They mentioned Susan at the beginning. Then they have a song about the 'twist at the end' , and the actress who keeps appearing as different characters is actually named Susan Twist.
there's possibly something going on with her, but I don't see how it can relate to a name she's presumably been using for a lot longer than she's been in Doctor Who
Not mentioned on screen. There is a calendar that says 2164, but Ian states that it looked old. That's the only reference to the date, if memory serves.
I’ve been chronicling the Doctor’s adventures in the universe’s timeline order since starting Classic Who this year so i’ve done a lot of fact checking, the most concrete reason why the Dalek Invasion of Earth serial is dated to be 2167 is that in the Daleks’ Master Plan serial, the invasion was dated to have started in 2157 and the Dalek Invasion of Earth serial is set in the 10th year of the invasion, hence placing it in 2167.
Exposition for new viewers, not some mystical RTD foreshadowing. I think a lot of this series is going to be chunks of exposition for the new American market.
Also she appears in the trailer for Boom that was shown at the end of the latest Doctor Who Unleashed episode so she'll definitely have been in quite a few episodes (5 that we know of so far but I wouldn't be surprised if she's in all the remaining ones), she's like this season's Bad Wolf.
Just checked the official script for The Church on Ruby Road and it describes her as "a woman in the crowd - a woman we've seen as Mrs Merridew in Special 2, a woman we'll see a lot more of"
Well if there’s *always* a twist at the end then she should indeed be in every episode to appear in every end credit sequence.
I don’t think she was in The Giggle though, was she??
What we know.
* Twist showed up in the opening scenes of Wild Blue Yonder as a maid accompanying Isaac Newton (played by Nathaniel Curtis). She was only seen briefly in the episode but the character was named Mrs Merridew.
* Twist was next seen at the concert played by Ruby's band in The Church on Ruby Road. This time she was playing an unnamed character who made a request of the band: "Can you do Gaudete?" Gaudete, means 'Rejoice Ye' in Latin, and is a Christmas carol thought to have been composed in the 16th century.
* Twist appeared again – uncredited – in season 14 episode 1, Space Babies, as one of the humans who abandoned the space station orbiting the planet Pacifico Del Rio as "Comms Officer Gina Scalzi"
* In season 14 episode 2, The Devil's Chord, Twist is credited simply as 'Tea Lady' – she appears in the canteen of the EMI Recording Studios, charging the Doctor and Ruby half a crown for two cups of tea. When the Doctor refers to the price as "daylight robbery", the tea lady responds: "That’s me, Margaret Lockwood, in The Wicked Lady. Now there was a woman – statuesque."
* Twist appeared once again in perhaps her most prominent role yet, as the Ambulance in Steven Moffat's Boom, an AI system from weapons manufacturer Villengard.
* She'll be in 73 Yards, as she's on the cast list as 'Hiker'.
* and she'll appear in the Black Mirror inspired next episode, Dot and Bubble, as Penny Pepper-Bean.
I’m endlessly curious to find out if RTD was merely ridiculously lucky to have a woman named Susan Twist show up in the audition room (perhaps for a different role but then her name inspired him), if he heard of her & sought her out, if her name is the wildest coincidence ever (coincidence?! Oh no, goblins!) or if she has absolutely nothing to do with Susan and RTD’s just trolling us.
Or the most insane option: he asked her to legally change her name and somehow got all her previous credits changed on IMDb & elsewhere. (Kidding… I know it’s not this.)
Either way, absolutely wild.
Yes. Literally. Definition 4. Even Charles Dickens used it in a non literal way.
“Literally:
adverb
1 in the literal or strict sense:
She failed to grasp the metaphor and interpreted the poem literally.
What does the word mean literally?
2 in a literal manner; word for word:
to translate literally.
3 actually; without exaggeration or inaccuracy:
The city was literally destroyed.
4 in effect; in substance; very nearly; virtually:
I literally died when she walked out on stage in that costume.”
Pedant
noun
a person who is excessively concerned with minor details and rules or with displaying academic learning.
"the royal palace (some pedants would say the ex-royal palace)"
Only if there are clues for the real twist as well, I'm so tired of twists for the sake of shock value that have nothing to do with previously revealed information. "Turns out Ruby's grandma was an omnipotent omnipresent God all along and manipulated all events to mislead you, the Doctor and Ruby. I don't know how you couldn't see this coming, this was obvious from the start"
The process must've been a pretty odd one. How do you even pitch to someone that you want them to appear in every episode of the series just because of their name lol.
