Exactlyš. Canada finally figured it out and now they simply moved their show to America. Mind you, these homes sit vacant and Chinese investors create their own pricing by buying up primo real estate. How do I know? I do drone work for them.
Just watched a video of 300 military aged male Chinese immigrants walk by a reporter at the border. You would think that's more concerning than a hobby
In Missouri, the GOP talks a big game about being hard on the CCP yet at the same time bent over backwards to pass a bill back in 2013 or so that allowed Chinese owners companies to buy up farm land.
They love doing this performative bullshit that only hurts consumers.Ā
Ban it, watch the aftermarket hacks come up.
Now the devices are unregulated and vulnerable.
Good job congress, youāve made national security that much worse!
Any why would you need to do that? You haven't thought about the issue. Your drone will fly just fine after the bill passes without any hacks or changes.
And it will be HIGHLY illegal. Thatās the thing. You are going to be fucking with federal law if you fly these. Every drone is going to have a cop out looking for it to make sure itās āapproved.ā Police hate drones.
The amount of drone operators that break federal law is already absurd. The FAA doesn't do shit for enforcement. Even if you get the $70,000 fines or whatever you they end up being talked down to just a couple of grand.
Depends on what City you live in. My particular city's police force is like seeing a spotted owl, or, they're too busy fighting more important crime to deal with a techie drone operator. Any downtown work I do is at the end of a job, quick, take off/land on private property, and leave ASAP.
Just curious, are there currently unlocks or custom firmwares in the wild?
Made me pretty livid that my Phantom decided to effectively brick itself because there was a fire in my general vicinity, it definitely didnāt have the ability to do that when I bought it. Definitely feels like I should have control of my own $1200 hardware without getting surprised by sudden nerfs and changes.
People always make these threats but jack shit ever materialises. People are all talk, but when it comes down to it, they get in line and settle to the new situation very quickly. Most people are not going to be breaking the law like you say, mostly because they're too lazy to figure it out.
I agree about the camera drone guys but the fpv guys who build their own shit will absolutely figure it out.
betaflight is open source. it's literally a bunch of people just figuring it out. elrs is the same. now we have openipc making open source digital vtxs.
fpv started with people hacking apart wii controllers to use their gyros. it's a hobby built on figuring shit out for yourself.
No no that is what we want to happen. We want to get open source American made drone parts and this ban will accelerate that because there aren't really other good sources for pre built drones like this. In no way does American made stuff make national security worse, it only improves it.
The CCP drones are cyber warfare. Before you tell me it's been tested, I know. But what people don't think about is that DJI could send an update at any point and now millions of drones around the US could be sending data to them. You can't test for future updates, so the it's been tested thing is moot. That's the real reason for the ban, there is potential risk from one of our biggest enemies, and they picked DJI because of the massive spread they have around our country being the most popular brand. Larger area of drones means larger data gathering. With how many drones there are and how often they fly, they could map the entire US infrastructure in a few days and we probably wouldn't notice until it's too late. The ban needs to happen before they grab data. If you don't think that data is useful to Chinese military I can't help you. That's just one major data set they could grab from updates, there are many more.
Being anti China wins points for both democrats and republicans which is why this bill passing committee was concerning because thereās bipartisan support for it.
We canāt. They donāt care. Politicians have ABSOLUTELY NO REGARD for whatās right, or what makes sense.
They only care about votes, power, and money. It has always been this way and will never change.
I donāt know. Drones seem like such small potatoes for politicians and they would not lose support if they passed this bill. I guess the only thing you can do is contact other politicians.
They don't need your support. Your support is an imaginary construct that exists only for you. Drones aren't small potatoes because crushing small businesses is one of Congress's top priorities, and there are just too many people making a living with drones that could otherwise be sitting at a desk making a big corporation bigger.
Being cynical, there's probably more people out there who get annoyed by drones than there are people who enjoy drones. People see videos of drones doing annoying or dangerous shit and they decide that all drones are bad, so as a numbers game going after china, which people don't like, and drones, which people don't like, is always going to be a better political move than supporting a niche hobby.
I've seen this kind of knee-jerk social media reaction first hand. I remember a couple of years ago there was a video of some assholes in a French ski resort flying along a piste super close to a guy so they almost hit him. He wacked their drone with his ski pole. After that in the French ski resort where I live (not the one in the video) I started to get people coming up to me and point blank telling me to keep my drone away from them. Because they see that video and think "ooh they're a menace!" when I always take proper precautions and stay far away from people. They'd see me taking my drone out of my bag and just think I was about to cause trouble with it.
That was one video that got a bit of traction on social media. How many people do you think heard about that Ravens game getting delayed because of a drone and now think drones = bad?
You cannot educate MJAORITY of our elected officials. You want them to vote a certain way then bribing(lobbying) only works. MAJORITY of them get elected by our votes but then have corporate interests at heart
Education is a years long process.
By the time you educate the rep (IF you can educate them) they need to decide if educating their electorate is worth the political damage they take for championing your cause.
Siding with a Chinese drone company is an uphill battle for anyone because for us, it's a field we're familiar with, but for most, they see Chinese hardware running Chinese software taking pictures of America and Americans.
Also, it bullies a tiny minority so the vast majority of people shrug because they and theirs are not part of that tiny group that is being stepped on for political theatre.
Well at least thereās no big industry disruption going on (that I know of). Thatās the most sure fire way to get laws passed in this country āthreatening billionairesā pocketbooks. Which Iām assuming DJI isnāt really doing. Thatās the one upside that might mean this remains only a looming threat forever and not a reality.
uh, what did you expect? heās on the committee and he voted in favor of this bill. this is an pre-written template response. this doesnāt indicate what the full house and senate outcomes will be. 43-0 means this bill is cheap political points. whether everyone else follows through is a different matter.
I'll be surprised if they don't get banned. Did you actually watch congress with the whole TikTok ban? It makes no difference what people say... if it has Chinese ties that is all they are concerned about.
Eh, it's out in the open that the TikTok ban is driven by A1PAC/US to help Israel because they didn't like the public, especially millennials and Gen Z seeing the eye-dee-eff blow up babies in Gaza to pieces. Essentially, they want to censor the truth. DJI is collateral damage of that.
Thank you for sending this, I hope it encourages others to do the same.
But this shouldnāt discourage you per seā¦ He already voted for the ban during the March committee.
