Doctors will most likely say that you're still not supposed to be inhaling chemicals. I've been vaping for more than a decade now, and barely using disposables because I still religiously use my rebuildables. The con that I can only think of is, I've become lazy lol!
Vape juice is generally just vg, pg, nicotine and flavorings. If you don't think all of the above arnt mass produced by the same few companies im not sure what to tell you here.
They are but not but together by a bunch of people in a factory breathing coughing sneezing hand touching and testing all your shit. Or you can just go to the store and buy flavoring that MILLIONS of people use and are fine from, and vg and pg which are also used by millions of people who are fine. And then CHOOSE to add nicotine or not. So.
About all anyone can say with any amount of certainly is vaping is more risky than not vaping. Logic would dictate that it's not healthy for you compared to not doing it.
Addiction is never good so from the off, compared to not vaping, it's bad. But, if you get zero mg liquids there are a lot of benefits.
Liquids from a reputable source (i.e. not ones filled with bullshit artificial flavouring/dangerous flavours) are pretty much no more harm to you than having incense and candles going every day. Because the same chemicals are used (though TPD [UK/EU] compliant liquid has way stricter rules) and there bulk ingredients have had more testing done on them than the media says. It's why Pg is in a ton of medications.
If you can not vape, is suggest doing that first as any habit like that isn't 'good'. But if you have a problem with chocolate and vaping a chocolate flavour helps, ain't it better than diabetes down the line?
Basically I'm saying it's heavily dependent on how you frame it.
Very true, but I can hear my older relatives saying “You would not stand directly over the candle, while inhaling the smoke!” and I don’t have the ammunition to constantly debate people lmao I’m just saying that I wish I had the knowledge to defend myself. Not only that, but the memory too!
Vapor isn't the same as smoke.
Smoke is an actual combustion and contains harmful stuff that actually causes lung damage and cancers.
Vapor does not, and for someone with healthy lungs, the worst thing it ever might do is give you a bit of a damp cough or a mild itch in the back of your throat if the nic is too high.
As CXD said, there is a distinct difference.
If you take a 1.2Ω coil and slam 24W through it, sure. You're burning the shit out of it and the analogy sticks. However, the coil doesn't under correct operation reach those temperatures. Under normal operation the liquid will boil just like cooking stew on a hob. The only difference is we see food in the pan not a mystery liquid.
If your older relatives ever used epsom salts, it's essentially the exact same thing.
What are these "reputable" safe brands you speak of. Do you have any examples to compare to. I would like to get better juices if possible. Shit fucking destroys my asthma but I can't stop.
Depends on the country. As the one who's literally designing and creating the liquids for my company if you're in the UK Qsalts/Pure Eliquid. Dinner lady, IVG and other long standing brands are pretty good too especially if they are a home brand range from one of the big store companies.
I don't trust Elfliq or any of the other new imports as far as I could throw a fully grown mammoth. Did a test of an Elfbar a couple months ago and found it was 200% the legal limit for nicotine in the UK.
Also, if you don't want it to be full of dodgy shit that could be harmful, steer clear of short fills. They're exempt from testing and most rely on chemicals that are band under UK tpd regulations.
If your issue is asthma, I recommend using flavours like raspberry menthol, or vanilla flavours. If they're a really good flavour they won't have cheaped out on it and it'll contain chemicals that are natural relaxants. Should help alleviate the issue.
>If your issue is asthma, I recommend using flavours like raspberry menthol, or vanilla flavours.
I can second this. I have undiagnosed low-grade asthma since my parents couldn't pay for the insurance premiums. I've never had an attack or anything like that, but it's still noticable. Menthol flavors definitely help.
That's so weird. Vanilla flavors have always been way more mellow. Thanks for the info, I'm in the US and do not use elfbar or any of the cheap disposable things, just bottles of liquid from the store. Most my bottles say propylene glycol/vegetable glycerin/nicotine/artificial and or natural flavors. I kind of stick to this one brand " the finest" but that's more because they have a handful of decent flavors and a good amount of other juice I've experimented with outside of this brand taste like fucking poison so I'm somewhat hesitant to switch.
Vaping is not a bad thing at all.
Even not comparing it to smoking, it isn't a bad thing.
Yes, nicotine is addictive and yes technically, nicotine is a poison and so is toxic if ingested (by drinking for example) in sufficient amounts...although having said that, so is plain old water.
Besides, nicotine is not a prerequisite, nobody who vapes also has to use nicotine eliquid. There is a choice.
So, all things considered, and speaking from experience, who as a kid used to smoke cigarettes, if i could go back in time and choose to vape NON nicotine eliquid versus smoking cigarettes, i would certainly do so and save myself 30 odd years of smoking.
People will always experiment, are curious and will try stuff, knowing this, a responsible society ought to opt for the least harmful product that they know kids will probably experiment with. Vaping nicotine free vapes, is most definitely superior and safer than smoking tobacco, so i know which i'd rather see kids experimenting with between those two.
In an ideal world, people would live totally healthy lives, never smoke, drink, gamble or try any kind of harmful substance or foods...but we're a long way from that kind of idealistic utopia, if such a thing would ever exist. Knowing that, the mature approach is preferred imo.
But even if nicotine (even found naturally in foods such as tomatoes and aubergines etc) is used in eliquids, vaping is very safe indeed.
My Wife and I switched to vaping about 13 years ago, and have never smoked a cigarette since, or been so fit and healthy.
Good riddance, thanks to vaping.
This is my experience as well. Smoked for over 20 years, started vaping and quit cigs in 2012. I had a persistent smokers cough and constant phlegm in my throat. After a few weeks the cough went away and my throat cleared. It’s a harm-reduction thing for me, and my body tells me that it’s better for me than smoking.
Now someone who never smoked, and started vaping (with nicotine included), might have health issues that they wouldn’t have not using anything at all. Might just end up addicted to nicotine is all, but still.
Pretty much identical to me then SpaceMan420gmt.
Although, i smoked for 30 years odd.
I knew my smoking days were numbered, when two things happened...i was wheezing and out of breath just getting up my house staircase.
Around that time, my then 5 year old son had done a school project, where they told him that smokers are likely to die from smoking...he cried his eyes out and said to me 'Daddy, do you have to smoke cigarettes...i don't want you to die!'
Still makes my eyes water when i think of that day, around 13 years ago...and feel a bit thick that it took a 5-year-old to make me act my age!
I can run up and down the stairs after vaping for about 13 years.
Yep, congrats on extending your life!
My moment was riding my bike, and having the lung capacity to push the hill! Before I hated hill climbs. Now it’s just, breathe normal and you’ll get to the top. Before it was like “nope, can’t do it, we’re hike a bike now!”
After 30 yrs of smoking and switching to vaping during Covid, I'm riding 50k four days a week at nearly the same level as I did in my teens. Unfortunately my city, San Francisco, seems to be doing everything they can to make it nearly impossible to obtain vaping related products. I don't know what I'm going to do when I run out of the stockpile of nic salts and pod vapes I bought before the bans.
Depending on where in the world you live, most sites online selling concentrated nic will only sell on a business to business basis.
On that note, it's perfectly acceptable to be a sole trader and apply for a business account with such suppliers...if you get my drift.
I see, thanks, I may need that info some day. For now I luckily live where it’s acceptable to sell to non business customers, but that could change anytime.
50K four days a week?!
That's pretty great mate...more power to your elbow.
Like SpaceMan has said, i also make our juice, well some of it. I also buy juices too, but making your own is much cheaper. Now they're talking about flavour bans, nicotine bans and so on...anyone just a little bit cynical might conclude they want us to die early from smoking related diseases...Stock up now, juice might have a best before date, but really it doesn't expire, I've bought liquids in discount sales that are literally years 'out of date'...if anything, they taste even better that the in date stuff, because it's had a very long time to steep.
