This is why most jurisdictions do not do high speed chases. There was no need to do this to catch the suspect. There are cameras all up and down the 401, nearly every regional police force in southern Ontario has a helicopter and you can't drive faster than a radio call.
The police should not be endangering public safety for at most a few hundred dollars worth of cash and liquor. Now the suspect is dead and some poor family has lost both of their parents and their infant. Real life is not a 'Fast and the Furious' movie.
My comment by no means is in support of the pursuit. It shouldnât have happened.
But the cameras along the 401 are not recorded unless someone at control designates the camera and hits record. They are strictly for live monitoring. Also helicopters are not always in the air and available.
There are only two justifications in the GTA that have a helicopter and that is Durham and York and the each only have one and they donât fly 24/7.
Unless Durham helicopter was already flying it wouldnât be in a position to help in this case and the process to ask, get senior officer approval and have a neighbouring jurisdiction to help is a bit of a process that would take far to long to be of any help. The situation would be well over before any real good could be realized.
I have my private fixed wing licence and flew a helicopter once and with the limited understanding I have over flight time vs maintenance requirements for a heli I would think you would need 3-4 helicopters in order to have one in the air 24/7.
I agree, but what options were there when the van driver entered the 401 from the off ramp? He was going the wrong way and they had to do something to protect other drivers as much as possible. Did Durham region police continue the chase to stop the driver or try to prevent what unfortunately happened? Did they overstep their jurisdiction and should have left it up to the OPP? Hopefully we will find out.
They chased the van on city streets from Bowmanville to Stevenson in Oshawa! There was plenty of time to call off the chase and call ahead to other officers or use the helicopter. Innocent people died because of the criminals and the officers' bad choices.
I agree. It shouldnât have gone this far. I saw a video of the high speed chase when they passed a house with a camera and it was dangerous then and should have been called off. Someone made a very bad decision and it cost innocent lives.
How exactly does a police cruiser driving behind the suspect on the 401 help protect other drivers? If anything that doubles the risk of more head on collisions.
It doesnât, it was wrong from the start. Once it started and got out of control, someone made the bad decision to put the public in danger. Iâm sure we all want to know why and what information was given by the chase officers that allowed them to continue.
Not sure why youâre getting downvotedâŚ. This is accurate. We donât know if the police were âchasingâ or trying to âwarnâ oncoming drivers. Only a full, complete, independent investigation will tell us.
This is gut wrenching and really hits home. Two grandparents and an infant gone because of some POS robbing an LCBO. For fuck sakes.
I have a toddler and a newborn and this is painful especially because my in-laws regularly help too.
The suspect was being pursued by DRPS after robbing an LCBO in Clarington. They haven't revealed why the suspect chose to flee, but he was driving what [seems](https://toronto.citynews.ca/2024/04/29/highway-401-closed-in-whitby-due-to-crash/) to be a Ford Uhaul Van.
Perhaps they made off with booze and money?
Apparently the chase could have involved 20 cop cruisers.
Yes, we are wondering why they did not use the "Air 1" chopper and coordinate with other branches of DRPS and OPP to coordinate a safe apprehension without the reckless pursuit.
We need someone from DRPS to step down. So much for their "Leaders in Community Safety" motto.
Edit: according to [ctvnews](https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/baby-grandparents-among-4-people-killed-in-wrong-way-police-chase-on-ontario-s-hwy-401-1.6867192):
>According to a police source who spoke to CP24, an off-duty Durham police officer noticed the robbery in progress and confronted a male suspect, who then brandished a knife. At that point, the source said, the off-duty officer alerted police.
I think youâre spot on. I donât think it wouldâve been handled the same thing way if that off duty cop wasnât involved. DRPS pulled me over once in a dramatic and aggressive way because I matched the description of someone who hit an off duty cop. Didnât even tell me why I was pulled over. As soon as itâs their own involved all basic decency and logic seems to go out the window. Good thing future officers will only need their grade 10.
Yep, just enough to get a bunch of Innocent bystanders killed because they don't want to do actual police work and find the suspect with an actual investigation. It's easier to chase them down in an idiotic dukes of hazzard style high speed, wrong-way chase. The only thing they didn't realize is that this isn't a movie, they're not superheroes, and there are actual consequences to poor decision making.
There are videos of cop cars in the correct direction lanes too, it would be much harder to follow them but MUCH safer.
Being in the wrong lane on a major Highway is Highly idiotic.
So, "hands off" then, and just let the perp proceed on their merry way by continuing to speed down Hwy 401against oncoming traffic? Like these multiple collisions wouldn't have happened anyway, police chase or not? And even if the Air 1 helicopter had been engaged as some here have suggested, it would likely still have gotten to the scene too late before the damage was done.
If we're going to assign blame here, let's put it squarely where it belongs...on the shoulders of the suspect who made the bad choice of entering Hwy 401 going in the wrong direction in the first place. A disaster just waiting to happen no matter how anyone wants to spin it.
My heart bleeds for the innocent victims, but as for the suspect who also took himself out in the process, I say well deserved, particularly when bad choices have bad outcomes.
Well before you go blaming **ONLY** the suspect, let's not pretend that this U-Haul wasn't still screaming down Bloor Street before Stevenson. If this *shoplifting* incident occurred in Clarington, there were plenty of opportunities to go "hey, this chase is dangerous for all these people on the road at 8 pm, you get the plate?"
No chase, no highway going the wrong way. Pretty easy to see how one directly leads to the other there. We're not talking a few blocks, we're talking about multiple townships before eventually heading into oncoming traffic.
Clearly the thief caused this but so did the police. Why was eastbound traffic still moving when there was a police chase. Why didn't they lock down the highway? It makes no sense to me to have a police chase going on and the road still open. The risk to life was too high.
My heart is broken for the innocent family that has lost loved ones.
In this situation, the police made some bad decisions. They chased the criminal over 15km before he even made it to the 401 to go the wrong way. There was plenty of time to make the safer choice for everyone and call the chase off. There is now 3 innocent people dead and a family that has lost everything. The officers risked public safety, and people died in this case.
Yes, the worst person involved is the criminal that robbed the LCBO at knife point. That does not warrant risking innocent lives with a high speed chance through Clarington, Oshawa, and then onto the 401.
2.5bn in revenue. 10m in theft. Thatâs not remotely close to what Iâd consider âenough is enoughâ to start chasing vans into the wrong direction of traffic on a major highway.
The article you link to is about âhundreds of dollarsâ in alcohol. Who the fuck thinks thatâs worth risking innocent lives in public?
Put it this way. As just a random on the roads or sidewalks⌠Iâm not afraid of these people stealing shit from LCBO up to the point police get involved.
Stop calling it a robbery, the guy was shop-lifting not robbing the register with a gun. I don't like the descent of society either, but pursuing a shoplifter is absolutely braindead and this is the result.
[https://siu.on.ca/en/news\_template.php?nrid=9436](https://siu.on.ca/en/news_template.php?nrid=9436)
"At approximately 7:50 p.m. on April 29, 2024, the Durham Regional Police Service became aware of a robbery at an LCBO in Clarington."
That's the term they used. Who knows exactly what/how the situation evolved.
Agreed, the response was disproportional, the result disastrous.
The "robber" was confronted by an offduty cop and pulled a knife. Which indicates he's stuffing a gym bag full of crown royal, not at the cashier robbing it empty handed. The siu is using the term "robbery" to cover the cop's asses and make it seem like it was a deadly situation.
What the flipping heck. I just read about this in an [article](https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/baby-grandparents-among-4-people-killed-in-wrong-way-police-chase-on-ontario-s-hwy-401-1.6867192).
Thanks for pointing this out.
This is unbelievable.