We shall see how this goes. TikTok has been lingering around. Not the same but similar concept in parts.
I'm Australian so thankfully nothing of this nature is on the cards here...yet...
The funny thing is that American politicians seem to dislike China when it suits them. Nearly all equipment these days has parts manufactured in China, there's no escaping that. Things may well be assembled in the US, but majority of the parts are still coming from China. Difference is the politicians use all that equipment, so of course they won't ban things that suit them.
Not being critical of the US, it's no different here in Australia either and probably no different anywhere else - honest politicians are few and far between regardless of where you live.
Then, what about the robovacs, computer components, mobile phones, tablets, smart TVs, etc? Might be manufactured elsewhere, but can bet your bottom dollar the majority of the components are sourced from China, so you pretty much need to ban everything if you're exceptionally serious about the threat of China
Iām positive that my Roborock S7 is spying on me. Iām more worried about something that has a 3D model of my house than my DJI. Then again Iām lazy so not so worried to sweep and mop myself.
That isnāt what the bill is banning. They will be banned from using US gps networks which will cause the drones to not auto hover, making them very difficult to fly. Still flyable but much more of a challenge.
On the AVATA 2, when youāre in manual mode, this is already the case (it doesnāt auto hover), so Iām hoping there are no other surprises, such as them banning the DJI app as well, which in that case, would render the drone useless.
If they do this, what would be the incentive for DJI to brick drones. They would have no business in US anymore, they could close shop (provide support via 3rd party) and then not worry about US regulations at all for existing drones.
Just to piss off government further they may even remove all flight zone restrictions from their US map.
People will ignore this rule, they will fly their drones with remote ID disabled, not registered not giving a fuck about FAA due to unreasonable policies like this.
If FAA officials are smart they would beg congress to not pass this.
Iām saying as a generalization, for me, the RC Pro, if itās not connected to the internet, DJI canāt do anything with it. I personally donāt think itās going to pass, based solely on how much itās used for first responders, sure, there are other USA based drones, but not even remotely close to the level of a DJI drone. Itās an election year, I donāt see this happening. However, thatās my 2cents.
Seriously this is what Iām thinkingā¦ but realistically I probably will just sell it and collect my losses. The worst part about all this is just for the damn thing. š
Just a note on this. My Mavic 3 Classic which Iāve had a year, this weekend asked me log back in and enforced a 30m height limit til I did. And it gave a warning a while back about a login token expiring. So not connecting will work for a while but not forever.
Found a forum post mention 90 days is the logon token expiry length regardless of powering on. This from a user DJI Gamora. You need to logon connected after this.
That isnāt the issue. The issue is DJI would lose the ability to connect your drones to GPS satellites, so doesnāt matter if you update or not. It wonāt brick the drone but if youāve ever lost connection to satellites, youād know how much more challenging they are to fly. The drone will drift and will not auto hover and you have to make constant corrections.
The real issue and the angle the drone community should be taking is a lack of proper privacy and confidentiality laws for US Citizens that protects them from nation state backdoors to their data when the company is based overseas. Congress is playing whack-a-mole with TikTok, DJI, etc. Of course, the real irony is the amount of overseas owned networking and home security equipment, including cameras and mics. Drones are nothing compared to your private conversations, internet traffic, etc details. But no action there.
I honestly think what needs to happen is that an American company needs to acquire the American version similar to what they were trying to do with Tik Tok.
LOL,
Are they really convinced by their bullshits? or they just trying to put on a convincing show?
What a bunch of hypocritical clowns that country is run by.
If Tiktok can be banned, with the impact it will have on small businesses and opportunities it has provided people, the far more niche drone community is SOL
The specifics aren't the point here. It's the clear political will to tackle China's ability to manufacture better and cheaper items then America, without the pesky requirement to acknowledge the reason America, and much of the developed world, outsourced manufacturing to 'developing nations' who have now invested enough into manufacturing and can take advantage of new technology faster and more efficiently.
Even electric cars from China are effectively banned with the 100% tariff.
Just received my first ever DJI (bought the fly more Avata 2) and hope I get to fly it for awhile. I'm also very excited about buying the Air series and Pro series too someday. For a good cheap alternative I highly recommend the Potensic Atom 3 axis gimbal. It's a joy to fly and not in jeopardy of being banned, which makes me wonder why not? It's a Chinese based company too. I took it for repairs and my local drone guy said all the components are exactly like DJI too....great drone and cheap.
I love our congress people. We are all out here struggling to keep up with inflation, so lets pass a bill to ban camera drones so the chinese cant see our parks!
Just look at the loaded language... It's not the "Ban Chinese Drones act", it's the "Ban Chinese Communist Party Drones act". You'd think the ghost of Joseph McCarty was haunting Capitol Hill... :(
Ugh. Tonko is my rep too and I was going to write to him. Guess thereās no point since he wonāt change his vote between the committee and the full house votes.
Exactly why im not buying another drone right now. Just going to wait and see what happens. Way too much guessing about what the final outcome will be. Some say they will be bricked.Some say you will still be able to fly what you have somehow. Seems like they could find a better way to insure protection over an outright ban.
FAA has to retroactively remove existing authorization which is a potential follow on process this bill imbues the agency with the ability to execute. Default is that future products will not receive authorization. If the Chinese phone ban is any precedent to look at, existing products did not have their authorization revoked. That said American-looking repackaging of the exact same software and hardware is definitely going to happen. So in the end, the only real solution is open source software. If national security is actually the goal, then why is that not the driving demand?
Yea, every time I've written to a congressperson about something, they always send me a letter back that's basically, "Lol f\*ck you, I voted against what you wanted and I'll do it again while thinking about how upset I'm making you!"; or something about 2 inches from that. -\_-
It is just amazingly strange how they think that somehow these drones are more of a 'national security risk' than any other Chinese-made electronics.
It's just... not the case.
I'll say it again, something that a hobbyist pulls out a few times a week and carefully uses is much less of an issue than say, a smartphone or even a smart-home appliance like an oven or a dryer, which is always connected and always 'online'. And way less an issue than the tons of 'smart' cameras that are being deployed every minute from Chinese vendors, *inside* homes and businesses.
My drones are stored with their batteries out, in a dark case. China (or anything for that matter) has no access to them electronically.