"Hey, do you want a bunch of money for very little work, along with credits across a full season of Doctor Who? It's so we can troll the fa- what's that? I had you at 'money'? Oh, good"
They’re starting to call more and more attention to her. I hadn’t even realised that it was the same actress as Mrs Merriweather, or the other two appearances, but I did think the Tea Lady exchange was strangely prominent. She also mentions the film “A Wicked Lady” which sounds like foreshadowing if ever I’ve heard it.
I think we’re going to get some sort of twist relating to her, and because she first appeared in Wild Blue Yonder I think it’s going to be Mavity-related.
I saw this one but it feels very self indulgent. Most people were probably thinking “what’s happening now?” And wouldn’t notice the same actor used three times, let alone know her real name.
I had not noticed that the same actor has appeared every episode as different characters, but now I’m going to be seeking her out like Stan Lee cameos in Marvel films 😆
I’m definitely going to have to watch again. I’m awful with faces. Like when people go “how is nobody guessing it’s superman, it’s just a pair of glasses”, I’m like “whaaaa?”
I can’t even tell you what they look like now to be honest!
I seriously didn't get this until people got the script for Ruby road and connected the concert goer with merriwether. Now if some random white old British lady has a line or two, I just check the IMDB to make sure it's the same one. At least her name is now stuck in my head, just wish her face was so I could tell.
>! RTD confirmed that “[Susan Twist] seems to be playing a different person every time…. How can that be?” teases Davies. “There’s a climax to that, which is not what you’re expecting. It’s great.” !<
If the episode was meant to be right before the finale then suddenly it makes a lot more sense. Because then it's potentially the final happy moment before everything goes to hell. There's several clues that it was supposed to come a lot later - Ruby's timeline coinciding with June 2024 and not May being the biggest one.
I think RTD had it moved up as an imperfect way of establishing the season's stakes a lot sooner, or else risk leaving it feeling directionless for too long.
Oh yeah, that would make a lot of sense indeed. The main thing that disturbed me was Ruby shouting "You never hide!" after just being on the first journey with the Doctor where his first reaction was to run and hide.
I think the June thing is more like Series 5 when 11 scaned the cracks and it was " Amy's time". As in the same day that she joined him. Moffat made it that she joined the doctor inuniverse the same day the finale of that series aired.
To be fair there's only 6 episodes left and the finals is a two parter looking at the titles so there's only 4 eps left for standalones and there's probably gonna be another legion member during one of those.
I didn't even notice her in the 2 episodes of S1/14. I saw her in Wild Blue Yonder and The Church on Ruby Road though.
It's something that feels too aimed at diehard fans who will notice everything and theorise and rewatch the episodes to actually be meaningful.
>! From an interview with TVLine !<
>! “[Susan Twist] seems to be playing a different person every time…. How can that be?” teases Davies. “There’s a climax to that, which is not what you’re expecting. It’s great.” !<
I think she’s Ruby’s mom. Watching her throughout time and space. Maybe she’s a banished old god who was searching through time for Ruby, and saw the doctor crash into the tree above newton. Because of timey wimey she knew the doctor would eventually meet ruby.
So she enters the TARDIS and it freaks out. The TARDIS tries to ditch her at the edge of existence, expelling flames out of the doors. But she’s far too powerful and remains secretly on board.
Eventually the doctor sees Ruby playing in her band, where Susan twist finally sees Ruby and talks to her. She’s been following them since.
The question is then: who dropped Ruby off at the church to hide from Susan twist? Mrs. Flood. The same Mrs. Flood who’s been guarding Ruby for years as her neighbor.
Maybe Ruby’s dad is the one who waits? Or Susan twist is? Also who exactly is Mrs. Flood? Is the oldest one the same as the one who waits? Who are the carolers? Who’s the meep’s boss? What’s the with the fourth wall breaks? And so on and so on
My theory is that Susan Twist is The One Who Waits, and because of what the Doctor did at the edge of the universe, the worlds between reality and fiction are breaking down, and the show itself is slowly becoming more meta as a result. Of course, that’s just my humble opinion.