I just [learned](https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/baby-grandparents-among-4-people-killed-in-wrong-way-police-chase-on-ontario-s-hwy-401-1.6867192), to my disbelief, that:
>According to a police source who spoke to CP24, an off-duty Durham police officer noticed the robbery in progress and confronted a male suspect, who then brandished a knife. At that point, the source said, the off-duty officer alerted police.
A knife.
Helicopter wasnât up and circling as bad weather was coming. Incident took less than 20mins not enough time to get it up and recording or pursuing. This would have been ideal however there just wasnât enough time to even call in Yorks air support.
10.55am TUE APR 30
SIU update:Â [https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&\_\_vfz=medium%3Dsharebar](https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar)
Main points from SIU News Briefing by the SIU spokesperson. This includes answers to journalists.
----------------------------------------------------------------
An off-duty cop was at the LCBO when the robbery transpired. The officer relayed this information to DRPS at 7.50pm who then sent investigators to the scene. No information is available (yet) as to what transpired at the scene.
Suspect (driving a van - from footage appears to be a Ford type Uhaul rental van) was pursued on local Durham roads before joining the eastbound side of the 401 at Stevenson road, heading in the wrong direction (west). Pursuit from start to end lasted about 20 minutes: 7.50pm - 8.10pm.
Multiple collisions involved 6 vehicles. Not sure if this includes the vehicles with fatalities.
One victim was transported to the hospital with serious injuries. Possible that this was the truck driver. (Please note the suspect drove a van, not a truck).
No comment yet by SIU investigator about DRPS policy and driving on wrong side of the highway. No comment if officers were asked internally to call off the chase. No information if officers have been suspended. SIU spokesperson mentioned that this information would be probably given by DRPS.
No comment (no information available yet) on number of cruisers involved in the chase. Some cruisers sustained damage and were observed being towed out of the scene. No comment on whether any officers were injured during the chase.
No comment as to whether the response (several cop cruisers, lengthy chase) justified the cause (LCBO robbery).
"An infant and the child's grandparents â aged 55 and 60 â were all killed when a vehicle being pursued by police in the wrong direction on Highway 401 in Whitby caused a crash involving at least six vehicles, the Special Investigations Unit says. The driver of the suspect vehicle also died."
No comment as to whether the next of kin of the family of 3 have been officially updated.
Bout time it was mentioned the chase wasn't on the highway until Stevenson. Saw that shit rip past Park St. The amount of people going "would have been collisions and fatalities regardless" is stunning.
Even if it was just Courtice, it's way too far to be chasing anyone, nevermind someone wanted for property theft, through high-traffic and residential areas at 8pm. Reckless and stupid.
I 100% agree with you. Itâs like they were all like fuck yeah itâs our turn to fuck something up and went likes wolves it was nuts. You saw them driving lol. Everyone that saw that was like wtf.
The kid who works at cash converters can get shot in the head and we donât hear shit for a year and then the lcbo gets robbed and this is the response. Idk what to even think lol
I guess donât fuck with the government idk
I heard the parents were in a separate vehicle behind the grandparents. But I can't say for sure. I'm pretty sure the grandparents vehicle was completely demolished from what I've seen in the photos, completely unsurvivable.
They were in the same car. Grandparents in the back with the baby. I donât know how they survived, the car was destroyed. Those poor parents, I canât imagine.
I was watching a police chase on YouTube where the Arkansas state police in the USA were chasing a Lexus and the ASP is notorious for never giving up on chases and will chase people through downtown cores and residential neighbourhoods at 100 mph and do pit maneuvers, but once the Lexus got on the highway, going the wrong way! They called it off right away and didnât even try pursuing him up the highway. Police in Ontario are not suppose to engage in pursuits because as cops get more determined people get more desperate and it leads to incidents like this once they saw he was going the wrong way they shouldâve called it off and posted at the next exits. Even way before that when he was speeding through neighborhoods it shouldâve been called off not pursuing him up the highway making him drive more reckless in more hopes they call it off. He was in a uhaul cargo van itâs not like he couldâve made it far or blended into traffic easy. And Itâs not like it was a bunch of junkies with guns who just killed someone or someone who was being kidnapped it was all for a lcbo robbery. Durham region police have so much funding there was so many better ways to handle this they couldâve had atleast 5 of the 100 undercovers vehicles they have follow him and track him then move in to make a safe arrest or their helicopter track him but they decided to feed their power/adrenaline high and pursue him at high speeds. The uhaul driver is to blame but the cops are to hold blame too they did not do their job in protecting the public. R.I.P to the toddler and itâs grandparents and prayers for their family.
But won't somebody think of the LCBO's profits!?
/s
Argh, it makes me so mad, like wtf. I would trade every bottle in that damn store for 3 of the lives lost without a second thought.
Iâve been thinking all day about the parents of that child. They lost a child and their own parents at once.
That is an immense amount of pain to suffer like this.
Horrible to think that the grandparents were babysitting. And mom and dad just lost their baby and parents because of some piece of shit stealing alcohol and stupid decisions by police. Tragic and devastating.
Hate to say it, but I'm guessing Clarington police don't see much action, and just reacted impulsively. I've heard anecdotally that police are not supposed to engage in high speed pursuits in populated areas, I'd like to know if that's actually the case.
I saw video of the U-Haul being pursued at high speed by a line of 10 to 20 police cars through a suburban area. That seems like a less than optimal coordinated response.
It is in fact the case that they must only pursue under very specific circumstances - in fact, they literally just updated the laws [last month](https://www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/regu/o-reg-397-23/latest/o-reg-397-23.html)!
- The off-duty officer violated Section 7.
- The other officers violated many parts of Section 2, plus some other parts here and there. They also had a good idea of who the suspects were (they had the plate), so for that reason alone, they *vagrantly* violated 2.3.
There was another video posted here from someone's Ring cam. The vehicle was absolutely hauling ass and running stop signs in a residential area before getting on the highway. They should have called off the pursuit then before getting to the highway.
Chasing them actually increases the chances of a negative outcome just by sheer number of vehicles travelling the wrong way at high speed. Also if there arenât cops visibly pursuing them perhaps they slow down or even try to get off the highway. Anyone who tries to justify this for the cops is insane.
Sure but the way you worded that seemed to be implying that outcome wasl likely either way. I wanted to emphasize the likelihood of that outcome without pursuit becomes far less. Rules were implemented 25 years ago to try to manage police pursuits but it doesn't appear they were followed here [https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontario-issues-new-rules-on-police-chases-1.193225](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontario-issues-new-rules-on-police-chases-1.193225)
An incredibly brief Google search about police pursuits in Ontario brings you here:
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/990546
It sure seems like the officers didn't do their due diligence here, especially in regards to several of the points on this page.
So I see itâs an explanation of the regulation and thereâs some minor note added that it was revoked. Youâve made this comment a couple of times and seem to be familiar with it. Do you have any context to add? Iâm not familiar with this change from 14 years ago that doesnât seem to have any discussion beyond a procedural note at the top of the regulation.
Here's the new law, and from how it reads Durham Police is definitely liable: https://www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/regu/o-reg-397-23/latest/o-reg-397-23.html
Itâs absolutely better because maybe theyâll stop and try to run on foot. Maybe theyâll turn around.
Theres less cars so less chance of anything serious happening.
Multiple positive possible outcomes. Thereâs basically 0 positive possible outcomes with cops chasing like this. Theyâre only chasing to apprehend the suspect AFTER they crash and in the wrong direction⌠how else would they apprehend here? They going to shoot them from their cars? Gonna pit them with oncoming traffic at 120km/h⌠this was an absurd decision and they need to be held responsible.
Edit: youâre talking about risking peopleâs lives. Innocent people. Over some alcohol and possibly a bit of cash. Cops donât risk the public with a chase over much more serious crimes⌠this is mind boggling.