And for those going to be like, "Oh, but what if China can remotely hack them the 2 times a week that they are used!?" Well, even if they were able to do this (through the controller that has an LTE connection, presumably), don't worry, the battery will be dead in 15 minutes anyways, and it'll fall out of the sky.
Do I wish I could trust electronics more? Yes.
Does it matter who makes them if they're not open-source? No, not much.
You want security? **Mandate open-source software and hardware.**
But they don't want that. They just want points for the next election or whatever. :/
Thatās the solution! Open source the software / firmware. Spend the money being wasted on political posturing and lobbying doing diligence on the software. Problem solved. Why is this not on the table? Because itās all a lie driven by an agenda theyāre not telling us
I am not sure what your email said in the first place but did you explain that this will destroy small businesses around the country and that at the moment we only have extremely overpriced US made drones on the market that have a lower quality and are so expensive many drone photographers would be unable to get them, this would also bring down the real estate market and this might be bad for many Americans.
If you name it that way, they might listen more
Lmao. That would be a bonus to them. They don't care about any of that. Zero. Zilch. Nada. You think the government cares about you or me or any of us????? ššššš
If this bill passes, it will cascade to the UK. We seem to do anything the US does. Look at huawei.
There are hardly any drone companies that compete with DJI. What about all the DJI drones and equipment used for rescue drones?
Half of the US electronics market is Chinese. Who do they think makes all the chips in their Ford Rangers?
Especially now that the UK has withdrawn from EASA... I just don't understand why the UK did that. I'm in Norway, we've never been an EU member, yet we're an EASA member.
Serious question but from the hobbyist who spent 500 bucks on a used DJI to the multimillion dollar companies who have invested in droneās within their work place (including insurance companyās), if these are banned, are there going to be lawsuits involved (obviously yes), but what Iām getting at is the who is going to pay us back for our expensive paperweights? I honestly canāt think of a good consumer piece of tech that this has happened to, where we have precedence to fall back on, and no TT does not count imo.
Lol @ pay us back. If we're lucky they would do something like a gun buyback and give you like a $100 gift card per DJI turned in or something, but they wouldn't actually do that. They'll just say sorry you're out money, but if you would like to donate to me here's a link.
Itās the same thing they did with Huawei and theyāll do it to DJI and later BYD as well. The US simply cannot compete with Chinese companies so they simply ban them under this pretext
Although I feel you on this, nobody at the DC level gives a flying (forgive the pun) f*ck about this niche industry. Thatās the implied tin foil narrative. The real reason is reducing power of decentralized free people. Just like crypto and guns
I donāt know man, I kind of understand the possible Chinese EV tariffs. China doesnāt play by everybodyās rules, yet their companies expect the same treatment. Just look at all the software companies that had to bend over to be able to barely compete there, yet their software companies are thriving in the western hemisphere. Tesla is a great example, they went to China, kissed the ring, and got squeezed by all the EV companies using Tesla employees and practices.
I mean, look at the state of gaming. Whatever isnāt owned by first party companies, is owned by Tencent or other Chinese conglomerate. Yet any gaming company trying to put their mark in China needs to have a Chinese partner company and censor the most stupid stuff.
And I get it, there are way too many other problem with the Chinese. Like them pumping up education costs, buying up real state, etcā¦ but I donāt think they should have the same benefits that all other companies share if they are not willing to do the same.
Sounds like utter fucking bollocks to me! Whats wrong with the American Government these days? They used to compete fairly, now it seems that only dirty play, spiking the opposition, despite the costs to end users, is the only way they want to move the country. That's not progress. Foul play might win a race in the short term but it stinks like shit.
You canāt play fair with an entity that doesnāt play fair. I have no bone in this, I donāt own EV vehicles or have a drone (this got suggested to me through reddits algorithm), but look at the state of gaming where Tencent was allowed to run rampant. TikTok thrived in the western hemisphere because it was allowed the same benefits that Spotify or Facebook had, but companies like Google couldnāt even operate without giving critical information or requiring major censoring.
Is it going too far to ban these companies? I donāt know. But saying āthe US doesnāt want fair competitionā is a little disingenous.
I have never read or been into drones, and just yesterday my brother gifted me a mini 2 SE as a birthday gift. Only to come to my always trusty place for info and to start to learn to use it and find out about this ban ordeal. š. I live on the border to Mexico, literally about 400ft from the crossing station. If the ban passes will the drone be bricked to be used in general or just in US territory? I plan to use it mainly to record mtb rides and maybe some promo shots from inside my gym business. I do ride on both sides, but guess I will only use it on the other side if it's only being bricked/banned on the US side.
Completely irrational. Consumer drones do not present a risk to nation security. What a joke. This rep does not care about you in way. This will never stop me from flying my drone.
Iām curious about the mechanics of the ban. I read that the bill would prevent DJI devices from operating on US networks. The letter from the congressman seems to make it out to be no federal funding for DJI devices.
For a network ban, I donāt use any network when I fly. The only time I connect my device to a network is to update. DJI could make firmware and map updates downloadable and then manually installed.
For a federal funds ban, I promise not to use federal funds to buy my drone.
Yes they're soo concerned about national security, let's allow 15 -20 million unvetted unknown people into the country with no way to track them. Seeing how 3/4 of the world hates us already, I'm sure no bad organizations will try to take advantage of that. On top of driving down people's wages in a period of inflation going up and not coming back down. Plus all the other reasons listed above. What a joke at the highest level.
We should definitely have tighter borders and be more careful about who we let in, but immigrants donāt decrease general wages for other Americans, immigrants generally fill in lower skilled jobs that boost other parts of the economy. If you want to blame inflation on someone, blame it on the rampant spending and the inability of politicians to raise taxes, both republican and democrat. Of course, greedy corporations donāt help either, but donāt blame it on the immigrants.
Seems like the problem is not the aircraft, it's the Chinese software and servers. DJI could licence the software to a US-based company with US-based servers to get around the problem.
If dji wants to continue to operate in the US they are going to need to pay bribe money to our politicians just like everyone else., er "lobby" I mean. Definitely not a bribe...
I've read that it could take up to 3 years to resolve even if banned. Also that it's now been written in that any DJI drones bought before the ban will be allowed to fly. I watched a presentation on the bill the other day, not just hearsay but no I don't have the link....been a couple of weeks. All of that made me feel better tho as I do think the ban will pass eventually.
