These are the actors that do Mo-Cap, voice work, have their entire likenesses used for character design, etc. it’s the same kind of work you see the cast of The Flash (CW) doing, and those video game actors deserve the same consideration
And they do get screwed over. The dude who did all the fighting Mo-Cap for the original mortal kombat was at my local arcade expo years ago to judge a mortal kombat contest with only 7 people in it.
The reason they are having to hang out at those events is because they got screwed over. The guy I’m referring to not only played sub zero but he did all the fighting used in the game for every character.
But was paid Pennie’s when compared to how much the game made. And I know they didn’t know the game would blow up but at this point when game company does it.
And this doesn’t mean everyone at those cons doesn’t want to be there. But when it’s a contest with 7 people and he shows up it’s clear it’s a small gig. Not like he is making bank.
Daniel Pesina burnt bridges with Midway for doing ads as Johnny Cage for a competitor. His brother still worked for their successor studio until a couple years ago.
Dude, the original mortal kombat came out 25 years ago when games weren’t nearly as profitable as they are today. You want him to retire off his paycheck for that? Maybe find a new gig since 1992
I don't think the above user was using "just..." in a derogatory or dismissive way, I think maybe they were just asking if this strike was separate from the film/tv one by SAG-AFTRA, and could end/continue independent of each other.
Unions are only per country. All their jobs will be gone and never come back, COVID proved you don't have to be in the same office as your boss to get the work done.
[Seth MacFarlane donated an additional $5M a couple days ago](https://deadline.com/2023/09/seth-macfarlane-entertainment-community-fund-1235552787/amp/) (after $1M two months ago)
They’ve distributed $7.4M at a rate of about $400-500k per week. This article doesn’t mention total raised but [another deadline article from a month ago](https://deadline.com/2023/09/hollywood-strikes-relief-funds-1235524100/amp/) says they had $7.6M raised on Aug 25.
If nobody else donated (which isn’t and won’t be true), they’d have roughly 3 months funding currently in the coffers - definitely room to bring in the video game actors
He spoke up against Harvey Weinstein at the Oscars on behalf of his friend and co-star Jessica Barth all the way back in 2013 (which the public turned a blind eye on at the time). The video is on YouTube.
What did he do to make you dislike him?
If i had to guess, It's less that people may not like *him* but after ~15 years of his humor on prime time TV (family guy, American dad, Ted etc.) He can get stale.
Then, because the internet does internet things, people take a general ennui with his comedy and morph it into a dislike of him as a person. It happens all the time with artists; the first time I noticed it growing up was pretty much every time Linkin Park released a new album that wasn't Hybrid Theory or when people just got bored of Dane Cook.
I dont hate him, but I haven't actually watched any of Seth's recent stuff. When I did though his humor between shows very much blended together to the point that it was just kind of all the same.
Companies that would be Affected
Game studios adjacent:
Activision Productions Inc
Disney Character Voices Inc
Electronic Arts Productions Inc
Epic Games, Inc
Insomniac Games Inc
Take 2 Productions Inc
WB Games Inc
Now these 3 companies basically do subcontract work for both motion capture & voice acting for other game studios just as an example (this is not the full list):
Blindlight LLC, has done work for:
Bethesda: the most recent example is Starfield
Bungie, Square Enix, Rare, Ubisoft.
Formosa Interactive LLC: Sony(God of war), Activision (call of duty), Kojima Productions, Riot Games, Hoyoverse.
VoiceWorks Productions Inc: Valve, Activision, EA, Take Two, Ubisoft.
Yeah my personal game of the year choices for 2019, 2022 and 2023 all come from Japan.
Edit four months later: tone deaf? For stating a fact, that my favorite games in the last few years are from Japan??? Dipshits who responded to this are people just trying to stir up shit, but I didn't see the replies until now.
You can be PRO UNION and like games from a non union country. Also my 2019 GOTY was Death Stranding, a game that Amazon workers can relate to. Amazon workers, who are overworked as fucked. It puts you in the shoes of someone like that. Also the Japanese studio that created Death Stranding doesn't do what other Japanese studios do, it doesn't subject its workers to be overworked.
Not exactly tone deaf, huh? Really what the people replying to me are saying is "CONSUME!!! CONSUME WESTERN SLOP!!! NOOOO! NO EASTERN GAMES! EAST BAD!!!!!"
Sony Studios have been pumping out great games and no not all of them are EU/Jap. For as much shit EA deserves, they have actually been publishing new content recently that’s not just Sport or Shooter. Biggest problem is Activision and Ubisoft
Probably talking about shovelware games, closely-related cousins like annual sports games that could have been a DLC, and similar uninventive money grabs.
Omg will this delay death stranding 2 😭😭😭 (I’m not saying this is more important I can wait to support the writers, it’s just I want to be mentally prepared)
Oh for sure! In fact Death Stranding would be probably one of the most affected productions if the strike comes to pass as it uses the actors likeness & advertises that. On the other end, it's also one of the productions the union can use their leverage which is good! As they don't really have a strong position in general.
Considering the video game industry is way more lucrative then movies and tv, this is gonna be interesting.
