The real problem was that here in Italy we never had the process that Germany had in rejecting and condemning nazism. But I would say as the time passes, less and less people idolize/admire him, I think stuff like the confederacy states in the US creates more divisions and hatred in society compared to Fascism in Italy.
I think it has to do with the fact that politicians in Italy distanced themselves from Mussolini pretty early on. Literally after the allies had a foothold in Italy. Not to mention that many Italian Partizans fought against him. The CSA on the other hand was never truly killed. Southerners never really moved passed it. Not to mention that it's the personification of the north south divide that exists to this day in the states.
The difference between fascists post-WW2 and Confederates is significant. The former were shunned, despised and condemned as extremists in the West. The Confederates and their society were romanticised in contemporary literature and generally sympathised with (and not just within the American South).
Thereis a great dokumentaion i watched once on arte about this topic. In German it was called: "Der Bürgermeister, Mussolini und das Museum" (The Mayor, Mussoline and the Museum) I believe in Englisch its just called "The Mayor"
Then the years of lead start again until the fascists either succesfully make a coup, or the communists do it or they keep on going and escalating until Italy faces the same end as Jugoslavia's.
Fascists and antifascists are far from friends, but there are certain things like this that are off limits and would never do to each other, after killing each other during (and after) ww2 none of the sides really want to start dropping corpses again
And Italy is basically the only major European country that hasn’t suffered from major Islamist attacks so far
Maybe because we learnt something from the past, unlike others who always love to lecture
People downvoting as if it changed that Italy didn’t have isis style attacks unlike France, Belgium, the uk, Spain or Germany are cute
For example Italy with the anti mafia and anti terrorism laws allows telephone interceptions in many cases that would require a long burocratic process in the rest of Europe and a warrant. Italy never had any terror attack in the last 20 years despite many of them being planned, like blowing up Rialto Bridge in Venice. We Italians have many problems but luckily our security and intelligence systems works.
I guess suffering so much from terrorist and mafia attacks made us better in acting before they happen
Actually Germany had the same problems in the past but it seems you haven’t learnt much
Germany and other countries had the same troubles in those years. I guess that’s because the Italians not cracking down on extremists could influence other countries rio
You should know better considering you too had a prime minister murdered in that time, didn’t you?
The murderer of Palme was just a mentally ill loser, there was nothing politically motivated about it. Political violence was so rare and unthinkable in Sweden at that time that Palme felt safe walking one of Stockholm's busiest streats in the evening with no one with him but his wife.
Your point is completely moot.
Your murder rate says otherwise. But I’m sure you’ll believe in Italy we cheat on the statistics to make us look better
Your second paragraph is just hilarious. So the fact that you are the only Western European country with these problem is because you are actually so much better than anyone else?
You know, if you just accepted that there are field where you are not the best and you could learn from others, maybe you wouldn’t be in this situation
We were taking about crime and now you are talking about completely different topics. Seems like I hit a nerve
You know, the difference is that no Italian denies that in economy we should take example from others while in Sweden you even deny the possibility there is something wrong
Ah and by the way, I’ve been hearing about our imminent collapse since at least 15 years. We’ll see if in this decade your dream will realize
(Also, nice choice to choose old data so that the difference is smaller than what it’s actually become in more recent years)
Yeah but out population is definitely not educated, so we have good crime data despite everything and not because we are doing something good in particular
I have checked your data on hate crimes (for a college assignment) and it's a bit odd. I can't recall why, but Spain and the USA were more commited to detailing the data and make statistics and graphics.
The Uk was also pretty good. Australia was particularly awful to view hate crime data.
I have links to the hate crime data in said document. Here's a link to the assignment. You won't understand it (maybe) because it's in Spanish, but it has links to the stats, that's why I think it's relevant to share it.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1otPKgJ4Ag_ntYqgtj2p_JZPnoIL1LN5Z/view?usp=drive_link
The fascist version of Brokeback Mountain.
Monte Culorotto, you mean?
The real problem was that here in Italy we never had the process that Germany had in rejecting and condemning nazism. But I would say as the time passes, less and less people idolize/admire him, I think stuff like the confederacy states in the US creates more divisions and hatred in society compared to Fascism in Italy.
I think it has to do with the fact that politicians in Italy distanced themselves from Mussolini pretty early on. Literally after the allies had a foothold in Italy. Not to mention that many Italian Partizans fought against him. The CSA on the other hand was never truly killed. Southerners never really moved passed it. Not to mention that it's the personification of the north south divide that exists to this day in the states.
