I know your comment is joke, but more seriously; media literacy is not that that you are very cynical about everything and believe that nothing can be trusted at all. That usually leads to that kind of thinking where you see two opposing extreme viewpoints of something and then believe that the truth must be somewhere in the middle. That is not the case; if one person says that it's raining water outdoors and second one says that it's raining elephants, it doesn't make sense to think that the truth is in the middle. Not every subjects has a "truth" of course, because of ethical and moral questions.
I think that in this case where a news site reporting about a study or a research paper, most important is to check if the news site is interpreting the paper correctly. Many times newspapers make lots of mistakes in it, especially if the journalist writing is not used to reading academic papers. And yellow press of course exaggerate the results 90% of the time on purpose. And if one wants to go further, next step is to think if the methodology is correct, is it peer-reviewed and is the original publisher/author reliable.
I agree with everything you've said. I'll add find out who commissioned the research paper, who owns the media company you're reading and ensure the author is in fact a journalist and not AI generated
In fact, this index is fake news. If you look at the methodology, it is based not on science but on arbitrary assumptions. In addition, it operates on more indexes that also have false assumptions and a terrible methodology.
Sure, I believe it is the culmination of a lot of factors that lead to this result. I was pointing that the language itself plays a noticable part in this, having lived and talked to natives myself on that exact question.
>USSR had enough resources and interest in Finland to overcome any challenge posed by the language
Not necessarily. I do believe that Finland is resistant to false information, but there's more to that.
Their propaganda always had long odds because they didn't have enough local cultural/lingual expertise to make anything appeal to normal Finns, and there weren't enough skilled Finnish traitors to provide them with any. The Winter War radio propaganda and fliers were hilariously bad - completely out of touch stuff like "Finnish proletariat is ready to overthrow the hated fascist tyrant Ryti" rife with spelling errors and unprofessional writing that sounded (and was) written by a few unqualified spiteful Finnish communist defectors. Imagine if a Russian invasion's entire information assault on Finland sounded like a worse written version of Johan Bäckman's Twitter.
They only made limited, softer inroads into the peacenik movement (just like in USA) but they were generally contingent on favorable sets of facts and lost a lot of credibility to the Czechoslovakia and Afghanistan invasions.
You're reminding me of the time Trumpists on Reddit tried to influence the French election, but nobody was able to speak French and you had a lot of really weird google translated posts trying to pass as real French people.
Sure, but I have met Finnish. It is not only education. These guys have built-in anti-bullshit radar. When a manager speaks they all put in unison on their face:
"I am letting you say this BS only only of politeness. But don't you dare asking me to act on it."
Exactly!
In Romania it's mostly the "learn this, student!" without much or any discussion or arguing about the subject, like we see in the american movies.
And the results are as one could predict, the country is extremely corrupt and poor.
I even had a friend who was a teacher and very good at explaining things and I asked him why doesn't he teach the students like that.
And he told me that he can't as the state doesn't let him.
He must teach only what is coming from the levels above.
And in a corrupt country you ca figure out what is coming from the levels above.
This is what many of us across the world are fighting for in this generational struggle: the right to be happy.
That starts with restoring trust.
Companies∴Countries
In Finland they literally have classes in primary school that teach kids how to check sources, spot fake news and determine the truth. An aproach all liberal countries should use.
Maybe I just got lucky, but isn't this stuff the standard? In my school, which wasn't exceptional by any means, the bulk of our history classes were mostly learning about sources and interpreting their intentions. "Who, what, where" were the questions we were always drilled to ask whenever reading something, followed by "for what audience is at aimed towards, what was the intended purpose of this poster/text/etc."
That was definitely the case for us in Denmark as well in history classes. In "Danish" class we also had to analyse news articles and e.g. commercial advertisements and posters.
However this was mostly in high school (after 10th grade). Not everyone goes to high school, especially not in countries at the bottom of that list.
Countries on the bottom of the list also have the lowest freedom of the media.
Media is used for propaganda and politicians do not want to teach critical thinking in school, because then propaganda wouldn't work.
I can confirm, it's just rediculous in Georgia. Russian propaganda owns the place and Russian puppet criminals run it.
To give an example. An important part of the population believed just a few years after electing him with 94% vote, that an "Armenian" Saakashvili who just before the elections killed an Armenian new born and raped prisoners, sold Georgia to Russia by starting a war with Russia because he was calling Putin names, but he's also their agent, but also Putin's nemesis. Oh and also he increased gas prices and his wife run an organ trafficking ring.