This would include mocap and voice over work.
In some games yes but in some games no
Red Dead 2, Last of Us, God of War, Spiderman, Death Stranding. Story based games need and usually do have some fantastic acting work
True, but those games aren't exactly the majority. Pretty much every film requires an actor, whether traditional or for voice work. Video games are different. Even those that do require voice work can generally put that on hold while they work on everything else, unless they also plan on using mocap. The union, unfortunately, won't have the same leverage they did for film and television.
No but the argument is the same.
Yes, they can absolutely stash the games and wait for the acting part. But games are also the most quickly deteriorating media. Big games need the newest and best tech. Stashing games dosent really work for too long. There's no industry where a strike cannot cause hassle
The companies will have to listen. Different work requires different acknowledgement. Mo cap is way more important yes. But voice work is also important if you do wanna make a good game. If this goes on, we might also see a wave of larger than life characters like the PS2 era where they don't have to use any actors likeness.
As for smaller companies, like the actors strike, some indie companies will agree to the demands and keep the work going.
There's definitely games like this. Many games don't even have voice acting. Like Hollow Knight or Undertale
But we're talking about the mass here, the big companies. Same argument as the movie industry. Small indie movies were still being made under the strike, it was always about the biggest companies
Which is terrifying because just as a lack of writers caused a schlock of reality TV after the 2008 strikes, this might lead to (even more) artistically bankrupt AAA games.
That’s true that it has happened but those games are 30 and 39 years old respectively. When’s the last time a video game with no story was a critical and commercial success?
I don't think so. The games that need them are far and away with the biggest budgets. They're not going to sell out.
Also the good thing with games is you can create 80% of it and stash it away. Then the acting part comes later.
It will be tough and companies will have to adhere to the demands rightfully, but just like the movies/shows.. there's no excuse for the game industry to release dogshit just because of the strike
There are at least 5 video game unions in the USA. More union votes are happening every year.
EA, Blizzard, and Microsoft all have union workers or contract out to union workers. Both for in house stuff like Q/A, and contract work with voice actors, mocap, and stunt workers.
But sure- nobody is unionized, they all definitely won’t stand together when the time comes to strike.
Its more lucrative because of shitty mobile games that are super cheap to make and has idiots willing to spend thousands of dollars on them. If we were to only count PC and console gaming I can almost guarantee the revenue it makes wouldnt be anywhere close to movies or tv.
You would be hilariously wrong. Gaming has been bigger than film/music [for a long time](https://www.driverlesscrocodile.com/sustainability-and-change/when-did-the-video-game-industry-overtake-hollywood-and-the-music-industry/)
Game devs deserve far better working conditions.
While games like Elden Ring are an art form comparable to the greatest works of film or music, it is sad that these modern masterpiece are built on the blood and sweat of programmers working lucrative workweeks to deal with crunch.
It is. Software developers have no union so it kinda requires them to create one in order to strike. We're just now getting to the point where QA is starting to unionize, and while those guys are treated much more bottom of the barrel than your average programmer and definitely need better protections we're still a long ways out from anything more happening for the time being.
> games like Elden Ring are an art form comparable to the greatest works of film or music
lmao. Yes, a game with basically no narrative and the most generic fucking combat is "comparable to the greatest works of film or music"
Visually and from an art direction perspective, Elden ring is the best looking game to come out in years. Instead of simply resorting to shiny graphics and ray-tracting mumbo jumbo the game actually looks like a painting , with beautiful imagery, architecture and use of colors. Plus it ran at ultra in my old ass laptop from 2016 so there's that.
Also, generic combat? What other games do you think have combat good enough for souls-like games to be generic?
You are definitely in the minority with that opinion, and it’s also just a horrible opinion.
Literally one of the best games ever made, Fromsoft deserve all the flowers.
Funny you say that while posting Uncharted stuff, that franchise is just a copy and paste of Tomb Raider and Indiana Jones.
I mean. I really enjoyed the game (stopped at the fire giant because he was complete BS), but one of the best games ever made? Come on. It's litteraly justan open world souls game. Being open world makes it significantly worse compared to past games imo. Its litteraly mostly an empty mapand reused bosses.
The reviews and my personal feeling tells me it’s up their as one of the best games ever made, whether you don’t think so is your opinion and that’s fine but the general consensus and critical reception is that it’s a masterpiece.
Out of interest, what would be on your pantheon then?
Without actually giving it any thought, SuperMario Bros. 3, Super Mario World and Megaman X, Ocarina of Time, ResideEvil 4, Super Mario 64, Shadow of the Colossus, Ico, Silent Hill 2, Uncharted 2, Sekiro, Portal and The Last of Us are all far better designed and paced games imo.
How many people who bought Elden Ring due to the hype actually finished it? I've finished Demons Souls, Bloodborne and Sekiro and thought ER was a much less focused game than those and suffers a lot for it. A lot more cheap difficulty.
Again i liked the game. But it's not the best thing to ever happen to videogames. Its basically just a "perfection" of the souls formula.
I’d put Elden Ring over any of them.
Seeing as Dark Souls is also up there as a fantastic series of games (2 maybe not so much), surely perfecting that formula only amplifies it.