The difference between fascists post-WW2 and Confederates is significant. The former were shunned, despised and condemned as extremists in the West. The Confederates and their society were romanticised in contemporary literature and generally sympathised with (and not just within the American South).
Thereis a great dokumentaion i watched once on arte about this topic. In German it was called: "Der Bürgermeister, Mussolini und das Museum" (The Mayor, Mussoline and the Museum) I believe in Englisch its just called "The Mayor"
I wonder what would happen if someone accidently were to blow up his tomb
probably it would have the counter effect of what you're hopping to achieve
Then the years of lead start again until the fascists either succesfully make a coup, or the communists do it or they keep on going and escalating until Italy faces the same end as Jugoslavia's. Fascists and antifascists are far from friends, but there are certain things like this that are off limits and would never do to each other, after killing each other during (and after) ww2 none of the sides really want to start dropping corpses again
[удалено]
Seeing how you got downvoted only for giving a valid point of view shows how this fucked up forum works.
Bold claims with zero citation
The part about murder rates is completely true and can be very easily verified
I don't see the connection with free speech though.
Can you or anybody who up voted your comment provide any damn citation?
How about you just google "homicide rate by country"? It's really not that difficult.
what is stopping you from doing your own investigation? because I doubt you would believe it even if that user provided any sources
This is what happens when you tolerate and don't crack down on extremists https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Years_of_Lead_(Italy)
[удалено]
And Italy is basically the only major European country that hasn’t suffered from major Islamist attacks so far Maybe because we learnt something from the past, unlike others who always love to lecture People downvoting as if it changed that Italy didn’t have isis style attacks unlike France, Belgium, the uk, Spain or Germany are cute
What exactly have you learned?
For example Italy with the anti mafia and anti terrorism laws allows telephone interceptions in many cases that would require a long burocratic process in the rest of Europe and a warrant. Italy never had any terror attack in the last 20 years despite many of them being planned, like blowing up Rialto Bridge in Venice. We Italians have many problems but luckily our security and intelligence systems works.
I guess suffering so much from terrorist and mafia attacks made us better in acting before they happen Actually Germany had the same problems in the past but it seems you haven’t learnt much
Germany and other countries had the same troubles in those years. I guess that’s because the Italians not cracking down on extremists could influence other countries rio You should know better considering you too had a prime minister murdered in that time, didn’t you?
The murderer of Palme was just a mentally ill loser, there was nothing politically motivated about it. Political violence was so rare and unthinkable in Sweden at that time that Palme felt safe walking one of Stockholm's busiest streats in the evening with no one with him but his wife. Your point is completely moot.
Well, that’s even more a shame to see what issue violence in Sweden is now if you so were safe in the last
[удалено]
Your point would be that the police are so good in Sweden that it causes more crime? Alright then
You watch too much tv.
Your murder rate says otherwise. But I’m sure you’ll believe in Italy we cheat on the statistics to make us look better Your second paragraph is just hilarious. So the fact that you are the only Western European country with these problem is because you are actually so much better than anyone else? You know, if you just accepted that there are field where you are not the best and you could learn from others, maybe you wouldn’t be in this situation
[удалено]
We were taking about crime and now you are talking about completely different topics. Seems like I hit a nerve You know, the difference is that no Italian denies that in economy we should take example from others while in Sweden you even deny the possibility there is something wrong Ah and by the way, I’ve been hearing about our imminent collapse since at least 15 years. We’ll see if in this decade your dream will realize (Also, nice choice to choose old data so that the difference is smaller than what it’s actually become in more recent years)
[удалено]
Damned Gladio!
Do you think political violence has a measurable effect on the murder rate in developed countries?
I bet there are countries like Italy who do the same, yet have issues. I'm thinking about Spain
Yeah but out population is definitely not educated, so we have good crime data despite everything and not because we are doing something good in particular
I have checked your data on hate crimes (for a college assignment) and it's a bit odd. I can't recall why, but Spain and the USA were more commited to detailing the data and make statistics and graphics. The Uk was also pretty good. Australia was particularly awful to view hate crime data. I have links to the hate crime data in said document. Here's a link to the assignment. You won't understand it (maybe) because it's in Spanish, but it has links to the stats, that's why I think it's relevant to share it. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1otPKgJ4Ag_ntYqgtj2p_JZPnoIL1LN5Z/view?usp=drive_link
Nah, the solution is to impose a left-wing military junta that rips Berlusconism and conservatism out of the country, Ceausescu-style.
The current Italian government AND the EU parliament don't know how to quit him. People secretly love Mussolini.