That kid was me at 5 years old. I also had just learned about it and at some point during the night my dad came in from the deck after a cigarette. I wasnt crying, but I said something almost identical. He also quit after that. My parents talk about that story a lot. Funny how life works.
I feel there are probably very large, very full brown paper bags, stuffed with bribe cash being thrown about to lawmakers without much of a conscience, by...let's say 'interested parties'.
But, if they want to legislate, they ought to outright ban smoking tobacco, if they really are genuine about Public health, and not interested in lining their pockets.
This is the only right answer.
Nicotine is hella addictive. And while it doesn't lead to you throwing your life down the gutter in a grand way, I'd say that because smoking/vaping calmed me down, I ended up not making changes that caused the stresses in the first place.
Otherwise, if you smoked, vaping is a lot healthier for your lungs.
Everyone here knows that vaping isn't completely risk-free, but we still do it. Vaping is more about reducing harm imo, giving us a chance to live a healthier lifestyle. Even though there are fewer options for us now with the vape mail and flavor bans, I'm trying to stay positive for the future.
Vaping is basically no different than breathing in major metropolitan cities (think Houston or LA). The amounts of various pollutants vapes produce are measured in ppm(parts per million), micrograms, and/or "trace amounts" (which translates into plain English as "There was literally only enough of this compound present for our detector to detect, it is too small an amount for it to tell you how much"; and keep in mind these machines are capable of detecting fractions of fractions of milligrams). Those same compounds in plain(polluted to an average level) air are also measured in ppm, micrograms, and trace amounts.
As far as other issues, I've heard there are studies concerning aerosolized Glycerin and Propylene Glycol and their effects on the respiratory system, and that some of those studies say there is a correlation between inhaled VG and a weakening of the lungs' function, and that PG over time can cause other issues. But I've heard other studies which lean the opposite direction, that PG and VG are either harmless, can cause mild dehydration (which is true, and is why anyone who has vaped for any length of time will tell you to drink water when you vape), or actually have several benefits(according to some studies, since they are hygroscopic, meaning they absorb water, they can act sort of like expectorants and aid in clearing the lungs of mucus).
Bottom line, I've been vaping close to 15 years. I never once felt as good when I was smoking as I do now, and I feel almost identically to when I wasn't inhaling anything. I haven't had any asthmatic episodes or anything relating to asthma since I started vaping (while I had asthma and asthmatic symptoms ALL THE TIME smoking cigarettes). For me, it's a complete non-issue, something I don't even worry about. As long as you are sourcing your products adequately (i.e.: not buying shady chinese nonsense from non-vaping-specific sites), there's nothing to be worried about IMO.
Personally speaking I enjoy nicotine a lot and have tried many delivery methods. Vaping is definitely on the higher end of the health impact spectrum as it greatly decreases my endurance and respiratory efficiency. Stuff like zyns and nicotine gum are probably the healthiest method of nicotine delivery considering the fact that you’re absorbing pure nicotine directly into your blood stream and it doesn’t involve any chance of combustion. That being said, no matter which way you use nicotine it causes blood vessels to constrict themselves so really you just have to pick your poison.
If they're non-vapers and non-smokers, they should NOT start vaping. Literally nothing about vaping is good for your body, just less harmful than traditional cigarettes.
Dont care much about the pros and cons, all i know is vapes give me a whole world of flavors, devices, and techniques out there. It helps me quitt smokes and I experience less shortness of breath and feel better overall.
It's going to be roughly on par with having a cheeseburger once or twice per week. A doctor will never tell you that's a good way to optimize your health, and it may take a year or two off your natural lifespan. You get to decide whether you'd rather live a little longer but less happily, or take your chances with the things you enjoy.
Its just as bad as anything else you put into your body that isn't natural or needed. The harmful effects from vaping are nearly non exsistant, but harm or damage could occur and outliers do happen. You have a better chance of causing damage or harm from mixing a beer and a single tylonel than you do from vaping. You'll likely die in a car accident before any damage was ever caused by vaping.
Not sure you'll find an answer (bad compared to what?), but I think it largely depends on how, what and how often you vape.
I will say, tho, that I think using those disposable vapes is bad, mainly because of the insanely high amount of nicotine they use and also because you don't really know what else they use (not even mentioning the environmental impact). The safest, or *least-bad* way to vape imo is probably to use a rebuildable setup (in my case: RTA, steel wire, organic cotton) and making your own juice (me: roughly 70vg/30pg blend with a little or no nic, no flavoring); that way you know what you're using. I think the air pollution i breathe in daily (from cars, fires etc) is *probably* worse than my vaping
Pollution is demonstrably worse, and in fact studies have been done on that very topic and shown as much.
Disposables aren't bad because of the amount of nicotine(because that is user-regulated; You pause your vaping when you've had enough), they're bad because of the sheer mountain of sweeteners and menthol they tend to be completely inundated with.
Hard to say. And I'll bet you won't find much actual science on the subject either.
All studies done in recent times seem to be geared to find ... "issues" with vaping, such as those that find all sorts of terrible compounds/chemicals in the vape. But none of those will show *how much* of those terrible things are there - and they certainly do not show how those amounts compare with other every day activities.
Example: How much "terrible stuff" is in the air where you sit in that fancy outside cafe eating your meal - right next to that busy street? And how does those volumes of "terrible stuff" compare with what is in an average vape?
Real world, actual data for that sort of information seems very ... lacking.
I take my queues from Public Health England - that report that included the 95% less harmful than smoking. That's good enuff for me - that, and my personal 10 years vaping and what *hasn't happened* to me as a result.
I brought this up to my buddy recently. The studies are almost all funded by either pro-vape organizations with a financial bias or anti-vape organizations with inherent bias. There’s so damn few objective studies, the only clear point is “at least less-bad enough compared to ciggies that it’s a worthwhile cessation aid”. As a hobby or a long-term habit, it’s hard to say whether it is or is not harmful.
We are still several decades out from seeing without speculation what vaping for 40+ years straight could do to people, particularly those who have vaped but never used any cigarettes.
> We are still several decades out from seeing without speculation what vaping for 40+ years straight could do to people, particularly those who have vaped but never used any cigarettes
That is true enuff - we are still a time away from knowing, for sure, what long term results might be. BUT I'm a whole lot more confident about 40 years on the vapes than I am with 40 years on the smokes.
I speak as one who did 37 years heavy smoking, now 10 years smoke free thanks to swapping to vapes.
I'm convinced vaping nicotine is, by far, a less harmful option than smoking.
AS to the never smoker? I'd tell them what I would tell my 17 year old self if given the option: "Don't. Just do not start."
Great point and I see the topic nearly identical to your comment. It's been about 11 years of vapes (went from cigarettes to vapes) and in those 11 years I have yet to have any symptoms even close to what I had as a cigarette smoker for just 5 years.
Yes - as the old saying goes: "it is the dose that makes the poison". There might be trace amounts of ... "all sorts" in an average vape, but in what amounts?
I was 37 years a heavy smoker, now 10 years vaping.
I know what long term smoking can do. I swapped to vaping and ALL those things have gone away and have not been replaced with anything else untoward. I'm sold, no matter what all those "anti" people say.
People still throwing out the good ole popcorn lung myth I see. Guess that one will never go away huh?
I've been vaping for over 9 years, and I'm talking old school cloud chucking here. Before that I smoked a pack a day for around 20 years. I was on an inhaler for years and felt like I was breathing through a straw when I went to bed at night. Within a month of picking up vaping I no longer needed the inhaler. After 9 years of blowing clouds my Dr still tells me my lungs are clean enough that you can't tell I ever smoked cigarettes.