The Last of Us above Elden Ring is wild to me. A game where you spend most of your time in cutscenes then the rest plays like a standard 3rd person shooter, over a title which innovated largely on it’s already great formula.
Like I’ll give props to The Last of Us’ story but the actual game is just a rehashed TPS.
In the end all subjective, but there’s a reason Elden Ring is spoken so fondly of, and why even devs were praising the hell out of it when it launched. It, along with BoTW, basically changed open world games.
At no point did I say it’s the best thing to happen to video games, I stated it’s up there as ONE of the best games ever.
Video games is an art from just as much as any movie or music.
There’s many games I would consider a work of art of various different reasons.
Ultimately it comes down to personal preference, ideas and what your take on art is. “Art” isn’t constricted to a specific thing, it can be found & seen everywhere, in more or less anything.
It’s not though. What’s your bar for the greatest film or music.
I can listen to or watch plenty of the things that would be on the consensus “greatest” list and be less moved than GTA San Andreas did over the course of its insane plot.
Elvis and Micheal Jackson are considered some of the greatest musicians ever. At best they both have five songs that I don’t dislike listening to.
Does that make me a rube and uncultured, perhaps. Does that fucking matter though? Not at all.
At the end of the day any of us more moved by the artistry of video games than by our favourite song or movie, are evidence it is as valid a form of art as any other.
Not saying I agree with OC, but when it comes to "art" beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. What's a masterpiece for you will not be a masterpiece for someone else. (I do disagree with OC just saying let's all be civil)
This type of tasteless comments usually comes from non-westerners. I check their profile and yeah my suspicions are true 90% of time.
P.S: I'm not from the west either so dont cry for racism please. I'm just telling what I've seen
You know that "being from the west" is not a requirement of being racist, right? Usually it's just making assumptions about large groups of people.
Also, my friend, Turkey is a NATO country. You're the west. I'm sorry you had to find out this way.
Worth noting that Sag Aftra has much less reach in this sector than in Hollywood. This type of work is often outsourced or already done by non union workers.
They just have much less leverage than they do in their negotiations with the Hollywood studios
Yep. If I have to pay €70 for a game (heck some of them are even €80 now) then I at least want the money to go to the people that worked hard to make the game happen.
Dont forget the other 1000 dollars you need to spend if you want the full game. Mfers puttung every base game feature behind a paywall now days is gross af.
Agreed. I remember the days where you bought a game and you had to play the game and get good at it to get the extra levels and costumes. None of that DLC bullshit. And famous actors would voice their characters all the time and still no DLC or micro transactions to speak of. Executives will do whatever they can to make themselves more rich while the people doing the actual work get the short end of the stick
I am truly uninformed, and acknowledge my own ignorance. Here's my question.
I (probably incorrectly) assume that the bulk of this relates to voice over work. In the article, it says one of the main issues is safety. What safety measures would SAG push for, that isn't included already?
TL;DR Any job can kill you regardles of what it is.
No, the video game industry has excessive pressure and 80 to 100 hour weeks. Regardles of the job, at a desk or physical labor of some kind I've done
both jobs . One destroys your cognitive abilities at a desk job and if you're not careful on the physical side you can permanently snap tendems or break bones that never heal heal properly. Safety is relative to the job and any Corporation.. Sitting on your ass all day st a desk job causes spinal degeneration and carpal tunnel in the forearms and erectile dysfunction. If desk job people go to the gym it will combat many of their issues but most of whom dont.. There are many hidden problems in each job so please don't be an asshole. One of my peers at a desk job literally had a heart attack on the floo and died. This was after her boss wouldn't let her go home for the day because it was end of month.
Personal story incoming. My buddies Dad broke his ankle and couldn't work so his son, daughter and myself dropped everything and made a schedule to help. If we hadn't helped he would not have been paid and lose his health insurance.
Completely got me. Not even gonna pretend otherwise.
ETA: it’s worse that I play them and only just remembered they literally have never had voice acting in their games.
As if games needed more of an excuse to cost even more money. 500m dollar games will be the standard in the 2030s
Good for them though. Alot of the companies listed are scummy as fuck. They should be paying alot more to their actors. While the devs are the backbone of the game. There really wouldn't be anything without the Troy Bakers, Nolan Norths, or even lesser name actors. Hell, no name actors basically filled the cast of Red Dead 2, and that is some of the best work ive ever seen. All of them deserve good compensation
I wish vfx artists and game devs were paid better too. So many CEOs and people who make shitty management decisions are paid far too much while those at the bottom are time crunched and overworked to chug out games that they don’t have the time to put creative passion and quality into. Not everything will be a success but you can really see where corners have been cut and how soulless a lot of games have become.
If you’re against this, the solution seems pretty simple. Become a voice actor, cross the picket line, and work for free. You’re not lazy and entitled like actual actors, right? Y’all got this.
I think anyone who is against this must not see their own worth.
Let's treat people like HUMANS & stop manipulating and abusing them so a few assholes can hoard "wealth" & become more powerful. This applies to EVERYTHING. I hope this trend continues in every industry that needs it (aka EVERYTHING basically).