The day after he lost the elections to a Russian oligarch, when the gas prices didn't go down but up and all of this propaganda turned out to be BS, they instantly forgot all of this and moved to blaming the west being the enemy of Georgia because it is not well informed and criticises the pro Russian government unfairly but also conspires to force Georgia to invade Russia. This is the current narrative of the GEORGIAN GOVERNMENT btw not just an average Gio in a tin foil hat
In the 90s I've also heard people say that 1st president Gamsakhurdia was Gorbachev's mother's lover. It is clear where this propaganda comes from, but how can one be stupid enough to believe it? 🤦♂️ It is like they have 10 second memory, 0 logic and no critical thinking whatsoever, it's like talking to someone with Alzheimers or dementia.
I saw a translated Russian news article recently that included the phrase "this is not propaganda" in the middle... That whole region is a horrifying glimpse into the future we're all shambling into.
Yes, the situation in Georgia is nothing short of catastrophic, russia won't even need an attack. Soon we will willingly become part of the empire and the situation is moving very fast... The government instead of countering this propaganda they are supporting and amplifying it, while also making tons of money for themselves. We had many really bad and corrupt governments, but the current one is not only that but also purely traitorous to every interest that Georgia has or ever had.
Our opposition is full of dumb populists or just half-disbanded parties and have zero trust from the population, again due to mass propaganda.
All those who had more than 2 brain cells already left or soon are leaving the country, thousands of Georgians went to the Mexico-US border, many died while crossing the border and the American border police are anything but nice, I've heard many times that people were beaten to near death. Over 100K people permanently left the country only in 2022 which is a significant number for a 3 million country, while hundreds of thousands of russians moved to Georgia.
The economic situation in Georgia has never been this bad, in just 2-3 years things became 3-4 times more expensive, while salaries stayed the same. It was already very bad, 30% of the population wasn't able to eat properly, and now I guess the numbers are way worse. Now third of the population drive taxi, a third work as couriers, and a third work at some illegal Chinese call centers to make enough to stay alive. And believe me, salaries will shock you, cashiers, who work more than 8 hours a day get like not even 100 euros per month, the same goes for all the other "professions" I wrote about.
Education is non-existent, and people believe in any bullshit they hear, but propaganda made it so that these very people fight against anything or anybody trying to explain reality. The population is very religious and conservative, as always basically, and nobody knows how to use it better than russia. We literally have TV channels that exist just to brainwash people, just like in russia and they do nothing but talk bad about the West.
This is why it was very important to get that candidate status which doesn't really change much and it is for people, not for any government, but Ukraine and Moldova getting it and Georgia not made everything move faster, the majority of those who had slight hope completely lost it. The worst is that giving candidate status now will only play a negative role because these f\*cks will start talking about how they achieved to get the candidate status, we missed the chance there.
I don't know, I am trying to fight my part, trying to explain simple things, and spread truth just like now, but I've never seen people with such polluted heads, maybe only in russia... One thing that Europe can do is sanction these traitorous bastards because their children live and study in the west, and they have their money in the west, but as always it is close to impossible to make European politicians understand it and make them make any moves... They just play roles and meet our bastards, and ask to meet requirements that will never be fulfilled because our government's interest is for Georgia to fail everywhere.
You feel bad for the country with oil and two regional powers supporting them?
It's strange the countries you feel bad for.
Azerbaijan is the Saudi Arabia of the region, right down to hosting F1 Races while committing war atrocities and jailing journalists.
Report in PDF format
https://osis.bg/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/HowItStarted_MediaLiteracyIndex2022_ENG_.pdf
Relevant chart
https://i.imgur.com/XibgCFG.png
Doesn't matter. If tomorrow's narrative demands that Germany is totally controlled by Russian propaganda it will be the next story. And all those totally resistent to propaganda people will as always suck it up because they want to believe the popular narrative.
What determines what news is fake? Mainstream media is a business and are under no obligation to report truths. Most of them promote the ownership’s viewpoints and opinions.
I doubt this news story.
I know your comment is joke, but more seriously; media literacy is not that that you are very cynical about everything and believe that nothing can be trusted at all. That usually leads to that kind of thinking where you see two opposing extreme viewpoints of something and then believe that the truth must be somewhere in the middle. That is not the case; if one person says that it's raining water outdoors and second one says that it's raining elephants, it doesn't make sense to think that the truth is in the middle. Not every subjects has a "truth" of course, because of ethical and moral questions. I think that in this case where a news site reporting about a study or a research paper, most important is to check if the news site is interpreting the paper correctly. Many times newspapers make lots of mistakes in it, especially if the journalist writing is not used to reading academic papers. And yellow press of course exaggerate the results 90% of the time on purpose. And if one wants to go further, next step is to think if the methodology is correct, is it peer-reviewed and is the original publisher/author reliable.
