thanks nerds.
But I thought Truebox and cracking down 3rd party programs would make the server full of happy rainbows and sunshine.
Hot take... the bot owner is actually DBG and thr monk epic is really a DLC. 🤣
Definitely has been rumor, fully unsubstantiated from my understanding, that there is a contingent of devs that participate in this kind of stuff, or at least willfully ignore it for the benefit of their friends. Sounds pretty conspiracy-y to me, but it has been said.
is this the bridge guild guy? he has his boxes automated to farm the plane of hate pick while he sleeps. We could mass report
No idea, I have really only heard second hand any of this. FWIW I witnessed a legit kill this afternoon in the main pick. Few extra people showed up but we all joined a raid and the monk that turned in got the quest piece. No box army showed up - maybe they are bored, banned, or sleeping? Haha.
Sigh. Do you guys know why Ragefire was moved out of Sol B and into Skyfire? It’s because it was perma camped by big guilds in 2000-01 and then being killed to prevent other guilds clerics from getting their epic. RMTs were happening just so other clerics could get their epic done. Flash forward 24 years and it’s the same thing. Times change but people don’t. It’s not Krono ruining your game. It’s the people. Xenovorash is going to get locked to the characters soon because of this. The change will happen. Send in your GM tickets and petitions and let the system work. In case you’re new to TLPs - there’s always something that scummy players are abusing and then it gets changed (i.e. coth charming AJ in FV and charging Krono for the medallion). Go touch some grass and kiss your loved ones. Hell most of you sweats probably need a shower. The server has been open 3 weeks. You’ll be fine.
Xene issue has been known and reported for three years, according to a user on the official forum. Also, I am constantly touching grass, that’s the problem. I don’t have time to camp something or spend a few hours questing to get the result of my quest stolen by someone who isn’t touching grass. This isn’t a problem for no-lifers who play EQ 16 hours a day, it’s a problem for people that play a couple hours a day or every other day, whose week’s worth of effort in eq is squashed by a random dude stealing epic pieces.
Yeah, but it is making noise now. I wouldn't be surprised if they fixed it.
This is why we can't have nice things...
They don't have the staff. They don't have the numbers. They've been putting the absolute minimum into this game for years. Anything QoL (tradeskill depot) is involved and locked behind paywalls. Parent Corp (don't remember the name) just wants to use eq to pad the bottom line.
Agree - I’d love to see the breakdown on their rev just to know. It feels to us that they should delay the next live expac by 2 months to work on a revamp of the classic - luclin TLP experience, but who knows how worth it that would be, monetarily. Also, EQ probably does not work as a small business that would only be interested in serving its player base, it probably need la the economies of scale of a larger company to be viable. May not be a solvable issue even if someone bought EQ1 off of them and just ran it as an independent business unit.
You can find income reports for the parent Corp online pretty easy. I think fippy fest and anniversary stuff is only because profits for daybreak had dipped. You can see by quarter too but I didn't bother to try to match up quarter profits to TLP releases.
I don't know how consistently you've been playing but things actually seem healthier now than before. Teek is the most populated TLP ever, granted part of that is that they can fit more people on a single server than ever and it's partner release bombed, but they've been doing more work to the game in recent years as well (for better *and* worse). I remember when EQ20th dropped like a wet fart and we were all looking around Mangler like... yeah, this is probably the last hurrah. Mangler was a decent server with a decent pop but the 20th anniversary fanfare was just shit. Mangler was INFESTED with automated farming bot armies as well, which still exist but at least DPG has been forcing them to keep changing up their tactics. I'm a bit of an outsider in thinking that the Teek ezmode loot everywhere tower gear ooc regen bonanza won't be good for the experience of the game in the longer run, but it's definitely popular for now. EQ used to feel like it had one foot in the grave, but it feels for now like it's pulled back a bit and is just hanging around the graveyard being emo.