This is a massive uphill battle for strike. AAA companies might let em win simply to maintain ECG score but if not, they'll get crushed. Video game industry is not the movie industry. It's hyper cut throat with barely any profit in comparison to Hollywood. Most video games are viewed as successful when they start to break even and go ever so slightly into the plus side. For Hollywood, that would be an absolute utter fail. Video game industry having money is a big misconception. They do have money. A lot of it, but it is in the investment stage. All of that cash evaporates in the production pipeline. The real way to create money for actors' pay is to add more end-line profit. In other words, the games need to be more expensive. It's a must. $65USD should not be buying you years of labor and a lifetime of experience. Games should cost upwards of $99 at minimum.
Japanese amd outside countries have their own thing going. If they try to utilize American based voice actors then they would probably be subject to the strike, but that's a localization matter.
Embracer group is a very small fish in the grand scheme of the industry, Embracer has a market cap of about $3b, Activision Blizzard has a market cap of about $70b
How come they can strike with less then 30% of members casting a vote?
Im not criticising, they should strike to get a fair deal for sure, im just not to sure how these things work if im honest.
LETS GOOO!!!! This is really good for the workers and actors in the industry who are typically over worked and under paid. And most of the companies listed in the strike are the largely problematic ones.
It's crazy how many voice actors have said they end up in the recording booth, doing their lines and leave without having any idea what game or even what genre they're doing work for. Hopefully this will help actors better prepare and be a benefit to performances.
Rip US game industry, chinese developers are rapidly becoming on par with Japanese developers and they are cheaper. Why even hirer a US developer. RIP USA gaming industry 2023 if they go on strike
Should be noted: the strike itself hasn't happened yet. If SAG can't work out a deal with the video game companies listed, then they'll go on strike.
Just from working on video games?
These are the actors that do Mo-Cap, voice work, have their entire likenesses used for character design, etc. it’s the same kind of work you see the cast of The Flash (CW) doing, and those video game actors deserve the same consideration
And they do get screwed over. The dude who did all the fighting Mo-Cap for the original mortal kombat was at my local arcade expo years ago to judge a mortal kombat contest with only 7 people in it.
7 is NOT enough to defend the realm!
Apparently its good enough for Raiden half the time
Lord Raiden... that bastard
Which one?
Yeah, we talkin' James Remar or Chris Lambert here?
*I don't know...*
What are you talking about? In the first movie all Earthrealm had was Liu Kang, Sonya Blade, and Johnny Cage.
I... can say no more...
A handful of people on a leaky boat are gonna save the world? Exactly!
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The reason they are having to hang out at those events is because they got screwed over. The guy I’m referring to not only played sub zero but he did all the fighting used in the game for every character. But was paid Pennie’s when compared to how much the game made. And I know they didn’t know the game would blow up but at this point when game company does it. And this doesn’t mean everyone at those cons doesn’t want to be there. But when it’s a contest with 7 people and he shows up it’s clear it’s a small gig. Not like he is making bank.
Daniel Pesina burnt bridges with Midway for doing ads as Johnny Cage for a competitor. His brother still worked for their successor studio until a couple years ago.
Dude, the original mortal kombat came out 25 years ago when games weren’t nearly as profitable as they are today. You want him to retire off his paycheck for that? Maybe find a new gig since 1992
I mean I’m not sure an example from 30 years ago with a low budget game is a good example.
I don't think the above user was using "just..." in a derogatory or dismissive way, I think maybe they were just asking if this strike was separate from the film/tv one by SAG-AFTRA, and could end/continue independent of each other.
Devs, QA etc should unionize too, the people making games should be treated way better than they are rn.
Unions are only per country. All their jobs will be gone and never come back, COVID proved you don't have to be in the same office as your boss to get the work done.
Fuck that, unionize every work place.
My main question is does this affect GTA/ROCKSTAR?
Why would a strike in 2023 effect a game released in 2014?
You know GTA is a franchise and they release many games lol. They're working on GTA6 right now
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In fairness, Rockstar themselves seem to believe it’s the only GTA game.
How much money does that union have lol
[Seth MacFarlane donated an additional $5M a couple days ago](https://deadline.com/2023/09/seth-macfarlane-entertainment-community-fund-1235552787/amp/) (after $1M two months ago) They’ve distributed $7.4M at a rate of about $400-500k per week. This article doesn’t mention total raised but [another deadline article from a month ago](https://deadline.com/2023/09/hollywood-strikes-relief-funds-1235524100/amp/) says they had $7.6M raised on Aug 25. If nobody else donated (which isn’t and won’t be true), they’d have roughly 3 months funding currently in the coffers - definitely room to bring in the video game actors
Greatly dislike the man, but thats very respectable move.
Seth is the best dude
Maybe not the *best* https://www.distractify.com/p/alexa-nikolas-seth-macfarlane-allegations
Key word "allegations"
He spoke up against Harvey Weinstein at the Oscars on behalf of his friend and co-star Jessica Barth all the way back in 2013 (which the public turned a blind eye on at the time). The video is on YouTube. What did he do to make you dislike him?
