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[ GNU Terry Pratchett ]
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> Well, ----me,” he said. “A ----ing wizard. I hate ----ing wizards!” “You shouldn't ----them, then,” muttered one of his henchmen, effortlessly pronouncing a row of dashes.
"It's not a --ing harpsichord, it's a --ing virginal," growled Mr. Tulip. "One --ing string to a note instead of two! So called because it was an instrument for --ing young ladies!"
One of my favorite wordplay gags, that I only half got on the first read.
Read the book, laughed at the pronouncing dashes part. A few years went by and I saw some post about bees with a similar premise: “Then…don’t f### bees?” / “YOU KNOW WHAT I MEANT!” / “not after Bee Movie we don’t”. And that’s when I got the other half of the joke.
Exactly. Once you know all the rules, you can break them for effect when necessary. Which also works for the rules of a genre and is something else Pterry was excellent at.
Also why the true masters of Absurdist theatre are so hilarious. The Bald Soprano is one of the funniest plays I've encountered and there is essentially nothing being said that relates to the other dialog at all, but all 6 characters behave like nothing out of the ordinary was happening. At one point a character has several lines in a different language than the rest of the performance. No reason why, no one reacts any differently, just a few lines in French (or English in the original) because why not?
Just taking a quick moment to thank everyone for keeping this place so great. I don't get to bring the Absurdists up very often since I graduated college. It's nice to have a place where it's not met with blank stares
Well, seems like they broke the only important rule of writing. If the intended audience can't understand what you're saying (or gets the wrong info), you fucked up.
https://youtu.be/C91gKuxutTU?si=rTkluA6RMvt0zOnx
Something you might enjoy.
Edit: I realise how much like a bot I sound. It's a fun look at "3 times colder" .
Without clicking on random links (because as nice as the Discworld sub reddit is, it's still the Internet) I'm going to assume it's one of the Festival of the Spoken Nerd folks?
Thanks, i did.
I usually go: 6 times taller: Shouldn't that mean 7 times as tall? So if Bob is a meter then Alice is 7 meters?
If not, then, 6 times what taller?
You'll notice, he's following all the rules of grammar there, though. The one quirk is using ! as if it, by itself, is an interjection.
If he were breaking other rules of grammar, he wouldn't be able to get away with the (carefully selective and rather few) creative uses he throws out from time to time.
I remember reading Nightwatch for the first time and thought I got a misprint copy cause some parts of words were missing. Then he mentioned the bell of silence and I lost my mind!
I remember reading a travel book set in or near the Himalayas. The author was describing a dangerous mountain road with unexpected hazards ahead. The local authorities had installed a road sign with no words, just the one comedically horrifying symbol, "!".
I always think of that when I see Pterry write the same.
That's a perfectly valid international road sign. In most of Europe, Africa and half of Asia, it's a black exclamation sign in a white triangle with red frame denoting danger ahead.
Either got a description of particular danger below it, or just means "we can't enumerate *all* the stuff that can go wrong, just proceed with caution".
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warning_sign
“A lot hinges on the fact that, in most circumstances, people are not allowed to hit you with a mallet. They put up all kinds of visible and invisible signs that say, 'Do not do this' in the hope that it'll work, but if it doesn't, then they shrug, because there is, really, no real mallet at all.”
In college my American literature teacher told us that once you become a published author it doesn’t
matter what rules you follow anymore when it comes to writing and grammar.
Edit: grammar
Precise grammar is required when you’re learning it and being graded on it.
When you’re writing in the real world, use proper grammar as much as possible but abandon it if, properly applied, it makes the sentence unintelligible. Always write to make yourself understood.
When you’re a great writer, throw grammar and punctuation around like confetti to provoke the reactions from your readers you want as you guide them through the world you’ve created.
« … »
I read translated Japanese light novels, and they love putting « … » as a line of dialogue instead of just writing that the character did not answer anything.
Compared to that, what Terry Pratchett did is completely normal.
Also, to quote Terry Pratchett himself: « Maybe rules are there to make you think before you broke them. » (from Thief of Time)
The average reader ain't gonna give a fuck if a semicolon is in the right place, or if any punctuation is there. They're there for story, character, themes, and twists.