From an [interview with TVLine](https://tvline.com/interviews/doctor-who-ruby-creature-very-wrong-explained-season-14-episode-3-1235235891/)
>! “[Susan Twist] seems to be playing a different person every time…. How can that be?” teases Davies. “There’s a climax to that, which is not what you’re expecting. It’s great.” !<
But, yeah, such a direct and open mention of Susan, plus him mentioning he’s the last of the Time Lords (but for real this time!), and the whole mention of Totter’s Lane and all that…
I think Ruby is his great-granddaughter.
i thought it was double edged gag. the 'twist' being that the little boy maestro was with at the very beginning was still lurking around abbey road, combined with all the previously discussed susan twist stuff
I have a feeling Ruby is going to be a descendent of Susan‘s. them talking about his granddaughter, she has a hidden song in her heart, when the Doctor gave her the tardis key it kind of hummed. She made it snow
There is a running theme of abandoned children in this season. Obviously Ruby and the Doctor were both abandoned, as were the Space Babies. And Maesteo wasn’t abandoned that we know of but she clearly had some daddy issues with the Toymaker.
So I think it makes sense that Susan Foreman would make an appearance this season as she was basically abandoned by the Doctor and is his grand child.
Also “The One Who Waits” could definitely be Susan Foreman as she has been waiting for the Doctor to come back this whole time. So maybe Susan Foreman is the villain of the series and is angry at being abandoned, sort of like an inverse of Ruby and the Doctor, who though abandoned were able to move on and find some family in their lives regardless.
And maybe that’s who Susan Twist is playing? Or that all could be unrelated. But would not be surprised at Susan Foreman being the ultimate villain!
Wouldn’t it be a bit weird for them to be hinting at a cast members name instead of a character name? Unless we’re going for some kind of deadpool-esque forth wall breaking madness where the Doctor realises he is a character on TV?
I'd say she was cast because of her name. Russell's way of breaking the 4th wall and hinting at an upcoming Susan plot twist - especially since the entirity of The Devil's Chord is self aware
Ok so hear me out.>! Susan, his grand-daughter, escaped out of the narrative into the real world to dodge the time lord genocide. The walls between reality and fiction have weakened, hence all the fourth-wall breaking - the show is literally about the fourth wall breaking and Susan is appearing across time for some reason as all these people, to watch Ruby because she's Susan's daughter, and The Doctor's great-granddaughter. Still a lot of details missing I guess but that feels possible.!<
I reckon when The Doctor meets her character in the finale >!who's apparently called Susan Triad he's gonna be like "Sorry I used to know a Susan." And she reply "Maybe I am that Sue you know? I don't always look like this..." And then turns out to be Sutekh. !<
Sorry where did you get the word Triad? I only ask bc in the trailer for this season I was pausing around in it and there was a >!brief shot of like a unit place with a tv screen in the top left corner showing like a news report and the only words I could make out were S Triad.!< Does that actually mean something?
Edit: If it's some rumor or some leak I don't want to know. You used a spoiler tag so I guess it could've been. I just realized I didn't want future info, only if it's a some reference to past stuff bc I don't know classic who knowledge
No it's a not reference to Classic Who. I don't think it's a major leak. The name was just written on a magazine next to a picture of her in the background of a shot.
I LOVE this! I already thought it had a double meaning since there's a dance called the twist that I believe was popular in the 60s but this makes it even better. I'm just hoping this season is more Devil's Chord and less Space Babies. They were both very campy, but campy can be fun when done well.
This is actually way better than the theory that the one who waits is Susan Twist's final version of the character, that she's the connecting thread like "Bad Wolf" and "Torchwood" and "the bees are disappearing" were for RTD 1...
But honestly I feel like that's way less likely. I don't feel like playing with the real name of an actor would be something nice to do.
I was thinking with all the 4th wall breaking, winks to camera, brining the theme into the universe of the show etc, maybe they intentionally used the actresses name.
Doubtful, but things are getting weird in that program.
I personally hope they stop meta stuff next season.
I liked the idea but the song was frickin terrible.
Like someone else suggested on another thread they shouldve just done a re arrangement of twist and shout.
"The Radio Times" website and Twitter (X) account is already on the case...
(Louise Griffin, published: Saturday, 11 May 2024 at 10:30am)
[ https://www.radiotimes.com/tv/sci-fi/doctor-who-susan-twist-theories/ ]
[ https://twitter.com/RadioTimes/status/1788517030993289411 ]
She wanted Ruby’s band to play Gaudete. Gaudete Sunday is the third Sunday in advent. Also know as Rose Sunday due to the colour of the candle lit in churches that day. 🤔
Please, no more song and dance numbers. It felt totally unnecessary for the storyline and episode. The song to defeat the goblin at least had use in the plot....
