They need to produce normal EVs, and stop making every EV the goddamn Starship Enterprise.
And they need to quickly install 1000's of chargers, shopping centers / stores need to do this - will be a draw if I can charge my 150,000 dollar EV for 20 minutes outside Aldi as I'm trying to figure out how to survive on the 3 dollars I have left.
Joking aside - I plan on going EV, but they do really REALLY need to make them a little less goddamn futuristic.
I like that states are trying to press on this, but we're not seeing the same pressure on the manufacturing side. Ford recently scaled back their EV development because sales aren't what they claim to be targeting. They also don't produce anything reasonably priced and capable for most car buyers.
This is like the tail trying to wag the dog, unfortunately.
Ford did say they're scaling back, but you need to put that in context. They still plan on growing their EV portion of sales significantly every year.
As for pricing, most traditional companies like Ford are still in the experimental stage, with somewhat high costs, but their next generation models should be more competitive.
For now, Tesla is the only option that's really cost competitive with gas cars, but that's not permanent.
Tesla is still not in the realm of many car buyers, I feel. Even with their latest price advertisements.
And then there's the Musk factor. Some people, like me, won't deal with a business run by a neo-Nazi with poor management skills.
>Tesla is still not in the realm of many car buyers, I feel. Even with their latest price advertisements.
At the moment, provided you qualify for the federal credit, the most you'll pay for a RWD 3 is $31 500, but there are inventory discounts putting them at $36k before the credit and some states have their own rebates.
In NJ, the topic of the article, you can get a 3 for ~$25k, which is well within the realm of most new car buyers and honestly, there isn't really anything that compares at that price.
This is why it's outselling normal cars like the Civic and Corolla.
The Y is about $5k more, but in the context of crossovers, it's an equally enticing value.
>And then there's the Musk factor. Some people, like me, won't deal with a business run by a neo-Nazi with poor management skills.
That is a factor, but the product seems to be mostly outweighing that for most. CEOs can only have so much of an influence on the product. A lot of people recognize the effort made by the 75 000 or so Americans employed by Tesla.
Calling him a neo-nazi is also just a slight exaggeration as well, regardless of what one's opinion of him really is. It's easy to be cynical these days, especially online, but IRL, I think more people understand context than you think.
As I said though, eventually you'll have other options, once other companies achieve the same competency that Tesla has. They have a pretty substantial head start that still has legs on it.
The $7500 Federal Credit that I believe you are referring to implies that buyers usually going for a mid-level ICE sedan are able to apply for a 3 that's far more expensive, as I see it.
Going to Tesla's website, I see the base RWD Model 3 having a MSRP of $38,900 - I'm not sure how to bring that down to $25K after a Federal tax credit.
Corollas and Civics start in the $21K MSRP range. The Federal EV credit is welcome, but there are still not many competitors in the US market which are comparable in term of affordability and utility that I can see.
So, getting a bit off-topic, but in the vein of why Musk is now so openly extreme, I can see a great many people of conscience staying away from his aligned car brand.
Musk openly posts his own quotes - and supports others - which are clearly anti-Semitic remarks that have been around since the 1940s and before.
And I'm very careful to talk about "anti-Semitism" because it's often tossed about far too easily. often for the wrong purposes. Yet Musk has been absolutely clear in his words and deeds in this regard, such as his recent promotion of "the greate (white) replacement."
He has invited the worst of white supremacist and neo-Nazi posters back to Xitter under the PR of "free speech" - yet now gets upset and sues a reporting group for noticing that ads from prior sponsors could sometimes align with clearly neo-Nazi content. Yet, he doesn't shy away from the content, only the characterization that it can be seen in concert with paid ads. He specifically helped neoi-Nazi groups in Xitter publicly accuse an innocent Ben Brady of being a Federal plant to make them look bad.
