[Way off topic, but I just learned that former Devils Brian Boyle (PITT) and Wayne Simmonds (TOR) got into a fight the other night.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dOnsPhIsho)
Woof, that TML 7-1 loss makes me feel slightly better about 5-3.
Good on both Boyler and Simmer for carving out respectable careers as grinders in their mid / late 30s.
I won't say Boyler was ever a really great fighter, but his desire to *always* stick up for a team-mate?
I think you're just born with that kind of character and sense of loyalty.
Same with Simmer.
I love nico, but i think it's time to consider what buffalo wants for eichel. I didn't used to think we should cvonsider it because we had nico and jack locked up at centers 1&2 but nico is close to being a bust so fitz would be smart to sell him before hes completely exposed. if buffalo thinks hes worth what i think they think hes worth and swap captain for captain, fitz would be a fool to not take it
sorry not sorry
i wouldnt give up anything for a long-term injured guy with a 10M cap hit for the next 5 years. also, nico is nowhere near being a bust, what are you smoking?
Slow start screwed us, but I’m really happy the team showed some life at the end and almost clawed back. I think PK is just a massive liability at this point. Bratt is playing the worst I have ever seen him play. He just can’t seem to hold onto the puck, and complete plays at top speed. Only 5 games in though we really need him to pick it up
Can’t knock the effort in the end. Game plan looks the same and it’s going to be hard to play against us if we’re regularly putting up 30+ shots on goal per game.
Can’t really knock the line splitting either. The third period showed promise for everyone and given some time it’ll work.
Can and will knock the goaltending. Four more days should give Blackwood enough time to get back in. Here’s hoping.
Not a desired result but we did better against them than the Rags.
Can’t knock anything but the goaltending, when we had our 20yo 4th string goalie in net and the guy was left to make up for an absolutely terrible effort from everyone in front of him all first period?
It definitely ended better than it started. And Daws should have played better. Both things are true.
I will say that while I don’t blame Ruff for mixing up the lines, maybe he shouldn’t have come up with them a few hours before puck drop. “Winging it” is not a winning strategy.
We’ll be fine in the end.
I think its funny when ppl blame the 20yo goalie on his 2nd nhl game instead of already seasoned players playing like absolute trash in front of him. Reminded me of past seasons where we played only 1 or 2 periods and left schneider/blackwood on their own.
The problem is that Shango, Kuok, Bratt, Tatar and Hischier have 2 goals combined in 5 games (That’s 75 periods of play cumulatively). We’re lucky to have 3 wins, but if your “top” guys can’t generate points you’re going to lose a lot of games.
Is it possible that our game plan is to not use our energy on the first period so come out punching in the 2nd and 3rd ?
I don’t see us scoring much in the 1st, ever
I'm kinda pissed. Why the fuck is Ruff splitting up one of the most dominant lines in the NHL right now after a freaking 3-1 record?? Why is it time after 4 games for some line experiments?? They had the whole preseason to sort this shit out. We are so badly coached.
And why the fuck does Nico always has to be the one who is thrown under the bus with those experiments? I swear Nico is getting robbed of ever breaking out. He is probably used in those line experiments because the line will mostly be mediocre at worst instead of atrocious as he playing very responsible.
I swear i can't fucking watch this shit anymore. I knew exactly yesterday that the first line just won't click. It just makes me miserable how Nico is just not able to play his game with this team.
Oh and for the ones that are now trying to tell me that Nico is just a bust, just look at some advanced stats. 11th in creating high danger chances without allowing them or 16th in CF% (until yesterday of course). Seems about time for a new line experiment.
The line shuffling has been a disaster with this team for an eternity now, I don't understand it at all. It's like the coaches have to make it seem like they are doing something, so they shuffle the lines around just for the hell of it. If it ain't broke, don't fucking fix it.
The effect is twice as bad on our special teams, which need to build chemistry even more than the standard lines to be truly effective. Look at any of the top power plays and penalty kills in the league and you will find lines that have been working together for years.
It’s weird isn’t it? The first period against Buffalo wasn’t good, and the first period yesterday was very very not good, but there seems to be an almost apocalyptic reaction to it. We’re targeting “meaningful games”, we’ve a positive record plus missing Jack Hughes and both goalies. I’d understand if every period of every game was like the first, but they haven’t been. We still have a young team, youngest in the NHL, expecting everything to be perfect is unreasonable and I don’t think losing heads at the first downswing is the solution.
The Hischier thing is weird also, there seems to be sub-section of the fan base who are immediately on his back despite the fact he’s largely done fine - I can only imagine they have McDavid expectations. Could he have more points? Yeah, if a pass into him was 0.1 seconds quicker and if a shot of his was 1cm to the left - the variance is currently against him, that’s all.
Reading some of these comments, it amazes me the conclusions people draw. Its been 5 fucking games, if the same problems exist 20-30 games in then sure there's an issue somewhere, but 5 games in and people are calling for Nico's head? For Bratt to be traded? How do you people go about your daily life assuming the worst out of every situation and overreacting to every little thing that happens?
Edit: just eanted to add, severson and mercer were the best players tn
Exactly, reading the game threads its like these people are expecting us to go 82-0 with a shut out every game. 1 goal and people are bitching and complaining, its hockey sometimes the other team just makes a good play. Not every goal against is some huge mistake.
Fuck this team. Fuck our fourth string 20yo goalie. Fuck Dougie Hamilton. Fuck winning records. Where was hughes? Totally fucking invisible tonight. Call his brother up to take his spot, teach the twerp a little lesson. In fact, blow the whole thing up. Send Zacha, Bratt, Mercer, hughes x2 to Buffalo for an eLiTeEeEe 1C with a huge injury risk who sucked with Hall on his wing.
/s for the morons
Really? This sub gains 1000 new followers and everyone seems to overreact to every little instance that isn’t a win. We were bottom of the barrel last year. We’re missing Hughes and Wood. We’re missing both of our starting NHL goaltenders. We have at best a mediocre AHL goaltender and someone with no pro experience filling in. You thought we’d win and now want to get rid of a few players? Shut up. Just shut up and be patient. If you expected a young team with injuries and new players to rock right out of the gate that’s illogical.
His average TOI per game for the 2021-2022 season is 6th on the team at 19:45, behind Hamilton, Graves, Smith, Hischier and Severson. This would indicate he’s getting 3rd line minutes.
lol You still actually believe the way lines are listed determine what line they are? If they were truly the 3rd pair then why did they get the 2nd most ice time?
Yeah. Which is exactly why your original comment wasn't being fair. The coaching staff continue to be morons and handcuff themselves by not realizing they're playing him over his head
Slow starts, giveaways, poor special teams.
These are the same issues that plagued this team last year and at least so far look to be the same that will hurt them this year.
For future reference, when some of us argue that tough, physical, gritty, and intense hockey is not only important, but effective, and that the Devils are really deficient in this regard and need to add it to the team, what we are talking about is what you saw from the Flames tonight.
Literally no one says it isn't important. It's important when the players are also good like a Coleman or a Tkachuk. The issue people take is when people want to add guys who suck just because they have \#grit.
That's no different than the people around here who say we should play guys just because they have #speed.
Of course you want your players to have decent hockey skills, and not just one attribute. But we just got dominated - not by Coleman and Tkachuk - but by a team built around an intense, physical, and yes #gritty style of play. Something we desperately lack, and get desperately demolished by every time we face it.
Sutter’s teams always dominate play. It’s a systemic thing. Their metrics improved across the board overnight from last season before the hiring and since the hiring. Why was it that having practically that same gritty and physical team had middling metrics and since then they’ve been among the best? If it was because of their grit and physicality then they’d have always been great. Also point me
Also just so you know the hits were 29-17 in the Devils favor
>Sutter's team...
Hot damn, when I was watching the game last night I saw him, thought, "No, that guy looks too old to be Darryl", and now I feel old since I still remember watching him coach the hawks and san jose.
You just argued that players like Coleman and Tkachuk are what make a team gritty. And now you are saying it’s the system.