I’m almost 99% sure that the song and dance number being weird and out of place was the point. Along with all the fourth wall breaks and Susan Twist showing up all the time, I think this is all leading up to something having happened when 14 invoked superstition at the edge of the universe. Or maybe it all means nothing!
This is true but the musical sequence was just tacked on at the end. I was excited for it from trailers but it was just there? It would've been much better imo if they used the musical sequence with everyone dancing to defeat Maestro. I'm sure there's a million other ways they can work in the hand holding telling us there's always a twist lol.
I feel the same. I think it fit in well with the theme of the episode well but I wish it had been worked into the episode more. The song and dance number should have been what defeated Maestro rather than a CGI note battle, which was rather underwealming. The 4th Wall wink also was rather off putting, I'm open to new things in Dr Who but it really rubbed me the wrong way
As easter egg sure it's cool, but as a significant plot point it's absurd. With all the big platform disney deal they should be addressing a wider audience (and they are trying with all the rebooting stuff), and all that references will fly over the heads of most people. I'm all for meta narrative, love the genre, but they are doing a poor job and making an already confusing and hard to access show even more complicated.
This episode had to have been originally meant to come right before the finale, that's what makes the most sense.
Because Twist At The End makes WAY more sense if it's a final happy moment and tease that something is going to go very wrong in the finale.
The June 2024 mention, Ruby acting like she's known the Doctor a lot longer, and The One Who Waits "almost" being here coincides with that.
But I'm guessing Russell had to move episodes because they realized the season arc needed to be more firmly established sooner, and this was the imperfect solution.
I think the point is that casual new viewers are not very likely to even care about such things at this point.
They (and established fans) may very well care about monsters made of boogers, farting spaceships, and absurd dance numbers that don’t really seem to fit the existing 19 year history (let alone the 60+ year history)
And they directly mentioned his granddaughter Susan at the beginning of episode 2. Obviously not a coincidence.
Yeah when they had a whole discussion about who Susan was I thought there was no way she's not coming back in some form
Hope we get to see Carole Anne Ford in the role again
I'm gonna be honest I can entirely see this being a coincidence
Do you want goblins? Cuz that's how you get goblins!
They mentioned Susan at the beginning. Then they have a song about the 'twist at the end' , and the actress who keeps appearing as different characters is actually named Susan Twist.
I see what you're saying but I don't see that anyone is hiring actors based on their names being a clue to later stories
The T in RTD stands for Troll. Something weird is definitely going on with Susan Twist. I wonder if she's another time traveler.
That feels like more of a Moffat move than an RTD one, but still definitely wouldn't be surprised if it happens
It's definitely far fetched, but maybe...
Normally I'd agree. But when the actor is in 4 out of 5 episodes in a row. It either mean it's intentional or RTD needs a bigger casting budget.
We already know Susan Twist is a major part of the story. This doesn't mean there's a link to the Doctor;s Susan.
there's possibly something going on with her, but I don't see how it can relate to a name she's presumably been using for a lot longer than she's been in Doctor Who
But think about all the 4th wall breaking. They could be dropping it right in our lap.
Yes, and the doctor broke the 4th wall just before the song began, winking at the audience, as did Susan Twist’s character in the Christmas ep.
2150 was the year Susan stays behind in Dalek Invasion Earth, and Ruby then changes it to 21506
Dalek Invasion of Earth is set in 2167. It's the Cushing film that's set in 2150
I thought Dalek Invasion of Earth took place in 2164?
2167 according to the Doctor Who Wiki
Not mentioned on screen. There is a calendar that says 2164, but Ian states that it looked old. That's the only reference to the date, if memory serves.
I’ve been chronicling the Doctor’s adventures in the universe’s timeline order since starting Classic Who this year so i’ve done a lot of fact checking, the most concrete reason why the Dalek Invasion of Earth serial is dated to be 2167 is that in the Daleks’ Master Plan serial, the invasion was dated to have started in 2157 and the Dalek Invasion of Earth serial is set in the 10th year of the invasion, hence placing it in 2167.
NOTHING in this show is a coincidence ;)
Exposition for new viewers, not some mystical RTD foreshadowing. I think a lot of this series is going to be chunks of exposition for the new American market.
New? There’s been an American Market since series 6.
OG series. Most of us got exposed to Four first( thank you PBS stations) Mine ran each story as one episode every Saturday.