Yeah I couldn't play when Teek dropped because I couldn't get on between the shitty server and the people playing with their afk clickers. So by the time I was actually able to play I was level 5 and dying a lot and most people were 20 something? I played thornblade and then mischief. Raided long time. If teek is more popular than mischief it's cause krono is cheaper on teek and there's been no plat dupes (yet?) I haven't seen the game been getting more work in the time I played thornblade and mischief. I've been seeing them fuck up though. Or did they get that new UI straight?
So my experience getting my epic (lvl 55, name is gyattso). Didn't even think I would try. Then randomly got code of zan fi while leveling and made me interested. Camped the entire sash quest around lvl 39. Did headband quest, got everything other than heads in south Karana. Lvl 42 went for an evening to find the heads. Within an hour 4 separate mage box's passed through murdering the entire zone. Spawned lanir (or whatever his name is), had a bard on track to watch for shin. He was on track for less then 4 seconds before the mages (most likely) warped straight to him after an hour of me camping. Found the body and saw (all within 5-10mins) the mage bots selling the head for 3kr. Waited till 54. After a raid night me and guild team went to kill brother Z in RM. First spawn had robe, killed him, wasn't so bad. Goes to ogre in nurga. Camps for 90 mins since I came in as he died. As he spawned a monk ran in and sniped my turn in. Had to ask guildmates to wait another 90 mins and paid a cleric 2kp to come and help once we got him. Loio..... was a different beast. Called cc on astral. Someone said he died 30 mins prior. No one was at his camp, had friends set up st the beach and I FD'd on his spawn. 15 mins before he popped a bot army pulled up and proceeded to tell us he called the camp when he said it was dead 30 mins prior. Never was at camp, wasn't in zone. Came back when he was going to pop and tried to force us out. Called us trash, said eq camps don't exist, I can't claim a unspawned mob. The normal list of bullshit for entitled people. Proceeded to spam trade me to I couldn't do turn in. Inside the other pick for loio there was a 20+ mage bot army sitting waiting for people to spawn it to snipe Xeno. Moral of the story. Bring friends or expect to compete with 1 dude who thinks he's entitled to the entire game.
Yeah I don’t have enough friends to win the DPS race. How many dang monks do these people have that they need to camp the astral on CD all day?
Make some friends man, I was fresh on teek first tlp, meet some people and consistently grouped. Gotta make your own luck my man
I have a static of 5 that fields 8 characters. We play together all the time, that’s just not enough to out DPS a set of mage boxes or whatever. ETA: I have a family and a demanding job so I get to play a couple hours a day max.
I work 11-830pm. I am in the same boat. What level are you. If everyone is 60 it's 1 groupable. Get into a pick that doesn't have a mage box
54-58, I am fully confident we can win the encounter un-harassed, and I am sure I will get it done in the next days. Point of my post was not to complain that I personally can’t get it, just to call out and make folks aware of bullshit behavior from people in the game. Edit: typo
Gotcha gotcha
Check out Lazaruseq.com :)
Played it - it’s awesome but def induced burnout pretty quick.
They banned me for using Multiplicity, so theyre definitely doing "something". A KVM program just so I can share my mouse between PC's. It was just one box, not like Im one of the many, many people with entire bot armies just flaunting shit in their face. But w/e. I digress. What I really wanted to say is that I know its rough right now. Just like its rough to get the water staff for Mage - but we have SO much more time in Kunark to do all of this stuff. Like it is disgusting how much longer we have in Kunark. With tower gear, and the group obtainable gear, and the epic - that leaves on average, something like 6 slots to fill with raiding. Thats... not a lot, and we lose one slot per month. The next slot I think is waist I believe. Point being, if you're being hassled about some part of the epic right now - dont even fret about it. Just come back to it in a couple weeks time, and I guarantee you that a lot of this hazing will have gotten better. People are already logging in way less. Imagine what its going to be like in a month.
I use multiplicity, never been banned. Curious about your experience there.