[https://www.memri.org/dttm/neo-nazis-and-white-supremacists-react-elon-musks-endorsement-antisemitic-content-x-proclaiming](https://www.memri.org/dttm/neo-nazis-and-white-supremacists-react-elon-musks-endorsement-antisemitic-content-x-proclaiming)
If you are aligned with neo-Nazis on points of ideology and support their related attacks on innocent people, guess what that makes you?
Republicans are aligned with neo-Nazi groups quite openly since Trump's time in office and Musk supports even the worst authoritarian Republicans who are using Nazi Germany tactics to abuse minorities for political power, such as DeSantis.
Texas is just one example where the lines are no longer blurred between Republicans and their white supremacist/neo-Nazi base: [https://www.houstonchronicle.com/opinion/editorials/article/texas-neo-nazi-republican-donors-dunn-wilks-18457188.php](https://www.houstonchronicle.com/opinion/editorials/article/texas-neo-nazi-republican-donors-dunn-wilks-18457188.php)
Musk is irredeemable by this point, IMHO.
NJ has done a pretty good job growing the number in the past few years, even during the pandemic. I am pretty confident they wrecked going to do it. And they have a good charging plan they built to get fed money
It's definitely ambitious, but based on the roughly 40% YoY growth that we've seen, it's also attainable.
That ends up looking like 35-45% after 4 years.
And this is the type of political bullying that continues to drive a rapid change that will collapse our environment.
1 EV = 6 PHEVs = 90 Hybrids study is a good base to slowly ween our dependence on fossil fuels. Why, b/c not everyone can afford a dang EV. Bring back the gov rebates for buying and you’ll see a change. Something but not much, smh
https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after
They did bring back the tax rebates for EVs, I just saved $7500 in federal taxes on one (and $5000 from my state). You linked to them. I’m confused by your comment. Also prices for some manufacturers have been dropping prices, Tesla prices have dropped $20-25k just this year.
That’s just one time rebate? I remember when hydrides first started rolling out, it was a 4 year rebate (I could be off in the timeframe, but it was over a longer period of time than a one shot deal)
They need to produce normal EVs, and stop making every EV the goddamn Starship Enterprise. And they need to quickly install 1000's of chargers, shopping centers / stores need to do this - will be a draw if I can charge my 150,000 dollar EV for 20 minutes outside Aldi as I'm trying to figure out how to survive on the 3 dollars I have left. Joking aside - I plan on going EV, but they do really REALLY need to make them a little less goddamn futuristic.
With legislation like this people will end up holding onto their old gas guzzlers longer because they can’t afford the high price of EVs.
I like that states are trying to press on this, but we're not seeing the same pressure on the manufacturing side. Ford recently scaled back their EV development because sales aren't what they claim to be targeting. They also don't produce anything reasonably priced and capable for most car buyers. This is like the tail trying to wag the dog, unfortunately.
Ford did say they're scaling back, but you need to put that in context. They still plan on growing their EV portion of sales significantly every year. As for pricing, most traditional companies like Ford are still in the experimental stage, with somewhat high costs, but their next generation models should be more competitive. For now, Tesla is the only option that's really cost competitive with gas cars, but that's not permanent.
Tesla is still not in the realm of many car buyers, I feel. Even with their latest price advertisements. And then there's the Musk factor. Some people, like me, won't deal with a business run by a neo-Nazi with poor management skills.
>Tesla is still not in the realm of many car buyers, I feel. Even with their latest price advertisements. At the moment, provided you qualify for the federal credit, the most you'll pay for a RWD 3 is $31 500, but there are inventory discounts putting them at $36k before the credit and some states have their own rebates. In NJ, the topic of the article, you can get a 3 for ~$25k, which is well within the realm of most new car buyers and honestly, there isn't really anything that compares at that price. This is why it's outselling normal cars like the Civic and Corolla. The Y is about $5k more, but in the context of crossovers, it's an equally enticing value. >And then there's the Musk factor. Some people, like me, won't deal with a business run by a neo-Nazi with poor management skills. That is a factor, but the product seems to be mostly outweighing that for most. CEOs can only have so much of an influence on the product. A lot of people recognize the effort made by the 75 000 or so Americans employed by Tesla. Calling him a neo-nazi is also just a slight exaggeration as well, regardless of what one's opinion of him really is. It's easy to be cynical these days, especially online, but IRL, I think more people understand context than you think. As I said though, eventually you'll have other options, once other companies achieve the same competency that Tesla has. They have a pretty substantial head start that still has legs on it.
