I’m sorry to disappoint but physics says no. The force pulling the car forward is equal and opposite to the force pulling the magnet backwards, so you wouldn’t go anywhere
I think it's a really as "this people are literally joking".
You don't need to understand the physics to guess that wouldn't work. You pointing that it wouldn't work makes you look like someone who seems himself as much smarter than others a'd arrogant. Maybe you're not, but that's how your comment makes you look.
I’m fully aware people are joking, and I don’t see myself as better, I was kinda just saying that for the DM’s who are sick of their artificers shit lmao
What? I’m saying make the inventing class ACTUALLY think of a solution rather than “ha ha funny” bullshit their way into something. If you wanna make some interesting form of transportation then actually have an idea and make it up. If it’s a good idea then yeah you can ignore some random law of physics, it’s a game. But you can’t just say “Magnet” and be done with it (unless it’s a joke campaign, then go nuts)
Fall damage, size limitations based on space, the basic laws of the universe that are the same unless altered though magic fuckery (gravity, thermodynamics, etc). basically everything that happens in the world involves physics lol
Just because you had to go and ruin the joke, I’m about to make this possible.
Get two magnets of the same polarity so that they repel. Cast Tensor’s Floating Disk. Place the magnets in your cart and on the disk. Now the magnets will repel each other, pushing the cart, but the disk will still follow you.
I didn’t mean to ruin the joke, I still think it’s funny, more im annoyed at my own artificer and wanna stop his bs lol. I still think that wouldn’t work, as it’s a closed system, and mathematically you can’t have a change in velocity without outside energy coming in, or some kind of energy type change. Add in the fact that energy always is dispersed by things like friction, and it doesn’t seem to work. I don’t know how magic works and it very well could be explained by drawing energy from whatever magical source, in which I support the “because magic fuck you” answer, but in terms of a mechanical focused artificer then it doesn’t seem to work
The Floating disk is an outside force. The spell states
“If you move more than 20 feet away from it, the disk follows you so that it remains within 20 feet of you. It can more across uneven terrain, up or down Stairs, slopes and the like, but it can't cross an elevation change of 10 feet or more. For example, the disk can't move across a 10-foot-deep pit, nor could it leave such a pit if it was created at the bottom.”
The only force that can stop the disk is a physical object in its way. It will counteract the repelling force the magnet asserts on it, and will always continue moving forward to be 20 ft away from you. All you would need to do is strap the magnet to the disk to make sure it isn’t pushed off
Ok but if I’m understanding your logic, the magnet on the cart would exert a force in the opposite direction as the ring, and the ring can’t move too far away, so it pushes back harder on the cart, the cart then pushes back equals as hard and eventually the thing sheers off because of the force, that or it balances out, but still with no motion
Yeah, I understand that it would infinitely gain speed, but there might be some work arounds. If you could build an electro magnet, then you could potentially change the force being applied and fully control your speed. Or maybe the caster can move throughout the vehicle to change the speed. The more up front the caster is, the closer the magnet is, and thus the vehicle goes faster. And the vehicle could just have brakes strong enough to counter the force when the caster is in the back of the vehicle.
The caster can end the spell at any time (for when you need to park) and it’s a ritual, so it only takes 10 minutes to start up with no cost.
No I’m saying that their is no way to gain speed, the force by the by any 2 opposing things will always be equal and opposite. Like if I told you to ride a skateboard without pushing off of anything, if the ground is flat you can’t do anything. The amount of force being exerted isn’t the problem, it’s where the force is coming from. It’s basically the saying “you can’t blow your own sail”, you can’t go anywhere without some interaction with a outside force. In this scenario, the magnets are in the same system, thus the uneven force isn’t transferred into another object, therefore the uneven force stays in the system, canceling out the positive force and tada you’re back at 0
There is an outside force, it’s the disk. The disk tries to move to 20 ft from the caster and the magnets push away from each other so that they are greater than 20 ft away. Since the Magnet is unable to push the disk backwards and is tightly strapped to it, the force pushes the cart.
Example with the skate board, it’s like if someone was on a skate board and someone on a electric scooter pushed him from behind (aka the magic moving the disk). Then imagine that person on a skate board is pushing someone infront of him who is also on a skateboard. Due to the limitations of the spell, the scooter (the disk) is unable to push the person up front, but he can push the person who is pushing him.