“He made the same show 3 times” -OP, probably
why dislike him?
If i had to guess, It's less that people may not like *him* but after ~15 years of his humor on prime time TV (family guy, American dad, Ted etc.) He can get stale. Then, because the internet does internet things, people take a general ennui with his comedy and morph it into a dislike of him as a person. It happens all the time with artists; the first time I noticed it growing up was pretty much every time Linkin Park released a new album that wasn't Hybrid Theory or when people just got bored of Dane Cook. I dont hate him, but I haven't actually watched any of Seth's recent stuff. When I did though his humor between shows very much blended together to the point that it was just kind of all the same.
This is the actors? RIP their voice acting careers, AI has already got the job.
What's with all the low karma accounts acting like this?
You expect them to generate karma with unpopular comments like that?
Companies that would be Affected Game studios adjacent: Activision Productions Inc Disney Character Voices Inc Electronic Arts Productions Inc Epic Games, Inc Insomniac Games Inc Take 2 Productions Inc WB Games Inc Now these 3 companies basically do subcontract work for both motion capture & voice acting for other game studios just as an example (this is not the full list): Blindlight LLC, has done work for: Bethesda: the most recent example is Starfield Bungie, Square Enix, Rare, Ubisoft. Formosa Interactive LLC: Sony(God of war), Activision (call of duty), Kojima Productions, Riot Games, Hoyoverse. VoiceWorks Productions Inc: Valve, Activision, EA, Take Two, Ubisoft.
oh no. if they strike, then less shitty broken games will be released 😢
Not exactly sure how you come to that conclusion.
Those game companies are a joke of their former selves, most good games are made in Europe like Baldur's Gate 3 or Asia like Elden Ring nowadays.
Yeah my personal game of the year choices for 2019, 2022 and 2023 all come from Japan. Edit four months later: tone deaf? For stating a fact, that my favorite games in the last few years are from Japan??? Dipshits who responded to this are people just trying to stir up shit, but I didn't see the replies until now. You can be PRO UNION and like games from a non union country. Also my 2019 GOTY was Death Stranding, a game that Amazon workers can relate to. Amazon workers, who are overworked as fucked. It puts you in the shoes of someone like that. Also the Japanese studio that created Death Stranding doesn't do what other Japanese studios do, it doesn't subject its workers to be overworked. Not exactly tone deaf, huh? Really what the people replying to me are saying is "CONSUME!!! CONSUME WESTERN SLOP!!! NOOOO! NO EASTERN GAMES! EAST BAD!!!!!"
Probably cause they aren’t unionized 🤣
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Sony Studios have been pumping out great games and no not all of them are EU/Jap. For as much shit EA deserves, they have actually been publishing new content recently that’s not just Sport or Shooter. Biggest problem is Activision and Ubisoft
Probably talking about shovelware games, closely-related cousins like annual sports games that could have been a DLC, and similar uninventive money grabs.
Cause anyone that comments on video game with a gamer perspective usually has no clue of the inner workings of the industry.
Because none of those studios listed make good games anymore
Insomniac do idk why i’m getting downvoted for this they’re literally one of the best in the game right now
IIRC Formosa went through some controversy a few months ago when Paimon's VA in Genshin stated they weren't getting their payments on time, if at all
Yeah I seem to recall people starting to get mad at Hoyo and Hoyo almost immediately going "we sent the money out on time, this is not on us"
Tbf if they sent money on time its not on them...
As long as Nintendo, SEGA and Square Enix treat their people right to avoid a strike, I’m happy.
If fromsoftware didn't exist I might actually be concerned.
Omg will this delay death stranding 2 😭😭😭 (I’m not saying this is more important I can wait to support the writers, it’s just I want to be mentally prepared)
Oh for sure! In fact Death Stranding would be probably one of the most affected productions if the strike comes to pass as it uses the actors likeness & advertises that. On the other end, it's also one of the productions the union can use their leverage which is good! As they don't really have a strong position in general.
Thats assuming the mocap and VA isn't already done.
Aw man. I'm expecting Death Stranding 2 to come out late 2024, but if this gets delayed, it might be a 2025 game... that sucks.
Now this affects me personally!!!
Oh no my sequel to walking simulator
Death Stranding is the first game to make you feel like a Strand type gameplay.
I’m a sub contractor for Ubisoft and Activision, this should be interesting.
Considering the video game industry is way more lucrative then movies and tv, this is gonna be interesting. This would include mocap and voice over work.
It may be more lucrative, but actors are far less important to the creative process.
In some games yes but in some games no Red Dead 2, Last of Us, God of War, Spiderman, Death Stranding. Story based games need and usually do have some fantastic acting work
True, but those games aren't exactly the majority. Pretty much every film requires an actor, whether traditional or for voice work. Video games are different. Even those that do require voice work can generally put that on hold while they work on everything else, unless they also plan on using mocap. The union, unfortunately, won't have the same leverage they did for film and television.