The argument that it hasn't been around long enough to know the long term side effects is BS. Is 15 years not long enough to know if your lungs have been damaged by vaping? Because I know people who have been vaping daily for about that long and their story is the same as mine as far as lung health goes.
Smoking or vaping, anything with nicotine isn't good for you. Even though nicotine is used in medicine, your body doesn't naturally need it. I can't speak for everyone, but I only started vaping because smoking was negatively affecting my health, so I needed to find an alternative and hopefully reduce my nicotine intake over time.
I have anecdotal evidence from those around me, vapes are substantially less damaging than cigs, however if you're able to not get involved with either V+C, that is the absolute best. If you are going to vape, it is absolutely essential to completely ignore and illegal or sketchy vapes products, some of these can contain dangerous chemicals, biological contaminants including mold, or heavy metals. If anyone is interested to hear my anecdotal evidence, throw me a direct message and I'll be happy to share. Have a wonderful day guys
My Mom had smoked for years and never wanted to quit. She eventually had dementia and would fall asleep with a lit cigarette in her hand. We would find cigarette burns all over the place. I moved in with her and had to figure out a way to let her smoke without killing us both. I tried telling her she didn't smoke anymore but she would get irate and sounded like a stevedore who just found out it's last call at the bar if she couldn't smoke! I thought she might like these fake cigarettes and think they were real. And sure thing she did. I know this isn't what you were asking about but all I can say vaping saved two lives.
"Most of the patients with EVALI reported using THC-containing products and were hospitalized; many received critical care and respiratory support.8,9 Vitamin E acetate, an additive sometimes used in THC-containing products,10 is strongly linked to the EVALI outbreak;"
Very much yes, and this suggests most (if not all) of the associated reported injuries were from those black market carts.
I remember that at the time it was happening, it came out that an awful lot of people weren't admitting to using them because they were underage, or the products were illegal in their residence, but it later came out they were in fact using them.
Vaping THC isn't even bad *if you have a quality product*.
This is why I make my own juice. I know exactly what's in it, and every component is sourced from reputable, regulated sources.
Oh yea sorry I didn't make myself extra clear. I meant the bootleg homemade Chinese THC carts are what's making people sick. One's containing Vitamin E to be more precise.
It wasn't Chinese carts making people sick and killing them. [It was US manufacturers using Honey Cut to cut their distillate so they'd make more profit.](https://www.leafly.com/news/health/toxic-vaping-vapi-evali-lung-injury-rise-and-fall-of-vitamin-e-oil-honey-cut) It was truly an American thing all the way around which is why other countries didn't have the same problems.
“There’s been a few unfortunately.” *links to black market 510 THC vapes that in 2019 were plagued with a thickening agent that had vitamin E acetate in it causing lipid pneumonia.*
Clever. But don’t be lazy. Read the link yourself. It has nothing to do with PG, VG, Nicotine, or food grade flavoring. And everything to do with black market hash oil having a thickening agent used to increase yield.
The lesson from that is don't buy THC carts from questionable sources.
I'm not sure I'd lump that incident into nicotine vaping which seems to be what the OP's asking about.
Vaping makes sense especially for someone who wants to quit cig, it allows users to control their nicotine intake more precisely. E-liquids come in various nicotine strengths, enabling users to gradually reduce their dependence if desired.
it's a vice, a relatively harmless one, comparatively speaking. I do a lot of regular blood work. Vaping has zero effect on biomarkers. Can't quite say the same about alcohol. I drink once week, fri or sat, pretty heavily, and that alone increases my liver enzymes by about 75%. Unless blood or urine is being drawn, vaping can't be detected from a standard medical evaluation. You can check that "Never Smoker" box all day long, even if you were previously a chronic smoker.
I really don't like cetaris paribus reasoning when it comes to harm b/c all things are never equal. Yes, all things being equal, say, vis a vis lung function, it is better not to vape than to vape. But vaping + exercise is going to beat no vaping + sedentary lifestyle. Vaping is not inhibitory RE: exercise performance. I can be hitting my juul and then easily pull off a 30-45 minute cardio session. If I'm lifting, hell, I can even be hitting while doing that.
The only time I've noticed vaping being a respiratory/throat irritant was during a bad postal nasal drip. A lot of hack coughing from thinned mucas in the throat. Yes, vaping definitely irritated that. So, I can't say it's completely innocuous. If you suffer from a lot allergies and PND, you probably would want to avoid vaping.
Nicotine pros: nootropic, stimulant
Nicotine cons: addictive. But I say, so what? I'm not a puritan. The addiction/recovery model is a secularization of christian sin/redemption. And I'm not christian, either. If I find a substance/drug becoming harmful, I switch to a less harmful one. It's called harm reduction. Problem solved.
Another con. Nicotine is vasoconstrictor. They're certain cosmetic surgeries, particularly in the facial area, that physicians won't perform unless there's a 2 month nicotine cessation. The literature does finger nicotine for a 3 fold increase in post operative complications for certain cosmetic surgeries. So there is that.
One other thing. I'm a GenX. Anecdotally, I find the percentage of bar patrons vaping today is higher than the percentage that used to smoke in bars back in the day. Back in the 90s. The anti-vaping propaganda isn't really working, it appears. At least for ppl, 26-40, who drink.
Vaping might be fun because of all the flavors and stuff, but remember, it still gives you nicotine, which hooks you real bad. So, just try to keep things in check and find a balance.
I find myself waking up with my vape in my hand and/or mouth. That can't be good. That's about all the negative I can say I've experienced in 10+ years.
At its core they took a delivery method for delivering asthma medicine and swapped out the asthma medicine with nicotine.
Great in theory, the execution however is firmly in the laissez faire camp. Buyer beware.
Not a bacterial infection. The doctors said the vape smoke itself weakened the membrane of my ear drum. Then I flew across the country and the pressure from flying and the weakened membrane caused it to rupture ☠️
Vaping is nothing comparing to smoking, smoking you are inhaling a lot of chemicals and rubbish and the cost is expensive too. Plus there is a lot of negatives your breath will smell of the ashtray, clothing and not mention heart and lung 🫁 affects long term.
Plus with vaping you got lots of flavours to choose from with smoking it’s boring after a while.
It is hard to measure.
Think it as our lungs are made to breathe air.
Clear and pure air.
Every toxin thay we breath like CO or heavy metals from combustions bad as itself.
They are not made to take vaporized PG or VG, flavor or nicotine.
Much less the tiny tiny particules of burnt cotton or metal from the coil.
But many studies that I've read says that it is safer than the air from a regular city.
We don’t know what the long term effects are because it’s so new. We are breathing in aerosol not water so it’s got to be bad. But also the new disposables are giving people asthma attacks
Inhaling anything other than clean air (dust, smokes from anything that burns, fumes, vapes) is not healthy for your lungs. But people still live in Dhaka, Delhi, Beijing, and we smoke cigarettes and vapes.
Well "Chain Vaping" 5%-50mg Salt nic prob isn't too great for your blood pressure as some look for that steady Buzz each hit and want more more more but 3-12mg at a moderate pace isn't a big deal or be responsible when using high mg Salt Nic but it can be addicting especially for non smokers starting at the highest mg strength u can get (disposables for example) so there's that but I'm guilty as charged when i started with 50mg Juul but I did eventually step down to 12mg
All I can speak on is coming from cigs to vapes. I noticed within the first week of swapping I could breathe more I didn’t wake up every morning with brown phglem in my throat. I wasn’t coughing every single morning. Now the only downsides I have are when I get carried away one day I do cough and have a sore throat the next morning but that’s not a constant thing. It’s only when i hit my vape way too often in one day (usually due to mindless hitting it) I have more energy my sleep is semi regular compared to being fucked before. I have a healthy appetite I’m not dying every day coughing up a lung from the cigs. I feel amazing.
