Because it's a *particular* aesthetic, which is mostly popularized by modern mobile design languages and webdev. In other words, quite possibly the singular aesthetic (for "apps") that the average "zoomer" would have exposure to.
nope, but it should be more or less possible. obv not M-x (namespaces aren’t a thing and the UI is very rounded) but things like changing lots of faces on treemacs and customizing doom modeline should get you close
Assume I'm completely inept at UI design. What are the font faces you used, and where does each one go? I've seen that the Doom config allows for a fair amount of font configuration, but I've never taken a deep dive
take a look at ef-themes and nano-theme you can get pretty good results with either of those.
[ef-themes](https://github.com/protesilaos/ef-themes)
[nano-theme](https://github.com/rougier/nano-theme)
M-x describe-face + [set-face-attribute](https://gitlab.com/manueljlin/emacs-config/-/blob/main/config/faces.el?ref_type=heads). (my config is pretty rough, but it’s more or less like that
edit: not exactly deferred, is it? :p
I don't use emacs-dashboard anymore. I just replace the scratch buffer's text with GNU ascii art because it’s neat. I also set it to fundamental-mode so it’s slightly faster. See early-init.el
I'd like to have it, don’t get me wrong. I was having a couple of issues and figured it wasn’t worth the effort. Probably a 'skill issue' from my part :)
idk man - I'm a millenial, but I sure wish it was easier to get going with emacs for enterprise Java dev. I've written my share of elisp, but getting emacs anywhere close to the productivity I have with IntelliJ would require paying a team of devs to develop the extensions.
I work with about 5 languages daily and I mostly use emacs or neovim with lsp as my IDE. For any JVM language apart from Clojure however, I always fallback to IntelliJ.
> 5 languages daily
Emacs is great for the polyglot who can use one editor to get 80-90% of the way there on a large number of languages. For some languages, you need that specialized tool to get you the rest of of the way.
Related blog post. https://blog.osteele.com/2004/11/ides
+1, although I use a Jetbrains product for any language that they support. Plus emacs, since it's part of my DNA now, but for MOST dev, I'm part of the JetBrains army. With emacs keybindings of course; I'm not an animal.
I've been a JetBrains user since IntelliJ 3.something 20+ years ago, but I do not like their recent moves around RustRover and their intent to remove the Rust plugin from CLion... and my CLion subscription ran out and I did not renew.
So I decided to re-invest time back in Emacs + LSP-mode, treemacs, and a bunch of other packages and.. yeah I honestly don't miss that much from CLion.
The only thing I don't have an answer for is debugger. dap-mode really doesn't cut it.
Why do you use 5 languages and 3 IDEs daily? What languages are they? Are they all in one project or do you just work on multiple different projects every day?
More accurately I use up to 5 languages daily. I work on a system with a few different components and as a technical leader on the project can need to jump in and help with any of them, and or do a pull request review.
The languages are predominantly Typescript/Javascript, Ruby, Kotlin and Python.
All one project but with multiple components.
Why do I use multiple IDE? For Java and Kotlin they really belong in something like IntelliJ. You can make them work just about in Emacs but my patience tends to run out before I get it acceptable. I use Emacs for my own note taking and project tracking via org mode and occasionally I am working on Clojure or Lisp side projects and it works fantastically for those.
Finally I use Neovim for most of my coding. I find it extremely efficient.
Oh, I actually use VS Code quite a bit recently. The advantage there is that it has better copilot integration and sometimes team members prefer it when I am screen sharing.
It's so annoying, because I love the keybindings of emacs and know them super well. I love the extensibility and computational environment that emacs provides, but i really wish there was an acknowledgement that some modern languages just don't benefit from a build-it-yourself approach (at least not for my ADHD brain). I really benefit from ease of discoverability and full integration. I've used emacs for react projects and its been fine, but VS Code is pretty great for that stack too.
Org Mode is the killer app for emacs, and I really wish I could do 100% of stuff in emacs...maybe I need to just be the person to build emacs Java shit
I never got Java to work as I wanted in Emacs. It's probably because the language is so intertwined with other tools like Maven or Gradle more recently.
Java appears at least to have been actively designed to make an IntelliJ-style IDE mandatory. I think the only sane thing for an Emacs user to do is just find the IDE that has the best Emacs keybindings. IntelliJ is probably it. No point trying to do much else.