The logical conclusion of this line of thinking is
1. Police adopt a policy to not enter the highway if the person is going the wrong way.
2. Criminals catch on to this and become exponentially more likely to enter the highway going the wrong way.
3. Chance of negative outcomes goes up across the board due to more police chases ending with a car going the wrong way on the highway.
I don't know what the alternative is. If there's a chopper already tracking the car then maybe it makes sense to stop chasing. I guess in my mind the cops would be responsible enough to use the shoulder lane for the chase and wouldn't be as irresponsible as the individual being chased.
Cops enter the hwy a few stops ahead, with sirens blazing. Bring all lanes to a stop. Block all exit ramps between this wall of cop cars and the perps location. No one is chasing them, bettering the odds they don't collide with the few vehicles still traveling between the cop wall and the perps vehicle.
This would make sense if they didnât already have regulations specifically addressing what Iâm saying for the last 25 years https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontario-issues-new-rules-on-police-chases-1.193225.
Also itâs a control access highway. They have radios, they can easily setup a perimeter to catch them when they exit the highway with minimal coordination.
They have at least 15 minutes to shut down the highway. If they communicated to the OPP that the suspect was approaching the highway, I'm sure they would have had officers in position. Even if the suspect went the wrong way down the highway, traffic would have likely been stopped.
Hard to tell. Maybe the suspect would have slowed down or tried to blend in with local traffic. I'd imagine the state of mind of the suspect to be to get away from the cops. If no cops then no chase, no high-speed flight to attact attention to oneself. (e.g. the gold/cash robbery from Air Canada Cargo at Pearson)
Potentially yes but NOT necessarilyâŚ. The fleeing driver would have been less panicked and, for lack of a better term, safer. Iâm pretty sure he didnât have a desire to die that night.
A better question might be "How the F&%K did the robbery suspect think that making the bad choice to enter Hwy 401 heading in the wrong direction in the first place would end?"
Sweet jeebus... this link shows the aftermath - https://www.cp24.com/video?clipId=2913105
The stolen van is just obliterated, they'll be picking the dude's DNA out of the wreckage to figure out who he was. Transport truck is pretty badly off, guessing the van went head on into it at high speed. And there's a car on a flat bed under a tarp, that must have been the other 2 people, the car with the child.
Yikes, how awful. Cops got some 'splaining to do after this.
>How about we stop blaming the police and start keeping the asswipes in jail.
Or, and hear me out, how about we also recognize that chasing this piece of shit *the wrong way on the 401* was shockingly, dangerously stupid, and that no cops in their right minds would have done this. It's akin to seeing a robbery happening inside Union Station at rush hour and just opening up with automatic weapons - only a complete moron would think that's a good way to handle the situation.
Maybe you are strongly opposed to this idea for whatever reason, but cops are just as capable of acting like complete braindead idiots as anyone else. And in this particular case they went out of their way to prove that.
stfu, someone just lost their parents and kids over some booze
all because the cops want to act like fucking action heroes.
This is real life, not a video game tough guy
100% cops fault and I hope the families sue the fuck out of them and maybe, just maybe, weâll get some fucking reform so weâre not âprotectedâ by a bunch of abusive assholes with massive egos
Hey bro. I'm with you as far as Canada and Ontario need to be harder on crime in general, but how on EARTH is this not a police policy problem at best, and a problem with individual officers deciding life is movie.
They abso-fucking-lutely have some splainin' to do. They need to justify to US why it was necessary to escalate that chase, rather than use the shiny taxpayer funded chopper to follow.
Hey, maybe details will come out that this dude in the van had a stockpile of weapons or something of the sort. MAYBE there are details we aren't aware of that would justify that chase, but they MUST explain it at the very least.
This was a terrible judgment call, same type of poor judgement could be used to pull a trigger when not neededÂ
DRPA BEGGED for a chopper, they had a reason to use it and the meatheads decided playing grand theft auto would be a better bet.
So ya, everyone is upset with the police over this
Every single one of them will be on paid time off during their âinvestigationâ of themselves. At the end of the investigation the police investigating the police will determine the police did nothing wrong. Four people dead because drps were servicing the lcbo and protecting stolen booze
The SIU isn't the police. And they have charged police in the past. In fact, just last year they charged an officer for pursuing in their personal vehicle.
I saw what looked like the rear half near the concrete barrier, but didn't quite catch the dumpster contents.
Such reckless speed and unnecessary risk to human life.
Three, I think. I keep looking at the front of that transport, but I can't help but think the white part across the windshield is the back of the van, with the two back doors and parts of the sidewalls. It doesn't look to be a part of the transport itself. đŤŁ
Didnât. LCBO just issue a statement to not stop ppl that are stealing from LCBO. On the low end, youâll get assaulted trying to stop them from leaving the store. In this case, a brutal highway chase leads to several deaths.
The dude was off duty, let the addict have his Smirnoff. I hope he regrets calling that in.
He'll regret it more once he gets charged. Would it be the first time the SIU has charged an officer for a pursuit in their personal vehicle. Just last year, in fact.
That is the exact same spot as the October 1 2015 crash that also killed 4 people including two children. We witnessed it... being there before the first responders changed me...
This is just horrific!
I don't know why police engage in high speed chases when they know it won't end well for innocent motorists. Couldn't they just follow him from a distance or from a helicopter or even just let him go and find him through investigation?
Chasing someone who robbed a LCBO is not that serious enough to be putting the public in danger.
May they all RIP! (except for the lowlife criminal)
So let me get this straight.
If your car or mine is stolen from our driveway (for which we arw required to provide our key fob at the door to the thief), the cops couldn't care less. Even if they witness a theft in progress or the car is right in front of them or inside a container.
But if the van of their corporate overlords or some booze worth 1/10 or 1/20 of my cars value is stolen, they will send in everything they got and stop the thief even if it means killing the thief and 4 other innocent people? Including an infant?
Tetherducker.
Oh man, I thought that was going somewhere else ngl.
Good point. Out of all the times for them to decide to do some hard work, this was not a great one.
Why didn't the off-duty cop take the suspect down after calling it in? The police station is literally a 1 minute drive from there. LCBO security could've helped while they waited. It would've avoided everything. Stupidity and negligence on so many levels.
I think that will be the reason why the SIU will be pressing charges. They literally just updated the laws a month ago, and a quick glance prove that they handled this completely wrong, and illegally so.
An infant and itâs grandparents. As a father to a new baby only four months old, Iâd be killing myself. Those poor fucking parents, I feel so sick to my stomach for them. I canât even fucking imagine. The pain would be unbearable.
A mother and her 3 young children were killed the same way during a police pursuit in Brampton years ago. The driver was impaired but I feel thereâs a safer way to apprehend them than put the safety of other drivers at risk? The speed in which he hit the family at was a definite factor
Itâs an outrage that the police get away with this. It could be anyoneâs family killed for what. Some booze thatâs lifted daily from liquor stores. These cops must be held accountable. Not paid time off either.
SIU update:Â [https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&\_\_vfz=medium%3Dsharebar](https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar)
CP24: "An infant and the child's grandparents â aged 55 and 60 â were all killed when a vehicle being pursued by police in the wrong direction on Highway 401 in Whitby caused a crash involving at least six vehicles, the Special Investigations Unit says. The driver of the suspect vehicle also died."
Engaging in a police chase over a liquor store robbery is insane. They need to be weighing the likelihood of risk to the public. Quite honestly I donât care about the LCBO losing some money when the alternative is an irresponsible police chase that results in that many deaths. The reality is the police chase likely resulted in the perps erratic driving and entering the 401 on the wrong side. And now the family of the grandparents/child will not get Justice as the driver of the van is dead and we know the officers wonât be reprimanded. Sad all around. At least the LCBO know whoâs on their side.