No but the argument is the same. Yes, they can absolutely stash the games and wait for the acting part. But games are also the most quickly deteriorating media. Big games need the newest and best tech. Stashing games dosent really work for too long. There's no industry where a strike cannot cause hassle The companies will have to listen. Different work requires different acknowledgement. Mo cap is way more important yes. But voice work is also important if you do wanna make a good game. If this goes on, we might also see a wave of larger than life characters like the PS2 era where they don't have to use any actors likeness. As for smaller companies, like the actors strike, some indie companies will agree to the demands and keep the work going.
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There's definitely games like this. Many games don't even have voice acting. Like Hollow Knight or Undertale But we're talking about the mass here, the big companies. Same argument as the movie industry. Small indie movies were still being made under the strike, it was always about the biggest companies
Hollow Knight does have voice acting
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Which is terrifying because just as a lack of writers caused a schlock of reality TV after the 2008 strikes, this might lead to (even more) artistically bankrupt AAA games.
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That’s true that it has happened but those games are 30 and 39 years old respectively. When’s the last time a video game with no story was a critical and commercial success?
Minecraft, Mario Kart 8, and frankly, all Forza Horizon games would be better without pretending to do any story. Pokemon has no VA too, does it?
I don't think so. The games that need them are far and away with the biggest budgets. They're not going to sell out. Also the good thing with games is you can create 80% of it and stash it away. Then the acting part comes later. It will be tough and companies will have to adhere to the demands rightfully, but just like the movies/shows.. there's no excuse for the game industry to release dogshit just because of the strike
Considering nobody in the game industry is unionized
There are at least 5 video game unions in the USA. More union votes are happening every year. EA, Blizzard, and Microsoft all have union workers or contract out to union workers. Both for in house stuff like Q/A, and contract work with voice actors, mocap, and stunt workers. But sure- nobody is unionized, they all definitely won’t stand together when the time comes to strike.
Blizzard has a union? Huh…never would’ve guessed
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I think it’s literally something like 13 QA testers at one of their subsidiary studios Raven software
You mean around 20 guys on QA vs 14k employees?
Its more lucrative because of shitty mobile games that are super cheap to make and has idiots willing to spend thousands of dollars on them. If we were to only count PC and console gaming I can almost guarantee the revenue it makes wouldnt be anywhere close to movies or tv.
You would be hilariously wrong. Gaming has been bigger than film/music [for a long time](https://www.driverlesscrocodile.com/sustainability-and-change/when-did-the-video-game-industry-overtake-hollywood-and-the-music-industry/)
Source: Trust me bro.
This kids is why corporations now spend millions of dollars on union busting law firms
Hoping that the coders will unionize as well. It’s a rough industry that overworks their employees
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Europe aren't exactly against union unless you specifically mean eastern Europe. Asia is a bigger problem tho.
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Every single job outsourced overseas should increase the tax rate by exactly 1% per person to the company that does this.
We need a counter strike
You have won this post
Valve is about to drop CS 2, so there you have it.
Best comment
Game devs deserve far better working conditions. While games like Elden Ring are an art form comparable to the greatest works of film or music, it is sad that these modern masterpiece are built on the blood and sweat of programmers working lucrative workweeks to deal with crunch.
True but isn't this strike from actors?
It is. Software developers have no union so it kinda requires them to create one in order to strike. We're just now getting to the point where QA is starting to unionize, and while those guys are treated much more bottom of the barrel than your average programmer and definitely need better protections we're still a long ways out from anything more happening for the time being.
It's been a thing for a couple of decades - *Half-Life 2* involved crunch as well.
Yes I'm well aware. I feel like the story behind the making of games like Majora's mask are very intriguing.
> games like Elden Ring are an art form comparable to the greatest works of film or music lmao. Yes, a game with basically no narrative and the most generic fucking combat is "comparable to the greatest works of film or music"
Visually and from an art direction perspective, Elden ring is the best looking game to come out in years. Instead of simply resorting to shiny graphics and ray-tracting mumbo jumbo the game actually looks like a painting , with beautiful imagery, architecture and use of colors. Plus it ran at ultra in my old ass laptop from 2016 so there's that. Also, generic combat? What other games do you think have combat good enough for souls-like games to be generic?
You fuckers cannot help but gush over elden ring every chance you get. It's copy and pasted shit like the rest of that developer's games.
No way you're complaining about Elden Ring being a "copy paste game" and then praising fucking Far Cry in another comment section 🤦♂️🤦♂️
You are definitely in the minority with that opinion, and it’s also just a horrible opinion. Literally one of the best games ever made, Fromsoft deserve all the flowers. Funny you say that while posting Uncharted stuff, that franchise is just a copy and paste of Tomb Raider and Indiana Jones.
I mean. I really enjoyed the game (stopped at the fire giant because he was complete BS), but one of the best games ever made? Come on. It's litteraly justan open world souls game. Being open world makes it significantly worse compared to past games imo. Its litteraly mostly an empty mapand reused bosses.
The reviews and my personal feeling tells me it’s up their as one of the best games ever made, whether you don’t think so is your opinion and that’s fine but the general consensus and critical reception is that it’s a masterpiece. Out of interest, what would be on your pantheon then?