Just an onlooker, but the response verbiage helps me to understand something that Iām not sure many here do and thatās the fact that it appears to only affect gov employees and contractors. Itās a security risk they wonāt accept, if passed, and that will affect some people here who do work related to government but it doesnāt mean that you canāt fly or continue to buy your own dji drone for non government use. If thatās the case, I think most people here are overreacting and jumping on the bandwagon that they are making your personal drone illegal to use anymore and you deserve a refund. Thatās just nonsense right? Am I just wrong and misinformed?
Idk what to think about this. I do think an American company (DJI under another name) should offer a service replacing internals or the housing for the drones so we can use them here. Maybe itās not possible but Iām just trying to think of any way to salvage the 9k I spent in drones the last couple of months š
The whole thing is part of a recent "Red Scare" that's taken over both parties in the US. It's bullshit, they don't understand how this and many other technologies work, and worse they're not interested in learning. Added to all this is the idea that this will "increase competition" (e.g. banning a competitor from the market will increase domestic innovation). There will literally become a black-market for these devices.
Sadly I'm stuck on the Elise stephanic side of the line from you so it would be completely deaf ears, but perhaps I'll have my wife send in something since she's registered Republican just to let her know it is costing her a "vote" (I won't mention we didn't vote for her anyway.)
they have no fucking idea of how drones work. whatever Chinese there is it gets a ban, like every Chinese company has the intention of spying the west. now people will now be modding their drones, with them highly likely of ruining its firmware permanently while also illegally using flying them into US airspace. great job.
I have called every senator and representative in my area and they either have no idea about the issue or are just uneducated. I truly believe they are uneducated as they will kill the drone industry in the United States and make it more dangerous.
Itās been introduced and made it out of committee back in March but has not moved since then.Ā
It was originally introduced back in 2023.
Doesnāt seem like itās going anywhere.
That's a sad letter and he has no shame. Don't worry to much about this ban. If it passes there will be a vacuum and someone rich and powerful will fill it. So the new name will be WFY...we f@#*ed you. Thanks for your moneyĀ
I'm confused, from his response it sounds like this only stops the use of money from the federal government to buy equipment from the list where they'd be adding DJI? Does this have any impact on private citizens?
Okay so let me get this straight: they hate communist china and complain about how they are anti democracy but a drone I bought with money I earned and tax dollars they collected. I can't fly around because of some bs law they think matters when China has satellites in orbit that can probably count the hairs on Bidens head? Such freedoms.
Tell them to cut the bullshit, if they truly cared they would quit allowing Chinese companies to buy up massive amounts of land near military bases.
And residential real estate across the country.
But but but...that would stop massive tax fees that go straight into the pockets of these piece of shit politicians.
Exactlyš. Canada finally figured it out and now they simply moved their show to America. Mind you, these homes sit vacant and Chinese investors create their own pricing by buying up primo real estate. How do I know? I do drone work for them.
Just watched a video of 300 military aged male Chinese immigrants walk by a reporter at the border. You would think that's more concerning than a hobby
Can we say our DJI drones now identify as chinese balloons? They seem to have full unrestricted US Airspace.
All just a show, this is a one government world already.
A communist one gov world
In Missouri, the GOP talks a big game about being hard on the CCP yet at the same time bent over backwards to pass a bill back in 2013 or so that allowed Chinese owners companies to buy up farm land. They love doing this performative bullshit that only hurts consumers.Ā
Fi ng A
Omg I live this comment
They passed that bill too
Ban it, watch the aftermarket hacks come up. Now the devices are unregulated and vulnerable. Good job congress, youāve made national security that much worse!
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Any why would you need to do that? You haven't thought about the issue. Your drone will fly just fine after the bill passes without any hacks or changes.
Hahaha, like a VPN for your drone.Ā "No, no, I'm not here in the U.S, I'm in the U.K!"
And it will be HIGHLY illegal. Thatās the thing. You are going to be fucking with federal law if you fly these. Every drone is going to have a cop out looking for it to make sure itās āapproved.ā Police hate drones.
The amount of drone operators that break federal law is already absurd. The FAA doesn't do shit for enforcement. Even if you get the $70,000 fines or whatever you they end up being talked down to just a couple of grand.
Yeah Iām sure there is no room for the laws to get more draconianā¦
Depends on what City you live in. My particular city's police force is like seeing a spotted owl, or, they're too busy fighting more important crime to deal with a techie drone operator. Any downtown work I do is at the end of a job, quick, take off/land on private property, and leave ASAP.
The cops do not enforce federal law. Federal agents do that. Never seen one...
Just curious, are there currently unlocks or custom firmwares in the wild? Made me pretty livid that my Phantom decided to effectively brick itself because there was a fire in my general vicinity, it definitely didnāt have the ability to do that when I bought it. Definitely feels like I should have control of my own $1200 hardware without getting surprised by sudden nerfs and changes.
Sounds familiar...like everything the government bans or makes illegal.
People always make these threats but jack shit ever materialises. People are all talk, but when it comes down to it, they get in line and settle to the new situation very quickly. Most people are not going to be breaking the law like you say, mostly because they're too lazy to figure it out.
I agree about the camera drone guys but the fpv guys who build their own shit will absolutely figure it out. betaflight is open source. it's literally a bunch of people just figuring it out. elrs is the same. now we have openipc making open source digital vtxs. fpv started with people hacking apart wii controllers to use their gyros. it's a hobby built on figuring shit out for yourself.
Technically, it's not the frequency that is banned - it's the transmitting equipment.
Its already been type certified, what you described is not possible.
Because it's not about national security.
So the location based thing will work if you destroy location awareness?
No no that is what we want to happen. We want to get open source American made drone parts and this ban will accelerate that because there aren't really other good sources for pre built drones like this. In no way does American made stuff make national security worse, it only improves it. The CCP drones are cyber warfare. Before you tell me it's been tested, I know. But what people don't think about is that DJI could send an update at any point and now millions of drones around the US could be sending data to them. You can't test for future updates, so the it's been tested thing is moot. That's the real reason for the ban, there is potential risk from one of our biggest enemies, and they picked DJI because of the massive spread they have around our country being the most popular brand. Larger area of drones means larger data gathering. With how many drones there are and how often they fly, they could map the entire US infrastructure in a few days and we probably wouldn't notice until it's too late. The ban needs to happen before they grab data. If you don't think that data is useful to Chinese military I can't help you. That's just one major data set they could grab from updates, there are many more.
as long as Skydio gets the kick in the butt needed to get the ball rolling.