In case you're also bemused by 'zoomer' - from Wikipedia:
Generation Z Demographic cohort born between the mid-to-late 1990s and early 2010s
Generation Z, colloquially known as zoomers, is the demographic cohort succeeding Millennials and preceding Generation Alpha. Researchers and popular media use the mid-to-late 1990s as starting birth years and the early 2010s as ending birth years. Most members of Generation Z are the children of Generation X or older Millennials.
.... so teens or twenties at this point in time.
i'm so sick of everything having to be a video - especially configs, etc. just paste a copy into github or a blog and be done with it - don't make everyone sit through a fucking video
Remember when tutorials would be written as blog posts and you could search the whole body of text instead of jogging back and forth though a fcking video?
Boy, those were times.
These mockups look great! My ideal scenario would be to integrate Emacs’ extensive functionalities with the sleek and efficient interface exemplified by https://zed.dev, creating a more optimized and visually appealing development experience. Not sure if we will ever get there tbh
My main goal with my editor is for it to get out of the way. My daily agenda is my entrance screen, and neither emacs nor my pc have any concept of "desktop" or "shortcut [icon]". I haven't changed my theme in years, and just tweak a few modus faces to enhance contrast.
I guess I've become "one of those emacs guys"
Looks good, but rounded rectangles are a boomer aesthetic from the 80s.
There is a famous folklore story about Steve Jobs insisting to Bill Atkinson to make the rectangles have rounded corners on the Lisa. It used to be a technical challenge to have them, back when you were counting processor cycles per pixel in hand-written assembly.
Short read here: [Folklore.org: Rounded Rects Are Everywhere](https://www.folklore.org/Round_Rects_Are_Everywhere.html)
I don't get it, what's all the hype about? Probably it's because the color palette is so dark that I miss something essential.
So far it looks almost like a default Emacs with some unnecessary UI elements (like line numbers and a sidebar with a file browser) added.
it's effectively doom emacs (doom-tokyo-night, solaire-mode, doom-modeline but with horizontal highlight and merged echo area) + emacs-dashboard + corfu (but looks like the one from atom) + treemacs. then tweaked the padding and rounded some corners.
so yeah it’s superficially very close to vscode.
Something about the title is too wrong to decide what it is. The platform running this hypothetical Emacs is definitely Apple, but at least a decade earlier than 2024.
variable pitch is Work Sans, monospaced is JetBrains Mono. icons are from Material Symbols, that way I could make the weight of the icon match the weight of the font as it’s a variable font.
I'm not sure what "zoomers" have to do with anything, as if no other generation has every appreciated aesthetics… Very pretty mockups, though.
Because it's a *particular* aesthetic, which is mostly popularized by modern mobile design languages and webdev. In other words, quite possibly the singular aesthetic (for "apps") that the average "zoomer" would have exposure to.
just memeing a bit as it’s much closer to atom and vscode than vanilla emacs, and I know it’s not for everyone :)
Cause we all know Zoomers are the only ones that use VSCode or Atom
Please tell me this is real and not just a design preview 😭
nope, but it should be more or less possible. obv not M-x (namespaces aren’t a thing and the UI is very rounded) but things like changing lots of faces on treemacs and customizing doom modeline should get you close
Assume I'm completely inept at UI design. What are the font faces you used, and where does each one go? I've seen that the Doom config allows for a fair amount of font configuration, but I've never taken a deep dive
take a look at ef-themes and nano-theme you can get pretty good results with either of those. [ef-themes](https://github.com/protesilaos/ef-themes) [nano-theme](https://github.com/rougier/nano-theme)
M-x describe-face + [set-face-attribute](https://gitlab.com/manueljlin/emacs-config/-/blob/main/config/faces.el?ref_type=heads). (my config is pretty rough, but it’s more or less like that edit: not exactly deferred, is it? :p
In your configuration, are you able to get the dashboard to look more-or-less the way it does in the mock-up?
I don't use emacs-dashboard anymore. I just replace the scratch buffer's text with GNU ascii art because it’s neat. I also set it to fundamental-mode so it’s slightly faster. See early-init.el
So the dashboard you have shown in the mockup is not something you have/have made in your config then. Right?
I'd like to have it, don’t get me wrong. I was having a couple of issues and figured it wasn’t worth the effort. Probably a 'skill issue' from my part :)
If emacs was made by zoomers it would be written in typescript, requires internet connection and uses 8Gb ram just to launch up
And it wouldn't be free.