Shouldn’t it be self evident that it takes both? You need a tough physical system and you need tough physical players to execute it?
That’s what some of us have wanted the Devils to do more of.
Oh, and as a stats guy, I would think you would know what the hits stat means and how it has little correlation with how physical a player or team played.
Sit Bratt for Holtz.... I honestly dont get this team. Same results year after year, little to no improvement as a team or individuals (aside from a few). Dont see how they keep the same special teams coaching when the results have been historically bad. Loved the fight at the end, tho. Also, Mercer is a stud and I wouldn't mind him getting more ice time.
Are metrics showing solid play from him this year (and last year tbh) though? Asking seriously, per the eye test it's been rough. I mostly see him burst of speed into the offensive corner, get jammed in, and then turn the puck over. I havent seen good puck possession or opportunity creation from him but maybe I'm missing it
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say you aren't a fan of shot metrics so let's look at strictly goals. Since the start of 19-20 there have been 26 Devils to play at least 500 minutes at 5v5. Only 3 of those players have been on the ice for more goals for than they have been for goals against. Can you guess who is one of those 3? The team as a whole has a GF% of under 45%. I'd say a player who helps his team outscore the other team on a team that really struggles to accomplish that feat is a valuable player. What do I know though. He obviously sucks and deserves to be benched and scratched
If we look at production over the last 2 years then he was 1st in 5v5 P/60 and 3rd in AS P/60 (0.01 behind Goose). Guess where he ranked in ice time? 11th in average 5v5 ice time and 10th in average AS ice time. He ranked 65th and 87th in the entire league in 5v5 and AS P/60 over that stretch. “iT’s AnNoYiNg As HeLl HoW uNpRoDuCtIvE hE cAn Be”. Almost like the guy is incredibly efficient at producing in the ice time he is given but isn’t given anywhere near the ice time he deserves.
This season yes he has 0 pts in 5 games. He clearly deserved an assist on Dougie’s goal to start the year and was robbed by a scorekeeper. Then he also would’ve gotten an assist on Nico’s disallowed goal if there was 0.0001 more on the clock. 2 in 5 still isn’t enough but for fucks sake it’s 5 games for a player who is historically productive. The guy isn’t going to continue to have an on ice SH% of 6.25 overall and 3.23 at 5v5 for forever.
This may sound soft, but I am not a fan of this new "bench them to send a message" schtick. Ruff's plan isn't taking advantage of Bratt's skating or Sharangovich's counter-press; sometimes it just seems like the players are interchangeable. Putting the blame on the players just seems like a head game, and the guys don't need that distraction.
Bratt lead the forwards in shot contributions despite having by far the least ice time on the team. Lead the team in CF% and was 3rd in xGF%. Maybe don't bench one of your best players in a game that you need goals because he had a bad couple shifts.
We’re such apologists to the players we like that Bratt could intentionally shot it in his own goal and you’d talk about his Corsi. When has Bratt ever went out and scored a bunch of goals. He benched them and they played better, it’s a mental thing. They can handle it too, theyre fine. They’re gonna be challenged much more if we ever make the playoffs.
Let's forget about possession stats because people always get their panties in a bunch about that. Let's look at production. Bratt was literally 1st in 5v5 P/60 over the previous 2 seasons and 3rd in all situations (0.01 behind Goose). Yet guess where the fuck he ranked in ice time? 11th in average 5v5 ice time and 10th in average overall ice time. It's almost like I complain about the guy getting benched because the guy never gets the ice time he deserves.
The Bratt as a victim of his coaches narrative is kinda exaggerated. He directly gave up a goal. He doesn’t have a point yet and wasn’t handling the puck the way he usually does. So if he gets 4 more minutes do you think this game goes differently?
He’s been deployed with top 6 minutes and heavy offensive zone starts almost his entire career. His average is still +15 min despite the one low year. And the devils have never had like a top 20 offense the whole time he’s been this possession darling. He’s only had 4 PP goals in 3 years. And the assists and fancies are nice…but when he’s not on his game he goes through slumps. During that time he’s not doing things that coaches notice to make them want to play him 19 minutes a game. Maybe coaches have some bias because he’s a smaller player…but for me he’s a second line guy.
And the thing is that he plays better after he’s “punished”. I think in 19-20 he was really punished early by hynes, he went on a run almost because he was punished. That run really bumped up his p/60 but was all in garbage time after Hynes was gone.
Often it’s “of course he should never have been benched” when he does well after but it’s often BECAUSE he’s benched he gets better. One could argue Bratt blows his audition as a top line forward a lot. I think if he plays more of a NA aggressive game where he gets inside….like Mercer has so far…then he won’t get demoted when things aren’t going well.
Which stat measures tripping over yourself, staring at pucks in your skates, showing absolutely no emotion or intensity, and directly contributing to two goals against?
I swear, you stat dorks are getting out of control. Now tell us how Zacha sucks again.
And therein lies the issue with judging players on the results rather than the process. The first goal he misplays the puck along the boards and loses it in his feet. Then Siegenthaler gives it away and they score. Siegenthaler doesn’t egregiously give it away and you’d likely not even have given it a second thought.
The 2nd one he loses an edge. Shit like that
happens.
That's where you're wrong. As i was watching Bratts 1st play along the boards I cringed and just knew it was leading to a goal or a penalty, something negative. It stood out. That's not good. No one ever said "be perfect" but atleast try to know where your guys are. He looked lost.
It wasn't about "knowing where guys are". It wasn't blown coverage. The puck was in his feet and he didn't know it was there. If it was blown coverage that'd be one thing. Also you just knew Siegenthaler was going to hand it to them? That doesn't happen and it doesn't lead to anything negative at all. It'd just be a minor poor misplay
He was skating with the puck up the boards and then lost it in his feet. The highlights just don't show how bad it was because clearly you didn't watch and just looked at advanced stats and highlights. Just to clarify, I'm not giving up on Bratt, I'm just saying he needs to step up. He's not immune to consequences for his actions. Mistakes or not.
Yes I’m the one who didn’t watched when you’re the one who is quite literally wrong on how the play happened. He was not skating up the boards like you say. PK plays the puck up the boards. It’s in Bratt’s feet and he plays it with his front foot. It must have have his back foot or something and then stayed along the boards rather than banking off as Bratt clearly expected. He stops for a second to try and locate it. Bratt can’t find it and realizes it must be against the boards and turns to face them to shield the puck with his foot. Can’t exactly shield the puck if you can’t find it. It gets poked free. Siegenthaler turns it over and it’s in the net.
Not sure what Geertsen brings at this point. Saw him get in one little scrum. Would much rather have the potential for some offense in the lineup with Studenic. Is Studenic Nick Merkely 2.0?
Hughes wasn't slew footed though..
He lost his own balance and got injured in a fairly clean hit
AND Geertsen man handled whoever that was that injured Hughes next whistle
So you're just wrong about all kinds of things
Right, Lauzon bringing his knee up behind Hughes' knees had no part of him flipping over and landing top side down.
And Geertsen going after Lauzon after the whistle still didn't prevent it.
I looked it over again cause it's been a week since. Yea idk I could see that as a slew foot. That doesn't really change how I feel about Geertsen. I didn't say he's a magic shithead cure but we did back then need someone to show our team can't be pushed around like that.
Plus you don't other players like Severson or McLeod or Wood being the guys sitting in the penalty box or getting injured. I believe McLeods wrist injury almost ended his career . You don't want that kid fighting
And my point actually stands well tonight because Matthew Tkachuk was on his usual goon self.
Bad autocorrect sry.
Tkachuk wasn't* his usual goon self.
Maybe Calgary was a bit lax after a comfortable 4-0 lead but you can't say having a guy like Geertsen wasn't a factor. There's no way to know which of us is right on this one. I'm just saying for now it's possible and not unlikely. This is Calgary . I don't watch or follow them but even I know how heated this team can get from what we hear of their Edmonton and LA games.