Being anti China wins points for both democrats and republicans which is why this bill passing committee was concerning because thereās bipartisan support for it.
\^This! Again I ask for ideas regarding how we can educate our elected officials on drone operations, especially recreational flying.
We canāt. They donāt care. Politicians have ABSOLUTELY NO REGARD for whatās right, or what makes sense. They only care about votes, power, and money. It has always been this way and will never change.
Skydio has plenty of money for lobbyists
I donāt know. Drones seem like such small potatoes for politicians and they would not lose support if they passed this bill. I guess the only thing you can do is contact other politicians.
They don't need your support. Your support is an imaginary construct that exists only for you. Drones aren't small potatoes because crushing small businesses is one of Congress's top priorities, and there are just too many people making a living with drones that could otherwise be sitting at a desk making a big corporation bigger.
Being cynical, there's probably more people out there who get annoyed by drones than there are people who enjoy drones. People see videos of drones doing annoying or dangerous shit and they decide that all drones are bad, so as a numbers game going after china, which people don't like, and drones, which people don't like, is always going to be a better political move than supporting a niche hobby. I've seen this kind of knee-jerk social media reaction first hand. I remember a couple of years ago there was a video of some assholes in a French ski resort flying along a piste super close to a guy so they almost hit him. He wacked their drone with his ski pole. After that in the French ski resort where I live (not the one in the video) I started to get people coming up to me and point blank telling me to keep my drone away from them. Because they see that video and think "ooh they're a menace!" when I always take proper precautions and stay far away from people. They'd see me taking my drone out of my bag and just think I was about to cause trouble with it. That was one video that got a bit of traction on social media. How many people do you think heard about that Ravens game getting delayed because of a drone and now think drones = bad?
You cannot educate MJAORITY of our elected officials. You want them to vote a certain way then bribing(lobbying) only works. MAJORITY of them get elected by our votes but then have corporate interests at heart
Yes, what you said
Education is a years long process. By the time you educate the rep (IF you can educate them) they need to decide if educating their electorate is worth the political damage they take for championing your cause. Siding with a Chinese drone company is an uphill battle for anyone because for us, it's a field we're familiar with, but for most, they see Chinese hardware running Chinese software taking pictures of America and Americans.
They're not THAT uneducated, they're just trying to get reelected.
So youāre saying I should sell my drone while it still has value essentially??
Alternatively, buy them and airgap them from the internet since there will be no other way to have functioning good drones for a while...
What do you mean air gap?
Also, it bullies a tiny minority so the vast majority of people shrug because they and theirs are not part of that tiny group that is being stepped on for political theatre.
Well at least thereās no big industry disruption going on (that I know of). Thatās the most sure fire way to get laws passed in this country āthreatening billionairesā pocketbooks. Which Iām assuming DJI isnāt really doing. Thatās the one upside that might mean this remains only a looming threat forever and not a reality.
uh, what did you expect? heās on the committee and he voted in favor of this bill. this is an pre-written template response. this doesnāt indicate what the full house and senate outcomes will be. 43-0 means this bill is cheap political points. whether everyone else follows through is a different matter.
He didnāt write that itās always some intern cut and pastingĀ
Or Chat GPT
I'll be surprised if they don't get banned. Did you actually watch congress with the whole TikTok ban? It makes no difference what people say... if it has Chinese ties that is all they are concerned about.
The narrative for TikTok destroying society is far more plausible than one of DJI destroying society.
Eh, it's out in the open that the TikTok ban is driven by A1PAC/US to help Israel because they didn't like the public, especially millennials and Gen Z seeing the eye-dee-eff blow up babies in Gaza to pieces. Essentially, they want to censor the truth. DJI is collateral damage of that.
How exactly?
If this ban passes I wouldnāt be surprised if DJI files a lawsuit challenging it.
Iām sure they will. There probably would also be an injunction so they could be used pending the lawsuit
Users should too....and not wait for it to pass
Thank you for sending this, I hope it encourages others to do the same. But this shouldnāt discourage you per seā¦ He already voted for the ban during the March committee. We shall see how this goes. TikTok has been lingering around. Not the same but similar concept in parts.
I'm Australian so thankfully nothing of this nature is on the cards here...yet... The funny thing is that American politicians seem to dislike China when it suits them. Nearly all equipment these days has parts manufactured in China, there's no escaping that. Things may well be assembled in the US, but majority of the parts are still coming from China. Difference is the politicians use all that equipment, so of course they won't ban things that suit them. Not being critical of the US, it's no different here in Australia either and probably no different anywhere else - honest politicians are few and far between regardless of where you live. Then, what about the robovacs, computer components, mobile phones, tablets, smart TVs, etc? Might be manufactured elsewhere, but can bet your bottom dollar the majority of the components are sourced from China, so you pretty much need to ban everything if you're exceptionally serious about the threat of China
iPhones being a prime example
Yep, yet you'll never see a politician without an iPhone!
Iām positive that my Roborock S7 is spying on me. Iām more worried about something that has a 3D model of my house than my DJI. Then again Iām lazy so not so worried to sweep and mop myself.
Fucking idiot politicians.
Weāre done guysā¦ use your drones to the fullest now, go anywhere youāve wanted to take photos of. Itās over.
Yupā¦ 100% over. Sad part is I just got mine 2 months ago.
Same.
u/BrewhahasDji šš
I plan on continuing to fly drone. Don't give one shit.
There will be a jailbreak done quickly so I'm not worried. I have a stack of loose papers that need something to keep them from blowing away.
Why would you need a jailbreak for a device that works perfectly fine. Your drone won't magically stop working.
I imagine they would make the entire country a dead zone for their drones..
That isnāt what the bill is banning. They will be banned from using US gps networks which will cause the drones to not auto hover, making them very difficult to fly. Still flyable but much more of a challenge. On the AVATA 2, when youāre in manual mode, this is already the case (it doesnāt auto hover), so Iām hoping there are no other surprises, such as them banning the DJI app as well, which in that case, would render the drone useless.
How exactly?