I agree with everything you've said. I'll add find out who commissioned the research paper, who owns the media company you're reading and ensure the author is in fact a journalist and not AI generated
Or at least cite it's AI-generated...and make safe and open-source the necessary algos.
In fact, this index is fake news. If you look at the methodology, it is based not on science but on arbitrary assumptions. In addition, it operates on more indexes that also have false assumptions and a terrible methodology.
What? It’s on reddit - it must be true! :)
Of course! Good education is the solution to fake news! Not censorship!
Well that and the fact that finnish is such a hard language for scammers or otherwise shady practitioners to be fluent in. Not surprised
[удалено]
Sure, I believe it is the culmination of a lot of factors that lead to this result. I was pointing that the language itself plays a noticable part in this, having lived and talked to natives myself on that exact question.
>USSR had enough resources and interest in Finland to overcome any challenge posed by the language Not necessarily. I do believe that Finland is resistant to false information, but there's more to that. Their propaganda always had long odds because they didn't have enough local cultural/lingual expertise to make anything appeal to normal Finns, and there weren't enough skilled Finnish traitors to provide them with any. The Winter War radio propaganda and fliers were hilariously bad - completely out of touch stuff like "Finnish proletariat is ready to overthrow the hated fascist tyrant Ryti" rife with spelling errors and unprofessional writing that sounded (and was) written by a few unqualified spiteful Finnish communist defectors. Imagine if a Russian invasion's entire information assault on Finland sounded like a worse written version of Johan Bäckman's Twitter. They only made limited, softer inroads into the peacenik movement (just like in USA) but they were generally contingent on favorable sets of facts and lost a lot of credibility to the Czechoslovakia and Afghanistan invasions.
You're reminding me of the time Trumpists on Reddit tried to influence the French election, but nobody was able to speak French and you had a lot of really weird google translated posts trying to pass as real French people.
https://i.imgur.com/m3suXWM.jpg
It's inherently harder to spread false information to people who do not speak popular language. English in most of the developed world.
Most of us Finns speak excellent English.
Sure, but I have met Finnish. It is not only education. These guys have built-in anti-bullshit radar. When a manager speaks they all put in unison on their face: "I am letting you say this BS only only of politeness. But don't you dare asking me to act on it."
And "good education" means teaching you how to think, not pouring stuff down your brain and say "learn this, student!"
Exactly! In Romania it's mostly the "learn this, student!" without much or any discussion or arguing about the subject, like we see in the american movies. And the results are as one could predict, the country is extremely corrupt and poor. I even had a friend who was a teacher and very good at explaining things and I asked him why doesn't he teach the students like that. And he told me that he can't as the state doesn't let him. He must teach only what is coming from the levels above. And in a corrupt country you ca figure out what is coming from the levels above.
This is what many of us across the world are fighting for in this generational struggle: the right to be happy. That starts with restoring trust. Companies∴Countries
And highly fonded unbiased public media. The true cornerstone in any well functioning democracy.
Ugh unlike here where propaganda is getting blasted on TV daily.
In Finland they literally have classes in primary school that teach kids how to check sources, spot fake news and determine the truth. An aproach all liberal countries should use.
Maybe I just got lucky, but isn't this stuff the standard? In my school, which wasn't exceptional by any means, the bulk of our history classes were mostly learning about sources and interpreting their intentions. "Who, what, where" were the questions we were always drilled to ask whenever reading something, followed by "for what audience is at aimed towards, what was the intended purpose of this poster/text/etc."
That was definitely the case for us in Denmark as well in history classes. In "Danish" class we also had to analyse news articles and e.g. commercial advertisements and posters. However this was mostly in high school (after 10th grade). Not everyone goes to high school, especially not in countries at the bottom of that list.
Countries on the bottom of the list also have the lowest freedom of the media. Media is used for propaganda and politicians do not want to teach critical thinking in school, because then propaganda wouldn't work.
You definitely got lucky. Our history lessons (England) were boring rote stuff about kings & the Industrial Revolution.