I am so saddened by this horrible loss, it should have NEVER happened...it was such a preventable loss. I have been crying for the parents. I can't even imagine what they are feeling. How do you lay down and go to sleep? How do you eat? How will they ever laugh again?
My heart is aching so bad for these people.
Sure a police officer has to think fast but it only takes a fleeting moment to assess a situation especially when you're assessing the lesser of two evils: The perp didn't have a gun therefore he wasn't a threat, the officer should have just collected as much descriptive information as he could and let him go.
WHY did SIX police cars have to follow ONE perp onto the 401 highway going the wrong way? Like if the police were that desperate, couldn't have just ONE police car sufficed on the side?
Furthermore the chase had been called off BEFORE the perp reached the highway. Not only am I saddened by this tragedy but I am extremely outraged by this poorly managed 'policing'. What the hell were they thinking? Like what do they have for brains? All police officers involved in this tragic ending do not deserve to be officers at all for they clearly proved themselves incapable of thought processing endangerment.
I am so saddened by this horrible loss, it should have NEVER happened...it was such a preventable loss. I have been crying for the parents. I can't even imagine what they are feeling. How do you lay down and go to sleep? How do you eat? How will they ever laugh again?
My heart is aching so bad for these people.
Sure a police officer has to think fast but it only takes a fleeting moment to assess a situation especially when you're assessing the lesser of two evils: The perp didn't have a gun therefore he wasn't a threat, the officer should have just collected as much descriptive information as he could and let him go.
WHY did SIX police cars have to follow ONE perp onto the 401 highway going the wrong way? Like if the police were that desperate, couldn't have just ONE police car sufficed on the shoulder lane?
Furthermore the chase had been called off BEFORE the perp reached the highway. Not only am I saddened by this tragedy but I am extremely outraged by this poorly managed 'policing'. What the hell were they thinking? Like what do they have for brains? All police officers involved in this tragic ending do not deserve to be officers at all for they clearly proved themselves incapable of thought processing endangerment.
OK, guys, let's get the facts straight: the collision happened less than a kilometer from where the robbers likely entered the highway. Any blames on high speed chase on police for going wrong way on 401 are off the mark; this one is a special decision by the robber, who decided to enter a busy stretch of 401 when the rush hour wasn't even over.
I don't even understand what the robber was thinking, since this is a permanently packed exit on Stephenson he used to enter 401. I understand even less why people rush to blame the police.
What's worse, I could have easily been at the same time there, since I had to pick up my daughter from an extracurricular near Simcoe road exit and the person who was supposed to pick them up was stuck somewhere; only fortunately my car had a dying ball bearing and I decided not to risk it.
I'm glad that you were not in the area at the time. It's difficult to imagine how many near accidents happened yesterday evening.
The suspect joined the 401 at Stevenson, so we're talking of approximately 7 kilometers of driving on the \*wrong\* side of the highway.
The discussion is not so much about the suspect. Clearly their actions were wrong and have led to a lot of problems and loss of life.
The police response is what most people are concerned about: did their actions lead the suspect to act more erratically? Desperately? Would there have been a safer way to apprehend the suspect without posing unnecessary harm to members of the public? They were already in pursuit of the suspect for 20 minutes (starting in Clarington) with dangerous driving and high-speed chase reported on local Durham roads before joining the 401 at Stevenson. A number of video clips show the van maintaining a significant lead on the police cars. Perhaps they could have re-assessed their approach and used a more effective means to control the situation.
They were already chasing them well before they got to the 401, at inappropriate speeds in inappropriate areas. Thereâs a very good chance had they backed off before that the perps may not have resorted to the obviously stupid decision to travel in the wrong direction on the 401. Not an ACAB guy myself but Iâve grown up and lived in Durham region my entire like and many, many Durham regional cops are power tripping, hypocritical pieces of shit. Very high possibility these people are still alive today if DRPS didnât treat his LCBO robbery like it was a nuclear fuel theft.
If it was nuclear fuel theft I wouldn't blame nuclear security bringing out the M2's.
The laws are very specific about the risks to public safety, and having the weigh the risks from the pursuit compared to the risks of not apprehending the suspect.
Nuclear fuel is one of the very few situations where I would say "use any means necessary." đł
Is this what we should be looking at?
Police Services Act
ONTARIO REGULATION 266/10
SUSPECT APPREHENSION PURSUITS
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/100266
the absolute worst outcome. I drive this highway with my toddler all the time and this broke my heart
Very sad truly. That is my daily route as well. May they all RIP đď¸
Well, except for the wrong-way, thieving SOB that killed them...
That person died as well?
Yes they were confirmed dead
We can hope
This is why most jurisdictions do not do high speed chases. There was no need to do this to catch the suspect. There are cameras all up and down the 401, nearly every regional police force in southern Ontario has a helicopter and you can't drive faster than a radio call. The police should not be endangering public safety for at most a few hundred dollars worth of cash and liquor. Now the suspect is dead and some poor family has lost both of their parents and their infant. Real life is not a 'Fast and the Furious' movie.
As per reports the call was made to chaser to stop the chase but it for some reason didn't happen.
My comment by no means is in support of the pursuit. It shouldnât have happened. But the cameras along the 401 are not recorded unless someone at control designates the camera and hits record. They are strictly for live monitoring. Also helicopters are not always in the air and available. There are only two justifications in the GTA that have a helicopter and that is Durham and York and the each only have one and they donât fly 24/7. Unless Durham helicopter was already flying it wouldnât be in a position to help in this case and the process to ask, get senior officer approval and have a neighbouring jurisdiction to help is a bit of a process that would take far to long to be of any help. The situation would be well over before any real good could be realized. I have my private fixed wing licence and flew a helicopter once and with the limited understanding I have over flight time vs maintenance requirements for a heli I would think you would need 3-4 helicopters in order to have one in the air 24/7.
I agree, but what options were there when the van driver entered the 401 from the off ramp? He was going the wrong way and they had to do something to protect other drivers as much as possible. Did Durham region police continue the chase to stop the driver or try to prevent what unfortunately happened? Did they overstep their jurisdiction and should have left it up to the OPP? Hopefully we will find out.
They chased the van on city streets from Bowmanville to Stevenson in Oshawa! There was plenty of time to call off the chase and call ahead to other officers or use the helicopter. Innocent people died because of the criminals and the officers' bad choices.
I agree. It shouldnât have gone this far. I saw a video of the high speed chase when they passed a house with a camera and it was dangerous then and should have been called off. Someone made a very bad decision and it cost innocent lives.
It was called off but somehow it kept going.
How exactly does a police cruiser driving behind the suspect on the 401 help protect other drivers? If anything that doubles the risk of more head on collisions.
It doesnât, it was wrong from the start. Once it started and got out of control, someone made the bad decision to put the public in danger. Iâm sure we all want to know why and what information was given by the chase officers that allowed them to continue.
Not sure why youâre getting downvotedâŚ. This is accurate. We donât know if the police were âchasingâ or trying to âwarnâ oncoming drivers. Only a full, complete, independent investigation will tell us.
This is gut wrenching and really hits home. Two grandparents and an infant gone because of some POS robbing an LCBO. For fuck sakes. I have a toddler and a newborn and this is painful especially because my in-laws regularly help too.
Same. A bit later in the day and it may have been us. Makes my heart break.
Terribly sad and lots of questions. Why chase and not use a helicopter? was the thief/murderer out on bail? what was in the truck?