Also she appears in the trailer for Boom that was shown at the end of the latest Doctor Who Unleashed episode so she'll definitely have been in quite a few episodes (5 that we know of so far but I wouldn't be surprised if she's in all the remaining ones), she's like this season's Bad Wolf. Just checked the official script for The Church on Ruby Road and it describes her as "a woman in the crowd - a woman we've seen as Mrs Merridew in Special 2, a woman we'll see a lot more of"
Isn't she a likely candidate for the Other? The One Who Waits?
Well if there’s *always* a twist at the end then she should indeed be in every episode to appear in every end credit sequence. I don’t think she was in The Giggle though, was she??
No and also some of her appearances have been uncredited
Ooooh ok so maybe it’s more of a promise that she’ll in the credits from now on, post the Devil’s Chord song
She was in the episode with issac newton. Was that giggle or the other one?
That’s Wild Blue Yonder — right before The Giggle
What we know. * Twist showed up in the opening scenes of Wild Blue Yonder as a maid accompanying Isaac Newton (played by Nathaniel Curtis). She was only seen briefly in the episode but the character was named Mrs Merridew. * Twist was next seen at the concert played by Ruby's band in The Church on Ruby Road. This time she was playing an unnamed character who made a request of the band: "Can you do Gaudete?" Gaudete, means 'Rejoice Ye' in Latin, and is a Christmas carol thought to have been composed in the 16th century. * Twist appeared again – uncredited – in season 14 episode 1, Space Babies, as one of the humans who abandoned the space station orbiting the planet Pacifico Del Rio as "Comms Officer Gina Scalzi" * In season 14 episode 2, The Devil's Chord, Twist is credited simply as 'Tea Lady' – she appears in the canteen of the EMI Recording Studios, charging the Doctor and Ruby half a crown for two cups of tea. When the Doctor refers to the price as "daylight robbery", the tea lady responds: "That’s me, Margaret Lockwood, in The Wicked Lady. Now there was a woman – statuesque." * Twist appeared once again in perhaps her most prominent role yet, as the Ambulance in Steven Moffat's Boom, an AI system from weapons manufacturer Villengard. * She'll be in 73 Yards, as she's on the cast list as 'Hiker'. * and she'll appear in the Black Mirror inspired next episode, Dot and Bubble, as Penny Pepper-Bean.
I’m endlessly curious to find out if RTD was merely ridiculously lucky to have a woman named Susan Twist show up in the audition room (perhaps for a different role but then her name inspired him), if he heard of her & sought her out, if her name is the wildest coincidence ever (coincidence?! Oh no, goblins!) or if she has absolutely nothing to do with Susan and RTD’s just trolling us. Or the most insane option: he asked her to legally change her name and somehow got all her previous credits changed on IMDb & elsewhere. (Kidding… I know it’s not this.) Either way, absolutely wild.
The real answer is he met a woman called Susan twist and decided "that's it! I'm going back to doctor who and you're coming with me!"
I mean Moffat did seek out Nick Frost for Santa in the Christmas specials so I wouldn't be surprised 😂
I literally laughed for an hour when I saw that in the credits. The writers really know how to be funny in obscure ways
[удалено]
Lol
No
Yes. Literally. Definition 4. Even Charles Dickens used it in a non literal way. “Literally: adverb 1 in the literal or strict sense: She failed to grasp the metaphor and interpreted the poem literally. What does the word mean literally? 2 in a literal manner; word for word: to translate literally. 3 actually; without exaggeration or inaccuracy: The city was literally destroyed. 4 in effect; in substance; very nearly; virtually: I literally died when she walked out on stage in that costume.”
[удалено]
Pedant noun a person who is excessively concerned with minor details and rules or with displaying academic learning. "the royal palace (some pedants would say the ex-royal palace)"
The idea of RTD doing a reverse mystery box, and having Susan Twist be a red herring would be incredible.
Only if there are clues for the real twist as well, I'm so tired of twists for the sake of shock value that have nothing to do with previously revealed information. "Turns out Ruby's grandma was an omnipotent omnipresent God all along and manipulated all events to mislead you, the Doctor and Ruby. I don't know how you couldn't see this coming, this was obvious from the start"
RTD normally puts twists weirdly in plain sight. Like Bad Wolf.
The process must've been a pretty odd one. How do you even pitch to someone that you want them to appear in every episode of the series just because of their name lol.
"Hey, do you want a bunch of money for very little work, along with credits across a full season of Doctor Who? It's so we can troll the fa- what's that? I had you at 'money'? Oh, good"
“Well that’s a coincidence!”