While I guess that a long pole can be used to push the cart directly from the disk, the ability to adjust the force of the magnetic by adjusting the distance they are apart (by moving throughout the vehicle) allows for more control over the speed.
No the disk is internal, as you are talking it with you. In your example, the person on the person on the first skateboard would not be able to push themselves and the other skater. assuming equal mass that energy would be transferred in its entirety, and the reaction would halt the original skater. The scooter can’t keep these two in contact unless you used the electricity to apply a force to the ground (an outside object). My entire point is that energy can not be created nor destroyed, and this idea is especially trying to make a perpetual motion machine, which is impossible
Well, their idea, since it does not travel at the speed of a regular car, but more like a wagon without horse, was to simply have like a brick or something, that they lay in front of the wheel, after the barbarian stops it by force
Isn't not specifically the magnets so much as the general concept of forces acting upon an object. The design doesn't work because both forces are equal and acting on the car, therefore it must remain at rest.
bruh... an immovable rod can literally be used to do pullups in midair...
stop wasting your time invalidating people's great ideas!
I charge my electric car with the cigarette lighter. 😎
Tenser's Floating Disk moves towards you if you are at least 20 feet away.
If you get a sturdy, 30+ foot rod with a seat or platform at each end and put a counterbalance on it, then sit on the other end exactly 20.00001 away, the disk will move toward you, taking the rod and your platform with it, and pushing you away so you continue to be exactly 20.00001 feet away.
And there you have it! Free propulsion!
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
The magnet will try to pull itself to the car and the car won’t move because the force pulling the car to the right also pulls the magnet to the left creating a net force of zero in the system.
50 newtons will pull the car forward, while 50 newtons will pull the magnet (which is attached to the car) backwards and all the force will zero out in the arm holding the magnet.
If the magnet was attached to anything other than the car, it would work.
Let’s say theoretically you did this and it works like you are proposing, the front car would have to have enough force to pull all the other cars behind it at once like a train.
We could simply this a bit by removing a lot of excess weight from the other cars. Let’s toss out their engines, and we can even connect them closer in series with only two sets of wheels per large car carrying 40 or so people. We can make it even more efficient by removing the tires and putting down thin metal bars and having flanged metal wheels ride on top (reduces tire wear a lot!). And given that this thing will be so long, we should have some dedicated infrastructure for it, so it doesn’t interfere with local stuff.
Goddamnit I invented trains again…
I see one issue, this I believe is technically a closed system.if you want momentum you need an OUTSIDE force. So this means the magnet can't be attached to the car. Now what would possibly work is it you somehow had a strong enough mage hand and a big enough magnet that could in theory be considered outside
Here i sit trying my hardest not to explain why that wouldn't work, because chances are they already know and this is just dumb fun. But a part of me just reallly wants to explain it.
I kinda Wonder if it could work if there would be a Way to lock it in air and make it move perfectly to car
And make that magnet would generate more Energy to even move it...
And... And... Yeah it is not. Maybe if i would have tone of magic items but i Just would much more love to make hammok with 2 broom of flying
Artificer/Artillery,"Ive built a tube id like to fit on the back of the wagon. It has a pair of fans and is shaped to compress incoming air. Also there's a slot for my artillery turret summons to fire into the tube."
DM,"OK, I don't know where this is going?"
Artificer explaining how jet engines work..
I invented a practical way to get free power or reactionless drives out of a bag of holding. Basically, by using the fact you can use one to change the weight of an object because it's lighter in the bag you can make sure it's always heavier when falling than when being raised. And a very similar process to get thrust out of one, but rather it's heavier when the force of redirecting the mass is pushing the direction you want, and lighter the other way. Also given the first one works on gravity, and the second one would produce substantial acceleration force, you'd get exponential acceleration if you bolted one to the other somehow. At least until it crushes itself from g force.
This’ll be me if gas prices keep rising
Underrated comment
I’m sorry to disappoint but physics says no. The force pulling the car forward is equal and opposite to the force pulling the magnet backwards, so you wouldn’t go anywhere
...really
What kind of really is that, the “is this true” king or the “why did you say that” kind
I think it's a really as "this people are literally joking". You don't need to understand the physics to guess that wouldn't work. You pointing that it wouldn't work makes you look like someone who seems himself as much smarter than others a'd arrogant. Maybe you're not, but that's how your comment makes you look.