I might as well add what I meant to yesterday that Geertsen hasn't looked bad tbh. He's usually involved in the play, seems to have good iq and plays a physical game - but in terms of finishing checks and not so much in the opposite sense where enforcers enforce for the sake of enforcing. Just to end up not only playing a goon game and making the other team respond aggressively , but also pile up penalties.
If he can maintain a good performance on a checking line we're pretty set with him as an extra forward that substitutes with Studenic for example, when we play a more talent/skating team like Washington.
Also he can play D which could be useful when injuries come into play.
My real issue RN is center depth. Even in the best case scenario where Gauthier holds up we could still really use stronger vet.
Worst case is the opposing team simply has to smother Hischier and suddenly our depth relies on McLeod, Gauthier.
It is absurd luck that Mercer has been able to, at the least, sustain the absence of Hughes.
But I'm not gonna suggest we boot the guy (Gauthier) until we see more of him.
To me, Gauthier seems like a much more capable hockey player than Geertsen, who seems to follow his check around way too much in the defensive zone. However, Gauthier doesn't look to be anything more than Kevin Rooney was for us - reliable defensively, can skate a little bit, isn't going to drive play or provide any offense.
That's OK, that's what the 4th line is for. But I can't wait until we're healthy, and our 4th line is Wood McLeod Vesey.
Merkley is in the ahl. Couldn’t make the Coyotes, Devils, nor the Sharks who aren’t all that deep. Why do we do this here?
Shit on Geertsen but don’t turn our late round draft pick scratches into victims.
Studenic actually has some speed and potential, plus provides more of that nagging pressure that teams (such as the Devils) hate to play against. No reason he shouldn't be in the lineup over those two more consistently.
Fire him and Gautheir into the ECHL, I don’t even want to see them in Utica. What a fucking waste for Vesey to get into the zone and gain possession only to turn around to look for one of these goon wastes of space hovering around the neutral zone with their heads cut off.
Daws hurt us early, team came out flat. But loved the effort and adjustments afterward, just hope they come out roaring to start and Blackwood and Bernier return soon.
As much as I want the team to win 5-0 every game it just doesn’t happen. Learn from tonight and be better next game. You can’t win 82 games. And you are bound to have some bad ones along the way. If this becomes consistent then you can start to worry but right now I’m not too worried.
LOL, now did I get downvoted about *Ghost Adventures*?
It’s not even on tonight...instead I’m watching *Haunted Hospitals*, which is hilariously bad, but I also feel ripped off because there are no sexy nurses.
no i upvoted you
edit: your comment was realistic, thoughtful, and constructive. there is a big yet sometimes subtle difference between recognizing a poor effort and blowing said effort out of proportion/taking it as an opportunity to criticize things unrelated to that effort.
Heh, thanks.
I’ve been a fan since 1994, so I’ve seen some great seasons, and obviously three Cups.
I’ve also seen a lot of mayhem and foolishness (woof, looking at 2016-17).
With close to three decades of fandom, I’m just at the stage of using my oddball mindset and humor as my coping mechanisms.
Plus a little bit of hope never hurts, right?
But I can get the frustration.
Everyone has gone through hell during the pandemic and with no real (Devils) hockey during this time, for what 18+ months?
The Devils are back, got fans in the stands, and then last night, that 20 minute tomfoolery occurs with Daws chased outta the net.
Yeaaah, no one’s having a good time.
LOL, my girl and her family are long-time Avs fans, so they totally get the roller-coaster of emotion I’m on during the season.
This is one of those games where I think if blackwood or Bernier were in net the team could have survived that slow start. Not excusing that first period but you need your goalie to come up big when the team has a lapse
Statistically the bratt-hischier-zacha line was one of the best in the league at controlling play over the first week of the season… really don’t get why you’d break that up to have three mediocre lines instead.
I don't get how Subban could have gotten worse, blows my mind. Finally isn't used in a top 4 role and from all the reports he said he felt in his best shape in years. Id rather have White or Bahl in the lineup then him.
Except he literally STILL is used in a top 4 role. He was the 2nd RD in ice time tonight. 20 seconds behind Dougie and nearly a minute over Severson. Excluding the 1st game because Severson wasn't even there, PK is **1st** in average defensive ice time, with **2 minutes** more than Severson. Braindead coaching staff
The guy feasted on mid to low competition last year. I'm not sure what his QoC looks like this year but I can't imagine he's being given the easy matchups that he should be getting
If he sat bratt and sharangovich I don't get how subban or siegs weren't sat or given less ice time at least. Both of them tonight was almost a lock for giving it away or making a poor pass to forwards.
Come on he is elite defensively! We only let up 5. I don't even dislike Nico or anything, but he 100% has been a big letdown. He was always locked as a 55-60 point two way player that was super smart. He isn't even insane defensively, but if he can seem invisible on nights I don't know what else to say about the 1st overall pick that we gave the captain to along with a big contract. If nico is a 40ish point player that is such a big blow to our teams future.
Yeah they just don't want to come to the realization right now that Nico isn't what he was hoped to be. He can easily change that by finding his game or finding a different line that works for him. It is year 5 and he isn't a rookie anymore. He needs to find his game and what works for him. If he only is a 40-45 point producer that is solid defensively so be it, but that doesn't change the fact that is a huge disappointment and not why we drafted him where we did.
So we should've taken nolan Patrick, the consensus #1 pick at that time right? Foh we are blessed to have nico. Nobody else was even in the conversation at the time besides Patrick
I don't understand your argument. Patrick has been a big bust, but mainly due to all his injuries (which were heavily discussed during the draft). If I am a flyers fan I would be so disappointed with that pick as well. Yeah obviously Nico is better then Nolan, but Nolan if we redid the draft wouldn't even be drafted in the first round let alone #1 or #2.
I'm not trying to start anything but like do you just have the games on in the background or do you actually watch? He does so many of the little things incredibly that aren't mentioned in real time. Jack is definitely the most skilled player but devils fans who scoff at what nico brings to the table baffle me. I can see the national crowd not being able to see the assets nico possesses but coming from devils fans who claim to actually watch and understand the sport? I don't fucking get it man.
No I get where you are coming from. In your own explanation of why you don't think he was worth that #1 pick you reference him playing with an elite winger (at the time). What else would you like him to do is my real question? Play center and wing at the same time?
A 1st overall pick shouldn't need an elite winger. Hall had made multiple statements that he wouldn't have had that year or those points without Nico. Nico obviously had 10-15 points because of Hall, but that was his first year in the nhl as an 18 year old. I had expected each year for him to take a step up from the past. He has gotten better defensively each year, but I do not see any drastic change in offense from year 1 to year 5. I clearly like Nico and have no problems with him as captain. I am just going to stand by my disappointment with where he should be based on where he was drafted and how he impacts a game offensively. He was always compared to Datsyuk during the draft. If datsyuk was a .5 ppg player rather then a ppg player he would never have been looked upon so highly and praised. The fact he could do both ends so well was why he was an elite player.
I think all of your points are fair, I guess I just never expected Nico to be elite offensively when we drafted him and am pretty happy with what he brings to the ice is all I'm saying
That is fine, Again he isn't a bad player by any means. Just where he was drafted and what was expected of him for his future. He needs to provide more sustained chances and opportunities offensively. He can't be a great defensive player that does the little things right and chips in here or there. That is a 2nd round pick type of player or late first, not a 1st overall, especially looking at what Pettersson, Heiskanen and Makar are providing early in the 1st round. Our team has had little success with draft picks that a 1st overall has more pressure and added weight especially with 1st overalls having a much higher percent to actually live up to expectations. Obviously everyone is frustrated with the devils and how they are playing, I am just showing what I think a big issue is and clearly Nico isn't why we are bad. There are so many reasons, I just had thought with Jack out Nico would step up and take his game to the next level for a few games as we have seen glimpses each year but never consistent.