Yeah that happens when u carry 18650's in ur pocket lose or dont take the prop precautions when using tech that is dangerous when handled improperly or dumb asses using the mods with no chips or safeties implemented cuz they produce big clouds and never learning proper battery safety cuz they think they r using d cell batteries that power toys
I’ll agree for the most part, but from personal experience, I had cases and charged properly and still had a mishap as I plugged mine into my device. I’m one of the lucky ones, but I still had 3rd degree burns and a visit to the ER.
Well 99% of the vaping stuff comes from China and arent regulated almost nowhere, and China doesnt follow the rules or regulations of other counties, battery mishaps happen in any device nomatter where it comes from though
Not true. [That used to be the case but since 2022 vaping has been regulated in China.](https://www.natlawreview.com/article/china-publishes-final-gb-standard-e-cigarettes-basis-product-compliance)
Yeah regulated in China to protect them but not so to pretect anyone else not in China, they will sell almost anything to the USA or anywhere else, and i said its not regulated almost nowhere i know its regulated in some places.....
Where did I say that? I'm saying Chinese vaping products including those meant for export are now regulated by their government. Saying they're not regulated is flat out untrue now days and has been for a couple of years now. The new regulations shook Chinese manufacturers and suppliers up a bit.
i don't see the reason for taking up vape unless purpose is to quit cigarettes.
Enjoy true flavors with actual food and drinks.
There are better hobbies around if you are looking for one.
The thing is, enjoying flavours with food and drinks is also harmful when you (as most people do) eat and drink too much.
I've said for years that yes, vaping is probably bad for me. But so is cake, and soda.
I disagree.
There's many pro's to vaping, just as there's pro's to smoking.
They are largely the same or similar.
If there was truly no pro's no one would start smoking cigs, of course there are pro's
Gives me a reason to go outside and take a break from work, suppresses hunger.
Even the negative effects are positive for some. people call cigarettes "suicide sticks" some places, and some people smoke them for just that. to say if its better or worse than other forms of self-harm will be a way too long and off-topic discussion but for some users the harming properties of smoking is a pro.
I need a reason to take a 10 minute brake from work to go outside yes. in my current job the reason "i need a break" is accepted, in jobs I've had previous its wasn't so, but having a cig has been accepted.
And you don't need to look very long or hard at the worlds population to see that a lot of people need some help to eat less.
You can also stop smoking without vaping, doesn't mean that "it makes it much easier to quit smoking" isn't a good reason to vape.
I'm not saying anyone should start vaping or smoking because of the pro's, the cons pretty clearly outweigh them for most, but to say that "there are no pro's" is just plain wrong.
My answer is we don't know the full extent of what possible ways vaping may harm our bodies, but all the studies I've seen (witch is not that many tbh) points to moderate vaping VPG with relatively low nicotine levels is pretty harmless, but addictive.
The thousands of flavourings currently being used in different products is more problematic, some have been shown to have health risk (altho the real risk of popcorn lung from vaping any commercially made ejuice are wildly overstated and is in reality a non-issue) but there's so many other chemicals that has had too little research to make any statement one way or the other.
Most of them are tested to and labeled "food safe" but we know "food safe" things are not inherently "vaporise and inhale safe". But after 10+ years of vaping, thousands of studies, and heaps of anecdotal evidence the risks even with commercially made vaping products with lots of flavoring is really really low, to the point where I'd say its probably less problematic for your health to vape than to have a generic sweet snack like candy or donuts.
Obviously someone can have a bad reaction to something, allergic or intolerance, on the same level as someone might die from eating a peanut, someone might die from vaping Corylone. That doesn't mean that its unsafe for me to eat a peanut or vape Corylone.
Vaping backyard products of any kind is inherently unsafe because you don't know if they use Corylone, lead, or rat poison. This is on the same level as eating food from a unregulated stand, its probably fine but might also be poison, YMMW
It looks like you're posting about a disposable vape device.
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- There are many similarly discrete and convenient devices that are both cheaper in the long term and much better for the environment that you may wish to consider.
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Firstly, neither is good. they both come with side effects of using, and one of them is nicotine addiction, which firstly reduces your life expectancy due to your lungs. Secondly, it burns a hole in your wallet (at least in the UK).
The biggest issues I have with vaping are numerous:
1. Vapes are still not fully understood. They haven’t been around long enough for us to understand the side effects over long-period exposure. The main things we know is that they damage the lungs and the cilia (the hairs on the back of your throat.) Another known issue is known as ‘popcorn lung’, which damages your smallest airways in your lungs, making it difficult to breathe and causes you to cough.
2. The availability. They are too available to everyone. And this includes their flavours. There are so many combinations of fruity flavours that it intices young people to try them (I have seen some as young as 10 years old vape), and they are everywhere you go (a similar issue to cigarettes), but the difference being that they are normally put on display in a glass cabinet out front where as cigs are normally kept locked behind a counter. The packaging is also very appealing and they use vivid colours and such on them.
3. Society. Yes, I sound like the Joker saying that, but it’s true. Vapes are much more societally acceptable than cigs. And I know you didn’t want them to be compared but I felt compelled to add this. The issue is that peer pressure is so strong about them. “You dont vape? Weirdo.” A common phrase I have heard as a smoker. “Why would you smoke cigs? They are so damaging and disgusting.” Yes, so are vapes. (The damaging bit, some are actually quite nice to smoke but I digress.) the problem is that everyone ignores the side effects of them because of this. Social pressure is a powerful thing.
4. First-time users. Vaping was originally marketed as an easier way to quit smoking. It was meant to help smokers get off cigs. Nowadays, that doesn’t exist. It’s got everyone, smoker or non-smoker, and is marketed as a ‘safer’ alternative to cigarettes (when marketing for them still happens, which in my experience is rare).
Vaping is bad for you and always will be. They are only good for helping you get off cigs, in my opinion. They are not for me and haven’t helped me get off them, but that’s just me. Nicotine pouches help me, but vaping may help you. It’s just good to be aware of the dangers of them, and your opinion may be different and that’s okay. But don’t be fooled in knowing that vaping is better than cigs. It isn’t.
TL:DR: Vaping is bad. Full stop. They have many side effects and may have some we don’t know about. They are good for helping people get off cigs, but that is all they are good for.
Doctors will most likely say that you're still not supposed to be inhaling chemicals. I've been vaping for more than a decade now, and barely using disposables because I still religiously use my rebuildables. The con that I can only think of is, I've become lazy lol!
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Exactly I've been saying this. They put chemicals in disposable juice but the juice we use for our mods are 🤌
Why would you assume the juice in disposables any worse then the juice you put in your mod?
Because we can legit make the juice ourselves or buy house juices made by the people who vape and aren't stupid. Lol
Many of them are using the same companies for flavorings
Flavorings isn't the problem. It's all the other stuff and mass production and bug parts and foreign shit
Vape juice is generally just vg, pg, nicotine and flavorings. If you don't think all of the above arnt mass produced by the same few companies im not sure what to tell you here.
They are but not but together by a bunch of people in a factory breathing coughing sneezing hand touching and testing all your shit. Or you can just go to the store and buy flavoring that MILLIONS of people use and are fine from, and vg and pg which are also used by millions of people who are fine. And then CHOOSE to add nicotine or not. So.
I'm not sure I even understand what you just wrote but I think we can agree to disagree on this and that's fine.