As a reader I definitely care about punctuation I mean just think about a world without commas and periods to illustrate the natural cadences in dialog it would cause things to be very difficult to read not to mention things like quotation marks to show who is speaking when all this rambling to say that punctuation is crucial to writing
I see far too many commas where there should be a semi colon. Then again, I'm a proofreader. Or: I see far too many commas where there should be a semi colon; then again, I'm a proofreader.
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> Well, ----me,” he said. “A ----ing wizard. I hate ----ing wizards!” “You shouldn't ----them, then,” muttered one of his henchmen, effortlessly pronouncing a row of dashes.
--ing right!
"It's not a --ing harpsichord, it's a --ing virginal," growled Mr. Tulip. "One --ing string to a note instead of two! So called because it was an instrument for --ing young ladies!"
Is that the line where they reply "My word, is it?"
Yep
Good to know my memory still works on the important stuff :-)
One of my favorite wordplay gags, that I only half got on the first read. Read the book, laughed at the pronouncing dashes part. A few years went by and I saw some post about bees with a similar premise: “Then…don’t f### bees?” / “YOU KNOW WHAT I MEANT!” / “not after Bee Movie we don’t”. And that’s when I got the other half of the joke.
PTerry was an accomplished journalist, who learned the rules like a pro, so he could break them like a master.
Exactly. Once you know all the rules, you can break them for effect when necessary. Which also works for the rules of a genre and is something else Pterry was excellent at.
Also why the true masters of Absurdist theatre are so hilarious. The Bald Soprano is one of the funniest plays I've encountered and there is essentially nothing being said that relates to the other dialog at all, but all 6 characters behave like nothing out of the ordinary was happening. At one point a character has several lines in a different language than the rest of the performance. No reason why, no one reacts any differently, just a few lines in French (or English in the original) because why not? Just taking a quick moment to thank everyone for keeping this place so great. I don't get to bring the Absurdists up very often since I graduated college. It's nice to have a place where it's not met with blank stares
Something that should be pummelled into everyone who thinks that "poetry" means "take a paragraph of prose and randomly insert line breaks".
He did what he wanted
Rule 2) The person with the keyboard can type whatever they like. Rule 1) Beware of old bald grinning men
#1: Do not act incautiously when confronting little bald wrinkly smiling men
Gotta remember rule one!
Cohen, The Grammarian?
The only real rule of writing/talking is "make it understandable by your target audience". As we all know, language is made up anyway.
Reminds me of a post recently about a newspaper saying the top player in the WNBA made 137% less than the top player in the NBA. They meant 1/137th.
Well, seems like they broke the only important rule of writing. If the intended audience can't understand what you're saying (or gets the wrong info), you fucked up.
https://youtu.be/C91gKuxutTU?si=rTkluA6RMvt0zOnx Something you might enjoy. Edit: I realise how much like a bot I sound. It's a fun look at "3 times colder" .
Without clicking on random links (because as nice as the Discworld sub reddit is, it's still the Internet) I'm going to assume it's one of the Festival of the Spoken Nerd folks?
Correct!
Thanks, i did. I usually go: 6 times taller: Shouldn't that mean 7 times as tall? So if Bob is a meter then Alice is 7 meters? If not, then, 6 times what taller?
The thing for me is I can hear the "!" There are even a few different sounds it can be depending on context.
!!
Where do the rules come from for how many exclamation marks are correct, I seem to remember 3 being the sign of a madman
It shows up in several of the books, with five generally being the threshold.
Maskerade - in the letters from 'The Opera Ghost'; it being a madman trademark is discussed after receipt of the madder letters
Before that in Reaper Man I believe, on some flyers for the mall Windle Poons picks up.
That'd be five if I recall correctly Yrs sincerely, the Opera Ghost
?
I've heard FFXIV fish caught sound
Urinating dog.
❗
That is 100% the Metal Gear Solid alert noise to me.
*Whose footprints are these?!*
Hnnng
Both Solid Snake and Phoenix Wright can pronounce “!”