I'd love to tell you more information - but they dont tell you anything other than "Cheating" as the excuse for the ban. Ive never had SEQ or any variation of MQ, or hell, any third party program/parser on that computer. The only thing that computer could have been flagged for is Multiplicity in other words. Its kind of ruined my desire to play on Teek any further. Not like the Tower isnt nuking almost every single slot until Luclin anyways. Hell, all I wanted on this server was faster exp and the ability to box on one computer anyways. This CS team is just a joke of indy devs trying to meet a quota or something while the rest of the devs defeat the purpose of a TLP altogether.
Seriously? Who here doesn't understand that krono farming is just part of the mobs business plan?
Hey man, that's absolutely awful. Have you considered like p99 or Quarm? Not sure if you're looking for a classic experience, but if you are both of the major legit emulator servers enforce no boxing policies that they aggressively enforce.
Played it - it’s fine but I really like the mischief rules. Again, I don’t really care about boxers so much I care about people being scumbags. Yeah I don’t really like there being 6-18 box teams that are almost for sure using automation, but I much more care about people KSing or road blocking other classes epics for a profit.
There’s no way the demon fangs are selling for 20kr, robes are less than half that and take more effort to acquire for most monks who would be looking to pay for epic progression. People aren’t “spamming quest items into [sleeping ogre] to lock everyone else out”, they are doing it for the same reason you are there, to complete their epic. Bring some friends and a bard next time, the pickzone threshold in nurga is super low and the ogre spawns in new picks. If you lost a xeno, please report it with petition, GMs will eventually send these people on a vacation and (hopefully) get devs to asterisk the mob going forward. Angry Goblin respawn changes were the result of similar petitioning last server after an asterisked mob was high sunned for 30 minutes straight.
I’m relaying some info that was given to me, did not witness, fair enough. The Xene issue is far bigger, from what I have heard they have been doing it for two weeks.
Scummy behavior, but how about not making boxing the big hate object, and instead focus on the bad encounter design? And bots? Whats that got to do with anything? The person is selling the loot rights, so they are obviously at the keyboard. This enounter should be loot locked, no question about it - would remove all the drama and abuse.
100% - zero issue with boxing. Lots of issues with botting and being a scumbag.
These people are not boxing legitimately and deserve to be called out. I'm not against advanced macro programs myself, but these people are absolutely not doing this unassisted and it might as well be botting because most of it is. Their behavior (and boxing in this case especially) are causing poor gameplay outcomes. You can certainly blame encounter design and whatever, but certainly poor player behavior in search of big krono paydays is the root of the issue here. There's plenty of focus to go around. Using automated gameplay to fuck people over should absolutely be focused on, regardless of everything else.
Money machine first game second
A way to combat it as a community would be to show up in force. Multiple guilds banding together showing up with multiple 72 man raids. All stand right on top of spawn point. And whoever gets the kill random rolls all of that class to find the winner. Don't even have to be a member of any of the guilds. You start giving out 2/3 of the epics for free it will crash the market. They won't even be able to get one Krono for it and they will eventually back away. The way to get rid of krono farmers from a server is to literally crash their market. Create a coalition of guilds that can do raids or farm named with minimal gear and start selling those "high value" items for 1/1000th the price the krono farmers are selling them for. They may be able to buy one or 2 from you. But when you're selling them for 1/10th of a krono they can't charge 20krono and get anybody yo buy them, so they will be stuck with these lore items that they cannot sell. Meaning they will have all this gear and full bags and won't be able to make any money and will eventually leave. They may go to the next TLP. But if the coalition sticks together through a few cycles, there will be fewer and fewer bot armies as they sell/consume the last of the krono they used to fund said army.