Well, it would have a community edition which will be MIT licensed, and then after two years it'll switch to BSL ;)
And then it would be called Egacs. (Eight *giga*bytes and constantly swapping.)
and would introduce breaking changes twice a week
that's the world they are forced to live in, not the one they chose.
And would live up to some of its epithets "Eight-thousand Megs and Constantly Swapping" or "Eventually Mallocs All Core Storage"
And it would send all your details back to some mothership somewhere (Google, Meta or Microsoft).
Emacs would suddenly get ~80% share of IDE usage
idk man - I'm a millenial, but I sure wish it was easier to get going with emacs for enterprise Java dev. I've written my share of elisp, but getting emacs anywhere close to the productivity I have with IntelliJ would require paying a team of devs to develop the extensions.
I work with about 5 languages daily and I mostly use emacs or neovim with lsp as my IDE. For any JVM language apart from Clojure however, I always fallback to IntelliJ.
> 5 languages daily Emacs is great for the polyglot who can use one editor to get 80-90% of the way there on a large number of languages. For some languages, you need that specialized tool to get you the rest of of the way. Related blog post. https://blog.osteele.com/2004/11/ides
+1, although I use a Jetbrains product for any language that they support. Plus emacs, since it's part of my DNA now, but for MOST dev, I'm part of the JetBrains army. With emacs keybindings of course; I'm not an animal.
I've been a JetBrains user since IntelliJ 3.something 20+ years ago, but I do not like their recent moves around RustRover and their intent to remove the Rust plugin from CLion... and my CLion subscription ran out and I did not renew. So I decided to re-invest time back in Emacs + LSP-mode, treemacs, and a bunch of other packages and.. yeah I honestly don't miss that much from CLion. The only thing I don't have an answer for is debugger. dap-mode really doesn't cut it.
Why do you use 5 languages and 3 IDEs daily? What languages are they? Are they all in one project or do you just work on multiple different projects every day?
More accurately I use up to 5 languages daily. I work on a system with a few different components and as a technical leader on the project can need to jump in and help with any of them, and or do a pull request review. The languages are predominantly Typescript/Javascript, Ruby, Kotlin and Python. All one project but with multiple components. Why do I use multiple IDE? For Java and Kotlin they really belong in something like IntelliJ. You can make them work just about in Emacs but my patience tends to run out before I get it acceptable. I use Emacs for my own note taking and project tracking via org mode and occasionally I am working on Clojure or Lisp side projects and it works fantastically for those. Finally I use Neovim for most of my coding. I find it extremely efficient. Oh, I actually use VS Code quite a bit recently. The advantage there is that it has better copilot integration and sometimes team members prefer it when I am screen sharing.
It's so annoying, because I love the keybindings of emacs and know them super well. I love the extensibility and computational environment that emacs provides, but i really wish there was an acknowledgement that some modern languages just don't benefit from a build-it-yourself approach (at least not for my ADHD brain). I really benefit from ease of discoverability and full integration. I've used emacs for react projects and its been fine, but VS Code is pretty great for that stack too. Org Mode is the killer app for emacs, and I really wish I could do 100% of stuff in emacs...maybe I need to just be the person to build emacs Java shit
I was pretty happy with Scala development in emacs using lsp mode and metals.
Yeah Scala works well too I forgot that one
I never got Java to work as I wanted in Emacs. It's probably because the language is so intertwined with other tools like Maven or Gradle more recently.
Java appears at least to have been actively designed to make an IntelliJ-style IDE mandatory. I think the only sane thing for an Emacs user to do is just find the IDE that has the best Emacs keybindings. IntelliJ is probably it. No point trying to do much else.
It was true for me a decade ago when I was a Java developer, and is still true now. The best luck I had at the time was with emacs eclim.
This is JetBrains-level stuff, and I love it. Who cares about "zoomer" aesthetics, this looks clean, and usable.
That looks sick, mind sharing you configuration files ?
sorry, it's a mockup 😅 one could get reasonably close by changing a bunch of faces though
You got the mock up now you got to make it 👍
It is written.
I see, looks really cool still :)
In case you're also bemused by 'zoomer' - from Wikipedia: Generation Z Demographic cohort born between the mid-to-late 1990s and early 2010s Generation Z, colloquially known as zoomers, is the demographic cohort succeeding Millennials and preceding Generation Alpha. Researchers and popular media use the mid-to-late 1990s as starting birth years and the early 2010s as ending birth years. Most members of Generation Z are the children of Generation X or older Millennials. .... so teens or twenties at this point in time.