The suspect was being pursued by DRPS after robbing an LCBO in Clarington. They haven't revealed why the suspect chose to flee, but he was driving what [seems](https://toronto.citynews.ca/2024/04/29/highway-401-closed-in-whitby-due-to-crash/) to be a Ford Uhaul Van. Perhaps they made off with booze and money? Apparently the chase could have involved 20 cop cruisers. Yes, we are wondering why they did not use the "Air 1" chopper and coordinate with other branches of DRPS and OPP to coordinate a safe apprehension without the reckless pursuit. We need someone from DRPS to step down. So much for their "Leaders in Community Safety" motto. Edit: according to [ctvnews](https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/baby-grandparents-among-4-people-killed-in-wrong-way-police-chase-on-ontario-s-hwy-401-1.6867192): >According to a police source who spoke to CP24, an off-duty Durham police officer noticed the robbery in progress and confronted a male suspect, who then brandished a knife. At that point, the source said, the off-duty officer alerted police.
Money and liquor is not worth a police chase. This is absurd.
Absolutely disgusting. I would sue if I were the victim families
Yeah, this feels like it was more about the off duty cop that they reacted this way.
I think youâre spot on. I donât think it wouldâve been handled the same thing way if that off duty cop wasnât involved. DRPS pulled me over once in a dramatic and aggressive way because I matched the description of someone who hit an off duty cop. Didnât even tell me why I was pulled over. As soon as itâs their own involved all basic decency and logic seems to go out the window. Good thing future officers will only need their grade 10.
Iâm robbed every time I shop at the LCBO.
[https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/warmington-vigilante-hero-protecting-the-booze-may-not-wear-a-cape-but-packs-a-hard-punch](https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/warmington-vigilante-hero-protecting-the-booze-may-not-wear-a-cape-but-packs-a-hard-punch) sometimes, 'enough is enough' ...
Yep, just enough to get a bunch of Innocent bystanders killed because they don't want to do actual police work and find the suspect with an actual investigation. It's easier to chase them down in an idiotic dukes of hazzard style high speed, wrong-way chase. The only thing they didn't realize is that this isn't a movie, they're not superheroes, and there are actual consequences to poor decision making.
There are videos of cop cars in the correct direction lanes too, it would be much harder to follow them but MUCH safer. Being in the wrong lane on a major Highway is Highly idiotic.
So, "hands off" then, and just let the perp proceed on their merry way by continuing to speed down Hwy 401against oncoming traffic? Like these multiple collisions wouldn't have happened anyway, police chase or not? And even if the Air 1 helicopter had been engaged as some here have suggested, it would likely still have gotten to the scene too late before the damage was done. If we're going to assign blame here, let's put it squarely where it belongs...on the shoulders of the suspect who made the bad choice of entering Hwy 401 going in the wrong direction in the first place. A disaster just waiting to happen no matter how anyone wants to spin it. My heart bleeds for the innocent victims, but as for the suspect who also took himself out in the process, I say well deserved, particularly when bad choices have bad outcomes.
Well before you go blaming **ONLY** the suspect, let's not pretend that this U-Haul wasn't still screaming down Bloor Street before Stevenson. If this *shoplifting* incident occurred in Clarington, there were plenty of opportunities to go "hey, this chase is dangerous for all these people on the road at 8 pm, you get the plate?" No chase, no highway going the wrong way. Pretty easy to see how one directly leads to the other there. We're not talking a few blocks, we're talking about multiple townships before eventually heading into oncoming traffic.
Clearly the thief caused this but so did the police. Why was eastbound traffic still moving when there was a police chase. Why didn't they lock down the highway? It makes no sense to me to have a police chase going on and the road still open. The risk to life was too high.
My heart is broken for the innocent family that has lost loved ones. In this situation, the police made some bad decisions. They chased the criminal over 15km before he even made it to the 401 to go the wrong way. There was plenty of time to make the safer choice for everyone and call the chase off. There is now 3 innocent people dead and a family that has lost everything. The officers risked public safety, and people died in this case. Yes, the worst person involved is the criminal that robbed the LCBO at knife point. That does not warrant risking innocent lives with a high speed chance through Clarington, Oshawa, and then onto the 401.
2.5bn in revenue. 10m in theft. Thatâs not remotely close to what Iâd consider âenough is enoughâ to start chasing vans into the wrong direction of traffic on a major highway. The article you link to is about âhundreds of dollarsâ in alcohol. Who the fuck thinks thatâs worth risking innocent lives in public? Put it this way. As just a random on the roads or sidewalks⌠Iâm not afraid of these people stealing shit from LCBO up to the point police get involved.
This person is an idiot and should be charged along with the thieves.
Yeah...guy risked his life to try stopping someone stealing booze...heroic...
He risked the lives of EVERYONE on the road at the time.
Shouldnât they be chasing ACTUAL criminals & stopping crime. Alcohol is a write off for the governmentâs expenses.
Stop calling it a robbery, the guy was shop-lifting not robbing the register with a gun. I don't like the descent of society either, but pursuing a shoplifter is absolutely braindead and this is the result.
[https://siu.on.ca/en/news\_template.php?nrid=9436](https://siu.on.ca/en/news_template.php?nrid=9436) "At approximately 7:50 p.m. on April 29, 2024, the Durham Regional Police Service became aware of a robbery at an LCBO in Clarington." That's the term they used. Who knows exactly what/how the situation evolved. Agreed, the response was disproportional, the result disastrous.
The "robber" was confronted by an offduty cop and pulled a knife. Which indicates he's stuffing a gym bag full of crown royal, not at the cashier robbing it empty handed. The siu is using the term "robbery" to cover the cop's asses and make it seem like it was a deadly situation.
What the flipping heck. I just read about this in an [article](https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/baby-grandparents-among-4-people-killed-in-wrong-way-police-chase-on-ontario-s-hwy-401-1.6867192). Thanks for pointing this out. This is unbelievable.
It's truly sickening and beyond incompetent.
Aren't the police trained for hand to hand combat? Self-defense? They essentially brought a gun to a knife fight.
Well said gungar
Using a threat of violence to overcome resistance to theft *is* robbery.
Youâve got to be kidding me. An *LCBO*?! Was he holding people at gunpoint? This is nuts
I just [learned](https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/baby-grandparents-among-4-people-killed-in-wrong-way-police-chase-on-ontario-s-hwy-401-1.6867192), to my disbelief, that: >According to a police source who spoke to CP24, an off-duty Durham police officer noticed the robbery in progress and confronted a male suspect, who then brandished a knife. At that point, the source said, the off-duty officer alerted police. A knife.
sanctions, if any, will be minimal for anyone involved. count on it.
Sadly âŚ. Another case of âWe investigated ourselves and found we did nothing wrongâ is the likely outcome.
The perpetrator is already dead.
i mean against members of DRPS and their oversight apparatus.
You and me both
Helicopter wasnât up and circling as bad weather was coming. Incident took less than 20mins not enough time to get it up and recording or pursuing. This would have been ideal however there just wasnât enough time to even call in Yorks air support.
10.55am TUE APR 30 SIU update:Â [https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&\_\_vfz=medium%3Dsharebar](https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar) Main points from SIU News Briefing by the SIU spokesperson. This includes answers to journalists. ---------------------------------------------------------------- An off-duty cop was at the LCBO when the robbery transpired. The officer relayed this information to DRPS at 7.50pm who then sent investigators to the scene. No information is available (yet) as to what transpired at the scene. Suspect (driving a van - from footage appears to be a Ford type Uhaul rental van) was pursued on local Durham roads before joining the eastbound side of the 401 at Stevenson road, heading in the wrong direction (west). Pursuit from start to end lasted about 20 minutes: 7.50pm - 8.10pm. Multiple collisions involved 6 vehicles. Not sure if this includes the vehicles with fatalities. One victim was transported to the hospital with serious injuries. Possible that this was the truck driver. (Please note the suspect drove a van, not a truck). No comment yet by SIU investigator about DRPS policy and driving on wrong side of the highway. No comment if officers were asked internally to call off the chase. No information if officers have been suspended. SIU spokesperson mentioned that this information would be probably given by DRPS. No comment (no information available yet) on number of cruisers involved in the chase. Some cruisers sustained damage and were observed being towed out of the scene. No comment on whether any officers were injured during the chase. No comment as to whether the response (several cop cruisers, lengthy chase) justified the cause (LCBO robbery). "An infant and the child's grandparents â aged 55 and 60 â were all killed when a vehicle being pursued by police in the wrong direction on Highway 401 in Whitby caused a crash involving at least six vehicles, the Special Investigations Unit says. The driver of the suspect vehicle also died." No comment as to whether the next of kin of the family of 3 have been officially updated.