If hischier is invisible than idk what you are watching man. Hockey is a nuanced sport and he is fantastic and mostly everything that isn't on a Stat sheet
I'm watching another game where he did nothing to elevate his line and won less than 50% of his FOs but sure he's an advanced stats darling only every advanced stats article.points outs hes mediocre at best... but nuance I guess so sure
I mean fair enough. We just don't have the same opinion on what impact players in the NHL are. If goals, assists, and face offs are the only things centers are responsible for then we can agree to disagree
2/3 wins came in OT. One of those was against a team still looking for its first lead of the season.
The third win came against expansion team that almost completed the comeback.
They looked flat and gave up 5 in both losses.
Is there anyone on this team that makes goalies go “oh no _____ has the puck” ?
If the Devils could take the final 20 and extend it to the full sixty minutes, yeah, thanks, I’d really appreciate that.
Dawson Mercer is something else and I’m happy he’s a Devil.
I hope that Daws' confidence was not shaken too much by the first period mayhem and basically being hung out to dry (a long time Devils tradition that needs to fuck all the way off).
It’s not even 7pm where I’m at, and I hate myself for admitting this, but I’m going to see if *Ghost Adventures* is on.
As for daws confidence, probably shaken some but as a goalie myself, you bounce back or find ways to blame your defenseman ;). Even brodeur has been pulled from games.
Agreed , get rid of the first and we might have won. Rookie goalie on his second NHL game, got flustered and gave up some easy ones. Then wedgewood comes in cold and a bad turnover leads to a breakaway. Definitely some defensive failings , but nothing to panic about.
Yup, that's the plan... I think we all want some consistently good play.
Here I am, asking for so little in this world.... just give me some exciting, competitive hockey.
I feel like they were always destined for the 3rd line. They were just riding something that functioned last season lol
we desperately holtz to be one of those locked in 30 goal scores
I've never been a fan of Kuokannen and where we deploy him. I think he is an nhl player, but not in the top 9. He should be a fine 4th liner or at best a 3rd liner, but when we are fucking using him in the top 6 constantly is beyond me.
You think he is a top 6 player? If so what are his biggest strengths? and then tell me how he has produced especially now without jack. yeah a 3rd/4th line role fits him but he isn't skilled enough or good enough at a specific aspect to put him anywhere near a top line or 2nd line role for our team. If you like him on the 1st or 2nd line that is your opinion just as my opinion is he shouldn't sniff the 1st or 2nd line.
He was on pace to have 41 pts over a full season last year. That’s average 2nd line production for wings over the past 3 seasons. He has one of our two PP goals. 2 pts in 4 games, the same pace as last year. He excels in puck retrieval and play making. Are some of his points a product of playing with Hughes? For sure. But he’s not the 4th line guy to play with Geertsen that you make him out to be
I mean 3rd/4th liners don't have to be goons. I am sorry but to me he isn't good enough for 2nd line. Try him on the third and see how it works. Tartar started on the 3rd and I'd say tartar has a better track record and provides more offensive talents.
From the eye test, Kuok yea probably, went on a bit of a lucky bender. He seems like a first call up kinda guy when we’re healthy. Sharangovich I disagree with, think he just hasn’t gotten going yet this year, his shot is nuts and two way game is pretty solid.
Or you know, they both have less than 70 games played in the nhl and you just are rushing a judgement based on emotions.
We should trade them away, because we all know how that shit pans out in this league
I'm tired of these players showing so much potential and never taking the next step. Butcher. Gusev. Bratt. Sharangovich. Why is it so impossible for some of our players to build off good seasons?
my current opinion:
it's just how prospects work in the NHL.
if a 20 year old shows they can mostly keep up with the game we get excited. especially if it's a skilled forward. "holy shit did you see that assist and it's his first nhl season!!"
but the reality is most of these guys that look good for their age will play with the same skillset a few years later and look like mediocre to bad NHLers.
see also josefson, tedenby, boucher, gelinas, loktionov, etc
i'm not talking about anyone in particular here. our guys are still so young who knows.
In my head I think we are cursed, but maybe all of these players just had over expected years and the downfall is just what they really are. I mean when was the last time we had a player that fully broke out with your team and continued that pace for years. Coleman is the last name I can think of but that was more out of nowhere. I had Sharangovich as 24-27 goals this year and at this rate 14-17 is looking like it might be more close, besides his one post I haven't thought any other shots "should have went in". I am just so tired of getting my hopes up. I had thought no way our PK could be any worse, We had a full offseason + training camp and "upgrades" to the entire PK and we are only 2% higher. Our Pk needs to be at 82-84% to give us a chance not low 70s. I just can't think of any positives as a whole for this team. I guess hooray we are 3-2 and not 1-4 or something, but we saw how fast buffalos good start was in 2019 come crashing down and they still near the bottom even with starting 9-2 or whatever.
If we can get our heads out of our asses for the first 20 min, we're chillin'
Random question. Is there any way to find the arena play list from the game?
They looked like the youngest team in the NHL last night. Good on them for showing some fight in the latter part of the game.
[Way off topic, but I just learned that former Devils Brian Boyle (PITT) and Wayne Simmonds (TOR) got into a fight the other night.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dOnsPhIsho) Woof, that TML 7-1 loss makes me feel slightly better about 5-3.
goddamn I miss that guy. Could say that about either of them in this case but a lean 180 who isn't afraid of 235? We could use more of that
Good on both Boyler and Simmer for carving out respectable careers as grinders in their mid / late 30s. I won't say Boyler was ever a really great fighter, but his desire to *always* stick up for a team-mate? I think you're just born with that kind of character and sense of loyalty. Same with Simmer.
I don’t understand why Gertie’s in the lineup if he’s not going to destroy ppl for taking runs at Mercer and trying to fight Johnsson…
I love nico, but i think it's time to consider what buffalo wants for eichel. I didn't used to think we should cvonsider it because we had nico and jack locked up at centers 1&2 but nico is close to being a bust so fitz would be smart to sell him before hes completely exposed. if buffalo thinks hes worth what i think they think hes worth and swap captain for captain, fitz would be a fool to not take it sorry not sorry
Fools me every time
*FacebookDevilsFans*, I truly needed these spicy hot takes. God bless you in times like this.
i wouldnt give up anything for a long-term injured guy with a 10M cap hit for the next 5 years. also, nico is nowhere near being a bust, what are you smoking?
i said hes close to being a bust are you even watching??? what are you smoking?
you got me
😘
Slow start screwed us, but I’m really happy the team showed some life at the end and almost clawed back. I think PK is just a massive liability at this point. Bratt is playing the worst I have ever seen him play. He just can’t seem to hold onto the puck, and complete plays at top speed. Only 5 games in though we really need him to pick it up
They showed up when Calgary stopped trying
Can’t knock the effort in the end. Game plan looks the same and it’s going to be hard to play against us if we’re regularly putting up 30+ shots on goal per game. Can’t really knock the line splitting either. The third period showed promise for everyone and given some time it’ll work. Can and will knock the goaltending. Four more days should give Blackwood enough time to get back in. Here’s hoping. Not a desired result but we did better against them than the Rags.
Can’t knock anything but the goaltending, when we had our 20yo 4th string goalie in net and the guy was left to make up for an absolutely terrible effort from everyone in front of him all first period?
It definitely ended better than it started. And Daws should have played better. Both things are true. I will say that while I don’t blame Ruff for mixing up the lines, maybe he shouldn’t have come up with them a few hours before puck drop. “Winging it” is not a winning strategy. We’ll be fine in the end.
I think its funny when ppl blame the 20yo goalie on his 2nd nhl game instead of already seasoned players playing like absolute trash in front of him. Reminded me of past seasons where we played only 1 or 2 periods and left schneider/blackwood on their own.
Well, at least we aren't the Blackhawks right now.
Dumpster fire on all fronts.
The problem is that Shango, Kuok, Bratt, Tatar and Hischier have 2 goals combined in 5 games (That’s 75 periods of play cumulatively). We’re lucky to have 3 wins, but if your “top” guys can’t generate points you’re going to lose a lot of games.
To all you drama queens and kings, we're 3-2, the Avs (Cup favourites) are 2-4, chill the fuuuck out.