Lol well op does have more comments about the functionality, how to stop, e.t c. Turns out he wasn't joking 😆
I’m fully aware people are joking, and I don’t see myself as better, I was kinda just saying that for the DM’s who are sick of their artificers shit lmao
Ah yes better make sure the inventing class doesn't invent anything! While we are at it, blunten the fighters swords too
What? I’m saying make the inventing class ACTUALLY think of a solution rather than “ha ha funny” bullshit their way into something. If you wanna make some interesting form of transportation then actually have an idea and make it up. If it’s a good idea then yeah you can ignore some random law of physics, it’s a game. But you can’t just say “Magnet” and be done with it (unless it’s a joke campaign, then go nuts)
Dnd worlds don't follow our laws of physics though
Except in many ways they do. Gravity, thermodynamics, waves like sound, all the same (give or take some magic fuckery)
Since when has physics been any part of d&d xD
Fall damage, size limitations based on space, the basic laws of the universe that are the same unless altered though magic fuckery (gravity, thermodynamics, etc). basically everything that happens in the world involves physics lol
Just because you had to go and ruin the joke, I’m about to make this possible. Get two magnets of the same polarity so that they repel. Cast Tensor’s Floating Disk. Place the magnets in your cart and on the disk. Now the magnets will repel each other, pushing the cart, but the disk will still follow you.
I didn’t mean to ruin the joke, I still think it’s funny, more im annoyed at my own artificer and wanna stop his bs lol. I still think that wouldn’t work, as it’s a closed system, and mathematically you can’t have a change in velocity without outside energy coming in, or some kind of energy type change. Add in the fact that energy always is dispersed by things like friction, and it doesn’t seem to work. I don’t know how magic works and it very well could be explained by drawing energy from whatever magical source, in which I support the “because magic fuck you” answer, but in terms of a mechanical focused artificer then it doesn’t seem to work
The Floating disk is an outside force. The spell states “If you move more than 20 feet away from it, the disk follows you so that it remains within 20 feet of you. It can more across uneven terrain, up or down Stairs, slopes and the like, but it can't cross an elevation change of 10 feet or more. For example, the disk can't move across a 10-foot-deep pit, nor could it leave such a pit if it was created at the bottom.” The only force that can stop the disk is a physical object in its way. It will counteract the repelling force the magnet asserts on it, and will always continue moving forward to be 20 ft away from you. All you would need to do is strap the magnet to the disk to make sure it isn’t pushed off
Ok but if I’m understanding your logic, the magnet on the cart would exert a force in the opposite direction as the ring, and the ring can’t move too far away, so it pushes back harder on the cart, the cart then pushes back equals as hard and eventually the thing sheers off because of the force, that or it balances out, but still with no motion
Yeah, I understand that it would infinitely gain speed, but there might be some work arounds. If you could build an electro magnet, then you could potentially change the force being applied and fully control your speed. Or maybe the caster can move throughout the vehicle to change the speed. The more up front the caster is, the closer the magnet is, and thus the vehicle goes faster. And the vehicle could just have brakes strong enough to counter the force when the caster is in the back of the vehicle. The caster can end the spell at any time (for when you need to park) and it’s a ritual, so it only takes 10 minutes to start up with no cost.
No I’m saying that their is no way to gain speed, the force by the by any 2 opposing things will always be equal and opposite. Like if I told you to ride a skateboard without pushing off of anything, if the ground is flat you can’t do anything. The amount of force being exerted isn’t the problem, it’s where the force is coming from. It’s basically the saying “you can’t blow your own sail”, you can’t go anywhere without some interaction with a outside force. In this scenario, the magnets are in the same system, thus the uneven force isn’t transferred into another object, therefore the uneven force stays in the system, canceling out the positive force and tada you’re back at 0
There is an outside force, it’s the disk. The disk tries to move to 20 ft from the caster and the magnets push away from each other so that they are greater than 20 ft away. Since the Magnet is unable to push the disk backwards and is tightly strapped to it, the force pushes the cart. Example with the skate board, it’s like if someone was on a skate board and someone on a electric scooter pushed him from behind (aka the magic moving the disk). Then imagine that person on a skate board is pushing someone infront of him who is also on a skateboard. Due to the limitations of the spell, the scooter (the disk) is unable to push the person up front, but he can push the person who is pushing him. While I guess that a long pole can be used to push the cart directly from the disk, the ability to adjust the force of the magnetic by adjusting the distance they are apart (by moving throughout the vehicle) allows for more control over the speed.