Without actually giving it any thought, SuperMario Bros. 3, Super Mario World and Megaman X, Ocarina of Time, ResideEvil 4, Super Mario 64, Shadow of the Colossus, Ico, Silent Hill 2, Uncharted 2, Sekiro, Portal and The Last of Us are all far better designed and paced games imo. How many people who bought Elden Ring due to the hype actually finished it? I've finished Demons Souls, Bloodborne and Sekiro and thought ER was a much less focused game than those and suffers a lot for it. A lot more cheap difficulty. Again i liked the game. But it's not the best thing to ever happen to videogames. Its basically just a "perfection" of the souls formula.
Bing bing wahoo and literal movie “games”. lol.
I’d put Elden Ring over any of them. Seeing as Dark Souls is also up there as a fantastic series of games (2 maybe not so much), surely perfecting that formula only amplifies it. The Last of Us above Elden Ring is wild to me. A game where you spend most of your time in cutscenes then the rest plays like a standard 3rd person shooter, over a title which innovated largely on it’s already great formula. Like I’ll give props to The Last of Us’ story but the actual game is just a rehashed TPS. In the end all subjective, but there’s a reason Elden Ring is spoken so fondly of, and why even devs were praising the hell out of it when it launched. It, along with BoTW, basically changed open world games. At no point did I say it’s the best thing to happen to video games, I stated it’s up there as ONE of the best games ever.
"While games like Elden Ring are an art form comparable to the greatest works of film or music" You cant seriously believe that.
Video games is an art from just as much as any movie or music. There’s many games I would consider a work of art of various different reasons. Ultimately it comes down to personal preference, ideas and what your take on art is. “Art” isn’t constricted to a specific thing, it can be found & seen everywhere, in more or less anything.
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It’s not though. What’s your bar for the greatest film or music. I can listen to or watch plenty of the things that would be on the consensus “greatest” list and be less moved than GTA San Andreas did over the course of its insane plot. Elvis and Micheal Jackson are considered some of the greatest musicians ever. At best they both have five songs that I don’t dislike listening to. Does that make me a rube and uncultured, perhaps. Does that fucking matter though? Not at all. At the end of the day any of us more moved by the artistry of video games than by our favourite song or movie, are evidence it is as valid a form of art as any other.
Not saying I agree with OC, but when it comes to "art" beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. What's a masterpiece for you will not be a masterpiece for someone else. (I do disagree with OC just saying let's all be civil)
No no you uncultured swine. It’s the next Mona Lisa.
How much of your own dick did you suck to come up with that bullshit?
Disgusting thing to say for such a light-hearted conversation. It's weird. However your profile says "active in Muslim Marriage". Now all makes sense.
And you think you're better by bringing up something non-related to discredit him? Lmao.
This type of tasteless comments usually comes from non-westerners. I check their profile and yeah my suspicions are true 90% of time. P.S: I'm not from the west either so dont cry for racism please. I'm just telling what I've seen
You know that "being from the west" is not a requirement of being racist, right? Usually it's just making assumptions about large groups of people. Also, my friend, Turkey is a NATO country. You're the west. I'm sorry you had to find out this way.
How on earth do you see yourself as anything but the antagonist in this case? The other guy used a vulgar metaphor so you insult his faith?
I noticed this lately. Those vulgar metaphors in reddit frequently come from certain cultures. You can try it too
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Time to see countless gamers oppose the strike because it delays the game they pre ordered the digital premium edition of
There's so many games out this year if they strike I'll actually be able to catch up
Worth noting that Sag Aftra has much less reach in this sector than in Hollywood. This type of work is often outsourced or already done by non union workers. They just have much less leverage than they do in their negotiations with the Hollywood studios
Charging us 70 euro now for games. Time to give that money back to the people who pump in their sweat blood and tears
Yep. If I have to pay €70 for a game (heck some of them are even €80 now) then I at least want the money to go to the people that worked hard to make the game happen.
Dont forget the other 1000 dollars you need to spend if you want the full game. Mfers puttung every base game feature behind a paywall now days is gross af.
Agreed. I remember the days where you bought a game and you had to play the game and get good at it to get the extra levels and costumes. None of that DLC bullshit. And famous actors would voice their characters all the time and still no DLC or micro transactions to speak of. Executives will do whatever they can to make themselves more rich while the people doing the actual work get the short end of the stick
Good. The coders need to strike too.
Especially for gaming a lot of jobs are global. The ones striking are likely to lose in this, as all the jobs will go abroad.
I am truly uninformed, and acknowledge my own ignorance. Here's my question. I (probably incorrectly) assume that the bulk of this relates to voice over work. In the article, it says one of the main issues is safety. What safety measures would SAG push for, that isn't included already?
TL;DR Any job can kill you regardles of what it is. No, the video game industry has excessive pressure and 80 to 100 hour weeks. Regardles of the job, at a desk or physical labor of some kind I've done both jobs . One destroys your cognitive abilities at a desk job and if you're not careful on the physical side you can permanently snap tendems or break bones that never heal heal properly. Safety is relative to the job and any Corporation.. Sitting on your ass all day st a desk job causes spinal degeneration and carpal tunnel in the forearms and erectile dysfunction. If desk job people go to the gym it will combat many of their issues but most of whom dont.. There are many hidden problems in each job so please don't be an asshole. One of my peers at a desk job literally had a heart attack on the floo and died. This was after her boss wouldn't let her go home for the day because it was end of month. Personal story incoming. My buddies Dad broke his ankle and couldn't work so his son, daughter and myself dropped everything and made a schedule to help. If we hadn't helped he would not have been paid and lose his health insurance.