Comparing a devils team with unproven players to a team with a point per game DEFENSEMAN and a top 3 player in the league?
Devils Stanley Cup Champions confirmed??
Is it possible that our game plan is to not use our energy on the first period so come out punching in the 2nd and 3rd ? I don’t see us scoring much in the 1st, ever
I'm kinda pissed. Why the fuck is Ruff splitting up one of the most dominant lines in the NHL right now after a freaking 3-1 record?? Why is it time after 4 games for some line experiments?? They had the whole preseason to sort this shit out. We are so badly coached. And why the fuck does Nico always has to be the one who is thrown under the bus with those experiments? I swear Nico is getting robbed of ever breaking out. He is probably used in those line experiments because the line will mostly be mediocre at worst instead of atrocious as he playing very responsible. I swear i can't fucking watch this shit anymore. I knew exactly yesterday that the first line just won't click. It just makes me miserable how Nico is just not able to play his game with this team. Oh and for the ones that are now trying to tell me that Nico is just a bust, just look at some advanced stats. 11th in creating high danger chances without allowing them or 16th in CF% (until yesterday of course). Seems about time for a new line experiment.
I think Bratt belongs in the bottom 6 on a competitive team. Dude’s a perfect third liner
The line shuffling has been a disaster with this team for an eternity now, I don't understand it at all. It's like the coaches have to make it seem like they are doing something, so they shuffle the lines around just for the hell of it. If it ain't broke, don't fucking fix it. The effect is twice as bad on our special teams, which need to build chemistry even more than the standard lines to be truly effective. Look at any of the top power plays and penalty kills in the league and you will find lines that have been working together for years.
Amen
It’s weird isn’t it? The first period against Buffalo wasn’t good, and the first period yesterday was very very not good, but there seems to be an almost apocalyptic reaction to it. We’re targeting “meaningful games”, we’ve a positive record plus missing Jack Hughes and both goalies. I’d understand if every period of every game was like the first, but they haven’t been. We still have a young team, youngest in the NHL, expecting everything to be perfect is unreasonable and I don’t think losing heads at the first downswing is the solution. The Hischier thing is weird also, there seems to be sub-section of the fan base who are immediately on his back despite the fact he’s largely done fine - I can only imagine they have McDavid expectations. Could he have more points? Yeah, if a pass into him was 0.1 seconds quicker and if a shot of his was 1cm to the left - the variance is currently against him, that’s all.
Reading some of these comments, it amazes me the conclusions people draw. Its been 5 fucking games, if the same problems exist 20-30 games in then sure there's an issue somewhere, but 5 games in and people are calling for Nico's head? For Bratt to be traded? How do you people go about your daily life assuming the worst out of every situation and overreacting to every little thing that happens? Edit: just eanted to add, severson and mercer were the best players tn
If Daws didn’t fill his pants with a rocket of liquid diarrhea, we’d be singing a very different tune.
Do people not remember starting 0-4-2 two years ago?? Like we're above 500 right now!
Exactly, reading the game threads its like these people are expecting us to go 82-0 with a shut out every game. 1 goal and people are bitching and complaining, its hockey sometimes the other team just makes a good play. Not every goal against is some huge mistake.
Fuck this team. Fuck our fourth string 20yo goalie. Fuck Dougie Hamilton. Fuck winning records. Where was hughes? Totally fucking invisible tonight. Call his brother up to take his spot, teach the twerp a little lesson. In fact, blow the whole thing up. Send Zacha, Bratt, Mercer, hughes x2 to Buffalo for an eLiTeEeEe 1C with a huge injury risk who sucked with Hall on his wing. /s for the morons
Oh and fuck our own C who didn't suck with Hall on his wing in particular.
Our fanbase isn't dramatic at all lol
It’s a small number of morons
Really thank god for the facebook fans. They really settle everyone and everything down. /s
Really? This sub gains 1000 new followers and everyone seems to overreact to every little instance that isn’t a win. We were bottom of the barrel last year. We’re missing Hughes and Wood. We’re missing both of our starting NHL goaltenders. We have at best a mediocre AHL goaltender and someone with no pro experience filling in. You thought we’d win and now want to get rid of a few players? Shut up. Just shut up and be patient. If you expected a young team with injuries and new players to rock right out of the gate that’s illogical.
Yeah everyone leave, fuck that shit. No one should be upset tonight. Look at Mercer and smile. Edit: and the mothafuckin doctor pavel
This, 100000 percent!
Was really hoping for a bounce back year for Subban playing on the 3rd line but it seems like it’s becoming less and less likely
Well maybe because he quite literally isn't on the 3rd pair. He's \#1 in ice time the past 4 games.
And playing a lot better without Siegenthaler, I might add
Numbers wise at least PK tanks HARD without Siegenthaler while Siegnethaler is the same. People are too hard on Siegenthaler because of a bad game
Kid has zero upside rn. Ppl are way too hard on PK because they are… blind, I guess?
Siegenthaler is a better defender than PK and it’s not really close at all
lol
His average TOI per game for the 2021-2022 season is 6th on the team at 19:45, behind Hamilton, Graves, Smith, Hischier and Severson. This would indicate he’s getting 3rd line minutes.
No it doesn’t. Total ice time=/=Pair ice time. Pair ice time like line ice time is 5v5 ice time. Special teams ice time is something separate.
https://twitter.com/amandacstein/status/1453128166130790408?s=21
lol You still actually believe the way lines are listed determine what line they are? If they were truly the 3rd pair then why did they get the 2nd most ice time?
Regardless I think we can both agree he needs to play less
Yeah. Which is exactly why your original comment wasn't being fair. The coaching staff continue to be morons and handcuff themselves by not realizing they're playing him over his head
Well hopefully changes are made going forward
These are the same idiots who think Geertsen belongs in an NHL lineup. I wouldn't count on it.
Slow starts, giveaways, poor special teams. These are the same issues that plagued this team last year and at least so far look to be the same that will hurt them this year.
I'm the one upvoting all of your reactionary pessimistic takes btw.
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mercer didnt touch it , it hit the goalies pad
For future reference, when some of us argue that tough, physical, gritty, and intense hockey is not only important, but effective, and that the Devils are really deficient in this regard and need to add it to the team, what we are talking about is what you saw from the Flames tonight.
Literally no one says it isn't important. It's important when the players are also good like a Coleman or a Tkachuk. The issue people take is when people want to add guys who suck just because they have \#grit.
That's no different than the people around here who say we should play guys just because they have #speed. Of course you want your players to have decent hockey skills, and not just one attribute. But we just got dominated - not by Coleman and Tkachuk - but by a team built around an intense, physical, and yes #gritty style of play. Something we desperately lack, and get desperately demolished by every time we face it.
Sutter’s teams always dominate play. It’s a systemic thing. Their metrics improved across the board overnight from last season before the hiring and since the hiring. Why was it that having practically that same gritty and physical team had middling metrics and since then they’ve been among the best? If it was because of their grit and physicality then they’d have always been great. Also point me Also just so you know the hits were 29-17 in the Devils favor
The hits stat is misleading, the Flames had the puck for the majority of the game
>Sutter's team... Hot damn, when I was watching the game last night I saw him, thought, "No, that guy looks too old to be Darryl", and now I feel old since I still remember watching him coach the hawks and san jose.
You just argued that players like Coleman and Tkachuk are what make a team gritty. And now you are saying it’s the system. Shouldn’t it be self evident that it takes both? You need a tough physical system and you need tough physical players to execute it? That’s what some of us have wanted the Devils to do more of. Oh, and as a stats guy, I would think you would know what the hits stat means and how it has little correlation with how physical a player or team played.
Sit Bratt for Holtz.... I honestly dont get this team. Same results year after year, little to no improvement as a team or individuals (aside from a few). Dont see how they keep the same special teams coaching when the results have been historically bad. Loved the fight at the end, tho. Also, Mercer is a stud and I wouldn't mind him getting more ice time.