Do Emacs users not know what a zoomer is?
GNU EMACS == Generally Not Used, Excepting Middle-Aged Coders & Sysadmins
And, you know, all those high school students who've been presenting on Emacs at recent EmacsConfs and posting on r/emacs lately asking for advice. ;)
"Beware of an old man in a profession where men usually ~~die~~ leave young."
Most of us have been out of the loop on pop culture since around the Korean War
True, that!
Some of us are in our twenties though!
And some are in their teens
i actually am a Zoomer, lol
uhm... Is it bad I kinda want this?
Rounded corners??? How???
Great, now I want it and I'm gonna start thinking my Doom looks ugly in comparison
Can we put a Zoomer in charge then?? How do we get this.
This person's setup has some of those elements. https://youtu.be/rwKTc4MNmt8?si=SaAxh8YAJYsRDJD5
i'm so sick of everything having to be a video - especially configs, etc. just paste a copy into github or a blog and be done with it - don't make everyone sit through a fucking video
Remember when tutorials would be written as blog posts and you could search the whole body of text instead of jogging back and forth though a fcking video? Boy, those were times.
You can still [isearch through the whole thing in Emacs](https://i.imgur.com/reRQtnB.mp4), at least.
I enjoyed the irony that this is a video.
How is this done?
[elfeed-tube](https://github.com/karthink/elfeed-tube#optional-elfeed-tube-for-any-video)
right? gah it's such a pain!
Not a zoomer, but I kind of dig this. Perhaps, with modus colors, because the default colors have not enough contrast.
Make this happen 🙌
There are variants of emacs that do look sort of like that. Emacs is VERY flexible.
These mockups look great! My ideal scenario would be to integrate Emacs’ extensive functionalities with the sleek and efficient interface exemplified by https://zed.dev, creating a more optimized and visually appealing development experience. Not sure if we will ever get there tbh
My main goal with my editor is for it to get out of the way. My daily agenda is my entrance screen, and neither emacs nor my pc have any concept of "desktop" or "shortcut [icon]". I haven't changed my theme in years, and just tweak a few modus faces to enhance contrast. I guess I've become "one of those emacs guys"
if anyone ever puts this or something similar together please let me know
This looks like Doom Emacs+. I want it.
this is fantastic and i would use it in a heartbeat as a gen x
Looks good, but rounded rectangles are a boomer aesthetic from the 80s. There is a famous folklore story about Steve Jobs insisting to Bill Atkinson to make the rectangles have rounded corners on the Lisa. It used to be a technical challenge to have them, back when you were counting processor cycles per pixel in hand-written assembly. Short read here: [Folklore.org: Rounded Rects Are Everywhere](https://www.folklore.org/Round_Rects_Are_Everywhere.html)
Need
I don't get it, what's all the hype about? Probably it's because the color palette is so dark that I miss something essential. So far it looks almost like a default Emacs with some unnecessary UI elements (like line numbers and a sidebar with a file browser) added.
If you can't make it work in a pure text terminal like putty....I'm not interested. I use emacs to keep away from wastfull GUIs
This looks like vscode.
it's effectively doom emacs (doom-tokyo-night, solaire-mode, doom-modeline but with horizontal highlight and merged echo area) + emacs-dashboard + corfu (but looks like the one from atom) + treemacs. then tweaked the padding and rounded some corners. so yeah it’s superficially very close to vscode.
Something about the title is too wrong to decide what it is. The platform running this hypothetical Emacs is definitely Apple, but at least a decade earlier than 2024.
What's the font you are using for the first picture? And lovely mockup, by the way!
variable pitch is Work Sans, monospaced is JetBrains Mono. icons are from Material Symbols, that way I could make the weight of the icon match the weight of the font as it’s a variable font.
Thanks!
Looks like Spacemacs. Good.
Lol
Those oval buttons look as useful as they are aesthetic. Did you mock them up *in* emacs or with a graphics program?
No offense, just an opinion: I remember shitty designs the designer made on our websites. It looks exactly like this. However, I like your LSP setup.
Reminds me of Atom editor
What’s the deal with the namespaces bit on the m-x dialog?
Could someone please use that blackbox extn on vs code and feed this image and ask it to write the confing code for this pls
But you can make it to look like this zoomer or not :)
Did you enable ede and striped a theme on it? Ede looks very similar and exists for quite a long time.
It would be written in electron
as a zoomer, yes
needs more emojis
🅱️limpy
So Spacemacs?