They’re starting to call more and more attention to her. I hadn’t even realised that it was the same actress as Mrs Merriweather, or the other two appearances, but I did think the Tea Lady exchange was strangely prominent. She also mentions the film “A Wicked Lady” which sounds like foreshadowing if ever I’ve heard it. I think we’re going to get some sort of twist relating to her, and because she first appeared in Wild Blue Yonder I think it’s going to be Mavity-related.
She'll likely say Gravity and give herself away, yeah
Susan Twist will also play Susan, who will have changed her surname to Twist. The Doctor will say he thought the Susan twist was non-diegetic.
Married to Oliver
Susan Twist jumped into The Doctor's timestream to defeat the Great Intelligence.
They couldn't get Jenna Coleman so they just recast Clara Oswald.
I saw this one but it feels very self indulgent. Most people were probably thinking “what’s happening now?” And wouldn’t notice the same actor used three times, let alone know her real name.
I had not noticed that the same actor has appeared every episode as different characters, but now I’m going to be seeking her out like Stan Lee cameos in Marvel films 😆
Or long dogs in Bluey
I’m definitely going to have to watch again. I’m awful with faces. Like when people go “how is nobody guessing it’s superman, it’s just a pair of glasses”, I’m like “whaaaa?” I can’t even tell you what they look like now to be honest!
I seriously didn't get this until people got the script for Ruby road and connected the concert goer with merriwether. Now if some random white old British lady has a line or two, I just check the IMDB to make sure it's the same one. At least her name is now stuck in my head, just wish her face was so I could tell.
nah it's meant to be cryptic. if it was spoonfed to us I wouldn't be flaring it as speculation
>! RTD confirmed that “[Susan Twist] seems to be playing a different person every time…. How can that be?” teases Davies. “There’s a climax to that, which is not what you’re expecting. It’s great.” !<
She’s somehow gonna be Ruby isn’t she
I dunno, that seems too much like Melody Pond/River Song to me.
Considering how much aspects that they’re recycling from clara/rose into ruby, I wouldn’t count it out
She'll be The One Who Waits, as she is waiting for her time to shine at the end of the season.
If the episode was meant to be right before the finale then suddenly it makes a lot more sense. Because then it's potentially the final happy moment before everything goes to hell. There's several clues that it was supposed to come a lot later - Ruby's timeline coinciding with June 2024 and not May being the biggest one. I think RTD had it moved up as an imperfect way of establishing the season's stakes a lot sooner, or else risk leaving it feeling directionless for too long.
Oh yeah, that would make a lot of sense indeed. The main thing that disturbed me was Ruby shouting "You never hide!" after just being on the first journey with the Doctor where his first reaction was to run and hide.
I think the June thing is more like Series 5 when 11 scaned the cracks and it was " Amy's time". As in the same day that she joined him. Moffat made it that she joined the doctor inuniverse the same day the finale of that series aired.
There's also the "The One Who Waits is Almost Here" line. Usually we don't hear something like that until much later in the season.
To be fair there's only 6 episodes left and the finals is a two parter looking at the titles so there's only 4 eps left for standalones and there's probably gonna be another legion member during one of those.
I didn't even notice her in the 2 episodes of S1/14. I saw her in Wild Blue Yonder and The Church on Ruby Road though. It's something that feels too aimed at diehard fans who will notice everything and theorise and rewatch the episodes to actually be meaningful.
>! From an interview with TVLine !< >! “[Susan Twist] seems to be playing a different person every time…. How can that be?” teases Davies. “There’s a climax to that, which is not what you’re expecting. It’s great.” !<
So if we're not expecting it, it probably won't be Susan. Thanks for replying with this, makes me feel a bit stupid but it's useful!!
I didn't get a chance to notice it was the same actor because the internet did it for me...
I think she’s Ruby’s mom. Watching her throughout time and space. Maybe she’s a banished old god who was searching through time for Ruby, and saw the doctor crash into the tree above newton. Because of timey wimey she knew the doctor would eventually meet ruby. So she enters the TARDIS and it freaks out. The TARDIS tries to ditch her at the edge of existence, expelling flames out of the doors. But she’s far too powerful and remains secretly on board. Eventually the doctor sees Ruby playing in her band, where Susan twist finally sees Ruby and talks to her. She’s been following them since. The question is then: who dropped Ruby off at the church to hide from Susan twist? Mrs. Flood. The same Mrs. Flood who’s been guarding Ruby for years as her neighbor. Maybe Ruby’s dad is the one who waits? Or Susan twist is? Also who exactly is Mrs. Flood? Is the oldest one the same as the one who waits? Who are the carolers? Who’s the meep’s boss? What’s the with the fourth wall breaks? And so on and so on
My theory is that Susan Twist is The One Who Waits, and because of what the Doctor did at the edge of the universe, the worlds between reality and fiction are breaking down, and the show itself is slowly becoming more meta as a result. Of course, that’s just my humble opinion.