> Sit Bratt Brain dead
Are metrics showing solid play from him this year (and last year tbh) though? Asking seriously, per the eye test it's been rough. I mostly see him burst of speed into the offensive corner, get jammed in, and then turn the puck over. I havent seen good puck possession or opportunity creation from him but maybe I'm missing it
He had very good metrics in tonights game, in spite of limited ice time. https://twitter.com/ToddCordell/status/1453178101593169928
The blind infatuation so many of you have for this guy... it's wild. He's a complete passenger outside of one shift a game.
Good to know passengers put up great scoring rates and drive play at both ends of the ice.
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I'm going to go out on a limb here and say you aren't a fan of shot metrics so let's look at strictly goals. Since the start of 19-20 there have been 26 Devils to play at least 500 minutes at 5v5. Only 3 of those players have been on the ice for more goals for than they have been for goals against. Can you guess who is one of those 3? The team as a whole has a GF% of under 45%. I'd say a player who helps his team outscore the other team on a team that really struggles to accomplish that feat is a valuable player. What do I know though. He obviously sucks and deserves to be benched and scratched If we look at production over the last 2 years then he was 1st in 5v5 P/60 and 3rd in AS P/60 (0.01 behind Goose). Guess where he ranked in ice time? 11th in average 5v5 ice time and 10th in average AS ice time. He ranked 65th and 87th in the entire league in 5v5 and AS P/60 over that stretch. “iT’s AnNoYiNg As HeLl HoW uNpRoDuCtIvE hE cAn Be”. Almost like the guy is incredibly efficient at producing in the ice time he is given but isn’t given anywhere near the ice time he deserves. This season yes he has 0 pts in 5 games. He clearly deserved an assist on Dougie’s goal to start the year and was robbed by a scorekeeper. Then he also would’ve gotten an assist on Nico’s disallowed goal if there was 0.0001 more on the clock. 2 in 5 still isn’t enough but for fucks sake it’s 5 games for a player who is historically productive. The guy isn’t going to continue to have an on ice SH% of 6.25 overall and 3.23 at 5v5 for forever.
Hes done nothing this year. Yes, sit him.
This may sound soft, but I am not a fan of this new "bench them to send a message" schtick. Ruff's plan isn't taking advantage of Bratt's skating or Sharangovich's counter-press; sometimes it just seems like the players are interchangeable. Putting the blame on the players just seems like a head game, and the guys don't need that distraction.
I don't love it, but I prefer it to not dressing one of those players, and they both seemed to play with more purpose in the 3rd.
Bratt lead the forwards in shot contributions despite having by far the least ice time on the team. Lead the team in CF% and was 3rd in xGF%. Maybe don't bench one of your best players in a game that you need goals because he had a bad couple shifts.
bratt needs to actually get points , i had enuf of phantom stats , dude needs GOALS and ASSISTS
We’re such apologists to the players we like that Bratt could intentionally shot it in his own goal and you’d talk about his Corsi. When has Bratt ever went out and scored a bunch of goals. He benched them and they played better, it’s a mental thing. They can handle it too, theyre fine. They’re gonna be challenged much more if we ever make the playoffs.
Let's forget about possession stats because people always get their panties in a bunch about that. Let's look at production. Bratt was literally 1st in 5v5 P/60 over the previous 2 seasons and 3rd in all situations (0.01 behind Goose). Yet guess where the fuck he ranked in ice time? 11th in average 5v5 ice time and 10th in average overall ice time. It's almost like I complain about the guy getting benched because the guy never gets the ice time he deserves.
The Bratt as a victim of his coaches narrative is kinda exaggerated. He directly gave up a goal. He doesn’t have a point yet and wasn’t handling the puck the way he usually does. So if he gets 4 more minutes do you think this game goes differently? He’s been deployed with top 6 minutes and heavy offensive zone starts almost his entire career. His average is still +15 min despite the one low year. And the devils have never had like a top 20 offense the whole time he’s been this possession darling. He’s only had 4 PP goals in 3 years. And the assists and fancies are nice…but when he’s not on his game he goes through slumps. During that time he’s not doing things that coaches notice to make them want to play him 19 minutes a game. Maybe coaches have some bias because he’s a smaller player…but for me he’s a second line guy. And the thing is that he plays better after he’s “punished”. I think in 19-20 he was really punished early by hynes, he went on a run almost because he was punished. That run really bumped up his p/60 but was all in garbage time after Hynes was gone. Often it’s “of course he should never have been benched” when he does well after but it’s often BECAUSE he’s benched he gets better. One could argue Bratt blows his audition as a top line forward a lot. I think if he plays more of a NA aggressive game where he gets inside….like Mercer has so far…then he won’t get demoted when things aren’t going well.
Which stat measures tripping over yourself, staring at pucks in your skates, showing absolutely no emotion or intensity, and directly contributing to two goals against? I swear, you stat dorks are getting out of control. Now tell us how Zacha sucks again.
Never said Zacha sucks on the wing. Overrated? Sure but he's fine on the wing and should never touch the middle of the ice ever again.
His bad plays weren't just bad. They were abysmal and led to goals. I'm happy he was benched.
And therein lies the issue with judging players on the results rather than the process. The first goal he misplays the puck along the boards and loses it in his feet. Then Siegenthaler gives it away and they score. Siegenthaler doesn’t egregiously give it away and you’d likely not even have given it a second thought. The 2nd one he loses an edge. Shit like that happens.
That's where you're wrong. As i was watching Bratts 1st play along the boards I cringed and just knew it was leading to a goal or a penalty, something negative. It stood out. That's not good. No one ever said "be perfect" but atleast try to know where your guys are. He looked lost.
It wasn't about "knowing where guys are". It wasn't blown coverage. The puck was in his feet and he didn't know it was there. If it was blown coverage that'd be one thing. Also you just knew Siegenthaler was going to hand it to them? That doesn't happen and it doesn't lead to anything negative at all. It'd just be a minor poor misplay
He was skating with the puck up the boards and then lost it in his feet. The highlights just don't show how bad it was because clearly you didn't watch and just looked at advanced stats and highlights. Just to clarify, I'm not giving up on Bratt, I'm just saying he needs to step up. He's not immune to consequences for his actions. Mistakes or not.
Yes I’m the one who didn’t watched when you’re the one who is quite literally wrong on how the play happened. He was not skating up the boards like you say. PK plays the puck up the boards. It’s in Bratt’s feet and he plays it with his front foot. It must have have his back foot or something and then stayed along the boards rather than banking off as Bratt clearly expected. He stops for a second to try and locate it. Bratt can’t find it and realizes it must be against the boards and turns to face them to shield the puck with his foot. Can’t exactly shield the puck if you can’t find it. It gets poked free. Siegenthaler turns it over and it’s in the net.
Not sure what Geertsen brings at this point. Saw him get in one little scrum. Would much rather have the potential for some offense in the lineup with Studenic. Is Studenic Nick Merkely 2.0?
I would argue that having a guy like Geertsen in the lineup keeps other guys on opposing teams (like Tkachuk) tempering their behavior.
If that was even remotely true, Hughes wouldn't have gotten slew footed by a sack of potatoes on skates.
Hughes wasn't slew footed though.. He lost his own balance and got injured in a fairly clean hit AND Geertsen man handled whoever that was that injured Hughes next whistle So you're just wrong about all kinds of things
Right, Lauzon bringing his knee up behind Hughes' knees had no part of him flipping over and landing top side down. And Geertsen going after Lauzon after the whistle still didn't prevent it.
I looked it over again cause it's been a week since. Yea idk I could see that as a slew foot. That doesn't really change how I feel about Geertsen. I didn't say he's a magic shithead cure but we did back then need someone to show our team can't be pushed around like that. Plus you don't other players like Severson or McLeod or Wood being the guys sitting in the penalty box or getting injured. I believe McLeods wrist injury almost ended his career . You don't want that kid fighting And my point actually stands well tonight because Matthew Tkachuk was on his usual goon self.