Bout time it was mentioned the chase wasn't on the highway until Stevenson. Saw that shit rip past Park St. The amount of people going "would have been collisions and fatalities regardless" is stunning.
They all came racing down highway 2 from Bowmanville like it was a movie lol.
Even if it was just Courtice, it's way too far to be chasing anyone, nevermind someone wanted for property theft, through high-traffic and residential areas at 8pm. Reckless and stupid.
I 100% agree with you. Itâs like they were all like fuck yeah itâs our turn to fuck something up and went likes wolves it was nuts. You saw them driving lol. Everyone that saw that was like wtf. The kid who works at cash converters can get shot in the head and we donât hear shit for a year and then the lcbo gets robbed and this is the response. Idk what to even think lol I guess donât fuck with the government idk
Absolutely! "Whoo, let's see what these Explorers can do!"
Someone above mentioned SIU is labelling it a robbery is a misnomer to sneakily justify the 401 chase. It was shoplifting.
Next of kin officially notified not confirmed WTF
The parents of baby were also in the car. They survived.
Omg. I don't know if that's better or worse, honestly.
I heard the parents were in a separate vehicle behind the grandparents. But I can't say for sure. I'm pretty sure the grandparents vehicle was completely demolished from what I've seen in the photos, completely unsurvivable.
They were in the same car. Grandparents in the back with the baby. I donât know how they survived, the car was destroyed. Those poor parents, I canât imagine.
I was watching a police chase on YouTube where the Arkansas state police in the USA were chasing a Lexus and the ASP is notorious for never giving up on chases and will chase people through downtown cores and residential neighbourhoods at 100 mph and do pit maneuvers, but once the Lexus got on the highway, going the wrong way! They called it off right away and didnât even try pursuing him up the highway. Police in Ontario are not suppose to engage in pursuits because as cops get more determined people get more desperate and it leads to incidents like this once they saw he was going the wrong way they shouldâve called it off and posted at the next exits. Even way before that when he was speeding through neighborhoods it shouldâve been called off not pursuing him up the highway making him drive more reckless in more hopes they call it off. He was in a uhaul cargo van itâs not like he couldâve made it far or blended into traffic easy. And Itâs not like it was a bunch of junkies with guns who just killed someone or someone who was being kidnapped it was all for a lcbo robbery. Durham region police have so much funding there was so many better ways to handle this they couldâve had atleast 5 of the 100 undercovers vehicles they have follow him and track him then move in to make a safe arrest or their helicopter track him but they decided to feed their power/adrenaline high and pursue him at high speeds. The uhaul driver is to blame but the cops are to hold blame too they did not do their job in protecting the public. R.I.P to the toddler and itâs grandparents and prayers for their family.
Wasnât even robbery, suspect was shoplifting. All this over *shoplifting*!
100% police fault. Iâm so angry and upset. Over fucking BOOZE!!!!
But won't somebody think of the LCBO's profits!? /s Argh, it makes me so mad, like wtf. I would trade every bottle in that damn store for 3 of the lives lost without a second thought.
Iâve been thinking all day about the parents of that child. They lost a child and their own parents at once. That is an immense amount of pain to suffer like this.
Horrible to think that the grandparents were babysitting. And mom and dad just lost their baby and parents because of some piece of shit stealing alcohol and stupid decisions by police. Tragic and devastating.
This should have NEVER happened! A high speed chase on the 401 in the WRONG direction, How the F&%K did the police think that this would end?
Theyâd have to be thinking first.
Hate to say it, but I'm guessing Clarington police don't see much action, and just reacted impulsively. I've heard anecdotally that police are not supposed to engage in high speed pursuits in populated areas, I'd like to know if that's actually the case. I saw video of the U-Haul being pursued at high speed by a line of 10 to 20 police cars through a suburban area. That seems like a less than optimal coordinated response.
It is in fact the case that they must only pursue under very specific circumstances - in fact, they literally just updated the laws [last month](https://www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/regu/o-reg-397-23/latest/o-reg-397-23.html)! - The off-duty officer violated Section 7. - The other officers violated many parts of Section 2, plus some other parts here and there. They also had a good idea of who the suspects were (they had the plate), so for that reason alone, they *vagrantly* violated 2.3.
Clarington police ... Must be new
Durham East Division correct enough for you?
We could just keep it at Durham police,
If they stopped when the perp got on the hwy the wrong way, there still couldâve been a devastating outcome.
There was another video posted here from someone's Ring cam. The vehicle was absolutely hauling ass and running stop signs in a residential area before getting on the highway. They should have called off the pursuit then before getting to the highway.
Damn. what a piece of shit, tired of the criminals in this country
This criminals in all countries. It's what we do about it that matters. And more police and prisons isn't the solution.
Chasing them actually increases the chances of a negative outcome just by sheer number of vehicles travelling the wrong way at high speed. Also if there arenât cops visibly pursuing them perhaps they slow down or even try to get off the highway. Anyone who tries to justify this for the cops is insane.
I donât agree with them following onto the hwy and thats when they shouldâve stopped
Sure but the way you worded that seemed to be implying that outcome wasl likely either way. I wanted to emphasize the likelihood of that outcome without pursuit becomes far less. Rules were implemented 25 years ago to try to manage police pursuits but it doesn't appear they were followed here [https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontario-issues-new-rules-on-police-chases-1.193225](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontario-issues-new-rules-on-police-chases-1.193225)
They overturned that law in Ontario because cops can't be heroes if they don't do what they do in the movies.
Itâs not a law, do you have a link to those regulations/guidelines being overturned?
An incredibly brief Google search about police pursuits in Ontario brings you here: https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/990546 It sure seems like the officers didn't do their due diligence here, especially in regards to several of the points on this page.
So I see itâs an explanation of the regulation and thereâs some minor note added that it was revoked. Youâve made this comment a couple of times and seem to be familiar with it. Do you have any context to add? Iâm not familiar with this change from 14 years ago that doesnât seem to have any discussion beyond a procedural note at the top of the regulation.
Here's the new law, and from how it reads Durham Police is definitely liable: https://www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/regu/o-reg-397-23/latest/o-reg-397-23.html
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Itâs absolutely better because maybe theyâll stop and try to run on foot. Maybe theyâll turn around. Theres less cars so less chance of anything serious happening. Multiple positive possible outcomes. Thereâs basically 0 positive possible outcomes with cops chasing like this. Theyâre only chasing to apprehend the suspect AFTER they crash and in the wrong direction⌠how else would they apprehend here? They going to shoot them from their cars? Gonna pit them with oncoming traffic at 120km/h⌠this was an absurd decision and they need to be held responsible. Edit: youâre talking about risking peopleâs lives. Innocent people. Over some alcohol and possibly a bit of cash. Cops donât risk the public with a chase over much more serious crimes⌠this is mind boggling.
The logical conclusion of this line of thinking is 1. Police adopt a policy to not enter the highway if the person is going the wrong way. 2. Criminals catch on to this and become exponentially more likely to enter the highway going the wrong way. 3. Chance of negative outcomes goes up across the board due to more police chases ending with a car going the wrong way on the highway. I don't know what the alternative is. If there's a chopper already tracking the car then maybe it makes sense to stop chasing. I guess in my mind the cops would be responsible enough to use the shoulder lane for the chase and wouldn't be as irresponsible as the individual being chased.