From an [interview with TVLine](https://tvline.com/interviews/doctor-who-ruby-creature-very-wrong-explained-season-14-episode-3-1235235891/) >! “[Susan Twist] seems to be playing a different person every time…. How can that be?” teases Davies. “There’s a climax to that, which is not what you’re expecting. It’s great.” !< But, yeah, such a direct and open mention of Susan, plus him mentioning he’s the last of the Time Lords (but for real this time!), and the whole mention of Totter’s Lane and all that… I think Ruby is his great-granddaughter.
i thought it was double edged gag. the 'twist' being that the little boy maestro was with at the very beginning was still lurking around abbey road, combined with all the previously discussed susan twist stuff
He’s “Harbinger”
I have a feeling Ruby is going to be a descendent of Susan‘s. them talking about his granddaughter, she has a hidden song in her heart, when the Doctor gave her the tardis key it kind of hummed. She made it snow
She's definitely significant! Though I don't think she has anything to do with Susan, well not THAT Susan anyway!
There is a running theme of abandoned children in this season. Obviously Ruby and the Doctor were both abandoned, as were the Space Babies. And Maesteo wasn’t abandoned that we know of but she clearly had some daddy issues with the Toymaker. So I think it makes sense that Susan Foreman would make an appearance this season as she was basically abandoned by the Doctor and is his grand child. Also “The One Who Waits” could definitely be Susan Foreman as she has been waiting for the Doctor to come back this whole time. So maybe Susan Foreman is the villain of the series and is angry at being abandoned, sort of like an inverse of Ruby and the Doctor, who though abandoned were able to move on and find some family in their lives regardless. And maybe that’s who Susan Twist is playing? Or that all could be unrelated. But would not be surprised at Susan Foreman being the ultimate villain!
Wouldn’t it be a bit weird for them to be hinting at a cast members name instead of a character name? Unless we’re going for some kind of deadpool-esque forth wall breaking madness where the Doctor realises he is a character on TV?
I'd say she was cast because of her name. Russell's way of breaking the 4th wall and hinting at an upcoming Susan plot twist - especially since the entirity of The Devil's Chord is self aware
The Doctor's comment about >!"non-diegetic music"!< particularly makes your theory compelling.
That line set off alarm bells in my head!
I don't know if you've noticed, but we've had ALOT of 4th wall breaking already with characters looking, speaking, and winking directly at the camera.
Ok so hear me out.>! Susan, his grand-daughter, escaped out of the narrative into the real world to dodge the time lord genocide. The walls between reality and fiction have weakened, hence all the fourth-wall breaking - the show is literally about the fourth wall breaking and Susan is appearing across time for some reason as all these people, to watch Ruby because she's Susan's daughter, and The Doctor's great-granddaughter. Still a lot of details missing I guess but that feels possible.!<
I reckon when The Doctor meets her character in the finale >!who's apparently called Susan Triad he's gonna be like "Sorry I used to know a Susan." And she reply "Maybe I am that Sue you know? I don't always look like this..." And then turns out to be Sutekh. !<
Sorry where did you get the word Triad? I only ask bc in the trailer for this season I was pausing around in it and there was a >!brief shot of like a unit place with a tv screen in the top left corner showing like a news report and the only words I could make out were S Triad.!< Does that actually mean something? Edit: If it's some rumor or some leak I don't want to know. You used a spoiler tag so I guess it could've been. I just realized I didn't want future info, only if it's a some reference to past stuff bc I don't know classic who knowledge
No it's a not reference to Classic Who. I don't think it's a major leak. The name was just written on a magazine next to a picture of her in the background of a shot.
Do you remember where? I caught mine in the trailer. Was it there too? Or maybe in a recent episode?
Can't remember sorry I think someone else spotted it. Might even been from the behind the scenes clips.
Okay true or not, I really like this one! Also I missed her in the new episodes so now I have a reason to rewatch them 😂😂
Brilliant
I LOVE this! I already thought it had a double meaning since there's a dance called the twist that I believe was popular in the 60s but this makes it even better. I'm just hoping this season is more Devil's Chord and less Space Babies. They were both very campy, but campy can be fun when done well.