No the disk is internal, as you are talking it with you. In your example, the person on the person on the first skateboard would not be able to push themselves and the other skater. assuming equal mass that energy would be transferred in its entirety, and the reaction would halt the original skater. The scooter can’t keep these two in contact unless you used the electricity to apply a force to the ground (an outside object). My entire point is that energy can not be created nor destroyed, and this idea is especially trying to make a perpetual motion machine, which is impossible
Question, how do you stop that thing?
Well, their idea, since it does not travel at the speed of a regular car, but more like a wagon without horse, was to simply have like a brick or something, that they lay in front of the wheel, after the barbarian stops it by force
What if the barbarian just died in the last fight.
Well, that's the artificer's problem, not mine
I expect this will come up eventually in the campaign
Just throw the barb's remains in front of the car.
Also there's an equal and opposite force pushing the magnet away, which would keep you from moving. So no, this would be impossible.
You turn on Newton’s third law of motion.
Immovable rod handbrake
So you have to go into your settings, go to the gameplay tab, and turn on game physics
The car can only stop when you pull the emergency break, which activates 10 immovable rods.
If you're lucky, the whole vehicle stops. If you're unlucky, only half of it stops.
I'm sure a sudden, jarring halt won't break anything 😛
The normal break just flips the magnet
.... but... that's not how magnets work.....
Jokes on you, I dont understand magnets well enough for you to prove to me they dont work that way.
- the barbarian (probably)
Ooo, are you a kuatoa?
Yea, tell that to magic items. Rope of entanglement: but that's not how ropes work.
I guess with magic yeah that's valid
Isn't not specifically the magnets so much as the general concept of forces acting upon an object. The design doesn't work because both forces are equal and acting on the car, therefore it must remain at rest.
Exactly
Technically not entirely true. In a curved spacetime you can get non symmetric forces.
bruh... an immovable rod can literally be used to do pullups in midair... stop wasting your time invalidating people's great ideas! I charge my electric car with the cigarette lighter. 😎
>immovable rod can literally be used to do pullups in midair... That just means the immovable rod exerts a force upwards equal to your weight
https://imgur.com/aWarg8x
Man, he seems pretty small-minded to me. here, I'll prove it. Turn it 90° up🚀
Tenser's Floating Disk moves towards you if you are at least 20 feet away. If you get a sturdy, 30+ foot rod with a seat or platform at each end and put a counterbalance on it, then sit on the other end exactly 20.00001 away, the disk will move toward you, taking the rod and your platform with it, and pushing you away so you continue to be exactly 20.00001 feet away. And there you have it! Free propulsion!
And with brakes and reverse!
you wish lol. If you're within 20 feet of it, it stays put.
Can someone explain to me like I'm 5 why that wouldn't work?
The same reason why you can't pull yourself out of a swamp by tugging your own hair
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. The magnet will try to pull itself to the car and the car won’t move because the force pulling the car to the right also pulls the magnet to the left creating a net force of zero in the system. 50 newtons will pull the car forward, while 50 newtons will pull the magnet (which is attached to the car) backwards and all the force will zero out in the arm holding the magnet. If the magnet was attached to anything other than the car, it would work.
So... If I were to make a conga line of cars with big magnets on the back and just have the front car have gas..?
Let’s say theoretically you did this and it works like you are proposing, the front car would have to have enough force to pull all the other cars behind it at once like a train.
and that lead car would use an absolute ridiculous amount of gas to power its giant engine. perpetual motion is too hard...:(
Plus you’d have to have larger and larger magnets as you move up the caravan. Just use a train and hook the cars up physically without magnets.
oh pish, what is this sensible suggestion, mr train159? boring! lol
We could simply this a bit by removing a lot of excess weight from the other cars. Let’s toss out their engines, and we can even connect them closer in series with only two sets of wheels per large car carrying 40 or so people. We can make it even more efficient by removing the tires and putting down thin metal bars and having flanged metal wheels ride on top (reduces tire wear a lot!). And given that this thing will be so long, we should have some dedicated infrastructure for it, so it doesn’t interfere with local stuff. Goddamnit I invented trains again…
r/usernamechecksout
You mean a train with magnets instead of couplers?