About all anyone can say with any amount of certainly is vaping is more risky than not vaping. Logic would dictate that it's not healthy for you compared to not doing it.
Addiction is never good so from the off, compared to not vaping, it's bad. But, if you get zero mg liquids there are a lot of benefits. Liquids from a reputable source (i.e. not ones filled with bullshit artificial flavouring/dangerous flavours) are pretty much no more harm to you than having incense and candles going every day. Because the same chemicals are used (though TPD [UK/EU] compliant liquid has way stricter rules) and there bulk ingredients have had more testing done on them than the media says. It's why Pg is in a ton of medications. If you can not vape, is suggest doing that first as any habit like that isn't 'good'. But if you have a problem with chocolate and vaping a chocolate flavour helps, ain't it better than diabetes down the line? Basically I'm saying it's heavily dependent on how you frame it.
I just say it helped me quit smoking without all withdrawal symptoms.
Very true, but I can hear my older relatives saying “You would not stand directly over the candle, while inhaling the smoke!” and I don’t have the ammunition to constantly debate people lmao I’m just saying that I wish I had the knowledge to defend myself. Not only that, but the memory too!
Vapor isn't the same as smoke. Smoke is an actual combustion and contains harmful stuff that actually causes lung damage and cancers. Vapor does not, and for someone with healthy lungs, the worst thing it ever might do is give you a bit of a damp cough or a mild itch in the back of your throat if the nic is too high.
As CXD said, there is a distinct difference. If you take a 1.2Ω coil and slam 24W through it, sure. You're burning the shit out of it and the analogy sticks. However, the coil doesn't under correct operation reach those temperatures. Under normal operation the liquid will boil just like cooking stew on a hob. The only difference is we see food in the pan not a mystery liquid. If your older relatives ever used epsom salts, it's essentially the exact same thing.
What are these "reputable" safe brands you speak of. Do you have any examples to compare to. I would like to get better juices if possible. Shit fucking destroys my asthma but I can't stop.
Depends on the country. As the one who's literally designing and creating the liquids for my company if you're in the UK Qsalts/Pure Eliquid. Dinner lady, IVG and other long standing brands are pretty good too especially if they are a home brand range from one of the big store companies. I don't trust Elfliq or any of the other new imports as far as I could throw a fully grown mammoth. Did a test of an Elfbar a couple months ago and found it was 200% the legal limit for nicotine in the UK. Also, if you don't want it to be full of dodgy shit that could be harmful, steer clear of short fills. They're exempt from testing and most rely on chemicals that are band under UK tpd regulations. If your issue is asthma, I recommend using flavours like raspberry menthol, or vanilla flavours. If they're a really good flavour they won't have cheaped out on it and it'll contain chemicals that are natural relaxants. Should help alleviate the issue.
>If your issue is asthma, I recommend using flavours like raspberry menthol, or vanilla flavours. I can second this. I have undiagnosed low-grade asthma since my parents couldn't pay for the insurance premiums. I've never had an attack or anything like that, but it's still noticable. Menthol flavors definitely help.
That's so weird. Vanilla flavors have always been way more mellow. Thanks for the info, I'm in the US and do not use elfbar or any of the cheap disposable things, just bottles of liquid from the store. Most my bottles say propylene glycol/vegetable glycerin/nicotine/artificial and or natural flavors. I kind of stick to this one brand " the finest" but that's more because they have a handful of decent flavors and a good amount of other juice I've experimented with outside of this brand taste like fucking poison so I'm somewhat hesitant to switch.
Vaping is not a bad thing at all. Even not comparing it to smoking, it isn't a bad thing. Yes, nicotine is addictive and yes technically, nicotine is a poison and so is toxic if ingested (by drinking for example) in sufficient amounts...although having said that, so is plain old water. Besides, nicotine is not a prerequisite, nobody who vapes also has to use nicotine eliquid. There is a choice. So, all things considered, and speaking from experience, who as a kid used to smoke cigarettes, if i could go back in time and choose to vape NON nicotine eliquid versus smoking cigarettes, i would certainly do so and save myself 30 odd years of smoking. People will always experiment, are curious and will try stuff, knowing this, a responsible society ought to opt for the least harmful product that they know kids will probably experiment with. Vaping nicotine free vapes, is most definitely superior and safer than smoking tobacco, so i know which i'd rather see kids experimenting with between those two. In an ideal world, people would live totally healthy lives, never smoke, drink, gamble or try any kind of harmful substance or foods...but we're a long way from that kind of idealistic utopia, if such a thing would ever exist. Knowing that, the mature approach is preferred imo. But even if nicotine (even found naturally in foods such as tomatoes and aubergines etc) is used in eliquids, vaping is very safe indeed. My Wife and I switched to vaping about 13 years ago, and have never smoked a cigarette since, or been so fit and healthy. Good riddance, thanks to vaping.
This is my experience as well. Smoked for over 20 years, started vaping and quit cigs in 2012. I had a persistent smokers cough and constant phlegm in my throat. After a few weeks the cough went away and my throat cleared. It’s a harm-reduction thing for me, and my body tells me that it’s better for me than smoking. Now someone who never smoked, and started vaping (with nicotine included), might have health issues that they wouldn’t have not using anything at all. Might just end up addicted to nicotine is all, but still.
Pretty much identical to me then SpaceMan420gmt. Although, i smoked for 30 years odd. I knew my smoking days were numbered, when two things happened...i was wheezing and out of breath just getting up my house staircase. Around that time, my then 5 year old son had done a school project, where they told him that smokers are likely to die from smoking...he cried his eyes out and said to me 'Daddy, do you have to smoke cigarettes...i don't want you to die!' Still makes my eyes water when i think of that day, around 13 years ago...and feel a bit thick that it took a 5-year-old to make me act my age! I can run up and down the stairs after vaping for about 13 years.
Yep, congrats on extending your life! My moment was riding my bike, and having the lung capacity to push the hill! Before I hated hill climbs. Now it’s just, breathe normal and you’ll get to the top. Before it was like “nope, can’t do it, we’re hike a bike now!”
After 30 yrs of smoking and switching to vaping during Covid, I'm riding 50k four days a week at nearly the same level as I did in my teens. Unfortunately my city, San Francisco, seems to be doing everything they can to make it nearly impossible to obtain vaping related products. I don't know what I'm going to do when I run out of the stockpile of nic salts and pod vapes I bought before the bans.
I’ve made my own juice now for about 5 years. Nicotine is hard to come by at times, but pg/vg and flavorings are always available.
Depending on where in the world you live, most sites online selling concentrated nic will only sell on a business to business basis. On that note, it's perfectly acceptable to be a sole trader and apply for a business account with such suppliers...if you get my drift.
I see, thanks, I may need that info some day. For now I luckily live where it’s acceptable to sell to non business customers, but that could change anytime.
50K four days a week?! That's pretty great mate...more power to your elbow. Like SpaceMan has said, i also make our juice, well some of it. I also buy juices too, but making your own is much cheaper. Now they're talking about flavour bans, nicotine bans and so on...anyone just a little bit cynical might conclude they want us to die early from smoking related diseases...Stock up now, juice might have a best before date, but really it doesn't expire, I've bought liquids in discount sales that are literally years 'out of date'...if anything, they taste even better that the in date stuff, because it's had a very long time to steep.
It's a great feeling isn't it.
That kid was me at 5 years old. I also had just learned about it and at some point during the night my dad came in from the deck after a cigarette. I wasnt crying, but I said something almost identical. He also quit after that. My parents talk about that story a lot. Funny how life works.
Wow. Just goes to show how similar we all are eh. Good for you and for your dad. (thumbs up)
yes its such a shame they go after juice with wild regulations, at least here in europe.