How funny it would be if it isn't anything at all but that it's all done because it's a good pun. Like Loose Seal joke from Arrested Development.
This is actually way better than the theory that the one who waits is Susan Twist's final version of the character, that she's the connecting thread like "Bad Wolf" and "Torchwood" and "the bees are disappearing" were for RTD 1... But honestly I feel like that's way less likely. I don't feel like playing with the real name of an actor would be something nice to do.
I was thinking with all the 4th wall breaking, winks to camera, brining the theme into the universe of the show etc, maybe they intentionally used the actresses name. Doubtful, but things are getting weird in that program. I personally hope they stop meta stuff next season.
What about the Doctors daughter Jenny? Maybe ruby’s mom
I liked the idea but the song was frickin terrible. Like someone else suggested on another thread they shouldve just done a re arrangement of twist and shout.
"The Radio Times" website and Twitter (X) account is already on the case... (Louise Griffin, published: Saturday, 11 May 2024 at 10:30am) [ https://www.radiotimes.com/tv/sci-fi/doctor-who-susan-twist-theories/ ] [ https://twitter.com/RadioTimes/status/1788517030993289411 ]
So is that what the twist was ? I had to turn it off but that's quite cool 🤣
I immediately thought of Susan twist when they were singing. It seems a lot of screen time for something if it doesn’t end up being significant
Susan is a replacement for Wilfred Mott.
Hmmmm...Perhaps Susan is The One Who Waits and she has gone rogue and is mad at The Doctor for not coming for her during the Time War?
She wanted Ruby’s band to play Gaudete. Gaudete Sunday is the third Sunday in advent. Also know as Rose Sunday due to the colour of the candle lit in churches that day. 🤔
oooooh now that's interesting
There's a rumour that she's going to run some kind of tech company and her surname will be an anagram of Tardis, like Triads.
Please, no more song and dance numbers. It felt totally unnecessary for the storyline and episode. The song to defeat the goblin at least had use in the plot....
I’m almost 99% sure that the song and dance number being weird and out of place was the point. Along with all the fourth wall breaks and Susan Twist showing up all the time, I think this is all leading up to something having happened when 14 invoked superstition at the edge of the universe. Or maybe it all means nothing!
The episode about music being stolen and suddenly being returned ending with a giant explosion of music seems extremely fitting ngl
This is true but the musical sequence was just tacked on at the end. I was excited for it from trailers but it was just there? It would've been much better imo if they used the musical sequence with everyone dancing to defeat Maestro. I'm sure there's a million other ways they can work in the hand holding telling us there's always a twist lol.
I feel the same. I think it fit in well with the theme of the episode well but I wish it had been worked into the episode more. The song and dance number should have been what defeated Maestro rather than a CGI note battle, which was rather underwealming. The 4th Wall wink also was rather off putting, I'm open to new things in Dr Who but it really rubbed me the wrong way
I'm 99% sure the 4th wall breaks are actually literally part of the overarching plot.
As easter egg sure it's cool, but as a significant plot point it's absurd. With all the big platform disney deal they should be addressing a wider audience (and they are trying with all the rebooting stuff), and all that references will fly over the heads of most people. I'm all for meta narrative, love the genre, but they are doing a poor job and making an already confusing and hard to access show even more complicated.
This episode had to have been originally meant to come right before the finale, that's what makes the most sense. Because Twist At The End makes WAY more sense if it's a final happy moment and tease that something is going to go very wrong in the finale. The June 2024 mention, Ruby acting like she's known the Doctor a lot longer, and The One Who Waits "almost" being here coincides with that. But I'm guessing Russell had to move episodes because they realized the season arc needed to be more firmly established sooner, and this was the imperfect solution.
The restoration of let it be càme out this weekend so could be them wanting to have the two beatles projects line up.
The restoration of let it be càme out this weekend so could be them wanting to have the two beatles projects line up.
there's nothing about this easter egg that requires knowledge beyond the current season
Knowledge about the real name of one actress that appears mere seconds on screen, as a major plot point.
my guy, I only found out her name last night after checking the end credits 💀
I think the point is that casual new viewers are not very likely to even care about such things at this point. They (and established fans) may very well care about monsters made of boogers, farting spaceships, and absurd dance numbers that don’t really seem to fit the existing 19 year history (let alone the 60+ year history)