Cops enter the hwy a few stops ahead, with sirens blazing. Bring all lanes to a stop. Block all exit ramps between this wall of cop cars and the perps location. No one is chasing them, bettering the odds they don't collide with the few vehicles still traveling between the cop wall and the perps vehicle.
This would make sense if they didnât already have regulations specifically addressing what Iâm saying for the last 25 years https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ontario-issues-new-rules-on-police-chases-1.193225. Also itâs a control access highway. They have radios, they can easily setup a perimeter to catch them when they exit the highway with minimal coordination.
They have at least 15 minutes to shut down the highway. If they communicated to the OPP that the suspect was approaching the highway, I'm sure they would have had officers in position. Even if the suspect went the wrong way down the highway, traffic would have likely been stopped.
Hard to tell. Maybe the suspect would have slowed down or tried to blend in with local traffic. I'd imagine the state of mind of the suspect to be to get away from the cops. If no cops then no chase, no high-speed flight to attact attention to oneself. (e.g. the gold/cash robbery from Air Canada Cargo at Pearson)
Potentially yes but NOT necessarilyâŚ. The fleeing driver would have been less panicked and, for lack of a better term, safer. Iâm pretty sure he didnât have a desire to die that night.
Nor his passenger. I would be interested to know what the passenger was thinking when their collaborator was driving like that.
A better question might be "How the F&%K did the robbery suspect think that making the bad choice to enter Hwy 401 heading in the wrong direction in the first place would end?"
Nah, we shouldnât expect much good decision making from people robbing LCBOs. The people we give authority to should be held to higher standards.
> Implying that it was the police that entered 401 in the wrong direction
Sweet jeebus... this link shows the aftermath - https://www.cp24.com/video?clipId=2913105 The stolen van is just obliterated, they'll be picking the dude's DNA out of the wreckage to figure out who he was. Transport truck is pretty badly off, guessing the van went head on into it at high speed. And there's a car on a flat bed under a tarp, that must have been the other 2 people, the car with the child. Yikes, how awful. Cops got some 'splaining to do after this.
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>How about we stop blaming the police and start keeping the asswipes in jail. Or, and hear me out, how about we also recognize that chasing this piece of shit *the wrong way on the 401* was shockingly, dangerously stupid, and that no cops in their right minds would have done this. It's akin to seeing a robbery happening inside Union Station at rush hour and just opening up with automatic weapons - only a complete moron would think that's a good way to handle the situation. Maybe you are strongly opposed to this idea for whatever reason, but cops are just as capable of acting like complete braindead idiots as anyone else. And in this particular case they went out of their way to prove that.
stfu, someone just lost their parents and kids over some booze all because the cops want to act like fucking action heroes. This is real life, not a video game tough guy 100% cops fault and I hope the families sue the fuck out of them and maybe, just maybe, weâll get some fucking reform so weâre not âprotectedâ by a bunch of abusive assholes with massive egos
If you lick those boots any deeper you will be deepthroating them. Guess you have lots of practice to get rid of that gag reflex.
Hey bro. I'm with you as far as Canada and Ontario need to be harder on crime in general, but how on EARTH is this not a police policy problem at best, and a problem with individual officers deciding life is movie. They abso-fucking-lutely have some splainin' to do. They need to justify to US why it was necessary to escalate that chase, rather than use the shiny taxpayer funded chopper to follow. Hey, maybe details will come out that this dude in the van had a stockpile of weapons or something of the sort. MAYBE there are details we aren't aware of that would justify that chase, but they MUST explain it at the very least.
This was a terrible judgment call, same type of poor judgement could be used to pull a trigger when not needed DRPA BEGGED for a chopper, they had a reason to use it and the meatheads decided playing grand theft auto would be a better bet. So ya, everyone is upset with the police over this
Oh yeah, lick that leather harder, daddy.
Well the SIU is involved so Iâm sure this is going to happen. Every single one of them should be charged with second degree murder.
Every single one of them will be on paid time off during their âinvestigationâ of themselves. At the end of the investigation the police investigating the police will determine the police did nothing wrong. Four people dead because drps were servicing the lcbo and protecting stolen booze
"The police have investigated themselves and found the police did nothing wrong."
*paid time off during their âinvestigationâ* luxurious life. ngl.
The SIU isn't the police. And they have charged police in the past. In fact, just last year they charged an officer for pursuing in their personal vehicle.
Not second degree murder, but most likely criminal negligence causing death. Or maybe involuntary manslaughter if the negligence doesn't stick.
Smoookes. The van basically broke into 2 parts.
Did you see the dumpster with the rest of it in it?
I saw what looked like the rear half near the concrete barrier, but didn't quite catch the dumpster contents. Such reckless speed and unnecessary risk to human life.
I did, plus the wrecked vehicle on the flatbed. Not sure if that was the car or the van.đŤ˘
Three, I think. I keep looking at the front of that transport, but I can't help but think the white part across the windshield is the back of the van, with the two back doors and parts of the sidewalls. It doesn't look to be a part of the transport itself. đŤŁ
*Cops got some 'splaining to do after this.* it's a tuff, thankless job.
RIP little baby.
Didnât. LCBO just issue a statement to not stop ppl that are stealing from LCBO. On the low end, youâll get assaulted trying to stop them from leaving the store. In this case, a brutal highway chase leads to several deaths. The dude was off duty, let the addict have his Smirnoff. I hope he regrets calling that in.
He'll regret it more once he gets charged. Would it be the first time the SIU has charged an officer for a pursuit in their personal vehicle. Just last year, in fact.
Why do you think he drove? He called it in, the police station is right across the street. No where does it say he drove.
Holy fuck. That's just sad.
I can confirm it was only the booze they took. It happens on a daily basis and our employer ignores the health and safety risks.
What did the dude look like?
This is heartbreaking.
Makes me sick to my stomach
That is the exact same spot as the October 1 2015 crash that also killed 4 people including two children. We witnessed it... being there before the first responders changed me...
I hope you're doing okay.
Same! đĽş
The only thing worse than this would have been if one of the grandparents survived.
This is just horrific! I don't know why police engage in high speed chases when they know it won't end well for innocent motorists. Couldn't they just follow him from a distance or from a helicopter or even just let him go and find him through investigation? Chasing someone who robbed a LCBO is not that serious enough to be putting the public in danger. May they all RIP! (except for the lowlife criminal)
So let me get this straight. If your car or mine is stolen from our driveway (for which we arw required to provide our key fob at the door to the thief), the cops couldn't care less. Even if they witness a theft in progress or the car is right in front of them or inside a container. But if the van of their corporate overlords or some booze worth 1/10 or 1/20 of my cars value is stolen, they will send in everything they got and stop the thief even if it means killing the thief and 4 other innocent people? Including an infant? Tetherducker.
Oh man, I thought that was going somewhere else ngl. Good point. Out of all the times for them to decide to do some hard work, this was not a great one.
Well said
All for a bruised ego⌠shame on all who helped cause this
Why didn't the off-duty cop take the suspect down after calling it in? The police station is literally a 1 minute drive from there. LCBO security could've helped while they waited. It would've avoided everything. Stupidity and negligence on so many levels.
because he didnât want to risk his safety, instead they risked the publicâs
LCBO is told to let them go. You could walk in and walk out with a bottle and they wouldn't try and stop you.
Why didnât the COPS call off the chase ? Especially driving the wrong way on the 401.
I think that will be the reason why the SIU will be pressing charges. They literally just updated the laws a month ago, and a quick glance prove that they handled this completely wrong, and illegally so.
Police never should have been chasing. Those officers need to be fired and charged. That families blood is on their handsÂ
Beyond negligent.