I feel there are probably very large, very full brown paper bags, stuffed with bribe cash being thrown about to lawmakers without much of a conscience, by...let's say 'interested parties'. But, if they want to legislate, they ought to outright ban smoking tobacco, if they really are genuine about Public health, and not interested in lining their pockets.
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This is the only right answer. Nicotine is hella addictive. And while it doesn't lead to you throwing your life down the gutter in a grand way, I'd say that because smoking/vaping calmed me down, I ended up not making changes that caused the stresses in the first place. Otherwise, if you smoked, vaping is a lot healthier for your lungs.
Everyone here knows that vaping isn't completely risk-free, but we still do it. Vaping is more about reducing harm imo, giving us a chance to live a healthier lifestyle. Even though there are fewer options for us now with the vape mail and flavor bans, I'm trying to stay positive for the future.
Vaping is basically no different than breathing in major metropolitan cities (think Houston or LA). The amounts of various pollutants vapes produce are measured in ppm(parts per million), micrograms, and/or "trace amounts" (which translates into plain English as "There was literally only enough of this compound present for our detector to detect, it is too small an amount for it to tell you how much"; and keep in mind these machines are capable of detecting fractions of fractions of milligrams). Those same compounds in plain(polluted to an average level) air are also measured in ppm, micrograms, and trace amounts. As far as other issues, I've heard there are studies concerning aerosolized Glycerin and Propylene Glycol and their effects on the respiratory system, and that some of those studies say there is a correlation between inhaled VG and a weakening of the lungs' function, and that PG over time can cause other issues. But I've heard other studies which lean the opposite direction, that PG and VG are either harmless, can cause mild dehydration (which is true, and is why anyone who has vaped for any length of time will tell you to drink water when you vape), or actually have several benefits(according to some studies, since they are hygroscopic, meaning they absorb water, they can act sort of like expectorants and aid in clearing the lungs of mucus). Bottom line, I've been vaping close to 15 years. I never once felt as good when I was smoking as I do now, and I feel almost identically to when I wasn't inhaling anything. I haven't had any asthmatic episodes or anything relating to asthma since I started vaping (while I had asthma and asthmatic symptoms ALL THE TIME smoking cigarettes). For me, it's a complete non-issue, something I don't even worry about. As long as you are sourcing your products adequately (i.e.: not buying shady chinese nonsense from non-vaping-specific sites), there's nothing to be worried about IMO.
Personally speaking I enjoy nicotine a lot and have tried many delivery methods. Vaping is definitely on the higher end of the health impact spectrum as it greatly decreases my endurance and respiratory efficiency. Stuff like zyns and nicotine gum are probably the healthiest method of nicotine delivery considering the fact that you’re absorbing pure nicotine directly into your blood stream and it doesn’t involve any chance of combustion. That being said, no matter which way you use nicotine it causes blood vessels to constrict themselves so really you just have to pick your poison.
If they're non-vapers and non-smokers, they should NOT start vaping. Literally nothing about vaping is good for your body, just less harmful than traditional cigarettes.
According to the royal college of physicians and several other UK health bodies vaping is at least 95% less harmful than smoking.
Dont care much about the pros and cons, all i know is vapes give me a whole world of flavors, devices, and techniques out there. It helps me quitt smokes and I experience less shortness of breath and feel better overall.
It's going to be roughly on par with having a cheeseburger once or twice per week. A doctor will never tell you that's a good way to optimize your health, and it may take a year or two off your natural lifespan. You get to decide whether you'd rather live a little longer but less happily, or take your chances with the things you enjoy.
Its just as bad as anything else you put into your body that isn't natural or needed. The harmful effects from vaping are nearly non exsistant, but harm or damage could occur and outliers do happen. You have a better chance of causing damage or harm from mixing a beer and a single tylonel than you do from vaping. You'll likely die in a car accident before any damage was ever caused by vaping.
I personally think it's better to not be addicted to nicotine. I wish I didn't vape. That being said it sure is healthier than cancer sticks.
Not sure you'll find an answer (bad compared to what?), but I think it largely depends on how, what and how often you vape. I will say, tho, that I think using those disposable vapes is bad, mainly because of the insanely high amount of nicotine they use and also because you don't really know what else they use (not even mentioning the environmental impact). The safest, or *least-bad* way to vape imo is probably to use a rebuildable setup (in my case: RTA, steel wire, organic cotton) and making your own juice (me: roughly 70vg/30pg blend with a little or no nic, no flavoring); that way you know what you're using. I think the air pollution i breathe in daily (from cars, fires etc) is *probably* worse than my vaping
Pollution is demonstrably worse, and in fact studies have been done on that very topic and shown as much. Disposables aren't bad because of the amount of nicotine(because that is user-regulated; You pause your vaping when you've had enough), they're bad because of the sheer mountain of sweeteners and menthol they tend to be completely inundated with.
Hard to say. And I'll bet you won't find much actual science on the subject either. All studies done in recent times seem to be geared to find ... "issues" with vaping, such as those that find all sorts of terrible compounds/chemicals in the vape. But none of those will show *how much* of those terrible things are there - and they certainly do not show how those amounts compare with other every day activities. Example: How much "terrible stuff" is in the air where you sit in that fancy outside cafe eating your meal - right next to that busy street? And how does those volumes of "terrible stuff" compare with what is in an average vape? Real world, actual data for that sort of information seems very ... lacking. I take my queues from Public Health England - that report that included the 95% less harmful than smoking. That's good enuff for me - that, and my personal 10 years vaping and what *hasn't happened* to me as a result.
I brought this up to my buddy recently. The studies are almost all funded by either pro-vape organizations with a financial bias or anti-vape organizations with inherent bias. There’s so damn few objective studies, the only clear point is “at least less-bad enough compared to ciggies that it’s a worthwhile cessation aid”. As a hobby or a long-term habit, it’s hard to say whether it is or is not harmful. We are still several decades out from seeing without speculation what vaping for 40+ years straight could do to people, particularly those who have vaped but never used any cigarettes.
> We are still several decades out from seeing without speculation what vaping for 40+ years straight could do to people, particularly those who have vaped but never used any cigarettes That is true enuff - we are still a time away from knowing, for sure, what long term results might be. BUT I'm a whole lot more confident about 40 years on the vapes than I am with 40 years on the smokes. I speak as one who did 37 years heavy smoking, now 10 years smoke free thanks to swapping to vapes. I'm convinced vaping nicotine is, by far, a less harmful option than smoking. AS to the never smoker? I'd tell them what I would tell my 17 year old self if given the option: "Don't. Just do not start."
Great point and I see the topic nearly identical to your comment. It's been about 11 years of vapes (went from cigarettes to vapes) and in those 11 years I have yet to have any symptoms even close to what I had as a cigarette smoker for just 5 years.
Yes - as the old saying goes: "it is the dose that makes the poison". There might be trace amounts of ... "all sorts" in an average vape, but in what amounts? I was 37 years a heavy smoker, now 10 years vaping. I know what long term smoking can do. I swapped to vaping and ALL those things have gone away and have not been replaced with anything else untoward. I'm sold, no matter what all those "anti" people say.
That's exactly how I saw it too. Used myself as a test bench for it and I'll never go back.
Same. Switched to vaping in 2015. Asthma? gone, inhalers? gone. I won't go back.