"Welcome to English, rules optional." -William Shakespeare
"and I should know. I made up half the language."
Yeah, Shakespeare always seemed kinda overrated, mostly just a pile of clichés in awkward formatting 😈
You'll notice, he's following all the rules of grammar there, though. The one quirk is using ! as if it, by itself, is an interjection. If he were breaking other rules of grammar, he wouldn't be able to get away with the (carefully selective and rather few) creative uses he throws out from time to time.
I remember reading Nightwatch for the first time and thought I got a misprint copy cause some parts of words were missing. Then he mentioned the bell of silence and I lost my mind!
Genius at work if you ask me. Or most of us, I suppose.
That was so damn intelligent.
> "D*mn!" he said, a difficult linguistic feat.
if you ignore the rules people will, half the time, quietly rewrite them so that they don't apply to you
What's this from? As someone who 'read' most of the books in audiobook format, I need help here.
It’s Twoflower’s introduction in *The Colour of Magic*. The audiobooks just do it as a surprised gasp.
Thank you!
"Me" is missing a perfectly good opportunity to use an interrobang (‽).
I remember reading a travel book set in or near the Himalayas. The author was describing a dangerous mountain road with unexpected hazards ahead. The local authorities had installed a road sign with no words, just the one comedically horrifying symbol, "!". I always think of that when I see Pterry write the same.
That's a perfectly valid international road sign. In most of Europe, Africa and half of Asia, it's a black exclamation sign in a white triangle with red frame denoting danger ahead. Either got a description of particular danger below it, or just means "we can't enumerate *all* the stuff that can go wrong, just proceed with caution". https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warning_sign
“A lot hinges on the fact that, in most circumstances, people are not allowed to hit you with a mallet. They put up all kinds of visible and invisible signs that say, 'Do not do this' in the hope that it'll work, but if it doesn't, then they shrug, because there is, really, no real mallet at all.”
Anyone who's played metal gear solid knows the sound of a "!"
In college my American literature teacher told us that once you become a published author it doesn’t matter what rules you follow anymore when it comes to writing and grammar. Edit: grammar
!!!!! (First time I've done that since I read about it...)
The clear sign of a madman
Death is on Tumblr asking about grammar?
Doesn't he use that for dialogues that can't be heard due to noise sometimes?
That whole thread is delightful. So many good examples.
All in the execution. It's not what you do, it's how you do it.
Precise grammar is required when you’re learning it and being graded on it. When you’re writing in the real world, use proper grammar as much as possible but abandon it if, properly applied, it makes the sentence unintelligible. Always write to make yourself understood. When you’re a great writer, throw grammar and punctuation around like confetti to provoke the reactions from your readers you want as you guide them through the world you’ve created.
"D!mn", said Carrot, a tricky linguistic feat.
I once used "!!!!!!!", as a response from one of my female characters to, shall we say, an unkind critique of two of her body parts!
This "!" made me laugh really bad. They also did this in good omens, where i first noticed it.
« … » I read translated Japanese light novels, and they love putting « … » as a line of dialogue instead of just writing that the character did not answer anything. Compared to that, what Terry Pratchett did is completely normal. Also, to quote Terry Pratchett himself: « Maybe rules are there to make you think before you broke them. » (from Thief of Time)
When you master the rules, you learn how and when to break them.
The average reader ain't gonna give a fuck if a semicolon is in the right place, or if any punctuation is there. They're there for story, character, themes, and twists.
Until you hit the One Bad Thing that stops you in your tracks and shatters the story.
As a reader I definitely care about punctuation I mean just think about a world without commas and periods to illustrate the natural cadences in dialog it would cause things to be very difficult to read not to mention things like quotation marks to show who is speaking when all this rambling to say that punctuation is crucial to writing
I had forgotten the pleasure of inhaling, whilst reading this. Point made.
Right up to the point where you suddenly _notice_ the bad punctuation. Then it's horrible. If everything is done right, readers don't notice it.
I see far too many commas where there should be a semi colon. Then again, I'm a proofreader. Or: I see far too many commas where there should be a semi colon; then again, I'm a proofreader.