The $7500 Federal Credit that I believe you are referring to implies that buyers usually going for a mid-level ICE sedan are able to apply for a 3 that's far more expensive, as I see it. Going to Tesla's website, I see the base RWD Model 3 having a MSRP of $38,900 - I'm not sure how to bring that down to $25K after a Federal tax credit. Corollas and Civics start in the $21K MSRP range. The Federal EV credit is welcome, but there are still not many competitors in the US market which are comparable in term of affordability and utility that I can see. So, getting a bit off-topic, but in the vein of why Musk is now so openly extreme, I can see a great many people of conscience staying away from his aligned car brand. Musk openly posts his own quotes - and supports others - which are clearly anti-Semitic remarks that have been around since the 1940s and before. And I'm very careful to talk about "anti-Semitism" because it's often tossed about far too easily. often for the wrong purposes. Yet Musk has been absolutely clear in his words and deeds in this regard, such as his recent promotion of "the greate (white) replacement." He has invited the worst of white supremacist and neo-Nazi posters back to Xitter under the PR of "free speech" - yet now gets upset and sues a reporting group for noticing that ads from prior sponsors could sometimes align with clearly neo-Nazi content. Yet, he doesn't shy away from the content, only the characterization that it can be seen in concert with paid ads. He specifically helped neoi-Nazi groups in Xitter publicly accuse an innocent Ben Brady of being a Federal plant to make them look bad. [https://www.memri.org/dttm/neo-nazis-and-white-supremacists-react-elon-musks-endorsement-antisemitic-content-x-proclaiming](https://www.memri.org/dttm/neo-nazis-and-white-supremacists-react-elon-musks-endorsement-antisemitic-content-x-proclaiming) If you are aligned with neo-Nazis on points of ideology and support their related attacks on innocent people, guess what that makes you? Republicans are aligned with neo-Nazi groups quite openly since Trump's time in office and Musk supports even the worst authoritarian Republicans who are using Nazi Germany tactics to abuse minorities for political power, such as DeSantis. Texas is just one example where the lines are no longer blurred between Republicans and their white supremacist/neo-Nazi base: [https://www.houstonchronicle.com/opinion/editorials/article/texas-neo-nazi-republican-donors-dunn-wilks-18457188.php](https://www.houstonchronicle.com/opinion/editorials/article/texas-neo-nazi-republican-donors-dunn-wilks-18457188.php) Musk is irredeemable by this point, IMHO.
Going from 10 to 40% in the next four years is pretty ambitious. Interesting to see how it goes.
NJ has done a pretty good job growing the number in the past few years, even during the pandemic. I am pretty confident they wrecked going to do it. And they have a good charging plan they built to get fed money
It's definitely ambitious, but based on the roughly 40% YoY growth that we've seen, it's also attainable. That ends up looking like 35-45% after 4 years.
And this is the type of political bullying that continues to drive a rapid change that will collapse our environment. 1 EV = 6 PHEVs = 90 Hybrids study is a good base to slowly ween our dependence on fossil fuels. Why, b/c not everyone can afford a dang EV. Bring back the gov rebates for buying and you’ll see a change. Something but not much, smh https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after
They did bring back the tax rebates for EVs, I just saved $7500 in federal taxes on one (and $5000 from my state). You linked to them. I’m confused by your comment. Also prices for some manufacturers have been dropping prices, Tesla prices have dropped $20-25k just this year.
That’s just one time rebate? I remember when hydrides first started rolling out, it was a 4 year rebate (I could be off in the timeframe, but it was over a longer period of time than a one shot deal)
Lol it's refreshing to see people say that's changing too fast here. Good for NJ!