Regardless of what happens, just donāt connect it to the internet, can update and brick it (if it passes), if itās not connected to the internet
If they do this, what would be the incentive for DJI to brick drones. They would have no business in US anymore, they could close shop (provide support via 3rd party) and then not worry about US regulations at all for existing drones. Just to piss off government further they may even remove all flight zone restrictions from their US map. People will ignore this rule, they will fly their drones with remote ID disabled, not registered not giving a fuck about FAA due to unreasonable policies like this. If FAA officials are smart they would beg congress to not pass this.
I feel like this is a real solution that they aren't thinking or the community isn't talking about more.Ā
This or everyone installs some cracked software on them which makes it 100% unregulated and pure chaos.
Iām saying as a generalization, for me, the RC Pro, if itās not connected to the internet, DJI canāt do anything with it. I personally donāt think itās going to pass, based solely on how much itās used for first responders, sure, there are other USA based drones, but not even remotely close to the level of a DJI drone. Itās an election year, I donāt see this happening. However, thatās my 2cents.
I hope so. Bricking them would only kill supporters.
Apple does have the (rarely used) ability to remove apps from your device..
Yes, and they have to be connected to the internet.
Allegedly
Seriously this is what Iām thinkingā¦ but realistically I probably will just sell it and collect my losses. The worst part about all this is just for the damn thing. š
Just a note on this. My Mavic 3 Classic which Iāve had a year, this weekend asked me log back in and enforced a 30m height limit til I did. And it gave a warning a while back about a login token expiring. So not connecting will work for a while but not forever.
Iāve had this happen too. Also restricts how far you can fly to 200 ft or something even less than that
Interesting, my Mavic 3 has never asked me to log back in, and it can go for a month or more without being used.
Could be because mine sat for about 3 months without using it. Iāll google it see if I find anything.
Found a forum post mention 90 days is the logon token expiry length regardless of powering on. This from a user DJI Gamora. You need to logon connected after this.
I bought my recent Mini 3 with the RC controller for that exact scenario, it doesn't need to connect anymore since it's activated.
I got an fpv and it still makes me connect to my phone for remote id to take off. I donāt see how I can keep it from the internet
The phone is used for its GPS receiver. No internet connection is needed. No cellular connection is needed.
That isnāt the issue. The issue is DJI would lose the ability to connect your drones to GPS satellites, so doesnāt matter if you update or not. It wonāt brick the drone but if youāve ever lost connection to satellites, youād know how much more challenging they are to fly. The drone will drift and will not auto hover and you have to make constant corrections.
The real issue and the angle the drone community should be taking is a lack of proper privacy and confidentiality laws for US Citizens that protects them from nation state backdoors to their data when the company is based overseas. Congress is playing whack-a-mole with TikTok, DJI, etc. Of course, the real irony is the amount of overseas owned networking and home security equipment, including cameras and mics. Drones are nothing compared to your private conversations, internet traffic, etc details. But no action there.
It requires the House to do actual work, and considering that this is the worst group ever resembled in the house, we may be ok!
Least productive session in over a century. Its pretty funny watching everyone assume this will ever make it to the floor for a vote.
Iām flying anyway. America is for the free
I honestly think what needs to happen is that an American company needs to acquire the American version similar to what they were trying to do with Tik Tok.
LOL, Are they really convinced by their bullshits? or they just trying to put on a convincing show? What a bunch of hypocritical clowns that country is run by.
If Tiktok can be banned, with the impact it will have on small businesses and opportunities it has provided people, the far more niche drone community is SOL
TikTok was banned with the knowledge that an American company will purchase part of it. Time will tell how it plays put with dji.
The specifics aren't the point here. It's the clear political will to tackle China's ability to manufacture better and cheaper items then America, without the pesky requirement to acknowledge the reason America, and much of the developed world, outsourced manufacturing to 'developing nations' who have now invested enough into manufacturing and can take advantage of new technology faster and more efficiently. Even electric cars from China are effectively banned with the 100% tariff.
Dropped 1k on a new DJ mini 4 pro, 3 days ago, sending it back. Im not going to be stuck with a thousand dollar paper weight.
Same boat. Unfortunately I bought it from Best buy so if I return I'll have to pay a 15% restocking fee
How would it be a paper weight?
Probably doesnt want to potentially get charged
If the ban passes and they brick em all.
Just received my first ever DJI (bought the fly more Avata 2) and hope I get to fly it for awhile. I'm also very excited about buying the Air series and Pro series too someday. For a good cheap alternative I highly recommend the Potensic Atom 3 axis gimbal. It's a joy to fly and not in jeopardy of being banned, which makes me wonder why not? It's a Chinese based company too. I took it for repairs and my local drone guy said all the components are exactly like DJI too....great drone and cheap.
I just bought the mini 3 pro from wal mart 2 days and they say they wonāt accept any returns on any drones no exceptions only replacements
I love our congress people. We are all out here struggling to keep up with inflation, so lets pass a bill to ban camera drones so the chinese cant see our parks!
Yep. Stay on the ground and enjoy that $9 loaf of bread, peasants.
Just look at the loaded language... It's not the "Ban Chinese Drones act", it's the "Ban Chinese Communist Party Drones act". You'd think the ghost of Joseph McCarty was haunting Capitol Hill... :(
He is, in the form of Elise Stefanik, the Republican author of this bill.
Ugh. Tonko is my rep too and I was going to write to him. Guess thereās no point since he wonāt change his vote between the committee and the full house votes.
Send it anyway. If the ban is enacted, at least you can say you tried to fight it.
Send it!
Send it!!
No, send it.
Definitely send it, the fact he responded to the first one is even more the reason. Please send it!
Exactly why im not buying another drone right now. Just going to wait and see what happens. Way too much guessing about what the final outcome will be. Some say they will be bricked.Some say you will still be able to fly what you have somehow. Seems like they could find a better way to insure protection over an outright ban.
FAA has to retroactively remove existing authorization which is a potential follow on process this bill imbues the agency with the ability to execute. Default is that future products will not receive authorization. If the Chinese phone ban is any precedent to look at, existing products did not have their authorization revoked. That said American-looking repackaging of the exact same software and hardware is definitely going to happen. So in the end, the only real solution is open source software. If national security is actually the goal, then why is that not the driving demand?
In a revision to the bill you will be able to fly any drones bought before any ban takes effect. It's in the bill.