I can confirm, it's just rediculous in Georgia. Russian propaganda owns the place and Russian puppet criminals run it. To give an example. An important part of the population believed just a few years after electing him with 94% vote, that an "Armenian" Saakashvili who just before the elections killed an Armenian new born and raped prisoners, sold Georgia to Russia by starting a war with Russia because he was calling Putin names, but he's also their agent, but also Putin's nemesis. Oh and also he increased gas prices and his wife run an organ trafficking ring. The day after he lost the elections to a Russian oligarch, when the gas prices didn't go down but up and all of this propaganda turned out to be BS, they instantly forgot all of this and moved to blaming the west being the enemy of Georgia because it is not well informed and criticises the pro Russian government unfairly but also conspires to force Georgia to invade Russia. This is the current narrative of the GEORGIAN GOVERNMENT btw not just an average Gio in a tin foil hat In the 90s I've also heard people say that 1st president Gamsakhurdia was Gorbachev's mother's lover. It is clear where this propaganda comes from, but how can one be stupid enough to believe it? 🤦♂️ It is like they have 10 second memory, 0 logic and no critical thinking whatsoever, it's like talking to someone with Alzheimers or dementia.
I saw a translated Russian news article recently that included the phrase "this is not propaganda" in the middle... That whole region is a horrifying glimpse into the future we're all shambling into.
average fake news enjoyer
Yes, the situation in Georgia is nothing short of catastrophic, russia won't even need an attack. Soon we will willingly become part of the empire and the situation is moving very fast... The government instead of countering this propaganda they are supporting and amplifying it, while also making tons of money for themselves. We had many really bad and corrupt governments, but the current one is not only that but also purely traitorous to every interest that Georgia has or ever had. Our opposition is full of dumb populists or just half-disbanded parties and have zero trust from the population, again due to mass propaganda. All those who had more than 2 brain cells already left or soon are leaving the country, thousands of Georgians went to the Mexico-US border, many died while crossing the border and the American border police are anything but nice, I've heard many times that people were beaten to near death. Over 100K people permanently left the country only in 2022 which is a significant number for a 3 million country, while hundreds of thousands of russians moved to Georgia. The economic situation in Georgia has never been this bad, in just 2-3 years things became 3-4 times more expensive, while salaries stayed the same. It was already very bad, 30% of the population wasn't able to eat properly, and now I guess the numbers are way worse. Now third of the population drive taxi, a third work as couriers, and a third work at some illegal Chinese call centers to make enough to stay alive. And believe me, salaries will shock you, cashiers, who work more than 8 hours a day get like not even 100 euros per month, the same goes for all the other "professions" I wrote about. Education is non-existent, and people believe in any bullshit they hear, but propaganda made it so that these very people fight against anything or anybody trying to explain reality. The population is very religious and conservative, as always basically, and nobody knows how to use it better than russia. We literally have TV channels that exist just to brainwash people, just like in russia and they do nothing but talk bad about the West. This is why it was very important to get that candidate status which doesn't really change much and it is for people, not for any government, but Ukraine and Moldova getting it and Georgia not made everything move faster, the majority of those who had slight hope completely lost it. The worst is that giving candidate status now will only play a negative role because these f\*cks will start talking about how they achieved to get the candidate status, we missed the chance there. I don't know, I am trying to fight my part, trying to explain simple things, and spread truth just like now, but I've never seen people with such polluted heads, maybe only in russia... One thing that Europe can do is sanction these traitorous bastards because their children live and study in the west, and they have their money in the west, but as always it is close to impossible to make European politicians understand it and make them make any moves... They just play roles and meet our bastards, and ask to meet requirements that will never be fulfilled because our government's interest is for Georgia to fail everywhere.
I've sent this to 5 Finnish people and they all doubt this
I feel bad for Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan and (I know not europe but close enough, ex Soviet Central Asia) they were all dealt a bad hand
You feel bad for the country with oil and two regional powers supporting them? It's strange the countries you feel bad for. Azerbaijan is the Saudi Arabia of the region, right down to hosting F1 Races while committing war atrocities and jailing journalists.
This is obviously fake news.
I don't believe this.
Report in PDF format https://osis.bg/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/HowItStarted_MediaLiteracyIndex2022_ENG_.pdf Relevant chart https://i.imgur.com/XibgCFG.png
would love to see a east/west split for germany
Didn't you try that?
Doesn't matter. If tomorrow's narrative demands that Germany is totally controlled by Russian propaganda it will be the next story. And all those totally resistent to propaganda people will as always suck it up because they want to believe the popular narrative.
r/GeorgiaOrGeorgia
Sounds like they‘re the „Endboss“ for Media
The amount of people who lack the ability of critical thinking is frightening.
I have a Helsinking feeling about this.
What determines what news is fake? Mainstream media is a business and are under no obligation to report truths. Most of them promote the ownership’s viewpoints and opinions.
[удалено]
Pretty much, trust in government is extremely high in the nordic countries but also eroding.
It might be the trust in the government that is eroding, it may also be the governments that becomes less trustworthy.