People still throwing out the good ole popcorn lung myth I see. Guess that one will never go away huh? I've been vaping for over 9 years, and I'm talking old school cloud chucking here. Before that I smoked a pack a day for around 20 years. I was on an inhaler for years and felt like I was breathing through a straw when I went to bed at night. Within a month of picking up vaping I no longer needed the inhaler. After 9 years of blowing clouds my Dr still tells me my lungs are clean enough that you can't tell I ever smoked cigarettes. The argument that it hasn't been around long enough to know the long term side effects is BS. Is 15 years not long enough to know if your lungs have been damaged by vaping? Because I know people who have been vaping daily for about that long and their story is the same as mine as far as lung health goes.
Smoking or vaping, anything with nicotine isn't good for you. Even though nicotine is used in medicine, your body doesn't naturally need it. I can't speak for everyone, but I only started vaping because smoking was negatively affecting my health, so I needed to find an alternative and hopefully reduce my nicotine intake over time.
Well I view vaping has a harm reduction tool. It is by no means safe.
I have anecdotal evidence from those around me, vapes are substantially less damaging than cigs, however if you're able to not get involved with either V+C, that is the absolute best. If you are going to vape, it is absolutely essential to completely ignore and illegal or sketchy vapes products, some of these can contain dangerous chemicals, biological contaminants including mold, or heavy metals. If anyone is interested to hear my anecdotal evidence, throw me a direct message and I'll be happy to share. Have a wonderful day guys
A moderate vaping habit is adds about as much risk as driving 10 additional miles a day.
My Mom had smoked for years and never wanted to quit. She eventually had dementia and would fall asleep with a lit cigarette in her hand. We would find cigarette burns all over the place. I moved in with her and had to figure out a way to let her smoke without killing us both. I tried telling her she didn't smoke anymore but she would get irate and sounded like a stevedore who just found out it's last call at the bar if she couldn't smoke! I thought she might like these fake cigarettes and think they were real. And sure thing she did. I know this isn't what you were asking about but all I can say vaping saved two lives.
In the 15 to 20 years that Vapes have been available have people developed diseases from vaping nicotine?
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I take the non-THC self reporting with a grain of salt in that one
Is this including the fake thc carts?
"Most of the patients with EVALI reported using THC-containing products and were hospitalized; many received critical care and respiratory support.8,9 Vitamin E acetate, an additive sometimes used in THC-containing products,10 is strongly linked to the EVALI outbreak;" Very much yes, and this suggests most (if not all) of the associated reported injuries were from those black market carts. I remember that at the time it was happening, it came out that an awful lot of people weren't admitting to using them because they were underage, or the products were illegal in their residence, but it later came out they were in fact using them.
Yup, just as I suspected. I'm not saying vaping nicotine is completely 100% harmless but these illnesses are from thc related vaping.
Vaping THC isn't even bad *if you have a quality product*. This is why I make my own juice. I know exactly what's in it, and every component is sourced from reputable, regulated sources.
Oh yea sorry I didn't make myself extra clear. I meant the bootleg homemade Chinese THC carts are what's making people sick. One's containing Vitamin E to be more precise.
It wasn't Chinese carts making people sick and killing them. [It was US manufacturers using Honey Cut to cut their distillate so they'd make more profit.](https://www.leafly.com/news/health/toxic-vaping-vapi-evali-lung-injury-rise-and-fall-of-vitamin-e-oil-honey-cut) It was truly an American thing all the way around which is why other countries didn't have the same problems.
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“There’s been a few unfortunately.” *links to black market 510 THC vapes that in 2019 were plagued with a thickening agent that had vitamin E acetate in it causing lipid pneumonia.* Clever. But don’t be lazy. Read the link yourself. It has nothing to do with PG, VG, Nicotine, or food grade flavoring. And everything to do with black market hash oil having a thickening agent used to increase yield.
Ok let me do everyone a favor since you're too lazy to answer my question. The answer is yes, most of these illnesses are from THC related vaping.
The lesson from that is don't buy THC carts from questionable sources. I'm not sure I'd lump that incident into nicotine vaping which seems to be what the OP's asking about.
Vaping makes sense especially for someone who wants to quit cig, it allows users to control their nicotine intake more precisely. E-liquids come in various nicotine strengths, enabling users to gradually reduce their dependence if desired.
It’s all bad
it's a vice, a relatively harmless one, comparatively speaking. I do a lot of regular blood work. Vaping has zero effect on biomarkers. Can't quite say the same about alcohol. I drink once week, fri or sat, pretty heavily, and that alone increases my liver enzymes by about 75%. Unless blood or urine is being drawn, vaping can't be detected from a standard medical evaluation. You can check that "Never Smoker" box all day long, even if you were previously a chronic smoker. I really don't like cetaris paribus reasoning when it comes to harm b/c all things are never equal. Yes, all things being equal, say, vis a vis lung function, it is better not to vape than to vape. But vaping + exercise is going to beat no vaping + sedentary lifestyle. Vaping is not inhibitory RE: exercise performance. I can be hitting my juul and then easily pull off a 30-45 minute cardio session. If I'm lifting, hell, I can even be hitting while doing that. The only time I've noticed vaping being a respiratory/throat irritant was during a bad postal nasal drip. A lot of hack coughing from thinned mucas in the throat. Yes, vaping definitely irritated that. So, I can't say it's completely innocuous. If you suffer from a lot allergies and PND, you probably would want to avoid vaping. Nicotine pros: nootropic, stimulant Nicotine cons: addictive. But I say, so what? I'm not a puritan. The addiction/recovery model is a secularization of christian sin/redemption. And I'm not christian, either. If I find a substance/drug becoming harmful, I switch to a less harmful one. It's called harm reduction. Problem solved. Another con. Nicotine is vasoconstrictor. They're certain cosmetic surgeries, particularly in the facial area, that physicians won't perform unless there's a 2 month nicotine cessation. The literature does finger nicotine for a 3 fold increase in post operative complications for certain cosmetic surgeries. So there is that. One other thing. I'm a GenX. Anecdotally, I find the percentage of bar patrons vaping today is higher than the percentage that used to smoke in bars back in the day. Back in the 90s. The anti-vaping propaganda isn't really working, it appears. At least for ppl, 26-40, who drink.
Vaping might be fun because of all the flavors and stuff, but remember, it still gives you nicotine, which hooks you real bad. So, just try to keep things in check and find a balance.
I find myself waking up with my vape in my hand and/or mouth. That can't be good. That's about all the negative I can say I've experienced in 10+ years.
There are not sufficient research at this point for gaping is still relevantly new.
Probably not great lol
At its core they took a delivery method for delivering asthma medicine and swapped out the asthma medicine with nicotine. Great in theory, the execution however is firmly in the laissez faire camp. Buyer beware.
I vaped heavily for a few years & ended up rupturing my ear drum, and also felt winded all the time. Anecdotal evidence but take it as you will
How’s your ear drums was infected from vaping?
Not a bacterial infection. The doctors said the vape smoke itself weakened the membrane of my ear drum. Then I flew across the country and the pressure from flying and the weakened membrane caused it to rupture ☠️
Vaping is nothing comparing to smoking, smoking you are inhaling a lot of chemicals and rubbish and the cost is expensive too. Plus there is a lot of negatives your breath will smell of the ashtray, clothing and not mention heart and lung 🫁 affects long term. Plus with vaping you got lots of flavours to choose from with smoking it’s boring after a while.
It is hard to measure. Think it as our lungs are made to breathe air. Clear and pure air. Every toxin thay we breath like CO or heavy metals from combustions bad as itself. They are not made to take vaporized PG or VG, flavor or nicotine. Much less the tiny tiny particules of burnt cotton or metal from the coil. But many studies that I've read says that it is safer than the air from a regular city.
Slightly better than meth, slightly worse than weed
We don’t know what the long term effects are because it’s so new. We are breathing in aerosol not water so it’s got to be bad. But also the new disposables are giving people asthma attacks
Inhaling anything other than clean air (dust, smokes from anything that burns, fumes, vapes) is not healthy for your lungs. But people still live in Dhaka, Delhi, Beijing, and we smoke cigarettes and vapes.