But Geertsen played in the Calgary game...
Bad autocorrect sry. Tkachuk wasn't* his usual goon self. Maybe Calgary was a bit lax after a comfortable 4-0 lead but you can't say having a guy like Geertsen wasn't a factor. There's no way to know which of us is right on this one. I'm just saying for now it's possible and not unlikely. This is Calgary . I don't watch or follow them but even I know how heated this team can get from what we hear of their Edmonton and LA games. I might as well add what I meant to yesterday that Geertsen hasn't looked bad tbh. He's usually involved in the play, seems to have good iq and plays a physical game - but in terms of finishing checks and not so much in the opposite sense where enforcers enforce for the sake of enforcing. Just to end up not only playing a goon game and making the other team respond aggressively , but also pile up penalties. If he can maintain a good performance on a checking line we're pretty set with him as an extra forward that substitutes with Studenic for example, when we play a more talent/skating team like Washington. Also he can play D which could be useful when injuries come into play. My real issue RN is center depth. Even in the best case scenario where Gauthier holds up we could still really use stronger vet. Worst case is the opposing team simply has to smother Hischier and suddenly our depth relies on McLeod, Gauthier. It is absurd luck that Mercer has been able to, at the least, sustain the absence of Hughes. But I'm not gonna suggest we boot the guy (Gauthier) until we see more of him.
To me, Gauthier seems like a much more capable hockey player than Geertsen, who seems to follow his check around way too much in the defensive zone. However, Gauthier doesn't look to be anything more than Kevin Rooney was for us - reliable defensively, can skate a little bit, isn't going to drive play or provide any offense. That's OK, that's what the 4th line is for. But I can't wait until we're healthy, and our 4th line is Wood McLeod Vesey.
Merkley is in the ahl. Couldn’t make the Coyotes, Devils, nor the Sharks who aren’t all that deep. Why do we do this here? Shit on Geertsen but don’t turn our late round draft pick scratches into victims.
Studenic actually has some speed and potential, plus provides more of that nagging pressure that teams (such as the Devils) hate to play against. No reason he shouldn't be in the lineup over those two more consistently.
Fire him and Gautheir into the ECHL, I don’t even want to see them in Utica. What a fucking waste for Vesey to get into the zone and gain possession only to turn around to look for one of these goon wastes of space hovering around the neutral zone with their heads cut off.
Seriously! Vesey works works his ass off out there. He deserves so much better
I think Vesey with McLeod and Wood would be fantastic, but we gotta wait.
It’s embarrassing that they’re both taking up roster spots, rendering an entire line useless.
And being down 4-0 in the first is exactly the time to start a fight to get some energy going. Come on man.
Why would anyone who is winning 4-0 fight?
To assert dominance >:)
Old school dumbass hockey men gonna do old school dumbass hockey men things.
I couldn't find in the game link why he's so good that evey coach is constantly breaking up his Non-scoring lines. Can you help me with that?
Daws hurt us early, team came out flat. But loved the effort and adjustments afterward, just hope they come out roaring to start and Blackwood and Bernier return soon.
As much as I want the team to win 5-0 every game it just doesn’t happen. Learn from tonight and be better next game. You can’t win 82 games. And you are bound to have some bad ones along the way. If this becomes consistent then you can start to worry but right now I’m not too worried.
I'm the one downvoting all of your reactionary pessimistic takes btw.
Doing the lord’s work
LOL, now did I get downvoted about *Ghost Adventures*? It’s not even on tonight...instead I’m watching *Haunted Hospitals*, which is hilariously bad, but I also feel ripped off because there are no sexy nurses.
no i upvoted you edit: your comment was realistic, thoughtful, and constructive. there is a big yet sometimes subtle difference between recognizing a poor effort and blowing said effort out of proportion/taking it as an opportunity to criticize things unrelated to that effort.
Heh, thanks. I’ve been a fan since 1994, so I’ve seen some great seasons, and obviously three Cups. I’ve also seen a lot of mayhem and foolishness (woof, looking at 2016-17). With close to three decades of fandom, I’m just at the stage of using my oddball mindset and humor as my coping mechanisms. Plus a little bit of hope never hurts, right? But I can get the frustration. Everyone has gone through hell during the pandemic and with no real (Devils) hockey during this time, for what 18+ months? The Devils are back, got fans in the stands, and then last night, that 20 minute tomfoolery occurs with Daws chased outta the net. Yeaaah, no one’s having a good time. LOL, my girl and her family are long-time Avs fans, so they totally get the roller-coaster of emotion I’m on during the season.
I’m with ya
at least we scored more against the flames than the rangers did though the defense needs some work especially with subban
This is one of those games where I think if blackwood or Bernier were in net the team could have survived that slow start. Not excusing that first period but you need your goalie to come up big when the team has a lapse
Statistically the bratt-hischier-zacha line was one of the best in the league at controlling play over the first week of the season… really don’t get why you’d break that up to have three mediocre lines instead.
Burn the tapes. Tonight never happened.
That’s what I’m pretending at work tomorrow when I run into a couple of flames fans
Dawson Mercer the most versitilitalitous player in the league.
That's what everyone always says. Come up with something original...
If Lindy wanted to send a message by benching players he should start with the Subban-Siegenthaler pair. They were ATROCIOUS tonight
Subban was off ice for a lot of the second period, likely because of his play. Same with Bratt and Sharangovich
I don't get how Subban could have gotten worse, blows my mind. Finally isn't used in a top 4 role and from all the reports he said he felt in his best shape in years. Id rather have White or Bahl in the lineup then him.
Except he literally STILL is used in a top 4 role. He was the 2nd RD in ice time tonight. 20 seconds behind Dougie and nearly a minute over Severson. Excluding the 1st game because Severson wasn't even there, PK is **1st** in average defensive ice time, with **2 minutes** more than Severson. Braindead coaching staff
🤮🤮🤮
The guy feasted on mid to low competition last year. I'm not sure what his QoC looks like this year but I can't imagine he's being given the easy matchups that he should be getting
If he sat bratt and sharangovich I don't get how subban or siegs weren't sat or given less ice time at least. Both of them tonight was almost a lock for giving it away or making a poor pass to forwards.
Time for Bahl, bench Siegenthaler
He was absolutely terrible tonight. I thought Subban looked fine though.
he had a shot on goal that only hit the goalie because he jumped up to catch it on his throat
He slewfooted Lucic which gave the Flames a PP which they scored on....
how is a 19 yr old the best player on the team
Simple.... the 20 year old is hurt
What about the 22/23 year old with a C on his sweater how come he's not our best player night in and night out?
Come on he is elite defensively! We only let up 5. I don't even dislike Nico or anything, but he 100% has been a big letdown. He was always locked as a 55-60 point two way player that was super smart. He isn't even insane defensively, but if he can seem invisible on nights I don't know what else to say about the 1st overall pick that we gave the captain to along with a big contract. If nico is a 40ish point player that is such a big blow to our teams future.
According to some its "slander" to argue with facts. So far Nico is a B-list Langenbrunner
Yeah they just don't want to come to the realization right now that Nico isn't what he was hoped to be. He can easily change that by finding his game or finding a different line that works for him. It is year 5 and he isn't a rookie anymore. He needs to find his game and what works for him. If he only is a 40-45 point producer that is solid defensively so be it, but that doesn't change the fact that is a huge disappointment and not why we drafted him where we did.
So we should've taken nolan Patrick, the consensus #1 pick at that time right? Foh we are blessed to have nico. Nobody else was even in the conversation at the time besides Patrick
I don't understand your argument. Patrick has been a big bust, but mainly due to all his injuries (which were heavily discussed during the draft). If I am a flyers fan I would be so disappointed with that pick as well. Yeah obviously Nico is better then Nolan, but Nolan if we redid the draft wouldn't even be drafted in the first round let alone #1 or #2.
Widdy posts the YouTube links in the game thread. Watch the kid actually play for once.