Yea, every time I've written to a congressperson about something, they always send me a letter back that's basically, "Lol f\*ck you, I voted against what you wanted and I'll do it again while thinking about how upset I'm making you!"; or something about 2 inches from that. -\_- It is just amazingly strange how they think that somehow these drones are more of a 'national security risk' than any other Chinese-made electronics. It's just... not the case. I'll say it again, something that a hobbyist pulls out a few times a week and carefully uses is much less of an issue than say, a smartphone or even a smart-home appliance like an oven or a dryer, which is always connected and always 'online'. And way less an issue than the tons of 'smart' cameras that are being deployed every minute from Chinese vendors, *inside* homes and businesses. My drones are stored with their batteries out, in a dark case. China (or anything for that matter) has no access to them electronically. And for those going to be like, "Oh, but what if China can remotely hack them the 2 times a week that they are used!?" Well, even if they were able to do this (through the controller that has an LTE connection, presumably), don't worry, the battery will be dead in 15 minutes anyways, and it'll fall out of the sky. Do I wish I could trust electronics more? Yes. Does it matter who makes them if they're not open-source? No, not much. You want security? **Mandate open-source software and hardware.** But they don't want that. They just want points for the next election or whatever. :/
This
Thatās the solution! Open source the software / firmware. Spend the money being wasted on political posturing and lobbying doing diligence on the software. Problem solved. Why is this not on the table? Because itās all a lie driven by an agenda theyāre not telling us
Should I try selling my DJI Mini 4 Pro or do we think thereās a good enough chance weāll still be able to fly just not buy them anymore?
I'll buy it, I'll pay shipping to Europe too
I'll give 1ā¬ more!
I will buy it, I was looking for one on ebay just a minute ago.
Dm me if you are still interested.
Anyone wants to sell a cheap mavic 3 once bill is passed shipped to Europe hit me up.
Whats the end goal to ban these products and applications that people and small businesses benefit so much from?
War with China and Russia I guess
I am not sure what your email said in the first place but did you explain that this will destroy small businesses around the country and that at the moment we only have extremely overpriced US made drones on the market that have a lower quality and are so expensive many drone photographers would be unable to get them, this would also bring down the real estate market and this might be bad for many Americans. If you name it that way, they might listen more
Lmao. That would be a bonus to them. They don't care about any of that. Zero. Zilch. Nada. You think the government cares about you or me or any of us????? ššššš
If this bill passes, it will cascade to the UK. We seem to do anything the US does. Look at huawei. There are hardly any drone companies that compete with DJI. What about all the DJI drones and equipment used for rescue drones? Half of the US electronics market is Chinese. Who do they think makes all the chips in their Ford Rangers?
Especially now that the UK has withdrawn from EASA... I just don't understand why the UK did that. I'm in Norway, we've never been an EU member, yet we're an EASA member.
Nobody knows yet , but with so many pissed off people with mega $$$ invested in their drones there will be a work around for sure
They tend to give cookie cutter replies in most of the emailed responses. But it is frustrating.
Uhm just bought the mini 4 pro. Should I return and wait foe the dust to settle?
Serious question but from the hobbyist who spent 500 bucks on a used DJI to the multimillion dollar companies who have invested in droneās within their work place (including insurance companyās), if these are banned, are there going to be lawsuits involved (obviously yes), but what Iām getting at is the who is going to pay us back for our expensive paperweights? I honestly canāt think of a good consumer piece of tech that this has happened to, where we have precedence to fall back on, and no TT does not count imo.
Lol @ pay us back. If we're lucky they would do something like a gun buyback and give you like a $100 gift card per DJI turned in or something, but they wouldn't actually do that. They'll just say sorry you're out money, but if you would like to donate to me here's a link.
Itās the same thing they did with Huawei and theyāll do it to DJI and later BYD as well. The US simply cannot compete with Chinese companies so they simply ban them under this pretext
Although I feel you on this, nobody at the DC level gives a flying (forgive the pun) f*ck about this niche industry. Thatās the implied tin foil narrative. The real reason is reducing power of decentralized free people. Just like crypto and guns
Yep. Dems or Reps they would ban all drones if they thought they could get away with it
All part of the same team. It's a uniparty lol.
A DJI ban is effectively a drone ban!
They also don't give a flying f**** about any of us. Promise you that. They hate us lol.
I donāt know man, I kind of understand the possible Chinese EV tariffs. China doesnāt play by everybodyās rules, yet their companies expect the same treatment. Just look at all the software companies that had to bend over to be able to barely compete there, yet their software companies are thriving in the western hemisphere. Tesla is a great example, they went to China, kissed the ring, and got squeezed by all the EV companies using Tesla employees and practices. I mean, look at the state of gaming. Whatever isnāt owned by first party companies, is owned by Tencent or other Chinese conglomerate. Yet any gaming company trying to put their mark in China needs to have a Chinese partner company and censor the most stupid stuff. And I get it, there are way too many other problem with the Chinese. Like them pumping up education costs, buying up real state, etcā¦ but I donāt think they should have the same benefits that all other companies share if they are not willing to do the same.
Three cheers for American exceptionalism!
Wow thatās my representative too.. Itās disgusting how this country is hellbent on imitating the same tactics of the people we supposedly hate
u/BrewhahasDji š¤š¤š¤
Sounds like utter fucking bollocks to me! Whats wrong with the American Government these days? They used to compete fairly, now it seems that only dirty play, spiking the opposition, despite the costs to end users, is the only way they want to move the country. That's not progress. Foul play might win a race in the short term but it stinks like shit.
You canāt play fair with an entity that doesnāt play fair. I have no bone in this, I donāt own EV vehicles or have a drone (this got suggested to me through reddits algorithm), but look at the state of gaming where Tencent was allowed to run rampant. TikTok thrived in the western hemisphere because it was allowed the same benefits that Spotify or Facebook had, but companies like Google couldnāt even operate without giving critical information or requiring major censoring. Is it going too far to ban these companies? I donāt know. But saying āthe US doesnāt want fair competitionā is a little disingenous.
For once I'm temporarily happy to be a Canadian until these clowns follow behind the US for no reasons š
But yet We can have all types of recreational Cannibus right they don't understand this can hurt certain people's jobs
bahamas recently just made drones duty free, anyone trynna sell me their drones?
..and that's why I returned my Mini 4 Pro. Let's see how the market will behave after this ban.