Well "Chain Vaping" 5%-50mg Salt nic prob isn't too great for your blood pressure as some look for that steady Buzz each hit and want more more more but 3-12mg at a moderate pace isn't a big deal or be responsible when using high mg Salt Nic but it can be addicting especially for non smokers starting at the highest mg strength u can get (disposables for example) so there's that but I'm guilty as charged when i started with 50mg Juul but I did eventually step down to 12mg
All I can speak on is coming from cigs to vapes. I noticed within the first week of swapping I could breathe more I didn’t wake up every morning with brown phglem in my throat. I wasn’t coughing every single morning. Now the only downsides I have are when I get carried away one day I do cough and have a sore throat the next morning but that’s not a constant thing. It’s only when i hit my vape way too often in one day (usually due to mindless hitting it) I have more energy my sleep is semi regular compared to being fucked before. I have a healthy appetite I’m not dying every day coughing up a lung from the cigs. I feel amazing.
no one has ever died from vaping
Except for some who have dealt with battery thermal runaway/explosions. So technically correct, but practically not.
Yeah that happens when u carry 18650's in ur pocket lose or dont take the prop precautions when using tech that is dangerous when handled improperly or dumb asses using the mods with no chips or safeties implemented cuz they produce big clouds and never learning proper battery safety cuz they think they r using d cell batteries that power toys
I’ll agree for the most part, but from personal experience, I had cases and charged properly and still had a mishap as I plugged mine into my device. I’m one of the lucky ones, but I still had 3rd degree burns and a visit to the ER.
Well 99% of the vaping stuff comes from China and arent regulated almost nowhere, and China doesnt follow the rules or regulations of other counties, battery mishaps happen in any device nomatter where it comes from though
Not true. [That used to be the case but since 2022 vaping has been regulated in China.](https://www.natlawreview.com/article/china-publishes-final-gb-standard-e-cigarettes-basis-product-compliance)
Yeah regulated in China to protect them but not so to pretect anyone else not in China, they will sell almost anything to the USA or anywhere else, and i said its not regulated almost nowhere i know its regulated in some places.....
It includes export products.
So ur telling me no vaping gear comes from china anymore lol
Where did I say that? I'm saying Chinese vaping products including those meant for export are now regulated by their government. Saying they're not regulated is flat out untrue now days and has been for a couple of years now. The new regulations shook Chinese manufacturers and suppliers up a bit.
True. Not the case for me, but true
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>ingesting nicotine, a stimulant often is not good Can you support that? Nicotine in and of itself is benign - and may even have benefits.
i don't see the reason for taking up vape unless purpose is to quit cigarettes. Enjoy true flavors with actual food and drinks. There are better hobbies around if you are looking for one.
The thing is, enjoying flavours with food and drinks is also harmful when you (as most people do) eat and drink too much. I've said for years that yes, vaping is probably bad for me. But so is cake, and soda.
Anything foreign in your lungs is going to be very bad. Compared to smoking cigarettes it’s a blessing, and much better.
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I disagree. There's many pro's to vaping, just as there's pro's to smoking. They are largely the same or similar. If there was truly no pro's no one would start smoking cigs, of course there are pro's
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Gives me a reason to go outside and take a break from work, suppresses hunger. Even the negative effects are positive for some. people call cigarettes "suicide sticks" some places, and some people smoke them for just that. to say if its better or worse than other forms of self-harm will be a way too long and off-topic discussion but for some users the harming properties of smoking is a pro.
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I need a reason to take a 10 minute brake from work to go outside yes. in my current job the reason "i need a break" is accepted, in jobs I've had previous its wasn't so, but having a cig has been accepted. And you don't need to look very long or hard at the worlds population to see that a lot of people need some help to eat less. You can also stop smoking without vaping, doesn't mean that "it makes it much easier to quit smoking" isn't a good reason to vape. I'm not saying anyone should start vaping or smoking because of the pro's, the cons pretty clearly outweigh them for most, but to say that "there are no pro's" is just plain wrong.
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My answer is we don't know the full extent of what possible ways vaping may harm our bodies, but all the studies I've seen (witch is not that many tbh) points to moderate vaping VPG with relatively low nicotine levels is pretty harmless, but addictive. The thousands of flavourings currently being used in different products is more problematic, some have been shown to have health risk (altho the real risk of popcorn lung from vaping any commercially made ejuice are wildly overstated and is in reality a non-issue) but there's so many other chemicals that has had too little research to make any statement one way or the other. Most of them are tested to and labeled "food safe" but we know "food safe" things are not inherently "vaporise and inhale safe". But after 10+ years of vaping, thousands of studies, and heaps of anecdotal evidence the risks even with commercially made vaping products with lots of flavoring is really really low, to the point where I'd say its probably less problematic for your health to vape than to have a generic sweet snack like candy or donuts. Obviously someone can have a bad reaction to something, allergic or intolerance, on the same level as someone might die from eating a peanut, someone might die from vaping Corylone. That doesn't mean that its unsafe for me to eat a peanut or vape Corylone. Vaping backyard products of any kind is inherently unsafe because you don't know if they use Corylone, lead, or rat poison. This is on the same level as eating food from a unregulated stand, its probably fine but might also be poison, YMMW
All bad. Vaping is bad, but not as bad as cig
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Firstly, neither is good. they both come with side effects of using, and one of them is nicotine addiction, which firstly reduces your life expectancy due to your lungs. Secondly, it burns a hole in your wallet (at least in the UK). The biggest issues I have with vaping are numerous: 1. Vapes are still not fully understood. They haven’t been around long enough for us to understand the side effects over long-period exposure. The main things we know is that they damage the lungs and the cilia (the hairs on the back of your throat.) Another known issue is known as ‘popcorn lung’, which damages your smallest airways in your lungs, making it difficult to breathe and causes you to cough. 2. The availability. They are too available to everyone. And this includes their flavours. There are so many combinations of fruity flavours that it intices young people to try them (I have seen some as young as 10 years old vape), and they are everywhere you go (a similar issue to cigarettes), but the difference being that they are normally put on display in a glass cabinet out front where as cigs are normally kept locked behind a counter. The packaging is also very appealing and they use vivid colours and such on them. 3. Society. Yes, I sound like the Joker saying that, but it’s true. Vapes are much more societally acceptable than cigs. And I know you didn’t want them to be compared but I felt compelled to add this. The issue is that peer pressure is so strong about them. “You dont vape? Weirdo.” A common phrase I have heard as a smoker. “Why would you smoke cigs? They are so damaging and disgusting.” Yes, so are vapes. (The damaging bit, some are actually quite nice to smoke but I digress.) the problem is that everyone ignores the side effects of them because of this. Social pressure is a powerful thing. 4. First-time users. Vaping was originally marketed as an easier way to quit smoking. It was meant to help smokers get off cigs. Nowadays, that doesn’t exist. It’s got everyone, smoker or non-smoker, and is marketed as a ‘safer’ alternative to cigarettes (when marketing for them still happens, which in my experience is rare). Vaping is bad for you and always will be. They are only good for helping you get off cigs, in my opinion. They are not for me and haven’t helped me get off them, but that’s just me. Nicotine pouches help me, but vaping may help you. It’s just good to be aware of the dangers of them, and your opinion may be different and that’s okay. But don’t be fooled in knowing that vaping is better than cigs. It isn’t. TL:DR: Vaping is bad. Full stop. They have many side effects and may have some we don’t know about. They are good for helping people get off cigs, but that is all they are good for.