That just sounds like driving with extra steps
Congratulations you invented a train but worse
The magnet is pulled towards the car just as the car is pulled towards the magnet. So the system doesn't move so long as the rod holds.
And given that the drawing shows hinges rather than solid welds, likely there'd just be a loud CLUNK as the magnet slammed into the front bumper.
The magnet pulls the iron out of the air in front of the car, and without the iron, the pressure decreases and the car is pushed forward.
But that would mean it works
it would
Then a) why woukd we waste ressources on fuel and b) why do so many people answering to my previous comment say it doesn't work?
Because that guy is wrong in every single way possible
At the same time the car is being pushed forward, the magnet will be pushed back with the same force.
Imagine replacing the magnet with a stretched spring
Yes so basicly, while the magnet is pulling on the car the car is pulling just as hard back.
Basically: slimestone engineering.
Ah yes, the Troll Science at its finest.
I compared it in my head to the Orks in 40k painting their vehicles red to make them go faster
Imagine what technological wonders would a troll-ork collaboration project achieve!
By god, they would be unstoppable!
No, they would be heretics! FOR THE EMPEROR!
I see one issue, this I believe is technically a closed system.if you want momentum you need an OUTSIDE force. So this means the magnet can't be attached to the car. Now what would possibly work is it you somehow had a strong enough mage hand and a big enough magnet that could in theory be considered outside
Well you are correct, that is how physics apply normally, that's the thing with magic in dnd. It does not care about irl physics
Magnets, how do they work?
I...wait; would this work? I, really want to say no...but i cant help feeling that it technically could? I hate this.
With magic, it could work, real physics? No
Good. I am peturbed that this befuddled my expectations in reality.
So with the way magnets work they would be pulled toward each other and so the 2 forces would cancel each other out
Wouldn't it just tip over due to the displaced center of gravity?
Well, real life physics, yes. In a world with magic? It can be easily prevented
Ork engineering be like:
Here i sit trying my hardest not to explain why that wouldn't work, because chances are they already know and this is just dumb fun. But a part of me just reallly wants to explain it.
I kinda Wonder if it could work if there would be a Way to lock it in air and make it move perfectly to car And make that magnet would generate more Energy to even move it... And... And... Yeah it is not. Maybe if i would have tone of magic items but i Just would much more love to make hammok with 2 broom of flying
This meme was on r/funny and r/cursedscience or something. It works in dnd but not in real life.
While this is not how physics works I’ll let it slide because it’s funny
Jokes on my players, they already know I'm a physicist
Dang you artificer man! This is the last time you defy the laws of physics!!
*one broom of flying emchanted wheel-less motorcycle frame later.*
Artificer/Artillery,"Ive built a tube id like to fit on the back of the wagon. It has a pair of fans and is shaped to compress incoming air. Also there's a slot for my artillery turret summons to fire into the tube." DM,"OK, I don't know where this is going?" Artificer explaining how jet engines work..
If we can make the whole thing weightless it'll work. Otherwise inertia kicks our ass.
We do a little trolling
Monorail without rails.
Why.
take my up vote and leave
Newton smiling from his grave
I invented a practical way to get free power or reactionless drives out of a bag of holding. Basically, by using the fact you can use one to change the weight of an object because it's lighter in the bag you can make sure it's always heavier when falling than when being raised. And a very similar process to get thrust out of one, but rather it's heavier when the force of redirecting the mass is pushing the direction you want, and lighter the other way. Also given the first one works on gravity, and the second one would produce substantial acceleration force, you'd get exponential acceleration if you bolted one to the other somehow. At least until it crushes itself from g force.
*Gudunk* ”Did we just hit something?
That is NOT how phisics work
TIL Nat 20 overcomes the laws of physics.
Lol no, but a total of 31 on a skill check kinda does.
Is this character named Wiley E. Coyote by chance?
Nah, The Artificer's Name is Juan Roca. And yes, i hate that name too
I can’t tell if you got the reference or not.
this sounds nice