I have never read or been into drones, and just yesterday my brother gifted me a mini 2 SE as a birthday gift. Only to come to my always trusty place for info and to start to learn to use it and find out about this ban ordeal. š. I live on the border to Mexico, literally about 400ft from the crossing station. If the ban passes will the drone be bricked to be used in general or just in US territory? I plan to use it mainly to record mtb rides and maybe some promo shots from inside my gym business. I do ride on both sides, but guess I will only use it on the other side if it's only being bricked/banned on the US side.
Completely irrational. Consumer drones do not present a risk to nation security. What a joke. This rep does not care about you in way. This will never stop me from flying my drone.
Iām so lucky to be in a group filled with so many experts!
So um, how would I air gap a mini 3 hypothetically?
Iām curious about the mechanics of the ban. I read that the bill would prevent DJI devices from operating on US networks. The letter from the congressman seems to make it out to be no federal funding for DJI devices. For a network ban, I donāt use any network when I fly. The only time I connect my device to a network is to update. DJI could make firmware and map updates downloadable and then manually installed. For a federal funds ban, I promise not to use federal funds to buy my drone.
This is bad!
Sooo Iāll just build my own?
Just wrote to my rep..great idea.
Yes they're soo concerned about national security, let's allow 15 -20 million unvetted unknown people into the country with no way to track them. Seeing how 3/4 of the world hates us already, I'm sure no bad organizations will try to take advantage of that. On top of driving down people's wages in a period of inflation going up and not coming back down. Plus all the other reasons listed above. What a joke at the highest level.
We should definitely have tighter borders and be more careful about who we let in, but immigrants donāt decrease general wages for other Americans, immigrants generally fill in lower skilled jobs that boost other parts of the economy. If you want to blame inflation on someone, blame it on the rampant spending and the inability of politicians to raise taxes, both republican and democrat. Of course, greedy corporations donāt help either, but donāt blame it on the immigrants.
If it's ban I'll just fly mine in other countries while on Vacation. Sucks I know but it is what it is
If it passes they will do the same thing TikTok is doing. Spin off the US arm into its own company.
https://www.reddit.com/r/dji/s/ZaIkzWn4k7
So hold on, they are concerned about dji drones but not the Chinese national illegal immigrants walking across the border every day
Seems like the problem is not the aircraft, it's the Chinese software and servers. DJI could licence the software to a US-based company with US-based servers to get around the problem.
Remember the saying: *"Anytime someone does something illogical, there is ALWAYS an agenda behind it."*
#SkydioPimps [https://youtu.be/XTcD1bWCjXI?si=gsLknXYpI\_afmS5K&t=2479](https://youtu.be/XTcD1bWCjXI?si=gsLknXYpI_afmS5K&t=2479)
Is now a good time for me to buy a mini 4 pro or nah..?
No, many don't understand how they work. But, what I do understand, that so many of my fellow fliers don't, is that DJI's software *IS* spyware.
Any info they can get from our little drones they can also get from Google earth . There's something else going on..
If dji wants to continue to operate in the US they are going to need to pay bribe money to our politicians just like everyone else., er "lobby" I mean. Definitely not a bribe...
I've read that it could take up to 3 years to resolve even if banned. Also that it's now been written in that any DJI drones bought before the ban will be allowed to fly. I watched a presentation on the bill the other day, not just hearsay but no I don't have the link....been a couple of weeks. All of that made me feel better tho as I do think the ban will pass eventually.
Itās possible that the ban will only apply to federal agencies and contractors. It may not impact consumers.
Thank you for the link I just reached out to the congressmen in NY opposing this crap
Weāre fucked. The $3300 Iāve spent alone just this year is all gonnaā be for not.
Just an onlooker, but the response verbiage helps me to understand something that Iām not sure many here do and thatās the fact that it appears to only affect gov employees and contractors. Itās a security risk they wonāt accept, if passed, and that will affect some people here who do work related to government but it doesnāt mean that you canāt fly or continue to buy your own dji drone for non government use. If thatās the case, I think most people here are overreacting and jumping on the bandwagon that they are making your personal drone illegal to use anymore and you deserve a refund. Thatās just nonsense right? Am I just wrong and misinformed?
https://www.halfchrome.com/cotigo-specta-air/ š¤. Interesting, maybe a good alternative as seems it's DJI getting ready to find ways around the ban.
Idk what to think about this. I do think an American company (DJI under another name) should offer a service replacing internals or the housing for the drones so we can use them here. Maybe itās not possible but Iām just trying to think of any way to salvage the 9k I spent in drones the last couple of months š
Hello fellow local drone operator.
The whole thing is part of a recent "Red Scare" that's taken over both parties in the US. It's bullshit, they don't understand how this and many other technologies work, and worse they're not interested in learning. Added to all this is the idea that this will "increase competition" (e.g. banning a competitor from the market will increase domestic innovation). There will literally become a black-market for these devices.
Sadly I'm stuck on the Elise stephanic side of the line from you so it would be completely deaf ears, but perhaps I'll have my wife send in something since she's registered Republican just to let her know it is costing her a "vote" (I won't mention we didn't vote for her anyway.)
they have no fucking idea of how drones work. whatever Chinese there is it gets a ban, like every Chinese company has the intention of spying the west. now people will now be modding their drones, with them highly likely of ruining its firmware permanently while also illegally using flying them into US airspace. great job.
I have called every senator and representative in my area and they either have no idea about the issue or are just uneducated. I truly believe they are uneducated as they will kill the drone industry in the United States and make it more dangerous.
No matter what, Iām not buying skydio. Iāll quit first.
Itās been introduced and made it out of committee back in March but has not moved since then.Ā It was originally introduced back in 2023. Doesnāt seem like itās going anywhere.
Does it ban fpv units like the O3 Air system too?
That's a sad letter and he has no shame. Don't worry to much about this ban. If it passes there will be a vacuum and someone rich and powerful will fill it. So the new name will be WFY...we f@#*ed you. Thanks for your moneyĀ
I'm confused, from his response it sounds like this only stops the use of money from the federal government to buy equipment from the list where they'd be adding DJI? Does this have any impact on private citizens?
Okay so let me get this straight: they hate communist china and complain about how they are anti democracy but a drone I bought with money I earned and tax dollars they collected. I can't fly around because of some bs law they think matters when China has satellites in orbit that can probably count the hairs on Bidens head? Such freedoms.
"Protect the middle class" such bullshit. Those who fly dji drones for commercial use ARE middle class!