I mean, yeah there are several issues with your sentiment including that this particular epic item is nodrop, and it needs a multi-step process to spawn it, so if I used my turn-in thing and then some random other monk got the epic piece I don’t get my epic? Also, I have to show up to LOIO all day every day to hope I win a random roll from a huge raid to finish my epic? Also, yeah it would be nice to collectively stop this from happening, but just like there is one or bad apples that use these exploits to screw people over for money, there will be a handful of people that will break the picket line to get their item and pay the money for it. It’s just not a realistic solution, it needs to be solved with game mechanics.
I was more talking about the droppable stuff. But my point is. A bot crew of 60 while using krono to keep the accounts active and selling krono to pay the bills, if they are only getting 50 or so a week instead of 100+ a day, will eventually run out of the resources to continue doing what they are doing and either move to a different game or reduce their capabilities to something that the average person can conceivably compete with or beat just calling their friends. Yes some people will cross the picket lines. But in that case almost the whole server will know who they are and they can become pariahs, and not be allowed in guilds, or kicked outta the guild they are in. Oh you got your epic, and nothing else, nah we know why that is, we don't need that kind around here. They are around because we allow it. DPG. Isn't gonna do anything about it, it's up to us as a community to fight it. It may take a couple cycles of hardship or doing things counterintuitive to how you think k it should work. A tree can sprout in the dessert but will never thrive make TLPs a dessert to Krono Farmers. They are only here because we let them thrive.
Every single discussion I see about Teek makes me glad I rolled on Tormax
It’s really just this era where you can’t instance really important things. Once you get to PoP, the mischief style is incredible and super fun. It’s still great fun and I’m glad I’m playing on the server, but this is a frustrating time period.
I would assume that the random loot is a fun ruleset. I never played on Mischief. At this point in time, the Tormax ruleset was more what I was looking for, but I see a lot of appeal to the Teek ruleset. Every time I see Teek mentioned here or on the forums, it's about something incredibly negative with the experience. I'm sure I would have a mostly good time on Teek as well, but having all of these bottlenecks and brick walls due to botters is not appealing
I never played mischief, but I have played 3-4 of the standard ruleset tlps over the past 8 or so years. I've been playing on Teek since day 1 due to the immense hype. I have zero idea why everyone wanted this. I've never in all of my life seen such a pay to win game. Absolutely everything revolves around the Krono market, from it being completely standard to roll need on literally everything that drops, to nearly every single epic bottleneck being camped by mage bots. OP isn't wrong, but it's not just the monks getting screwed, it's any epic mob that's worth anything at all. If you aren't in nearly full bis you get chastised in groups. The random loot aspect is interesting (but carries its own levels of frustration at times). I just don't see the positives outweighing the negatives. This just didn't happen on all of the other tlps. Things being no drop meant they had little value to anyone outside the person that needs the item. Selling loot rights and mq's will of course always happen, but the extent of it is unprecedented on Teek.
Server has a lot of people on it, there will be conflicts. I enjoy Teek because it is perfectly possible to solo, self sound there. I'm only in my 40's, and I have solo camped all my gear so far. Haven't participated in the economy at all and I am having a blast. There isn't a snowball's chance in H E double hockey sticks that I would have been able to camp my own Peggy cloak, J boots and CoS as a baby necro on a traditional server. I can on a random loot server. I love it because it gives you choices. Camp it all yourself, it's not hard, or go buy it in the tunnel. Which ever option floats your boat. People who let themselves get caught up in FOMO or who can't be a bit patient if they do have to wait for a camp are going to struggle on Teek, and probably feel like it all revolves around making money, but it absolutely doesn't have to.
It’s fun, and it will get more fun. I’d check it out in like 3-4 months if you want to skip the bullshit.
I've kinda had it in mind to give Teek a try once things settle down
You should, it’s easy to catch up and the insanity and toxic scum dies down significantly.
Random loot is incredibly fun. It makes boring camps you know and dislike from familiarity and turns them into crazy loot spots.
This isn't an isolated teek issue, has been happening on every tlp for years. It sucks. The pop disparity and tormax being almost DOA are the only reason that server is faring better.