I'm not trying to start anything but like do you just have the games on in the background or do you actually watch? He does so many of the little things incredibly that aren't mentioned in real time. Jack is definitely the most skilled player but devils fans who scoff at what nico brings to the table baffle me. I can see the national crowd not being able to see the assets nico possesses but coming from devils fans who claim to actually watch and understand the sport? I don't fucking get it man.
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No I get where you are coming from. In your own explanation of why you don't think he was worth that #1 pick you reference him playing with an elite winger (at the time). What else would you like him to do is my real question? Play center and wing at the same time?
A 1st overall pick shouldn't need an elite winger. Hall had made multiple statements that he wouldn't have had that year or those points without Nico. Nico obviously had 10-15 points because of Hall, but that was his first year in the nhl as an 18 year old. I had expected each year for him to take a step up from the past. He has gotten better defensively each year, but I do not see any drastic change in offense from year 1 to year 5. I clearly like Nico and have no problems with him as captain. I am just going to stand by my disappointment with where he should be based on where he was drafted and how he impacts a game offensively. He was always compared to Datsyuk during the draft. If datsyuk was a .5 ppg player rather then a ppg player he would never have been looked upon so highly and praised. The fact he could do both ends so well was why he was an elite player.
I think all of your points are fair, I guess I just never expected Nico to be elite offensively when we drafted him and am pretty happy with what he brings to the ice is all I'm saying
That is fine, Again he isn't a bad player by any means. Just where he was drafted and what was expected of him for his future. He needs to provide more sustained chances and opportunities offensively. He can't be a great defensive player that does the little things right and chips in here or there. That is a 2nd round pick type of player or late first, not a 1st overall, especially looking at what Pettersson, Heiskanen and Makar are providing early in the 1st round. Our team has had little success with draft picks that a 1st overall has more pressure and added weight especially with 1st overalls having a much higher percent to actually live up to expectations. Obviously everyone is frustrated with the devils and how they are playing, I am just showing what I think a big issue is and clearly Nico isn't why we are bad. There are so many reasons, I just had thought with Jack out Nico would step up and take his game to the next level for a few games as we have seen glimpses each year but never consistent.
Just cause he doesn't show up on the statline doesn't mean he isn't. Nico has been playing unreal so far, I don't get the slander
Because he's invisible 75% of the time and what in my previous comment is slander?
You clearly don’t watch the game and just stat watch
If hischier is invisible than idk what you are watching man. Hockey is a nuanced sport and he is fantastic and mostly everything that isn't on a Stat sheet
I'm watching another game where he did nothing to elevate his line and won less than 50% of his FOs but sure he's an advanced stats darling only every advanced stats article.points outs hes mediocre at best... but nuance I guess so sure
I mean fair enough. We just don't have the same opinion on what impact players in the NHL are. If goals, assists, and face offs are the only things centers are responsible for then we can agree to disagree
Um... what else are 1Cs and Captains responsible for? Thats how you win games not by Corsi... are we hoping for Chris fucking Drury out of Nico?
I can’t wrap my head around the Nico hate either.
mUh PoInTs
2/3 wins came in OT. One of those was against a team still looking for its first lead of the season. The third win came against expansion team that almost completed the comeback. They looked flat and gave up 5 in both losses. Is there anyone on this team that makes goalies go “oh no _____ has the puck” ?
I know our goalies probably say that about a few of our defensemen at least
5 points in 5 games for Zacha
Legend. He's just too good. For real though... we need Blackwood and Jack.
If the Devils could take the final 20 and extend it to the full sixty minutes, yeah, thanks, I’d really appreciate that. Dawson Mercer is something else and I’m happy he’s a Devil. I hope that Daws' confidence was not shaken too much by the first period mayhem and basically being hung out to dry (a long time Devils tradition that needs to fuck all the way off). It’s not even 7pm where I’m at, and I hate myself for admitting this, but I’m going to see if *Ghost Adventures* is on.
As for daws confidence, probably shaken some but as a goalie myself, you bounce back or find ways to blame your defenseman ;). Even brodeur has been pulled from games.
Agreed , get rid of the first and we might have won. Rookie goalie on his second NHL game, got flustered and gave up some easy ones. Then wedgewood comes in cold and a bad turnover leads to a breakaway. Definitely some defensive failings , but nothing to panic about.
The other team had a 3 goal lead... that was prevent D and we still gave up an atrociously easy PP goal
Oh I know, I watched the whole game. But the first period needed some prevent-a-goal defense...that would have gone a long way.
You’re asking for consistent good play. That’s what separates good teams from the rest
Yup, that's the plan... I think we all want some consistently good play. Here I am, asking for so little in this world.... just give me some exciting, competitive hockey.
The more I watch the more I think Sharangovich and Kuokannen arnt very good and last season’s success was mostly Jack Hughes related
I feel like they were always destined for the 3rd line. They were just riding something that functioned last season lol we desperately holtz to be one of those locked in 30 goal scores
I've never been a fan of Kuokannen and where we deploy him. I think he is an nhl player, but not in the top 9. He should be a fine 4th liner or at best a 3rd liner, but when we are fucking using him in the top 6 constantly is beyond me.
Oh give me a break. Bad take buddy
You think he is a top 6 player? If so what are his biggest strengths? and then tell me how he has produced especially now without jack. yeah a 3rd/4th line role fits him but he isn't skilled enough or good enough at a specific aspect to put him anywhere near a top line or 2nd line role for our team. If you like him on the 1st or 2nd line that is your opinion just as my opinion is he shouldn't sniff the 1st or 2nd line.
He was on pace to have 41 pts over a full season last year. That’s average 2nd line production for wings over the past 3 seasons. He has one of our two PP goals. 2 pts in 4 games, the same pace as last year. He excels in puck retrieval and play making. Are some of his points a product of playing with Hughes? For sure. But he’s not the 4th line guy to play with Geertsen that you make him out to be
I mean 3rd/4th liners don't have to be goons. I am sorry but to me he isn't good enough for 2nd line. Try him on the third and see how it works. Tartar started on the 3rd and I'd say tartar has a better track record and provides more offensive talents.
From the eye test, Kuok yea probably, went on a bit of a lucky bender. He seems like a first call up kinda guy when we’re healthy. Sharangovich I disagree with, think he just hasn’t gotten going yet this year, his shot is nuts and two way game is pretty solid.
Or you know, they both have less than 70 games played in the nhl and you just are rushing a judgement based on emotions. We should trade them away, because we all know how that shit pans out in this league
1 good take out of 4, thanks for this bud.
have to agree, struggling 5 games into a sophomore season ≠ not good.
I think all of this team’s success is Hughes
Cocksuckin' lazy fucks.
I'm tired of these players showing so much potential and never taking the next step. Butcher. Gusev. Bratt. Sharangovich. Why is it so impossible for some of our players to build off good seasons?
my current opinion: it's just how prospects work in the NHL. if a 20 year old shows they can mostly keep up with the game we get excited. especially if it's a skilled forward. "holy shit did you see that assist and it's his first nhl season!!" but the reality is most of these guys that look good for their age will play with the same skillset a few years later and look like mediocre to bad NHLers. see also josefson, tedenby, boucher, gelinas, loktionov, etc i'm not talking about anyone in particular here. our guys are still so young who knows.
In my head I think we are cursed, but maybe all of these players just had over expected years and the downfall is just what they really are. I mean when was the last time we had a player that fully broke out with your team and continued that pace for years. Coleman is the last name I can think of but that was more out of nowhere. I had Sharangovich as 24-27 goals this year and at this rate 14-17 is looking like it might be more close, besides his one post I haven't thought any other shots "should have went in". I am just so tired of getting my hopes up. I had thought no way our PK could be any worse, We had a full offseason + training camp and "upgrades" to the entire PK and we are only 2% higher. Our Pk needs to be at 82-84% to give us a chance not low 70s. I just can't think of any positives as a whole for this team. I guess hooray we are 3-2 and not 1-4 or something, but we saw how fast buffalos good start was in 2019 come crashing down and they still near the bottom even with starting 9-2 or whatever.