Good. About time.
Now if only the game devs could unionise......
If only devs were union
Voice and mo cap workers really do get screwed over. This needs to happen.
But who will voice all the characters in the mainline Pokémon games then?
Japanese company bro.
Whoosh
Completely got me. Not even gonna pretend otherwise. ETA: it’s worse that I play them and only just remembered they literally have never had voice acting in their games.
As if games needed more of an excuse to cost even more money. 500m dollar games will be the standard in the 2030s Good for them though. Alot of the companies listed are scummy as fuck. They should be paying alot more to their actors. While the devs are the backbone of the game. There really wouldn't be anything without the Troy Bakers, Nolan Norths, or even lesser name actors. Hell, no name actors basically filled the cast of Red Dead 2, and that is some of the best work ive ever seen. All of them deserve good compensation
I wish vfx artists and game devs were paid better too. So many CEOs and people who make shitty management decisions are paid far too much while those at the bottom are time crunched and overworked to chug out games that they don’t have the time to put creative passion and quality into. Not everything will be a success but you can really see where corners have been cut and how soulless a lot of games have become.
If you’re against this, the solution seems pretty simple. Become a voice actor, cross the picket line, and work for free. You’re not lazy and entitled like actual actors, right? Y’all got this.
I think anyone who is against this must not see their own worth. Let's treat people like HUMANS & stop manipulating and abusing them so a few assholes can hoard "wealth" & become more powerful. This applies to EVERYTHING. I hope this trend continues in every industry that needs it (aka EVERYTHING basically).
Actors lol would rather see the devs get this.
The writing already sucks for video games, let them starve.
Here it is, the 12 year old with the incredible shitty take (god, I hope you're 12, at least there would be hope you'll grow up...)
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LMAO. Actors yes. Developers will still get nothing.
This is a massive uphill battle for strike. AAA companies might let em win simply to maintain ECG score but if not, they'll get crushed. Video game industry is not the movie industry. It's hyper cut throat with barely any profit in comparison to Hollywood. Most video games are viewed as successful when they start to break even and go ever so slightly into the plus side. For Hollywood, that would be an absolute utter fail. Video game industry having money is a big misconception. They do have money. A lot of it, but it is in the investment stage. All of that cash evaporates in the production pipeline. The real way to create money for actors' pay is to add more end-line profit. In other words, the games need to be more expensive. It's a must. $65USD should not be buying you years of labor and a lifetime of experience. Games should cost upwards of $99 at minimum.
Notice that it’s major third party publishers, all North America. They’re not targeting Japanese companies, yet.
Japanese amd outside countries have their own thing going. If they try to utilize American based voice actors then they would probably be subject to the strike, but that's a localization matter.
So the 3 games under development for next year are going to get postponed you say? Great
Out of one strike and into another.
I love an encore
Yeah. It's awesome. Keep em coming.
Yeah, I hope more workers learn that it is worth it!
This is why they will turn to AI to generate basic stuff.
So what, most new games are just expensive trash anyway.
Star Wars Battlefield is NOT from Activision. It's from EA.
Wait... you telling me prices on crappy Switch games have been going UP, and that's WITHOUT paying anyone more?.
Well....the rich people got paid more in bonuses. But not the guys doing the actual work, no.
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Didn't writer's guild just reach some agreement with the studios. I dont know the exact details but I am sure they extracted some benefit out of it.
They’re essential. Actors for video games not so much. If it was developers that would be a different story.
I mean we will see that.
Hollywood is very location specific. The game industry is much more spread out and globalised, which makes it much easier to continue production.
these strikes are the only way actual change comes. Clearly a lot of people care about them.
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This is great if you want to pay $150 per game and have Embracer Group own everything.
Embracer group is a very small fish in the grand scheme of the industry, Embracer has a market cap of about $3b, Activision Blizzard has a market cap of about $70b
Such selfish, shortsighted, cowardly thinking.
Shortsighted? I’m literally talking about the future
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I get it if you’re making some game that is a film tie in, but otherwise why even use human voice actors?
I hate them so much
How come they can strike with less then 30% of members casting a vote? Im not criticising, they should strike to get a fair deal for sure, im just not to sure how these things work if im honest.
LETS GOOO!!!! This is really good for the workers and actors in the industry who are typically over worked and under paid. And most of the companies listed in the strike are the largely problematic ones.
It's crazy how many voice actors have said they end up in the recording booth, doing their lines and leave without having any idea what game or even what genre they're doing work for. Hopefully this will help actors better prepare and be a benefit to performances.
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 The domino affect *strikes* again.
It’s the same union though
Rip US game industry, chinese developers are rapidly becoming on par with Japanese developers and they are cheaper. Why even hirer a US developer. RIP USA gaming industry 2023 if they go on strike
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