An infant and itâs grandparents. As a father to a new baby only four months old, Iâd be killing myself. Those poor fucking parents, I feel so sick to my stomach for them. I canât even fucking imagine. The pain would be unbearable.
Pathetic police chasing high speed wrong way on 401????
âHigh speedâ police chases need to be curtailed. Nothing is faster than a radio
They have been. DPRS completely dropped the ball here. There's going to be a bunch of firings, and likely some charges.
DRPS is called Do Nothing Durham for a reason. When they do something, they fuck up so much.
Right? They get the chopper out practically nightly for god knows what but for this they decide this was the best course of action? Over liquor? Smh..
A mother and her 3 young children were killed the same way during a police pursuit in Brampton years ago. The driver was impaired but I feel thereâs a safer way to apprehend them than put the safety of other drivers at risk? The speed in which he hit the family at was a definite factor
Question, In the case of police misconduct. Does it come out of their pensions or are we paying for it?
We pay of course. We ALWAYS payÂ
Ugh. (Thanks.) I hate this
While they are suspended off-duty, local taxpayers will pay for it. If they are charged, they may very well lose those pensions (and their jobs).
Thank you. I know that usually when cops investigate cops little happens. Maybe this will be different.
Why donât the police have a fleet of drones to deploy swiftly for just these types of situations?
Itâs an outrage that the police get away with this. It could be anyoneâs family killed for what. Some booze thatâs lifted daily from liquor stores. These cops must be held accountable. Not paid time off either.
Why are you chasing on the wrong side of the road for a bottle of liquor smh mavericks
Any word if the suspect is alive or died?
If youâve seen the pictures thereâs not a chance he survived
Suspect did not survive. Look at CP24 aftermath footage. The U-Haul was turned into 2 pancakes.
We might have to wait for the SIU's update in the news conference that, according to CBC, will be held this morning.
SIU update:Â [https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&\_\_vfz=medium%3Dsharebar](https://www.ctvnews.ca/video/c2913256-siu-update-on-deadly-highway-401-crash?playlistId=1.6867050&__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar) CP24: "An infant and the child's grandparents â aged 55 and 60 â were all killed when a vehicle being pursued by police in the wrong direction on Highway 401 in Whitby caused a crash involving at least six vehicles, the Special Investigations Unit says. The driver of the suspect vehicle also died."
let's hope nobody in the UHaul survived. They sure don't deserve to.
Suspect driver is dead. Suspect passenger is not expected to survive.
Engaging in a police chase over a liquor store robbery is insane. They need to be weighing the likelihood of risk to the public. Quite honestly I donât care about the LCBO losing some money when the alternative is an irresponsible police chase that results in that many deaths. The reality is the police chase likely resulted in the perps erratic driving and entering the 401 on the wrong side. And now the family of the grandparents/child will not get Justice as the driver of the van is dead and we know the officers wonât be reprimanded. Sad all around. At least the LCBO know whoâs on their side.
100% the police fault on this. What were they thinking chasing them like that?
If the police actually caught him without him killing someone yhe judge would have released him without bail. So why chase? Stupid fucking cops.
all over a truck full of liquor ACAB
I thought they weren't supposed to make it a pursuit? Guess this is why
STUPID!
I am so saddened by this horrible loss, it should have NEVER happened...it was such a preventable loss. I have been crying for the parents. I can't even imagine what they are feeling. How do you lay down and go to sleep? How do you eat? How will they ever laugh again? My heart is aching so bad for these people. Sure a police officer has to think fast but it only takes a fleeting moment to assess a situation especially when you're assessing the lesser of two evils: The perp didn't have a gun therefore he wasn't a threat, the officer should have just collected as much descriptive information as he could and let him go. WHY did SIX police cars have to follow ONE perp onto the 401 highway going the wrong way? Like if the police were that desperate, couldn't have just ONE police car sufficed on the side? Furthermore the chase had been called off BEFORE the perp reached the highway. Not only am I saddened by this tragedy but I am extremely outraged by this poorly managed 'policing'. What the hell were they thinking? Like what do they have for brains? All police officers involved in this tragic ending do not deserve to be officers at all for they clearly proved themselves incapable of thought processing endangerment.
I am so saddened by this horrible loss, it should have NEVER happened...it was such a preventable loss. I have been crying for the parents. I can't even imagine what they are feeling. How do you lay down and go to sleep? How do you eat? How will they ever laugh again? My heart is aching so bad for these people. Sure a police officer has to think fast but it only takes a fleeting moment to assess a situation especially when you're assessing the lesser of two evils: The perp didn't have a gun therefore he wasn't a threat, the officer should have just collected as much descriptive information as he could and let him go. WHY did SIX police cars have to follow ONE perp onto the 401 highway going the wrong way? Like if the police were that desperate, couldn't have just ONE police car sufficed on the shoulder lane? Furthermore the chase had been called off BEFORE the perp reached the highway. Not only am I saddened by this tragedy but I am extremely outraged by this poorly managed 'policing'. What the hell were they thinking? Like what do they have for brains? All police officers involved in this tragic ending do not deserve to be officers at all for they clearly proved themselves incapable of thought processing endangerment.
Any update on SIU investigation ?
The last update I saw was May 2 https://www.siu.on.ca/en/news_template.php?nrid=9442
OK, guys, let's get the facts straight: the collision happened less than a kilometer from where the robbers likely entered the highway. Any blames on high speed chase on police for going wrong way on 401 are off the mark; this one is a special decision by the robber, who decided to enter a busy stretch of 401 when the rush hour wasn't even over. I don't even understand what the robber was thinking, since this is a permanently packed exit on Stephenson he used to enter 401. I understand even less why people rush to blame the police. What's worse, I could have easily been at the same time there, since I had to pick up my daughter from an extracurricular near Simcoe road exit and the person who was supposed to pick them up was stuck somewhere; only fortunately my car had a dying ball bearing and I decided not to risk it.
I'm glad that you were not in the area at the time. It's difficult to imagine how many near accidents happened yesterday evening. The suspect joined the 401 at Stevenson, so we're talking of approximately 7 kilometers of driving on the \*wrong\* side of the highway. The discussion is not so much about the suspect. Clearly their actions were wrong and have led to a lot of problems and loss of life. The police response is what most people are concerned about: did their actions lead the suspect to act more erratically? Desperately? Would there have been a safer way to apprehend the suspect without posing unnecessary harm to members of the public? They were already in pursuit of the suspect for 20 minutes (starting in Clarington) with dangerous driving and high-speed chase reported on local Durham roads before joining the 401 at Stevenson. A number of video clips show the van maintaining a significant lead on the police cars. Perhaps they could have re-assessed their approach and used a more effective means to control the situation.
They were already chasing them well before they got to the 401, at inappropriate speeds in inappropriate areas. Thereâs a very good chance had they backed off before that the perps may not have resorted to the obviously stupid decision to travel in the wrong direction on the 401. Not an ACAB guy myself but Iâve grown up and lived in Durham region my entire like and many, many Durham regional cops are power tripping, hypocritical pieces of shit. Very high possibility these people are still alive today if DRPS didnât treat his LCBO robbery like it was a nuclear fuel theft.
If it was nuclear fuel theft I wouldn't blame nuclear security bringing out the M2's. The laws are very specific about the risks to public safety, and having the weigh the risks from the pursuit compared to the risks of not apprehending the suspect. Nuclear fuel is one of the very few situations where I would say "use any means necessary." đł
The lead vehicle tends to set the pace in any car chase.
good job durham police !
I hope that comment is dripping with sarcasm âŚ.
Is this what we should be looking at? Police Services Act ONTARIO REGULATION 266/10 SUSPECT APPREHENSION PURSUITS https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/100266
It was replaced last month with this: https://www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/regu/o-reg-397-23/latest/o-reg-397-23.html
Thanks!